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Author Topic: 7 Wonders??  (Read 11710 times)

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theParty

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7 Wonders??
« on: August 16, 2011, 09:39:02 am »
+1

Has anyone played 7 Wonders?  It keeps popping up for me on Amazon's suggestions, and people's descriptions of it always reference Dominion.

Has anyone that has played it comment?  Looking for new games, as friends are sick of Dominion......
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WanderingWinder

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2011, 10:00:37 am »
0

I've played it a couple times. It's fairly fun but feels quite a bit more random than dominion. Totally different game. You're very dependant on what you draw and actually on what your neighbours do, but there are also some decisions to be made.

Thisisnotasmile

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2011, 10:33:50 am »
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It's alright. Nothing special though. You just pass some cards around a table 3 times and that's pretty much it. You can't have any tactics because everything you do is public and people will just use the cards they know you want before passing them to you.
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rogerclee

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2011, 10:55:09 am »
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I found 3-player 7 wonders to be reasonably tactical and fun, since you have a lot more control over what happens and can mostly tell which cards everyone is getting after the first two passes (in theory, after the first pass, but I don't know all the cards).

The big selling point of the game though is that additional players don't make the game proportionately longer to play, and the rules are pretty light.
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rod-

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2011, 11:04:34 am »
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7 Wonders is very different from dominion, it shares very little in fact.  The game makes you 'think' you have options, and to some degree you do, but the limited set of cards & upgrade paths makes it very easy to get 'locked in' to a strategy at around 1/3 of the way through the game, at which point it's merely a "decision" of 'which of these cards can i play?'. 

It's still a fun, light game, but emphasis needs to be put on 'light'. 
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DG

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2011, 11:41:21 am »
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Seven Wonders is a good game with new looking game mechanic. The good features are that it plays quickly (45 minutes?), the rules are simple, it can handle up to seven players without slowing down much, and there are plenty of decisions with a variety of competitive strategies. It's probably not a game you'd want to play four times in a night.
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Davio

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2011, 11:48:32 am »
+1

I think 7 Wonders is comparable with Dominion in regard of substance, not gameplay.

It offers a somewhat challenging experience and is often quick enough that you can play multiple games in a row. There are multiple ways to victory and which way you choose is up to you, but you are still limited to the cards you receive from your neighbors.

You only get to play up to 18 cards every game, so you want to make sure ever card counts. There is some strategy in this.

The different scoring mechanisms make it somewhat obscure who is winning and this can be a surprise in the end, but all the information is right there, so you're free to do precise calculations if you so wish.

I like it a lot and rarely turn down a game. I even have the expansion which adds a bit, but is not necessary to enjoy the game.


If you have a friend's birthday coming up, you can always buy a copy and give it away and buy it yourself if you like it. :)
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theParty

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2011, 12:28:55 pm »
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Thanks for all the info guys.  Much appreciated.
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Silverback

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #8 on: August 16, 2011, 12:53:32 pm »
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I like the game a lot, though I still dont get behind the strategy.

It's fun to play and in the end someone wins and nobody knows why. At least in my experience.

There are some articles about strategy at nextlevelcardgames.com and you can play it online at brettspielwelt.de
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HiveMindEmulator

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #9 on: August 16, 2011, 01:09:03 pm »
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I agree with Davio. It's simple to learn and quick to play and has nice art, so people who aren't seriously into games can play and enjoy it. In that sense, it's like dominion. In terms of actual game play, it doesn't really have anything in common.
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guided

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #10 on: August 16, 2011, 03:24:03 pm »
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In practice, once you have the basic strategy down, the best choice (or a couple of choices that are equally good) will be obvious in every hand you see, and you'll do that thing, and you'll win or lose based 98% on the shuffle and the relative incompetence of your neighbors. I found 7 Wonders to be enormously fun for 8-10 plays and then oppressively boring after that.

It's fun for a large group who aren't already familiar with it.
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fp

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #11 on: August 21, 2011, 12:15:05 pm »
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..I found 7 Wonders to be enormously fun for 8-10 plays and then oppressively boring after that...

Same. That being said, if you haven't played it, you should play it, just don't expect to get into it that much.
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krawhitham

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #12 on: August 21, 2011, 07:25:40 pm »
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I played 2 games of this at the weekend, my first time playing. The rules and mechanics are very simple, however I do not understand why it is compared to Dominion.

You don't build a deck, you don't shuffle, you don't have attacks and defences (there is combat, but it's initiated automatically at the end of each phase instead of by players actions).

It's more like a cross between Citadels and Settlers of Catan (it has been compared with Race For The Galaxy but I have not played RFTG).

I enjoyed playing, it was very quick to learn. I think there are a few subtle tactical choices to be made but the learning curve is not very steep.

