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Author Topic: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four  (Read 31617 times)

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theory

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2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« on: January 20, 2013, 06:45:57 pm »
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Over the next several days, we'll be posting interviews with each of the Final Four, gathering their thoughts on Dominion, boardgaming, strategy, and their most feared opponent(s).
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2013, 06:50:06 pm »
+2

Note that we are guaranteed a Europe vs US final.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2013, 06:52:20 pm »
+3

Note that we are guaranteed a Europe vs US final.

USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #3 on: January 20, 2013, 08:33:50 pm »
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Maaan... Stef is totally destroying the poll.
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Mic Qsenoch

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #4 on: January 20, 2013, 09:05:27 pm »
+5

Maaan... Stef is totally destroying the poll.

I voted for him.
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Gamecmdr

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #5 on: January 20, 2013, 09:24:25 pm »
+3

No pressure stef
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #6 on: January 20, 2013, 11:06:12 pm »
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I really like this final four - all highly skilled superfreaks from my somewhat limited experience playing them. I voted for stef, but lespeutere should give him a run for his money - experience doesn't hurt and they are both playing lights out. Obi vs stef with stef taking it sounds about right.
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lespeutere

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2013, 03:53:19 am »
+3

I think I need some sparring. Anyone feeling like being able to mimick -Stef-?  ::)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2013, 03:58:37 am »
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Note that we are guaranteed a Europe vs US final.

USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!

EU! EU! EU! EU! EU! ;)
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lespeutere

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2013, 05:15:34 am »
+2

Anyone remember at one point during isodom discussion someone mentioning a Ryder Cup style thing?
Now we have mini Ryder Cup  8)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2013, 05:20:47 am »
+2

Well, there are no "pretenders" amongst these four which definitely says something about the "luck vs skill" argument.

I'm rooting for my fellow Dutchie -Stef- of course.  ;)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2013, 06:36:24 am »
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I'm supportung lespeutere of course, but -Stef- is probably not the easiest semifinal opponent imaginable.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2013, 08:17:47 am »
+3

On the other hand, these are some matches I would definitely want to watch on YouTube! Too bad Iso doesn't have a spectator mode or something. :(
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blackb

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2013, 08:48:54 am »
+3

Note that we are guaranteed a Europe vs US final.

Lucky drawing for the americans.  :D
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lespeutere

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2013, 09:07:35 am »
+6

On the other hand, these are some matches I would definitely want to watch on YouTube! Too bad Iso doesn't have a spectator mode or something. :(

I will record our match unless there is a serious obstacle.
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Davio

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #15 on: January 21, 2013, 10:28:48 am »
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On the other hand, these are some matches I would definitely want to watch on YouTube! Too bad Iso doesn't have a spectator mode or something. :(

I will record our match unless there is a serious obstacle.
Okay great, looking forward to it!!

Still, some sort of "replayer" functionality as some of you may know from various Poker software would have been an awesome Iso feature.
Maybe Goko?  8) :D
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #16 on: January 21, 2013, 10:36:49 am »
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Still, some sort of "replayer" functionality as some of you may know from various Poker software would have been an awesome Iso feature.
Maybe Goko?  8) :D
Oce Goko logs contain really all information about the game (some is still missing, but those are mostly bugs) it should be possible to make an external replayer that, fed with game log, shows how it went.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #17 on: January 21, 2013, 11:45:31 am »
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On the other hand, these are some matches I would definitely want to watch on YouTube! Too bad Iso doesn't have a spectator mode or something. :(

I will record our match unless there is a serious obstacle.

Do you have a YouTube channel on which you will post the videos?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #18 on: January 21, 2013, 11:51:02 am »
+1

On the other hand, these are some matches I would definitely want to watch on YouTube! Too bad Iso doesn't have a spectator mode or something. :(

I will record our match unless there is a serious obstacle.

Do you have a YouTube channel on which you will post the videos?

http://www.youtube.com/user/lespeutere

PitzerMike

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #19 on: January 21, 2013, 11:58:37 am »
+1

Still, some sort of "replayer" functionality as some of you may know from various Poker software would have been an awesome Iso feature.
Maybe Goko?  8) :D
Oce Goko logs contain really all information about the game (some is still missing, but those are mostly bugs) it should be possible to make an external replayer that, fed with game log, shows how it went.

Well, that's definitely a project I could see myself using my moderate programming skills on. After implementing about a third of the cards I got tired of my own Dominion implementation. But I could use the code base to implement a replayer. For most Iso logs it should also be possible to backtrack the deck states as long as there's no crazy stuff going on.
Of course it would still be cool to finish all the cards at least for "hot-seat solitaire" play so you could take over at any point in the replay and try stuff.

On a more on-topic note I'm already very excited to see which of these fine gentlemen is going to take the win.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2013, 12:06:01 pm »
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For most Iso logs it should also be possible to backtrack the deck states as long as there's no crazy stuff going on.

"Crazy stuff" is only Masquerade currently, right?
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PitzerMike

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2013, 12:14:38 pm »
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For most Iso logs it should also be possible to backtrack the deck states as long as there's no crazy stuff going on.

"Crazy stuff" is only Masquerade currently, right?

Yeah, I think so.
And for other stuff it doesn't matter much although it might sometimes be interesting - like in what order was the rest of your deck before you played Chancellor?
When stuff is trashed I think Iso always writes what you trashed, so there shouldn't be a problem.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2013, 12:17:52 pm »
+3

If logs are good enough, there's no crazy stuff at all. Iso logs unfortunately are not, even if you simply draw cards mid-turn, they don't say what cards you drew.

Deck state (how many copies of each card each player has) can be tracked on Iso even during the game (that's what the point couter extension is doing). But what is currently in deck and in discard can't be tracked even post-game.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #23 on: January 21, 2013, 01:23:07 pm »
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Rather impressive that three of the top four ranked people made the final four. Guess the Iso ranking is pretty accurate and 7 games is long enough to weed out most of the luck factor =)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #24 on: January 21, 2013, 05:55:07 pm »
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Deck state (how many copies of each card each player has) can be tracked on Iso even during the game

Except for Masquerade.
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hsiale

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #25 on: January 21, 2013, 06:36:11 pm »
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Deck state (how many copies of each card each player has) can be tracked on Iso even during the game

Except for Masquerade.
No, it works for Masquerade as well. I play with the point counter extension and it works as it should in Masquerade games. I'm not sure if post-game logs allow for Masquerade tracking, but definitely in-game log does so.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #26 on: January 21, 2013, 07:06:16 pm »
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PCE tracks deck states despite Masq in 2-player games but not in games with more players IIRC because the information is imperfect.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #27 on: January 21, 2013, 07:10:24 pm »
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That's possible, I don't think I ever played a 3-player game on Iso.
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #28 on: January 21, 2013, 07:58:55 pm »
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Deck state (how many copies of each card each player has) can be tracked on Iso even during the game

Except for Masquerade.
No, it works for Masquerade as well. I play with the point counter extension and it works as it should in Masquerade games. I'm not sure if post-game logs allow for Masquerade tracking, but definitely in-game log does so.

Post-game logs don't show the Masq pass, just as they don't show what you draw with your Smithy etc.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #29 on: January 22, 2013, 02:56:58 am »
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... even if you simply draw cards mid-turn, they don't say what cards you drew.

This pretty much kills it. Masq alone wouldn't be that bad.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #30 on: January 22, 2013, 03:01:42 am »
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I voted for Stef, too. Stef knocked me out in round, uh 4 I think.

Note, this is not the same as picking the person who I personally would be most afraid of beating. That would be Bonogi. I never, ever, ever, ever beat Bonogi.
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Davio

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #31 on: January 22, 2013, 08:22:33 am »
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In terms of "fear" for opponents, I would rate them as follows:

1. Mic Qsenoch
2. Obi Wan Bonogi
3. Stef
4. lespeutere

I think I've beat Obi Wan Bonogi a couple of times (note I'm happy saying "a couple of times"). Obi Wan was also "the man" (#1) for a long time back in the day when I first joined Iso with a friend. We would brag about even playing against him, let alone having any chance of winning. That time has left a lasting shadow over me.

