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Author Topic: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)  (Read 163966 times)

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cayvie

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Welcome to Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia

Deck is here

If you would like a link to the spectator discussion QuickTopic, please send me a PM.  Thanks.

Game Over
1 alive
1. Insomniac Queen of Cups, Mafia Doctor, Stabbed in the Back Night 1
2. Voltgloss
3. pingpongsam Knight of Wands, Werewolf, Lynched day 3
4. Grujah Five of Pentacles, One-Shot Strongman Vigilante, Ripped to Pieces Night 2
5. Eevee Ace of Swords, One-Shot Weak Vigilante, Shot Night 2
6. Robz888 Page of Cups, Mafia Goon Beaten to Death Day 3
7. O Werewolf High Priestess, Strangled Night 1
8. yuma Two of Wands, Vanilla Townie, Had a Heart Attack Night 2
9. ftl Five of Wands, One-Shot Day Vigilante Had a Brain Aneurysm Night 3
10. Galzria Ten of Cups, Unrequited Lover Stabbed in the Back Night 3
11. shraeye Three of Swords, Vanilla Townie, Shot Night 1
12. angrybirds Two of Swords, Vanilla Townie, Endgamed
13. sparky5856 Page of Pentacles, Mafia Goon, Lynched Day 2
14. Morgrim7 Ten of Swords, Vigilante, Lynched Day 4
15. Axxle Four of Wands, Lonely Mason, Endgamed
16. ehunt Ten of Wands, Doctor, Lynched Day 1

Jotheonah is your backup/weekend mod. (I am V/LA on weekends).

Mafia Ruleset

Game Rules:

General Gameplay and Etiquette:
1. You may not quote private Moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind.  Paraphrasing (for role claims, etc.) is acceptable.
2. There is to be NO personal communication outside of the forum postings unless your role PM specifically allows it.  Mafia members may communicate at night and during the confirmation stage.
3. If you have a role with a Night action your choices are due to me by the posted deadline (generally 48 hours from Night start).  If I do not receive your choice via PM by the posted deadline you will forfeit your actions.  In case of multiple submissions, the last valid one before the deadline will be used.
4. Roles with Night actions will not be able to submit an action on Night 0 (i.e. during the confirmation stage).
5. Any player with a Night action may instead submit a “No Action” PM to let the Mod know that you do not want to perform your expected action that Night phase.
6. As a general rule you should aim for one post every 48 hours, minimum, to keep the game moving.

Voting, Deadlines, and Player Death:
1. A simple majority (rounded up) of all living members must agree on one person for a lynch to occur prior to deadline.
2. Once you have reached a simple majority no further unvoting will change someone’s fate.  Further votes will also be ignored.
3. Once a player is lynched the game enters twilight until I post a death scene; all players including the one who was lynched may continue to post during twilight.
4. Please submit votes as: Vote: PlayerName.  Votes will NOT be counted if they are not bold or do not follow this syntax!  Obvious abbreviations or nicknames will be counted so long as they are unambiguous.
5. Please submit vote revocations as either Unvote: PlayerName or Unvote. Unvotes are not necessary before changing votes.
6. You may Vote: No Lynch - half the total number of players (round up) must vote No Lynch to send the game to Night phase without a lynch.
7. This game will generally have 2 week deadlines.  If a player or No Lynch does not have a simple majority at deadline, no lynch will occur, and the game will go into night.
8. Once you are killed (either via lynch or night kill) you may no longer post. This means that you do not even get a “Bah” post. The dead in this game are silent.
9. Do not edit or delete posts.  We don't want some players having more information than others.  If you want to clarify posts, feel free to double post.

Miscellaneous/Mechanics:
1. Bold, blue text is reserved for the Mod.  No invisible/small text is allowed, nor is cryptography.
2. If you have an issue/problem with the game, please PM the Mod privately.  Do not post issues/complaints in the game thread.
3. The Mod may make mistakes - please point out any mistakes gently.  Mistakes will be corrected where possible, but sometimes mistakes are made that cannot be reversed.  These will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. Please bold all requests to the Mod so that they don’t get missed.
5. Prods of missing players will be issued automatically after 72 hours of no activity or upon request after 48 hours of no activity.  A prodded player has 48 hours to respond or risks replacement.  A player who has been prodded 3 times is subject to replacement without further notice.
6. Rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, up to and including a Modkill.
7. If you anticipate being unavailable for more than a 48-hour period please post a notice to that effect in the thread.  Treat this game as a commitment.  Be considerate – don’t leave us hanging.

The Golden Rule:

Please remember that this is a game and your main objective is to have fun! Be considerate of each other, don’t get personal, and enjoy the game.

Helpful Links:

TO CLARIFY, I AM NOT A MODERATOR OF F.DS IN ANY WAY, SHAPE OR FORM.  IN THE CONTEXT OF THIS GAME, I AM MODERATING THAT THE RULES ARE FOLLOWED AND HIDDEN ACTIONS ARE COMPLETED PROPERLY.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2012, 03:29:26 am by cayvie »
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2012, 04:00:02 am »

The strange shop opened up in your sleepy town; Cayvie's Fortune Hut read the awning.

You felt compelled to enter. The strange masked proprietor took your cash (or credit card) and placed a single card from a filigreed deck onto the antique table in front of you. You realized that it summed up your life, all of it, right there. Your mind was blown.

You decided to play a game of Mafia.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2012, 04:25:41 am by cayvie »
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2012, 04:20:55 am »

Confirmed.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2012, 04:24:58 am »

Confirmed.

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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2012, 04:29:50 am »

Confirmed.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2012, 04:31:37 am »

Confirmed.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2012, 04:47:11 am »

okay good night everyone, can't believe i got this started before i had to go to sleep.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2012, 05:38:33 am »

Confirm
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2012, 05:39:02 am »

wait has the game actually started? or is this pregame?

If the game has started, Vote: Axxle  for lurking. The game has probably maybe even started and he hasn't posted yet.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #9 on: August 09, 2012, 05:39:48 am »

oh wait, I just read the OP and it says it'll start when more people confirm. Well, then my vote doesn't count yet.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #10 on: August 09, 2012, 06:07:48 am »

Confirmed.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2012, 08:39:58 am »

In this game I'm a firm con.
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shark_bait

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #12 on: August 09, 2012, 08:41:36 am »

The shark has landed.  confirmed.
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Hello.  Name's Bruce.  It's all right.  I understand.  Why trust a shark, right?

Is quite curious - Who is the mystical "Celestial Chameleon"?

Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #13 on: August 09, 2012, 08:51:57 am »

Confirmed.  Perfect timing too!
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I support funsockets.... taking as much time as they need to get it right.

angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #14 on: August 09, 2012, 12:12:33 pm »

Ok I'll confirm here as well
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #15 on: August 09, 2012, 12:26:50 pm »

confirmed
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #16 on: August 09, 2012, 01:03:55 pm »

Confirming? What is this? I'm an anti-conformist.

Regardless, for the purposes of the game, confirmed.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #17 on: August 09, 2012, 01:18:32 pm »

Confirmative
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #18 on: August 09, 2012, 01:39:40 pm »

Oh, confirm again? COnfirmed.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #19 on: August 09, 2012, 01:42:25 pm »

I confirm in this thread as well.
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #20 on: August 09, 2012, 01:58:02 pm »

Yes, double confirm!!
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #21 on: August 09, 2012, 02:43:39 pm »

DAY 1 START

9 to lynch
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #22 on: August 09, 2012, 02:44:45 pm »

Vote: Morgrim7
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #23 on: August 09, 2012, 02:45:07 pm »

So this.. is.. RSV?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #24 on: August 09, 2012, 02:46:24 pm »

Vote: Eevee for not knowing that the acronym is RVS.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #25 on: August 09, 2012, 02:47:55 pm »

Vote: Axxle for being the post above this one
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #26 on: August 09, 2012, 02:57:57 pm »

Vote: Galzria for lurking
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #27 on: August 09, 2012, 02:59:13 pm »

So this.. is.. RSV?
My vote is only 50% random.
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I support funsockets.... taking as much time as they need to get it right.

Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #28 on: August 09, 2012, 03:10:20 pm »

So this.. is.. RSV?
My vote is only 50% random.
Care to share the 50% that isnt?
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #29 on: August 09, 2012, 03:12:23 pm »

So this.. is.. RSV?
My vote is only 50% random.
Care to share the 50% that isnt?

Frisk always wants to policy lunch morgrim in RVS
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #30 on: August 09, 2012, 03:13:25 pm »

Frisk always wants to policy lunch morgrim in RVS

This.  He tastes great with provolone and a side of curly fries.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #31 on: August 09, 2012, 03:28:23 pm »

Mmmmm, I want a policy lunch. Sounds delicious

Vote: Morgrim7
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #32 on: August 09, 2012, 03:29:20 pm »

I love how despite lynch being a legal word - our iphones all autocorrect it to lunch.
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I support funsockets.... taking as much time as they need to get it right.

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #33 on: August 09, 2012, 03:30:44 pm »

I love how despite lynch being a legal word - our iphones all autocorrect it to lunch.

I actually type lunch and my iPhone knows lynch now. I type lunch because of Axxles slip in BM3
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #34 on: August 09, 2012, 03:32:15 pm »

vote: angrybirds for eating all of the candy when he came over last
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #35 on: August 09, 2012, 03:33:36 pm »

vote: angrybirds for eating all of the candy when he came over last

Can you refresh my memory on your real life claim?  I remember thinking that I had busted you with an alt account once when I saw a post from angrybirds show up in thread somewhere - only to be quickly deleted and replaced with yours.
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I support funsockets.... taking as much time as they need to get it right.

yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #36 on: August 09, 2012, 03:42:38 pm »

vote: angrybirds for eating all of the candy when he came over last

Can you refresh my memory on your real life claim?  I remember thinking that I had busted you with an alt account once when I saw a post from angrybirds show up in thread somewhere - only to be quickly deleted and replaced with yours.

sure. We are brothers. If I remember right that was in m3 when he was living here with my wife and me. He sometimes stays over weekends nowadays. Will that be a problem?
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #37 on: August 09, 2012, 03:44:21 pm »

twinclaims are the best part of f.ds mafia

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #38 on: August 09, 2012, 03:45:09 pm »

Lynch all liars.  Someone's iphone lied to us when it autocorrected.  Therefore,

Vote: Iphones
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #39 on: August 09, 2012, 03:45:47 pm »

vote: angrybirds for eating all of the candy when he came over last

Can you refresh my memory on your real life claim?  I remember thinking that I had busted you with an alt account once when I saw a post from angrybirds show up in thread somewhere - only to be quickly deleted and replaced with yours.

sure. We are brothers. If I remember right that was in m3 when he was living here with my wife and me. He sometimes stays over weekends nowadays. Will that be a problem?
I dont see a problem, but its good of you to tell us!
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #40 on: August 09, 2012, 03:48:18 pm »

Vote Count
Morgrim7 (2): Captain_Frisk, shraeye
Eevee (1): Axxle
Axxle (1): Insomniac
Galzria (1): ftl
angrybirds (1): yuma

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #41 on: August 09, 2012, 04:02:43 pm »

vote: angrybirds for eating all of the candy when he came over last

Can you refresh my memory on your real life claim?  I remember thinking that I had busted you with an alt account once when I saw a post from angrybirds show up in thread somewhere - only to be quickly deleted and replaced with yours.

sure. We are brothers. If I remember right that was in m3 when he was living here with my wife and me. He sometimes stays over weekends nowadays. Will that be a problem?

Not a problem.

Vote: yuma
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #42 on: August 09, 2012, 04:09:20 pm »

I love how despite lynch being a legal word - our iphones all autocorrect it to lunch.

Correct? I type lunch half the time deliberately.

Like when I'm hungry. I don't want to go with no lunch. Let's start a bandwagon! Vote: Morgrim7
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #43 on: August 09, 2012, 04:14:06 pm »

twinclaims are the best part of f.ds mafia
I probably should have claimed this long ago, but I guess now is a good a time as any.

I've known O since I was very young, before kindergarten.  A very reliable fellow, I always knew where to find him: right between N and P...
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #44 on: August 09, 2012, 05:12:20 pm »

vote: Captain Frisk

The better policy-lynch choice.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #45 on: August 09, 2012, 05:17:11 pm »

So this.. is.. RSV?
My vote is only 50% random.
Care to share the 50% that isnt?
That would be the "vote" part.

Query to all:  Do you think Day 1 suitclaims would benefit the town?
(The analog being the sideclaims and setclaims we provided in Mystery Mafia.)
(I'm mulling the question presently and am interested to hear others' views.)
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #46 on: August 09, 2012, 05:18:22 pm »

No, suitclaims would out the major arcana.


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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #47 on: August 09, 2012, 05:19:16 pm »

I agree with ftl.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #48 on: August 09, 2012, 05:35:51 pm »

vote: Captain Frisk

The better policy-lynch choice.

The best IMHO.  This is a regularish game and I need to get my day 1 death stats up.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #49 on: August 09, 2012, 05:41:31 pm »

Oh, by the way, I'll quote this here because it doesn't appear to be in this thread, just in the other one which I had to look for to find.

Setup Info

So here's how this works. This is a Semi-Open setup.

I've divided my Tarot deck into two piles, the Major and Minor Arcana. As seen below, I've assigned specific, fairly traditional Mafia roles to the Minor Arcana. The Major Arcana, however, have been assigned secret abilities that range from "Oh, that's new and interesting" to "What on Earth was that?" in power and strangeness. Some Major Arcana are town-aligned, some are Mafia, some are Werewolf, and some are other.

In order to keep the Major Arcana roles feeling appropriately special, I've separated them from the rest of the deck. For every seven players that join the game, one Major Arcana role is added to the setup. After that is done, I deal enough Tarot cards to give everyone a role.

Minor tweaking is done afterward to ensure some semblance of balance. It usually comes out pretty balanced, but sometimes there's six werewolves out of 16 players and that's just no good.

The Deck

Cups
Ace - Lover
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - Vengeful Lover
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Cop
Eight - Roleblocker
Nine - Innocent Child
Ten - Lover
Page - Mafia Goon
Knight - Mafia Goon
Queen - Mafia Doctor
King - Mafia Watcher

Pentacles
Ace - Mafia-Immune Serial Killer
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - One-Shot Strongman Vigilante
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Cop
Eight - Backup
Nine - Jack of all Trades
Ten - Spy
Page - Mafia Goon
Knight - Mafia Goon
Queen - Mafia Roleblocker
King - Mafia Godfather

Wands
Ace - Werewolf-Immune Serial Killer
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - One-Shot Day Vigilante
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Seer
Eight - Ninja Doctor
Nine - Bulletproof Townie
Ten - Doctor
Page - Werewolf
Knight - Werewolf
Queen - Werewolf Rolecop
King - Alpha Werewolf

Swords
Ace - One-Shot Weak Vigilante
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - Vengeful Townie
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Seer
Eight - Jailkeeper
Nine - FBI Agent
Ten - Vigilante
Page - Werewolf
Knight - Werewolf
Queen - Ninja Werewolf
King - Werewolf Tracker

Major Arcana

0: The Fool
I: The Magician
II: The High Priestess
III: The Empress
IV: The Emperor
V: The Hierophant
VI: The Lovers
VII: The Chariot
VIII: Strength
IX: The Hermit
X: The Wheel of Fortune
XI: Justice
XII: The Hanged Man
XIII: Death
XIV: Temperance
XV: The Devil
XVI: The Tower
XVII: The Star
XVIII: The Moon
XIX: The Sun
XX: Judgment
XXI: The World


While outing mafia-aligned major arcana would be good, outing town-aligned major arcana would be really, really bad, they'll be our super-powered power roles. We wouldn't know whether the Major Arcana we out are mafia or town, but scum certainly would.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #50 on: August 09, 2012, 05:47:21 pm »

No, suitclaims would out the major arcana.

This is an excellent point and one I completely forgot about.

Let me refine the question slightly and ask again.

If we arbitrarily grouped the major arcana to be honorary members of the "suits," would Day 1 suitclaims be a good or bad thing for the town?

By "arbitrarily group" I mean something like, "Major Arcana 0 through 5 would claim Cups; Major Arcana 6 through 10 would claim Pentacles; Major Arcana 11 through 16 would claim Swords; Major Arcana 17 through 21 would claim Wands."

Thoughts?

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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #51 on: August 09, 2012, 05:50:14 pm »

While outing mafia-aligned major arcana would be good, outing town-aligned major arcana would be really, really bad, they'll be our super-powered power roles. We wouldn't know whether the Major Arcana we out are mafia or town, but scum certainly would.
I assume mafia-aligned major arcana would just lie anyway.  Or pretend to be town aligned.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #52 on: August 09, 2012, 05:51:10 pm »

Wands and pentacles have 1 scum more than the cups and swords (4/14 and 5/14). Should we perhaps lynch a wand or a pentacle day1 then?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #53 on: August 09, 2012, 05:51:15 pm »

No, suitclaims would out the major arcana.

This is an excellent point and one I completely forgot about.

Let me refine the question slightly and ask again.

If we arbitrarily grouped the major arcana to be honorary members of the "suits," would Day 1 suitclaims be a good or bad thing for the town?

By "arbitrarily group" I mean something like, "Major Arcana 0 through 5 would claim Cups; Major Arcana 6 through 10 would claim Pentacles; Major Arcana 11 through 16 would claim Swords; Major Arcana 17 through 21 would claim Wands."

Thoughts?

Initially I'd say no, but I think about it more.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #54 on: August 09, 2012, 05:53:14 pm »

No, suitclaims would out the major arcana.

This is an excellent point and one I completely forgot about.

Let me refine the question slightly and ask again.

If we arbitrarily grouped the major arcana to be honorary members of the "suits," would Day 1 suitclaims be a good or bad thing for the town?

By "arbitrarily group" I mean something like, "Major Arcana 0 through 5 would claim Cups; Major Arcana 6 through 10 would claim Pentacles; Major Arcana 11 through 16 would claim Swords; Major Arcana 17 through 21 would claim Wands."

Thoughts?
Oh, missed this.  Maybe?  I guess it would limit what scum could fakeclaim as? But it might also help scum narrow down the problematic roles.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #55 on: August 09, 2012, 05:54:56 pm »

Keep in mind that in RMM we were able to quote PMs which added some credibility to them and made faking harder.

Here I am assuming we can't.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #56 on: August 09, 2012, 05:55:44 pm »

1. You may not quote private Moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind.  Paraphrasing (for role claims, etc.) is acceptable.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #57 on: August 09, 2012, 06:00:13 pm »

I think it would give scum more info than town.

It would NOT prevent scum from lying! Because we're not guaranteed to have any particular number of any suit, mafia can still lie about which suit they are and then pick a role and honestly have a pretty good chance of having their fakeclaim unchallenged. In BMMMMMMMMMM , sideclaims and setclaims could get something because after everyone set/seat claimed, you could catch liars if two people claimed the same seat or if the wrong number of people claimed each set (we had claimed info that would verify how many from each set).
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #58 on: August 09, 2012, 06:03:29 pm »

1. You may not quote private Moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind.  Paraphrasing (for role claims, etc.) is acceptable.

Ha ha... thanks for the warning axxle  :)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #59 on: August 09, 2012, 06:08:32 pm »

1. You may not quote private Moderator-supplied information (either real or fabricated) of any kind.  Paraphrasing (for role claims, etc.) is acceptable.

Ha ha... thanks for the warning axxle  :)
Thanks, cayvie PM'ed me the rule... OH WAIT!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #60 on: August 09, 2012, 06:11:10 pm »

The key difference I see between this and side / set claiming in Ozleland - is that in Ozleland there was some validation.  Timchen could validate the set claims, and there were a list of known seats, and lots of mod supplied information that made knowing who was in what seats very useful

In this game - unless we got really and had uneven distribution - what are we actually learning?  Cups / Swords are slightly less scummy (4/13 vs. 5/13)

Depending on whether investigative roles get flavor names or not - you could potentially be putting town in a situation in which they would prefer to lie (town aligned major arcana that is in Pentacles for example)

PPE - looks like I've been beaten by ftl - Also - per Axxle's post - perhaps it would just result in modkilling.

FOS: Axxle for trying to get people modkilled?

Cayvie - I like the Ace of Swords touch.  I am praying for the 1 in whatever chance that it went to Galz.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #61 on: August 09, 2012, 06:16:13 pm »

FOS: Axxle for trying to get people modkilled?
How?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #62 on: August 09, 2012, 06:33:04 pm »

The wind suddenly picks up and rushes around your ears. You can distinctly make out the sound of ghostly voices. They say, "There is at least one serial killer in this game." Then they say, "BOO!"
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #63 on: August 09, 2012, 06:35:18 pm »

So I was gonna say that the main benefit of suit claiming might be to discern if we are dealing with one or two scum factions but perhaps the wind will tell us so I'm going to be against suit claiming
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #64 on: August 09, 2012, 06:36:47 pm »

FOS: Axxle for trying to get people modkilled?
How?

Sorry - confused you and voltgloss over the switch in pages.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #65 on: August 09, 2012, 06:38:30 pm »

Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #66 on: August 09, 2012, 06:43:14 pm »

Captain Frisk is obviously Serial Killer guys, we even have mod confirmation.

Join me in my wagon.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #67 on: August 09, 2012, 06:46:30 pm »

Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever.

I have a whole forum full of reasons!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #68 on: August 09, 2012, 06:47:09 pm »

Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever.

I have a whole forum full of reasons!
Shoot your right.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #69 on: August 09, 2012, 06:47:39 pm »

Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever.

I have a whole forum full of reasons!
Shoot your right.
Ehh, O is right. Your obvSK.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #70 on: August 09, 2012, 06:53:17 pm »

vote: shraeye, a newb like I am
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #71 on: August 09, 2012, 06:53:32 pm »

vote: shraeye
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #72 on: August 09, 2012, 07:08:14 pm »

Vote Count
Morgrim7 (3): Captain_Frisk, shraeye, ftl
Eevee (1): Axxle
yuma (1): Insomniac
angrybirds (1): yuma
Captain_Frisk (2): O, Morgrim7
shraeye (1): angrybirds

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #73 on: August 09, 2012, 07:12:05 pm »

Cayvie - I like the Ace of Swords touch.  I am praying for the 1 in whatever chance that it went to Galz.

I believe it works out to 1/64.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #74 on: August 09, 2012, 09:54:54 pm »

Oh, my vote is still with Morgrim?  I thought I changed it to iPhones.  I'll give them both a break.
Unvote: Morgrim
Unvote: iPhones
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #75 on: August 09, 2012, 10:00:34 pm »

Also, I agree that suit claiming may lead to interesting situations.  Some suits have slightly more (probabilistically negligible I suspect, but I'm not willing to work it out quite yet) chance of having a claimer of that suit be scum (assuming everyone tells the truth) and this may cause the protown Major arcana to have to lie.  Even vanilla townies and small power townies may want to lie because if they correctly say they are in wands, they may stand a higher chance of being lynched.  So will we go for people in wands/pentacles or cups/swords since scum may likely claim to be there.  It seems like it puts lots of pressure on people for giving hard truths, or careful lies, without really giving any informational payoff.  If someone can convince me there will be real payoff, I can change my mind just as easy as I set it.

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #76 on: August 09, 2012, 10:15:57 pm »

Well, 16 players in a non-BM game! Not bad... Hope you're up for the work Cayvie. You've got a 4000 post behemoth coming your way!

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #77 on: August 09, 2012, 10:16:51 pm »

Volt, are you a Werewolf?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #78 on: August 09, 2012, 10:17:14 pm »

Axxle, are you Mafia?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #79 on: August 09, 2012, 10:18:06 pm »

Shraeye, are you a Serial Killer?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #80 on: August 09, 2012, 10:19:49 pm »

And yes, I get an obligatory Ace of Swords claim. I'm him.

...

Just not this game.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #81 on: August 09, 2012, 10:26:41 pm »

And yes, I get an obligatory Ace of Swords claim. I'm him.

...

Just not this game.
Counter claim, I'm the one who isn't the Ace of Swords!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #82 on: August 09, 2012, 10:27:15 pm »

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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #83 on: August 09, 2012, 10:52:37 pm »

If we arbitrarily grouped the major arcana to be honorary members of the "suits," would Day 1 suitclaims be a good or bad thing for the town?

By "arbitrarily group" I mean something like, "Major Arcana 0 through 5 would claim Cups; Major Arcana 6 through 10 would claim Pentacles; Major Arcana 11 through 16 would claim Swords; Major Arcana 17 through 21 would claim Wands."

Thoughts?

Why not just claim to be Major Arcana? Of course, doing that sure would attract a whole lot of attention to yourself. Your method is probably better. Seems like there's two Major Arcana roles, as per cayvie's Setup Info, am I correct in this?

Dangit, talking about Tarot cards is reminding me of The Binding of Issac. Addicting game.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #84 on: August 09, 2012, 11:01:45 pm »

Why not just claim to be Major Arcana? Of course, doing that sure would attract a whole lot of attention to yourself.
Yes, claiming to be Major Arcana will probably get you killed by the Mafia or Werewolves.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #85 on: August 09, 2012, 11:09:35 pm »

Galzria, I can't tell if that's a real question, but I'll bite that bait anyway.  No, I'm not a Serial Killer.

Voltgloss, these are real questions for you.  What do you think would be gained by suitclaiming?  Why did you forget about the Major Arcana in your first query?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #86 on: August 09, 2012, 11:12:32 pm »

Galzria, I can't tell if that's a real question, but I'll bite that bait anyway.  No, I'm not a Serial Killer.

Voltgloss, these are real questions for you.  What do you think would be gained by suitclaiming?  Why did you forget about the Major Arcana in your first query?

They were all serious. I haven't heard from Volt or CF yet.

eHunt, want to answer for your Mafia buddy?
Eevee, what about you? Who are you planning on NK'ing for your faction kill?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #87 on: August 09, 2012, 11:24:53 pm »

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Shraeye, are you a Serial Killer?

Volt, are you a Werewolf?

Axxle, are you Mafia?

They were all serious. I haven't heard from Volt or CF yet.

eHunt, want to answer for your Mafia buddy?
Eevee, what about you? Who are you planning on NK'ing for your faction kill?


YOU'RE NOT SUBTLE. WHY CAN'T YOU BE SUBTLE FOR ONE GODDAMN GAME IN YOUR LIFE

RAGEVOTE: GALZRIA
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #88 on: August 09, 2012, 11:40:59 pm »

Galzria, I can't tell if that's a real question, but I'll bite that bait anyway.  No, I'm not a Serial Killer.

Voltgloss, these are real questions for you.  What do you think would be gained by suitclaiming?  Why did you forget about the Major Arcana in your first query?

They were all serious. I haven't heard from Volt or CF yet.

eHunt, want to answer for your Mafia buddy?
Eevee, what about you? Who are you planning on NK'ing for your faction kill?

Well that's a shame.  There's a difference between probing questions and arbitrary questions.  One type helps us find scum, the other type fills up forum space.  Here's a probing question.

Why not just claim to be Major Arcana? Of course, doing that sure would attract a whole lot of attention to yourself.
Sparky can you explain your reasoning behind why you said that Major Arcana should just claim as such?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #89 on: August 09, 2012, 11:52:09 pm »

Galzria, I can't tell if that's a real question, but I'll bite that bait anyway.  No, I'm not a Serial Killer.

Voltgloss, these are real questions for you.  What do you think would be gained by suitclaiming?  Why did you forget about the Major Arcana in your first query?

They were all serious. I haven't heard from Volt or CF yet.

eHunt, want to answer for your Mafia buddy?
Eevee, what about you? Who are you planning on NK'ing for your faction kill?

Well that's a shame.  There's a difference between probing questions and arbitrary questions.  One type helps us find scum, the other type fills up forum space.  Here's a probing question.

Why not just claim to be Major Arcana? Of course, doing that sure would attract a whole lot of attention to yourself.
Sparky can you explain your reasoning behind why you said that Major Arcana should just claim as such?

I don't think they're arbitrary at all, responses often vary.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #90 on: August 09, 2012, 11:52:41 pm »

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Shraeye, are you a Serial Killer?

Volt, are you a Werewolf?

Axxle, are you Mafia?

They were all serious. I haven't heard from Volt or CF yet.

eHunt, want to answer for your Mafia buddy?
Eevee, what about you? Who are you planning on NK'ing for your faction kill?


YOU'RE NOT SUBTLE. WHY CAN'T YOU BE SUBTLE FOR ONE GODDAMN GAME IN YOUR LIFE

RAGEVOTE: GALZRIA

*yawn*
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #91 on: August 09, 2012, 11:53:19 pm »

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Shraeye, are you a Serial Killer?

Volt, are you a Werewolf?

Axxle, are you Mafia?

They were all serious. I haven't heard from Volt or CF yet.

eHunt, want to answer for your Mafia buddy?
Eevee, what about you? Who are you planning on NK'ing for your faction kill?


YOU'RE NOT SUBTLE. WHY CAN'T YOU BE SUBTLE FOR ONE GODDAMN GAME IN YOUR LIFE

RAGEVOTE: GALZRIA

*yawn*
Oh, geez.
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I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #92 on: August 09, 2012, 11:54:48 pm »

I think loaded questions are more useful IRL than on the message board. The problem is that I get plenty of time to think and say "hey! that question presupposes that I have a mafia buddy, but that would make me mafia, so it's a loaded question!" And then nobody learns anything. IRL you get to watch the wheels turning when you ask pressure questions.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #93 on: August 09, 2012, 11:58:34 pm »

I think loaded questions are more useful IRL than on the message board. The problem is that I get plenty of time to think and say "hey! that question presupposes that I have a mafia buddy, but that would make me mafia, so it's a loaded question!" And then nobody learns anything. IRL you get to watch the wheels turning when you ask pressure questions.

Hey, in truth of you read back through other games, I've not been a big fan either - actively called out how pointless they were. Buuut,, Robz liked to stand by them, so in his absence and lack of posting I figure they can stand in just fine. Besides, while all the vets know and have seen them, you never know when someone new might go "wait, what?"
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #94 on: August 09, 2012, 11:58:52 pm »

I think loaded questions are more useful IRL than on the message board. The problem is that I get plenty of time to think and say "hey! that question presupposes that I have a mafia buddy, but that would make me mafia, so it's a loaded question!" And then nobody learns anything. IRL you get to watch the wheels turning when you ask pressure questions.

Without referencing any other games, its another... lets say interesting... well, not claim, but obvious tactic for a specific role that might be in the game.

Actually, this role can be either scum or town in this game so I'm directly calling this one out

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Lie_Detector
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #95 on: August 10, 2012, 12:00:57 am »

I think loaded questions are more useful IRL than on the message board. The problem is that I get plenty of time to think and say "hey! that question presupposes that I have a mafia buddy, but that would make me mafia, so it's a loaded question!" And then nobody learns anything. IRL you get to watch the wheels turning when you ask pressure questions.

Without referencing any other games, its another... lets say interesting... well, not claim, but obvious tactic for a specific role that might be in the game.

Actually, this role can be either scum or town in this game so I'm directly calling this one out

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Lie_Detector

You over think things WAY to much.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #96 on: August 10, 2012, 12:02:58 am »

I don't really mind anything to get the talking going, btw, even if it's loaded questions. I prefer theory to RVS and general hollering but don't much care. I'm too exhausted to theorize about the setup right now though. One thing to note - the decks function to give vanilla townies a bit of a "named townies" role like Jo unintentionally got for himself in MVI. This will probably be very helpful to town.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #97 on: August 10, 2012, 12:04:02 am »

I don't really mind anything to get the talking going, btw, even if it's loaded questions. I prefer theory to RVS and general hollering but don't much care. I'm too exhausted to theorize about the setup right now though. One thing to note - the decks function to give vanilla townies a bit of a "named townies" role like Jo unintentionally got for himself in MVI. This will probably be very helpful to town.

If by unintentionally got for himself, you mean intentionally got for himself, which wasn't intended for by the mod, then yes.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #98 on: August 10, 2012, 12:12:51 am »

To angrybirds, shraeye, other new folks - in MVI when I was brand new I found the constant references to old mafia games annoying and not helpful,  but you do actually learn a lot from them if you sit down and read through them. They are pretty hard to skim, though, and long.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #99 on: August 10, 2012, 12:32:08 am »

Hi guys. I am here for a few minutes. I have skimmed the thread. I don't have time to catch up for real now. I am packing up Friday and moving on Saturday, so I will have basically very little availability until Saturday night/Sunday. Sorry! (And nobody say I am am over-committed in mafia games or I will vote for them!)
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #100 on: August 10, 2012, 12:34:25 am »

Quote
To angrybirds, shraeye, other new folks - in MVI when I was brand new I found the constant references to old mafia games annoying and not helpful,  but you do actually learn a lot from them if you sit down and read through them. They are pretty hard to skim, though, and long.

