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Author Topic: Official Version Launching 8/16?  (Read 97830 times)

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blueblimp

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #225 on: August 17, 2012, 01:00:29 am »
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Ouch, some of the negative tweets are pretty brutal.
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #226 on: August 17, 2012, 01:02:24 am »
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Ouch, some of the negative tweets are pretty brutal.

That's what happens when you keep telling everyone it will be out a certain date, have a press release come out the day of and then have nothing to show for it.
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Kirian

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #227 on: August 17, 2012, 02:03:40 am »
+1

Someone on Iso had the status "Goko: games that go nowhere!"  Ouch.
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yudantaiteki

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #228 on: August 17, 2012, 02:07:18 am »
+1

Eh, if they get it out soon this will blow over.  Goko has done some bumbling in the leadup to the release (the whole process really), but the main deciding factor in its success will be the playability of the product on release.  Especially since the base set can be played for free, it's hard for me to imagine that more than a handful of people will completely refuse to even try it solely because of Goko's current behavior.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2012, 02:10:49 am by yudantaiteki »
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Tombolo

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #229 on: August 17, 2012, 02:32:17 am »
+2

I don't think they will specifically refuse, but I think there will be quiiite a few potential customers lost from press releases that link to nothing.
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Not a Cylon

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #230 on: August 17, 2012, 02:48:04 am »
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Goko has done some bumbling in the leadup to the release (the whole process really), but the main deciding factor in its success will be the playability of the product on release.

That's true. Unfortunately, I can tell you there will be plenty to be pissed off about after it's released. The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.
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Kirian

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #231 on: August 17, 2012, 04:21:16 am »
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Goko has done some bumbling in the leadup to the release (the whole process really), but the main deciding factor in its success will be the playability of the product on release.

That's true. Unfortunately, I can tell you there will be plenty to be pissed off about after it's released. The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.

Seriously, can someone explain why this would be?
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DStu

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #232 on: August 17, 2012, 04:33:43 am »
+1

Goko has done some bumbling in the leadup to the release (the whole process really), but the main deciding factor in its success will be the playability of the product on release.

That's true. Unfortunately, I can tell you there will be plenty to be pissed off about after it's released. The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.

Seriously, can someone explain why this would be?

I'm quite sure that has something to do with pizzas...
« Last Edit: August 17, 2012, 04:35:04 am by DStu »
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blueblimp

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #233 on: August 17, 2012, 04:55:05 am »
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Goko has done some bumbling in the leadup to the release (the whole process really), but the main deciding factor in its success will be the playability of the product on release.

That's true. Unfortunately, I can tell you there will be plenty to be pissed off about after it's released. The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.

Seriously, can someone explain why this would be?
Over in the BGG thread, someone made the argument that the majority of computerized board game players play games offline vs AI and don't touch multiplayer. (I don't know whether this is right, but it's believable.) If so, a lack of offline support will bother a lot more people than isotropic going down bothers, and unlike the isotropic people (who are merely going from a great implementation to an okay one), the people who want offline support will have nothing at all.

Edit: Here's the post I mentioned. I misquoted it a little (since he was talking about some particular PC game, not computerized board games in general), but I got the gist right I think.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2012, 04:57:51 am by blueblimp »
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yudantaiteki

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #234 on: August 17, 2012, 05:04:43 am »
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If people are upset by the vocal criticism of Goko here, they should stay away from BGG -- the threads there make the threads here look like nothing.
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blueblimp

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #235 on: August 17, 2012, 05:06:57 am »
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While picking out BGG posts, I also thought this one was insightful. Excerpt:
Quote
A well-made, standalone Dominion app would likely be just as successful, if not more so, than Ticket to Ride has been.

A multi-platform, web-based digital gaming platform makes more sense as an affordable option for the less popular games that may not be able to stand on their own.
This makes a lot of sense to me. Any multi-platform approach is inherently going to deliver a worse experience on any given platform than is possible by writing for that platform specifically. It can be worth it if you can't afford to write platform-specific apps, but Dominion is quite popular, so it seems totally plausible that it could support both an iOS-native app with offline play and desktop app (maybe HTML5, maybe Flash) and still be financially viable.

Then you don't have this weird situation now where the iOS users are totally unhappy while meanwhile the desktop players are somewhat happy yet have problems with the concessions made to target the iPad, such as fixed play area size, lots of dragging, etc.
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DStu

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #236 on: August 17, 2012, 05:17:20 am »
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I thought there would be native iOS and Android apps? Not just now?
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blueblimp

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #237 on: August 17, 2012, 05:22:06 am »
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I thought there would be native iOS and Android apps? Not just now?
To my knowledge, all they've said is that if there is enough demand, they'll look into supporting offline play eventually. So... pretty far off, and that still might not mean a native client, but instead moving enough server logic to the client so that it can be played from cache.

Edit: Found it:
Quote
At the moment, there is no offline mode for Goko's games, but Griggs said such a feature could be added if users demanded it.
This to me says: there are no plans for offline play at the moment, but they are not ruling it out as a possibility. Which means it's not coming for a long time.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2012, 05:26:56 am by blueblimp »
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DStu

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #238 on: August 17, 2012, 05:26:33 am »
0

I thought there would be native iOS and Android apps? Not just now?
To my knowledge, all they've said is that if there is enough demand, they'll look into supporting offline play eventually. So... pretty far off, and that still might not mean a native client, but instead moving enough server logic to the client so that it can be played from cache.