Stef I respect a bunch, but I don't really fear him. Maybe that's because I've seen his face, makes him somewhat less scary. :)

I think I can hold my own against lespeutere, but Mic Qsenoch always seems a couple of steps ahead of me.

Still, going to be very very interesting seeing the best of the best duke it out in the Dominion arena. Whoever wins this has a title that's really going to be worth something in my eyes.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #32 on: January 22, 2013, 09:27:00 am »
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I'm now rooting for Mic solely because I have a good friend who is 24 and a Midwestern Chem graduate student. In my mind he's pretended to be bad at Dominion whenever we've played against each other while secretly becoming one of the best players in the world. That would be cool.


Also, I always love these interviews. Good work Theory.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #33 on: January 22, 2013, 11:01:35 am »
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I'm not sure which opponent I would fear the most, due to a lack of games with them; however, I can say that I have won more games against these for opponents than I have lost against them. (I won my one game against Mic Qsenoch, back when he was like level 34 or something, and never played any of the others)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #34 on: January 22, 2013, 12:05:38 pm »
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My record against the 4:

-Stef-: 1-4
lespeutere: 0-2
Mic Qsenoch: 2-3-1
Obi Wan Bonogi: 2-6

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #35 on: January 22, 2013, 12:30:16 pm »
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I'm over .500 barely against three of the four.  And only down one against Bonogi.  But I'm pretty sure I would lose badly to any of them if we played today. 

Good luck to everyone.  Excited to see the games.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #36 on: January 22, 2013, 12:31:18 pm »
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I am fairly confident that none of the 4 finalists have EVER beaten me.

In fact, quite a lot of the people in this thread have never beaten me either!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #37 on: January 22, 2013, 12:34:52 pm »
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I am fairly confident that none of the 4 finalists have EVER beaten me.

In fact, quite a lot of the people in this thread have never beaten me either!
Or lost to you.  ;)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #38 on: January 22, 2013, 01:44:27 pm »
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I am fairly confident that none of the 4 finalists have EVER beaten me.

In fact, quite a lot of the people in this thread have never beaten me either!
Or lost to you.  ;)

Sssssh, a minor technicality!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #39 on: January 22, 2013, 02:17:45 pm »
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I am fairly confident that none of the 4 finalists have EVER beaten me.

In fact, quite a lot of the people in this thread have never beaten me either!

Are you MrEevee?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #40 on: January 22, 2013, 02:29:21 pm »
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Nope, Eevee is MrEevee
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #41 on: January 22, 2013, 03:20:41 pm »
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The fun thing about playing high level players is when you're a bit behind coming out of the early game. You can't count on them making a mistake as a novice would sometimes do. So maintaining the same strategy is almost always a sure loss. Makes for some very entertaining kitchen sink games.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #42 on: January 22, 2013, 03:28:05 pm »
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #43 on: January 22, 2013, 03:28:56 pm »
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The fun thing about playing high level players is when you're a bit behind coming out of the early game. You can't count on them making a mistake as a novice would sometimes do. So maintaining the same strategy is almost always a sure loss. Makes for some very entertaining kitchen sink games.

I dunno... you can still hope for bad shuffle luck to slow them down. And high-ranked players still make mistakes; just not as many.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #44 on: January 22, 2013, 04:17:33 pm »
+4

Nope, Eevee is MrEevee

http://i.qkme.me/3soa6s.jpg

Eevee's isotropic handle is MrEevee. Eevee posted a thread once asking why he couldn't use Eevee on Isotropic, and was told someone else already had used that name once. Then Ozle decided to pretend like that person was him because Ozle is a flapdoodle.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #45 on: January 22, 2013, 04:23:54 pm »
+2

Took him like a week to notice!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #46 on: January 22, 2013, 04:24:44 pm »
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Took him like a week to notice!
Notice you pretended or notice you are not Eevee?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #47 on: January 22, 2013, 11:13:49 pm »
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Good luck to everyone. Obi Wan and Stef are pretty much the two players who owned my soul more than anyone else when I was playing, whereas the opposite might be true for lespeutere :p (then again he knocked me out of this tournament). Never played much against Mic but I'm sure he's a beast too.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #48 on: January 23, 2013, 12:00:30 am »
+1

Losers Bracket is down to the Final Four as well... Do we get interviews? >_>
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #49 on: January 23, 2013, 06:49:34 am »
0

The fun thing about playing high level players is when you're a bit behind coming out of the early game. You can't count on them making a mistake as a novice would sometimes do. So maintaining the same strategy is almost always a sure loss. Makes for some very entertaining kitchen sink games.

I dunno... you can still hope for bad shuffle luck to slow them down. And high-ranked players still make mistakes; just not as many.
Well, sure, but somehow the intimidation factor starts playing a role and you start seriously considering Thief or something silly like that. :)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #50 on: January 23, 2013, 09:22:30 am »
0

As a fellow midwest chemistry grad student, Mic has my garnered my support!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #51 on: January 23, 2013, 09:39:17 am »
0

Mic is an enigma to me, if he wins, I hope we get a 2 page interview. :)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #52 on: January 23, 2013, 09:52:08 am »
0

Losers Bracket is down to the Final Four as well... Do we get interviews? >_>

If you like, sure, though I think it'd be limited to just being posted on the forum.  I've already squashed poor WW's articles (which are excellent, btw!) enough this week.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #53 on: January 23, 2013, 10:29:52 am »
0

I was mostly joking, but I sent out the questions to the others anyway. I'll post them up if they get back to me.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #54 on: January 24, 2013, 07:26:15 pm »
+19

Mic Qsenoch wins 4-1 over Obi Wan Bonogi

Game 1 - http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/24/game-20130124-150835-1c5cbba8.html
Apothecary, Festival, Harvest, Haven, Highway, Noble Brigand, Philosopher's Stone, Potion, Remake, Saboteur, and Trader

We both go for Remake into Highway/Festival. I pick up a second Remake while he gets a Noble Brigand, which probably costs him this game. The attack is actually helpful to my deck after I've purchased my first Highway or two since I don't want silvers anymore anyway. Giving me Coppers doesn't hurt so bad because of Remake also. I win the Highway split 8-2 so he resigns.

Game 2 - http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/24/game-20130124-151604-c557cc22.html
Bazaar, Develop, Familiar, Fortune Teller, Library, Lookout, Potion, Silk Road, Trading Post, Venture, and Walled Village

He opens Potion/Fortune Teller while I try Silver/Lookout. I'm hoping to get enough trashing from Lookout and Trading Post to ignore the Curses and transition into greening sooner than he can. I am able to trash all of my Coppers which is nice for Venture, I don't get to trash as many Curses as I'd like (although his Fortune Teller helps me out a bit in that regard). This one is very close, but I get some nice hands at the end to overcome the Curses with a 5-3 Province split. I'm not sure how good my plan is in general, but it worked out barely.

Game 3 - http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/24/game-20130124-153229-281d4081.html
Bank, Bishop, Fairgrounds, Fortune Teller, Horn of Plenty, Jester, Nomad Camp, Potion, Spice Merchant, Vineyard, and Woodcutter

So this board didn't have any standout cards so I thought it would be hard to get 8 Provinces easily, making 6 VP Fairgrounds a real possibility. I get plenty of Jesters early, mainly because I can't seem to get $6, but they should be helpful with a long game and possibly assist the Fairgrounds. He gets a big early lead on Provinces, but I take 6 of the Fairgrounds, and eventually give him a lot of Curses with Jester. This slows him down enough for me to take the lead and then I have a couple of lucky hands at the end for Provinces to close it out. My weird buy in here is the Potion/Vineyards. It's two unique cards, and with 9 action cards a Potion in hand is as good as $5 once the Duchy dancing starts. Of course I don't actually have 9 action cards (whoops), but it didn't seem to hurt me too much. This was a weird game overall, and I'm not sure if I played this well or got lucky.

Game 4 - http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/24/game-20130124-153805-bce68031.html
Baron, Gardens, Goons, Haggler, Ironworks, Margrave, Menagerie, Nobles, Secret Chamber, and Thief

Ironworks/Gardens rush mirror. We split the Gardens and I get more estates, but he gets a Nobles and correctly picks up Barons on some turns where I incorrectly get Silvers or something. He pulls ahead with Duchies and then I can't pick up Barons because of three-piling. He wins. I do wonder if something with Goons could beat the Gardens player, but uncontested Ironworks/Gardens goes really fast.