Indeed they are. It took me a couple hours to read the first mafia game, and that wasn't a 4000 page behemoth.

shraeye, here's my reasoning. I initially found Volt's query unnecessarily complex. Once you suit claim, there's automatically a possibility you're Major Arcana, which means who-knows-what to all who aren't as such. I then reasoned, why not claim to just be Major Arcana (a bit of talking out loud), but then if you do you claim to be an unknown super-power role, which means people will be watching you much more closely. So, not smart. With Volt's method, if you claim, say, Pentacles, you have a 87.5% chance of actually being Pentacles, if you're telling the truth and there's two Major Arcanas. Arcani. Whatever the plural is.

Heh, not playing mafia in a couple of years is quite challenging, I will admit.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #101 on: August 10, 2012, 12:37:32 am »

I would suggest that anybody really serious about learning stuff should read either MII or MIV. Those were very, very good games where the wins were well-deserved. MV and MVI, on the other hand, resolved themselves based on almost entirely random night targeting.
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #102 on: August 10, 2012, 12:39:25 am »

Don't look at MV and MVI because I played poorly in both games.

FTFY

Well, mainly MVI, but still.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #103 on: August 10, 2012, 12:42:58 am »

So just over 1/4 of the deck consists of scum roles. With 16 players then, is 4 scum too much? Too little? I can't imagine 5 scum in 16 players, but if it's 4 and we know that there is an SK, then the odds of two scum factions (both WW and Mafia) should go down, correct? Or else 1 faction only has 1 member.

So how do you think the breakdown went?

2
1
SK
?

3
SK
?

Or do you see there being 5 scum, with teams being

2
2
SK
?

Thoughts?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #104 on: August 10, 2012, 12:44:38 am »

So just over 1/4 of the deck consists of scum roles. With 16 players then, is 4 scum too much? Too little? I can't imagine 5 scum in 16 players, but if it's 4 and we know that there is an SK, then the odds of two scum factions (both WW and Mafia) should go down, correct? Or else 1 faction only has 1 member.

So how do you think the breakdown went?

2
1
SK
?

3
SK
?

Or do you see there being 5 scum, with teams being

2
2
SK
?

Thoughts?

Splitting scumteams makes more scum more balanced. MVI had 6/18 (not incl. survivor) scum and probably favors town even with noncrap scum play.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #105 on: August 10, 2012, 01:28:11 am »

I recommend that people "serious" about learning stuff jump right in, play games, and don't worry about rereading old games unless that's your idea of fun. Seriously, it's not important enough to be worth reading the sort of volume of posts that go into these games. Also, feel free to be aggressive and accuse people and ruffle people's feathers, and shrug it off when people do the same to you.

I'm not sure that I even buy
 
I would suggest that anybody really serious about learning stuff should read either MII or MIV. Those were very, very good games where the wins were well-deserved. MV and MVI, on the other hand, resolved themselves based on almost entirely random night targeting.
 


 So far all f.ds games have been basically won or lost via night targeting and investigations. Not necessarily random, but still, it's all about the power roles. VTs play a supporting role.  In MII, the part where mafia hit a cop N1 was pretty critical, don't you think?

OK, back to gamechat about arcacna.

If 1/4 of the deck consists of scum roles, we're probably in pretty good shape. 2 WW, 2 Mafia... not so bad. It depends on the luck of the draw - if we get  a Mafia Godfather and a cop clears him early, we're sort of screwed, but you can't really plan for that and whatever. Also depends on whatever the heck the Major Arcana are. I look forward to one of them dying just so that we can know what sort of things they have!

We'll see after N1 what the breakdown is. I would expect 2-3 deaths N1, with the potential for more or less. 3 probably means we have SK or vig, 2 probably means no SK, 4 means SK AND Vig of some sort. 1 death probably means no sk, no vig, and a lucky doctor/roleblocker. I think the probabilities work out so at least 1 ww and at least 1 mafia are pretty likely?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #106 on: August 10, 2012, 01:30:28 am »

Mod confirmed SK. ;D
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #107 on: August 10, 2012, 01:31:16 am »

The wind suddenly picks up and rushes around your ears. You can distinctly make out the sound of ghostly voices. They say, "There is at least one serial killer in this game." Then they say, "BOO!"
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #108 on: August 10, 2012, 01:46:14 am »

oh right
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #109 on: August 10, 2012, 01:49:27 am »

Volt, are you a Werewolf?
No.

Voltgloss, these are real questions for you.  What do you think would be gained by suitclaiming?  Why did you forget about the Major Arcana in your first query?
As someone else (Axxle?) suggested, the benefit I was mulling was forcing scum to drop some information now under circumstances where lying (1) has no immediate discernible benefit and (2) may complicate things for them later - i.e., catch them IN a lie - if they try to fakeclaim a role outside their suit bounds.  I was specifically comparing this to Mystery Mafia in my head.  But it wasn't at all clear to me though whether, in THIS setup (as opposed to Mystery Mafia), such benefit outweighed the potential detriment(s).   

That I was thinking about this vis-a-vis Mystery Mafia is why I didn't think about the Major Arcana when first raising the question.  My initial thought process was simply:  "we have suits -> different types of roles are restricted to certain suits -> like Mystery Mafia where different cardnames are linked to different sets -> do we want to claim suits like we claimed sets?"  No analog to Major Arcana in Mystery Mafia, so they didn't enter my head until ftl specifically mentioned them in responding to me (and reposted the full setup list plus Major Arcana).  [I've been thinking about Mystery Mafia rather a lot more than this game, so far]

The intent of the question was not to suggest we should try to trap/reveal Major Arcana early.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #110 on: August 10, 2012, 02:38:26 am »

... we should try to trap/reveal Major Arcana early.
Gasp!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #111 on: August 10, 2012, 02:46:52 am »

asp!

Vote: Axxle because he's a snake.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #112 on: August 10, 2012, 06:14:15 am »

e's a snake.

'E is?  Get 'im!

Vote: eHunt
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #113 on: August 10, 2012, 07:12:22 am »

Well, 16 players in a non-BM game! Not bad... Hope you're up for the work Cayvie. You've got a 4000 post behemoth coming your way!

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Sorry galz, I am not scum.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #114 on: August 10, 2012, 07:18:16 am »

I am quite town too. Galzria looks towny to me, so does Volt. Apparently the active always do though.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #115 on: August 10, 2012, 07:30:20 am »

I'm going to confuse sparky and shraeye for the foreseeable future. How can I differentiate them? What's your playstyle? Angrybirds I can remember because he's twinclaimed by yuma.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #116 on: August 10, 2012, 07:35:20 am »

As far as I'm concerned, the value of the old mafia games is less "seeing good mafia games" and more "learning people's behavior patterns." The primary example so far is Morgrim, whose play is very eccentric. It's easy to mistake the eccentricity for scumminess. Galzria tends to be verbose.

It's sort of boring to dig in, though.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #117 on: August 10, 2012, 08:48:57 am »

 i am going to vote:Galzeria because he is playing just like a person who wants us to think he is town
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #118 on: August 10, 2012, 09:52:21 am »

I would like to say that I plan on doing upping my game.  After poor showings in BMMMMM1 and RMM1 and my recent death in BMIV, I'm done with that style of mafia.  The new and improved shark_bait is here.  And yes ehunt, I am already starting to get quite aware of some players' idiosyncrasies.  Hopefully that will help me in this game.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #119 on: August 10, 2012, 10:20:47 am »

Hey shark you changing your play style to cover for the fax your scum this game?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #120 on: August 10, 2012, 10:39:18 am »

Hey shark you changing your play style to cover for the fax your scum this game?
vote sharky
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #121 on: August 10, 2012, 11:36:07 am »

I would like to say that I plan on doing upping my game.  After poor showings in BMMMMM1 and RMM1 and my recent death in BMIV, I'm done with that style of mafia.  The new and improved shark_bait is here.  And yes ehunt, I am already starting to get quite aware of some players' idiosyncrasies.  Hopefully that will help me in this game.

Sharky, what do you perceive to be the defects in your previous strategy? What do you plan to change?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #122 on: August 10, 2012, 11:40:00 am »

(careful not to talk about ongoing games)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #123 on: August 10, 2012, 11:44:49 am »

(careful not to talk about ongoing games)

Oh, yeah. Don't mention MVII.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #124 on: August 10, 2012, 11:48:22 am »

(careful not to talk about ongoing games)

Oh, yeah. Don't mention MVII.

I think all of the games sharky has played in are still ongoing, yes? 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #125 on: August 10, 2012, 12:07:43 pm »

(careful not to talk about ongoing games)

Oh, yeah. Don't mention MVII.

I think all of the games sharky has played in are still ongoing, yes?

You have an excellent example of him playing mafia in BM4 - which just ended!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #126 on: August 10, 2012, 12:09:42 pm »

(careful not to talk about ongoing games)

Oh, yeah. Don't mention MVII.

I think all of the games sharky has played in are still ongoing, yes?

You have an excellent example of him playing mafia in BM4 - which just ended!
Holy crap, I really thought he was just spectating.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #127 on: August 10, 2012, 12:13:51 pm »

You have an excellent example of him playing mafia in BM4 - which just ended!
Holy crap, I really thought he was just spectating.

I have no idea how people got that impression.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #128 on: August 10, 2012, 12:17:01 pm »

I think of BM4 as more of an "event" than "game."
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #129 on: August 10, 2012, 12:18:23 pm »

Don't worry, I wasn't planning on mentioned VII at all!  Well one thing I will do better is reading the rules and not getting modkilled, but apart from that, I think one thing I'm not good at is scumhunting.  If I truly think someone is town, a little voice in the back of my head says "WIFOM" and then I second guess myself.  I still am not confident on myself to distinguish between town play and scum play.  And then there is BMMMMM1 (which is still in progress so I'll just mention my stuff).  I decided as cop to just play a nice and easy D1, work on the MM part but I get called out lurking and not actively caring about catching scum.  My first response could probably have been better as it led to more votes against me which basically made me claim PR to Eevee.

So what do I plan on changing?  I plan on taking notes in a document about my thoughts on various players and discussions.  In this way I am not constantly forced to look back in the thread to find information.  I can save time which can then be used for more productive things.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #130 on: August 10, 2012, 12:22:03 pm »

Dude... Frisk, you can't really count BMIV.  I was only able to play that way b/c you explicitly omitted the player list.  Everyone knows that I'm actually playing in this game.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #131 on: August 10, 2012, 12:49:33 pm »

Dude... Frisk, you can't really count BMIV.  I was only able to play that way b/c you explicitly omitted the player list.  Everyone knows that I'm actually playing in this game.

So you are admitting that you're going to play scum differently here.  Got it.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #132 on: August 10, 2012, 01:03:09 pm »

Hey shark you changing your play style to cover for the fax your scum this game?
vote sharky

oh wow. That h is gonna get annoying real fast >_<

I'm with eHunt that there's value in learning how people behave. That's usually how I approach these games. I've only played like, eight or nine games to the end online. I remember being mafia more often than town though >_< But everyone said I was a skilled player when mafia. Those games weren't very intense though. We very often were setback by inactive players, never saying anything because they "couldn't find things to say". A lot of modkills occurred. Anyways, in my first game when I was scum, I had two partners and one of them got killed by the Vigilante. During day 3 the Vigilante suspected me and my remaining partner as the remaining scum, and so I backstabbed my remaining partner out of nowhere by accusing and voting him, in a last-ditch effort to survive. I did end up winning that game, but it was a very risky stunt I'm not likely to repeat. It actually cost me a lot of games that I played afterwards, because I often got lynched because no one could trust me  ;D

So behavior matters.

Quote
It's easy to mistake the eccentricity for scumminess.

I can confirm this as well. So many Townies were lynched when I played for this very reason.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #133 on: August 10, 2012, 01:17:39 pm »

Hey shark you changing your play style to cover for the fax your scum this game?
vote sharky

oh wow. That h is gonna get annoying real fast >_<
Yeah, sharky looks too much like sparky for me; I assume that's what you're talking about
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #134 on: August 10, 2012, 03:45:59 pm »

Yeah, in this game it's probably better to use full names. "sharkbait" not "sharky" please folks.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #135 on: August 10, 2012, 04:27:59 pm »

Yeah, in this game it's probably better to use full names. "sharkbait" not "sharky" please folks.

my apologies

vote: sharkbait
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #136 on: August 10, 2012, 04:56:18 pm »

Dude... Frisk, you can't really count BMIV.  I was only able to play that way b/c you explicitly omitted the player list.  Everyone knows that I'm actually playing in this game.

So you are admitting that you're going to play scum differently here.  Got it.

You're forgetting Frisk.  I "wasn't" playing in BMIV  ;)

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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #137 on: August 10, 2012, 05:09:02 pm »

I'm going to confuse sparky and shraeye for the foreseeable future. How can I differentiate them? What's your playstyle? Angrybirds I can remember because he's twinclaimed by yuma.

What does twinclaimed mean?
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #138 on: August 10, 2012, 05:10:09 pm »

To angrybirds, shraeye, other new folks - in MVI when I was brand new I found the constant references to old mafia games annoying and not helpful,  but you do actually learn a lot from them if you sit down and read through them. They are pretty hard to skim, though, and long.

i viewed throughout most of the third game and the medical game
you played well in the med one
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #139 on: August 10, 2012, 05:15:26 pm »

Vote Count
Morgrim7 (1): Captain_Frisk
Eevee (1): Axxle
yuma (1): Insomniac
shark_bait (1): yuma
Captain_Frisk (1): Morgrim7
Galzria (2): O, angrybirds
Axxle (1): ftl
ehunt (1): Voltgloss

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #140 on: August 10, 2012, 05:19:42 pm »

Vote Count
Galzria (2): O, angrybirds

Sure

Vote: Galzria
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #141 on: August 10, 2012, 05:21:33 pm »

Didnt know I still had my joke vote on yuma

Unvote
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #142 on: August 10, 2012, 05:24:56 pm »

I'm going to confuse sparky and shraeye for the foreseeable future. How can I differentiate them? What's your playstyle? Angrybirds I can remember because he's twinclaimed by yuma.

What does twinclaimed mean?

Its a f.ds thing.  Glooble and Jotheonah are allegedly real-life twins.  They "revealed" halfway through MIV.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #143 on: August 10, 2012, 05:25:53 pm »

I'm going to confuse sparky and shraeye for the foreseeable future. How can I differentiate them? What's your playstyle? Angrybirds I can remember because he's twinclaimed by yuma.

What does twinclaimed mean?

Its a f.ds thing.  Glooble and Jotheonah are allegedly real-life twins.  They "revealed" halfway through MIV.

In the general case it means two people who know each other in real life.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #144 on: August 10, 2012, 08:21:11 pm »

Well, one way to get things going is to start a wagon. Vote: Galzria . Because he's scummy.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #145 on: August 10, 2012, 08:22:30 pm »

Oh, wait, axxle just did that and I missed it. Failz on my part, I thought I was the third vote.

Well, I'm the fourth I guess.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #146 on: August 10, 2012, 10:12:08 pm »

Galzria is certainly outspoken. I'm especially questioning his interrogatory quintuple post. Not something you see every day.

We're almost on page 7. Is it time to start the inevitable bandwagon? I don't want to get onboard just yet. I need more convincing.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #147 on: August 10, 2012, 10:25:45 pm »

Galzria is certainly outspoken. I'm especially questioning his interrogatory quintuple post. Not something you see every day.

We're almost on page 7. Is it time to start the inevitable bandwagon? I don't want to get onboard just yet. I need more convincing.
i would suggest his complete lack of posts since very very early this morning could be compelling

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #148 on: August 11, 2012, 12:07:22 am »

i would suggest [Galzria's] complete lack of posts since very very early this morning could be compelling
But he warned us of V/LA this weekend starting today.  He's only made 5 posts today, and only one suggests that he spent any time on it.  O and Morgrim haven't posted in even longer, but neither have made ANY posts in the last 15.5 hours.  I'd say at this point that length in time from posting where so little has been revealed is a pretty flimsy reason.

If you want something more interesting to discuss look at this post:
So I was gonna say that the main benefit of suit claiming might be to discern if we are dealing with one or two scum factions but perhaps the wind will tell us so I'm going to be against suit claiming
where Insomniac posits that suit-claiming will let us know how many factions we are dealing with.  Protip: it won't tell us anything unless either wands/swords or pentacles/cups had no claimers since we have no good way to tell or suspect that a particular suitclaim is scum.  Maybe he and his scummates were planning to claim in the other suits (all WW wands move to Cups, all WW Swords move to Pentacles, as an example) and make it look like there was one less faction.  No real evidence here, only a bit of food for thought.

Or look at these posts:
[AT END OF POST]
While outing mafia-aligned major arcana would be good, outing town-aligned major arcana would be really, really bad, they'll be our super-powered power roles. We wouldn't know whether the Major Arcana we out are mafia or town, but scum certainly would.
I assume mafia-aligned major arcana would just lie anyway.  Or pretend to be town aligned.
In which f.DS.mafia veterans both forget that there could be extra scum factions, only referring to mafia in their posts.  Could be a slip of thought since most games here only have mafia.  But I bet neither of them is SK or WW; hard to forget yourself.  But wouldn't every good townie be super-paranoid of ALL the baddies....?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #149 on: August 11, 2012, 12:38:37 am »

Unless it matters, I use mafia and scum interchangeably.  Doesn't really matter until we talk about scumbuddies.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #150 on: August 11, 2012, 02:44:22 am »

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #151 on: August 11, 2012, 04:35:12 am »

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
No, I'm super really sure you didn't.  I'll let others decide what that means because it could be just a bad habit, but I'm lurking around for whatever "clues" I can get at this stage.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #152 on: August 11, 2012, 04:48:33 am »

Well, one way to get things going is to start a wagon. Vote: Galzria . Because he's scummy.
Hey shark you changing your play style to cover for the fax your scum this game?
vote sharky
I don't know who to vote for.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #153 on: August 11, 2012, 05:37:45 am »

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #154 on: August 11, 2012, 10:24:33 am »

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac

You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #155 on: August 11, 2012, 12:16:49 pm »

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac

You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.

He's already expressed his disagreement with one of Insomniac's posts.

Quote
Quote from: Insomniac on August 09, 2012, 06:35:18 pm
So I was gonna say that the main benefit of suit claiming might be to discern if we are dealing with one or two scum factions but perhaps the wind will tell us so I'm going to be against suit claiming
where Insomniac posits that suit-claiming will let us know how many factions we are dealing with.  Protip: it won't tell us anything unless either wands/swords or pentacles/cups had no claimers since we have no good way to tell or suspect that a particular suitclaim is scum.  Maybe he and his scummates were planning to claim in the other suits (all WW wands move to Cups, all WW Swords move to Pentacles, as an example) and make it look like there was one less faction.  No real evidence here, only a bit of food for thought.

On another note, I'm getting those pro-town vibes about shraeye. I think he's trying to really look out for the town. Of course, more clarification concerning the above WOULD be nice (particularly because of yuma's last statement; I've seen many townies do very anti-townie things), and failure to provide such could change my mind. I'll see.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #156 on: August 11, 2012, 02:52:38 pm »

I want to argue that

1. a suit-claim (or another sort of claim) is bad for town.

2. in general, if "x" is some sort of move we could make that's bad for town, it's not that anti-town to ask "hey, is x good for town?" There's plenty of room for theory discussion before anything happens. Arguing forcefully or disingenuously for x in the face of overwhelming arguments that x is bad for town, on the other hand, is very scummy. Now you do have to be careful, e.g., if you're the two-shot bulletproof weak vigilante, you don't want to answer the "is x good for town" question by saying "no! what about the two-shot bulletproof weak vigilante's perspective!" but smart people aren't going to do that.

tl;dr i'm not so suspicious of insomniac even though suit-claiming is a mistake.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #157 on: August 11, 2012, 03:34:40 pm »

I never said we should suit claim I was saying a select few claiming could reveal if there are multiple factions. Quite the contrary I oppose suit claiming especially en masse
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #158 on: August 11, 2012, 03:59:04 pm »

I'm pretty sure I did talk about sk/ww here.

If 1/4 of the deck consists of scum roles, we're probably in pretty good shape. 2 WW, 2 Mafia... not so bad. It depends on the luck of the draw - if we get  a Mafia Godfather and a cop clears him early, we're sort of screwed, but you can't really plan for that and whatever. Also depends on whatever the heck the Major Arcana are. I look forward to one of them dying just so that we can know what sort of things they have!

We'll see after N1 what the breakdown is. I would expect 2-3 deaths N1, with the potential for more or less. 3 probably means we have SK or vig, 2 probably means no SK, 4 means SK AND Vig of some sort. 1 death probably means no sk, no vig, and a lucky doctor/roleblocker. I think the probabilities work out so at least 1 ww and at least 1 mafia are pretty likely?

Of course, I was sort of wrong because we had modconfirmation of a SK present. So we should expect 3 night deaths with the possibility of fewer if we get lucky with doctors or with mafia/ww/sk targeting the same person.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #159 on: August 11, 2012, 05:22:01 pm »

Vote: Insomniac
You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.
Basically there are a lot of posts from Insomniac (7 when I made my vote) and only 1 which I could mayybe see it as a constructive town post were reasons for taking certain actions were analyzed in a pro-town light.  That seems to me like someone who is trying to avoid lurking while also avoiding really pushing for bringing scum out (even Galz's straightforward posts at least tried to get things started).  At the time of that vote he had the worst ratios of any players in constructive posts/total posts (where constructive votes are subjectively rated by me before tallying).  This feels like something scum would try to do.  His 7 posts were
1. a quick random vote for fun
2. joke/explanation of someones random vote
3. explanation of that joke above
4. joke-feeling vote on brother-claiming yuma
6. a joke/attack at sharkbait for trying to play this game "differently"
7. unvoting joke-vote on yuma

I left off #5 in the middle and that is the post I've previously tried to analyze.  I'm going to try to write more about my feelings on it. 
So I was gonna say that the main benefit of suit claiming might be to discern if we are dealing with one or two scum factions but perhaps the wind will tell us so I'm going to be against suit claiming
First, I've already pointed out how suit-claiming could be gamed by a faction to make it look more like they aren't there.
Second, this really reads to me like he's somewhat upset at cayvie for deciding that it will be good to reveal information to the town, maybe because this would make his faction-trick less possible.
Now new information is given, where Insomniac says this:
I never said we should suit claim I was saying a select few claiming could reveal if there are multiple factions. Quite the contrary I oppose suit claiming especially en masse
Well he had never made a select few/en masse distinction before despite this claim.  Also, he makes it sound like he's now very opposed to something he previously suggested he was for.  Convenient switch now that consensus has come out that town doesn't want suitclaims.



1. in general, if "x" is some sort of move we could make that's bad for town, it's not that anti-town to ask "hey, is x good for town?" There's plenty of room for theory discussion before anything happens.
I agree.  I haven't seen anything that is patently anti-town.  I've just noticed and pointed out some suspicious behaviors.  I've asked the "hey, is x good for town"-sayers to explain their thoughts and positions and so far mostly everything has left me with a more positive feeling about them.  Except for pooossibly Axxle's and definitely Insomniac's

I'm pretty sure I did talk about sk/ww here.
If 1/4 of the deck consists of scum roles, we're probably in pretty good shape. 2 WW, 2 Mafia... not so bad. It depends on the luck of the draw - if we get  a Mafia Godfather and a cop clears him early, we're sort of screwed, but you can't really plan for that and whatever. Also depends on whatever the heck the Major Arcana are. I look forward to one of them dying just so that we can know what sort of things they have!
We'll see after N1 what the breakdown is. I would expect 2-3 deaths N1, with the potential for more or less. 3 probably means we have SK or vig, 2 probably means no SK, 4 means SK AND Vig of some sort. 1 death probably means no sk, no vig, and a lucky doctor/roleblocker. I think the probabilities work out so at least 1 ww and at least 1 mafia are pretty likely?
Yup, that's true.  I was referring to the posts before the one I was quoting, you had made an early mistake and since then you have corrected it.  Since you did that without anybody having called you out yet, I feel it may have been a legitimate mistake.  Axxle is the same way, he had corrected his mistake before it was pointed out.  I think in general I get good vibes from you (by this I mean explaining consequences of various actions in logical ways in order to steer us towards a better decision.)  I get mostly good vibes from Axxle, but a slight negative from how he dismissed my post without much consideration, while you took time to hunt out counterexamples and defend yourself.  That feels more like you care about stopping me from coming to the wrong conclusion and Axxle cares more about getting the suspicion off his back quickly.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #160 on: August 11, 2012, 06:56:53 pm »

i would suggest [Galzria's] complete lack of posts since very very early this morning could be compelling
But he warned us of V/LA this weekend starting today.  He's only made 5 posts today, and only one suggests that he spent any time on it.  O and Morgrim haven't posted in even longer, but neither have made ANY posts in the last 15.5 hours.  I'd say at this point that length in time from posting where so little has been revealed is a pretty flimsy reason.


well i am going to keep my vote on him   at least until he responds and i can see a little bit more of him before i change my mind about anything
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #161 on: August 11, 2012, 06:57:32 pm »

i would suggest [Galzria's] complete lack of posts since very very early this morning could be compelling
But he warned us of V/LA this weekend starting today.  He's only made 5 posts today, and only one suggests that he spent any time on it.  O and Morgrim haven't posted in even longer, but neither have made ANY posts in the last 15.5 hours.  I'd say at this point that length in time from posting where so little has been revealed is a pretty flimsy reason.


well i am going to keep my vote on him   at least until he responds and i can see a little bit more of him before i change my mind about anything
sorry bolded part is mine that i just added
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #162 on: August 11, 2012, 10:28:16 pm »

@shraeye: I've never been good at RVS look at any game I played in.

The sharky thing in particular is how I handled day 1 in M6

to your number 5, well I've already said I'm against suit claiming but I was toying with a few ideas when cayvie revealed the SK.

If one person from the mafia aligned suits voluntarily claimed and one from the other suits voluntarily claimed it would prove that there were multi factions, but the scum could use it to game the town. Additionally there isn't really a good way to handle the major arcana. Hence I came out against suit claiming.

And well this is how I play the game.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #163 on: August 12, 2012, 01:18:56 am »

So I see shraeye starting to attack the specific wording of peoples' posts, which is a common approach by eager new players (it certainly was mine!), and I'm about to dismiss it as such when I see this:

Now new information is given, where Insomniac says this:
I never said we should suit claim I was saying a select few claiming could reveal if there are multiple factions. Quite the contrary I oppose suit claiming especially en masse
Well he had never made a select few/en masse distinction before despite this claim.  Also, he makes it sound like he's now very opposed to something he previously suggested he was for.  Convenient switch now that consensus has come out that town doesn't want suitclaims.

And shraeye makes a pretty good point here.  Insom's "explanation" raises more questions than it answers.  He didn't say anything about "a select few claiming" in his initial post on the subject.  So why make that response?  It feels like trying too hard in response to some early suspicion. 

Insom's latest has me scratching my head some more.  I flat out don't understand what he's getting at in his second-to-last paragraph.  It continues to feel like too much of a response to first-day semi-RVS suspicion.  Which makes me want to ratchet up the pressure some more to see what else we get.

Vote: Insomniac
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #164 on: August 12, 2012, 03:14:35 am »

Ok, thats enough to convince me. Vote: Insomniac
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #165 on: August 12, 2012, 11:19:57 am »

Ok, thats enough to convince me. Vote: Insomniac

Why do you never have unique information to add to a game? Why why why?
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #166 on: August 12, 2012, 11:24:05 am »

What are we going to do if Morgrim is scum one of these games?
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #167 on: August 12, 2012, 11:31:57 am »

What are we going to do if Morgrim is scum one of these games?

Wait for him to claim cop/rolecop hybrid again?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #168 on: August 12, 2012, 12:00:25 pm »

I'm pretty sure I did talk about sk/ww here.

If 1/4 of the deck consists of scum roles, we're probably in pretty good shape. 2 WW, 2 Mafia... not so bad. It depends on the luck of the draw - if we get  a Mafia Godfather and a cop clears him early, we're sort of screwed, but you can't really plan for that and whatever. Also depends on whatever the heck the Major Arcana are. I look forward to one of them dying just so that we can know what sort of things they have!

We'll see after N1 what the breakdown is. I would expect 2-3 deaths N1, with the potential for more or less. 3 probably means we have SK or vig, 2 probably means no SK, 4 means SK AND Vig of some sort. 1 death probably means no sk, no vig, and a lucky doctor/roleblocker. I think the probabilities work out so at least 1 ww and at least 1 mafia are pretty likely?

Of course, I was sort of wrong because we had modconfirmation of a SK present. So we should expect 3 night deaths with the possibility of fewer if we get lucky with doctors or with mafia/ww/sk targeting the same person.

Why would 2 deaths in the night mean no Serial Killer? Admittedly, I'm catching up and I might have missed something. Do we have confirmed double scum teams or vig or something?

Also, what is the case against Insomniac? Insomniac never survives Day 1.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #169 on: August 12, 2012, 12:43:25 pm »

Robz, the mod confirmed there is at least one SK.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #170 on: August 12, 2012, 12:47:33 pm »

Robz, the mod confirmed there is at least one SK.

Right, so we should have 2 deaths, and then maybe a 3rd if Vig or something. But ftl said 2 deaths would mean no Sk...
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #171 on: August 12, 2012, 01:09:55 pm »

Also, what is the case against Insomniac? Insomniac never survives Day 1.

The case against Insomniac is that he overreacted to minor pressure, by way of claiming his earlier posts said things that they pretty clearly were not saying.

I know town-Insom also tends to react poorly to pressure, but this was really not much pressure at all (coming from only one source, shraeye).
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #172 on: August 12, 2012, 01:23:59 pm »

So I see shraeye starting to attack the specific wording of peoples' posts, which is a common approach by eager new players (it certainly was mine!)

Insom's latest has me scratching my head some more.  I flat out don't understand what he's getting at in his second-to-last paragraph.  It continues to feel like too much of a response to first-day semi-RVS suspicion.  Which makes me want to ratchet up the pressure some more to see what else we get.
Yeah, I am throwing around some attacks when I see small inconsistencies.  I really like to give people a chance to explain themselves, this gives me a chance to flesh out a ? read into a +/0/- read (these are my shorthand for suspicious or interesting--yeah I'm overloading that symbol--and then pro-town/null/anti-town).

I want to hear Insomniac give a reply to Volt's unstated question.  What do you mean by that second to last paragraph?
If one person from the mafia aligned suits voluntarily claimed and one from the other suits voluntarily claimed it would prove that there were multi factions, but the scum could use it to game the town. Additionally there isn't really a good way to handle the major arcana. Hence I came out against suit claiming.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #173 on: August 12, 2012, 01:39:49 pm »

Right, so we should have 2 deaths, and then maybe a 3rd if Vig or something. But ftl said 2 deaths would mean no Sk...
I'm so confused here.  It seems to me that we could have Mafia, Werewolves, SK, and even a Vig.  So I'm definitely not expecting more than 4 deaths (wait, I just realized there can be multiple vigs and multiple SKs.  Good gravy.)  But still, I don't really know how many deaths we should expect, or what certain numbers might mean. 

Can't scum also opt for no-kill in the night?  Here, my limited experience with playing this game is limiting (haha) me.  Do scum always kill at night?  Not killing may cause confusion, but I'm not sure that confusion would really change towns strategy at all.  Is not night-killing ever beneficial to mafia, and would the answer change if there were multiple factions?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #174 on: August 12, 2012, 02:21:49 pm »

Scum will rarely not use a kill.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #175 on: August 12, 2012, 02:25:51 pm »

Yeah, scum not wanting to kill is super super rare, and never happens this early in the game. I suggest we cross that bridge when we get there, I would assume we are dealing with two scum teams and a single serial killer (and a vig or two for town) though.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #176 on: August 12, 2012, 02:57:57 pm »

What, what, and what?

Robz, the mod confirmed there is at least one SK.

Right, so we should have 2 deaths, and then maybe a 3rd if Vig or something. But ftl said 2 deaths would mean no Sk...

Why should we have exactly 2 deaths? The odds of there being that a Mafia and Werewolf faction exist is pretty high. Let me see if I got calculations right; if I'm reading over The Deck correctly, there's 8 Werewolf Roles out of a possible 52 Minor Arcana Roles, which there's 14 of, given 2 Major Arcana roles. The probability of there NOT having Werewolves in this game is (44/52)*(41/51)*...*(31/39) [14 fractions, one for each role selection NOT werewolf] is approx. 6.5%. Doing the same process for mafia, I'm getting a 4.4% chance that there's no mafia. But of course, what mafia game wouldn't have mafia. Still, if we subtract each from 100%, we get 93.5% and 95.6% chances of there having Werewolf and Mafia factions in this game, respectively. Multiplying them gives about an 89% chance that both factions are in this game. And all of that isn't even including the Major Arcana. There could be scum roles there too, although that's impossible to calculate given no real information on them.

Therefore, assuming all night kills are successful, then there will mostly likely be 3 (or more) deaths over the night. There exists a CHANCE of 2 deaths occurring, but it's not guaranteed. Which is why I'm confused that there should be 2 deaths.

