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Author Topic: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?  (Read 80483 times)

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Obi Wan Bonogi

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #50 on: December 24, 2012, 02:16:43 am »
+5

I gave it a shot, tried to be optimistic, but I was very let down and I haven't been back since.  I imagine that if there was positive feedback to it around here I would have went back on there and gave it another go.
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #51 on: December 24, 2012, 07:46:05 am »
0

Tried it, just didnt really like it to be honest.

Just wasn't a 'fun' experience to me

Although i hardly play on Iso any more these days, but usually crack out the Cards when mates over.
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #52 on: December 25, 2012, 12:53:43 pm »
+5

I recently tried Goko out for a day after buying Dark Ages.
Was disappointed by how expensive everything is, especially only getting 3 cards (that weren't even from DA!) after shelling out for the expansion, but I'll put that aside and talk exclusively about gameplay.
For someone who owns all the expansions, I quickly got bored with campaign. I can see its usefulness for new players, but what really bugged me is how little variation there was in the cards at the beginning (not even the full base set!) half of what I love about dominion is the variation, so that kind of put me off.
I like some of the ideas, like the handicapping the computer or giving them an advantage by messing with the starting set. thats an interesting idea.

For multiplayer, the single greatest thing that killed it for me was the lack of an automatch, and especially the small sizes of the game rooms. This isn't the 90's people! I think that by itself was the deal breaker for me.

I don't mind the interface, it'd be nice to turn off the background, and  its awkward to see what people did previously (even the text information drowns out important info with periods and extra stuff you don't need to know, and it all being white on brown makes it hard to distinguish things) and the position of the VP count (for counters) is awkward as well.
Not having a points counter and not having veto mode or an equivalent is a downer, but not a deal-breaker for me.

Also, the "Your Deck" feature must have been designed by someone who hadn't played the game much, as almost no one I know specifically picks ten, rather they pick in sets (mix of prosperity and hinterlands or something) or specific cards (I want rats and chapel and 8 other randoms for fun) and let the rest random. This would be way better than a stupid pick 10 specific cards or full random as the only two choices. That is also a bit of a downer. At least you can *not* use it.

So yeah, I'm not convinced I should spend time on Goko at all as of yet, and especially not convinced I need to shell out $20-30 for it.

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Kuildeous

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #53 on: December 26, 2012, 11:48:52 am »
0

I voted "Other" because I just don't find myself devoting a length of consistent time to playing an online game. Not as much as before, anyway.

And if I do get in the mood to still in front of a screen for a couple of hours, I usually choose more action-oriented games like Team Fortress. I'm fortunate enough to have a good pool of players to pull from when I am in a Dominion mood, so I just don't have enough interest in playing online. That could change in the future, though. Who knows?
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Taco Lobster

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #54 on: December 26, 2012, 12:51:03 pm »
0

I've wanted to buy an official Dominion online game for a while now, and since I began playing Dominion over two years ago, I've filled that want with various Dominion-like products, including the iPhone Gundabad game that is a direct rip-off, the rough fan version with only the Base set, and Ascension.  I participated in the beta, and enjoyed it as much as the substitutes I'd been sampling, but I'm not willing to pay the amount being asked for the product being delivered.  Here are my fundamental problems:

1.  Too Expensive:  This is an arbitrary issue - one person's expensive is another's good bargain - but I just can't justify paying so much to play Dominion.  I logged on for the first time in months yesterday, and noted that there's now a bundle that includes all of the coded expansions, the released expansions that have not been implemented online, and Dark Ages for a not completely unreasonable price (~$40, IIRC).  I came close to buying that, but ultimately didn't pull the trigger.  In large part, that decision was because getting $40 worth of owl coins required spending $50 in cash.  I realize there are a lot of virtual markets in which you can't purchase products for cash, and instead need to purchase an intermediate currency (e.g., Xbox live), but if I have to play games with exchange rates, and discounts for purchasing intermediate currency in bulk, I'm more likely to not bother and walk away. 

