Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: 1 ... 6 7 [8] 9 10 ... 187  All

Author Topic: Interview with Donald X.  (Read 754395 times)

2 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

ipofanes

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1372
  • Shuffle iT Username: ipofanes
  • Respect: +701
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #175 on: December 10, 2012, 11:33:24 am »
+2

This version should include chits in a bag instead of cards. Kids are poor shufflers and tend to warp cards, especially if excited by the game.
Logged
Lord Rattington denies my undo requests

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5378
  • Respect: +21879
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #176 on: December 10, 2012, 12:12:51 pm »
+5

Do you have favorite kid's game?
I'm fond of step-on-feet. You try to step on their feet. They try to step on your feet. You win when every other player has conceded.

Any thoughts on a "Dominion for Kids" sort of variant similar to what we've seen for Settlers and Carcassonne?
I have not given any thought to such a thing. I've played Dominion with an 8-year-old, and I'm not sure I'd want to aim much lower.
Logged

mith

  • Jester
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 761
  • Shuffle iT Username: mith
  • Respect: +765
    • View Profile
    • MafiaScum.net
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #177 on: December 10, 2012, 01:32:10 pm »
+4

Any thoughts on a "Dominion for Kids" sort of variant similar to what we've seen for Settlers and Carcassonne?
I have not given any thought to such a thing. I've played Dominion with an 8-year-old, and I'm not sure I'd want to aim much lower.

"You may drool on this card. If you don't, +$3."

What games did you play growing up (if any)? What's your earliest gaming memory?
« Last Edit: December 10, 2012, 01:37:56 pm by mith »
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5378
  • Respect: +21879
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #178 on: December 10, 2012, 02:36:18 pm »
+10

What games did you play growing up (if any)? What's your earliest gaming memory?
I played a lot of D&D. I played it when it was the little books - Eldritch Wizardry etc. No-one ever played by the rules, because there were awful, so I guess that was probably my first experience with game design. At some point in my teens I briefly tried to be good at chess. I was good at intimidating people by being smart, I would push a piece forward and they would be sure it must be some great plan.

Otherwise, you know, normal American stuff, this will not be interesting. Monopoly, Checkers, etc. etc. Trying to figure out what my oldest such memory is is too hard and boring. I'm like the Memento guy, I can only remember the last 38 years. I have a photo of a man from before then and it says "don't believe his lies;" I think it's referring to Santa Claus.
Logged

Drab Emordnilap

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1832
  • Shuffle iT Username: Drab Emordnilap
  • Luther Bell Hendricks V
  • Respect: +1881
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #179 on: December 10, 2012, 03:25:49 pm »
+1

Why does Spy cost $4? Were Spy/Spy openings just too annoying to resolve or something?
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5378
  • Respect: +21879
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #180 on: December 10, 2012, 04:05:36 pm »
+2

Why does Spy cost $4? Were Spy/Spy openings just too annoying to resolve or something?
It's pretty random. I didn't know as much what I was doing then; I tried it at $4 and people bought it and you didn't have to. These days I wouldn't make it at all - it's too slow for what you get, and charging less doesn't fix that. Rabble is the way to do Spy.

The "this has to cost $4 to stop you from opening with two of them" thing first came to light with a main set outtake that was "trash a card from your hand, discard a card, +3 cards." It was $3 for a while and I upped it to $4 to stop that opening (and moved it to Intrigue, then to Dark Ages, then it died). Throne Room is $4 because $3 was too good with +buys; it was cute that you could open Throne / Feast but I couldn't preserve that. Remodel is $4 because that makes it better. Smithy, Gardens, and Feast want to be $4. Militia, Moneylender, Bureaucrat, and Thief are all somewhat randomly at $4; they were trying to fit into a continuum of cards, where as you know the big difference is from $4 to $5. They are correctly less than $5. I'm happy with them being $4; it's not like you want to face double-attack openings a lot (bad or not) when you're new to the game. Moneylender fits fine into the continuum.
Logged

ftl

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2028
  • Respect: +1295
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #181 on: December 10, 2012, 04:34:08 pm »
+3

That seems like it would go well on the spy wiki page.
Logged

jupiter

  • Swindler
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 19
  • Respect: +21
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #182 on: December 10, 2012, 08:50:59 pm »
0

That seems like it would go well on the spy wiki page.

