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[Robz888]

Robz wanting to Vig me is ridiculous. YES my claim makes me more like death, I promise I'm town and this isn't a gambit.

Pros to lynching Robz: He wants to vig me, didn't note a role in the list he keeps toting everyone to know, and tried to dayvig eevee when there was no consensus

Pros to lynching Galz: The wording above was used TWICE. Because there is only one QT between the 3 players it is IMPOSSIBLE for Robz to be scum and also vig scum, although I still think Robz would have dayvigged as scum.

I know I am town, and I know eevee is town, so if Galzria is actually town, he should shoot you. Is Galzria actually town? Probably not, but it's possible. I think it's less possible now that you've explained fully.

[Robz888]

Oh this is scum self-voting, if ever there was one.

[Galzria]

King of Swords, Ace of Wands - to be specific.

If there are any other Vig's out there, they should shoot Eevee tonight, since it removes a NK, and WW's can't do it, and Mafia won't see the need to. Vig'ing Robz will be pointless since he'll be lynched tomorrow anyway.

[Galzria]

Robz is WW. Eevee is SK.

King of Swords, Ace of Wands - to be specific.

If there are any other Vig's out there, they should shoot Eevee tonight, since it removes a NK, and WW's can't do it, and Mafia won't see the need to. Vig'ing Robz will be pointless since he'll be lynched tomorrow anyway.

[Robz888]

King of Swords, Ace of Wands - to be specific.

If there are any other Vig's out there, they should shoot Eevee tonight, since it removes a NK, and WW's can't do it, and Mafia won't see the need to. Vig'ing Robz will be pointless since he'll be lynched tomorrow anyway.

Well go ahead, it won't hurt Eevee.

[Voltgloss]

Hmm.

Well first off, that is a very detailed full claim.  Doesn't feel fake.  Insom could be lying about his alignment, but I expect his role works as he says it does.

One thing to confirm:  Insom, if a player is a Serial Killer, then I assume you wouldn't see them as having a QT, right?  (As Death in Major Arcana I, I was classified as a Serial Killer and I did not have a QT.)

I am not following why Robz's desire to claim early gives him town points.  As scum Dayvig, he could have been looking for the best target Day 1 just in case he wound up being the Day 1 lynch. 

PPE:  Insom, so I am clear:  are you suggesting Galz's comment that "if Robz hits scum he gets to live" is basically a scumslip that Robz could have hit scum if he had targeted right (i.e., picked Galz)?

PPE #2:  Galz, what the hell with the self-vote, man.  If you are town, I am just not comprehending how that is pro-town.

[Insomniac]

Galz what the crap. I prefer Robz today

@Volt RE Galz: It's possible the wording made me very uneasy
@Volt RE SK: If for some reason the serial killer has a qt I would see it, if they do not I would not.

[shraeye]

On Ins:
His alignment is so not clear. I am even suspecting scum more, as the role is somewhat similar to High Priestess (power which can help you with finding other team, but also town PRs).

Do note that if he dies, something weird will happen.

Yes, something will happen on a MA's death, but it's not clear if it's good or bad.  Just something unusual (Recall Grujah gaining some power after killing Robz last Arcana game).  I'm also unclear about Insomniac's alignment. 

Hm.. I guess it's between Galz and Robz for sure, based on his rashness to shoot. But he is crazy Robz ATM, which I heard means town Robz, but I don't give too much credit for that, he can fake/change. Galz's explanation post was written in a way that it seems like almost 100% that Robz is scum. Maybe not intentional :s. I also didn't like Galz's insta-claim, for no reason.

I don't give Robz town-credit for his reaction at all.  I also don't like Galz's insta-claim but I still think it's honest at this point.

After re-reading both Robz and Galz, I think either of them could be scum, but I'm leaning towards Robz. His posts seem more like scummy scrambling than cornered Townie. I certainly think he's clever enough to come up with "if I pretend I don't know my role exists, it'll be obvious I don't have it." I'm also not thrilled about his attempted vig. I know he'll say he was forced into it, but I think Town Robz would have tried to talk his way out of it first.