Not talking about offline, talking about apps for online play.  Supporting offline play is a completely different story, or?  You could also do offline in a browser on the desktop, I suspect without much work.  Just let the client download the html, slightly change the code to direct to file:// , set a bookmark and there you go?
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blueblimp

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #239 on: August 17, 2012, 05:29:47 am »
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I thought there would be native iOS and Android apps? Not just now?
To my knowledge, all they've said is that if there is enough demand, they'll look into supporting offline play eventually. So... pretty far off, and that still might not mean a native client, but instead moving enough server logic to the client so that it can be played from cache.

Not talking about offline, talking about apps for online play.  Supporting offline play is a completely different story, or?  You could also do offline in a browser on the desktop, I suspect without much work.  Just let the client download the html, slightly change the code to direct to file:// , set a bookmark and there you go?
Ah okay, I misunderstood. I haven't seen anything about plans to make a native client to connect to their existing servers. There is an app submitted to the app store, but it's likely just a wrapper for the web client.
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polonkus

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #240 on: August 17, 2012, 07:05:03 am »
+2

I thought there would be native iOS and Android apps? Not just now?
To my knowledge, all they've said is that if there is enough demand, they'll look into supporting offline play eventually. So... pretty far off, and that still might not mean a native client, but instead moving enough server logic to the client so that it can be played from cache.

Not talking about offline, talking about apps for online play.  Supporting offline play is a completely different story, or?  You could also do offline in a browser on the desktop, I suspect without much work.  Just let the client download the html, slightly change the code to direct to file:// , set a bookmark and there you go?

Doing an offline web app without allowing everyone to steal all your server code will require a level of careful development which Goko has given me absolutely no reason to believe they are capable of.
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Jedit

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #241 on: August 17, 2012, 07:57:53 pm »
+1

The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.

Seriously, can someone explain why this would be?

Because basically every other deckbuilding game adapted for the iPad has it, and because not everyone's iPad is in a Wifi hotspot at all times.  Also see Diablo III.
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WanderingWinder

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #242 on: August 17, 2012, 08:04:42 pm »
+2

The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.

Seriously, can someone explain why this would be?

Because basically every other deckbuilding game adapted for the iPad has it, and because not everyone's iPad is in a Wifi hotspot at all times.  Also see Diablo III.
...and because iPad users demand that everything be optimized for their device.

Captain_Frisk

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #243 on: August 17, 2012, 08:23:17 pm »
+1

The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.

Seriously, can someone explain why this would be?

Because basically every other deckbuilding game adapted for the iPad has it, and because not everyone's iPad is in a Wifi hotspot at all times.  Also see Diablo III.
...and because iPad users demand that everything be optimized for their device.

We are all dicks for sure, but the goko beta isn't exactly smooth, even on a high end pc.  It ran like dog crap on my g1 iPad, but ascension is super sweet.  I can understand the preference for native implementation if you insist on making a flashy hi, instead of barebones.
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blueblimp

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #244 on: August 17, 2012, 08:41:26 pm »
+2

The lack of offline play on the iPad, for instance, is a shitstorm waiting to happen.

Seriously, can someone explain why this would be?

Because basically every other deckbuilding game adapted for the iPad has it, and because not everyone's iPad is in a Wifi hotspot at all times.  Also see Diablo III.
...and because iPad users demand that everything be optimized for their device.
I know this is trolling, but I feel compelled to respond anyway.

First off, buying a non-iOS mobile device is like using a non-Windows desktop OS. You just can't expect as many games, because most of the game developers primarily target iOS/Windows, and most people who care about games use iOS/Windows, because of that. So while you're free to choose whichever mobile device you like, it rankles me a bit to complain about games when you chose a platform that gets fewer games, just like an iOS user would be silly to complain too much about lack of customizability.

Second, mobile devices benefit a lot from native apps, much more than desktop OSes. For example:
  • Mobile devices are not as powerful as even laptop computers, so performance is a big deal.
  • Screen size is limited, so the app needs to be designed for the particular screen. Each device with a different screen size potentially needs a re-thinking of the design in order to have a good interface.
  • It's difficult to accurately fake native touch response, for scrolling, etc.

Third, iOS devices alone are a big games market. If the market is that big, it's not unreasonable to expect a top-notch offering. If it isn't top-notch, there are lots of alternatives to play instead.
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eHalcyon

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #245 on: August 17, 2012, 08:54:14 pm »
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Doesn't Android have a higher market share than iOS now?  If not, it's got to be very close.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #246 on: August 17, 2012, 08:59:38 pm »
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Doesn't Android have a higher market share than iOS now?  If not, it's got to be very close.

Apple users pay for apps though. I'll fid a source later if I remember
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blueblimp

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #247 on: August 17, 2012, 09:01:30 pm »
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Doesn't Android have a higher market share than iOS now?  If not, it's got to be very close.
Market share of the OS isn't the key factor though. From what I've read, game devs sell more on iOS (maybe because the app store is good? or because the users are more willing to pay for games?) and the development cost is less (less fragmentation of hardware and such).
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Ozle

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #248 on: August 17, 2012, 09:06:21 pm »
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Pretty sure the size of android market is bigger, but devs make much more from ios (as does apple)
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eHalcyon

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Re: Official Version Launching 8/16?
« Reply #249 on: August 17, 2012, 09:08:55 pm »
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Doesn't Android have a higher market share than iOS now?  If not, it's got to be very close.
Market share of the OS isn't the key factor though. From what I've read, game devs sell more on iOS (maybe because the app store is good? or because the users are more willing to pay for games?) and the development cost is less (less fragmentation of hardware and such).

Ah.  Thanks!

I don't know about Apple's App store, but Android has a lot of good stuff for free.  Nonetheless, I tend to buy the "Pro" versions of apps to support the devs.
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