Math is fun.

If one person from the mafia aligned suits voluntarily claimed and one from the other suits voluntarily claimed it would prove that there were multi factions, but the scum could use it to game the town. Additionally there isn't really a good way to handle the major arcana. Hence I came out against suit claiming.

Let me try to make sense of this. Let's say that I claim, Pentacles. 5/13 chance of being Mafia. Then, someone else claims "one from the other suits". Okay, so this is Cups, Wands, or Swords. They claim Cups, let's say. No Werewolves there. So, how would this prove that there are multiple factions? Maybe you meant that if one claims Cups/Pentacles, another claims Wands/Swords, or something like that. But wouldn't it be important to make that distinction?  ???

And I don't think the opposing factions would want to work together, each faction is trying to win on their own. Moreover, they are capable of killing each other, when most Town roles can't, so they pose more of a threat.

I've already expressed my opinions on handling the Major Arcana. Just mentioning it in one sentence doesn't really add a lot.

Quote
Quote
Quote from: Insomniac on August 11, 2012, 03:34:40 pm
I never said we should suit claim I was saying a select few claiming could reveal if there are multiple factions. Quite the contrary I oppose suit claiming especially en masse
Well he had never made a select few/en masse distinction before despite this claim.  Also, he makes it sound like he's now very opposed to something he previously suggested he was for.  Convenient switch now that consensus has come out that town doesn't want suitclaims.

I fail to see the argument here. Why does the lack of few/en masse distinction beforehand matter? And I will concede that his original post (post #5 to you) is ambiguous to determine why he's against suit claims, but he did mention it in the end. He never switched.

And btw, I've never chosen to <no kill> whenever I was mafia, as I failed to see the logic in that. There could be a few reasons I suppose, but I'm not experienced enough in this game to give a full explanation.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #177 on: August 12, 2012, 09:25:30 pm »

Robz, the mod confirmed there is at least one SK.

Right, so we should have 2 deaths, and then maybe a 3rd if Vig or something. But ftl said 2 deaths would mean no Sk...

I was wrong. We have modconfirmed the presence of an SK. We have a high probability of at least 1 werewolf and at least 1 mafia, so I expect 3 kills at night. 4 is possible if we have a vigilante.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #178 on: August 12, 2012, 09:30:12 pm »

In the games of forum mafia that have gone on so far, there's never been a 'no kill' choice by scum. There've been times where nobody died due to doctors or jailkeepers, but never due to direct mafia inaction.

Usually, the amount of confusion mafia add by a no-kill not worth the extra days for town to lynch and extra nights for power roles to investigate.

So if we get too few kills for the expected setup (less than three), I would assume that means that either we got lucky doctoring, lucky jailkeeping, or mafia/werewolves/sk targeted the same person.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #179 on: August 12, 2012, 09:31:16 pm »

Wait, how on earth would 'a select few' claiming give us knowledge as to whether there are multiple factions or not?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #180 on: August 12, 2012, 10:14:11 pm »

Why should we have exactly 2 deaths? The odds of there being that a Mafia and Werewolf faction exist is pretty high. Let me see if I got calculations right; if I'm reading over The Deck correctly, there's 8 Werewolf Roles out of a possible 52 Minor Arcana Roles, which there's 14 of, given 2 Major Arcana roles. The probability of there NOT having Werewolves in this game is (44/52)*(41/51)*...*(31/39) [14 fractions, one for each role selection NOT werewolf] is approx. 6.5%. Doing the same process for mafia, I'm getting a 4.4% chance that there's no mafia. But of course, what mafia game wouldn't have mafia. Still, if we subtract each from 100%, we get 93.5% and 95.6% chances of there having Werewolf and Mafia factions in this game, respectively. Multiplying them gives about an 89% chance that both factions are in this game. And all of that isn't even including the Major Arcana. There could be scum roles there too, although that's impossible to calculate given no real information on them.

Therefore, assuming all night kills are successful, then there will mostly likely be 3 (or more) deaths over the night. There exists a CHANCE of 2 deaths occurring, but it's not guaranteed. Which is why I'm confused that there should be 2 deaths.

Math is fun.
Whoa. This math frightens me.  First off, we don't know the alignment of any Major Arcana, so this will introduce unavoidable error in the probabilities.  Secondly, the draws were random, but cayvie reserved the right to balance the game after draws, so some theoretically obtainable results will not occur.  Also, why did P(no mafia)=0.044?  It seems like there are 8 mafia roles and 8 werewolf roles unless I really don't know what some of cayvie's list means.  Next, don't multiply P(mafia exist)*P(werewolves exist) to get P(both exist) because they aren't independent events. 

So what we really calculate is P(mafia AND werewolf) supposing that Major Arcana are not aligned with those factions, and cayvie did not rebalance regardless of results.  To do this we'll need to work out conditional probability for P(mafia exists GIVEN THAT werewolves exist), but I'm not really eager to post deep calculations.  Bonus points for anyone who also reaches this number (man, I should ask my class this question!):
Assuming no Major Arcana are scum-aligned, P(both mafia AND werewolves exist)=P(werewolves)*P(mafia|werewolves)=.935*.903=.844.

Regardless I fully agree with both of your conclusions. Math is fun! Also, there is a high percentage of two factions and 3 or more deaths.  Some people seem more obviously towny than others so may make good targets.  So I also suspect that two kills on one person is a significant possibility.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #181 on: August 12, 2012, 10:53:16 pm »

Ok, thats enough to convince me. Vote: Insomniac

Why do you never have unique information to add to a game? Why why why?
Morgrim I want a response to this.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #182 on: August 12, 2012, 11:10:41 pm »

Whoa. This math frightens me.  First off, we don't know the alignment of any Major Arcana, so this will introduce unavoidable error in the probabilities.  Secondly, the draws were random, but cayvie reserved the right to balance the game after draws, so some theoretically obtainable results will not occur.  Also, why did P(no mafia)=0.044?  It seems like there are 8 mafia roles and 8 werewolf roles unless I really don't know what some of cayvie's list means.  Next, don't multiply P(mafia exist)*P(werewolves exist) to get P(both exist) because they aren't independent events. 

So what we really calculate is P(mafia AND werewolf) supposing that Major Arcana are not aligned with those factions, and cayvie did not rebalance regardless of results.  To do this we'll need to work out conditional probability for P(mafia exists GIVEN THAT werewolves exist), but I'm not really eager to post deep calculations.  Bonus points for anyone who also reaches this number (man, I should ask my class this question!):
Assuming no Major Arcana are scum-aligned, P(both mafia AND werewolves exist)=P(werewolves)*P(mafia|werewolves)=.935*.903=.844.

Regardless I fully agree with both of your conclusions. Math is fun! Also, there is a high percentage of two factions and 3 or more deaths.  Some people seem more obviously towny than others so may make good targets.  So I also suspect that two kills on one person is a significant possibility.

P(no mafia)=0.044, because there's 9 mafia roles counting the spy. Although, he wouldn't have much of a purpose if mafia didn't exist, so probably we should leave him out of the calculations. And "P(both mafia AND werewolves exist)=P(werewolves)*P(mafia|werewolves)" does make a lot more sense. I just love to jump into math without thinking whenever I find the opportunity to use it  ;D

We still arrived at the same basic conclusions though. And yes, the unavoidable error due to the Major Arcana is unfortunate.

How often do we get a vote count?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #183 on: August 12, 2012, 11:14:32 pm »

Vote Count
Morgrim7 (1): Captain_Frisk
shark_bait (1): yuma
Galzria (4): O, angrybirds, Axxle, ftl
Insomniac (2): shraeye, Voltgloss, Morgrim7

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #184 on: August 12, 2012, 11:19:44 pm »

I would like to say that I plan on doing upping my game.  After poor showings in BMMMMM1 and RMM1 and my recent death in BMIV, I'm done with that style of mafia.  The new and improved shark_bait is here.  And yes ehunt, I am already starting to get quite aware of some players' idiosyncrasies.  Hopefully that will help me in this game.

So by upping your game do you mean to continue to be lurky and not post?

Yes I am pressing you again (you think I would have learned my lesson when you ended up being cop in BMM1), but I guess I haven't. But then again, neither have you!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #185 on: August 13, 2012, 04:35:37 am »

I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.
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Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #186 on: August 13, 2012, 04:46:38 am »

I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.
obvscum.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #187 on: August 13, 2012, 04:48:13 am »

In the games of forum mafia that have gone on so far, there's never been a 'no kill' choice by scum.
I just finished a game on mafiascum where the SK chose not to kill, a very interesting choice in a closed setup.  We had no idea that there was an SK until the mafia killed him by accident.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #188 on: August 13, 2012, 05:00:18 am »

So what we really calculate is P(mafia AND werewolf) supposing that Major Arcana are not aligned with those factions, and cayvie did not rebalance regardless of results. 

Cayvie said she would rebalance if it was obviously imbalanced.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #189 on: August 13, 2012, 07:42:02 am »

Galz looks reeal scummy, but I think my vote is staying on Insomniac. For now.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #190 on: August 13, 2012, 07:48:00 am »

Galz looks reeal scummy

Why do you think Galz looks real scummy?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #191 on: August 13, 2012, 07:57:07 am »

He's been awfully quiet, (something he doesn't normally do) and when he does say something, its like this:
I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #192 on: August 13, 2012, 08:57:33 am »

Ok, thats enough to convince me. Vote: Insomniac

Why do you never have unique information to add to a game? Why why why?
Morgrim I want a response to this.

Morgrim! You are online now and you were earlier after I posted this. Do you have a mod-restriction that doesnt' allow you to answer my questions?

Please answer
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #193 on: August 13, 2012, 09:12:22 am »

I have a modrestriction that doesn't allow me to answer your (specificly you[also Captain_Frisk's]) questions.

JK. /sarcasam

Why do I never have unique info to add? I let you guys do the hard thinking, and choose which case is better. But is someone really jumps out to me as scum, I'll vote for that person.
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #194 on: August 13, 2012, 09:41:20 am »

I have a modrestriction that doesn't allow me to answer your (specificly you[also Captain_Frisk's]) questions.

JK. /sarcasam

Why do I never have unique info to add? I let you guys do the hard thinking, and choose which case is better. But is someone really jumps out to me as scum, I'll vote for that person.

I have a very strong case against someone who consistently displays anti-town behavior, but you'll have to trust me.  Just vote for who I vote for - and all will be ok when that person flips.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #195 on: August 13, 2012, 09:54:11 am »

I have a modrestriction that doesn't allow me to answer your (specificly you[also Captain_Frisk's]) questions.

JK. /sarcasam

Why do I never have unique info to add? I let you guys do the hard thinking, and choose which case is better. But is someone really jumps out to me as scum, I'll vote for that person.

I have a very strong case against someone who consistently displays anti-town behavior, but you'll have to trust me.  Just vote for who I vote for - and all will be ok when that person flips.

In the spirit of our theme, allow me to predict the future:

Quote from: Morgrim
Sounds good
Quote from: Captain_Frisk
Vote: Morgrim
Quote from: Morgrim
Vote: Morgrim
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #196 on: August 13, 2012, 10:18:13 am »

@Volt - I'm already voting for morgrim - you don't need to fake quote it.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #197 on: August 13, 2012, 10:34:19 am »

@Volt - I'm already voting for morgrim - you don't need to fake quote it.

I tried to predict the future, but I only predicted the past!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #198 on: August 13, 2012, 10:35:25 am »

vote: Captain_Frisk. Morgrim-hunting is a scumtell.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #199 on: August 13, 2012, 10:38:19 am »

vote: Captain_Frisk. Morgrim-hunting is a scumtell.

It's got its own full article on the mafiascum wiki and everything!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #200 on: August 13, 2012, 11:19:54 am »

Wait, how on earth would 'a select few' claiming give us knowledge as to whether there are multiple factions or not?
This is one of the reasons my vote is staying with Insomniac

P(no mafia)=0.044, because there's 9 mafia roles counting the spy.
Oh, I guess I didn't realize what spy meant.  This changes calculations, but another post with useless numbers is not helpful.  Still, math is fun.  I'll probably work it out at some point out of curiosity.

So what we really calculate is P(mafia AND werewolf) supposing that Major Arcana are not aligned with those factions, and cayvie did not rebalance regardless of results. 
Cayvie said she would rebalance if it was obviously imbalanced.
Yeah, both those suppositions are things that I think are not true.  But there's no way to calculate probability that cayvie found something unbalanced, so for theoretical numbers this is a necessary assumption.  Also, This is a question that I've been asking myself as well.  How do we even select the few that claim??
Wait, how on earth would 'a select few' claiming give us knowledge as to whether there are multiple factions or not?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #201 on: August 13, 2012, 11:29:41 am »

Why does Galz have 4 votes on him?  O ragevoted him after his direct questions, then mentioned Lie Detector roles.  Angrybirds voted for him
because he is playing just like a person who wants us to think he is town
Axxle voted possibly just because 2 people had already voted?
Vote Count
Galzria (2): O, angrybirds

Sure

Vote: Galzria
Then ftl voted to get a bandwagon started, but also mentioned Galz was scummy.
Well, one way to get things going is to start a wagon. Vote: Galzria . Because he's scummy.

I guess Morgrim mentioned that Galz looked real scummy because
He's been awfully quiet, (something he doesn't normally do) and when he does say something, its like this:
I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.

Is this the reason that he looked scummy to you ftl?  Or was it really just because you wanted there to be a bandwagon?  What was the reason for your vote, Axxle?  Is there really something to that Lie Detector role?  I wonder if there's something I've missed but I have only the neutralest of reads on Galz so far.  Hey Galz, post more!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #202 on: August 13, 2012, 11:57:28 am »

O, post more! I haven't heard from you in 3.5 days!
sharkbait, post more! I haven't heard from you in 3 days!
sparky, post more!
Robz, post more!
Eevee, post more!
angrybirds, post more!
You all have only 7 posts by my count.  And actually sharkbait has only 5.

Galz!! Respond to angrybirds!
i am going to vote:Galzeria because he is playing just like a person who wants us to think he is town
i am going to keep my vote on him   at least until he responds and i can see a little bit more of him before i change my mind about anything
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #203 on: August 13, 2012, 12:03:05 pm »

Galzria just died in M-VII, so he may have more time to post here now.  He was also V/LA over the weekend.

cayvie, could you please prod O and shark_bait?  Thanks.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #204 on: August 13, 2012, 12:31:48 pm »

Right-O!

Well, there's surprisingly little to respond TO for having 4 votes on me (5 now with Morgrim?). Points of interest that pop into my head for what I do see pertaining to me:

#1: My rapid fire posts were my first of the game. They were serious in that seeing different reactions is always interesting, if not always informing. Out of them all, I thought Shraeye's response of "What's this, I don't even..." Was the most strange, since it really was a simple yes/no question.

As my first posts though, they were essentially there for RVS purposes... I wanted to have fun. Unlike others, I don't jump in going votevotevotevote for completely frivolous purposes. Asking directed (albeit mostly pointless) questions is much more entertaining to me. O's response was quite frankly hilarious, especially because he raged over my supposed unsubtle attempt to play a role that isn't even listed as being in the game.

All that said, yeah, they were serious. I would personally find the non-answer over such a ridiculous question to be scummy. The fact that each in turn was answerable by a simple "No, I'm not" was irrelevant.

#2: I'm looking like someone who wants to appear town... Well, sure. I mean, I'm not playing with the goal of saying "look at me! I'm town!", but certainly wanting to appear town is not exactly a scumtell.

Personally I believe that "naturally" looking like town is infinitely easier for scum, who come into the game with a certain amount of confidence that their "reads" can never exactly be wrong. Town members on the other hand look around and see potential scum in every player on the list. Because of this, there's an inherent desire to want to be trusted and it comes across as unnatural. It's a large part of the reason f.DS has yet to lynch Mafia D1. Town just looks so much more uncomfortable, and thus scummy.

This changes somewhat in a multi-faction setup, as the scumteams no longer have absolute information over the town. M-VI is probably a good perusal for how scumfactions interact (even if they did play terribly there). It's not exactly light reading however. :P

#3: I was quiet because I was on V/LA all weekend. My post count across all games was significantly reduced to almost nill, and the games that I did take the time to post in were on deadlines. I don't think Morgrim was alive in any of those games, and I don't believe he's followed here or the V/LA thread closely enough to know that I was actually gone. So from that perspective at least his vote on me seems like it actually has merit (compared to Axxle and ftl, who seem to have voted for me because....?).

I'll be reviewing the thread fully later and posting my thoughts on events up to date and others this afternoon. If there is some big case that I've failed to address above, feel free to let me know.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #205 on: August 13, 2012, 12:43:14 pm »

Sorry guys.  Just catching up, weekend was busier than expected.  And honestly, I'm still at a loss for how to effectively scumhunt on D1.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #206 on: August 13, 2012, 12:56:01 pm »

And honestly, I'm still at a loss for how to effectively scumhunt on D1.

Stop worrying about "effectively" scumhunting.  Just worry about "scumhunting."  You don't know if it's effective or not until you're actually doing it and see people's reactions.  And gauging those reactions is how you learn to sharpen your scumhunting efforts.

The only absolutely certain way to "ineffectively" scumhunt is to not try to do it at all.  I.e., to lurk.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #207 on: August 13, 2012, 01:17:30 pm »

Scumbag back-up mod missed the memo on the separate thread and didn't know the game had started. Just posting here so this will show up on my "New Replies." Carry on.

Vote Count
Morgrim7 (1): Captain_Frisk
shark_bait (1): yuma
Galzria (4): O, angrybirds, Axxle, ftl
Insomniac (3): shraeye, Voltgloss, Morgrim7
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2012, 03:28:56 pm by jotheonah »
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #208 on: August 13, 2012, 01:25:28 pm »

Personally I believe that "naturally" looking like town is infinitely easier for scum, who come into the game with a certain amount of confidence that their "reads" can never exactly be wrong. Town members on the other hand look around and see potential scum in every player on the list. Because of this, there's an inherent desire to want to be trusted and it comes across as unnatural. It's a large part of the reason f.DS has yet to lynch Mafia D1. Town just looks so much more uncomfortable, and thus scummy.

This changes somewhat in a multi-faction setup, as the scumteams no longer have absolute information over the town. M-VI is probably a good perusal for how scumfactions interact (even if they did play get terribly unlucky there). It's not exactly light reading however. :P

FTFY.

But other than that, I agree with this sentiment.

I for one need to post more in this game. Actually I'm not even sure who's in this game. Doesn't look to me like there's been much serious analysis. The fact that I've skated by not posting like at all is probably not a good sign. Anyway, I'll try to review and post some thoughts soon.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #209 on: August 13, 2012, 01:27:09 pm »

#2: I'm looking like someone who wants to appear town... Well, sure. I mean, I'm not playing with the goal of saying "look at me! I'm town!", but certainly wanting to appear town is not exactly a scumtell.
Overly wanting to appear doing pro-town things, without actually doing pro-town things, is a scumtell though.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #210 on: August 13, 2012, 02:20:22 pm »

(compared to Axxle and ftl, who seem to have voted for me because....?).

Yeah, pretty much... I wanted to poke you and get some reaction, not having realized that Axxle did it first a few posts earlier. Of course, then you went away and gave no reaction, and after like days of sitting there at 4 votes it doesn't seem like pressure at all.

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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #211 on: August 13, 2012, 03:27:09 pm »

sparky, post more!

Heh. I actually think I've been doing rather well so far, I'm proud of myself for being as active as I have been haha. I've waited all day Sunday for replies with barely any (I did respond to shraeye's concerns about the math), and then as I go to sleep the thread explodes with over a page of posts.

One theory that I developed over the years that may be completely bonkers is that longer posts = pro-town. It means that you're putting more effort into protecting the good guys. With mafia, it's hard to do that. Moreover, if mafia just try to disprove anyone whenever the opportunity presents itself, instead of putting their thoughts into one specific issue (because maybe it makes them look uncomfortable? the heart of the issue is that they're mafia maybe?), it gives them more room into faking innocence. Someone who fits this bill perfectly, is Axxle. His posts seem to be all over the map, and they don't add much. Perhaps he always plays like that? And I have yet to see him answer this question:

I guess Morgrim mentioned that Galz looked real scummy because
He's been awfully quiet, (something he doesn't normally do) and when he does say something, its like this:
I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.

Is this the reason that he looked scummy to you ftl?  Or was it really just because you wanted there to be a bandwagon?  What was the reason for your vote, Axxle?  Is there really something to that Lie Detector role?  I wonder if there's something I've missed but I have only the neutralest of reads on Galz so far.  Hey Galz, post more!

shark_bait has contributed almost nothing to the scumhunting. He mentions that it's hard to do on Day 1. Well, doesn't mean we shouldn't try, right? I've seen plenty of games where scum was nailed Day 1.

Ditto for Robz888, although he's realized that this is bad for him.

Quote
Doesn't look to me like there's been much serious analysis.

Hey, I've been trying to seriously analyze  ;)

If you all were looking for my reaction to Galzria... I'm inconclusive so far. It really didn't look like he was pressured after 4 votes. He does mention this which I find important:

Quote
Personally I believe that "naturally" looking like town is infinitely easier for scum, who come into the game with a certain amount of confidence that their "reads" can never exactly be wrong. Town members on the other hand look around and see potential scum in every player on the list. Because of this, there's an inherent desire to want to be trusted and it comes across as unnatural. It's a large part of the reason f.DS has yet to lynch Mafia D1. Town just looks so much more uncomfortable, and thus scummy.

So, according to this, we should go for who appears to be the most comfortable and on top of the game? Right now shraeye sticks out in my mind for this, but he's been putting too much effort into his posts to make me believe that he is scum. He's putting too much effort into the scumhunting to be scum himself. Someone else who appears comfortable... is Galzria himself? Trying to cover yourself, even implicitly, seem like a scum-tell in my opinion. I don't think he would have said that (and I think he would have had a different reaction to his votes) if he was mafia. Now I'm leaning Galzria more towards the clean side.

Actually, Galzria has been acting pretty comfortable the whole game:

Quote
Quote from: O on August 09, 2012, 11:24:53 pm
Quote from: Galzria on August 09, 2012, 10:15:57 pm
Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Quote from: Galzria on August 09, 2012, 10:18:06 pm
Shraeye, are you a Serial Killer?

Quote from: Galzria on August 09, 2012, 10:16:51 pm
Volt, are you a Werewolf?

Quote from: Galzria on August 09, 2012, 10:17:14 pm
Axxle, are you Mafia?

Quote from: Galzria on August 09, 2012, 11:12:32 pm
They were all serious. I haven't heard from Volt or CF yet.

eHunt, want to answer for your Mafia buddy?
Eevee, what about you? Who are you planning on NK'ing for your faction kill?


YOU'RE NOT SUBTLE. WHY CAN'T YOU BE SUBTLE FOR ONE GODDAMN GAME IN YOUR LIFE

RAGEVOTE: GALZRIA

*yawn*

That strikes me as "oh wow, this raging over me is quite pointless. Because I know who I am. And it's not scum."

Maybe I'm reading too much into things. At least I'm going after players now.

PS Insomniac has three votes, not two.  ;)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #212 on: August 13, 2012, 03:29:18 pm »

I have no idea what you're talking about ;)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #213 on: August 13, 2012, 03:40:14 pm »

Galzria just died in M-VII, so he may have more time to post here now.  He was also V/LA over the weekend.

cayvie, could you please prod O and shark_bait?  Thanks.

i was giving people a little extra time because of the weekend
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #214 on: August 13, 2012, 03:40:36 pm »

sparky, post more!

Heh. I actually think I've been doing rather well so far, I'm proud of myself for being as active as I have been haha. I've waited all day Sunday for replies with barely any (I did respond to shraeye's concerns about the math), and then as I go to sleep the thread explodes with over a page of posts.

One theory that I developed over the years that may be completely bonkers is that longer posts = pro-town. It means that you're putting more effort into protecting the good guys. With mafia, it's hard to do that.

Hah! For me, it felt like the other way around. When I was mafia, I felt like I'd write long screeds, because I'd have to double-check everything and make sure my words were solid and didn't have anything that could be misinterpreted as a scumslip and so on.

Whereas as town, I'm much more okay with just throwing out a short post saying something, because I know I won't accidentally reveal myself as scum because I'm not!

It might be a personality thing.


Quote
Is this the reason that he looked scummy to you ftl?

Nah, my vote was before that. I wanted to start something going because wagon analyzing feels so much more refreshing than analyzing wording. But, well, Galz never responded quickly so I didn't get a chance to argue around with him or anything.

Quote
  Or was it really just because you wanted there to be a bandwagon?  What was the reason for your vote, Axxle?  Is there really something to that Lie Detector role?

Not unless it's a Major Arcana, we know it's not one of the standard ones from the suits, cayvie posted all of those.

Quote
  I wonder if there's something I've missed but I have only the neutralest of reads on Galz so far.  Hey Galz, post more!

Don't worry, he will :)

Quote
I've seen plenty of games where scum was nailed Day 1.

How did they doooooooo it :( we've never had that yet here on f.ds :(


Quote
Quote
Personally I believe that "naturally" looking like town is infinitely easier for scum, who come into the game with a certain amount of confidence that their "reads" can never exactly be wrong. Town members on the other hand look around and see potential scum in every player on the list. Because of this, there's an inherent desire to want to be trusted and it comes across as unnatural. It's a large part of the reason f.DS has yet to lynch Mafia D1. Town just looks so much more uncomfortable, and thus scummy.

So, according to this, we should go for who appears to be the most comfortable and on top of the game?

It's sad because it feels like a reverse policy lynch, you lynch whoever knows what they're talking about and you're left with like the lurkers and Morgrim and the rest of the lost people. It might work better than what we've been doing here on f.ds but if feels so wrong...


...I'm still waiting for a response from Insomniac about his "select few claiming" thing. I suspect, given that last paragraph and last quote, that should be a towntell rather than a scumtell at this point in f.ds meta.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #215 on: August 13, 2012, 03:48:56 pm »

And I have yet to see him answer this question:

I guess Morgrim mentioned that Galz looked real scummy because
He's been awfully quiet, (something he doesn't normally do) and when he does say something, its like this:
I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.

Is this the reason that he looked scummy to you ftl?  Or was it really just because you wanted there to be a bandwagon?  What was the reason for your vote, Axxle?  Is there really something to that Lie Detector role?  I wonder if there's something I've missed but I have only the neutralest of reads on Galz so far.  Hey Galz, post more!
#2: I'm looking like someone who wants to appear town... Well, sure. I mean, I'm not playing with the goal of saying "look at me! I'm town!", but certainly wanting to appear town is not exactly a scumtell.
Overly wanting to appear doing pro-town things, without actually doing pro-town things, is a scumtell though.

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #216 on: August 13, 2012, 03:55:17 pm »

Hi guys.

Yea I didn't *actually* realize that lie detector wasn't in the game... except maybe as major arcana, but whatever.

vote: voltgloss because my galzria vote sucks and... yea.. HOW DARE YOU PROD ME!!! I WILL DESTROY YOU!!!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #217 on: August 13, 2012, 03:58:16 pm »

I'm breaking so many rules by doing this but...

post moar

3:56:31
3:55:17

U MAD, CAYVIE?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #218 on: August 13, 2012, 03:59:15 pm »

lol
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #219 on: August 13, 2012, 04:08:05 pm »

Hi.

I am waiting to hear more from sharkbait before I do much else.

And morgrim... That wasn't what I was looking for. I am asking why you don't contribute. Do you have so little faith in your own reads on people that you can only piggyback on the reads of others. I really want to hear more. If you agree with someone tell us why you agree before voting. If you think someone is mafia tell us why before voting. This game thrives in content and context. You provide neither.

I am not posting this as demands to change or else I will vote. Instead I am asking if you can post more to lessen the confusion you add to the game and instead shed some light into it
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #220 on: August 13, 2012, 04:40:27 pm »

I had a post here about Morgrim, but I deleted it, as Morgrim is a pertinent topic of current conversation in the Murder Mystery Mafia.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #221 on: August 13, 2012, 04:40:43 pm »

Let's not talk about Morgrim.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #222 on: August 13, 2012, 04:43:24 pm »

I had a post here about Morgrim, but I deleted it, as Morgrim is a pertinent topic of current conversation in the Murder Mystery Mafia.

uhh you deleted a post?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #223 on: August 13, 2012, 04:47:58 pm »

Surprising people writing these walls of text I must say! Much respect.

What can I say, as per usual, the active and talkative guys appear town to me. I suspect playing like I have thus far (not posting much and drawing zero attention) is exceptionally favorable for mafia in this game, because it's so huge it's very easy to blend in. In smaller games, I think lurkers often get called out when the active guys lynch the one or two guys who seem scummy and start realizing "wait.. all of these active guys sort of look towny to me" and then there is almost nothing the lurker can do. Well, here we have so so many people, that there is always going to be someone active that accidentally says something others interpret as scummy and then its easy for the lurkers to quietly steer the town towards lynching them.
On the other hand, multiple scum factions means even scum has an incentive to scumhunt, they only have to lie about their teammates.

After the catastrophes with Gazria in murder mystery (still ongoing but both me and Galz are dead there) and with eHalc in VI, I have pretty much resigned from trying to form reads day 1. It is frustrating, I know lurking is bad for town, but if I try to scumhunt, I'll just end up finding no one scummy and trusting the active guys, then I'll get called out for doing that again and you lynch me, which is very anti-town seeing how I am town. So.. I do not know. Also, following a game with this many players is haaard.

Shraeye and ftl look towny to me, but what else is new? Oh and fwiw, shark_bait is hc lurking in mafia VII (still ongoing so we dont know his alignment there but still makes lurking here less damning, he's probably just irl busy).
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #224 on: August 13, 2012, 04:48:10 pm »

I meant I deleted it when I was previewing it. I didn't post it.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #225 on: August 13, 2012, 04:48:49 pm »

(that was in response to insomniac's
I had a post here about Morgrim, but I deleted it, as Morgrim is a pertinent topic of current conversation in the Murder Mystery Mafia.

uhh you deleted a post?
not you eevee)
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #226 on: August 13, 2012, 05:02:34 pm »

Ok - we're far enough in that RVS is no longer fun. 

Unvote

Morgrim - Please be smart though.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #227 on: August 13, 2012, 06:11:46 pm »

i think i am posting often enough, not as much as others just enough to say what i want to say
do people have things they want me to talk about?
my vote is staying on Galz, he seems mafialike to me
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #228 on: August 13, 2012, 07:23:18 pm »

Let's not talk about Morgrim.

Ok, I am done, but I would like him to respond more... That is it, I won't mention him again all game unless I actually find him scummy.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #229 on: August 13, 2012, 07:23:41 pm »

Talk about why, specifically, Galz seems mafia-like to you. Do you have any particular quotes of his that stood out to you as mafia-like?
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #230 on: August 13, 2012, 07:24:25 pm »

that was at angrybirds.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #231 on: August 13, 2012, 07:25:40 pm »

I can't talk about myself.  :(
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #232 on: August 13, 2012, 07:29:05 pm »

I can't talk about myself.  :(

Ever? or now? Because your voting w/o explanation isn't new in this game. So if it is a restriciton, it is an aptly applied restriction that merely reflects your previous play styles. (if true, nice one cayvie)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #233 on: August 13, 2012, 07:29:57 pm »

I think he meant that I was shutting down Morgrim discussion...

...and by trying to do that I've started Morgrim discussion...


...dammit.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #234 on: August 13, 2012, 07:31:15 pm »

...dammit.

how I feel... now I am really, seriously done here.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #235 on: August 13, 2012, 07:36:52 pm »

#1: My rapid fire posts were my first of the game. They were serious in that seeing different reactions is always interesting

As my first posts though, they were essentially there for RVS purposes... I wanted to have fun.

All that said, yeah, they were serious.
is it serious, is it not serious, is it serious, i can't tell
Quote
#2: I'm looking like someone who wants to appear town... Well, sure. I mean, I'm not playing with the goal of saying "look at me! I'm town!", but certainly wanting to appear town is not exactly a scumtell.

Personally I believe that "naturally" looking like town is infinitely easier for scum, who come into the game with a certain amount of confidence that their "reads" can never exactly be wrong.
he seems to be one of the more confident players around
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #236 on: August 13, 2012, 07:49:59 pm »

Alright, I just got myself caught up. There is surprisingly little... but... if anybody stands out to me right now it's Axxle. His posts just seem to lack any real content, and there's a whole lot of joking mixed in. Axxle is usually a lot more driven towards pushing for scumhunting. I remember an Axxle from games past who would link useful articles about how to avoid RVS, and how to scumhunt with some efficiency D1 (at least, above average). Yes, that Axxle got himself lynched D1, and yes, that Axxle was town, so YES, I must consider the possibility that Axxle is just trying to not care quite so much and lay low...

But using the Mod'ing of another game and staying present only through light humor and nothing substantial seems slightly off-beat compared to town Axxle's of the past. So FoS: Axxle for now. I'd like to see more (serious) engagement from him.

