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[ftl]

So Donald X suggested that in a post:

Obv. there are campaigns, and new players do gravitate towards them; the important thing currently is, man, replace the main set campaign with a better one. And then that's uh 60 games so there you go.

However! I believe Goko wants more campaigns. Specifically they want multi-expansion campaigns. There may be nifty tools available for spicing up levels, but let's say for the moment that there aren't, that all you have to work with is the set of 10 and the starting decks. And the number of players and which bots they are if that's relevant and the paragraph of flavor at the start. And how many zaps you get. Possibly I'm forgetting something.

So anyway. You, Beyond Awesome, and your pals at dominionstrategy.com, could make just such a campaign. Pick two or three expansions and only use those cards (expansions meaning the published ones, so Prosperity and Cornucopia and so on, I am just clarifying that I don't mean the half-sets like Bigger and Better). Tell your story, such as it is. Try to make the levels fun. Maybe 20 levels? Since that's what the others are.

And I mean if you produce this thing and offer it to them, directly or through me, then odds are they will put it up when they get to fixing the campaigns.

I think that's would be interesting to try and make. I'd try it solo, but it would probably turn out better with more than just me!

Anyone interested in collaborating?

[werothegreat]

Sure, why not.  I'll come up with Johnny kingdoms that are all best-case scenarios for the cards I think work in all kingdoms for some reason.  And then we can rig the AI to only do that combo.

[ftl]

I don't think we can rig the AI.

[werothegreat]

Can we fiddle with endgame conditions?

[Donald X.]

Can we fiddle with endgame conditions?

There is a list of proposed features, but for this one I recommend just making do with what it already does. There can be more campaigns later.

You can pick which existing bots the opponents are, that is the one control over the AI you have. Well that and starting deck.

[werothegreat]

Ideas:

-AI starts with all the Provinces - you have to Saboteur/Graverob them back
-Make your entire deck Rats in a certain amount of turns
-Trash your entire deck in a certain amount of turns


Or we could just do sets of 10 with a story.

This would never happen, but it would be interesting if it were 10 random piles.  Well, maybe not 10, let's say 3.  3 random piles where you didn't know what was in any of them except the top.

[ftl]

Those are cool and all, but at the moment that's not what the specs are for designing something that would make it in...

[werothegreat]

Hrrrmrmrmrmr...

Maybe it would be best to decide which expansions to use, first.

The Saboteur/Graverob thing would only work if you used Dark Ages and Intrigue, or maybe Dark Ages and Hinterlands (Rogue/Highway).

I'd definitely be down for coming up with a story (I'm somewhat good with that, to toot a horn).

[ftl]

Well, before we decide which expansions to use we probably figure out who's actually in just the two of us would work but I think Ozle had mentioned he was interested, back in the original thread.

Story is good. I was wondering whether I'd have to do that and probably make a mess of it because I ain't a writer by any means. Not like anyone reads them carefully, but still.

I'd vote for using an expansion they don't have a campaign for yet. Maybe Alchemy? It should be out soon. So many people hate Alchemy but it doesn't have to be bad, I like it! If we can make something that'll help people like Alchemy that would be nice

I feel that I don't have a high-level grasp of a lot of DA cards, I'd be sort of worried that I'd mess up DA sets by not knowing what I'm doing with them.

[jonts26]

Well, before we decide which expansions to use we probably figure out who's actually in just the two of us would work but I think Ozle had mentioned he was interested, back in the original thread.

Story is good. I was wondering whether I'd have to do that and probably make a mess of it because I ain't a writer by any means. Not like anyone reads them carefully, but still.

I'd vote for using an expansion they don't have a campaign for yet. Maybe Alchemy? It should be out soon. So many people hate Alchemy but it doesn't have to be bad, I like it! If we can make something that'll help people like Alchemy that would be nice

I feel that I don't have a high-level grasp of a lot of DA cards, I'd be sort of worried that I'd mess up DA sets by not knowing what I'm doing with them.

I could be in for some campaign making. How about an alchemy/cornucopia campaign? Those sets were designed as one big one that got split in two at some point. Certainly it will make for incredibly enginey games so take that big money.

Thematically it might be a little hard. Alchemists and harvest time arent exactly easy to combine.

[werothegreat]

We could do a campaign that focuses on Dark Ages, and pairs with a different set with each act.  So the first act could be DA/Cornucopia, the next act DA/Alchemy, and then some sort of finale.

[eHalcyon]

Well, before we decide which expansions to use we probably figure out who's actually in just the two of us would work but I think Ozle had mentioned he was interested, back in the original thread.

Story is good. I was wondering whether I'd have to do that and probably make a mess of it because I ain't a writer by any means. Not like anyone reads them carefully, but still.