All the other cards he mentioned should go too.
Logged

Powerman

  • Jester
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 766
  • Respect: +602
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #183 on: December 11, 2012, 12:27:53 am »
+1

How do you go about teaching the game in general to new players?

How many games of Dominion would you guess you have played?

What card do you think you are "best" with?  What about worst?

Boxers or briefs?

Which is more frustrating for you in a competitive-ish game, Turn 5 chapel or 2+P in a Familiar game?
Logged
A man on a mission.

michaeljb

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1395
  • Shuffle iT Username: michaeljb
  • Respect: +2044
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #184 on: December 11, 2012, 01:42:29 am »
0

This thread seems similar enough to a reddit AMA that this feels appropriate....

Would you rather fight one Trusty Steed-sized Rat or 100 Rat-sized Trusty Steeds?

edit: asked this before coming to the post where you said you wouldn't be answering funny questions
« Last Edit: December 11, 2012, 02:22:30 am by michaeljb »
Logged

ftl

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2028
  • Respect: +1295
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #185 on: December 11, 2012, 02:09:22 am »
+1

Which is more frustrating for you in a competitive-ish game, Turn 5 chapel or 2+P in a Familiar game?

I bet I can provide the start of his answer! "It depends on the board..."
Logged

michaeljb

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1395
  • Shuffle iT Username: michaeljb
  • Respect: +2044
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #186 on: December 11, 2012, 02:23:08 am »
0

That seems like it would go well on the spy wiki page.


A whole lot of this thread would be great for the wiki.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5378
  • Respect: +21879
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #187 on: December 11, 2012, 04:54:22 am »
+1

How do you go about teaching the game in general to new players?
I uh explain the rules? "This is a game of building a deck..." I explain the data in the game - "you have a deck, a discard pile, a hand of cards..." I explain how your turn goes. I explain the card types, the four +'s, gain/trash, the end condition. I am teaching the game using whatever expansion I am testing, so I explain whatever twists it has.

How many games of Dominion would you guess you have played?
Man. Well, in the thousands. IRL I must have played at least 3K games; it's hard to estimate because any given game night may have involved other games. There are 3600+ posts in playtest forum threads for posting results from playing online; they aren't all games and I'm not in all of them, although a lot are and I'm in a lot of them. That doesn't cover all online games, just from Cornucopia on (I had a bad online version when working on the main set).

What card do you think you are "best" with?  What about worst?
I'm best with new, untested cards. Also against them.

I'm looking at the sets, I don't see cards that say I will lose. I buy the weak cards less often than the strong cards, the narrow cards less often than the flexible ones. I guess like anyone decent can say, I do worse against swingy cards.

Boxers or briefs?
Boxers; the motif on them is a boxer, poised to punch.

Which is more frustrating for you in a competitive-ish game, Turn 5 chapel or 2+P in a Familiar game?
Well I've experienced the former more than the latter so I guess that one. But really, if this game is competitive-ish, phew, I can point to this as why I lost. The pressure's off.
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4733
  • Respect: +3327
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #188 on: December 11, 2012, 05:02:33 am »
+6

What I've always liked about Dominion and disliked about Magic is that in Dominion all players have the same choices. Every card in the kingdom was available to every player. You weren't limited to the amount of money you wanted to spend on random booster packs and such. You could just buy a set, know every card you were going to get and have equal access to all of those cards.

Cornucopia changed this with the Tournament prizes and it seems that a lot of games are decided on who gets Followers or Trusty Steed first. Dark Ages introduced Ruins and Knights and even made the initial shuffles more different with Shelters.

Now I understand that it's sometimes fun when games are this asymmetrical, but it seems like you're straying further from the original "equal access" concept - if that even ever existed. Even cards that "do something with the trash" attribute to this as the timing of when you play your trasher/trash-grabber matters a lot.

Did you have an "equal access" concept in mind when you started designing Dominion? Is there a reason you've been exploring asymmetry more and more?
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5378
  • Respect: +21879
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #189 on: December 11, 2012, 08:01:52 am »
+2

edit: asked this before coming to the post where you said you wouldn't be answering funny questions
I don't want to disappoint people, I just don't want to spend hours trying to think of funny answers. I started looking for an old, unrelated joke to post instead, and even that was taking too long.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5378
  • Respect: +21879
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #190 on: December 11, 2012, 08:11:40 am »
0

What I've always liked about Dominion and disliked about Magic is that in Dominion all players have the same choices. Every card in the kingdom was available to every player. You weren't limited to the amount of money you wanted to spend on random booster packs and such. You could just buy a set, know every card you were going to get and have equal access to all of those cards.