Game 5 - http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201301/24/game-20130124-154536-79db9ea7.html
Apothecary, Explorer, Forge, Ill-Gotten Gains, Library, Potion, Salvager, Talisman, Throne Room, Tournament, and Watchtower

This is another messy kind of game. 5/2 on an IGG board. Salvager looks good. We don't really go for the IGG rush (I am afraid of his Watchtower). I was pretty lucky to win a couple Tournaments. I only played the Followers twice, and once he had Watchtower. But the Duchy was nice. I have luck with Salvager at the end to win this one, because you can see by my final deck contents that I was not in a position to be buying Provinces.


Several of these boards were one card away from having decent engines. A lot of them needed villages, trashing, or +buy. I think if those things had been present you'd see a very different match result, as Obi Wan is much better than me at those kinds of games. I also got some lucky breaks as well. Thanks for the match Obi Wan Bonogi!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #55 on: January 24, 2013, 08:04:28 pm »
+8

A bunch of ugly games from me.  Youre right I blundered game 1.  I still cant believe I lost game 2 honestly.  I spent the rest of the match thinking about this game.  I was thinking something was off with my midgame but looking back now the biggest mistake I made was once you get silver with 4 and show me youre not going familiar I should have went silver and played it safe.  Fortune teller was a dud early and often and I had some rough collisions.  Still couldn't believe I lost the game though and it kind of put me on tilt. 

Game 3 fortune teller is also a dud and my turns 3/4 are $4/$4 compared to your 5/3, its not that I didn't want Jester early it just didn't work out that way.   

Theory just asked me what my least favorite cards were and my answers were IGG and Tournament so it's very fitting that they show up on the board in which I am eliminated.  Overall I had nothing going for me in this match, I played poorly first and foremost, the boards we played didn't fit my strengths, and I got a bit unlucky.  To top that off I was playing against a very strong player who played well. 

Congrats MQ.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #56 on: January 24, 2013, 08:28:20 pm »
0

Noooooo...
Obi Wan, you took my spot in the tournament without winning?!

Oh well. You came closer than I probably would have.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #57 on: January 24, 2013, 08:43:08 pm »
0

Were these matches recorded by any chance?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #58 on: January 24, 2013, 09:05:05 pm »
+18

Were these matches recorded by any chance?

I did not record them but if you would like some subtitles while reading the game logs I'd be more than happy to provide.  It went something like this:

"Fuck, Fuck, ok, that was dumb, fuck, FUCK!, this board is lame, fuck, dammit, okay that was definitely dumb, dammit, this board is dumb, fuck, I didnt even see that! dammit, dammit, I hate that card, fuck, sigh."
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #59 on: January 25, 2013, 01:11:14 am »
+3

Congrats MicQ. Good luck in the final. America is counting on you.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #60 on: January 25, 2013, 03:32:46 am »
+1

gl, Mic!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #61 on: January 25, 2013, 04:22:18 am »
0

Congrats MicQ. Good luck in the final. America is counting on you.
Nah, forget America, it's the chemists counting on you (unless I move on, then they don't care, so you Anerican guys may take over)..
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #62 on: January 25, 2013, 05:25:13 am »
+7

Congratulations, Mic Qsenoch. Reading through the logs it looks like you really deserved it. Well done.

I first noticed f.ds about a year ago, during the previous version of this tournament. The first posts I read on dominionstrategy.com were about the final entries to the Kingdom Design Contest. I was really impressed and I considered it a very cool way to finish a tournament. But hey, it was so unfair, only available to two players, people at least 15 levels above me. I did know at least part of those 15 levels had to do with my unfamiliarity with the cards, but still...

Now I'm only 1 match away of actually playing those kingdoms so carefully designed by so many players. lespeutere and I will be playing that match tomorrow. I really hope I'll be joining you. I know it's possible, but I'm also very aware it could go either way. 70% votes for me is a nice boost in confidence, but I think people overestimate the differences in the top, or at least how they affect win%.

And then there's this really weird psychological factor which is hard to catch in math. I know I can play pretty well on most days, but once in a while I have a day where I lose 2/3 of my matches to just about everyone. And I'm not talking about streaks of bad luck, because honestly dominion isn't that much about luck when you play several games. It's just some weird thought process that climbs into my head, removes all constructive thinking and keeps me stuck in criticizing past decisions while making new mistakes over and again. Although I don't like the swearing, the nature of Obi Wan's comments sound very familiar to me on one of those days. So now I'm hoping tomorrow isn't one for me ;)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #63 on: January 25, 2013, 07:11:45 am »
+1

Ohne Holland, fahr'n wir zur WM!

(english translation (kinda): go lespeutere!)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #64 on: January 25, 2013, 07:15:17 am »
+1

Ohne Holland, fahr'n wir zur WM!

(english translation (kinda): go lespeutere!)
Schade Deutschland alles ist vorbei? :)
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lespeutere

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #65 on: January 25, 2013, 07:17:04 am »
0

Ohne Holland, fahr'n wir zur WM!

(english translation (kinda): go lespeutere!)
Funny thing is, when I saw there was a new post, I didn't really read the poster's name but just overlooked it quickly and in my mind it was not "def" but "-Stef-".  :D
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #66 on: January 25, 2013, 07:23:46 am »
0

Ohne Holland, fahr'n wir zur WM!

(english translation (kinda): go lespeutere!)
Schade Deutschland alles ist vorbei? :)

If this were really about football (and I mean the game in which you actually play a ball with your foot, not the other one where carry some oval thing around in your hand), the final - no matter what the semifinal result will be - would be sort of like a walk in the park. ;)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #67 on: January 25, 2013, 08:04:03 am »
+2

Ohne Holland, fahr'n wir zur WM!

(english translation (kinda): go lespeutere!)
Schade Deutschland alles ist vorbei? :)

If this were really about football (and I mean the game in which you actually play a ball with your foot, not the other one where carry some oval thing around in your hand), the final - no matter what the semifinal result will be - would be sort of like a walk in the park. ;)
... only if it would be the men's WM ...
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #68 on: January 25, 2013, 10:53:09 am »
0

Congrats MicQ. Good luck in the final. America is counting on you.
Nah, forget America, it's the chemists counting on you (unless I move on, then they don't care, so you Anerican guys may take over)..

Wait, is Mic yet another chemist?  Crazy.
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lespeutere

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #69 on: January 25, 2013, 11:05:21 am »
+3

Congrats MicQ. Good luck in the final. America is counting on you.
Nah, forget America, it's the chemists counting on you (unless I move on, then they don't care, so you Anerican guys may take over)..

Wait, is Mic yet another chemist?  Crazy.
Once in a while, a look at the blog is worth the time. ;-) Hidden between the WanderingWinder's brilliant articles on fundamental deck types there are interviews of the final four participants.
And there he says he is.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #70 on: January 25, 2013, 11:12:16 am »
+3

Congrats MicQ. Good luck in the final. America is counting on you.
Nah, forget America, it's the chemists counting on you (unless I move on, then they don't care, so you Anerican guys may take over)..

Wait, is Mic yet another chemist?  Crazy.
Once in a while, a look at the blog is worth the time. ;-) Hidden between the WanderingWinder's brilliant articles on fundamental deck types there are interviews of the final four participants.
And there he says he is.

There's a blog now?

:p
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #71 on: January 25, 2013, 11:17:55 am »
+3

DS : f.ds :: RL Dominion : Online Dominion

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #72 on: January 25, 2013, 11:18:48 am »
+1

There's a blog now?

OH some years ago: "Do you know that Kelly Osbourne's father now also starts making music?"
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #73 on: January 25, 2013, 11:19:26 am »
0

Apparently Michael Jackson is dead?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #74 on: January 25, 2013, 11:20:19 am »
+1

Apparently Michael Jackson is dead?
Someone should install a mod for spoilers...
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #75 on: January 25, 2013, 11:56:34 am »
+2

We should just make this the slowpoke meme thread now.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #76 on: January 25, 2013, 01:45:38 pm »
0

Ohne Holland, fahr'n wir zur WM!