2.  Inability to Sculpt the Board:  The largest value of Goko to me has been the ability to play single player games.  It's not as competitive as playing against a human, but the computer also doesn't mind if you put the game down for 10 minutes to deal with feuding children.  Sometimes, I want to play with a particlar set to get a feel for it, or a particular handful of cards to test a combo.  For whatever reason, I can't make that choice.  Similarly, I can't even put constraints on the random card selection as is the case in Isotropic.  This is an important feature for me, and not having it makes me less excited about the game generally.

Neither of these is an insurmountable problem, but my current view is that the cost of the product is well in excess of similar products and that it fails to offer an experience of sufficient quality to justify that price.  If Goko had been released a year ago, being a graphics based, official Dominion game might've been sufficient for me to buy it.  But these days, the bar is set higher (particularly when the price charged is so high), and the ability to play a graphics based, official Dominion game, without much else and at a fairly high price, just isn't enough to justify the purchase.  On top of that, the high price plus the lack of a sophisticated ranking/data system as is available in Isotropic means that the player base is thin and significantly diminishes the value of the multiplayer online.

I really want to like Goko, I really want to play Dominion online, but I think I'm going to have to pass for now.  My expectations have moved since I started playing, and a product that I would've embraced a year ago is no longer in the ballpark of what I will purchase.
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hsiale

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #55 on: December 26, 2012, 01:19:18 pm »
+1

In large part, that decision was because getting $40 worth of owl coins required spending $50 in cash.
It doesn't. You can pay $20 twice, each time getting 230 owl coins, which is enough to buy the full package.
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Taco Lobster

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #56 on: December 26, 2012, 01:23:44 pm »
+1

In large part, that decision was because getting $40 worth of owl coins required spending $50 in cash.
It doesn't. You can pay $20 twice, each time getting 230 owl coins, which is enough to buy the full package.

Thank you! 

What can I say, I'm impatient and bad at math.  If something costs $40, I want to just pay $40 and be done with it.  Adding an additional level of purchasing decision, in which I need to figure out what constellation of online currency gets me to $40, annoys me and creates a disincentive to complete the transaction.

Thunderstone has received a stupid number of dollars from me due to the fact that I can purchase cards at an inflated price using the App Store.  (Though partly, that's because I also kept believing the game would become good/fun if only I had a few more cards - so far, this has not been true). 
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #57 on: December 26, 2012, 03:20:47 pm »
+2

Maybe Goko just likes knapsacks?
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Kirian

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #59 on: December 26, 2012, 08:17:33 pm »
+1

I don't play on it because I own the games irl.  I don't want to buy something that I've already bought.  I play on isotropic with the cards I own (I haven't gotten all the expansions yet), but not ones I don't have.  (I voted other on the poll)
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #60 on: December 26, 2012, 08:55:13 pm »
+1

For me, I actually think $40 is a reasonable price to pay for every expansion minus Guilds. I can see how their currency system makes things complicated though.

Goko has its pros and cons, but it is getting better.
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Kirian

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #61 on: December 27, 2012, 03:01:25 am »
0

For me, I actually think $40 is a reasonable price to pay for every expansion minus Guilds. I can see how their currency system makes things complicated though.

Goko has its pros and cons, but it is getting better.

I will admit that even as a major Goko detractor, these points are both true.  I could understand the complaints about price point when it looked like the price point was going to be $100 for all sets.  $45?  Seriously, that's the retail price of the base set!  That's a serious value for a good game.  I don't want to pay it in beta, but that's a separate point; the price point itself is not expensive at all.

And yes, Goko's getting better.  I really didn't intend this as a Goko-bashing thread--I hope it didn't come across that way!  I hop that the local Goko staffers are watching this thread, as it might offer them some insight.
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #62 on: December 27, 2012, 04:10:27 am »
0

For me, I actually think $40 is a reasonable price to pay for every expansion minus Guilds. I can see how their currency system makes things complicated though.

Goko has its pros and cons, but it is getting better.

I will admit that even as a major Goko detractor, these points are both true.  I could understand the complaints about price point when it looked like the price point was going to be $100 for all sets.  $45?  Seriously, that's the retail price of the base set!  That's a serious value for a good game.  I don't want to pay it in beta, but that's a separate point; the price point itself is not expensive at all.