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Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #237 on: August 13, 2012, 08:09:09 pm »

unvote , btw. With angrybirds suspecting Galz, if he votes that would be 5 votes on Galz, and I don't want 5 votes on Galz yet.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #238 on: August 13, 2012, 08:09:53 pm »

unvote , btw. With angrybirds suspecting Galz, if he votes that would be 5 votes on Galz, and I don't want 5 votes on Galz yet.

It's a 16 player game.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #239 on: August 13, 2012, 08:14:59 pm »

unvote , btw. With angrybirds suspecting Galz, if he votes that would be 5 votes on Galz, and I don't want 5 votes on Galz yet.
I'm getting a bad feeling from FTL.  He wanted to pressure Galz... and now doesn't want to pressure Galz a very short time afterwards.  It feels like he's giving the impression of scumhunting but is getting paranoid of voting for his scumbuddy.  I'm fine with my vote on Galz or FTL at this juncture.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #240 on: August 13, 2012, 08:32:46 pm »


Galzria (4): O, angrybirds, Axxle, ftl


From last vote count; I dont' think angrybirds has unvoted since then. FOS:FTL (first time ever using that)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #241 on: August 13, 2012, 08:38:45 pm »


Galzria (4): O, angrybirds, Axxle, ftl


From last vote count; I dont' think angrybirds has unvoted since then. FOS:FTL (first time ever using that)
Oh, that was the order of the votes? I'm actually good with:
Vote: FTL
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #242 on: August 13, 2012, 09:40:05 pm »

sparky, post more!

Heh. I actually think I've been doing rather well so far, I'm proud of myself for being as active as I have been haha. I've waited all day Sunday for replies with barely any (I did respond to shraeye's concerns about the math), and then as I go to sleep the thread explodes with over a page of posts.

One theory that I developed over the years that may be completely bonkers is that longer posts = pro-town. It means that you're putting more effort into protecting the good guys. With mafia, it's hard to do that.

Hah! For me, it felt like the other way around. When I was mafia, I felt like I'd write long screeds, because I'd have to double-check everything and make sure my words were solid and didn't have anything that could be misinterpreted as a scumslip and so on.

Whereas as town, I'm much more okay with just throwing out a short post saying something, because I know I won't accidentally reveal myself as scum because I'm not!

It might be a personality thing.

Yeah, might just be a personality thing. What I feel is just my personal experience. You are right though about the double-checking part. Because I've been mafia more often than not and I can certainly understand. I'm finding it hard to understand the bit about town though; maybe it's because I've been town less often. Certainly it's easier to defend yourself if accused because you can defend yourself genuinely. What I believe townies should be doing is actually hunting the scum, and less about covering their own skin. Because do the former, and the latter should follow suit. This is my first game here so we'll see if my theory holds.

Quote
I've seen plenty of games where scum was nailed Day 1.
How did they doooooooo it :( we've never had that yet here on f.ds :(

Well, I remember one was pure luck XD one was because the mafia made some major-slipups on Day 1 (such as rushing people into making careless votes). And the entire mafia games over there would be as long as this thread is now...

Quote
Quote
Personally I believe that "naturally" looking like town is infinitely easier for scum, who come into the game with a certain amount of confidence that their "reads" can never exactly be wrong. Town members on the other hand look around and see potential scum in every player on the list. Because of this, there's an inherent desire to want to be trusted and it comes across as unnatural. It's a large part of the reason f.DS has yet to lynch Mafia D1. Town just looks so much more uncomfortable, and thus scummy.

So, according to this, we should go for who appears to be the most comfortable and on top of the game?

It's sad because it feels like a reverse policy lynch, you lynch whoever knows what they're talking about and you're left with like the lurkers and Morgrim and the rest of the lost people. It might work better than what we've been doing here on f.ds but if feels so wrong...

...so now I'm thinking, maybe we should approach Day 1 differently, and not make it like 50 pages? I've always considered Day 1 to be Stab-In-The-Dark Day; we don't know much information yet. I realize the whole point of carrying out discussion is to try to find someone who slips up and go for them. But, and this is with this game especially because we have no idea what the roles are, we quite frankly don't know much yet. Would more be revealed by seeing who the night victims are? And maybe for Day 1, go for...
Quote
the lurkers and Morgrim and the rest of the lost people.
...because leaving the talkative ones in will leave more light to be shed on all the discussions. So, what's best?

Quote
So, according to this, we should go for who appears to be the most comfortable and on top of the game?

That might contradict with what I just said. But for Day 1 only, maybe going for the "lost people" is better, and hold on to what I previously said for later days, when we have less people.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #243 on: August 13, 2012, 09:46:27 pm »

Vote Count
shark_bait (1): yuma
Galzria (1): angrybirds
Insomniac (3): shraeye, Voltgloss, Morgrim7
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Voltgloss (1): O
ftl (1): Axxle

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #244 on: August 13, 2012, 09:58:59 pm »

unvote , btw. With angrybirds suspecting Galz, if he votes that would be 5 votes on Galz, and I don't want 5 votes on Galz yet.
I'm getting a bad feeling from FTL.  He wanted to pressure Galz... and now doesn't want to pressure Galz a very short time afterwards.  It feels like he's giving the impression of scumhunting but is getting paranoid of voting for his scumbuddy.  I'm fine with my vote on Galz or FTL at this juncture.

Yeah, I intended to pressure him by being the third vote on him. And then I ended up being the fourth, because you voted while I was going to. ...and then he disappeared for a while and it didn't feel like pressure because there was nothing going on with the wagon, and then it sounded like angrybirds was going to be a fifth vote and I was like "hmm, 5 votes is a little much" so I unvoted.

And now there's no more wagon on galz and I still know nothing about him, got a town vibe of angrybirds though.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #245 on: August 13, 2012, 10:46:56 pm »

I don't agree that five is too many votes. To me "too many votes" means "dangerous because scum or a foolish townie can kill without discussion." That's unlikely to happen since scum have a great incentive to scum-hunt well when there are multiple scum-factions. I think until someone's at L-2, it's wrong to back down.

The reason FTL doesn't want to be vote five is that being vote number five can really call attention to you when someone says "hey, this wagon grew too fast." In other words, even though there are no strategic reasons not to want five votes on someone, there are survivalist reasons for any individual player not to provide that fifth vote.

Now, in my opinion, survivalism is not scummy, so I can't be too upset at FTL over this. Every good townie will try to survive as hard as possible (as will every good scum-player), except that townies shouldn't lie to survive.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #246 on: August 13, 2012, 10:48:55 pm »

I wasn't going to be the fifth vote I was already the fourth and decided not to be
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #247 on: August 13, 2012, 11:59:09 pm »

Ok so I'm going to try to clear up the whole thing regarding me. When I saw Volt's question about suit claiming I thought about it a lot and the thoughts that went through my head were:

1) There isn't really a good way to conceal the major arcana, arbitrarily claiming a suit is just bad news.

2) Ok so what are we hoping to get out of a suit claim, limiting scum fakeclaims. I investigated the suits to see what they could tell us, I noted that Cups and Pentacles are Mafia related and that Wands Swords are werewolf related.

3) I thought about how we could use that information I noted above to benefit town, surely there was a way to engineer a claim that would reveal if there was an additional scum faction, not only would this be useful information but if there are 2 scum factions, the scum teams will scum hunt and take pot shots at each other like they did in MVI this is obviously a good thing based on the fact that all 3 scum factions were obliterated in MVI

4) A thought came into my head what if one or two people voluntarily claimed Cups/Pentacles or Wands/Swords, this would reveal the presence of one scum faction, then another one or two people could voluntarily claim the presence of the other suit. The problem with this is that a scum faction might claim the opposing suits just to sow confusion.

5) I made a post detailing in essence 2-4 and that because scum could use it to sow confusion I was going to be against mass claim. Then cayvie confirmed the presence of a SK which I hadn't noted as a possibility. I figured if cayvie was willing to out the presence of a SK then we might as well wait on the suit claim because the wind might reveal it for us without having to allow the mafia the chance to sow confusion. So I changed my post to say so

6) Later when questioned I thought I had posted my original thinking instead of the modified one after the mod confirmed a SK, since I'm in a lot of mafia games right now I didn't think to look back and check and just assumed I had made the first one since thats the one I had put most of my thought into I recalled making it, when in fact I had not.

I do appologize for the confusion it caused I hope this post clears it up.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #248 on: August 14, 2012, 03:47:45 am »

Argg! This is a dificult game, man

@Insomniac, post #247 clears you of most of the problems in my head, your first response in 63 sounded like you were tryin to write something huge , and then cayvie's post popped up and made obsolete some of the things you were saying.  There is only one deal left and that is point four in #247.  You are clearly assuming that if 2 people say "I have cups" then we definitely have Mafia.  What?? Thast' crazy talk.  tehre are plenty of nonmafia roles in every suit (i still dont know how we could get anyone to voluunteer, it seems that if 2 ppl claim cups you assume there is mafia, so one of themhas to be it--no town, mafia, ww, or other will jump infront of that gun).  So i'm feeling more like you are with me these days,and are just confused about probability, or something like that.  So i'm rereading everyingn to see who I would switch my bvote to and golly, this is a diffcult game! I'm flippin/ paranoid of everybody! (ow, just accidently punched ans endtqble!!) it turns out that i even type with big gestureso, and not jsut talk withthem.

recently ftl gag seems exactly like a mistake to me; not scummy slipupmisake, because it's way too ridiculous to not be a brainfart/total slip.  I'm expecting a scummy ftl to find a way to nonchalontly pull off of Galz and onto whatever bandwagon might work. A town ftl probably wouldn't want to stay on a galz wagon just because he hasn't been posting as muh as usual, thats just a flimsy reason.  the difference is how he does it.  ftl misses O's voteswitch to voltglosss (galz now at 3) gets worried that angry will be a new bote on Galz DESPITE FTL being teh guy who asked angrybird to explain why galz seems scummy enough tokeep his voet there.  Then enter ehunt, with really strange analysis with not wanting to be the 5th voter. is 5th voter a thing?? ?? that sounds stupid.  also, in a hilarious comedy of errors, ftl was never worried about being the 5th vote he was incorrectly not wanting to be 4th of 5 when he would have actually been 3 of 3 if he had stayed.  I disagree with Axxles suspicoun over ftl's flipflop on galz pressure.  he wanted a bandwagon to see what happened.  nothing happend. Now he's reasssessing players and he says "i don't want 5 on galz".  i agree, i also gonot want galz to be lynched, he's giving me complete null reads, and I want to lynch someoen who i read as sucm.

here's the real deal guys. i realized taht people who are not scum hunting, or are trying to look hunty without actually doing it are just playing badyly. with teh multiple factions, those old tells aren't hte same.  EVERYBODY wants to scumhunt now.  it's even beetter to be scumhunting as scum because the people you suspect/find coudl only ever be at best (when a scumtell is spoton) a competng scum faction, or if you're wrong it's a townie, there's no way to fail for them.  now me, i'm terrified at failing, and i suspect if we go back and read tings, which i'll do tomorrwo when i sober up, those who area the most terrified are probably more likely to be town.  So damn, that sentence makes me recondier Galz, who sparky keeps saying is confident.  but it's different confidence maybe, i mean, im loking for someone who is scared of voting ofr the wrong person, not someone who is scared of being voted for--those guys are my town reads, or will be, or mightnot if i can't tell whose sufficiently scared.

but wait, sparky is on my list of suspicious dudes right now, even though he was almost on my certain-town list a while ago. check this, he started off by asking "why dont major arcana just claim?" in #83 and I had him explain it.  that was back in everyfuckingslipupis ascumtell-shraeye days.  but it's not, mistakes happen too, and if i inspect hard enoguh i bet i can find some of MY posts that don't sit well with me for some reason.  but the question we need to ask is why did this mistake happen, and was it relevent.  so here i go with some analysis on spartky.
He explained his reason for saying that in #100, but
Quote
here's my reasoning. I initially found Volt's query unnecessarily complex. Once you suit claim, there's automatically a possibility you're Major Arcana
is weird. voltgloss's query wasnt complex, and the auto-possibility doesn't come after a suitclaim.  it came when we started this game.  when you sort MajorA into suits, of course theres a possibility that a particluar card from one suit is a MajorA, that's not news or a reason for anything. But he does say he eventually realized that people will be watching you more closely so it's hard.  why wouldn't he immediately realize that people will watch the major arcana for scumminess, maybe because he personal is not trying to assess whether they're scum, jsut what they can do to jack up his faciton's plans, since any major arcana he doens't already know about will definitely be an enemy and is super killable.  for us townies, when a major arcana comes out, we STILL don't know if we want them dead because they might be on our side and our only real chance of overcoming 3 mafia facions.
NExt, he makes some regular hunty posts, with no town/scum reads to them.  but in 155 before i can explain why i voted insomniac in the first place he says
Quote
He's already expressed his disagreement with one of Insomniac's posts.
Here was my "disagreement":
If you want something more interesting to discuss look at this post:
So I was gonna say that the main benefit of suit claiming might be to discern if we are dealing with one or two scum factions but perhaps the wind will tell us so I'm going to be against suit claiming
where Insomniac posits that suit-claiming will let us know how many factions we are dealing with.  Protip: it won't tell us anything unless either wands/swords or pentacles/cups had no claimers since we have no good way to tell or suspect that a particular suitclaim is scum.  Maybe he and his scummates were planning to claim in the other suits (all WW wands move to Cups, all WW Swords move to Pentacles, as an example) and make it look like there was one less faction.  No real evidence here, only a bit of food for thought.
Says Insomniac is incorrect, makes seemingly baseless-galz-style accusation, says this isn't really strong evidence.  MAN, that's not disagreement (the fact that i did have personal disagreement with Insomniac's post is irelevent beause that fact only became public in post #159) why were you trying to escalate me against insomniac? sounds like you KNOW insomniac is not on your team.

HEre's what really gets me; sparky posts "What, what, and what? Why should we have exactly 2 deaths? " does it sound like anyone else that he's too concerned about how many deaths there will be.  the exact number of deaths is that last thing on earth that is terrifying me right now.  but it might be of much more concern to someone who has an influence over nightdeaths.

Well slap me with a wrench, i went to look at the next post
One theory that I developed over the years that may be completely bonkers is that longer posts = pro-town. It means that you're putting more effort into protecting the good guys. With mafia, it's hard to do that. Moreover, if mafia just try to disprove anyone whenever the opportunity presents itself, instead of putting their thoughts into one specific issue, it gives them more room into faking innocence. Someone who fits this bill perfectly, is Axxle. His posts seem to be all over the map, and they don't add much.
well, i don't know if in general long posts mean pro-town/anti-town but yeah, it does indicate more effort into hunting.  but in this game EVERYONE wants to hunt!  This post makes me go"ohsnap" i have the wrong read on him". it just feels very genuinely allscumhunty.

Like sparky, axxle, you i also suspect. but this post is gettin enourmous. like my tiredness. so don't jump on that last bit till i can clairify. in the mronign. or afternoon when i wake up.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #249 on: August 14, 2012, 03:54:23 am »

sorry I haven't posted much

GOKO f5 took over my entire day today
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #250 on: August 14, 2012, 04:22:04 am »

Argg! This is a dificult game, man

@Insomniac, post #247 clears you of most of the problems in my head, your first response in 63 sounded like you were tryin to write something huge , and then cayvie's post popped up and made obsolete some of the things you were saying.  There is only one deal left and that is point four in #247.  You are clearly assuming that if 2 people say "I have cups" then we definitely have Mafia.  What?? Thast' crazy talk.  tehre are plenty of nonmafia roles in every suit (i still dont know how we could get anyone to voluunteer, it seems that if 2 ppl claim cups you assume there is mafia, so one of themhas to be it--no town, mafia, ww, or other will jump infront of that gun).  So i'm feeling more like you are with me these days,and are just confused about probability, or something like that.  So i'm rereading everyingn to see who I would switch my bvote to and golly, this is a diffcult game! I'm flippin/ paranoid of everybody! (ow, just accidently punched ans endtqble!!) it turns out that i even type with big gestureso, and not jsut talk withthem.

recently ftl gag seems exactly like a mistake to me; not scummy slipupmisake, because it's way too ridiculous to not be a brainfart/total slip.  I'm expecting a scummy ftl to find a way to nonchalontly pull off of Galz and onto whatever bandwagon might work. A town ftl probably wouldn't want to stay on a galz wagon just because he hasn't been posting as muh as usual, thats just a flimsy reason.  the difference is how he does it.  ftl misses O's voteswitch to voltglosss (galz now at 3) gets worried that angry will be a new bote on Galz DESPITE FTL being teh guy who asked angrybird to explain why galz seems scummy enough tokeep his voet there.  Then enter ehunt, with really strange analysis with not wanting to be the 5th voter. is 5th voter a thing?? ?? that sounds stupid.  also, in a hilarious comedy of errors, ftl was never worried about being the 5th vote he was incorrectly not wanting to be 4th of 5 when he would have actually been 3 of 3 if he had stayed.  I disagree with Axxles suspicoun over ftl's flipflop on galz pressure.  he wanted a bandwagon to see what happened.  nothing happend. Now he's reasssessing players and he says "i don't want 5 on galz".  i agree, i also gonot want galz to be lynched, he's giving me complete null reads, and I want to lynch someoen who i read as sucm.

here's the real deal guys. i realized taht people who are not scum hunting, or are trying to look hunty without actually doing it are just playing badyly. with teh multiple factions, those old tells aren't hte same.  EVERYBODY wants to scumhunt now.  it's even beetter to be scumhunting as scum because the people you suspect/find coudl only ever be at best (when a scumtell is spoton) a competng scum faction, or if you're wrong it's a townie, there's no way to fail for them.  now me, i'm terrified at failing, and i suspect if we go back and read tings, which i'll do tomorrwo when i sober up, those who area the most terrified are probably more likely to be town.  So damn, that sentence makes me recondier Galz, who sparky keeps saying is confident.  but it's different confidence maybe, i mean, im loking for someone who is scared of voting ofr the wrong person, not someone who is scared of being voted for--those guys are my town reads, or will be, or mightnot if i can't tell whose sufficiently scared.

but wait, sparky is on my list of suspicious dudes right now, even though he was almost on my certain-town list a while ago. check this, he started off by asking "why dont major arcana just claim?" in #83 and I had him explain it.  that was back in everyfuckingslipupis ascumtell-shraeye days.  but it's not, mistakes happen too, and if i inspect hard enoguh i bet i can find some of MY posts that don't sit well with me for some reason.  but the question we need to ask is why did this mistake happen, and was it relevent.  so here i go with some analysis on spartky.
He explained his reason for saying that in #100, but
Quote
here's my reasoning. I initially found Volt's query unnecessarily complex. Once you suit claim, there's automatically a possibility you're Major Arcana
is weird. voltgloss's query wasnt complex, and the auto-possibility doesn't come after a suitclaim.  it came when we started this game.  when you sort MajorA into suits, of course theres a possibility that a particluar card from one suit is a MajorA, that's not news or a reason for anything. But he does say he eventually realized that people will be watching you more closely so it's hard.  why wouldn't he immediately realize that people will watch the major arcana for scumminess, maybe because he personal is not trying to assess whether they're scum, jsut what they can do to jack up his faciton's plans, since any major arcana he doens't already know about will definitely be an enemy and is super killable.  for us townies, when a major arcana comes out, we STILL don't know if we want them dead because they might be on our side and our only real chance of overcoming 3 mafia facions.
NExt, he makes some regular hunty posts, with no town/scum reads to them.  but in 155 before i can explain why i voted insomniac in the first place he says
Quote
He's already expressed his disagreement with one of Insomniac's posts.
Here was my "disagreement":
If you want something more interesting to discuss look at this post:
So I was gonna say that the main benefit of suit claiming might be to discern if we are dealing with one or two scum factions but perhaps the wind will tell us so I'm going to be against suit claiming
where Insomniac posits that suit-claiming will let us know how many factions we are dealing with.  Protip: it won't tell us anything unless either wands/swords or pentacles/cups had no claimers since we have no good way to tell or suspect that a particular suitclaim is scum.  Maybe he and his scummates were planning to claim in the other suits (all WW wands move to Cups, all WW Swords move to Pentacles, as an example) and make it look like there was one less faction.  No real evidence here, only a bit of food for thought.
Says Insomniac is incorrect, makes seemingly baseless-galz-style accusation, says this isn't really strong evidence.  MAN, that's not disagreement (the fact that i did have personal disagreement with Insomniac's post is irelevent beause that fact only became public in post #159) why were you trying to escalate me against insomniac? sounds like you KNOW insomniac is not on your team.

HEre's what really gets me; sparky posts "What, what, and what? Why should we have exactly 2 deaths? " does it sound like anyone else that he's too concerned about how many deaths there will be.  the exact number of deaths is that last thing on earth that is terrifying me right now.  but it might be of much more concern to someone who has an influence over nightdeaths.

Well slap me with a wrench, i went to look at the next post
One theory that I developed over the years that may be completely bonkers is that longer posts = pro-town. It means that you're putting more effort into protecting the good guys. With mafia, it's hard to do that. Moreover, if mafia just try to disprove anyone whenever the opportunity presents itself, instead of putting their thoughts into one specific issue, it gives them more room into faking innocence. Someone who fits this bill perfectly, is Axxle. His posts seem to be all over the map, and they don't add much.
well, i don't know if in general long posts mean pro-town/anti-town but yeah, it does indicate more effort into hunting.  but in this game EVERYONE wants to hunt!  This post makes me go"ohsnap" i have the wrong read on him". it just feels very genuinely allscumhunty.

Like sparky, axxle, you i also suspect. but this post is gettin enourmous. like my tiredness. so don't jump on that last bit till i can clairify. in the mronign. or afternoon when i wake up.

too long did not read.  Although skimming reveals axxle suspicions.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #251 on: August 14, 2012, 04:26:54 am »

sorry I haven't posted much

GOKO f5 took over my entire day today
you've posted more than some.  a lot more than some.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #252 on: August 14, 2012, 04:29:19 am »

sorry I haven't posted much

GOKO f5 took over my entire day today
you've posted more than some.  a lot more than some.
We're not supposed to talk about me.
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Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #253 on: August 14, 2012, 04:30:56 am »

sorry I haven't posted much

GOKO f5 took over my entire day today
you've posted more than some.  a lot more than some.
We're not supposed to talk about me.
Moar Morgrim
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #254 on: August 14, 2012, 09:04:20 am »

sorry I haven't posted much

GOKO f5 took over my entire day today
you've posted more than some.  a lot more than some.
We're not supposed to talk about me.

AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #255 on: August 14, 2012, 10:10:56 am »

@ftl thanks for the town vibe i am not getting one from you thou.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #256 on: August 14, 2012, 10:12:41 am »

you've posted more than some.  a lot more than some.
We're not supposed to talk about me.
AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!

chill
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #257 on: August 14, 2012, 10:41:55 am »

Galzria's new avatar -> a poor lonesome cowboy -> a lonely wolf -> Galzria is a werewolf. It is known.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #258 on: August 14, 2012, 10:54:26 am »

shraeye, that post was, quite unlike you I must admit. All the typos give it away :) advice for any mafia game, try not to post when you are tired, it's much harder to concentrate. and I'm not just saying this because I'm on the chopping block, this is serious advice.

There are a couple things that I do want to clarify:

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac

You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.

He's already expressed his disagreement with one of Insomniac's posts.

Quote
Quote from: Insomniac on August 09, 2012, 06:35:18 pm
So I was gonna say that the main benefit of suit claiming might be to discern if we are dealing with one or two scum factions but perhaps the wind will tell us so I'm going to be against suit claiming
where Insomniac posits that suit-claiming will let us know how many factions we are dealing with.  Protip: it won't tell us anything unless either wands/swords or pentacles/cups had no claimers since we have no good way to tell or suspect that a particular suitclaim is scum.  Maybe he and his scummates were planning to claim in the other suits (all WW wands move to Cups, all WW Swords move to Pentacles, as an example) and make it look like there was one less faction.  No real evidence here, only a bit of food for thought.

That was intended to be against yuma, if anything I was trying to back you up, shraeye. The fact that you, well, didn't agree with Insomniac WAS disagreement.

Quote
HEre's what really gets me; sparky posts "What, what, and what? Why should we have exactly 2 deaths? " does it sound like anyone else that he's too concerned about how many deaths there will be.  the exact number of deaths is that last thing on earth that is terrifying me right now.  but it might be of much more concern to someone who has an influence over nightdeaths.

It's the logic of it that bugged me, not so much the night deaths.

There is one thing that is flawed with my posts though that you pointed out:

Quote
NExt, he makes some regular hunty posts, with no town/scum reads to them

You're right, I haven't outright accused anyone yet. That's because I'm not yet confident as to who to go for. A random vote probably wouldn't do too much now, huh XD I still want others to respond to my latest question. And yes, clarify whenever you can, whenever you feel more refreshed. Can't say it's good that I'm on the chopping block, but give it your best shot XD

P.S: Morgrim.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #259 on: August 14, 2012, 11:37:12 am »

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #260 on: August 14, 2012, 11:39:59 am »

I will keep mine on sharkbait for basically the same reason
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #261 on: August 14, 2012, 11:43:30 am »

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

I totally deserve this. I re-read the first half of the thread but haven't had time to catch up on the rest. This game is a little daunting right now, and nothing has jumped out at me as like, "wow, look at that!" Which may mean the mafia are being quiet. And hey, I'm being quiet! Sorry no vote for myself.

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #262 on: August 14, 2012, 12:25:03 pm »

Vote: Axxle

Appears to be posting just for the sake of not lurking. I feel he isnt helping town as much as he could.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #263 on: August 14, 2012, 03:56:58 pm »

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

You know what, I completely agree with this. Let's break the ice. I've been rambling for too long I think XD

So my vote: VOTE: shark_bait. I've already explained my position on lurkers and not contributing as much as you can.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #264 on: August 14, 2012, 04:32:56 pm »

I have to profusely apologize.  My laptop died on me this morning (I'm posting from a friend's computer).  So either I need a replacement for me or I need to be removed.  I don't know how soon I'll be able to get it fixed/get a new one so it does not make sense for me to stay in this game.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #265 on: August 14, 2012, 05:00:53 pm »

Oh wow, that was wayy too long of a post I put together.  It's so long, I didn't even read it all.  Well, at least I didn't want to read it all.  Basically that was stream of consciousness in which I said some things I wanted to say, and some half-baked ideas as if they were fully-baked.  I'll give the sparknotes version here.

1. Insomniac has cleared up almost all of my suspicion in his latest post (#247).  The only thing he is still consistently wrong on is part 4 of that post, in which he still says that a few people claiming in Cups/Pentacles and a few in Wand/Swords would confirm both scum factions.  This is just plain incorrect.  But he's been consistently wrong about that in a mistake-type way instead of a scum-type way.  So I think I'll move my vote off of him.

2. I didn't like people jumping at ftl's votecount mistake; it was soooo wrong that this couldn't possibly be a scumslip, this was so large-scale that it had to be innocent.  Ehunt makes some suspicious analysis regarding not being the 5th vote (note to self, track ehunt's votes) when, in a hilarious comedy of errors, ftl was never worried about being the 5th vote he was incorrectly not wanting to be 4th of 5 when he would have actually been 3 of 3 if he had stayed.  Nobody even noticed that O switched his vote off already.

3. This leads into my referenced suspicion of Axxle.  Usually super-level headed and accurate, he also doesn't realize that angrybird is already on Galz.  But he doesn't like the on/off pressure of Galz.  But he also brought pressure on Galz with vote #3 and then pulls it off, using ftl's mistake as his reason.  But what surprised me the most is that after putting slight suspicion on ftl, all it took was yuma posting the vote order for Axxle to almost immediately jump ship.  This feels like he also wanted to take pressure off Galz, but looked for a flimsy reason to do so, instead of having the guts just to pull his vote straight off Galz.
What really sits weird with me and Axxle is the way he does things really without stating explanations.  an example, is
Vote Count
Galzria (2): O, angrybirds

Sure

Vote: Galzria
OR
And I have yet to see him answer this question:

I guess Morgrim mentioned that Galz looked real scummy because
He's been awfully quiet, (something he doesn't normally do) and when he does say something, its like this:
I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.

Is this the reason that he looked scummy to you ftl?  Or was it really just because you wanted there to be a bandwagon?  What was the reason for your vote, Axxle?  Is there really something to that Lie Detector role?  I wonder if there's something I've missed but I have only the neutralest of reads on Galz so far.  Hey Galz, post more!
#2: I'm looking like someone who wants to appear town... Well, sure. I mean, I'm not playing with the goal of saying "look at me! I'm town!", but certainly wanting to appear town is not exactly a scumtell.
Overly wanting to appear doing pro-town things, without actually doing pro-town things, is a scumtell though.

What was he agreeing to in the first post? Maximum vagueness=maximum future flexibility.  And in the second post, I was looking forward to seeing his answer and comparing it to his previous feelings on this issue.  Axxle avoids this possibility by directly quoting something he already said.  This seems suspicious to me, especially as the "Overly wanting to appear doing pro-town things, without actually doing pro-town things, is a scumtell though" now looks to be an explanation of his vote where it had never been put in this context before.  And if this was his scumtell on Galz, it was never answered or responded to before Axxle was willing to give up that path and vote for ftl.  Weird.

4. Ok, so that last point was actually new, so back to sparknoting. I'm questioning how strong of a scumtell not actively hunting is, as even the scum have incentive to root out the opposing faction fast.  if they can always lynch an opposing faction, then nightkill town, they would be infinitely happy.

5. My major half-baked idea was burgeoning suspicion on sparky, that was my inner monologue debating his status, and it ended in non-suspicion.  But as I was going through his posts and analyzing them, the read became increasingly non-scum and I backed off in the end. The in-post 180deg flip was what "slap me with a wrench" indicated.  I don't regret putting out some of sparky's more suspicious moves, but I do regret FoS-ing him when I am currently getting overall town-reads from him.

6. I apologize for drunk and tired rants, i'll try to keep those in check.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #266 on: August 14, 2012, 05:05:24 pm »

3. Without commenting too much on other ongoing games, Axxle certainly is not playing "super level-headed" in them either.
6. I read through it, it gave me a huge town vibe. No reason to be sorry, I think posts like that are super informational because it's very hard to fake honest stream of consciousness like that.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #267 on: August 14, 2012, 05:25:19 pm »

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 
I agree fully, the highest vote-count was 10 total I think, and that was an interesting time when Galz/Insomniac had 4/3 votes on them.  If some nonvoters had come down on either side of that issue, we would have seen even more pressure and probably gotten better reads all around.

My sentiments on Axxle mimic Eevee's (#262) and he is the person I'm currently feeling the most scumvibe from.  Here's another piece on him I just noticed.  He reacted weirdly to the ftl-mistake sounding like he was trying pretty hard to make it a thing that got a lot of post time.  But do you know what happened directly before ftl's original mistaky post?  Galz put FoS on Axxle, and Axxle has not yet responded to this.  Bury instead of respond?  Here's not letting that work.
Alright, I just got myself caught up. There is surprisingly little... but... if anybody stands out to me right now it's Axxle. His posts just seem to lack any real content, and there's a whole lot of joking mixed in. Axxle is usually a lot more driven towards pushing for scumhunting. I remember an Axxle from games past who would link useful articles about how to avoid RVS, and how to scumhunt with some efficiency D1 (at least, above average).

vote: Axxle
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #268 on: August 14, 2012, 05:36:55 pm »

There's something going on with Axxle, and I don't know what. Vote: Axxle I don't know the vote count but I'm pretty sure that's not L-2 or L-1 or anything yet.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #269 on: August 14, 2012, 05:38:10 pm »

I'm happy to sheep my own reads into a Vote. I had been hoping to get a response with the FoS since I'm not big on casting votes I'm not sold on... But in the absence of a response Vote: Axxle.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #270 on: August 14, 2012, 06:10:29 pm »

@shraeye - no, 5th voter isn't a thing. Sorry I was unclear. I just mean I think it's weird for folks to say "I don't want there to be (n) votes on player x" when they mean "I don't want to be perceived as accelerating the wagon."