I'd vote for using an expansion they don't have a campaign for yet. Maybe Alchemy? It should be out soon. So many people hate Alchemy but it doesn't have to be bad, I like it! If we can make something that'll help people like Alchemy that would be nice

I feel that I don't have a high-level grasp of a lot of DA cards, I'd be sort of worried that I'd mess up DA sets by not knowing what I'm doing with them.

I could be in for some campaign making. How about an alchemy/cornucopia campaign? Those sets were designed as one big one that got split in two at some point. Certainly it will make for incredibly enginey games so take that big money.

Thematically it might be a little hard. Alchemists and harvest time arent exactly easy to combine.

The Alchemists are ready to brew up some delicious Potions, but they are missing their key ingredient!  Can you Harvest it for them in time for the big Hunting Party at the Fairgrounds?




Wrong Party, I know.

[werothegreat]

Well, before we decide which expansions to use we probably figure out who's actually in just the two of us would work but I think Ozle had mentioned he was interested, back in the original thread.

Story is good. I was wondering whether I'd have to do that and probably make a mess of it because I ain't a writer by any means. Not like anyone reads them carefully, but still.

I'd vote for using an expansion they don't have a campaign for yet. Maybe Alchemy? It should be out soon. So many people hate Alchemy but it doesn't have to be bad, I like it! If we can make something that'll help people like Alchemy that would be nice

I feel that I don't have a high-level grasp of a lot of DA cards, I'd be sort of worried that I'd mess up DA sets by not knowing what I'm doing with them.

I could be in for some campaign making. How about an alchemy/cornucopia campaign? Those sets were designed as one big one that got split in two at some point. Certainly it will make for incredibly enginey games so take that big money.

Thematically it might be a little hard. Alchemists and harvest time arent exactly easy to combine.

The Alchemists are ready to brew up some delicious Potions, but they are missing their key ingredient!  Can you Harvest it for them in time for the big Hunting Party at the Fairgrounds?




Wrong Party, I know.

I'd prefer to do something a little more classy than Goko's little things.

[eHalcyon]

Well, before we decide which expansions to use we probably figure out who's actually in just the two of us would work but I think Ozle had mentioned he was interested, back in the original thread.

Story is good. I was wondering whether I'd have to do that and probably make a mess of it because I ain't a writer by any means. Not like anyone reads them carefully, but still.

I'd vote for using an expansion they don't have a campaign for yet. Maybe Alchemy? It should be out soon. So many people hate Alchemy but it doesn't have to be bad, I like it! If we can make something that'll help people like Alchemy that would be nice

I feel that I don't have a high-level grasp of a lot of DA cards, I'd be sort of worried that I'd mess up DA sets by not knowing what I'm doing with them.

I could be in for some campaign making. How about an alchemy/cornucopia campaign? Those sets were designed as one big one that got split in two at some point. Certainly it will make for incredibly enginey games so take that big money.

Thematically it might be a little hard. Alchemists and harvest time arent exactly easy to combine.

The Alchemists are ready to brew up some delicious Potions, but they are missing their key ingredient!  Can you Harvest it for them in time for the big Hunting Party at the Fairgrounds?




Wrong Party, I know.

I'd prefer to do something a little more classy than Goko's little things.

Haven't actually looked at Goko's Adventures.  I just heard someone ask for a story.

That wasn't a serious suggestion, by the way.

[werothegreat]

Well, before we decide which expansions to use we probably figure out who's actually in just the two of us would work but I think Ozle had mentioned he was interested, back in the original thread.

Story is good. I was wondering whether I'd have to do that and probably make a mess of it because I ain't a writer by any means. Not like anyone reads them carefully, but still.

I'd vote for using an expansion they don't have a campaign for yet. Maybe Alchemy? It should be out soon. So many people hate Alchemy but it doesn't have to be bad, I like it! If we can make something that'll help people like Alchemy that would be nice

I feel that I don't have a high-level grasp of a lot of DA cards, I'd be sort of worried that I'd mess up DA sets by not knowing what I'm doing with them.

I could be in for some campaign making. How about an alchemy/cornucopia campaign? Those sets were designed as one big one that got split in two at some point. Certainly it will make for incredibly enginey games so take that big money.

Thematically it might be a little hard. Alchemists and harvest time arent exactly easy to combine.

The Alchemists are ready to brew up some delicious Potions, but they are missing their key ingredient!  Can you Harvest it for them in time for the big Hunting Party at the Fairgrounds?




Wrong Party, I know.

I'd prefer to do something a little more classy than Goko's little things.

Haven't actually looked at Goko's Adventures.  I just heard someone ask for a story.

That wasn't a serious suggestion, by the way.

It was too eerily similar to Goko's actual descriptions that I took it seriously.

[Beyond Awesome]

I'm in.