(english translation (kinda): go lespeutere!)
Schade Deutschland alles ist vorbei? :)

If this were really about football (and I mean the game in which you actually play a ball with your foot, not the other one where carry some oval thing around in your hand), the final - no matter what the semifinal result will be - would be sort of like a walk in the park. ;)
Well, the US played Germany in the 2002 World Cup quarterfinals.  And should have won!

Damn you, Frings...
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #77 on: January 25, 2013, 01:47:34 pm »
0

That was when our national team gave us a very hard time watching it..
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #78 on: January 25, 2013, 05:07:56 pm »
+1

Congrats MicQ. Good luck in the final. America is counting on you.
Nah, forget America, it's the chemists counting on you (unless I move on, then they don't care, so you Anerican guys may take over)..
lol. I'm getting the feeling that chemists are the best dominion players. 8)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #79 on: January 25, 2013, 05:29:09 pm »
0

I'm switching my vote to lespeutere since I've played him like 5 times in the last 2 days and have lost all of them.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #80 on: January 25, 2013, 07:49:07 pm »
+3

That was when our national team gave us a very hard time watching it..

Try watching England for 46 years...
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #81 on: January 25, 2013, 08:13:42 pm »
+1

I didn't know Tuvaluans watch England since 66?!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #82 on: January 25, 2013, 08:15:32 pm »
0

I have not, just pointing out it must be much harder watching the dross of England than a lot of other teams for the last 40 years, to have tasted glory and now to be so far away, despite such high expectations

Whereas in Tuvalu, we have had our first win in recent years and climbed off the bottom of the rankings. Its heady days!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #83 on: January 25, 2013, 08:16:22 pm »
+1

I'm switching my vote to lespeutere since I've played him like 5 times in the last 2 days and have lost all of them.

Switching your vote implies you played -Stef- a couple of times, too, and destroyed him?  ;)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #84 on: January 25, 2013, 09:59:03 pm »
0

I'm switching my vote to lespeutere since I've played him like 5 times in the last 2 days and have lost all of them.

Switching your vote implies you played -Stef- a couple of times, too, and destroyed him?  ;)

Nah, I played him once (and he beat me) but now he's much much much too scared to play me again ;) and for good reason!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #85 on: January 26, 2013, 08:50:13 am »
+4

Adding some suspense to the whole thing:

I'll start writing the report now, we just finished the match which came down to game 7, lasting 2 hours in total...
« Last Edit: January 26, 2013, 08:51:14 am by lespeutere »
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #86 on: January 26, 2013, 09:03:09 am »
0

Adding some suspense to the whole thing:

I'll start writing the report now, we just finished the match which came down to game 7, lasting 2 hours in total...

Suspense? We don't want suspense! We want answers ;)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #87 on: January 26, 2013, 09:04:47 am »
+4

But I want it nowwwwww!!!!!*

*In the tone of Violet from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #88 on: January 26, 2013, 09:32:26 am »
+2

I hope you are uploading already. >:(

Edit: Indeed he is, first three games already uploaded, so I'll start watching now and it should work out perfectly.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2013, 09:33:55 am by def »
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lespeutere

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #89 on: January 26, 2013, 11:01:09 am »
+19

So, it was -Stef- vs lespeutere, as you might know.

Result: -Stef- vs lespeutere 4-3

You can watch the games up here.

Post game-analysis

Apprentice, Caravan, Cellar, Colony, Feast, Forge, Great Hall, Monument, Pawn♦, Platinum, Swindler, Woodcutter, and Young Witch

1-0
There is young witch on this board without any +actions. Pawn as bane is easily spammable but then what do you do with a hand full of pawns? Trashing is provided by apprentice and forge which are potentially nice trashers but they are expensive so getting them might be really hard with curses being thrown around. We both open silver/YW and t3/4 gives this game a direction it will not depart from till the end: while -Stef- plays his YW on t3, I get to play mine on t4, giving him the curse after the reshuffle while I already have one in my deck when I reshuffle. We both get an apprentice on t3 and while he gets a caravan on t4, I get a silver for 4$. My reasoning is, I want to get forge as quickly as possible although I see caravanís usefulness in this sloggy game. T5/6 sees -Stef- playing caravan/YW and apprenticing 2 estates getting apprentice and gold such that the 2nd curse I give him on t6 misses the reshuffle again. I get apprentice/silver. The game feels pretty much over at this point and -Stef- doesnít have problems taking this one home as is expected. His $ split nicely as he gets a pawn with 3$ on t7 and a forge for 8$ on t8 while Iím restricted to silver and caravan. T12 is lovely for thim when he apprentices gold and is eventually able to forge his whole hand (4 coppers, 2 pawns, apprentice, curse) into a platinum while I just reach 7$ and the forge this turn. He gets three more platinums and finally takes it home with 5 colonies and a 20 point lead only since I buy the last colony for the end: 56-36.


Black Market, Caravan, Counting House, Fishing Village, Horse Traders, Island, Mandarin, Scout, Talisman, and Trader

1-1
There is a lot of +actions here from fishing villages but there is no carddraw at all (except for wharf, oracle, moat, witch, jack from the black market). There is trader and mandarin which I identify as a nice BigMoney option here since we open 2/5. So I open -/mandarin/trader while -Stef- skips mandarin. At this point I am not really sure what he is aiming for. He gets a FV, a BM, a horse traders, some caravans but doesnít get anything useful from the black market throughout the whole game while I play pretty much pure BM, trading an early estate which provides 3 quick golds on t5/7/8. I get another mandarin when I hit 5$ including a gold and cruise to victory with 6 provinces, a duchy, 2 islands in 19 turns which surprises me a bit considering itís only 2 mandarins and a trader (which I played twice) getting me there: 26-45.


Bridge, Great Hall, Highway, Hunting Party, Ironworks, Menagerie, Moneylender, Mountebank, Swindler, and Tournament

2-1
Potentially, there is a lot of things going on here: there is ironworks/great hall, there is highway/ironworks synergy, there is bridge, there is HP, moneylender for copper trashing, and swindler on top of it all. However, there is no +actions; and, even more decisive, there are mountebank and tournament. We open 4/3 and I open tournament/swindler which I still like. -Stef-, on the contrary, starts moneylender/silver. I get lucky to hit his moneylender which I swindle into a moneylender. At the time I figured moneylender to be the weakest 4$ card. Moreover, I hit 5$ twice, which gets me a mountebank and a HP and I feel very well as he gets two tournaments only on t3/4. I get 2 more HP on t5/6 (with 7$ on t6, shouldíve been gold, I guess, but I wanted to try and make sure I play mountebank every turn) while -Stef- gets a mountebank and HP. But then, miraculously, he pulls off 8$ on t7 and from here, things start to fall apart for me. I get another HP with 5$ on t8 but he pulls off another 8$ on t9, drawing province/tournament for t10, denying my tournament which results in another HP for me (which definitely shouldíve been a gold now). -Stef- starts winning prizes on t10 (trusty steed) and buys his third province on t11. He then denies more or less every tournament of mine, gets followers and his provinces hit by my swindlers twice, taking it home with 4 provinces and 5 duchies while I try some desperate highway/ironworks things which are supposed to never work. In hindsight, I really needed a gold much earlier than I got it but I still donít really get it how he managed to get these 3 provinces without reaching 5$ on t3/4 and his moneylender taken out of the shuffle by my swindler. Anyway, he wins it comfortably: 42-25.