Speaking of accelerating wagons...
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #271 on: August 14, 2012, 06:12:46 pm »

Sorry, I agree that I'm not as engaged in this game as I should be.  I'll reread the thread and get back to you guys later tonight.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #272 on: August 14, 2012, 06:15:03 pm »

3. This leads into my referenced suspicion of Axxle.  Usually super-level headed and accurate, he also doesn't realize that angrybird is already on Galz.  But he doesn't like the on/off pressure of Galz.  But he also brought pressure on Galz with vote #3 and then pulls it off, using ftl's mistake as his reason.  But what surprised me the most is that after putting slight suspicion on ftl, all it took was yuma posting the vote order for Axxle to almost immediately jump ship.  This feels like he also wanted to take pressure off Galz, but looked for a flimsy reason to do so, instead of having the guts just to pull his vote straight off Galz.
You're mixing me up with someone else.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #273 on: August 14, 2012, 06:17:28 pm »

No, wait.  I see what you're saying.  I like where my vote is though.  Whenever you make a vote and say it's "for pressure" it's a pretty scummy thing to do, since you're broadcasting that it's not a serious vote.  And FTL retracts it immediately saying he want's pressure but not that much pressure. 
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #274 on: August 14, 2012, 06:22:19 pm »

No, wait.  I see what you're saying.  I like where my vote is though.  Whenever you make a vote and say it's "for pressure" it's a pretty scummy thing to do, since you're broadcasting that it's not a serious vote.  And FTL retracts it immediately saying he want's pressure but not that much pressure.
Err... not immediately.  I'm really going to have to reread.  for now:
Unvote
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #275 on: August 14, 2012, 06:29:26 pm »

I have to profusely apologize.  My laptop died on me this morning (I'm posting from a friend's computer).  So either I need a replacement for me or I need to be removed.  I don't know how soon I'll be able to get it fixed/get a new one so it does not make sense for me to stay in this game.

Dang.

UNVOTE: shark_bait

I was hoping that that wouldn't be the defense. It always pains me to see a player that needs replacing. Too much of that happened when I played back in the day.

But enough about that. Axxle has a bandwagon. Axxle WAS another person I implied as anti-town in post #211. He makes the most sense to me at this point.

VOTE: Axxle

I haven't voted to pressure. I vote because it's how to win.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #276 on: August 14, 2012, 06:34:11 pm »

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

I totally deserve this. I re-read the first half of the thread but haven't had time to catch up on the rest. This game is a little daunting right now, and nothing has jumped out at me as like, "wow, look at that!" Which may mean the mafia are being quiet. And hey, I'm being quiet! Sorry no vote for myself.

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

as for yuma you want unique things? well he collects bouncy balls. is that unique enough?

I followed the games he played in pretty closely and thought that he just played M3 safe and M5 even safer (in that game he only cast one vote for you the entire game). in this game he seems to be a little more aggressive, especially with sharkbait and morgrim who he is always getting after, but I dont know if that is an attempt to change his mafia behavior or if he is playing as town in his real character.
in most games he plays aggressively and to win, but not obviously or annoyingly aggressive
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #277 on: August 14, 2012, 06:35:24 pm »

Almost forgot to mention this.

Nothing to apologize for shraeye. That one post actually did analyze some new insights. It puts pressure on people, and that can change the flow of the game, which is what we're trying to do in the first place. Glad you're analyzing everyone, even me  :) It's part of good mafia gameplay.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #278 on: August 14, 2012, 06:42:22 pm »

ehunt, are you confirming your vote on Frisk?
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #279 on: August 14, 2012, 06:47:45 pm »

Axxle seems scummy in every game he is in that I'm in. People even think he's scummy in RMM2! I think we should accept that this is how he plays, just loke you did me.

FoS Volt for voting for someone who has been busy and trying to lynch him before he can defend himself. It isn't nice to lynch someone when they are gone. One time, you guys lynched me while I was asleep. Not cool.

sorry I haven't posted much

GOKO f5 took over my entire day today
you've posted more than some.  a lot more than some.
We're not supposed to talk about me.

AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
;D  ;)
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #280 on: August 14, 2012, 06:52:04 pm »

ehunt, are you confirming your vote on Frisk?

It's not an rvs vote, if that's what you're asking.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #281 on: August 14, 2012, 07:13:11 pm »

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

I totally deserve this. I re-read the first half of the thread but haven't had time to catch up on the rest. This game is a little daunting right now, and nothing has jumped out at me as like, "wow, look at that!" Which may mean the mafia are being quiet. And hey, I'm being quiet! Sorry no vote for myself.

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

A little jumpy?
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #282 on: August 14, 2012, 07:14:20 pm »

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

A little jumpy?

Yes, you do seem a little jumpy.

vote: Robz888
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #283 on: August 14, 2012, 07:25:22 pm »

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

I totally deserve this. I re-read the first half of the thread but haven't had time to catch up on the rest. This game is a little daunting right now, and nothing has jumped out at me as like, "wow, look at that!" Which may mean the mafia are being quiet. And hey, I'm being quiet! Sorry no vote for myself.

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

A little jumpy?

no
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #284 on: August 14, 2012, 07:33:08 pm »

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

I totally deserve this. I re-read the first half of the thread but haven't had time to catch up on the rest. This game is a little daunting right now, and nothing has jumped out at me as like, "wow, look at that!" Which may mean the mafia are being quiet. And hey, I'm being quiet! Sorry no vote for myself.

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

A little jumpy?
he pretty much did exactly what you asked.

Vote: RObz
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #285 on: August 14, 2012, 07:45:30 pm »

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

A little jumpy?

Yes, you do seem a little jumpy.

vote: Robz888

pwned

*debates in my mind, axxle or robz, axxle or robz...*
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #286 on: August 14, 2012, 07:46:41 pm »

I have to profusely apologize.  My laptop died on me this morning (I'm posting from a friend's computer).  So either I need a replacement for me or I need to be removed.  I don't know how soon I'll be able to get it fixed/get a new one so it does not make sense for me to stay in this game.

I guess I should unvote. it is hard to read and then vote for someone that isn't in the game anymore...

I don't like either the Axxle wagon or the Robz wagon that is building. I don't think a-birds fully addressed Robz, and Robz is trying to further elicit a response.

As for Axxle he doesn't seem scummy, he seems ?distracted? that doesn't scream mafia to me.

The person who does seem most mafia to me is actually the complete opposite of my previous post, and disagrees with a couple other townspeople.

vote: shraeye

With all of the voting toward lurkers--both in this game and in others--it seem to me that mafia members would be very aware of not lurking. shraeye seems to have an astute enough mind to recognize this and is doing everything to make sure (she/he?) isn't put into the lurker category. I don't buy all of the long, long posts as evidence of town, but perhaps instead is evidence of covering up being mafia.

But Volt wanted votes, so there is mine
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #287 on: August 14, 2012, 11:17:49 pm »

Here is where I think we stand

Galzria (1): angrybirds
Insomniac (1): Morgrim7
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz (2): voltgloss, O, Axxle
Angrybirds (1): Robz
Axxle (5): Eevee, shraeye, ftl, galzria, sparky
shraeye (1): yuma

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #288 on: August 14, 2012, 11:40:46 pm »

Vote Count
Galzria (1): angrybirds
Insomniac (1): Morgrim7
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (3): Voltgloss, O, Axxle
angrybirds (1): Robz888
Axxle (5): Eevee, shraeye, ftl, Galzria, sparky5856
shraeye (1): yuma

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #289 on: August 14, 2012, 11:57:15 pm »

Oh hey, BMMMMMMM is done so we can talk about Morgrim now. Mostly I didn't want to talk about Morgrim because that game had people analyzing the Morgrim wagon trying to find my scumbuddy and I wasn't sure how to honestly say "I like having Morgrim around because he's such a magnet for scum votes at inopportune times" without referencing what was going on in that game.

Hi Morgrim, you can be a conversation topic again.

OK, this game.
Axxle: tempting lynch at first, but meh. Unvote now.
Angrybirds: town IMO.
sharaye and insom look ok,
shark_bait needs replacin'. So we won't have a sharky and a sparky.
sharky, Robz, Captain_Frisk and O all look scummier on reread. Vote: Robz .

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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #290 on: August 15, 2012, 12:17:57 am »

Yeah, okay, really going to focus on this game more. And just in time! A little wagon is building against me.

It looks to me like O and Axxle voted for me because they didn't like my response to angrybirds?

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

I totally deserve this. I re-read the first half of the thread but haven't had time to catch up on the rest. This game is a little daunting right now, and nothing has jumped out at me as like, "wow, look at that!" Which may mean the mafia are being quiet. And hey, I'm being quiet! Sorry no vote for myself.

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

A little jumpy?
he pretty much did exactly what you asked.

Vote: RObz

I agree that he did exactly what I asked. I didn't have any problem with his response to my questions--which were just attempting to generate info on a new player I know nothing about anyway. I said, "Jumpy are we?" because he said that I looked more suspicious to him. As far as I can tell, his reason for being suspicious of me was that I had asked him these questions and voted for him. That's textbook OMGUS suspicion, isn't it?

Really, though, I don't think he's scummy. He's just an eager newbie who thought that the right thing to do when someone went after you a bit was to return the favor. So Unvote. But to be clear, I said he was jumpy because he reacted to me voting/questioning him by saying that I was suspicious. Which is jumpy, right?

I'm not quite sure why that caused O and Axxle to vote for me. Well, my cynical answer is that O is just being O, and Axxle wanted to get a wagon going that wasn't his own.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #291 on: August 15, 2012, 01:09:56 am »

hai giaz.  i found this thing called isotropic and itz cool and stuff.  I'll try to post something though.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #292 on: August 15, 2012, 01:15:00 am »

Yeah, okay, really going to focus on this game more. And just in time! A little wagon is building against me.

It looks to me like O and Axxle voted for me because they didn't like my response to angrybirds?

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

I totally deserve this. I re-read the first half of the thread but haven't had time to catch up on the rest. This game is a little daunting right now, and nothing has jumped out at me as like, "wow, look at that!" Which may mean the mafia are being quiet. And hey, I'm being quiet! Sorry no vote for myself.

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.

i am not going to try and prove that i am not mafia to you. my posts and behavior should speak for themselves. if you have something suspicious or accusatory to ask me, feel free to do so and then i will respond.  i am continuing to keep my vote on galzaria, but i can now add you to my suspicious list, along with ftl

A little jumpy?
he pretty much did exactly what you asked.

Vote: RObz

I agree that he did exactly what I asked. I didn't have any problem with his response to my questions--which were just attempting to generate info on a new player I know nothing about anyway. I said, "Jumpy are we?" because he said that I looked more suspicious to him. As far as I can tell, his reason for being suspicious of me was that I had asked him these questions and voted for him. That's textbook OMGUS suspicion, isn't it?

Really, though, I don't think he's scummy. He's just an eager newbie who thought that the right thing to do when someone went after you a bit was to return the favor. So Unvote. But to be clear, I said he was jumpy because he reacted to me voting/questioning him by saying that I was suspicious. Which is jumpy, right?

I'm not quite sure why that caused O and Axxle to vote for me. Well, my cynical answer is that O is just being O, and Axxle wanted to get a wagon going that wasn't his own.

It's not really OMGUS.  He didn't vote for you, or even FOS you.  He didn't call on other players to scrutinize your play.  He just put you in a personal category. 

Why did you unvote him? He hasn't stopped being scummy in your eyes right?
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #293 on: August 15, 2012, 01:56:58 am »

With all of the voting toward lurkers--both in this game and in others--it seem to me that mafia members would be very aware of not lurking. shraeye seems to have an astute enough mind to recognize this and is doing everything to make sure (she/he?) isn't put into the lurker category. I don't buy all of the long, long posts as evidence of town, but perhaps instead is evidence of covering up being mafia.
I agree that f.DS has pretty much been jumping over lurking being a scumtell, so much so that it isn't even really a scumtell anymore.  Galz caught some flak for not posting, when he had given us a V/LA warning; this seemed unwarrented by me.  I'm not super certain Galz is towny, but his not posting isn't scummy behavior.  Similarly, I don't post long, long posts to appear towny.  Post frequency indicates talkativeness and post length indicates wordiness.  I don't think either should be used as primary clues for scumminess/towniness.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #294 on: August 15, 2012, 02:03:53 am »

I agree that he did exactly what I asked. I didn't have any problem with his response to my questions--which were just attempting to generate info on a new player I know nothing about anyway. I said, "Jumpy are we?" because he said that I looked more suspicious to him. As far as I can tell, his reason for being suspicious of me was that I had asked him these questions and voted for him. That's textbook OMGUS suspicion, isn't it?

Really, though, I don't think he's scummy. He's just an eager newbie who thought that the right thing to do when someone went after you a bit was to return the favor. So Unvote. But to be clear, I said he was jumpy because he reacted to me voting/questioning him by saying that I was suspicious. Which is jumpy, right?

I'm not quite sure why that caused O and Axxle to vote for me. Well, my cynical answer is that O is just being O, and Axxle wanted to get a wagon going that wasn't his own.

It's not really OMGUS.  He didn't vote for you, or even FOS you.  He didn't call on other players to scrutinize your play.  He just put you in a personal category. 

Why did you unvote him? He hasn't stopped being scummy in your eyes right?

I'm not sure if you're actually using a super specific definition for OMGUS here, or if you're just being difficult.  Robz perfectly described this situation, so much so that I can completely answer your questions.  The only patent reason for angrybirds being suspicious of Robz is Robz's question-asking and angrybirds-voting.  In response to this angrybirds says he can add Robs to his personal suspicious list.  Sure he never said vote-robz, or FoS-robz, but maybe he's just not using your technical lingo.  He literally said that he is suspicious of Robz, so why are yousaying this isn't FoS?  Because he didn't use those letter combinations?  Ridiculous.

Robz unvoted angrybirds because, as you said yourself, angrybirds did all Robz asked him to do, and those were the conditions of Robz unvoting.  Robz never said that angrybirds looked scummy, maybe he thought that, but probably he was just getting a less frequent poster to expose himself to analysis.  So stop putting words in Robz's eyes.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #295 on: August 15, 2012, 09:43:19 am »

What Shraeye said. Seriously. I didn't find angrybirds particularly suspicious in the first place, but Volt requested that we all vote for someone to get more action going. I found that a reasonable request, and I don't know much about abirds, and I am curious about his info on yuma. I didn't think abirds was particularly suspicious, but I do like to investigate the newbies, that's sort of always been my Day 1 plan for scumhunting. Abirds's response was fine, he's not so scummy, so unvote. Him saying I was suspicious was the behavior I found jumpy--it was jumpy--but that's all.

I don't think Axxle is paying very good attention to what happened. I think it should have been fairly clear that I didn't vote Abirds because I thought he was really scummy (as I laid out no case against him).
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #296 on: August 15, 2012, 10:08:13 am »

I think it should have been fairly clear that I didn't vote Abirds because I thought he was really scummy (as I laid out no case against him).

this is what I found suspicious, i know that voltgloss called for votes, but your selection of me without any evidence and a demand that i somehow prove my townness to you showed that you are merely wasting time and votes prodding people you don't find suspicious. Is there no one else in the town that you find suspicious that you could have used a vote on? when i vote, I provide the context for why, those who don't seem to be hiding something and that makes it suspsicious
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #297 on: August 15, 2012, 10:50:01 am »

Angrybirds, but doing just that has been a scumhunting method used by the town in all the Forum mafia games. Accuse someone at random (you weren't true random, I wanted to select a newbie, as I often do), and see how the respond. I thought you responded just fine. Sorry, but that's the way it works... or has worked (questionably effectively) so far in the mafia games.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #298 on: August 15, 2012, 11:38:14 am »

Angrybirds, but doing just that has been a scumhunting method used by the town in all the Forum mafia games. Accuse someone at random (you weren't true random, I wanted to select a newbie, as I often do), and see how the respond. I thought you responded just fine. Sorry, but that's the way it works... or has worked (questionably effectively) so far in the mafia games.

I understand that this is how scumhunting works but I don't think you were truly scumhunting. i think you were just doing what volt suggested to stay low, either because you are a town that doesn't want to attract attention or because you are a mafia that doesnt' want to attract attention, i don't know which so I didn't vote for you

accuse me all you want and i am glad to hear that you think i responded fine, it wasn't that you accused me that i found suspicious, it was the way, that is immediately after volt suggested it and with no substance to back it up. even if you select someone at random you can go back and find some quotes and ask them "why did you say that" "what were you trying to accomplish here", but you didn't, you just asked me to prove that i wasn't mafia
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #299 on: August 15, 2012, 11:43:44 am »

Robz's absence from earlier is due to well-documented V/LAness. His hard press on angrybirds, followed by his backing off, does not strike me as scummy at all. It's very typical day one play for anyone, especially for Robz. I don't understand why he's got so many votes.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #300 on: August 15, 2012, 11:50:36 am »

I understand why abirds had a negative reaction to this--he's knew; he doesn't know this is just how it goes. I also understand why Volt voted for me in the first place. I don't understand why O, Axxle, and ftl followed suited after the abirds exchange. I mean, it's not that out of character for O, I guess. Mostly Axxle and now ftl.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #301 on: August 15, 2012, 01:18:39 pm »

It's not a troll vote. Your response made no sense... Angrybirds pretty much posted a calm, adequate response to your vote and you reply with "a little jumpy?".
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #302 on: August 15, 2012, 01:21:14 pm »

It's not a troll vote. Your response made no sense... Angrybirds pretty much posted a calm, adequate response to your vote and you reply with "a little jumpy?".

You don't think Abirds saying that I was now on his suspicion list was a little jumpy of him?
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #303 on: August 15, 2012, 01:26:56 pm »

It's not a troll vote. Your response made no sense... Angrybirds pretty much posted a calm, adequate response to your vote and you reply with "a little jumpy?".

You don't think Abirds saying that I was now on his suspicion list was a little jumpy of him?

A new player slightly OMGUSing (not even with a vote)? Who ever *heard* of such madness?

I didn't see much of a threat there.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #304 on: August 15, 2012, 01:29:51 pm »

It's not a troll vote. Your response made no sense... Angrybirds pretty much posted a calm, adequate response to your vote and you reply with "a little jumpy?".

You don't think Abirds saying that I was now on his suspicion list was a little jumpy of him?

A new player slightly OMGUSing (not even with a vote)? Who ever *heard* of such madness?

I didn't see much of a threat there.

Neither did I. Which is why I took my vote off him. Like I said, it didn't make me suspicious of him. I think he's likely newbie town.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #305 on: August 15, 2012, 01:35:16 pm »

As exciting as Robz vs. angrybirds is, something entirely different caught my eye and I think warrants further discussion.

The person who does seem most mafia to me is actually the complete opposite of my previous post, and disagrees with a couple other townspeople.

vote: shraeye

With all of the voting toward lurkers--both in this game and in others--it seem to me that mafia members would be very aware of not lurking. shraeye seems to have an astute enough mind to recognize this and is doing everything to make sure (she/he?) isn't put into the lurker category. I don't buy all of the long, long posts as evidence of town, but perhaps instead is evidence of covering up being mafia.

This is an interesting take, yuma.  My question for you:  Why is shraeye more suspicious to you than sparky?  I have gotten a similar vibe from both shraeye and sparky so far this game - both new players, both verbose - and I have the sense that both of them fit the characterization you've described.  So I am curious to hear why your vote went to shraeye and not sparky.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #306 on: August 15, 2012, 01:36:32 pm »

It's not a troll vote. Your response made no sense... Angrybirds pretty much posted a calm, adequate response to your vote and you reply with "a little jumpy?".

You don't think Abirds saying that I was now on his suspicion list was a little jumpy of him?

A new player slightly OMGUSing (not even with a vote)? Who ever *heard* of such madness?

I didn't see much of a threat there.

Neither did I. Which is why I took my vote off him. Like I said, it didn't make me suspicious of him. I think he's likely newbie town.

you unvoted after me/axxle voted for you, not sure why this should effect my stance.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #307 on: August 15, 2012, 01:38:58 pm »

Personally, I would like to hear a bit more from Axxle. It felt like he came in, said "Yeah, I see why you might vote for me" and then left again, without really addressing any issues... which is exactly what he was accused of doing in the first place. Making noise without actually saying anything just to "appear" non-lurky.

Axxle?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #308 on: August 15, 2012, 01:39:29 pm »

Oh hey, BMMMMMMM is done so we can talk about Morgrim now. Mostly I didn't want to talk about Morgrim because that game had people analyzing the Morgrim wagon trying to find my scumbuddy and I wasn't sure how to honestly say "I like having Morgrim around because he's such a magnet for scum votes at inopportune times" without referencing what was going on in that game.

Hi Morgrim, you can be a conversation topic again.


@eHunt: this is why morgrim hunting on day 1. 

Our case on Axxle is what?  Not very engaged?  I just re-read everything and it seemed like we RVSed for a long time.  I didn't come out of it with any strong reads.

Why did the Galzwagon go away?  Those are my favorites.

The RobZ / Angrybirds thing was weird too.  Vote: RobZ for backing down too quickly.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #309 on: August 15, 2012, 01:48:32 pm »

Nothing to back down from... wasn't suspicious of person... wanted to provoke response... response was fine... 'cept for slight OMGUS...

The point was to get a read on Abirds, who clearly reads newbie town to me at this point. And he told us about Yuma. So I accomplished my goal.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #310 on: August 15, 2012, 02:06:19 pm »

And he told us about Yuma. So I accomplished my goal.

And what did you learn about me, huh?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #311 on: August 15, 2012, 02:09:02 pm »

Our case on Axxle is what?  Not very engaged? 

No, my current case on him is his way of redirecting heat.  At the most recent votecount he had 5 votes (that's the most for 1 person so far), and although ftl peels off of him, I would still be worried in his place.  But instead of spending any post-time on himself, Axxle starts prodding at the Robz v. angrybirds nonconflict, seemingly purposely misinterpreting it to make it bigger than it was.  This is the exact thing that happened the first time heat pointed at him.  Galz said he got the worst vibe from Axxle so far (i talked about this in 267), and Axxle immediately jumps over ftl for miscounting things.

Eevee's read on Axxle is that he's not helping town, but still posting(#262).  He's posting a lot, his post count is only bested by ftl.  That's crazy considering that he hasn't done much that seemed productive to me.  The few times he threw his weight around were the above cited times when it felt more like heat-redirecting to me.

Sparky contends that Axxle is really into disproving anyone when the opportunity presents itself instead of really focusing on one issue. (#211 for a more detailed description by sparky)

Galz (#236) cites lack of content in Axxles posts, and lack of the driven scumhunting that he was expecting.  I don't think any of us have main points that Axxle simply isn't engaged.  He's engaged, I feel; but, he's focused on completely the wrong things.

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #312 on: August 15, 2012, 02:11:00 pm »

And he told us about Yuma. So I accomplished my goal.

And what did you learn about me, huh?

That you collect bouncy balls!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #313 on: August 15, 2012, 02:12:01 pm »

No seriously, your twinclaimant pointed out that you barely voted in the other games, and you're being more aggressive now. It wasn't revelatory, no, but it jives with what I think of you.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #314 on: August 15, 2012, 02:19:39 pm »

This is an interesting take, yuma.  My question for you:  Why is shraeye more suspicious to you than sparky?  I have gotten a similar vibe from both shraeye and sparky so far this game - both new players, both verbose - and I have the sense that both of them fit the characterization you've described.  So I am curious to hear why your vote went to shraeye and not sparky.
Good question

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac

You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.

He's already expressed his disagreement with one of Insomniac's posts.


There was this ^earlier... although sparky did show that shraeye had disagreed with insomniac in the past.

Furthermore, shraeye has been much more active--with much longer posts that were long, but lacked a lot of content--where as sparky's posts have been less active, with some long posts, but not nearly as long or as many. Sparky seems more real, shraeye seems more forced.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #315 on: August 15, 2012, 02:19:58 pm »

No seriously, your twinclaimant pointed out that you barely voted in the other games, and you're being more aggressive now. It wasn't revelatory, no, but it jives with what I think of you.

and what do you think of me?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #316 on: August 15, 2012, 02:24:55 pm »

Yeah... need to pay more attention. Unvote
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #317 on: August 15, 2012, 02:33:50 pm »

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.
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A little jumpy?

Backlash

Yeah, okay, really going to focus on this game more. And just in time! A little wagon is building against me.

It looks to me like O and Axxle voted for me because they didn't like my response to angrybirds?

I agree that he did exactly what I asked. I didn't have any problem with his response to my questions--which were just attempting to generate info on a new player I know nothing about anyway. I said, "Jumpy are we?" because he said that I looked more suspicious to him. As far as I can tell, his reason for being suspicious of me was that I had asked him these questions and voted for him. That's textbook OMGUS suspicion, isn't it?

Really, though, I don't think he's scummy. He's just an eager newbie who thought that the right thing to do when someone went after you a bit was to return the favor. So Unvote. But to be clear, I said he was jumpy because he reacted to me voting/questioning him by saying that I was suspicious. Which is jumpy, right?

I'm not quite sure why that caused O and Axxle to vote for me. Well, my cynical answer is that O is just being O, and Axxle wanted to get a wagon going that wasn't his own.

Robz.  Why did you not unvote immediately?  Saying "Jumpy are we?" sounds like a way of trying to get more people to vote for him without explicitly calling out for it.  A scumtell in my book.

Revote: Robz
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #318 on: August 15, 2012, 02:40:25 pm »

I find it really hard to "force" people into decisions in Mafia, always because of that uncertainty factor. Everything always seems to feel like "Hey, this seems like the most sense at the moment, let's go for that!" There's so much logic to analyze that you're bound to be wrong somewhere (I'm speaking in general here, not particularly at anyone).

I dunno how long Day 1 should last. When I read Volt's call for votes (#259) I figured it was to seriously cast my vote on who is scum. Rereading it, Robz's vote seems perfectly legit. I did think angrybirds was an odd choice for scum (I've been thinking that he's one of the LEAST suspicious players so far, and Robz too feels the same way), but all Robz wanted to do was see a response, which is exactly what Volt called for. On a side note, I'm gonna be using OMGUS whenever I can now as it's now one of my favorite acronyms  ;D

Quote
Robz.  Why did you not unvote immediately?  Saying "Jumpy are we?" sounds like a way of trying to get more people to vote for him without explicitly calling out for it.  A scumtell in my book.

Maybe he wasn't expecting that reaction (specifically the implied FoS), so he reacted more naturally instead of immediately unvoting. idk.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #319 on: August 15, 2012, 02:41:30 pm »

This is an interesting take, yuma.  My question for you:  Why is shraeye more suspicious to you than sparky?  I have gotten a similar vibe from both shraeye and sparky so far this game - both new players, both verbose - and I have the sense that both of them fit the characterization you've described.  So I am curious to hear why your vote went to shraeye and not sparky.
Good question

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac

You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.

He's already expressed his disagreement with one of Insomniac's posts.


There was this ^earlier... although sparky did show that shraeye had disagreed with insomniac in the past.
I'm confused, it this just something differentiating me and sparky, or is it a reason I look scummier, having gone after Insomniac for what appeared to me to be suspicious.

Furthermore, shraeye has been much more active--with much longer posts that were long, but lacked a lot of content--where as sparky's posts have been less active, with some long posts, but not nearly as long or as many. Sparky seems more real, shraeye seems more forced.
Again I don't understand, are you saying I don't have much content in my posts (you should reread them if you feel this way) or that the content I have is forced (I have forceful opinions, that's true.  Once I see something suspicious I make sure everyone else sees it too.  But coming up with opinions and suspicions is happening quite naturally)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #320 on: August 15, 2012, 02:45:04 pm »

As for Robz v. angrybirds, I'm not sure what side I come down on.
Saying "Jumpy are we?" sounds like a way of trying to get more people to vote for him without explicitly calling out for it.  A scumtell in my book.
This makes complete sense to me, but maybe Robz got slightly more suspicious of angrybirds due to the response and wanted to see if anyone else felt that way too.  Still, that non-explicit call for more votes sits weirdly.  I like to be completely explicit with my opinions.  But I can't stop something in the back of my head from also thinking this.
Maybe he wasn't expecting that reaction (specifically the implied FoS), so he reacted more naturally instead of immediately unvoting. idk.

Regardless I think all of this is less important than the continued unanswered 4-person accusations on Axxle.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #321 on: August 15, 2012, 02:51:36 pm »

Wait a minute.

Continuing where I last left off... I find it odd that Axxle revotes Robz for not unvoting quickly enough...

Quote
The RobZ / Angrybirds thing was weird too.  Vote: RobZ for backing down too quickly.

Whereas HERE Captain_Frisk votes Robz because he unvoted TOO quickly. Inconsistencies bother me. What to make of this... anyone want to jump on this or does this mean nothing?

And another wait a minute. Saying that shraeye's posts don't have much content warrants some explaining, I agree. 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #322 on: August 15, 2012, 02:54:07 pm »

Wait a minute.

Continuing where I last left off... I find it odd that Axxle revotes Robz for not unvoting quickly enough...

Quote
The RobZ / Angrybirds thing was weird too.  Vote: RobZ for backing down too quickly.

Whereas HERE Captain_Frisk votes Robz because he unvoted TOO quickly. Inconsistencies bother me. What to make of this... anyone want to jump on this or does this mean nothing?

And another wait a minute. Saying that shraeye's posts don't have much content warrants some explaining, I agree.

The main thing to glean from this is that Robz's choices of either staying the course or unvoting does not imply scuminess. Both can be called out as scummy actions from different people, and both scum and town are known to do both actions.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #323 on: August 15, 2012, 03:02:25 pm »

The main thing to glean from this is that Robz's choices of either staying the course or unvoting does not imply scuminess. Both can be called out as scummy actions from different people, and both scum and town are known to do both actions.
I'm probably biased on this because I still have my scumread on Axxle, but does this act in a vaccuum (if it happened when Frisk, Robz, Axxle, angry all had neutral reads) cast any suspicion on Frisk or Axxle?  Like they're trying too hard to attach scumminess to natural actions and create suspicion around a character.  It's a catch-22 forcing Robz into scumminess for either choice. Would this be more or less suspicious by Frisk/Axxle if Robz currently was looking very towny or very scummy? 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #324 on: August 15, 2012, 03:05:54 pm »

The main thing to glean from this is that Robz's choices of either staying the course or unvoting does not imply scuminess. Both can be called out as scummy actions from different people, and both scum and town are known to do both actions.
I'm probably biased on this because I still have my scumread on Axxle, but does this act in a vaccuum (if it happened when Frisk, Robz, Axxle, angry all had neutral reads) cast any suspicion on Frisk or Axxle?  Like they're trying too hard to attach scumminess to natural actions and create suspicion around a character.  It's a catch-22 forcing Robz into scumminess for either choice. Would this be more or less suspicious by Frisk/Axxle if Robz currently was looking very towny or very scummy?

Possible. It could also mean that F.DS mafia is chalk full of terrible mafia play in general  ;D
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #325 on: August 15, 2012, 03:08:33 pm »

The main thing to glean from this is that Robz's choices of either staying the course or unvoting does not imply scuminess. Both can be called out as scummy actions from different people, and both scum and town are known to do both actions.
I'm probably biased on this because I still have my scumread on Axxle, but does this act in a vaccuum (if it happened when Frisk, Robz, Axxle, angry all had neutral reads) cast any suspicion on Frisk or Axxle?  Like they're trying too hard to attach scumminess to natural actions and create suspicion around a character.  It's a catch-22 forcing Robz into scumminess for either choice. Would this be more or less suspicious by Frisk/Axxle if Robz currently was looking very towny or very scummy?
They both are valid.

Robz said he'd unvote immediately.  He did not and seemed to try to get other to vote for angrybirds (my scumtell).

After not unvoting for angrybirds immediately, Robz then backs off as soon as a lot of backlash occurs (CF's scumtell).
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #326 on: August 15, 2012, 03:09:40 pm »

Regardless I think all of this is less important than the continued unanswered 4-person accusations on Axxle.
How do you want me to respond? I haven't been that engaged, I haven't been providing much content.  I'll try to do better from now on.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #327 on: August 15, 2012, 03:27:52 pm »

@shraeye/sparky
Quoting makes posts messy so I am not going to quote your quotes of my quotes, etc....

In answering Volt's question, I pointed out that I found shraeye's vote of Insomniac--the style of it--the way he said (not exact quotes) "who know who I do find scummy??? Insomniac" w/o providing explanation there and then for why you did." I quoted sparky to say that while he pointed out that shraeye had in fact shown some disagreement prior to your vote, it wasn't enough to resolve my suspicion of you.

As for content:

you have had a couple of ginormous posts, these are mainly the ones I am referring to,

#248 is large, but at the end of it I am thinking so what?
1. you talk about insomniac with "probaby" "golly, gee whiz" "I'm paranoid of everbody"

2. then you start talking about ftl... I don't know what you have to say about ftl, lots of words, and I am left with "what?" you then move onto ehunt and galz (again what are you trying to say, other than put down words"

3. you talk about scumhunting and conclude with "those guys are my town reads, or will be, or mightnot if i can't tell whose sufficiently scared." they are your town reads? or they will be? or they won't be? Why even write this if you are so unsure?

4. then you talk about yourself and sparky in relation to voltgloss's vote about suitclaiming? and again conclude with "this is what I think, but then again, maybe it isn't"

5. then you say sparky and axxle are your main suspects... but don't hold me accountable because I am tired.


post #265 is better, I like the highlights because they help me understand what you think is important, but still lacking in the so what department

1. insomniac is clear for me, except he isn't

2. you don't like people voting for ftl !yea, content!