I am mulling further on my commute, but one thing that stands out to me as weird is Eevee's reluctance to claim.  If he were the "ordinary" bulletproof townie, I don't see why he wouldn't claim that at this juncture.  We know he's bulletproof - he would just be confirming what we already know.

Robz is WW. Eevee is SK.

I'm slowly also reaching Galz's conclusion.  Eevee is SK who doesn't have a quicktopic; Robz is the one with the quicktopic from the group of three.  Voltgloss's point that Eevee should probably have just claimed if town rings true.  I don't like Eevee's response to this.

I didn't claim because I think protecting our major arcanas is a big deal. Basically didn't want to claim for no reason (and I wasn't/am not under a lynch threat or see no other benefit for town in claiming).

What does Eevee mean by 'protecting our major arcana'?  By not claiming, this leaves more people who could be major arcana, and gives scum more decisions over who to shoot?  Are you forgetting completely that in MA1, BOTH major arcana were scum-aligned.  And that Insomniac is already claiming Major Arcana in this game and says that he's town-aligned.   Combined with Eevee's hesitance to let Galz vig Insomniac, Eevee must buy Insom's towniness.  I am really certain that both major arcana in this game would not be town-aligned.  So basically saying that you are 'protecting major arcana' is one thing, but really there isn't that much incentive for a townmember to continue to protect major arcana in this game, especially if they believe Insomniac's towniness.

[Voltgloss]

@Volt RE SK: If for some reason the serial killer has a qt I would see it, if they do not I would not.

OK.  So for what it's worth, let me reiterate:  I was SK in the first Major Arcana game, and I did not have a QT.  I would expect, more likely than not, that cayvie would follow the same approach in this game.

[Robz888]

Volt gloss, because my claim makes me look really really bad. Insomniac says there is one scum between the three offs, and if I am scum, I am that one scum. So claiming a role that is 50% chance scum and then shooting one of the other three was not going to be a long term survival plan.

[Galzria]

My fucking god Volt. It's like nobody reads the crap I post, even when I've already quoted it 4 times. Well here it is AGAIN:

Cayvie, would the Ace of Wands be immune to the King of Swords?

yes

Then from my perspective:

Town!Robz would kill all iterations of Town!Eevee except Nine of Swords. But cannot both be town, so this does not work.

Scum!Robz can not kill Eevee if Eevee is the 5 of Swords (Town!Eevee), or the Ace of Swords (SK!Eevee).

There is no world where Eevee is scum, and Robz is town. Ergo from my perspective, it's proven that Robz is scum. The problem town faces, is that Eevee has a 50% chance of being a SK.

Town: I suggest we lynch Robz, and I'll still NK Eevee. This cannot be stopped. I believe the reason Eevee agreed to this earlier is that he's the Ace of Swords, and he knew that one of two things was true: Robz was scum, and would flip such, making me inclined not to shoot him, OR, Robz was town, meaning I was lying scum, and could not Strong-Man Big him. In either case, he was likely safe.

If town does not wish to follow this plan, I'm willing to lynch myself. You lose my NK, but you have one confirmed scum (Robz), and one likely in Eevee (although not guaranteed. I suggest he gets Copped).

[jotheonah]

Wouldn't 3 scum on the same team have "one qt between the three of them" if that's the exact wording?

[Robz888]

Galz would self vote as scum. Remember his fake vote tactic in blitz whatever?

[shraeye]

Wouldn't 3 scum on the same team have "one qt between the three of them" if that's the exact wording?

Good point.  Insomniac, what do you think about this?



Also, on a totally unrelated note, I'm not gonna suitclaim.

[Insomniac]

Wouldn't 3 scum on the same team have "one qt between the three of them" if that's the exact wording?