I agree with other posters that it is light, but it has huge potential for expansion, just consider Dominion base set Vs Dominion now (in terms of tactical choices).
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Kuildeous

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2011, 04:07:36 pm »
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This is such a tough topic for me. My wife wants to buy the game, but I'm not so willing to shell out money for it, especially since I have access to two copies if I tap my friends. I'm hoping she comes to the same conclusions I do, but I think I'll lose out and end up buying it.

It's not that I hate the game. I just don't see what the big fuss is. I have fun with it, sure, but it's not a particularly deep game. It's no Yahtzee, but the game deals a lot with luck. Sometimes I have great neighbors who help me build an awesome empire, and other times I get neighbors who don't produce crap. Naturally, those are the games where I build a market, only to discover I can't buy anything with it.

Although, I do have to say that I like the varied methods of scoring. A person does not win by getting blue cards alone or green cards alone or wonders alone. It does seem like the winner is often the person who craps out the most blues or greens is the winner, though. But I could see someone with a subtle but victorious military collecting enough victory points from yellows and wonders to take the lead.

I played with the leaders expansion once. It did improve my opinion of the game. The leaders added yet even more luck, but it's luck that you can control. You choose a leader to purchase in each of the three stages of the game. Which leader you choose can have quite the impact. If I do give in and buy the game, I'm getting the expansion as well.

One very important point, according to my friends who own the game: Do NOT play the game until you get the card sleeves. Apparently, the card quality is so atrocious that they'll start degrading when you first play the game. That might be a hyperbole, but my friends and online gamers have indicated that not buying the sleeves will be a costly mistake.
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SuperCoolMoss

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2011, 09:50:02 am »
0

There's a good strategy write-up here which may indicate that 7 Wonders isn't as light as it first may seem.

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/691370/some-complex-strategies-for-7-wonders



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Thisisnotasmile

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #15 on: September 09, 2011, 09:57:17 am »
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... Yeah, if it takes reading more than the entire contents of the library in which I work in order to see this game as anything more than "passing some cards around a table 3 times", then this game is going to remain as "passing some cards around a table 3 times".
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mangaguy

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #16 on: January 13, 2012, 03:29:51 am »
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I love this game. I love everything about the mechanic of card drafting, the beautiful art of the cards, and the wonderful theme. 7 Wonders is probably my favorite game of all time.

I would disagree with the fact that it is "just" passing cards around the table three times. Because,i n the process of passing those cards around the table, you compete with your neighbors in a spectacular fashion, trying to build up your empire of cards and resources to trump your opponent and deny him from success.

With each passing of a hand, you have to make a multitude of meaningful decisions, from deciding whether or not to pass your opponent a military card to finish his army, to deciding whether to start investing in scientific discoveries or civilian structures. Every little decision, from deciding who to pass your hard earned coins to for resources, from when to activate your second wonder stage, influences your opponents and creates a unique experience.
It tickles my inner architect/designer the same way Dominion would; in Dominion, I build my deck to be as smooth as possible so I can grab more points more consistently than my opponent, and in 7 Wonders, I build up my empire in the first and second ages to be a catapult to massive points in the third.

But that's not to say I don't think 7 Wonders has any flaws. There is some luck that might really screw you over, but the amount of luck isn't overwhelming and can sometimes be beaten with strategy and analysis. I find it similar to Dominion in this regard, with the shuffle luck and such. It is also true that after many plays, the game begins to lose its luster, its ingenuity, and its freshness, because it seems to become repetitive. I found the feeling similar to how I felt after playing the Dominion base set a lot of times, because there are only so many useful combinations and new strategies you can come up with, after which you crave more.
But as with Dominion, I found that expansions helped greatly in this regard. 7 Wonders: Leaders adds an extra phase to the game, with which you draft leaders, giving you many more options and combos like how Dominion: Intrigue or Seaside gave you more options or combinations. And 7 Wonders: Cities looks to add even more!

Anyways, I think saying that 7 Wonders is a game with no depth is simply untrue. Through my plays and interactions with my friends, I see a lot of thinking, a lot of socializing and strategizing about the best path to go. It might not be as clear cut as Dominion with a lot of its strategies and analysis, but it's definitely there, and I think it's unfair that some people would be so quick to dismiss it.
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Geronimoo

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #17 on: January 13, 2012, 03:51:53 am »
+2

7 Wonders has one major flaw: you're drafting the cards, but not actually playing them so there's no real 'fun'. In Dominion/Magic when you buy/draft a card you think "man, this is going to be cool", then when you play the card you're like "man, this IS cool!". The second part is missing in 7 Wonders.
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mangaguy

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #18 on: January 13, 2012, 04:08:34 am »
+1