And yes, Goko's getting better.  I really didn't intend this as a Goko-bashing thread--I hope it didn't come across that way!  I hop that the local Goko staffers are watching this thread, as it might offer them some insight.

If you really want, I will forward this thread to them. You are right. I think there are some good points for them to takeaway here.
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Piemaster

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #63 on: December 27, 2012, 06:18:56 am »
0

For me, I actually think $40 is a reasonable price to pay for every expansion minus Guilds. I can see how their currency system makes things complicated though.

Goko has its pros and cons, but it is getting better.

I will admit that even as a major Goko detractor, these points are both true.  I could understand the complaints about price point when it looked like the price point was going to be $100 for all sets.  $45?  Seriously, that's the retail price of the base set!  That's a serious value for a good game.  I don't want to pay it in beta, but that's a separate point; the price point itself is not expensive at all.

And yes, Goko's getting better.  I really didn't intend this as a Goko-bashing thread--I hope it didn't come across that way!  I hop that the local Goko staffers are watching this thread, as it might offer them some insight.

If you really want, I will forward this thread to them. You are right. I think there are some good points for them to takeaway here.

Although I fear that the point they might take away is that a lot more players would play there if only Isotropic was shut down...
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #64 on: December 27, 2012, 07:01:22 am »
+4

iPad.  You can't play on it, and it's my primary online device.

And I don't mean there's no native app.  I mean it doesn't work in Safari or Chrome on the iPad.
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greatexpectations

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #65 on: December 27, 2012, 08:57:51 am »
0

I will admit that even as a major Goko detractor, these points are both true.  I could understand the complaints about price point when it looked like the price point was going to be $100 for all sets.  $45?  Seriously, that's the retail price of the base set!  That's a serious value for a good game.  I don't want to pay it in beta, but that's a separate point; the price point itself is not expensive at all.

the trouble with the pricing is that (to me) it doesn't seem to make sense with what their intended market is. with all of the graphics and animations and all goko seems clearly catered towards the more casual gamer. you are right, to me $40 seems reasonable. but i am a more serious dominion fan, and i seriously doubt that the more casual fans out there are going to be willing to spend $40 for all of dominion like this. that demographic will likely want a cheap and easy implementation, and i think that the current price point will be a turn off.
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #66 on: December 27, 2012, 09:09:52 am »
+1

iPad.  You can't play on it, and it's my primary online device.

And I don't mean there's no native app.  I mean it doesn't work in Safari or Chrome on the iPad.

Normally it's the opposite problem.  There are a few games that are exclusive to the iPad that I'd love to play, but there's no PC version.
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Kuildeous

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #67 on: December 27, 2012, 09:12:17 am »
+2

the trouble with the pricing is that (to me) it doesn't seem to make sense with what their intended market is. with all of the graphics and animations and all goko seems clearly catered towards the more casual gamer. you are right, to me $40 seems reasonable. but i am a more serious dominion fan, and i seriously doubt that the more casual fans out there are going to be willing to spend $40 for all of dominion like this. that demographic will likely want a cheap and easy implementation, and i think that the current price point will be a turn off.

I'm no online marketing guru, so take my speculation with a grain of salt.

Hopefully, the casual gamer will see the small sets and be interested in paying only a few dollars to try something out. Maybe after completing the base adventure, the casual gamer will be intrigued in seeing the adventurer for Cornucopia or some such. After a few months of doing this, he might not even be aware that he's spent over $40. Obviously, the discerning Dominion fan knows that the package deal is pretty sweet, but this allows someone to dip his toes into the game and slowly submerge himself into our geekdom.

For that reason, I'm actually thinking that the store should not start off with the mega-value pack. That might scare away the casual gamer. Instead, start off with the cheaper sets and include some teasers. "Purchase this set to see the alluring Harem: It gives you 2 coins and is worth 2 Victory Points!" "Import more goods with the Wharf; you draw cards now and then again next turn!" There could a link for "Buy multiple sets and save!" This takes you to a page where you can buy the value packs.