3. more content, yea! but you say something yourself about axxle that I will hold you up to "Maximum vagueness=maximum future flexibility"

4. you talk about your own conflicts regarding sparky 

so just from these two posts it seems that you do have content--as anyone playing this game should--but it is spread so thin that it is hard to take anything away from it.

vote: shraeye

With all of the voting toward lurkers--both in this game and in others--it seem to me that mafia members would be very aware of not lurking. shraeye seems to have an astute enough mind to recognize this and is doing everything to make sure (she/he?) isn't put into the lurker category. I don't buy all of the long, long posts as evidence of town, but perhaps instead is evidence of covering up being mafia.


The above quote is why I voted for you.

You seem to be trying very hard to make sure that you are visible, that you are playing, but not leading or exciting anybody, long and frequent posts with minimal content accomplish this.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #328 on: August 15, 2012, 06:46:39 pm »

OK Robz is being jumpy. Once a wagon forms for him saying, "A little jumpy?" he unvotes to clear himself. Not that I am the best mafia player, but I do remember M2 where I was killed primarily for voting and then jumping off the wagon. Like Robz. I thought you would "only vote after you're completely sure"? Right? Vote: Robz
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #329 on: August 15, 2012, 07:20:46 pm »

OK Robz is being jumpy. Once a wagon forms for him saying, "A little jumpy?" he unvotes to clear himself. Not that I am the best mafia player, but I do remember M2 where I was killed primarily for voting and then jumping off the wagon. Like Robz. I thought you would "only vote after you're completely sure"? Right? Vote: Robz

... and you were town, remember?

How many votes is this against me? It's... a lot, I think.

I suppose I should have clarified when I voted for Abirds, I didn't suspect him, just wanted a reaction. Of course, if I said that, he wouldn't have needed to answer me at all. So I didn't. Really, I was trying to get more involved with the game, and answer Volt's call, which I thought was a good idea. Volt never said to vote for the person you suspect the most, just someone. I unvoted him to clarify that I didn't actually suspect him. It didn't really matter to me whether I unvoted or not, since it was the only vote on the guy, I'd gotten my answer, and it wasn't threatening. But it seemed to be confusing people, like I was going after this guy big time, so I unvoted to clarify that.

People vote and unvote for other people all the time, and often do so to people they don't think are scum, in order to learn something? We all know this, yes? I'm happy to continue to explain what happened with Abirds, but every time a new person votes for me, it's as if they haven't read anything I've said since, which is mildly frustrating.

On top of all of this, I am IRL extremely ill yesterday and today (right after my move to my new job, yay). I've been sleeping on and off all day. My point is that perhaps I'm not thinking/talking clearly as I imagine myself to be. But please don't hammer me before I get to speak, roleclaim, etc. I wasn't permitted any final words at all in RMM2.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #330 on: August 15, 2012, 07:32:51 pm »

OK Robz is being jumpy. Once a wagon forms for him saying, "A little jumpy?" he unvotes to clear himself. Not that I am the best mafia player, but I do remember M2 where I was killed primarily for voting and then jumping off the wagon. Like Robz. I thought you would "only vote after you're completely sure"? Right? Vote: Robz

... and you were town, remember?

How many votes is this against me? It's... a lot, I think.

I suppose I should have clarified when I voted for Abirds, I didn't suspect him, just wanted a reaction. Of course, if I said that, he wouldn't have needed to answer me at all. So I didn't. Really, I was trying to get more involved with the game, and answer Volt's call, which I thought was a good idea. Volt never said to vote for the person you suspect the most, just someone. I unvoted him to clarify that I didn't actually suspect him. It didn't really matter to me whether I unvoted or not, since it was the only vote on the guy, I'd gotten my answer, and it wasn't threatening. But it seemed to be confusing people, like I was going after this guy big time, so I unvoted to clarify that.

People vote and unvote for other people all the time, and often do so to people they don't think are scum, in order to learn something? We all know this, yes? I'm happy to continue to explain what happened with Abirds, but every time a new person votes for me, it's as if they haven't read anything I've said since, which is mildly frustrating.

On top of all of this, I am IRL extremely ill yesterday and today (right after my move to my new job, yay). I've been sleeping on and off all day. My point is that perhaps I'm not thinking/talking clearly as I imagine myself to be. But please don't hammer me before I get to speak, roleclaim, etc. I wasn't permitted any final words at all in RMM2.
...I wasn't the best towine, though. And I know you to be a pretty good player.

You haven't answered the roleclaim thingy. I would have waited, and once the wagon got threatening, roleclaimed. What you did was a little jumpy.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #331 on: August 15, 2012, 07:35:18 pm »

Robz is at L-3.

Well, was.  L-4 now.  As I'm moving my vote to the one person who's been in hardcore lurk mode ever since things started to get serious (and who doesn't have a fried computer as an excuse).

Vote: Insomniac 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #332 on: August 15, 2012, 08:17:22 pm »

@Volt I am lurking a bit, mostly over commited, I answered peoples questions to me and I don't find the Robz vs abird to be a fruitful argument right now, Robz used his vote to apply pressure and unvoted when he got a response, I don't see that different from what anybody else does.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #333 on: August 15, 2012, 08:19:10 pm »

Who do you suspect, Ins?
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #334 on: August 15, 2012, 08:25:08 pm »

I don't have a lot of suspects at the moment to be honest with you it goes back to my being bad at day 1. In MVI I got a bit better because I flailed around blatantly accusing people for no reason and then ended up with a conclusion (theorel) which was correct, but I wasn't super certain of it till day 2 and well, I was dead then and I don't particularily want to die here so I'm trying a bit more of my MIV style where I was quiet (also got killed night 1).

If I had to pick someone to be suspicious of it would be axxle since he makes a lot of content-less posts. Gets called out on it, comes back and says yea I do have contentless posts and then continues to make posts that aren't very contentfull. I also am quite suspicious of the people who are constantly drawing attention to the Robz/Abirds argument and those on Robz train, and well hey thats Axxle again.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #335 on: August 15, 2012, 09:11:05 pm »

Heh, I've been sort of in hardcore lurk mode, I've read everything but haven't formed any new suspicions. My vote on Robz is meh but I don't have a better place for it.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #336 on: August 15, 2012, 09:11:32 pm »

Phone posting, but claiming badnes at day 1 is such a cop out.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #337 on: August 15, 2012, 09:30:07 pm »

"Badnes?"
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #338 on: August 15, 2012, 09:36:14 pm »

"Badnes?"
Badness as in poor play I'm sure. 

Dunno if he's responding to me, insom, or ftl though.  Maybe all of us?
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #339 on: August 15, 2012, 09:46:27 pm »

"Badnes?"
Badness as in poor play I'm sure. 

Dunno if he's responding to me, insom, or ftl though.  Maybe all of us?

Insomniac
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #340 on: August 15, 2012, 11:05:53 pm »

Vote Count
Galzria (1): angrybirds
Insomniac (2): Morgrim7, Voltgloss
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (5): O, ftl, Captain_Frisk, Axxle, Morgrim7
Axxle (4): Eevee, shraeye, Galzria, sparky5856
shraeye (1): yuma

not voting (2): shark_bait, Insomniac

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #341 on: August 16, 2012, 11:15:56 am »

@yuma.  Posts #248 and #265 are related. you can choose to look at them seperately, but the first one was a drunk/tired stream of consciousness rant, and the other is me helping with the tl;dr aspect of the first.  I'm not asking to be held unaccountable for the thoughts in #248, those are all thoughts I had. 
Drunk post:
1. My suspicion of Insomniac has waned, enough so that I'd rather vote for other people.  I haven't completely cleared Insomniac, he still was confusingly incorrect about something that seemed clear to me.  For now, I'm chalking it up to actual mistake.
2. Regarding ftl, #248 and #265 say the same thing, so if one seems to have more content, it's because I wrote it in a more alert state of mind.
3. I'm trying to say that I suspect a towntell is that we look very scared of voting for the wrong person. (I say will be, since I haven't got around to actually applying it yet).  And then I say it mightnot be, because if everyone looks equally scared or feigns this scaredness, that will really reduce it's usefulness down to zero.
4/5. Then I systematically try to check sparky's scumminess and unfortunately mid-post I reverse my position and end up not suspecting him.  If you think I end up with Sparky as main suspect, you read this wrong.  I was saying that, just like sparky does, I suspect Axxle the most.  Reasons appeared in #265.

Remaining thoughts on your post #327:
"maximum vagueness=maximum flexibility" is a standard I hope you and others hold everyone to.  If somebody is scum, we should not them get away with that flexibility.  People should be as clear as they can with their thoughts.
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You seem to be trying very hard to make sure that you are visible, that you are playing, but not leading or exciting anybody, long and frequent posts with minimal content accomplish this.
I am trying as hard as I can to make my thoughts visible.  That is because I think they are valuable and correct.  I wasn't the first on the Axxle train, but I'm ok with being the loudest there.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #342 on: August 16, 2012, 11:27:19 am »

@Axxle
Regardless I think all of this is less important than the continued unanswered 4-person accusations on Axxle.
How do you want me to respond? I haven't been that engaged, I haven't been providing much content.  I'll try to do better from now on.
One thing I want to know is why did the ftl miscount, and the Robz v. angrybirds look like more important issues than responding to suspicion put on you?
I'm not going to tell you the magic words that will clear my suspicion on you.  That would make any scum's job too easy.  I want you to acknowledge and respond as you will to accusations that have been put on you.  Look to #211, #236, #262, #267, #311.

Another question: When you were voting for Galz, you said that it was because he was "Overly wanting to appear doing pro-town things, without actually doing pro-town things."  If this is your scumtell, could you explain to me how it does not apply to your actions?
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #343 on: August 16, 2012, 12:22:17 pm »

If I had to pick someone to be suspicious of it would be axxle

And yet you don't vote him.  No confidence in your convictions?

Insom's response reads to me like scum wanting to push the Axxle wagon further but worried that casting the fifth vote will make him a lynch magnet in case Axxle flips town. 

I realize Insom's meta is "I suck at Day 1" but man, I don't think that's a meta we should encourage or accept.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #344 on: August 16, 2012, 01:15:10 pm »

If I had to pick someone to be suspicious of it would be axxle

And yet you don't vote him.  No confidence in your convictions?

Insom's response reads to me like scum wanting to push the Axxle wagon further but worried that casting the fifth vote will make him a lynch magnet in case Axxle flips town. 

I realize Insom's meta is "I suck at Day 1" but man, I don't think that's a meta we should encourage or accept.

If Insomniac were scum, why would he be worried about casting the fifth vote in case Axxle flips town?  There would be no "in case" because scum Insomniac would know that Axxle was town in that situation.

Now, scum Volt, knowing both Insomniac and Axxle were town, might write "in case", because he knows that town Insomniac doesn't actually know the alignment of Axxle, so would be worried about casting that vote "in case he flips town".

All that is to say:

Vote: Voltgloss for scumslip.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #345 on: August 16, 2012, 01:16:43 pm »

lolololol

If Insomniac were scum, why would he be worried about casting the fifth vote in case Axxle flips town?  There would be no "in case" because scum Insomniac would know that Axxle was town in that situation.

Galz, this game has a modconfirmed SK

Vote: Galzria
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #346 on: August 16, 2012, 01:18:28 pm »

Ahh, drat. unvote. I forgot which game this was. >.> There are likely two scumfactions, do that isn't as solid a tell.

Warning: Don't post when your mind is elsewhere.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #347 on: August 16, 2012, 02:10:33 pm »

lolololol

If Insomniac were scum, why would he be worried about casting the fifth vote in case Axxle flips town?  There would be no "in case" because scum Insomniac would know that Axxle was town in that situation.

Galz, this game has a modconfirmed SK

yeah.

If I had to pick someone to be suspicious of it would be axxle

And yet you don't vote him.  No confidence in your convictions?

Insom's response reads to me like scum wanting to push the Axxle wagon further but worried that casting the fifth vote will make him a lynch magnet in case Axxle flips town. 

I realize Insom's meta is "I suck at Day 1" but man, I don't think that's a meta we should encourage or accept.

That still doesn't answer this though. If Axxle were town, it would be good for the scum because, well, they survived the day. But it would be even better if a member from the other scum faction (or the SK himself) was lynched; this means (possibly) one less death during the night, which increases their chances of survival even further.

Lynching town when you're town yourself sucks much more though; you decrease your chances of survival because your side is dwindling. You could probably make a stronger argument for Insomniac not voting to lynch due to "lack of confidence" just in case someone was town, if Insomniac was town himself. But hey, it's an issue still worth clarifying by Insomniac.

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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #348 on: August 16, 2012, 02:13:09 pm »

@Axxle
Regardless I think all of this is less important than the continued unanswered 4-person accusations on Axxle.
How do you want me to respond? I haven't been that engaged, I haven't been providing much content.  I'll try to do better from now on.
One thing I want to know is why did the ftl miscount, and the Robz v. angrybirds look like more important issues than responding to suspicion put on you?
I'm not a fan of self-meta, but I'll use it anyway.  This is how I play town.  I usually ignore suspicion against me.  If try to scumhunt anyway because, hey, if I get lynched then we have the opinion of a confirmed town out there now.  If I spent the whole day trying to defend myself, I wouldn't help the town at all if I get lynched.
Quote
I'm not going to tell you the magic words that will clear my suspicion on you.  That would make any scum's job too easy.  I want you to acknowledge and respond as you will to accusations that have been put on you.  Look to #211, #236, #262, #267, #311.
Sure, I'll look into those.
Quote
Another question: When you were voting for Galz, you said that it was because he was "Overly wanting to appear doing pro-town things, without actually doing pro-town things."  If this is your scumtell, could you explain to me how it does not apply to your actions?
I'll look back at Galz's posts previous to that accusation and tell you what I meant at the time.


Ahh, drat. unvote. I forgot which game this was. >.> There are likely two scumfactions, do that isn't as solid a tell.

Warning: Don't post when your mind is elsewhere.
There are likely 3 scumfactions (incl SK)
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #349 on: August 16, 2012, 03:05:37 pm »


Encounter cards are discarded.

Reborn's second encounter begins.

Lightning uses his power to gain a token.

Mite plays Wild Lightning drawing 3 cards from the Cosmic deck.

Reborn collects a ship from the warp.

Pacifist plays Wild Reborn drawing a card from the Cosmic deck.

Leaving a window for Zaps and other COs
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #350 on: August 16, 2012, 03:08:12 pm »


Encounter cards are discarded.

Reborn's second encounter begins.

Lightning uses his power to gain a token.

Mite plays Wild Lightning drawing 3 cards from the Cosmic deck.

Reborn collects a ship from the warp.

Pacifist plays Wild Reborn drawing a card from the Cosmic deck.

Leaving a window for Zaps and other COs


Your shame shall be forever recorded. ;)
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #351 on: August 16, 2012, 03:11:38 pm »

What is this?  It sounds more fun than the game we are playing.  Are we playing bastard cosmic encounter?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #352 on: August 16, 2012, 03:11:54 pm »


Encounter cards are discarded.

Reborn's second encounter begins.

Lightning uses his power to gain a token.

Mite plays Wild Lightning drawing 3 cards from the Cosmic deck.

Reborn collects a ship from the warp.

Pacifist plays Wild Reborn drawing a card from the Cosmic deck.

Leaving a window for Zaps and other COs


Your shame shall be forever recorded. ;)
Lol
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #353 on: August 17, 2012, 04:21:27 am »

I believe Grujah will be subbing in for shark_bait soon.

thoughts: should i move up the deadline? this day seems to be going pretty slowly. maybe just prod some folks?
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she/her

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #354 on: August 17, 2012, 04:36:57 am »

I think that the whole Dark Ages thing has taken its toll. I know I've been active around the forums, but I keep coming back here and being like reread... ok have to say something... OH WAIT BUT WHAT IF YOU COUNTERFEIT A COUNTERFEIT back to Previews forum!

When's the deadline here?

Unvote
Vote: O
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #355 on: August 17, 2012, 04:37:49 am »

Prods never hurt anyone, unless they're cattle prods. Send 'em out!
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #356 on: August 17, 2012, 04:38:53 am »

Hi?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #357 on: August 17, 2012, 09:18:44 am »

Yeah, everything seems to be at a crawl right now, but then f.DS has never been good at making D1 move... And DA + Goko aren't helping.

Vote: Axxle because I forgot to revote yesterday after my brainfart.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #358 on: August 17, 2012, 02:04:09 pm »

I'm all caught up on current ideas, and still hot on Axxle.  So I really have no new posts to add until other people start talking.  Moving up the deadline wouldn't make me upset.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #359 on: August 17, 2012, 02:12:39 pm »

On top of everything else that's been said re: Axxle - on reread, I do not at all like how he egged on the Robz/Abirds blowup.  I really don't see any substantive scumminess there from either Abirds or Robz - and yet there's Axxle trying to fan the flames.

Vote: Axxle

Waiting to hear from you, man. 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #360 on: August 17, 2012, 02:14:06 pm »

Can we get a vote count? Although these mega games (especially ones with sick roles) do start going smoother after we see one night, so just slogging through day 1 sounds good to me. Axxle-lynch and onto day 2, I say!
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #361 on: August 17, 2012, 02:20:18 pm »

I think this is right:

Unofficial Vote Count

Galzria (1): angrybirds
Insomniac (1): Morgrim7
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (4): O, Captain_Frisk, Axxle, Morgrim7
Axxle (5): Eevee, shraeye, Galzria, sparky5856, Voltgloss
shraeye (1): yuma
O (1): ftl

not voting (2): shark_bait, Insomniac
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #362 on: August 17, 2012, 02:20:49 pm »

...that can't be right Morgrim is in two places at once.  Um.

But I think it's right re: Axxle at least.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #363 on: August 17, 2012, 02:23:23 pm »

OK, this looks better.

Unofficial Vote Count

Galzria (1): angrybirds
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (4): O, Captain_Frisk, Axxle, Morgrim7
Axxle (5): Eevee, shraeye, Galzria, sparky5856, Voltgloss
shraeye (1): yuma
O (1): ftl

not voting (3): shark_bait, Insomniac, Robz888
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #364 on: August 17, 2012, 02:26:58 pm »

I think I'll add my vote to Axxle. Vote: Axxle

As Volt said, I also didn't like how he engaged me and Abirds. It looks like people are agreeing with me that that was a weird thing to harp on--me voting to gauge info, etc. It's something everybody does. I'm willing to spot O and Morgrim the usual character defenses, even though I am loath to do it for Morgrim again... he's just never actually mafia when we lynch him. And I have a less scummy read on Frisk than I do on Axxle, rest of the game considered, and it looks like we're moving toward an Axxle lynch. So that's fine.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #365 on: August 17, 2012, 02:28:18 pm »

I think I'll add my vote to Axxle. Vote: Axxle

As Volt said, I also didn't like how he engaged me and Abirds. It looks like people are agreeing with me that that was a weird thing to harp on--me voting to gauge info, etc. It's something everybody does. I'm willing to spot O and Morgrim the usual character defenses, even though I am loath to do it for Morgrim again... he's just never actually mafia when we lynch him. And I have a less scummy read on Frisk than I do on Axxle, rest of the game considered, and it looks like we're moving toward an Axxle lynch. So that's fine.

What are we going to do when the game comes and Morgrim IS Mafia?  ??? Just let him beat us all and laugh about it later? ;D
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #366 on: August 17, 2012, 02:32:12 pm »

I think I'll add my vote to Axxle. Vote: Axxle

As Volt said, I also didn't like how he engaged me and Abirds. It looks like people are agreeing with me that that was a weird thing to harp on--me voting to gauge info, etc. It's something everybody does. I'm willing to spot O and Morgrim the usual character defenses, even though I am loath to do it for Morgrim again... he's just never actually mafia when we lynch him. And I have a less scummy read on Frisk than I do on Axxle, rest of the game considered, and it looks like we're moving toward an Axxle lynch. So that's fine.

What are we going to do when the game comes and Morgrim IS Mafia?  ??? Just let him beat us all and laugh about it later? ;D

Nah ya lynch him if it gets close enough lol besides isn't the stat something like lynch town morgrim town wins?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #367 on: August 17, 2012, 02:33:45 pm »

I think I'll add my vote to Axxle. Vote: Axxle

As Volt said, I also didn't like how he engaged me and Abirds. It looks like people are agreeing with me that that was a weird thing to harp on--me voting to gauge info, etc. It's something everybody does. I'm willing to spot O and Morgrim the usual character defenses, even though I am loath to do it for Morgrim again... he's just never actually mafia when we lynch him. And I have a less scummy read on Frisk than I do on Axxle, rest of the game considered, and it looks like we're moving toward an Axxle lynch. So that's fine.

What are we going to do when the game comes and Morgrim IS Mafia?  ??? Just let him beat us all and laugh about it later? ;D

Nah ya lynch him if it gets close enough lol besides isn't the stat something like lynch town morgrim town wins?

It's a lie. M-II would like to talk to you.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #368 on: August 17, 2012, 02:34:05 pm »

What are we going to do when the game comes and Morgrim IS Mafia?  ??? Just let him beat us all and laugh about it later? ;D

Wait for him to claim simultaneous cop/rolecop   ::)
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #369 on: August 17, 2012, 02:34:29 pm »

I think I'll add my vote to Axxle. Vote: Axxle

As Volt said, I also didn't like how he engaged me and Abirds. It looks like people are agreeing with me that that was a weird thing to harp on--me voting to gauge info, etc. It's something everybody does. I'm willing to spot O and Morgrim the usual character defenses, even though I am loath to do it for Morgrim again... he's just never actually mafia when we lynch him. And I have a less scummy read on Frisk than I do on Axxle, rest of the game considered, and it looks like we're moving toward an Axxle lynch. So that's fine.

What are we going to do when the game comes and Morgrim IS Mafia?  ??? Just let him beat us all and laugh about it later? ;D

Morgrim is someone we don't want anywhere near lylo.

Going to lunch in about an hour should be able to post more then.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #370 on: August 17, 2012, 02:35:51 pm »

I think I'll add my vote to Axxle. Vote: Axxle

As Volt said, I also didn't like how he engaged me and Abirds. It looks like people are agreeing with me that that was a weird thing to harp on--me voting to gauge info, etc. It's something everybody does. I'm willing to spot O and Morgrim the usual character defenses, even though I am loath to do it for Morgrim again... he's just never actually mafia when we lynch him. And I have a less scummy read on Frisk than I do on Axxle, rest of the game considered, and it looks like we're moving toward an Axxle lynch. So that's fine.

What are we going to do when the game comes and Morgrim IS Mafia?  ??? Just let him beat us all and laugh about it later? ;D

Nah ya lynch him if it gets close enough lol besides isn't the stat something like lynch town morgrim town wins?

It's a lie. M-II would like to talk to you.

I try to forget I lost that game  ::)
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #371 on: August 17, 2012, 02:38:50 pm »

I don't like the Axxle wagon at all. Robz, I think definitely you were in the right in your spat with Axxle, but you weren't like, so overwhelmingly in the right that anybody seeing it differently must be scum. Can you give more reasons for the vote?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #372 on: August 17, 2012, 02:59:33 pm »

I don't like the Axxle wagon at all. Robz, I think definitely you were in the right in your spat with Axxle, but you weren't like, so overwhelmingly in the right that anybody seeing it differently must be scum. Can you give more reasons for the vote?

Sure. I mean, I think I was totally in the right, but I was considerably lurking, so I accept Volt's vote for me as entirely just. And O does his thing, and so does Morgrim, so whatever, that's fine. I try to look at how people behave, if it is in keeping with their behavior as town in previous games. So those are, you know, I think they're wrong, but it's okay. Ftl at least gave some reasoning, and it made clear that I wasn't the only person looking more suspicious to him.

But when I explained things to Axxle, he did unvote, saying he needed to pay better attention. Then he immediately revoted:

Vote: Angrybirds. I will unvote you if you explain to me exactly why you are not mafia, who you think is mafia, and tell us something unique about Yuma, your twinclaim. Yuma is one mafia who always evades us.
Response
A little jumpy?

Backlash

Yeah, okay, really going to focus on this game more. And just in time! A little wagon is building against me.

It looks to me like O and Axxle voted for me because they didn't like my response to angrybirds?

I agree that he did exactly what I asked. I didn't have any problem with his response to my questions--which were just attempting to generate info on a new player I know nothing about anyway. I said, "Jumpy are we?" because he said that I looked more suspicious to him. As far as I can tell, his reason for being suspicious of me was that I had asked him these questions and voted for him. That's textbook OMGUS suspicion, isn't it?

Really, though, I don't think he's scummy. He's just an eager newbie who thought that the right thing to do when someone went after you a bit was to return the favor. So Unvote. But to be clear, I said he was jumpy because he reacted to me voting/questioning him by saying that I was suspicious. Which is jumpy, right?

I'm not quite sure why that caused O and Axxle to vote for me. Well, my cynical answer is that O is just being O, and Axxle wanted to get a wagon going that wasn't his own.

Robz.  Why did you not unvote immediately?  Saying "Jumpy are we?" sounds like a way of trying to get more people to vote for him without explicitly calling out for it.  A scumtell in my book.

Revote: Robz

Um, I didn't unvote immediately because it was one vote, the only vote on this guy? And I was trying to get info out of him? And I don't see how my line about "jumpy are we" is an instance of the thing Axxle is explaining, nor is the thing Axxle is explaining necessarily a scumtell.

Admittedly, this is far from the most sure I've ever been on a Day 1 lynch, and no Day 1 lynch is ever correct. I was lurking--my fault, crazy week, moved to DC--and then I found myself playing defense over a vote and a comment that frankly surprised me it took so much heat. So the best I can do is focus on this little wagon against myself, and note that Axxle is the one on it who is definitely the most scum-looking. And other people have voted him for that reason and other reasons, so it seems worth to vote there. But, I can understand not liking the Axxle wagon. Day 1 with so many people is tough stuff. Everybody tends to run together.

For instance, has Sharky been replaced here? I'm okay with taking the still-hardcore lurkers to task. I think it's probably way too easy to disappear entirely from view in this game on Day 1. We don't want to let anybody slide by entirely undetected.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #373 on: August 17, 2012, 03:11:40 pm »

I think Grujah will be replacing sharky, but not sure when.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #374 on: August 17, 2012, 03:32:09 pm »

Need reply and conf and role from cayvie.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #375 on: August 17, 2012, 05:02:27 pm »

One theory that I developed over the years that may be completely bonkers is that longer posts = pro-town.
At least on mafiascum, walls of text are scumtells.
Quote
It means that you're putting more effort into protecting the good guys. With mafia, it's hard to do that. Moreover, if mafia just try to disprove anyone whenever the opportunity presents itself, instead of putting their thoughts into one specific issue (because maybe it makes them look uncomfortable? the heart of the issue is that they're mafia maybe?), it gives them more room into faking innocence. Someone who fits this bill perfectly, is Axxle. His posts seem to be all over the map, and they don't add much. Perhaps he always plays like that?
Yes, I tend to be very fluid with my vote Day 1.
Quote
And I have yet to see him answer this question:

I guess Morgrim mentioned that Galz looked real scummy because
He's been awfully quiet, (something he doesn't normally do) and when he does say something, its like this:
I apologize for the delay. I'm trying to get caught up everywhere but I'm exhausted. I see I have 4 votes on me? Exciting times! Still, those of you waiting for answers will need to wait a little bit longer. I need to catch some Zzz's (and trust me, they've been elusive). Luckily, other games should be moving into Night soon, so I should have time to catch up on all (...8? >.>) pages here tomorrow.

Is this the reason that he looked scummy to you ftl?  Or was it really just because you wanted there to be a bandwagon?  What was the reason for your vote, Axxle?  Is there really something to that Lie Detector role?  I wonder if there's something I've missed but I have only the neutralest of reads on Galz so far.  Hey Galz, post more!
The reason I gave was that he was trying to be protown, but wasn't.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'd like to see more (serious) engagement from him.
Sure.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Appears to be posting just for the sake of not lurking. I feel he isnt helping town as much as he could.
So you admit that I *am* helping the town?

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Galz put FoS on Axxle, and Axxle has not yet responded to this.  Bury instead of respond?  Here's not letting that work.
No, just didn't think it needed responding to.  His FOS was about me not posting a lot, and I really wasn't posting a lot.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Our case on Axxle is what?  Not very engaged? 

No, my current case on him is his way of redirecting heat.  At the most recent votecount he had 5 votes (that's the most for 1 person so far), and although ftl peels off of him, I would still be worried in his place.  But instead of spending any post-time on himself, Axxle starts prodding at the Robz v. angrybirds nonconflict, seemingly purposely misinterpreting it to make it bigger than it was.  This is the exact thing that happened the first time heat pointed at him.  Galz said he got the worst vibe from Axxle so far (i talked about this in 267), and Axxle immediately jumps over ftl for miscounting things.

Eevee's read on Axxle is that he's not helping town, but still posting(#262).  He's posting a lot, his post count is only bested by ftl.  That's crazy considering that he hasn't done much that seemed productive to me.  The few times he threw his weight around were the above cited times when it felt more like heat-redirecting to me.

Sparky contends that Axxle is really into disproving anyone when the opportunity presents itself instead of really focusing on one issue. (#211 for a more detailed description by sparky)

Galz (#236) cites lack of content in Axxles posts, and lack of the driven scumhunting that he was expecting.  I don't think any of us have main points that Axxle simply isn't engaged.  He's engaged, I feel; but, he's focused on completely the wrong things.

I'm really not that engaged.  The reason why I'm focusing on the Galz/Angrybirds situation is that it was the most recent scummy thing to I saw after I started to become more engaged.  It's *hard* to go over this thread again with any kind of schedule.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #376 on: August 17, 2012, 05:04:22 pm »

or is the thing Axxle is explaining necessarily a scumtell.
But in this case it is because you're scum.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #377 on: August 17, 2012, 06:22:23 pm »

I read walls of text as towntells.. but yours still looked scummy to me.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #378 on: August 17, 2012, 09:25:15 pm »

I know, I know you'd never steal, Jack.


Hi, shark_bait here! Now, can anyone fill me in on what's happening?
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #379 on: August 17, 2012, 09:37:38 pm »

vote: yuma

You can never trust a yuma.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #380 on: August 17, 2012, 11:33:04 pm »

All right folks - goko mania took hold of me today - and I couldn't bring myself to dedicate the time to catch up - will do so first thing tomorrow AM.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #381 on: August 17, 2012, 11:38:24 pm »

Couldn't look away from the train wreck?

(won't this be confusing)
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #382 on: August 18, 2012, 01:39:46 pm »

No posts in this game for a day! FOS: everyone...

OK, stream-of-consciousness big list post in a minute. Having a hard time designing a narrative to capture what's going on in this game.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #383 on: August 18, 2012, 01:51:04 pm »

1. Insomniac - I did not totally follow the suggest-we-suit-claim incident, but as I believe I said at the time, I don't think Insomniac's behavior was anti-town (even though suit-claiming is bad). He's been pretty absent lately.

2. Voltgloss - strong town read. Really appreciate how he has kept the conversation alive, which is what's killing this town.

3. Captain_Frisk - scum read. Morgrim-bashes, which is a scumtell since Frisk knows how Morgrim acts. When I call him out on it, he argues sarcastically, waits a while, then unvotes, saying it was just an RVS vote. Now lurking. My vote remains on him.

4. shark_bait/ Grujah - Grujah wants it to be RVS all over again even though the game's been going on for a week. Light scum read.

5. Eevee - no read. Unlike eevee to post so little, but there's so much noise.

6. Robz888 - light town read. I've already explained my position on him elsewhere.

7. O - barely realize he's in this game, which gives me a light scum read. I also disagreed with his vote on Robz.

8. yuma - doing hard detective work, although I disagreed with his reads.

9. ftl - I already explained my position on the "fifth vote" issue. Neutral to town read.

10. Galzria - very town. Could be more helpful.

11. shraeye - very town.

12. angrybirds - I did not get a scum read on Robz off the Robz/angrybirds fight. I did get a town read off AB though.

13. sparky5856 - very town, although I confuse sparky and shraeye which is bad.

14. Morgrim7 - Morgrim being Morgrim. Wish he would post more.

15. Axxle - I believe I addressed the Axxlewagon above and there are no new developments.

16. ehunt - hi.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #384 on: August 18, 2012, 01:55:01 pm »

4. shark_bait/ Grujah - Grujah wants it to be RVS all over again even though the game's been going on for a week. Light scum read.

I won't read 16 pages of previous stuff. I will read anything from my first post on. I have nothing strong to vote. If you want, you can give me quotes/numbers of most important posts (anyone can).
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #385 on: August 18, 2012, 03:22:09 pm »

VOTE: EHUNT for a long contentless post.

"I disagreed with his vote on Robz" --> Provides no reason for disagreeing, hell, he doesn't even seem to know why I voted for robz.
FOSing a replace-in because he's "not out of RVS yet" when nobody is really out of RVS yet.


And finally, a bunch of "very town's" without justification suggests buddying up to people.

Inb4zomgitsOMGUS.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #386 on: August 18, 2012, 03:34:13 pm »

4. shark_bait/ Grujah - Grujah wants it to be RVS all over again even though the game's been going on for a week. Light scum read.