7 Wonders has one major flaw: you're drafting the cards, but not actually playing them so there's no real 'fun'. In Dominion/Magic when you buy/draft a card you think "man, this is going to be cool", then when you play the card you're like "man, this IS cool!". The second part is missing in 7 Wonders.
In a way, I agree, because it would be really interesting to be able to draft to build a deck, like in Magic, just because the strategical option gets expanded and it adds an extra level.
But at the same time, I would argue that 7 Wonders' gameplay is elegant and simple. It boils down to three things you can do in your turn, much like the ABC concept in Dominion. Play, Wonder, orTrash. You can play it to use it yourself and maybe give your neighbors benefits. Wonder it to get additional benefits and hatedraft, or Trash it for additional income/hatedrafting. Instead of adding many complicated steps, it boils the essence of card drafting down, and makes it the entire game. Now, you could argue that it might not be for everyone, but I really like the interactions between players in card drafting, and I find a really elegant way for the designers to concentrate on it.
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Arya Stark

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #19 on: January 13, 2012, 07:07:27 am »
0

The only thing I really don't like about 7 wonders is there's not much talking going on
« Last Edit: January 13, 2012, 07:27:35 am by Arya Stark »
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Tables

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #20 on: January 13, 2012, 08:12:06 am »
+2

I've played 7 Wonders a bit recently. In fact, it's one of my society's most played games currently (Dominion is still played, but less so).

I've found that, despite people saying it's a 'bit like dominion', it's really the opposite. It's very hard to play strategicially, almost everything in the game comes down to tactics. Okay, you can see your neighbours have lots of military and thus never buy military, and/or try to get the resources for the spies guild, but things like that are both rare AND about the limit of planning. Mostly it comes down to 'I have these 4 cards to choose from, which helps most now, which might help in the future?'

The thing I dislike most though is how military works. I recently had a 7 player game where I came 2nd, by 2 points. The winner was Rhodes, and was sitting next to me. I built two military cards, an age two and an age three mostly to beat (and keep up with) the person on my right. I lost to Rhodes comfortably (he had I think 11 at the end). I scored 5 in military. The person two seats to my right also built two military, an age two and an age three. He scored 15 in military. So he got 10 points more than me, just because he wasn't being squeezed by his neighbours like I was.

It's a solid game, but don't play it thinking it'll be dominion. It isn't.
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GendoIkari

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #21 on: February 10, 2012, 03:41:44 pm »
+4

So I'm a little late to the topic....

I've only played 7 Wonders once... and I immediately loved it. It's one I look forward to playing more of.
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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #22 on: February 11, 2012, 05:51:18 pm »
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I have only played it once and enjoyed that, but I definately won't be adding it to my collection.

Its basically just a game of drafting, with out the actual playing of the game after it.

Think of another game where you draft cards to make a deck or a position or team, then you play them and try out different strategies with them. In this game, the card gets played, draft again. Repeat until end.

Its fun, but will get boring very quickly, and I have other games that will fill the not-much thinking role in games days (Incan Gold!)
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Kuildeous

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #23 on: December 10, 2015, 08:55:10 am »
+2

Well, that was fun. I entered a 7 Wonders tournament last night. I was a little rusty, but it all came back to me.

The hardest part is that I've only been playing the base set lately. Whenever we play 7 Wonders, there's always at least one newbie. Even though I don't think the Leaders and Cities add too much complexity (well, okay, Leaders), I get vetoed in trying to bring them to the table. So when I sat down for my first round last night, I had my nose buried in the icon reference to remind myself how these new-fangled cards worked.

Got third place in the first round. Nothing extraordinary. My leader choices just did not jive with me, and I felt I was actually working against myself in some cases. I ignored science, which was a mistake because my neighbors were also ignoring it, leaving all the science cards to two guys across the table. I felt that if I gave it some cursory attention, I could have scored better in my position.

Second round was better. Tied for first with my neighbor, but I had one more coin than him so eked out a tiebreaker. I didn't go strong science, but I had the leader that gave me points for each set of red, blue, and green, so I had three green cards. Pity I didn't get a set, but obviously it was enough.

The final round was with the highest placed players. Everyone but me treated science lightly. I even took two leaders that gave science. Sadly, my plan to unveil one at age 2 fell through as I couldn't scrape together enough gold. Still, revealing one at age 3 was enough to propel me to 48 points in science alone. Fortunately one of my neighbors cared enough about science to make a set, so I was able to copy his symbol for my mask card.

This was part of the new organized play, so I won a 7 Wonders play mat. It seems pretty nice, though it'll take up more room than I need. I also won the art pack, which contains new artist renditions of the seven original wonders. Everyone who entered got a promo card which was a Palace with alternate art.

Good times, and I'm really happy with my outcome considering how long it's been since I've played. And to think when we first bought this game I shrugged it off as being too swingy (as evident in my post in the thread 4 years ago). Well, it's still pretty swingy, but there are still a lot of tactics for weathering that luck. 

I'm just glad they didn't play with Babel. I've never played that, so I would have really been at a disadvantage.
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Kirian

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Re: 7 Wonders??
« Reply #24 on: December 10, 2015, 11:08:56 am »
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Heh, I played in a 7W tournament about a month ago... and came in last.  It was base only, but they split up the art pack, so I have the shiny new Rhodes.
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