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Author Topic: An offer to Donald X.  (Read 30588 times)

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synpax

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An offer to Donald X.
« on: December 12, 2012, 12:44:04 am »
+1

Mr X., Donald, Donny....

May I be frank?

I am a new player. I own Dominion (that three-game combo set), have introduced three other people to the game, and will be giving it as a gift.

I'm also a mediocre Isotropic Player and I have recently tried Goko.

I play up to 20 games a day on Isotropic and I have no interest in playing on Goko. I don't know how Goko got the contract, but they have already screwed it up and have already cost you / RGG money with their substantial delay.

And I'll tell you something else: Goko will never be as successful or have the audience that Isotropic does, even if Iso is forced to shut down.

So I have an offer.

Set a quarterly tribute for Isotropic for it's players to collectively pay. If they meet it, Isotropic stays up. If not, it goes away. Some will give none, some will give a lot.

Now, I understand you may have signed a contract with Goko giving them exclusive rights. But I'd also suggest they may be in breach of this contract due to their delays and that you no longer owe them exclusive rights.

However - I haven't seen the contract so I may be wrong.

So if you are forced to shut down Iso, please keep my bounty idea in mind for when Goko goes bankrupt and you've lost further potential earnings due to their incompetence.

Love,

Synpax

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werothegreat

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #1 on: December 12, 2012, 01:19:30 am »
+5

May I be frank?

No.

Do you honestly think Donald X hasn't considered something like this?  Do you honestly think that he would have entered into this agreement without being fully  aware of Goko's capabilities?  Do you honestly think this idea has not be discussed dozens of times in this very forum?

And I honestly don't understand why people hate Goko so much.  Yes, it is not perfect.  But they are working on it.  We have seen measured improvement, and we have every reason to expect the improvement will continue.  If you have beef with Goko, post on their forum, or in this forum, and your specific problem will be addressed.  If you just want to troll (and seriously, you cannot have seriously expected your offer would have been taken up), please do so somewhere else.
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sparky5856

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #2 on: December 12, 2012, 02:19:09 am »
0

Quote
So if you are forced to shut down Iso, please keep my bounty idea in mind for when Goko goes bankrupt and you've lost further potential earnings due to their incompetence.

That's a pretty bold statement there. Who said that bankruptcy is definitely happening?
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synpax

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2012, 03:40:29 am »
0


Do you honestly think Donald X hasn't considered something like this?

Do you honestly think that he thought that Goko would have F'd up his game so badly for so long when he signed the contract with them? Even if he had considered it before, it's time to reconsider it.

And I honestly don't understand why people hate Goko so much. 

Then you have no business commenting until you learn what empathy is.

I can understand why some people prefer to play something that Goko is trying to be even if I know it's not of interest to me.
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synpax

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2012, 03:51:41 am »
0

Quote
So if you are forced to shut down Iso, please keep my bounty idea in mind for when Goko goes bankrupt and you've lost further potential earnings due to their incompetence.

That's a pretty bold statement there. Who said that bankruptcy is definitely happening?

Bookmark it. I sure hope X didn't get lured in with an equity offer.

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kn1tt3r

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2012, 04:43:41 am »
+2

Even if this whole offer story was somehow reasonable, I quite doubt that it's Donald's call. I'm rather sure this is a RGG thing.
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 05:07:30 am by kn1tt3r »
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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #6 on: December 12, 2012, 05:03:32 am »
0

Yeah, like how Guilds might not be the last Dominion expansion we see if RGG/Jay wants more.
Donald has said he "likes to please people", but of course he also likes making money.

Being a game designer is tough, so I don't blame him for any financial decisions he makes.

I don't think Goko is that bad, but it just needs a lot of work. Still, in this light it's even more amazing how DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.
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Donald X.

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2012, 06:36:14 am »
+2

Set a quarterly tribute for Isotropic for it's players to collectively pay. If they meet it, Isotropic stays up. If not, it goes away. Some will give none, some will give a lot.
You are far from the first to desperately try to save isotropic.

I have no contract with Goko. I have a contract with RGG that lets RGG sublicense the game. So, until that expires, all I can do is offer opinions. Man I have offered opinions.

Once my contract with RGG expires... nothing will change. I'm not going anywhere. I will not possibly hate Goko enough to leave RGG.

I don't know when RGG's contract with Goko expires or what it looks like. But whatever problems there have been, if things are working at that point then it will probably be best just to stay with them.
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Donald X.

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2012, 06:38:23 am »
+2

Yeah, like how Guilds might not be the last Dominion expansion we see if RGG/Jay wants more.
Donald has said he "likes to please people", but of course he also likes making money.
The former is way more likely to produce a 9th expansion than the latter.
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Donald X.

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2012, 06:39:19 am »
+2

I don't think Goko is that bad, but it just needs a lot of work. Still, in this light it's even more amazing how DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.
The "Dougminion bug reports / requests" thread in the playtest forums has ~580 posts.
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greatexpectations

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2012, 08:42:11 am »
+4

Do you honestly think Donald X hasn't considered something like this?  Do you honestly think that he would have entered into this agreement without being fully  aware of Goko's capabilities?  Do you honestly think this idea has not be discussed dozens of times in this very forum?

i agree with the overall sentiment wero, but i think you need to take it easy. it was the users first post, and i think that a hostile response reflects badly on the forum at large. just because this sort of idea is old news for regulars here doesn't mean it's something that everyone out there has thought of.

The "Dougminion bug reports / requests" thread in the playtest forums has ~580 posts.