I won't read 16 pages of previous stuff. I will read anything from my first post on. I have nothing strong to vote. If you want, you can give me quotes/numbers of most important posts (anyone can).
I suggest looking at the current vote count, Ctrl-F'ing to see where people voted and why they voted.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #387 on: August 18, 2012, 03:50:43 pm »

Hey Grujah, here's my summary.  I've got a list of the order votes have been made in (vote re-affirmations aren't listed).  Sometimes the timing of the votes can be interesting but I haven't recorded it. (R) indicates a vote that seemed very RVS to me.  Names are abbreviated.  Colored vote are current votes.
History
Frisk->Morgrim (R)
Axxle->Eevee (R)
Insom->Axxle (R)
ftl->Galzria (R)
shraeye->Morg (R)
yuma->angry (R)
Insom->yuma
ftl->Morg
O->Frisk (R)
Morg->Frisk (R)
angry->Shraeye (R)
O->Galz
ftl->Axxle
Volt->ehunt (R)
angry->Galz
yuma->shark/G
Axxle->Galz
ftl->Galz
shraeye->Insom
Volt->Insom
Morg->Insom
ehunt->Frisk
O->Volt
Axxle->ftl
Volt->Robz
Robz->angry
Eevee->Axxle
sparky->shark/G
shraeye->Axxle
ftl->Axxle
Galz->Axxle
sparky->Axxle
O->Robz
Axxle->Robz
yuma->shraeye
ftl->Robz
Frisk->robz
Morg->Robz
Volt->Insom
Galz->Volt
Volt->Galz
ftl->O (R)
Galz->Axxle
Volt->Axxle
Robz->Axxle
Grujah->yuma (R)
O->ehunt

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but that's too much text to post it twice.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #388 on: August 18, 2012, 03:59:03 pm »

Also, here are posts I found interesting along with my short summary of it to remind myself.  Some of these have been discussed loudly and often, some maybe not at all.  These are just the things about other people that I for some reason wanted to remember at the time. 

#45/#50 Voltgloss wants suitclaims, explains in #109, sounds good
#49 ftl assumes there are only Mafia/town, explains in #150/#158
#51 Axxle assumes there are only Mafia/town, answers in #149
#63 Insomgate #157, #162, #247
#83 sparky thinks major arcana should claim as such, explains at #100
#117 angrybirds makes an unusual vote on Galz, explains in #147/#235
#156 ehunt somewhat defends Insom
#175 Eevee suggests we would know if someone No-killed
#176 sparky goes off on bad math, accuses Insom/protects insom (no switch)
#204 Galz defends self
#236 Galz suspects Axxle, so does eevee #262, so does sparky #211
#237 ftl miscounts
#245 ehunts 5th-vote argument
#292 Axxle contradicts self (#284) in heat-redirect
#308 Frisk doesn't understand Axxlevotes, says Robzv.Angry ended too quickly
#317 Axxle votes Robz for not ending soon enough
#334 Insom suspects Axxle, doesn't vote; #343 Volt calls him out
#371 ehunt doesn't like Axxle-wagon
#383 ehunt says all his +/- thoughts
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #389 on: August 18, 2012, 04:03:46 pm »

VOTE: EHUNT for a long contentless post.

"I disagreed with his vote on Robz" --> Provides no reason for disagreeing, hell, he doesn't even seem to know why I voted for robz.
FOSing a replace-in because he's "not out of RVS yet" when nobody is really out of RVS yet.


And finally, a bunch of "very town's" without justification suggests buddying up to people.

Inb4zomgitsOMGUS.
Phone post.

I explained my position on your Robz vote earlier. (I may not have addressed you by name, just criticized the Robzwagon.)
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #390 on: August 18, 2012, 04:08:52 pm »

Quote
Robz's absence from earlier is due to well-documented V/LAness. His hard press on angrybirds, followed by his backing off, does not strike me as scummy at all. It's very typical day one play for anyone, especially for Robz. I don't understand why he's got so many votes.

You call that an explanation? I can't imagine why you think random hard presses without basis typical day one play for anyone.

Unless you're saying Robz action was RVS action, in which case, why are you FOSing Grujah?

Finally, you ignored my "very town" point. 
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #391 on: August 18, 2012, 04:17:02 pm »

Quote
Robz's absence from earlier is due to well-documented V/LAness. His hard press on angrybirds, followed by his backing off, does not strike me as scummy at all. It's very typical day one play for anyone, especially for Robz. I don't understand why he's got so many votes.

You call that an explanation? I can't imagine why you think random hard presses without basis typical day one play for anyone.

Unless you're saying Robz action was RVS action, in which case, why are you FOSing Grujah?

Finally, you ignored my "very town" point.

I think those folks are very town. Would you rather that I lie? Nobody posted for a day, so I listed my thoughts.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #392 on: August 18, 2012, 04:41:36 pm »

eHunt, you voted for CF for voting for Morgrim, but you have CF's vote for Morgrim listed as RVS.  What's your reasoning here?
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #393 on: August 18, 2012, 04:47:14 pm »

eHunt, you voted for CF for voting for Morgrim, but you have CF's vote for Morgrim listed as RVS.  What's your reasoning here?

Are you confusing me with Shraeye?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #394 on: August 18, 2012, 04:56:28 pm »

vote: Captain_Frisk. Morgrim-hunting is a scumtell.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #395 on: August 18, 2012, 05:18:57 pm »

No, I mean the "listed as rvs" part is something shraeye did, not me.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #396 on: August 18, 2012, 05:19:20 pm »

Quote
Robz's absence from earlier is due to well-documented V/LAness. His hard press on angrybirds, followed by his backing off, does not strike me as scummy at all. It's very typical day one play for anyone, especially for Robz. I don't understand why he's got so many votes.

You call that an explanation? I can't imagine why you think random hard presses without basis typical day one play for anyone.

Unless you're saying Robz action was RVS action, in which case, why are you FOSing Grujah?

Finally, you ignored my "very town" point.

I think those folks are very town. Would you rather that I lie? Nobody posted for a day, so I listed my thoughts.
...and I like that. I think I will.

1. Insomniac: Still a little scummy, not so bad. Lurking, though.
2. Voltgloss: Same as eHunt
3. Captain_Frisk: Vote for me is scummy, but I think it was all in jest.
4. Grujah: meh. No idea.
5. Eevee: lurking
6. Robz888: Scum for reasons stated earlier.
7. O: No read
8. yuma: meh no read
9. ftl: smae as eHunt
10. Galzria: probably town
11. shraeye: geez he confuses me
12. angrybirds: town, maybe
13. sparky5856: townish
14. Morgrim7: Obvscum.  ;) :D
15. Axxle: Axxle being Axxle
16. ehunt: Town. really like how he posted his thoughts.
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #397 on: August 18, 2012, 05:23:35 pm »

No, I mean the "listed as rvs" part is something shraeye did, not me.
Oh, yes.  I did mix that up.

@shraeye: You're giving us lots of info.  Why aren't you asking questions about it? Why didn't you ask eHunt the question I asked him?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #398 on: August 18, 2012, 05:26:27 pm »

Also, you seem to be tunneling me, whether maliciously as scum, or accidentally as town, I don't know.  But most of this is very much centered around me:

Also, here are posts I found interesting along with my short summary of it to remind myself.  Some of these have been discussed loudly and often, some maybe not at all.  These are just the things about other people that I for some reason wanted to remember at the time. 

#45/#50 Voltgloss wants suitclaims, explains in #109, sounds good
#49 ftl assumes there are only Mafia/town, explains in #150/#158
#51 Axxle assumes there are only Mafia/town, answers in #149
#63 Insomgate #157, #162, #247
#83 sparky thinks major arcana should claim as such, explains at #100
#117 angrybirds makes an unusual vote on Galz, explains in #147/#235
#156 ehunt somewhat defends Insom
#175 Eevee suggests we would know if someone No-killed
#176 sparky goes off on bad math, accuses Insom/protects insom (no switch)
#204 Galz defends self
#236 Galz suspects Axxle, so does eevee #262, so does sparky #211
#237 ftl miscounts
#245 ehunts 5th-vote argument
#292 Axxle contradicts self (#284) in heat-redirect
#308 Frisk doesn't understand Axxlevotes, says Robzv.Angry ended too quickly
#317 Axxle votes Robz for not ending soon enough
#334 Insom suspects Axxle, doesn't vote; #343 Volt calls him out
#371 ehunt doesn't like Axxle-wagon
#383 ehunt says all his +/- thoughts
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #399 on: August 18, 2012, 05:52:11 pm »

No, I mean the "listed as rvs" part is something shraeye did, not me.

Yeah, RVS was totally my interpretation of it.  Don't attribute that to other players.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #400 on: August 18, 2012, 06:04:23 pm »

@shraeye: You're giving us lots of info.  Why aren't you asking questions about it? Why didn't you ask eHunt the question I asked him?
I'm not sure what question you asked eHunt here, could you reask it?

I actually have asked about some/most of these observations; and for others, I simply watched as others asked exactly what I was curious about.  Ask me about something specific in the list if you want and I'll explain/clarify.

Also, you seem to be tunneling me, whether maliciously as scum, or accidentally as town, I don't know.  But most of this is very much centered around me:
This is true.  I posted this info to help speed Grujah up on our game a bit, but also as a way for others to see my thinking (a la ehunt/morgrim but not in their same style).  This analysis should obviously be looked at with awareness that I focused on Insomniac first, toyed with sparky being scum second, and am now feeling very sure that Axxle is the one to lynch.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #401 on: August 18, 2012, 06:05:51 pm »

Also, you seem to be tunneling me, whether maliciously as scum, or accidentally as town, I don't know.  But most of this is very much centered around me:

Vote: Axxle every time I have seen this equivalent sentence said it has been by scum.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #402 on: August 18, 2012, 07:30:40 pm »

Also, you seem to be tunneling me, whether maliciously as scum, or accidentally as town, I don't know.  But most of this is very much centered around me:

Vote: Axxle every time I have seen this equivalent sentence said it has been by scum.
Every time I've said something equivalent I've been town.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #403 on: August 18, 2012, 10:23:32 pm »

Quote
Robz's absence from earlier is due to well-documented V/LAness. His hard press on angrybirds, followed by his backing off, does not strike me as scummy at all. It's very typical day one play for anyone, especially for Robz. I don't understand why he's got so many votes.

You call that an explanation? I can't imagine why you think random hard presses without basis typical day one play for anyone.

Unless you're saying Robz action was RVS action, in which case, why are you FOSing Grujah?

Finally, you ignored my "very town" point.

I think those folks are very town. Would you rather that I lie? Nobody posted for a day, so I listed my thoughts.
...and I like that. I think I will.

1. Insomniac: Still a little scummy, not so bad. Lurking, though.
2. Voltgloss: Same as eHunt
3. Captain_Frisk: Vote for me is scummy, but I think it was all in jest.
4. Grujah: meh. No idea.
5. Eevee: lurking
6. Robz888: Scum for reasons stated earlier.
7. O: No read
8. yuma: meh no read
9. ftl: smae as eHunt
10. Galzria: probably town
11. shraeye: geez he confuses me
12. angrybirds: town, maybe
13. sparky5856: townish
14. Morgrim7: Obvscum.  ;) :D
15. Axxle: Axxle being Axxle
16. ehunt: Town. really like how he posted his thoughts.

Town Morgrim has never made one of these before.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #404 on: August 18, 2012, 10:26:25 pm »

Actually, it was rare that townGrim ever actually posted his opinion on anyone, he was always "good enough for me" kinda guy.

So, Morg, why are you suddenly making a big leap from sheeping other people's reads to making your own?


(ok, I know that MorgHunting isn't really useful, but this is a different Morg, it seems)
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #405 on: August 19, 2012, 12:07:19 am »

Actually, it was rare that townGrim ever actually posted his opinion on anyone, he was always "good enough for me" kinda guy.

So, Morg, why are you suddenly making a big leap from sheeping other people's reads to making your own?


(ok, I know that MorgHunting isn't really useful, but this is a different Morg, it seems)
People want me to post more. And, because I am town, I should do what the town wants me to do. (It also helps me improve my mafai play! :)
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #406 on: August 19, 2012, 12:33:14 am »

Actually, it was rare that townGrim ever actually posted his opinion on anyone, he was always "good enough for me" kinda guy.

So, Morg, why are you suddenly making a big leap from sheeping other people's reads to making your own?


(ok, I know that MorgHunting isn't really useful, but this is a different Morg, it seems)
People want me to post more. And, because I am town, I should do what the town wants me to do. (It also helps me improve my mafai play! :)
Mafia slip
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #407 on: August 19, 2012, 12:44:56 am »

Really, axxle? Looking for mafia slips in Morgrim misspeaking words is a scumtell!

Vote: Axxle
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #408 on: August 19, 2012, 12:55:07 am »

Really, axxle? Looking for mafia slips in Morgrim misspeaking words is a scumtell!

Vote: Axxle
Vote: ftl for not realizing it was with 90% probability a joke.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #409 on: August 19, 2012, 03:12:16 am »

Really, axxle? Looking for mafia slips in Morgrim misspeaking words is a scumtell!

Vote: Axxle
Vote: ftl for not realizing it was with 90% probability a joke.
if serious itd have vote
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #410 on: August 19, 2012, 09:51:14 am »

Even if you think morg suddenly making lists and stuff means he is scum, dont vote for him yet. We really font want to discourage that behavior!

Oh and ehunt, the reason I post too little is just that the town is soo huge, especially when poaying in multiple games, its o hard to even remember everyone let alone take good reads. I do agree its very unlike me to play like this. I promise try to get more active!
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #411 on: August 19, 2012, 11:15:43 am »

Lol @ eevee - if he is scum, don't vote for him, cuz he plays town scum.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #412 on: August 19, 2012, 12:33:29 pm »

Keep up the good work Morgrim!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #413 on: August 19, 2012, 01:38:17 pm »

Lol @ eevee - if he is scum, don't vote for him, cuz he plays town scum.
obviously not what i meant.

if a lot of people insta-vote you for doing something, how likely are you to do it again?
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #414 on: August 19, 2012, 01:43:18 pm »

it's depressing how little we've progressed in this game.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #415 on: August 19, 2012, 01:49:19 pm »

Lol @ eevee - if he is scum, don't vote for him, cuz he plays town scum.
obviously not what i meant.

if a lot of people insta-vote you for doing something, how likely are you to do it again?

Dude, I am smarter than to go Morgrim hunting now, don't worry about the guy  ;D
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #416 on: August 19, 2012, 02:58:39 pm »

Back:

I don't agree with the Axxle wagon, nor do I like the Robz wagon that was forming.

I am still getting the same read from shraeye, but it appears that no one agrees with me... voltgloss mentioned getting a similar vibe a while back but I don't think I have seen anything else since then... added to that is shraeye's vote for Axxle.

As such, I am keeping my vote on shraeye, but could be persuaded to vote elsewhere, but unless something drastic changes, not for Axxle or Robz. I just dont' see the scumminess that everyone else is so sure about.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #417 on: August 19, 2012, 03:06:32 pm »

Oh ok if it was a joke then unvote
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #418 on: August 19, 2012, 05:41:44 pm »

Hey everyone, sorry I haven't been as active recently. The deadline is in a few days am I correct? It's been a while since I've thoroughly checked this thread, so let me go back on yuma's vote post on shraeye. I'll also have some new ideas that disagree with my old ones, since it's been a few days.

Quote
The person who does seem most mafia to me is actually the complete opposite of my previous post, and disagrees with a couple other townspeople.

vote: shraeye

With all of the voting toward lurkers--both in this game and in others--it seem to me that mafia members would be very aware of not lurking. shraeye seems to have an astute enough mind to recognize this and is doing everything to make sure (she/he?) isn't put into the lurker category. I don't buy all of the long, long posts as evidence of town, but perhaps instead is evidence of covering up being mafia.

But Volt wanted votes, so there is mine

And recalling back at this...

O, post more! I haven't heard from you in 3.5 days!
sharkbait, post more! I haven't heard from you in 3 days!
sparky, post more!
Robz, post more!
Eevee, post more!
angrybirds, post more!
You all have only 7 posts by my count.  And actually sharkbait has only 5.

Galz!! Respond to angrybirds!
i am going to vote:Galzeria because he is playing just like a person who wants us to think he is town
i am going to keep my vote on him   at least until he responds and i can see a little bit more of him before i change my mind about anything

Here shraeye makes it exceptionally clear implicitly that he is against lurkers, and he has shown that he's not one himself.

It's only Day 1, so this won't matter now, but here's a thought. shraeye is on the Axxle bandwagon now. Someone who's as outspoken as shraeye is will have a strong impact on the final lynch. This means that if you're mafia, you can continuously steer the town towards the wrong direction. I say this thought doesn't matter now because we don't know if this is the case. But if Axxle ends up being town, it's a thought to consider. I actually am much less certain now that Axxle is scum. He played with a different style in Mafia I, and he was scum then. I dunno, that was a while ago, so idk if that can apply.

Quote
I'm not a fan of self-meta, but I'll use it anyway.  This is how I play town.  I usually ignore suspicion against me.  If try to scumhunt anyway because, hey, if I get lynched then we have the opinion of a confirmed town out there now.  If I spent the whole day trying to defend myself, I wouldn't help the town at all if I get lynched.

yuma's development is interesting (because it's newer and goes against most of what is going on at the moment). I think more people should respond to him. so now my thoughts on shraeye are unknown. To make it more certain that people will discuss this and less likely that the day will end suddenly, UNVOTE: Axxle.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #419 on: August 19, 2012, 06:32:43 pm »

A few days 'till deadline

No major wagons that have taken off

therefore, mafia among lurkers/nonvoters.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #420 on: August 19, 2012, 06:39:07 pm »

A few days 'till deadline

No major wagons that have taken off

therefore, mafia among lurkers/nonvoters.

Seems like a solid plan...wait a tick...
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #421 on: August 19, 2012, 06:40:23 pm »

Basically everybody is a lurker at this point...
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #422 on: August 19, 2012, 08:07:13 pm »

Deadline is in 4 days.  I suggest everyone vote for me or Robz or give us a new lynch target so we don't quicklynch someone because of a late roleclaim.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #423 on: August 19, 2012, 08:32:55 pm »

Deadline is in 4 days.  I suggest everyone vote for me or Robz or give us a new lynch target so we don't quicklynch someone because of a late roleclaim.

shraeye
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #424 on: August 19, 2012, 08:48:59 pm »

A few days 'till deadline

No major wagons that have taken off

therefore, mafia among lurkers/nonvoters.

Basically everybody is a lurker at this point...

THE MAFIA IS AMONG EVERYONE
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #425 on: August 19, 2012, 09:04:59 pm »

Basically everybody is a lurker at this point...

Well, why?

Come on, you oldies, get some communications going! I am new here, I need new stuff flowing.

Gogogogo!
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #426 on: August 19, 2012, 09:22:01 pm »

Man - I finally get around to catching up (my wife is totally not pro-town about spending time scum hunting) - and there's nothing here.  I refuse to defend myself against ehunt for Morgrim hunting - because as other people have pointed out Morgrim is not the person you want to have around lylo.  Based on his previous play - if I was going to random lynch someone - it would be morgrim 9 times out of 10.  He's just as likely to have drawn scum as any of the rest of us.  Yes - my vote was during RVS.
</rant>
My vote remains on RobZ because I didn't like the way he backed of Angry Birds after he was called out on it, although to be fair he did say he would unvote.  Angry birds has been lurking - and probably could have stood to be pressed a little harder.  He hasn't posted in 4 days - and I'm fully aware that I'm the pot calling the kettle black in this instance.

Let's do some post counts instead and make some people post more:

424 posts over 16 players + mod means average post count will be 25

1. Insomniac - 18
2. Voltgloss - 30
3. Captain_Frisk - 24 (25 with this post)
4. shark_bait Grujah - 8 (!!!!!) - i think the broken computer excuse is over now.
5. Eevee - 16
6. Robz888 - 25
7. O - 23
8. yuma - 27
9. ftl - 41
10. Galzria - 25
11. shraeye -34
12. angrybirds - 17
13. sparky5856 - 20
14. Morgrim7 - 17
15. Axxle - 52 (!!!!)
16. ehunt - 22

Man - I've been lurking and I'm still in the middle?  This is a pretty cool game folks!

Grujah / shark_bait - whats going on?
Angrybirds - come back and talk to us.  What do you think of ehunt's vote on me?  Do you like RobZ or Axxle?  How many rounds would they go in a boxing match?
Insomniac - why aren't you voting?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #427 on: August 19, 2012, 09:26:16 pm »

Morgrim is a better vig target than lynch target.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #428 on: August 19, 2012, 09:26:37 pm »

Morgrim is a better vig target than lynch target.
Although we aren't gauranteed a vig.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #429 on: August 19, 2012, 09:34:40 pm »

Man - I finally get around to catching up (my wife is totally not pro-town about spending time scum hunting) - and there's nothing here.

Vote: Mrs. Frisk
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #430 on: August 19, 2012, 09:40:30 pm »

Man - I finally get around to catching up (my wife is totally not pro-town about spending time scum hunting) - and there's nothing here.

Vote: Mrs. Frisk

I'll pass that on.  Any thoughts on the game?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #431 on: August 19, 2012, 09:42:15 pm »

Dunno. Drunk. Robz can confirm.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #432 on: August 19, 2012, 09:49:56 pm »

I confirm.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #433 on: August 19, 2012, 09:50:38 pm »

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #434 on: August 19, 2012, 09:56:12 pm »

Nice way to up the post count Grujah, keep it up.

@all
I wouldnt be that worried of people not participating that much on day 1. Day 1 is hard! Especially with a town this size. Tomorrow, we'll have the night kills to analyze, maybe some power role results or claims, hopefully a wagon. One could almost say "that's when the real game begins". People have not had a tendency to drop huge scumslips on day 1, not even with Robz and Galzria pressuring them like madmen.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #435 on: August 19, 2012, 09:58:06 pm »

Nice way to up the post count Grujah, keep it up.

@all
I wouldnt be that worried of people not participating that much on day 1. Day 1 is hard! Especially with a town this size. Tomorrow, we'll have the night kills to analyze, maybe some power role results or claims, hopefully a wagon. One could almost say "that's when the real game begins". People have not had a tendency to drop huge scumslips on day 1, not even with Robz and Galzria pressuring them like madmen.

Sometimes we break Jotheonah, though. Get Insomniac killed. You know, the usual.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #436 on: August 19, 2012, 09:58:34 pm »

Eevee, I cannot do anything to fix sharky's low postcount, and I really cannot go and reread 16 pages. I started my game when I first posted. So far no good reads, except that Eevee feels town (he always does to me, though).
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #437 on: August 19, 2012, 09:59:55 pm »

Suspect me a lot, never even mention yuma (who is mafia, revealed day 6). Eventually settle on voting for morgrim, who then selfhammers and flips town. Yeah, the usual.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #438 on: August 19, 2012, 10:01:01 pm »

Eevee, I cannot do anything to fix sharky's low postcount, and I really cannot go and reread 16 pages. I started my game when I first posted. So far no good reads, except that Eevee feels town (he always does to me, though).
Buddying up to me so I'd drop the charges? Consider it done!  :-*

Fwiw, I've been town in every (finished) game you've read here. So yay for reading me well I guess?
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #439 on: August 19, 2012, 10:01:23 pm »

Suspect me a lot, never even mention yuma (who is mafia, revealed day 6). Eventually settle on voting for morgrim, who then selfhammers and flips town. Yeah, the usual.

IMO, mobs should NEVER kill morgrim. Vigs, on other hand, should.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #440 on: August 19, 2012, 10:02:09 pm »

Eevee, I cannot do anything to fix sharky's low postcount, and I really cannot go and reread 16 pages. I started my game when I first posted. So far no good reads, except that Eevee feels town (he always does to me, though).
Buddying up to me so I'd drop the charges? Consider it done!  :-*

Fwiw, I've been town in every (finished) game you've read here. So yay for reading me well I guess?

Lies. You've been Mob in MI or MII or MIII.

Lynch all the Liars.

Vote: Eevee.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #441 on: August 19, 2012, 10:03:28 pm »

Eevee come to iso, I need some fodder.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #442 on: August 19, 2012, 10:22:46 pm »

Eevee, I cannot do anything to fix sharky's low postcount, and I really cannot go and reread 16 pages. I started my game when I first posted. So far no good reads, except that Eevee feels town (he always does to me, though).
Buddying up to me so I'd drop the charges? Consider it done!  :-*

Fwiw, I've been town in every (finished) game you've read here. So yay for reading me well I guess?

Lies. You've been Mob in MI or MII or MIII.

Lynch all the Liars.

Vote: Eevee.
Didnt know you read III. Coming!
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #443 on: August 19, 2012, 11:02:49 pm »

Angrybirds - come back and talk to us.  What do you think of ehunt's vote on me?  Do you like RobZ or Axxle?  How many rounds would they go in a boxing match?

I've been gone over the weekend vacationing with the whole fam damnily. ehunt's vote on you?
well according to Shraye it is second earliest active vote, so it was made pretty early

i agree with O that his long post was contentless, but I think that voting for you for morgrim-hunting isn't ideal. does he have other reasons for doing so?

I vote for Galzaria. but if i had to vote for either robz or axxle, it would be axxle. In a boxing match they would both shake hands and decide to settle it thru dominion, robz would win.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #444 on: August 19, 2012, 11:19:04 pm »

Vote Count

Galzria (1): angrybirds
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, Axxle, Morgrim7
Axxle (6): Eevee, shraeye, Galzria, Voltgloss, Robz888, O,
shraeye (1): yuma
O (1): ftl
ehunt (1): O
Eevee (1): Grujah

not voting (1): Insomniac

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.

I really hope that's right.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #445 on: August 19, 2012, 11:23:38 pm »

Fun fact: ftl's vote on Axxle actually put him at L-1 briefly.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #446 on: August 19, 2012, 11:42:27 pm »

Day 1 is hard! Especially with a town this size. Tomorrow, we'll have the night kills to analyze, maybe some power role results or claims, hopefully a wagon. One could almost say "that's when the real game begins". People have not had a tendency to drop huge scumslips on day 1, not even with Robz and Galzria pressuring them like madmen.
I echo Eevee here.  I think the post rate has really dropped, not just because of Dark Ages/Goko, but also because people feel like they've mined all these posts for about as much as they can.  Looking at kills/flips/vote orders and agreements/disagreements after the night phase will be more fruitful I suspect.  I can keep hunting around and will, but I'm currently voting for the person who feels the scummiest to me.

It's only Day 1, so this won't matter now, but here's a thought. shraeye is on the Axxle bandwagon now. Someone who's as outspoken as shraeye is will have a strong impact on the final lynch. This means that if you're mafia, you can continuously steer the town towards the wrong direction. I say this thought doesn't matter now because we don't know if this is the case. But if Axxle ends up being town, it's a thought to consider. I actually am much less certain now that Axxle is scum. He played with a different style in Mafia I, and he was scum then. I dunno, that was a while ago, so idk if that can apply.
Quote
(From Axxle) I'm not a fan of self-meta, but I'll use it anyway.  This is how I play town.  I usually ignore suspicion against me.  If try to scumhunt anyway because, hey, if I get lynched then we have the opinion of a confirmed town out there now.  If I spent the whole day trying to defend myself, I wouldn't help the town at all if I get lynched.
There are often claims of "this is how I play town."  I don't have the energy to search out others, but I know that Axxle has not been the only one (Morgrim at the very least).  These really don't clear any suspicion at all in my mind.  I think it is weird to expect that somebody's play style will never evolve, I rarely tend to do the same thing in the same circumstance every game (except chess, gotta build that opening repertoire).  To clear anyone becaues they aren't playing this game like they did in Mafia XLI (clearly fake number, since this point is for everyone, not just Axxle) is silly, because if I had mafia twice, I'd be damned sure not to do the same thing I did last time.

I've considered what might happen if Axxle flips town, and I know that that will draw a lot of heat to me.  But after all, it takes 9 to lynch so if that does happen hopefully people will realize that there have got to be some townies amongst the voters.  Maybe that's the risk I run for being vocal, but it still seems a better option to push for a particular lynch than flip my vote around amongst tons of different people waiting for the stars to align and a quick lynch to come together.  That, frankly, sounds like something scum might do, riding the waves of current popular opinion hoping to lynch whoever is convenient.  I'm certainly going to take a look over the voting records to see who's done this if I survive the first night.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #447 on: August 19, 2012, 11:51:11 pm »

Another thought.  Although it feels weird in this stage since we left behind RVS like 5+ days ago, Grujah has added some life to the forum with his bantering and that's nice.  Not sure if he's giving me town reads or scum reads right now.  But I do like the vitality he brings.

Also, I think it is very strange that Insomnia hasn't cast a vote yet (well, he had one RVS on Axxle on day 1).  This hesitence feels pro-town in sentiment, but I think town would benefit from hearing more voices and seeing more votes.  With fewer people talking it seems like it could be easier for mafia to strongarm us into bad decisions.  So I encourage you to tell us your analysis thusfar and to back it up with your first non-RVS vote.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #448 on: August 19, 2012, 11:58:22 pm »

That, and if we wind up nolynching, it's on the guys who were not using their
votes.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #449 on: August 19, 2012, 11:59:58 pm »

Suspect me a lot, never even mention yuma (who is mafia, revealed day 6). Eventually settle on voting for morgrim, who then selfhammers and flips town. Yeah, the usual.

IMO, mobs should NEVER kill morgrim. Vigs, on other hand, should.

Can you explain this thinking please?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #450 on: August 20, 2012, 02:37:49 am »

I'm not voting because although I'm suspicious of Axxle I'm also suspicious of his wagon, and I'm not convinced Axxle is scum I mean sure he egged on the Robz/Birds fiasco but even thats not that bad he was probably just pushing for a scum slip
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #451 on: August 20, 2012, 02:57:06 am »

Axxle is being vote on I guess because he's the only one talking, according to the votecoutns. More talking = more scumslips. I guess I'm glad I unvoted there and he's not at L-1.

Not okay with: an angrybirds lynch, a me lynch.
Okay with: basically any other lynch.

hey let's Vote: Grujah
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #452 on: August 20, 2012, 06:06:30 am »

Suspect me a lot, never even mention yuma (who is mafia, revealed day 6). Eventually settle on voting for morgrim, who then selfhammers and flips town. Yeah, the usual.

IMO, mobs should NEVER kill morgrim. Vigs, on other hand, should.

Can you explain this thinking please?


He is a mislynch waiting to happen. Only game where he wasn't mislynched was MVI because I vouched for him; otherwise he would have died.
Why kill someone who can save you a day?

Vig, on other hand (no one-shot, full), can get a potential mob but generally not too much helpful townie out of the way.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #453 on: August 20, 2012, 07:25:11 am »

Axxle is being vote on I guess because he's the only one talking, according to the votecoutns. More talking = more scumslips. I guess I'm glad I unvoted there and he's not at L-1.

Not okay with: an angrybirds lynch, a me lynch.
Okay with: basically any other lynch.

hey let's Vote: Grujah
Just because you are OK with a random lynch doesn't mean you should automatically vote randomly. That got me lynched in M2 and M3.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #454 on: August 20, 2012, 08:55:16 am »

Galz has not posted in forever. was he also vla? his last post that had content was to vote for axxle, i think he just wanted to jump on that and ride it out without putting in any effort or attracting any attention
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #455 on: August 20, 2012, 09:18:23 am »

Galz has not posted in forever. was he also vla? his last post that had content was to vote for axxle, i think he just wanted to jump on that and ride it out without putting in any effort or attracting any attention

I was actually the first person to FoS him, and (I believe) the second vote (maybe third?). The only reason my vote left Axxle (and then went back on) was because of a momentarily distracted vote on Volt. I've been one of the earliest to vote Axxle, and one of the earliest to make a case against him. Please read the thread (and my posts) before claiming that my votes had no reason, or that I was just climbing aboard wagons, which is a flat out lie.
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Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #456 on: August 20, 2012, 11:11:47 am »

Whoever we decide to lynch, we need to do it well enough in advance of deadline to allow time for any roleclaims.  Given the setup, there appears to be only about a 25% chance of each individual player being a VT.  So odds are whoever we push to L-1 is going to roleclaim and then we need time to deal with that.

I still don't like Axxle's behavior.  I haven't seen an argument that pushes anyone else as significantly scummier than Axxle.  Though I would support a Grujah lynch at this point for what appears to be a willful refusal to get up to speed and contribute helpfully to the thread (maybe sharky's lurking wasn't JUST computer-related, but also influenced by his being scum?). 