I like the idea of DA campaign with Alchemy for Act 1, Cornucopia Act 2 and DA for Act 3. I was also thinking long term and if this campaign turns out well, we might want to do them for other combinations like Seaside/Prosperity, etc. I think a good starting point is using Donald X.'s recommended kingdoms for Alchemy, Cornucopia and going from there. Assuming, he is fine with that. Just thinking that might save us a little time. 60 levels is a lot of levels to program. But, if we are to do it the Goko way the first 3 levels tend to introduce some cards and then the boss battle has the cards we introduced. I don't know if we are going to do it that way or not.

[werothegreat]

I'm in.

I like the idea of DA campaign with Alchemy for Act 1, Cornucopia Act 2 and DA for Act 3. I was also thinking long term and if this campaign turns out well, we might want to do them for other combinations like Seaside/Prosperity, etc. I think a good starting point is using Donald X.'s recommended kingdoms for Alchemy, Cornucopia and going from there. Assuming, he is fine with that. Just thinking that might save us a little time. 60 levels is a lot of levels to program. But, if we are to do it the Goko way the first 3 levels tend to introduce some cards and then the boss battle has the cards we introduced. I don't know if we are going to do it that way or not.

The cards need to be introduced in a way that spotlights them, instead of just throwing them into a random kingdom.

[eHalcyon]

It was too eerily similar to Goko's actual descriptions that I took it seriously.

Oh.  Oh no.  I guess the need for new campaigns is greater than I thought!

[rrenaud]

Can you make a campaign that tries to teach strategy lessons?  For example, in theory's review of Dominion, he has two kingdom sets that have very high kingdom overlap, but that have a very different optimal strategies. 

http://dominionstrategy.com/2012/05/29/dominionreview/

Maybe if you guys are making a dominionstrategy campaign, you could focus on a campaign that contains some dominion strategy lessons.

[Beyond Awesome]

Can you make a campaign that tries to teach strategy lessons?  For example, in theory's review of Dominion, he has two kingdom sets that have very high kingdom overlap, but that have a very different optimal strategies. 

http://dominionstrategy.com/2012/05/29/dominionreview/

Maybe if you guys are making a dominionstrategy campaign, you could focus on a campaign that contains some dominion strategy lessons.

That would be ideal. The biggest thing to keep in mind is that casual players will be playing this and some of the subtle things might go over their heads. We are talking about people who usually load up on villages or load up on terminals when no villages are available.

[ftl]

I would expect that well-designed sets could  lead people to see strategies with the cards they're playing with. I do not think we should get super-clever and try to do things like show how single-card changes lead to changes in strategy or whatever, or try to railroad players into learning particular strategies or anything.

[Ozle]

Me no smart enough to come up with challenging combos, but I could possibly do the early easy levels and help with the story.

Mainly I just want to write the story when i volunteered in the other thread.

My thoughts would be, everyone creates kingdoms within a certain parameter, label them into one of 4 cats, Easy, Medium, Hard, Very Hard.

Then we have a vote and pick our favourite 4 of each, repeat for each 'level'
Then decide on an order
Then come up with an over arching story
Then come up with individual story for each one.

[Beyond Awesome]

Me no smart enough to come up with challenging combos, but I could possibly do the early easy levels and help with the story.

Mainly I just want to write the story when i volunteered in the other thread.

My thoughts would be, everyone creates kingdoms within a certain parameter, label them into one of 4 cats, Easy, Medium, Hard, Very Hard.

Then we have a vote and pick our favourite 4 of each, repeat for each 'level'
Then decide on an order
Then come up with an over arching story
Then come up with individual story for each one.

I don't think the goal is so much to come up with hard kingdoms. That is already taken care of by Goko's zap system.

[werothegreat]

Me no smart enough to come up with challenging combos, but I could possibly do the early easy levels and help with the story.

Mainly I just want to write the story when i volunteered in the other thread.

My thoughts would be, everyone creates kingdoms within a certain parameter, label them into one of 4 cats, Easy, Medium, Hard, Very Hard.

Then we have a vote and pick our favourite 4 of each, repeat for each 'level'
Then decide on an order
Then come up with an over arching story
Then come up with individual story for each one.

I don't think the goal is so much to come up with hard kingdoms. That is already taken care of by Goko's zap system.

Well, we could start with obvious engine boards, then maybe try something where you need Procession for +Actions...

[Ozle]

Me no smart enough to come up with challenging combos, but I could possibly do the early easy levels and help with the story.

Mainly I just want to write the story when i volunteered in the other thread.

My thoughts would be, everyone creates kingdoms within a certain parameter, label them into one of 4 cats, Easy, Medium, Hard, Very Hard.

Then we have a vote and pick our favourite 4 of each, repeat for each 'level'
Then decide on an order
Then come up with an over arching story
Then come up with individual story for each one.

I don't think the goal is so much to come up with hard kingdoms. That is already taken care of by Goko's zap system.

I was sort of including the Goko zap system in it.

However possibly Hard was the wrong word. Simple - Complex possibly?
For example, you dont want to throw Kings Court and Goons at them in a first game do you