Cornucopia changed this with the Tournament prizes and it seems that a lot of games are decided on who gets Followers or Trusty Steed first. Dark Ages introduced Ruins and Knights and even made the initial shuffles more different with Shelters.

Now I understand that it's sometimes fun when games are this asymmetrical, but it seems like you're straying further from the original "equal access" concept - if that even ever existed. Even cards that "do something with the trash" attribute to this as the timing of when you play your trasher/trash-grabber matters a lot.

Did you have an "equal access" concept in mind when you started designing Dominion? Is there a reason you've been exploring asymmetry more and more?
When I thought of the premise, my original thought was that there would be some cards to buy, and when you bought one we'd deal out a replacement. When I actually made the game, months later, that sounded bad. Wouldn't a lot come down to having a good card turned over when you got first shot at it? It might seem just like if we draw cards from a deck and I draw a better one, but it's much more in-your-face. Anyway I didn't manage to come up with a good solution, so for the first game, I just put (all) ten cards out at once. I figured, it would make it easy to find the broken cards, and if the game seemed promising I could come up with something better later. Then of course we liked getting to pick from ten cards. So this significant feature of Dominion was something I just lucked into.

From my perspective there has been no trajectory like you describe. The Knights and Black Market are from 2007. I have asymmetry in this area because it was something to do. There sure isn't much of it. It's like $7's; some people felt like $7's would break the game, not realizing that, even if I made say four of them, you still wouldn't have one in most games.
Logged

ipofanes

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1372
  • Shuffle iT Username: ipofanes
  • Respect: +701
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #191 on: December 11, 2012, 08:20:43 am »
+1

What I've always liked about Dominion and disliked about Magic is that in Dominion all players have the same choices. Every card in the kingdom was available to every player. You weren't limited to the amount of money you wanted to spend on random booster packs and such. You could just buy a set, know every card you were going to get and have equal access to all of those cards.

This is what instantly clicked with me. I committed to buying all the expansions if the game promised to be any good, and still be way below the money I spent for M:tG.
Logged
Lord Rattington denies my undo requests

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4733
  • Respect: +3327
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #192 on: December 11, 2012, 08:29:17 am »
+1

I agree with the fact that having a few asymmetric cards doesn't immediately sway the balance to complete asymmetry because most games wouldn't have those cards anyway, it's just something I noticed as more expansions came out.

I reckon it might be difficult for you (and us) to keep track of the timeline as our experience with the cards is different from yours. We don't exactly know the order the cards were designed in, we just know the order of the expansions. So introducing this asymmetry can simply be an effect of shuffling cards around from set to set and it's also quite logical that asymmetrical cards are more complex and thus end up in later sets.

And with Guilds around the corner I wondered if this was a trend or just a side effect of the way cards were released and judging from your answer, I guess it's the latter. In your view, correct me if I'm wrong, asymmetry has always been part of the game, but you can see how it looks to us like a trend, just because the expansions are released in a certain order.

I found the first tidbit about "just turn over some cards and replace them if they're bought" very interesting. So you essentially started with a Black Market deck? It's funny to see how games develop this way. Nowadays, picking 10 cards out of all the available cards is such a linchpin of the game that we don't even think twice about it and, for me certainly, this has been a big reason why it's been so popular.

Imagine playing with just the 25 cards from the base game, containing exactly one copy of Witch and one copy of Chapel.  ;D
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5378
  • Respect: +21879
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #193 on: December 11, 2012, 09:34:18 am »
+1

I reckon it might be difficult for you (and us) to keep track of the timeline as our experience with the cards is different from yours. We don't exactly know the order the cards were designed in, we just know the order of the expansions. So introducing this asymmetry can simply be an effect of shuffling cards around from set to set and it's also quite logical that asymmetrical cards are more complex and thus end up in later sets.
Tournament is a fixed Black Market and is in Cornucopia because I wanted something in the variety-based set that actually increased the number of cards available, which Black Market does. The Knights were always in Dark Ages, from when it was called War. They are Knights; it's a War. The Ruins cards and Shelters vary because that's more interesting than having them be the same. They were made for the set. It was not some drive to increase asymmetry or some careful saving of complex things; it was, can I make Curses more interesting, and then Tom suggesting replacing the starting Estates to push the Dark Ages flavor.