City, Conspirator, Fishing Village, Great Hall, Ironworks, Royal Seal, Steward, Venture, Wharf, and Workshop

2-2
Another highly interesting board. There is fishing village/wharf, there is conspirator for $, there is steward for trashing, ironworks for gaining conspirators/FV/great hall. And cities on top when piles run out. We start 3/4 and both of us open steward/ironworks. I havenít really decided whether I want to have wharves quickly and trash more aggressively then or whether I want to trash first to get the wharf engine up and running as soon as I get wharves. I buy a FV on t3 while -Stef- gets the nice ironworks for FV, trashing 2 estates with steward t3. My steward is card 11 or 12 and I now have the choice to gain a great hall with ironworks to draw steward with a 50% chance to trash copper/estate and buy nothing. I decide against this and get another FV and buy another steward while he gets his 2nd FV as well. We both play FV and steward for carddraw to buy a wharf on t5 while I gain another FV from ironworks, -Stef- gets a conspirator. T6 is my 4th FV and his 2nd wharf. He gains momentum when he can play the first wharf on t7 and gains another conspirator while I can play my first wharf on t8 only, when I trash two coppers and buy another FV. He, in turn, is able to buy wharf/conspirator. On t9, I miss playing a wharf but buy 2 of them, whereas he gets his first huge hand and buys wharf/3 conspirators with 17$. T10 sees me playing all my 4 wharves leading to 14$ and piles have run very low (2 FV, 2 conspirators, 2 wharves) so I know he can end it with all the $ from his conspirators which is why I feel I need to buy points: a province and 2 great hall. He had 2 wharves in play but no FV and doesnít draw any of them into his 9 cards hand so that he can only buy a great hall. On t11, I draw my whole deck and gain a conspirator along the way but donít have any wharves to play. I have exactly 16$ but buy one province to enlarge my lead and wharv/FV to work towards 3piling as I feel he can still overtake me as his deck is still better than mine. He gets a big turn 11 buying 2 provinces and a duchy but canít overtake me and I get lucky enough to get some carddraw going to pile out conspirators (via ironworks), FVs and wharves for the win of this 12 turn, 20 min game: 16-19.


Alchemist, Apothecary, Fool's Gold♦, Horn of Plenty, Potion, Royal Seal, Saboteur, Smithy, Thief, Tournament, Workshop, and Young Witch

3-2
There are 3 important cards here: young witch again, tournament again and foolís gold as bane. -Stef- opens FG/YW while I open FG/FG to 1st not lose the split and 2nd deny his YW. Both works out nicely, we split FGs 5/5 and I can deny his YW every single time. On t4 he gets a horn of plenty that lets him pick up a FG on t5. Rest of the game is told fast, he wins some tournaments and the game by getting 5 provinces: 38-26.


Alchemist, Cartographer, Familiar, Farming Village, Fool's Gold, Goons, Harem, Ironworks, Nobles, Potion, and Torturer

3-3
There are 2 cursers available here, familiars and torturers. I have recently been crashed by a torturer engine when I went for familiars but at the time I felt I got a little unlucky so I still went for familiars, as did -Stef- with both of us opening potion/silver, getting silver/familiar on t3/4. Both familiars miss the reshuffle but on top of that, -Stef-Ďs potion misses it, too, so he gets farming village/torturer while I can buy silver/familiar. We start cursing each other with familiars and I get a cartographer and a 3rd familiar on t7/8 whereas he gets FV/torturer. I discard to his torturers whenever he plays them and manage to win the curse split 8-2. I add 4 more cartographers to have 5 while he has 2, we get goons (2 vs. 1) and when itís obvious I can draw large parts of my deck consistently with cartographers/FV/Nobles while he can only once in a while he resigns after 23 turns instead of dragging this into another 20+ minute game.


Adventurer, Conspirator, Crossroads, Highway, Inn, Menagerie, Potion, Stash, Torturer, Treasury, and Vineyard

4-3
This time, the torturer chain is inevitable. We want 5$ quickly so we both start conspirator/silver (I have to admit I thought about starting menagerie or Xroads instead of silver but felt that I didnít want to start gambling in game 7 of this series, even when I was p2). T3 gets -Stef- a menagerie while I get 5$ which makes me think for quite a while. I decide to play this aggressively and try to win the curse split so I get a torturer. Surely enough, he gets his torturer on t4 and I like very much what I see on t4 when I hit 5$ again to get me an inn which lets me put back inn/torturer/conspirator. -Stef- plays a torturer on t5 to buy his first inn, while I can play inn/torturer/conspirator after discarding. This goes on for a while, we get torturers and inns, respectively, I also add a menagerie when I have 4$. He sees 2$ only on t9 and buys a crossroads after I tortured him a lot. Next turn, I torture him again down to 0 cards, while he takes a curse next turn. I take 2 on t10, while he discards to 0 again, to take 2 on my t12 when I buy the first province. At the time, I am pretty sure we split curses 5/5 and I really want to be up in points as there is no +buy on this board.  We indeed split curses 5/5 and I am up by a turn, then I lead by 3 points even after his turn when he buys a duchy to his province while I just my 2nd province. I have 4 inns compared to his 3 while he has one crossroads so overall, I feel pretty well but then he is able to make better use of his menagerie (i.e. he is luckier) and I have a hurting t15 when I have 1$ only so that I miss the Xroads, so that we are equal on t16 and he gets a 6 point lead by buying province/Xroads/province compared to my duchy/Xroads/duchy. T20/21 is 2 more Xroads for me, 1 for him. T22 lets him buy the penultimate province for a 12 point lead and I start to feel really desperate so I get a potion. We dance around a little and I am able to decrease his lead to 5 points buy a duchy on t28 such that he is in striking distance again. I draw a potion and wouldíve decreased the lead by another 4 points but that is just too much time for him to not have a decent hand and he eventually puts together his decisive hand by drawing 14 cards from Xroads alone to scrape together 8$ (well, maybe he didnít need to scrape but had some more actions in hand which he didnít need to play and which I canít see from the logs) for the win of this 30 min match: 41-30.


So, we both agreed that our performances matched rather equally, that this came eventually down to his overall 1st player advantage as all the games were won by first players. And this (including the fact that Iím the first who took him into a 7th game) is something Iím very proud of. Of course I wouldíve liked to win and I am a little disappointed Ė on the other hand, being an equal match to -Stef- today is more than I couldíve hoped for at the start of this tournament. So many thanks to -Stef- for this interesting series. I also wish to thank all those people on isotropic for wishing me good luck and providing other kind words during the last week. I really appreciate it. As well as jonts26 and greatexpectations for managing this tournament, I enjoyed it a lot. I felt this was a good place to say this, even though there is one more match to come. Stay tuned. ;-)

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SirPeebles

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #90 on: January 26, 2013, 12:05:14 pm »
0

Well played, lespeutere.  That last match just kept going, I had no idea how it would end.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #91 on: January 26, 2013, 12:42:37 pm »
0

Well played lespeutere. Watched the games and I have to say that most of the games I would have done the same as you.
Game 1 maybe start with Swindler. I might have gone more into Conspiritor in game 4, but would have made the same mistake as -Stef- with Torturers in game 6.
You lost the tournament games because of the second player disadvantage, not much u could do there.
In the last game you might have gone earlier into vineyard, but hard to say. In the end it came down to the starting player advantage. -Stef-, you have not made enough mistakes to lose. Congrats!
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Warrior

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #92 on: January 26, 2013, 12:51:33 pm »
+2

I am an American but I am rooting for -Stef- in the final round because he's super cool :)

But no offense to Mic!
« Last Edit: January 26, 2013, 01:21:56 pm by Warrior »
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dudeabides

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #93 on: January 26, 2013, 01:13:46 pm »
+3

I am an American but I am rooting for -Stef- in the final round because he's super cool :)

Traitor!  ;)
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Warrior

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #94 on: January 26, 2013, 01:22:30 pm »
0

I am an American but I am rooting for -Stef- in the final round because he's super cool :)

Traitor!  ;)

Haha! -Stef- is one of my favorite opponents ;)
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Warrior

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #95 on: January 26, 2013, 01:22:57 pm »
0

I am an American but I am rooting for -Stef- in the final round because he's super cool :)

Traitor!  ;)

BTW is that you in your profile picture?
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dudeabides

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #96 on: January 26, 2013, 05:49:48 pm »
+2

Stef is one of my favorite opponents, too. It's actually hard to decide who I'm rooting for, since Mic is representing us Midwestern grad students with nothing better to do than play Dominion ;) 

And, nah, that's Jeff Bridges as the Dude in The Big Lebowski. I'm working on it though. A white Russian a day, and I should be there soon
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Kirian

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #97 on: January 26, 2013, 06:33:50 pm »
+3

But I want it nowwwwww!!!!!*

*In the tone of Violet from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory

Veruca Salt.  Not Violet.  She's the one who turned into a blueberry.
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Morgrim7

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #98 on: January 26, 2013, 06:42:16 pm »
0

But I want it nowwwwww!!!!!*

*In the tone of Violet from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory

Veruca Salt.  Not Violet.  She's the one who turned into a blueberry.
Yeah, Violet was the gum chewer.
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Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Kirian

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #99 on: January 26, 2013, 07:02:52 pm »
0

But I want it nowwwwww!!!!!*

*In the tone of Violet from Charlie and the Chocolate Factory

Veruca Salt.  Not Violet.  She's the one who turned into a blueberry.
Yeah, Violet was the gum chewer.