I know that when playing Thunderstone online, I've paid more for cards than they're worth. A $2.50 transaction doesn't seem like a lot in the moment. I'm sure that online Dominion can get its fair share of those impulse buys.
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zaubererer

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #68 on: December 27, 2012, 10:48:13 am »
0

Because for 4 days they are undergoing routine maintainance.
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #69 on: December 27, 2012, 10:50:38 am »
+1

Because for 4 days they are undergoing routine maintainance.

Clear your cache.
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Kirian

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #70 on: December 27, 2012, 10:52:11 am »
+5

Because for 4 days they are undergoing routine maintainance.

Clear your cache.

This is actually one thing that gets me.  Never in the last ten years (likely more) have I had a website tell me to clear my browser cache to make their website work.
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Taco Lobster

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #71 on: December 27, 2012, 11:11:13 am »
+2

I don't mean to sound cheap - if you asked me in the abstract if I would pay $40 for electronic dominion, I probably would say yes.  But, goko is just so...I think half-assed is the best descriptor I can manage.  It still feels incomplete, and I don't have a lot of faith that they will still be around in twelve months.  It's not as if I'm buying a program that I can use irrespective of their continued existence.  I'm purchasing access to a website, and that access only has value for so long as the website is up.  That value is further reduced by the fact that much of the sets aren't available yet.  If $40 got me access to the whole shebang at the moment of purchase, I would've purchased.  But right now, $40 gets me access to the beta stuff and buys me a promise that I'll have access to the additional sets once they are finished being coded.  I don't know how much stock I put in that promise, and the fact that there's so much left to code just to get all the expansions released leads me to believe that the simple tools for board sculpting and better match-ups are even further away.

Heck, if I could pay $40 and get permanent access to the beta sets, that might even be enough.  But as long as my purchase is locked into a company that hasn't demonstrated a strong grasp of the product they are selling* and could go away at anytime, I have a hard time justifying the purchase at that price. 

Edit:
*For example, they seem to have spent a great deal of time and effort on the horrible looking avatars.  They clearly didn't understand how the game was played when they created that deck tool, and the fact that they wasted time programming something that wasn't relevant to the game and then publicly released it leads me to believe that they are not being careful or thoughtful in how they implement the game.  This is part of why I describe them as being half-assed - so much of the website feels like they handed the game off to a handful of offshore programmers, and then posted what they wrote without reviewing and revising to conform to the actual game they were trying to implement. 

« Last Edit: December 27, 2012, 11:37:41 am by Taco Lobster »
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Kuildeous

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #72 on: December 27, 2012, 11:38:41 am »
0

Well, can't really fault you for staying within your comfort level when it comes to spending money. Nobody wants to just piss money away. I've made my fair share of mistakes in the past, some of which are considerably more than $40. But I don't like the idea of losing even $10 unnecessarily.

For some, the risk is not worth it. For others, the risk is negligible for the price. Hell, how many board games did I buy for more than $40 that I only played once (if that often)? I at least can get more value out of Goko for that. Of course, the main solution is that I should stop spending over $40 on board games I won't play. I have a problem.

Some are more prone to risks. Kickstarter is a good indication of this. Some products would never have gotten off the ground if there weren't people who said, "You know, this may cost me $20, but I think it'll be a benefit in the long run." And when the Kickstarter project succeeds, the more conservative consumers can benefit from their wait-and-see attitude. Businesses need both types. Well, businesses probably prefer more risk-takers, but not everyone is going to be comfortable with that idea.
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Taco Lobster

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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #73 on: December 27, 2012, 11:45:21 am »
0

I'm probably more on the fence than my posts indicate, but I'm still surprised at my reluctance to pony up $40 for the game I love so much and am trying to understand it myself.  Goko doesn't inspire me, and I don't find it to be significantly better than the free third party Dominion app that only includes the base set.  They aren't adding value to my Dominion experience, and they don't seem focused on implementing the features that I would value.

I imagine I'll probably plunk down the cash eventually, but a year or so ago, I would've bought it without blinking an eye.  I'm not certain what has changed, and am trying to articulate that. 
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Re: Why aren't *you* playing on Goko?
« Reply #74 on: December 27, 2012, 11:56:11 am »
0

thanks,you have my eternal gratitude.
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