And with Guilds around the corner I wondered if this was a trend or just a side effect of the way cards were released and judging from your answer, I guess it's the latter.
I'm not really looking to tell people about Guilds yet. Let's just steer all questions away from that.

If the game didn't include any cards anyone hated, it wouldn't include any cards anyone loved either. You are complaining about a tiny number of things that some people absolutely adore. Don't play with Tournament and Knights if you don't like them. They are slam dunks for me.
Logged

TWoos

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 149
  • Respect: +88
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #194 on: December 11, 2012, 09:57:07 am »
0

If the game didn't include any cards anyone hated, it wouldn't include any cards anyone loved either. You are complaining about a tiny number of things that some people absolutely adore. Don't play with Tournament and Knights if you don't like them. They are slam dunks for me.

It struck me as amusing that Tournament and Knights are in different sets.  How can you have a Tournament without Knights?
Logged

Drab Emordnilap

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1832
  • Shuffle iT Username: Drab Emordnilap
  • Luther Bell Hendricks V
  • Respect: +1881
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #195 on: December 11, 2012, 10:02:18 am »
+1

It struck me as amusing that Tournament and Knights are in different sets.  How can you have a Tournament without Knights?

Well, when you host a Tournament, knights come from all over to compete; that doesn't mean they're each in your personal employ. The more provinces you yourself hold, though, the more likely the victor will come from your lands.

Also, I totally like the flavor of hiring Dame Molly to go wreck a tournament being hosted by another player.
Logged

Davio

  • 2012 Dutch Champion
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4733
  • Respect: +3327
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #196 on: December 11, 2012, 10:24:22 am »
0

If the game didn't include any cards anyone hated, it wouldn't include any cards anyone loved either. You are complaining about a tiny number of things that some people absolutely adore. Don't play with Tournament and Knights if you don't like them. They are slam dunks for me.

It struck me as amusing that Tournament and Knights are in different sets.  How can you have a Tournament without Knights?
Hey, I'm not saying I hate those cards! It's just something I noticed after the first sets not having such cards. :)

Some of the cards I'd like to see in Guilds are asymmetrical cards. Yes, you don't have to say anything about Guilds, but we're allowed to speculate.

Dominion by itself is already pretty asymmetrical with all the shuffling anyway.

Again, it's just something that caught my eye, I'm not judging it either way. Getting the 2nd prize with Tournament is certainly no more annoying than drawing $2P on turn 5.
Logged

BSG: Cagprezimal Adama
Mage Knight: Arythea

Drab Emordnilap

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1832
  • Shuffle iT Username: Drab Emordnilap
  • Luther Bell Hendricks V
  • Respect: +1881
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #197 on: December 11, 2012, 10:27:40 am »
0

Again, it's just something that caught my eye, I'm not judging it either way. Getting the 2nd prize with Tournament is certainly no more annoying than drawing $2P on turn 5.

So much less annoying than this. I wish Familiar cost $1P so badly.

Dolan, why 10 kingdom cards? Did you ever try 12 cards available at a time, or eight? (Different cards, not cards per pile)
Logged

SwitchedFromStarcraft

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1088
  • Respect: +853
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #198 on: December 11, 2012, 11:31:32 am »
0

Again, it's just something that caught my eye, I'm not judging it either way. Getting the 2nd prize with Tournament is certainly no more annoying than drawing $2P on turn 5.

So much less annoying than this. I wish Familiar cost $1P so badly.

Dolan, why 10 kingdom cards? Did you ever try 12 cards available at a time, or eight? (Different cards, not cards per pile)
Dolan?  Is this a scumslip?
Logged
Quote from: Donald X.
Posting begets posting.

Quote from: Asper
Donald X made me a design snob.

There is a sucker born every minute.

Tables

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2761
  • Build more Bridges in the King's Court!
  • Respect: +3257
    • View Profile
Re: Interview with Donald X.
« Reply #199 on: December 11, 2012, 11:34:56 am »
+7

Logged
...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.
I hereby declare myself the best dominion player in the world. Obviously.
Pages: 1 ... 6 7 [8] 9 10 ... 187  All
 

Page created in 0.094 seconds with 21 queries.