I'm only slightly embarrassed that I can sing almost the entire song.
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Donald X.

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #100 on: January 26, 2013, 07:49:23 pm »
+2

We
are the music-makers
and we
are the dreamers of dreams.
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heatthespurs

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #101 on: January 27, 2013, 12:51:22 am »
0

So when will the much anticipated FINAL be held?  ::)
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #102 on: January 27, 2013, 10:33:45 am »
+1

As soon as we get together a list of sets and can find a good time for three of us.
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-Stef-

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #103 on: January 27, 2013, 11:02:11 am »
+10

Thanks for playing this match lespeutere. It was a very evenly matched series that ended with a real nail-biter. "Better lucky then smart" :)
Also thanks for writing up the great report and making the videos. I had to leave immediately after the match so didn't have time for it yesterday, but here are my thoughts on our semifinal.

Apprentice, Caravan, Cellar, Colony, Feast, Forge, Great Hall, Monument, Pawn♦, Platinum, Swindler, Woodcutter, and Young Witch
pregame: With Young Witch as an immediate thread, the first question was whether to invest heavily in the very reasonable bane card (Young Witch/Pawn) or try to build up first (Young Witch/Silver). Colonies implies the game goes long, so there will be time to get a big Forge turn no matter what. Even bad decks (with quite some curses) can get a big Forge turn due to Apprentice eating something big like Gold. Big forge turns means winning the curse split isn't all that relevant. This made it a very clear decision for me to open Silver. I really want that Apprentice and on this opening I actually have a very reasonable chance of hitting $5 (Young Witch/Pawn has a very lousy chance of doing that).

early game: He duplicates my Silver opening, but I immediately get a small edge because I draw my Young Witch a turn sooner. Having the curse in before he reshuffles is nice, although I think he overestimates the importance. On turn 4 we both get a $4 decision, and I go Caravan where he takes another Silver. I don't think it's even close here. At this point we already have the $5 card, and hitting $5 again or $6 isn't that important. I want to play both my Apprentice and my Young Witch more often, increase the chance of Apprentice-Estate collision, and a Caravan will also help with the upcoming Forge turn.

midgame: Then I get some nice draws and quickly build up a lead. Turn 9 I play Young Witch over a small Forge, which was a pretty close decision. The reshuffle for turn 9/10 was my first bad one, but I'm already so much ahead that on turn 10 I can decide to play it very safe. In stead of trying for a big Forge turn right away, I decide to shuffle both apprentices back in and rely on the next reshuffle for the Forge.


Black Market, Caravan, Counting House, Fishing Village, Horse Traders, Island, Mandarin, Scout, Talisman, and Trader
My initial plan was to just deny this game ever happened. But hey, he's got the logs and the video, so that's going to be hard. More then any other card, Black Market can lure me into engines I really shouldn't try. It's just too much fun to play :). But on this board it's hopeless. I also really underestimated Mandarin-Trader here. I think my theories around Black Market are pretty sound, I just don't know why I keep breaking my own rules. Just to make me feel a tiny little bit better about this game, here they are:

Building an engine requires four components: +actions, draw, trashing, payload (either huge buying, huge scoring, or nasty attacks). To build an engine around Black Market, the best case scenario is where the first three are in the regular kingdom and you use BM for the payload. If you have superior trashing in the kingdom, drawing from the BM is also an option. If you have superior draw in the kingdom, trashing from the BM is also an option. I often see people looking at what's in the Black Market to decide whether they want to play a deck around it. Sure you should have a peek, but what's in the regular kingdom is of much more importance. There's almost always 'a little bit of everything' in there.

Here we have bad draw, bad trashing and no payload in the kingdom. Why oh why do I even try?


Bridge, Great Hall, Highway, Hunting Party, Ironworks, Menagerie, Moneylender, Mountebank, Swindler, and Tournament
pregame: A lot of possibilities, most of them killed by Mountebank. In fact so complicated that I just gave up on a real analysis. I ended with "I really want to hit $5, so let's pick two cards that don't clash and both bring me $2" and "In a tournament game I always like trashing". Menagerie looked cute but probably wasn't going to work, and neither was Ironworks/Highway. Mountebank & lots of Hunting Parties was what I wanted.

Early game: oh no! how can I not hit $5 even once on a Silver/Moneylender opening. The $4 cards aren't bad or anything, but I felt really lost after missing the Mountebank.
Midgame: with some incredible luck I get two early $8's and then all of a sudden it's my game in stead of his. Whowa!


City, Conspirator, Fishing Village, Great Hall, Ironworks, Royal Seal, Steward, Venture, Wharf, and Workshop
pregame: on a regular Wharf/Fishing Village game you don't need much more then those two. But here we have Iron Works for free Conspirators, enabled by Stewards trashing. That's easily strong enough to open Steward. I even thought about opening double Steward here for a while, but Steward with Wharf in play is just more powerful.

early game: I get a very good first reshuffle, immediately making up for my p2 disadvantage and more. He gets a second Steward which is not his dream scenario but I do agree with it.
midgame: I can trash more, gain more conspirators and manage to build a pretty sound lead.
late game: then I make a mistake I rarely ever do. In an already powerful deck, I keep investing in power in stead of reliability. I feel like not doing stuff like that is one of my strongest points in this game, but here I fail.

I don't have that many Fishing Villages (3) but trashed a lot so I feel good about it. The problem is that I split my villages 3/0 over the even/odd turns. On my turn 9 I have the opportunity to fix this to 3/1 by gaining a Fishing Village mid-turn but I neglect to do so. I get punished hard by not drawing any village in a 9-card hand.

He basically makes the same mistake by splitting his wharves 4/0, but he does get away with it. In his shoes I would have picked up a second Ironworks for free on turn 10 to get more end-game control, but that didn't prove necessary either.


Alchemist, Apothecary, Fool's Gold♦, Horn of Plenty, Potion, Royal Seal, Saboteur, Smithy, Thief, Tournament, Workshop, and Young Witch
pregame: Apothecary & Tournament are really great friends, but Fool's Gold as a bane is impossible to ignore. This felt like a game that was largely going to be decided on luck.

early game: He skips Young Witch for another Fool's Gold. I didn't expect it but it feels like a pretty good move, especially after he manages to block all Young Witches.
midgame: Fortunately even when the cursing fails Young Witch still isn't a dead card. I manage to sneak in a Horn of Plenty, and buy slightly more real Golds then he does. He gets the first Province, but powered by sheer luck I get the prizes and the game.



Alchemist, Cartographer, Familiar, Farming Village, Fool's Gold, Goons, Harem, Ironworks, Nobles, Potion, and Torturer
pregame: This one clearly was going to be about Familiars and not Torturers. Familiars aren't pretty for P2, but hey maybe he misses or gets them later on his shuffle or ... well at this point still a lot could happen.

early game: We mirror through the first 4 turns, but then I get some bad draws. Both my familiar and my potion miss this shuffle, and I make a somewhat desperate move for a Torturer. A Cartographer would have been a more sensible choice, unfortunately probably also losing.
midgame: I keep putting my familiar on the bottom, and lose the curse split 8-2 which is off course game decisive. My Torturers don't do anything but that was predictable.



Adventurer, Conspirator, Crossroads, Highway, Inn, Menagerie, Potion, Stash, Torturer, Treasury, and Vineyard
This one we play almost an exact mirror. I can't see much else to do either. The only decision I had to think about for real here was my first menagerie - should it be a crossroads? I really don't know. I need to be able to play many Torturers, but a Menagerie is also very good when you get hit by some torturers yourself.

Miraculously this game isn't over after the curses are split, because we both get 5. Torturer games tend to split them 8-2 or 2-8 much more often. So we continue, and continue, and continue... until I get some better draws and manage to get a serious lead. Then it still takes like forever, but eventually I get to $8 again and get a ticket to the finals :)


Thanks again lespeutere, it was a fun series to play and I feel almost sorry that you played so well and lost. Almost ;)
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WanderingWinder

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #104 on: January 27, 2013, 12:52:28 pm »
+4

I have very few comments on the first semifinal - I am a little confused as to how a IW/G game goes 25 turns but weird stuff can happen off of endgame considerations sometimes; it probably made sense as the game was being played.