No I recieve a number between 0-3 that tells me how many of the 3 players have access to a qt

[Insomniac]

Specifically

will tell you how many of those players have access to a quicktopic at night.

[Voltgloss]

My fucking god Volt. It's like nobody reads the crap I post, even when I've already quoted it 4 times. Well here it is AGAIN:

I did read this Galz, but I don't agree with it (or maybe don't understand it).

If town does not wish to follow this plan, I'm willing to lynch myself. You lose my NK, but you have one confirmed scum (Robz), and one likely in Eevee (although not guaranteed. I suggest he gets Copped).

The problem is that, if town lynches you, we don't have Robz confirmed to be scum.  We could have the situation of Robz being town!Dayvig, and Eevee being scum!Major-Arcana-who-is-bulletproof.

So that's why I don't see how lynching you is protown:  it doesn't solve our lynch question for Day 2.

[Robz888]

Volt, if Eevee is a bulletproof scum major arcana... I mean I'm just not weighing that option all too seriously.

[Insomniac]

At first, I'll admit when I set up my scheme I didn't realize I was a major arcana until I started putting my claim together and I kind of regretted it at first, but it killed RVS AND found (at least) 1 scum.

[Robz888]

At first, I'll admit when I set up my scheme I didn't realize I was a major arcana until I started putting my claim together and I kind of regretted it at first, but it killed RVS AND found (at least) 1 scum.

If Eevee wasn't bp it would have been a disaster. As is, it's okay I think. Even if we lynch me.

[Galzria]

My fucking god Volt. It's like nobody reads the crap I post, even when I've already quoted it 4 times. Well here it is AGAIN:

I did read this Galz, but I don't agree with it (or maybe don't understand it).

If town does not wish to follow this plan, I'm willing to lynch myself. You lose my NK, but you have one confirmed scum (Robz), and one likely in Eevee (although not guaranteed. I suggest he gets Copped).

The problem is that, if town lynches you, we don't have Robz confirmed to be scum.  We could have the situation of Robz being town!Dayvig, and Eevee being scum!Major-Arcana-who-is-bulletproof.

So that's why I don't see how lynching you is protown:  it doesn't solve our lynch question for Day 2.

Eevee STILL wouldn't have a QT in that situation, so Robz is STILL Werewolf. No problem. Ta-Da!

Even better, if you follow the following instead, it solves that fringe case:

Robz is WW. Eevee is SK.

King of Swords, Ace of Wands - to be specific.

If there are any other Vig's out there, they should shoot Eevee tonight, since it removes a NK, and WW's can't do it, and Mafia won't see the need to. Vig'ing Robz will be pointless since he'll be lynched tomorrow anyway.

[Robz888]

If I flip town, do you all agree (other than galz), that Eevee should not die? I think that's like obvious.

[Insomniac]

On to those that think I'm scum.

If I'm scum then this is undoubtably a gambit.

From MA1, the scumteam that had a major arcana had exactly two members. So lets look at what my gambit can accomplish.

1) My team gets to know what PR's there is between Robz/Galz/Eevee
2) I die when 0 of them flip scum
3) Best case scenario - All 3 get lynched then me. 16 players hell lets even assume its lynching and not vigging. 16-4=12 4 lynches buys 4 nk=12-4=8

So my team is down to 1/8 with another team around and possible a SK? Seems awful.

[shraeye]

King of Swords, Ace of Wands - to be specific.

If there are any other Vig's out there, they should shoot Eevee tonight, since it removes a NK, and WW's can't do it, and Mafia won't see the need to. Vig'ing Robz will be pointless since he'll be lynched tomorrow anyway.

Why aren't you going to be able to Vig Eevee yourself?

Do you really think you're getting lynched today?

[Voltgloss]

Galz, why wouldn't scum-MA-Eevee have a QT?  O was a scum Major Arcana in the first game, and he had a QT.