Dougminion! i love it.
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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2012, 09:17:05 am »
+3

Do you honestly think Donald X hasn't considered something like this?  Do you honestly think that he would have entered into this agreement without being fully  aware of Goko's capabilities?  Do you honestly think this idea has not be discussed dozens of times in this very forum?
i agree with the overall sentiment wero, but i think you need to take it easy. it was the users first post, and i think that a hostile response reflects badly on the forum at large. just because this sort of idea is old news for regulars here doesn't mean it's something that everyone out there has thought of.

I think we've had enough users whose first (and often only) post is a non-constructive criticism of Goko that "trolling" is no longer too strong a word.

I don't think Goko is that bad, but it just needs a lot of work. Still, in this light it's even more amazing how DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.
The "Dougminion bug reports / requests" thread in the playtest forums has ~580 posts.

That surprises me exactly not at all.  The difference is that DougZ actually fixed those bugs.  Meanwhile, we have two-month-old bugs still haunting Goko...
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theory

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2012, 09:32:43 am »
+1

Moved to Goko forum.
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Brando Commando

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #13 on: December 12, 2012, 10:17:43 am »
+1

I wouldn't be too hard on the OP.

Yes, too many pixels have already been wasted on the Iso vs. Goko arguments and "Why can't Goko be better?" etc.
But people have a strong gut reaction when you say to them "Hey, you know that thing you're willing to pay for? Well we're still taking it off the market." It just seems...crazy.

But yeah, DXV didn't make that call and it's a little absurd to ask him to fix this.
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werothegreat

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #14 on: December 12, 2012, 11:17:12 am »
+2

Yeah, like how Guilds might not be the last Dominion expansion we see if RGG/Jay wants more.
Donald has said he "likes to please people", but of course he also likes making money.
The former is way more likely to produce a 9th expansion than the latter.

Quick!  Everyone get out your picket signs!  Off to RGG!
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dougz

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2012, 11:51:50 am »
+26

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)
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pinkymadigan

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2012, 12:08:08 pm »
0

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...
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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2012, 12:15:19 pm »
+1

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...

It's probably about the same.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.

pinkymadigan

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #18 on: December 12, 2012, 12:25:52 pm »
+6

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...

It's probably about the same.

But didn't Doug do his work on top of a regular job? And by himself? And in a cave, up hill both ways in 7 feet of snow?
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 12:27:09 pm by pinkymadigan »
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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #19 on: December 12, 2012, 12:29:20 pm »
+1

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...

It's probably about the same.

But didn't Doug do his work on top of a regular job? And by himself? And in a cave, up hill both ways in 7 feet of snow?

You forget, Goko are working on other games and are working on something much bigger than Isotropic.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.

Captain_Frisk

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #20 on: December 12, 2012, 12:32:13 pm »
+3

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...

It's probably about the same.

But didn't Doug do his work on top of a regular job? And by himself? And in a cave, up hill both ways in 7 feet of snow?

You forget, Goko are working on other games and are working on something much bigger than Isotropic.

Goko also does a bunch of things that Isotropic doesn't:

1. Artificial Intelligence (this ups the "cost" to implement each card)
2. Billing & multiple forms of authentication
3. More complicated UI (I may hate it, but overhearing some "norms" at my game group - some did appreciate the prettier interface)
4. Music
5. Sound Effects
6. Avatars
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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #21 on: December 12, 2012, 12:32:38 pm »
+1

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...

It's probably about the same.

But didn't Doug do his work on top of a regular job? And by himself? And in a cave, up hill both ways in 7 feet of snow?

... programming by candlelight since there was no electricity there yet?
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pinkymadigan

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2012, 12:37:39 pm »
0

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...

It's probably about the same.

But didn't Doug do his work on top of a regular job? And by himself? And in a cave, up hill both ways in 7 feet of snow?

You forget, Goko are working on other games and are working on something much bigger than Isotropic.


And I would not dream of discounting the work they do on the UI, etc. I do prefer a nice UI (though Goko's is still a bit off the mark - cards need to all be on one screen, the dig for your WW card in this stack of everything is beyond silly, etc).

BUT; basic gameplay issues (rules related) are either not prioritized highly, or they take forever figuring out how to solve them. That's my main point. We still have active procession bugs, but we're gonna go ahead and release Cornucopia to keep the cash flowing in...
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dondon151

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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #23 on: December 12, 2012, 12:38:20 pm »
+2

... programming by candlelight since there was no electricity there yet?

... coding with quill on parchment since there were no computers yet?
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Re: An offer to Donald X.
« Reply #24 on: December 12, 2012, 12:38:55 pm »
+1

[...] DougZ programmed Iso on his own and got 99.9% of the rules right on the first try.

LOL.  You only ever saw the fifth try.  :-)

Still, let's check your bug squashing timeline vs Goko's...

It's probably about the same.

But didn't Doug do his work on top of a regular job? And by himself? And in a cave, up hill both ways in 7 feet of snow?

You forget, Goko are working on other games and are working on something much bigger than Isotropic.

Goko also does a bunch of things that Isotropic doesn't:

...
3. More complicated UI (I may hate it, but overhearing some "norms" at my game group - some did appreciate the prettier interface)
...

Less-pretty interface is the reason I stayed away from Iso for a while after I got into Dominion.

TBH, if I had encountered Goko before getting into Iso, I never would have gotten into Iso.  Except for the fact that Goko is pay vs. Iso free.  But I would have played lots of the base game on Goko and probably wouldn't have gotten into the expansions until much later.

To recap: lack of prettyness kept me away from iso, which is the only way I got into the expansions and thus became a real boy.  Goko being around back then would have (at best) elongated or (at worst) prevented this development.

The prettiness is a plus!  Even lifelong gamers like me LIKE pretty, elegant interfaces.  I'm not saying Goko is elegant, but it is pretty.  They get points for it.
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