I have lots of thoughts, though, on lespeuture vs Stef. And by the way, watch lespeuture's videos,  they're really interesting.

Game 1:The eventual goal has to be big apprentice and forge play, but there's some question of how to get there. I definitely am not getting a silver on turn 1 or 2 here - I'm not sure what's best, but it's some question of pawn, young witch and swindler. I find swindler really tempting, because it can nail every important card for quite a while - pawns go into estates, swindlers go into silver (which is the weakest thing), young witch turns into... I'm not sure, probably monument early, eventually feast, and most important, you can hit their apprentices into duchies. Oh and of course cursing attack on copper. You can get killed if you hit estates, but I think this is a risk you need to take. I don't like young witch with silver, because it's all about getting to forge, and I think the ability to block the curses is going to be more important because they will clog you for a good while and slow you way down in getting your apprentice/forge play going. You can clean it up eventually, but it will take a long time. I think this is a bigger deal than the decrease in buying power off of a pawn. In any case though, caravan is definitely the choice over silver, because getting your drawing up is going to be more important for the eventual apprentice/forge thing. As the game rolled, I think it was a little about Stef outplaying him, a little about shuffle luck, and a decent bit about first turn (you get the curses in shuffles earlier and then it snowballs).

Game 2: I actually think I would go for black market and the engine here. But the thing is, trader is not a card you want for a deck like that. I would have gotten... possibly, probably talisman for caravans off the opening. Stef's play is unconvincing; it seemed not well coordinated as I watched the video. But he also gets really dreadful luck with all of the important black market cards getting stuck at the end of the deck. Like ALL of them. And he isn't THAT far off of winning. But Mandarin into BM is better than people give credit for, too; the thing is, it's not super fast, but it has good longevity - it can get to 5,6,7 provinces without that much problem, once you have the proper build-up for the 4 that you'd normally look at. So maybe on average the BM works out anyway, but I still sort of like the Black Market here, but maybe that's my pendulum have over-swung to engine nowadays.

Game 3: I don't like moneylender here - the copper trashing is not going to be super good for this kind of deck, you be in better shape with almost anything else (well, maybe not bridge, which is definitely what I would have swindled the thing into rather than replacing with another moneylender. I would love to do an ironworks thing here - I am not sure, it's probably not quite good enough. IW/Highway obviously can't go as large as it often can here, but you can get tournaments, and with one highway, grab hunting parties. Probably this is too elaborate, and the simple hunting party stack with mountebanks, maybe with a swindler (I think probably), and and maybe with tournaments (actually, I think not). Well, Stef gets a tiny amount of bad luck early, but getting moneylender hit is really not an issue, and he gets big luck for the provinces after that, and the tournaments roll after this.

Game 4: Initially I was thinking no stewards, but with a lot of extra thought, I would think one. And you want an ironworks. Just one. You really need to get your engine up, and I think it's more preferable to do this off getting big wharf chains than trashing the deck super thin. Well, Stef plays it really well, strategically (I would have liked one more wharf and FV over a couple conspirators, but this isn't 100% clear from an objective standpoint), and lespeuture goes a little off with the second steward, but not so bad himself. But they both get this uneven wharf thing, which opens them up for problems, which they both hit, but it's really hard to avoid this, because you do want to draw everything on the turn - this is part of why I want more wharves, but sometimes you take that risk, because if you can get it right, it is faster. I might have greened earlier than this, and I think this is decently close, with Stef getting early luck but bad luck late, which is somehow the opposite of the previous game. Taken together, seems equitable to me.

Game 5: The interesting thing is, young witch with fool's gold is going to lose to the straight fool's gold, but I would expect that to have lost to the apothecary/tournament engine, with horns of plenty to top of a mega-turn - but that in turn is not going to hold up to cursing very well, losing to YW/FG. So I don't know, probably I go FG/FG as an open, and if they go for the engine pick up a YW later. Well, I guess young witch isn't too bad for FG anyway, with the filtering, so it's a close call.

Game 6: So there's going to be two phases to the game, the cursing and the goons. Well, if you lose the cursing phase too badly, and then it's just over. For the goons, you want a lot of draw, but you can dodge torturers long enough that familiars should probably win the curse split. And you can use some alchemists for draw. You know, cartographer is familiar's best friend, so you want some of them before the war goes down, but it's less important for goons. I think lespeuture gets a couple too many (say over alchemists), but with the big curse win, it's not too consequential.

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #105 on: January 27, 2013, 04:13:27 pm »
0

You forgot game 7
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #106 on: January 27, 2013, 04:44:47 pm »
0

You forgot game 7
No, I just don't have coherent thoughts on it.

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #107 on: January 27, 2013, 08:24:23 pm »
+1

I put together a sim for game 3 and it suggested that tournament/swindler was the stronger opening. However, the menageries seem to hardly help a swindler deck but be of great benefit to the moneylender deck, making it quite even. First player advantage seemed most significant.
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Davio

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #108 on: January 28, 2013, 08:23:22 am »
0

Congrats on advancing Stef.

By the time I watched the vids I was rooting for lespeutere as well, hope you don't mind. :)

I found it a shame that many of the boards were very swingy/luck dependent, but what can you do? I mean, the player decisions almost felt like micro optimizations compared to how decisive a good or bad shuffle was sometimes. You getting those 2 early Provinces in the Tournament/MB/HP game was unreal and so was you losing the curse split 2-8 with the Familiars.

Overall fun to watch though.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #109 on: January 28, 2013, 08:54:59 am »
+2

It's really hard not to root for the person making the video, particularly when there is commentary.  Hearing about the thoughts, seeing the emotional reactions, ...
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #110 on: January 28, 2013, 10:12:25 am »
0

I found it a shame that many of the boards were very swingy/luck dependent, but what can you do?

Maybe if there were enough good kingdoms submitted, theory could select for the third place match, as well?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #111 on: January 28, 2013, 01:36:16 pm »
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I don't know that I found this set of matches particularly luck dependent.

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #112 on: January 28, 2013, 04:06:23 pm »
0

I don't know that I found this set of matches particularly luck dependent.

Yeah, I don't think they were extraordinary luck dependent. But they were extremly favoring first player. Tournament twice, cursers, Fool's Gold... So in the end it's probably only logical that the first player advantage won between two players that good (though Stef is probably still a slight tough above everyone else).
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #113 on: January 28, 2013, 04:18:02 pm »
0

I don't know that I found this set of matches particularly luck dependent.

Yeah, I don't think they were extraordinary luck dependent. But they were extremly favoring first player. Tournament twice, cursers, Fool's Gold... So in the end it's probably only logical that the first player advantage won between two players that good (though Stef is probably still a slight tough above everyone else).
Stef is 6.5 levels above anyone else at the moment. I think it's more than just first player advantage. After him it gets closer again, but he is just miles above anyone else at the moment. (Interestingly, olneyce, a level 42, seems to have the 2nd highest skill.)
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kn1tt3r

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #114 on: January 28, 2013, 04:38:00 pm »
0

I don't know that I found this set of matches particularly luck dependent.

Yeah, I don't think they were extraordinary luck dependent. But they were extremly favoring first player. Tournament twice, cursers, Fool's Gold... So in the end it's probably only logical that the first player advantage won between two players that good (though Stef is probably still a slight tough above everyone else).
Stef is 6.5 levels above anyone else at the moment. I think it's more than just first player advantage. After him it gets closer again, but he is just miles above anyone else at the moment. (Interestingly, olneyce, a level 42, seems to have the 2nd highest skill.)

Sure, I see that. But nevertheless those matches had more 1st player advantage than average.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #115 on: January 28, 2013, 04:42:54 pm »
0

I don't know that I found this set of matches particularly luck dependent.

Yeah, I don't think they were extraordinary luck dependent. But they were extremly favoring first player. Tournament twice, cursers, Fool's Gold... So in the end it's probably only logical that the first player advantage won between two players that good (though Stef is probably still a slight tough above everyone else).
Stef is 6.5 levels above anyone else at the moment. I think it's more than just first player advantage. After him it gets closer again, but he is just miles above anyone else at the moment. (Interestingly, olneyce, a level 42, seems to have the 2nd highest skill.)
That's what playing only a couple games a week will do for you!

It looks like I've gone 27-4 in the month and a half since being eliminated from the tournament.  Bumping my skill up 3 points, while knocking the certainty down about the same amount.
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #116 on: January 29, 2013, 01:33:03 pm »
+2

So, Mic Qsenoch is losing this poll.

You know who lost last year's poll?  olneyce

Just sayin' :)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #117 on: January 29, 2013, 02:11:14 pm »
0

So, Mic Qsenoch is losing this poll.

You know who lost last year's poll?  olneyce

Just sayin' :)

Are you saying the DS poll is like the Presidents Trophy in the NHL?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #118 on: January 29, 2013, 02:25:50 pm »
0

So, Mic Qsenoch is losing this poll.

You know who lost last year's poll?  olneyce

Just sayin' :)

I voted for Mic.
Just sayin' :)
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #119 on: January 29, 2013, 02:57:06 pm »
0

Is there going to be a bronze medal match?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #120 on: January 29, 2013, 05:18:15 pm »
0

So, Mic Qsenoch is losing this poll.

You know who lost last year's poll?  olneyce

Just sayin' :)

I voted for Mic.
Just sayin' :)

We are the 6.7%!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #121 on: January 29, 2013, 05:45:26 pm »
0

So, Mic Qsenoch is losing this poll.

You know who lost last year's poll?  olneyce

Just sayin' :)

I voted for Mic.
Just sayin' :)

We are the 6.7%!

Well, you have to consider the fact that some votes aren't counting anymore. Without those, you are the...8,75%. Congrats.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #122 on: February 01, 2013, 08:16:43 am »
+1

Any word on when the final is yet?

I think I'm gonna be rooting for Stef. That way I'm part of the long chain of losers (I'd have lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to Stef (and I think I put the right number of clauses in there), which is a lot more amusing than going through winner wise.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.
I hereby declare myself the best dominion player in the world. Obviously.

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #123 on: February 01, 2013, 01:12:07 pm »
0

Any word on when the final is yet?

I think I'm gonna be rooting for Stef. That way I'm part of the long chain of losers (I'd have lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to Stef (and I think I put the right number of clauses in there), which is a lot more amusing than going through winner wise.
The guys over at the GameFAQs contest board call this the Ultimate Loser.
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #124 on: February 01, 2013, 01:21:52 pm »
0

Any word on when the final is yet?

I think I'm gonna be rooting for Stef. That way I'm part of the long chain of losers (I'd have lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to the person who lost to Stef (and I think I put the right number of clauses in there), which is a lot more amusing than going through winner wise.
The guys over at the GameFAQs contest board call this the Ultimate Loser.

Oh man, are you a B8er?  I used to be super into that crowd and LUE.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #125 on: February 01, 2013, 01:27:03 pm »
0

Heh. I'm a long time GFAQs user (like 2.2k karma), but avoid the social boards. Ultimate Loser sounds about right, yes.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.
I hereby declare myself the best dominion player in the world. Obviously.

SirPeebles

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #126 on: February 01, 2013, 03:13:13 pm »
0

Ha, theory was a LUEser?  4251 karma here.
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #127 on: February 01, 2013, 03:18:56 pm »
0

I tried to log back on but it seems like my LUE-eligible account got merged/deleted/closed?  :(  I was online since early 2003. 
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #128 on: February 01, 2013, 03:22:53 pm »
+3

"What are some good board games for people who aren't into board games?"

That's the first topic on LUE right now, coincidentally.  Dominion!

Edit:  More specifically, the OP asked "I am going to get Ticket to Ride for sure, and I have Settlers of Catan and Pandemic. I'm looking for something a little faster, though, maybe a card game?"

I was the first person to recommend Dominion.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2013, 03:24:30 pm by SirPeebles »
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #129 on: February 01, 2013, 06:43:32 pm »
0

Point him to this thread, it'll be fun!
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.
I hereby declare myself the best dominion player in the world. Obviously.

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #130 on: February 01, 2013, 07:33:55 pm »
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Nah, he says that he already has Dominion, but that there's not enough interaction and you sit there bored as the other three players take forever to finish their turns.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #131 on: February 01, 2013, 07:35:25 pm »
0

Innovation? Lots of interaction there.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #132 on: February 01, 2013, 08:52:54 pm »
0

Huzzah!  My LUE account has been restored!  With ... 894 karma (out of a possible 4830)

Why is there a "_basic" at the end of my name?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #134 on: February 02, 2013, 02:18:49 am »
+1

Nah, he says that he already has Dominion, but that there's not enough interaction and you sit there bored as the other three players take forever to finish their turns.
This is somewhat true, I find 3 to be the optimal number in real life, but 4 is just over the edge for me.
With 2 it's also fun, but you hardly have time to shuffle!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #135 on: February 02, 2013, 11:27:45 am »
0

I have a reliable source that the final will be tomorrow.

theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #136 on: February 02, 2013, 12:01:33 pm »
0

Yep.  18:00 GMT
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #137 on: February 02, 2013, 12:20:58 pm »
0

Livestream?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #138 on: February 02, 2013, 02:38:12 pm »
+4

Seems unlikely since I don't think either of them are streamers ...

The third place match will be at the same time, and will use the same kingdoms.  I can ask lespeutere if he'd like to stream.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #139 on: February 02, 2013, 02:44:24 pm »
+2

iso is really lacking a spectator mode
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #140 on: February 02, 2013, 05:08:46 pm »
0

The third place match will be at the same time, and will use the same kingdoms

Interesting!!
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #141 on: February 02, 2013, 09:20:12 pm »
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Looking forward to the big game tomorrow.
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theory

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #142 on: February 02, 2013, 11:14:13 pm »
+2

To reiterate: both the final and third place matches are tomorrow at 18:00 GMT / 10AM PST / 12PM CST / 1PM EST!  We'll probably be in the Secret Chamber, and either GE or me will be there to give out the kingdom sets. 
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #143 on: February 02, 2013, 11:56:04 pm »
0

I'll be there too! Anyone want to play out the sets with me?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #144 on: February 03, 2013, 08:29:07 am »
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That's a cool idea, I'm in.
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #145 on: February 03, 2013, 10:40:03 am »
0

Will anyone be recording or live streaming the final?
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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #146 on: February 03, 2013, 11:12:11 am »
0

Will anyone be recording or live streaming the final?
As noted above, neither of the finalists does this, so probably no.

I could probably record the lobby conversations, if you really wanted, as I plan on sitting there and chatting the sets up with whoever else is there. But I expect that would be a very very boring recording.

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #147 on: February 03, 2013, 11:20:10 am »
0

Will anyone be recording or live streaming the final?
As noted above, neither of the finalists does this, so probably no.

I could probably record the lobby conversations, if you really wanted, as I plan on sitting there and chatting the sets up with whoever else is there. But I expect that would be a very very boring recording.
Want to play the sets with someone (say myself), and record that?
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WanderingWinder

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #148 on: February 03, 2013, 11:22:10 am »
0

Will anyone be recording or live streaming the final?
As noted above, neither of the finalists does this, so probably no.

I could probably record the lobby conversations, if you really wanted, as I plan on sitting there and chatting the sets up with whoever else is there. But I expect that would be a very very boring recording.
Want to play the sets with someone (say myself), and record that?
Not while the matches are going on - I'll almost certainly miss the action!

philosophyguy

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #149 on: February 03, 2013, 11:45:13 am »
+2

Just checkingÖsets released and chat in Secret Chamber rather than Tournament?
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Dsell

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #150 on: February 03, 2013, 12:43:46 pm »
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It would be awesome if someone would copy and paste the lobby conversation, if possible, and post it somewhere. I thought I was going to be there but now it looks like I'm going to miss the first hour or so.
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shraeye

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #151 on: February 03, 2013, 01:21:47 pm »
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so...it is happening right now?
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Morgrim7

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Re: 2012 DominionStrategy.com Championships: Final Four
« Reply #152 on: February 11, 2013, 12:14:38 am »
0

Congrats to Stef!
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Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246
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