Whatever the case, we really need to push to some kind of consensus and do so with significant time left before deadline.  angrybirds said that if forced to choose between Robz and Axxle, he would vote Axxle.  Perhaps all of us who aren't currently voting one or the other should answer that same question.  And if the answer is "absolutely neither of them," what about a Grujah lynch instead?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #457 on: August 20, 2012, 11:18:44 am »

I can't imagine a scum Grujah deciding not to read the earlier part of the thread. That's such an obviously irritable thing to do.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #458 on: August 20, 2012, 11:20:45 am »

Whoever we decide to lynch, we need to do it well enough in advance of deadline to allow time for any roleclaims.  Given the setup, there appears to be only about a 25% chance of each individual player being a VT.  So odds are whoever we push to L-1 is going to roleclaim and then we need time to deal with that.

I still don't like Axxle's behavior.  I haven't seen an argument that pushes anyone else as significantly scummier than Axxle.  Though I would support a Grujah lynch at this point for what appears to be a willful refusal to get up to speed and contribute helpfully to the thread (maybe sharky's lurking wasn't JUST computer-related, but also influenced by his being scum?). 

Whatever the case, we really need to push to some kind of consensus and do so with significant time left before deadline.  angrybirds said that if forced to choose between Robz and Axxle, he would vote Axxle.  Perhaps all of us who aren't currently voting one or the other should answer that same question.  And if the answer is "absolutely neither of them," what about a Grujah lynch instead?
Lurker lynches usually go pretty bad for us on f.DS.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #459 on: August 20, 2012, 11:23:42 am »

Whoever we decide to lynch, we need to do it well enough in advance of deadline to allow time for any roleclaims.  Given the setup, there appears to be only about a 25% chance of each individual player being a VT.  So odds are whoever we push to L-1 is going to roleclaim and then we need time to deal with that.

I still don't like Axxle's behavior.  I haven't seen an argument that pushes anyone else as significantly scummier than Axxle.  Though I would support a Grujah lynch at this point for what appears to be a willful refusal to get up to speed and contribute helpfully to the thread (maybe sharky's lurking wasn't JUST computer-related, but also influenced by his being scum?). 

Whatever the case, we really need to push to some kind of consensus and do so with significant time left before deadline.  angrybirds said that if forced to choose between Robz and Axxle, he would vote Axxle.  Perhaps all of us who aren't currently voting one or the other should answer that same question.  And if the answer is "absolutely neither of them," what about a Grujah lynch instead?
Lurker lynches usually go pretty bad for us on f.DS.

I don't think I agree, actually. How often do we lynch people for lurking? Pretty rarely. And I can think of two cases where a big-time lurker actually was scum: Glooble in MIV and MVI. Of course there's Yuma, too, in MV (and to SOME extent MIII, although I wouldn't call him a lurker, just quiet).
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #460 on: August 20, 2012, 11:45:56 am »

If he fiasco of mafia VII taught me something, it is that lurkers are like really bad for town. Screw lynch all liars, lynch all lurkers imo.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #461 on: August 20, 2012, 11:47:50 am »

If he fiasco of mafia VII taught me something, it is that lurkers are like really bad for town. Screw lynch all liars, lynch all lurkers imo.

Yes. Lurkers are anti-town, and sometimes turn out to be mafia, and we don't kill them enough.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #462 on: August 20, 2012, 11:50:49 am »

Everybody in this game has been quite a bit lurky, cept for Axxle.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #463 on: August 20, 2012, 11:54:10 am »

Everybody in this game has been quite a bit lurky, cept for Axxle.

That is a point in his favor. I don't know if it's enough to unvote him, mostly because I don't want a No Lynch, and I don't know what other direction we could go (other than me). Of course, part of the reason I don't know that is because no one is talking. If you want to take on a random lurker, I might be game for that.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #464 on: August 20, 2012, 11:54:32 am »

By take on, I mean give votes to in order to gain a response. Not, like, quick lynch.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #465 on: August 20, 2012, 12:03:00 pm »

Everybody in this game has been quite a bit lurky, cept for Axxle.

That is a point in his favor. I don't know if it's enough to unvote him, mostly because I don't want a No Lynch, and I don't know what other direction we could go (other than me). Of course, part of the reason I don't know that is because no one is talking. If you want to take on a random lurker, I might be game for that.

But aren't the majority of Axxle's posts one-liners?*  Just because he has a higher raw post-count than anyone else doesn't necessarily mean he's the least lurky out of all of us.  (Nor is he amongst the MOST lurky, either)

*caveat:  this is my recollection/impression without having gone back to review
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #466 on: August 20, 2012, 12:05:11 pm »

Everybody in this game has been quite a bit lurky, cept for Axxle.

That is a point in his favor. I don't know if it's enough to unvote him, mostly because I don't want a No Lynch, and I don't know what other direction we could go (other than me). Of course, part of the reason I don't know that is because no one is talking. If you want to take on a random lurker, I might be game for that.

But aren't the majority of Axxle's posts one-liners?*  Just because he has a higher raw post-count than anyone else doesn't necessarily mean he's the least lurky out of all of us.  (Nor is he amongst the MOST lurky, either)

*caveat:  this is my recollection/impression without having gone back to review

No, you're right, I don't think its super substancy. But even vapid one-liners would put him well above like 4 or 5 other people at this point, I think.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #467 on: August 20, 2012, 12:13:33 pm »

If it comes down to deadline I would definetly be willing to lynch Axxle I just find the case on him a bit flimsy, but there isn't much else to go on as it seems people have settled on either Axxle or Robz.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #468 on: August 20, 2012, 12:27:30 pm »

If it comes down to deadline I would definetly be willing to lynch Axxle I just find the case on him a bit flimsy, but there isn't much else to go on as it seems people have settled on either Axxle or Robz.

Softclaim: Once I claim you will no longer want to lynch me.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #469 on: August 20, 2012, 12:29:28 pm »

If it comes down to deadline I would definetly be willing to lynch Axxle I just find the case on him a bit flimsy, but there isn't much else to go on as it seems people have settled on either Axxle or Robz.

Softclaim: Once I claim you will no longer want to lynch me.
Here we go. :-\
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #470 on: August 20, 2012, 12:30:48 pm »

If it comes down to deadline I would definetly be willing to lynch Axxle I just find the case on him a bit flimsy, but there isn't much else to go on as it seems people have settled on either Axxle or Robz.

Softclaim: Once I claim you will no longer want to lynch me.

Oh boy. Unvote, I guess?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #471 on: August 20, 2012, 12:33:09 pm »

Everybody in this game has been quite a bit lurky, cept for Axxle.

This seems like a weird claim; I currently count the following people as definitely not lurking.
Yuma, Voltgloss, myself, Robz (not anymore after his busy start), ftl, Captain Frisk, Axxle
Some people are doing a bit better recently than the start
Eevee, Grujah (after taking over for sharkbait), Morgrim
Some people seem on and off
ehunt, galzria, insomniac, o, sparky
Some people seem like they just don't like posting much
angry, o

I haven't updated my post count in a while, so I'm not ready to say any of these people have been suspiciously lurking.  But if everyone had 50+ posts like Axxle, we would have more than 32 pages to sift through.  That would be too much.  Just because not everyone is flooding, doesn't mean we're all lurking.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #472 on: August 20, 2012, 12:40:21 pm »

Everybody in this game has been quite a bit lurky, cept for Axxle.

This seems like a weird claim; I currently count the following people as definitely not lurking.
Yuma, Voltgloss, myself, Robz (not anymore after his busy start), ftl, Captain Frisk, Axxle
Some people are doing a bit better recently than the start
Eevee, Grujah (after taking over for sharkbait), Morgrim
Some people seem on and off
ehunt, galzria, insomniac, o, sparky
Some people seem like they just don't like posting much
angry, o

I haven't updated my post count in a while, so I'm not ready to say any of these people have been suspiciously lurking.  But if everyone had 50+ posts like Axxle, we would have more than 32 pages to sift through.  That would be too much.  Just because not everyone is flooding, doesn't mean we're all lurking.

I think I've posted more content than you TBH.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #473 on: August 20, 2012, 12:43:46 pm »

If it comes down to deadline I would definetly be willing to lynch Axxle I just find the case on him a bit flimsy, but there isn't much else to go on as it seems people have settled on either Axxle or Robz.

Softclaim: Once I claim you will no longer want to lynch me.

Oh boy. Unvote, I guess?
It's just that.. this road leads directly to a VT lynch or nolynch. Unless Axxle claims a specific card and risks a counterclaim? Would that be our best option with so many power roles around?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #474 on: August 20, 2012, 12:45:46 pm »

Whoever we decide to lynch, we need to do it well enough in advance of deadline to allow time for any roleclaims.  Given the setup, there appears to be only about a 25% chance of each individual player being a VT.  So odds are whoever we push to L-1 is going to roleclaim and then we need time to deal with that.

I actually think we need to stop this "you need to claim at L-1 shenanigans" that f.ds is into.

And look, I am following everything past to point of my joining, don't see why it is a problem.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #475 on: August 20, 2012, 12:46:35 pm »

If it comes down to deadline I would definetly be willing to lynch Axxle I just find the case on him a bit flimsy, but there isn't much else to go on as it seems people have settled on either Axxle or Robz.

Softclaim: Once I claim you will no longer want to lynch me.

Oh boy. Unvote, I guess?

VOTE: ROBZ

Reasons: Uncharacteristic push on Angry (idgaf about the backing off after)
When a robz wagon developed, a lot of people oddly were keen to criticize the wagon. Some of this was probably town, but I'm pretty sure one of his scumbuddies is defending him.

And for the terrible meta here. "After I claim you will no longer want to lynch me" can be a VT claim, just with a witty deflection, and makes it 1000x easier if we allow scum to fakeclaim like this.. It should be treated as if Axxle didn't claim at all.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #476 on: August 20, 2012, 12:51:47 pm »

If it comes down to deadline I would definetly be willing to lynch Axxle I just find the case on him a bit flimsy, but there isn't much else to go on as it seems people have settled on either Axxle or Robz.

Softclaim: Once I claim you will no longer want to lynch me.

Oh boy. Unvote, I guess?

Do we want to reward a vague softclaim like this with an unvote?  It's not in any way verifiable, nor (if Axxle is scum) does it at all restrict the universe of roles Axxle could fakeclaim if/when pressed. 

My concern:  if we accept this level of softclaim as a reason not to lynch Day 1, we will never lynch Mafia because they can ALL make this softclaim with no repercussions to themselves.  The only people we will successfully lynch Day 1 are Vanilla Townies who don't want to lie.

PPE:  I see Eevee and O are kinda beating me to the argument.  Posting anyway.
PPE2:  Grujah, what approach do you propose instead of L-1 claiming?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #477 on: August 20, 2012, 12:52:52 pm »

Haven't we only ever lynched VT claims Day 1 anyway?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #478 on: August 20, 2012, 12:53:04 pm »

Whoever we decide to lynch, we need to do it well enough in advance of deadline to allow time for any roleclaims.  Given the setup, there appears to be only about a 25% chance of each individual player being a VT.  So odds are whoever we push to L-1 is going to roleclaim and then we need time to deal with that.

I actually think we need to stop this "you need to claim at L-1 shenanigans" that f.ds is into.

And look, I am following everything past to point of my joining, don't see why it is a problem.
Surely you see why reading everything would be beneficial? Personally I always feel guilty for being so lazy with re-reading, and always admire the guys who make the effortto do that (Volt comes to mind as an example).
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #479 on: August 20, 2012, 12:53:47 pm »

PPE2:  Grujah, what approach do you propose instead of L-1 claiming?
You shouldn't L-1 claim.  You should only claim at L-1 if someone states the intent to hammer.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #480 on: August 20, 2012, 01:00:17 pm »

And for the terrible meta here. "After I claim you will no longer want to lynch me" can be a VT claim, just with a witty deflection, and makes it 1000x easier if we allow scum to fakeclaim like this.. It should be treated as if Axxle didn't claim at all.
I agree completely with O here.  This wasn't a claim.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #481 on: August 20, 2012, 01:01:18 pm »

PPE2:  Grujah, what approach do you propose instead of L-1 claiming?

L-1 claiming is bad, it is outing the power roles. Just take it. We need to get out of that mentality. Claim if it is beneficial for town to know, i.e. you found scum or it lightens an event.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #482 on: August 20, 2012, 01:06:36 pm »

PPE2:  Grujah, what approach do you propose instead of L-1 claiming?

L-1 claiming is bad, it is outing the power roles. Just take it. We need to get out of that mentality. Claim if it is beneficial for town to know, i.e. you found scum or it lightens an event.

Erm... Outing the PR's is better than killing the PRs.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #483 on: August 20, 2012, 01:07:03 pm »

I don't know, I'm sort of cooling to an Axxle lynch entirely. I get the feeling that there are at least some scum just completely lurking (which is why its so quiet in here.) And a couple people--Morgrim, eevee, ehunt, Insomniac, oh and even abirds--are lurking really hardcore now.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #484 on: August 20, 2012, 01:08:34 pm »

PPE2:  Grujah, what approach do you propose instead of L-1 claiming?

L-1 claiming is bad, it is outing the power roles. Just take it. We need to get out of that mentality. Claim if it is beneficial for town to know, i.e. you found scum or it lightens an event.

Erm... Outing the PR's is better than killing the PRs.

Expect that we do a quickmirslynch right after.  It is bad, you need to get yourself out of the lynch without claiming. Or at least not to wait till L-1 when it is late in the day already and it fucks as up.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #485 on: August 20, 2012, 01:08:51 pm »

Everybody in this game has been quite a bit lurky, cept for Axxle.

This seems like a weird claim; I currently count the following people as definitely not lurking.
Yuma, Voltgloss, myself, Robz (not anymore after his busy start), ftl, Captain Frisk, Axxle
Some people are doing a bit better recently than the start
Eevee, Grujah (after taking over for sharkbait), Morgrim
Some people seem on and off
ehunt, galzria, insomniac, o, sparky
Some people seem like they just don't like posting much
angry, o

I haven't updated my post count in a while, so I'm not ready to say any of these people have been suspiciously lurking.  But if everyone had 50+ posts like Axxle, we would have more than 32 pages to sift through.  That would be too much.  Just because not everyone is flooding, doesn't mean we're all lurking.

I think I've posted more content than you TBH.
This is exactly what I was trying to avoid with the caveat that I am not using this as a list of people being suspicious, sorry if it felt like an attack.  I caught up to the current vote count now, and I amend your position to "people doing better now than the start" post-count-wise.

Content is a whole 'nother bag of bricks.  Undeniably we have both posted content, but when we talk about more content, we could be talking about "more useful" content which is totally subjective, more content based on numbers, or more content based on percentages, or more unique content.  The first category is too hard to make an assessment of and neither of us are kings of the other three categories.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #486 on: August 20, 2012, 01:10:06 pm »

How am I lurking hardcore? I've been posting quite a bit I just don't have a strong read this game because I'm pretty sure the robz/birds/axxle thing is a big town fight like timchen v galz in mvii
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #487 on: August 20, 2012, 01:12:00 pm »

Erm... Outing the PR's is better than killing the PRs.
This is probably true, but it would be more important like Grujah said to have avoided outing AND killing the PRs.  If you are a PR and a lynch looks like it's forming around you, don't wait until it finally gets to L-1 to say "oh noooo."  It hurts town if you don't give us time to recover and find a better target.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #488 on: August 20, 2012, 01:12:54 pm »

How am I lurking hardcore? I've been posting quite a bit I just don't have a strong read this game because I'm pretty sure the robz/birds/axxle thing is a big town fight like timchen v galz in mvii

Yeah, maybe I shouldn't have included you on that list. But that still leaves like 3 people.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #489 on: August 20, 2012, 01:13:19 pm »

I really started making the effort to be more active after I realized how lurky I had been. Sad I'm still in the HC lurker category for Robz, got to change that.

For the record, I think ensuring we lynch someone is somewhat of a high priority today, so we might want to try finding some consensus here pretty soon already. 24 hours to deadline and no serious lynch candidate would not be good at all, and it might very well happen because of late claims or something if we dont get busy.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #490 on: August 20, 2012, 01:14:54 pm »

How am I lurking hardcore? I've been posting quite a bit I just don't have a strong read this game because I'm pretty sure the robz/birds/axxle thing is a big town fight like timchen v galz in mvii
I wouldn't characterize you as lurking hardcore right now, but the robz/birds/axxle thing has blown over.  Other things are being discussed now.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #491 on: August 20, 2012, 01:18:00 pm »

How about I do this then.

Grujah why are you unwilling to read a measly 20 pages it's not like it'll take that long is it because your scum and you don't care as you already know which scum to not hunt?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #492 on: August 20, 2012, 01:20:12 pm »

Here's my biggest thing on Axxle personally - And Robz, you should see this since you do read into meta's:

Town Axxle, while good at getting himself lynched, at least plays to a town wincon. He spends his time making posts filled with reasonable content, or providing links to... "Cop for Dummies", or "RVS and You! How not to suck!" It has nothing to do with votecount, but it's the complete lack of content in those posts. It's like he's trying to be present and be "town Axxle" except he isn't. I don't get the usual "Man, I'll feel like crap if Axxle is town" vibe because he's not the asset he usually is as town.... And I have to wonder why.
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Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #493 on: August 20, 2012, 01:20:49 pm »

Cuz it's boring.

I only read a very few games that I didn't play in (MV a bit, Ins's BM a bit). I also didn't read a big part of MIV D2 cuz I was lurking and didn't participate and it was just walls of texts.r
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #494 on: August 20, 2012, 01:23:22 pm »

Cuz it's boring.

I only read a very few games that I didn't play in (MV a bit, Ins's BM a bit). I also didn't read a big part of MIV D2 cuz I was lurking and didn't participate and it was just walls of texts.r


Then make it interesting and vote for robz.

Seriously guys, I'm not going to make a clusterf**k massive post and try to derail all discussion to get all of your attention, but look at the reactions to a robzswagon and it's all pointing to a scum robz.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #495 on: August 20, 2012, 01:25:47 pm »

Cuz it's boring.

I only read a very few games that I didn't play in (MV a bit, Ins's BM a bit). I also didn't read a big part of MIV D2 cuz I was lurking and didn't participate and it was just walls of texts.r


Then make it interesting and vote for robz.

Seriously guys, I'm not going to make a clusterf**k massive post and try to derail all discussion to get all of your attention, but look at the reactions to a robzswagon and it's all pointing to a scum robz.

I don't think I can argue against this anymore. O and Axxle (and somebody else? I don't remember) overreacted to me giving Abirds a very moderate grilling. Several people joined me in pointing out how overblown the whole thing was. Thus my wagon stalled.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #496 on: August 20, 2012, 01:28:16 pm »

Cuz it's boring.

I only read a very few games that I didn't play in (MV a bit, Ins's BM a bit). I also didn't read a big part of MIV D2 cuz I was lurking and didn't participate and it was just walls of texts.r


Then make it interesting and vote for robz.

Seriously guys, I'm not going to make a clusterf**k massive post and try to derail all discussion to get all of your attention, but look at the reactions to a robzswagon and it's all pointing to a scum robz.

I don't think I can argue against this anymore. O and Axxle (and somebody else? I don't remember) overreacted to me giving Abirds a very moderate grilling. Several people joined me in pointing out how overblown the whole thing was. Thus my wagon stalled.

And then they started scumhunting the wagon without a real reason to. Which is why I revoted for you.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #497 on: August 20, 2012, 01:40:18 pm »

Cuz it's boring.

I only read a very few games that I didn't play in (MV a bit, Ins's BM a bit). I also didn't read a big part of MIV D2 cuz I was lurking and didn't participate and it was just walls of texts.r


Then make it interesting and vote for robz.

Seriously guys, I'm not going to make a clusterf**k massive post and try to derail all discussion to get all of your attention, but look at the reactions to a robzswagon and it's all pointing to a scum robz.

I don't think I can argue against this anymore. O and Axxle (and somebody else? I don't remember) overreacted to me giving Abirds a very moderate grilling. Several people joined me in pointing out how overblown the whole thing was. Thus my wagon stalled.

And then they started scumhunting the wagon without a real reason to. Which is why I revoted for you.

Who scumhunted the wagon? Who on the wagon got scumhunted? It seems to me that Axxle was the only one who got in trouble that way, and Axxle already had a wagon building against him before all this nonsense.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #498 on: August 20, 2012, 02:00:23 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #499 on: August 20, 2012, 02:04:01 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.
Please do, I'd be really interested in seeing your results.  In other news
Unvote Axxle.
I'm working on an enormous manifesto of a person-by-person analysis.  Long story way too short, Axxle is not the scummiest out there.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #500 on: August 20, 2012, 02:05:16 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.
Please do, I'd be really interested in seeing your results.  In other news
Unvote Axxle.
I'm working on an enormous manifesto of a person-by-person analysis.  Long story way too short, Axxle is not the scummiest out there.

FYI I attempt to policy lynch anyone who posts enormous beasts of text, especially D1.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #501 on: August 20, 2012, 02:10:54 pm »

I really prefer putting my opinions out into the world regardless of consequences.  Why do you have this policy lynch? Isn't more-information better than less-information.  If the rest of the forum agrees, I can shorten it up some, but then I foresee people saying that it was contentless like your person-by-person analysis (sidenote, it wasn't contentless people!).  I'll let the masses decide.  If enough people want info, they'll get it even if I risk you trying to lynch me. 
Person-by-person summary?
person-by-person analysis? (but keep it short!) (say everything you want!)

Give me your preference among those three and I will deliver.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #502 on: August 20, 2012, 02:13:25 pm »

I really prefer putting my opinions out into the world regardless of consequences.  Why do you have this policy lynch? Isn't more-information better than less-information.  If the rest of the forum agrees, I can shorten it up some, but then I foresee people saying that it was contentless like your person-by-person analysis (sidenote, it wasn't contentless people!).  I'll let the masses decide.  If enough people want info, they'll get it even if I risk you trying to lynch me. 
Person-by-person summary?
person-by-person analysis? (but keep it short!) (say everything you want!)

Give me your preference among those three and I will deliver.

Huh? I didn't post person by person analysis.

And I would only not pursue a policy lynch if it is apparent to me from your post that you've read Politics and the English Language; meaning it's concise and I don't wander through thousands of words of fluff.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #503 on: August 20, 2012, 02:13:33 pm »

I really prefer putting my opinions out into the world regardless of consequences.  Why do you have this policy lynch? Isn't more-information better than less-information.  If the rest of the forum agrees, I can shorten it up some, but then I foresee people saying that it was contentless like your person-by-person analysis (sidenote, it wasn't contentless people!).  I'll let the masses decide.  If enough people want info, they'll get it even if I risk you trying to lynch me. 
Person-by-person summary?
person-by-person analysis? (but keep it short!) (say everything you want!)

Give me your preference among those three and I will deliver.

Uh... no. Don't even bother soliciting people for whether you think you should post info you think is beneficial to the town. Just post it all.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #504 on: August 20, 2012, 02:13:58 pm »

Yeah more (info) the merrier. O is just trolling, as per usual.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #505 on: August 20, 2012, 02:15:15 pm »

Why would you ever let the threat of someone voting for you change the way you play? O has said the same to me before (and probably followed through), but I was town.... So what did I care? Holding back intentionally is anti-town at best, and scummy at worst.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #506 on: August 20, 2012, 02:19:52 pm »

Why would you ever let the threat of someone voting for you change the way you play? O has said the same to me before (and probably followed through), but I was town.... So what did I care? Holding back intentionally is anti-town at best, and scummy at worst.
Yeah, that's my opinion too, which is why I asked O why he had this crazy policy-lynch idea.  If other f.DS members agreed to it, I would have rolled my eyes and done my best to shorten it.  I appreciate your desire for information, and I will deliver.  I'll try to not make it overly-wordy.  But I'm sayin' what I'm sayin'.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #507 on: August 20, 2012, 02:20:31 pm »

Huh? I didn't post person by person analysis.

And I would only not pursue a policy lynch if it is apparent to me from your post that you've read Politics and the English Language; meaning it's concise and I don't wander through thousands of words of fluff.
Also, you are right.  I confused you with ehunt.  Won't happen again, mate.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #508 on: August 20, 2012, 02:43:10 pm »

Grujah / shark_bait - whats going on?
Angrybirds - come back and talk to us.  What do you think of ehunt's vote on me?  Do you like RobZ or Axxle?  How many rounds would they go in a boxing match?
Insomniac - why aren't you voting?

I know Insomniac said something about not having voted yet.  Did Grujah and Angrybirds ever answer these questions to your content Frisk?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #509 on: August 20, 2012, 02:46:29 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.

I don't like either so there is that. I do feel strongly about shraeye though and wouldnot be surpised if I made it to the top if his scummy list he iscompiling
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #510 on: August 20, 2012, 02:48:25 pm »

yuma how come you are fading to the background again, actively trying to hide?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #511 on: August 20, 2012, 02:49:48 pm »

Well right now I am at work and can only phone post on breaks.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #512 on: August 20, 2012, 03:31:49 pm »

There are two wagons, and I think both of them are on town. A lot of y'all say Axxle's softclaim means nothing; I disagree and moreover I think it's a pro-town move (given that he was the likeliest lynch) to make it now instead of later.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #513 on: August 20, 2012, 03:32:34 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.

I'm probably violating criterion one in your list, although I have been voting for Frisk all day and am surprised nobody has joined me.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #514 on: August 20, 2012, 03:41:16 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.

I'm probably violating criterion one in your list, although I have been voting for Frisk all day and am surprised nobody has joined me.

Why are you voting for Frisk, again?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #515 on: August 20, 2012, 03:45:51 pm »

There are two wagons, and I think both of them are on town. A lot of y'all say Axxle's softclaim means nothing; I disagree and moreover I think it's a pro-town move (given that he was the likeliest lynch) to make it now instead of later.

I just had a "holy &$#! eHunt is in this game?"  moment. Speak more please! I never wondered in M-VI if you were in the game...
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #516 on: August 20, 2012, 03:49:54 pm »

Going through the players in order.

Insomniac is incredibly wishywashy on the two wagons right now.

see gems like this where he says he's suspicious of me, but also suspicious of people who think I'm suspicious:

I'm not voting because although I'm suspicious of Axxle I'm also suspicious of his wagon, and I'm not convinced Axxle is scum I mean sure he egged on the Robz/Birds fiasco but even thats not that bad he was probably just pushing for a scum slip

He hasn't taken a strong stance on anything.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #517 on: August 20, 2012, 03:56:01 pm »

Grujah, of course, hasn't mentioned it really due to not wanting to catch up.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #518 on: August 20, 2012, 04:00:31 pm »

FTL has voted for me in the past once for gut and once because of a joke I made.

I don't see where he explains his very strong read on angrybirds:

Axxle is being vote on I guess because he's the only one talking, according to the votecoutns. More talking = more scumslips. I guess I'm glad I unvoted there and he's not at L-1.

Not okay with: an angrybirds lynch, a me lynch.
Okay with: basically any other lynch.

hey let's Vote: Grujah
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #519 on: August 20, 2012, 04:04:00 pm »

And eHunt outed himself.

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.

I'm probably violating criterion one in your list, although I have been voting for Frisk all day and am surprised nobody has joined me.



(I skipped people who are currently voting for me and Robz)

I think we'll find scum among those three.

Unvote

I'll reread all of these player's posts later and push the scummiest player for lynch.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #520 on: August 20, 2012, 04:04:34 pm »

I think we'll find scum among those three.
*four.  Already forgot about Grujah.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #521 on: August 20, 2012, 04:11:07 pm »

Why am I scummy, again?
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #522 on: August 20, 2012, 04:12:19 pm »

Why am I scummy, again?
It's something you did 12 pages ago. Wouldn't you like to know?
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #523 on: August 20, 2012, 04:17:12 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.

I'm probably violating criterion one in your list, although I have been voting for Frisk all day and am surprised nobody has joined me.

Why are you voting for Frisk, again?

He (possibly RVS) votes Morgrim. Later, a fight about Morgrim happens; Frisk defends the case on Morgrim. I call him out for it and vote. He responds sarcastically. Time passes, and then he unvotes, saying it was just RVS, even though he had been defensive about it before. He's posted 8 times since then, and that was like a week ago. In those 8 posts, his only substantive one is IIoA. He also voted for Robz, a wagon that I don't like at all.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #524 on: August 20, 2012, 04:21:04 pm »

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.

I'm probably violating criterion one in your list, although I have been voting for Frisk all day and am surprised nobody has joined me.

Why are you voting for Frisk, again?

He (possibly RVS) votes Morgrim. Later, a fight about Morgrim happens; Frisk defends the case on Morgrim. I call him out for it and vote. He responds sarcastically. Time passes, and then he unvotes, saying it was just RVS, even though he had been defensive about it before. He's posted 8 times since then, and that was like a week ago. In those 8 posts, his only substantive one is IIoA. He also voted for Robz, a wagon that I don't like at all.

Okay, I asked because I've recently noticed his surprising relative silence.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #525 on: August 20, 2012, 04:21:23 pm »

Why am I scummy, again?
It's something you did 12 pages ago. Wouldn't you like to know?

Eevee!!! I laughed out loud at this. Good one.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #526 on: August 20, 2012, 04:49:32 pm »

It's easy to miss a lot when you sleep for 12 hours in a row  ;D

I need a vote count.

Galzria (1): angrybirds
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7, O
Axxle (3): Eevee, Galzria, Voltgloss
shraeye (1): yuma
ehunt (1): O
Eevee (1): Grujah
Grujah (1): ftl

not voting (3): Insomniac, Me, Axxle

I don't like either of the two major wagons at the moment, and I've already explained my thoughts on each of them. I think Axxle's softclaim helps him more than hurts him. There could be some uber-powerful town roles in this game (although really, any town role could fill his position, although with that he's more likely to have a PR), and if Axxle is lying, that only hurts him (if evidence is found to contradict the softclaim, he's only gonna get lynched faster). Robz had reason to vote for Abirds (as I previously mentioned), and then people jump on Robz, even forcing a Catch-22 as shraeye mentioned.

As far as shraeye goes, I'm thinking back to that long drunk post he made. It seems less likely that he would have made that if he was scum, because when playing as scum, you have to focus more on defense and less on scumhunting (although that's still valid in this game due to the other factions, SK most importantly since that's been confirmed). If shraeye is the SK, I'll be extremely dumbfounded. You really have to concentrate on defense there, since you're against everyone. So really, he would be okay with any lynch, which doesn't make any sense at all considering the vast amount of content in his posts. If 1/4 of roles really are VT, then he has a 11/15 chance of just throwing a dart onto a wall blindly with everyone's names on it, and successfully picking a PR.

I dunno how the SK would exactly play. I've never played with one in any game. Jumping on any strong bandwagon seems like a good idea, because if you're going against everyone, lynch anyone and you survive another day, and you get to kill someone. Maybe directing the attention towards lynching Mafia/WW would be good, since it's easy to think about them. So, who jumps out the most as the SK?

...Why am I even rambling about this. I'm supposed to be deciding who at all is anti-town. I don't have a vote on anyone. That should change. VOTE: Grujah. I find it odd that he would't want to read the earlier portions of the thread, I've already voted on his more fish-like form in the past, and voting for someone that already has been voted on at this point is better, since it's easier to start a bandwagon that way. Hey, here's a tip, nabbing players for something they did 10-20 pages back is a good way to play this game and to stay on top of it. And for Grujah that's apparently not possible.

Day 1 is almost over and we need something.

Quote
Warning - while you were typing 9 new replies have been posted.

HOOVER DAMMIT

Anyways, eHunt. Axxle mentions he's scummy. I don't really have an opinion on him, I'll have to Print Page F3 "eHunt on" to gather such.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #527 on: August 20, 2012, 04:53:49 pm »

I believe I was the first to mention that Robz was in a Catch-22.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #528 on: August 20, 2012, 05:02:50 pm »

I think Axxle's softclaim helps him more than hurts him. There could be some uber-powerful town roles in this game (although really, any town role could fill his position, although with that he's more likely to have a PR), and if Axxle is lying, that only hurts him (if evidence is found to contradict the softclaim, he's only gonna get lynched faster).

What sort of evidence are you envisioning that could contradict Axxle's softclaim? 
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #529 on: August 20, 2012, 05:04:15 pm »

Okay, I asked because I've recently noticed his surprising relative silence.

Yeah - admittedly so - goko, golf, beer tasting, family time etc.  When I post counted it up however - I clearly wasn't out of line.  It's amazing what happens when you just kindof skim and know that you don't want to reply without really reading... and all the sudden you can't really reply until you sit down for 30 minutes to catch up...
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #530 on: August 20, 2012, 05:05:17 pm »

So, hi, sparky, nice to meet you.

So you were writing that post for almost an hour? Kinda scummy.  :o
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #531 on: August 20, 2012, 05:11:02 pm »

Suspect me a lot, never even mention yuma (who is mafia, revealed day 6). Eventually settle on voting for morgrim, who then selfhammers and flips town. Yeah, the usual.

IMO, mobs should NEVER kill morgrim. Vigs, on other hand, should.

Can you explain this thinking please?


He is a mislynch waiting to happen. Only game where he wasn't mislynched was MVI because I vouched for him; otherwise he would have died.
Why kill someone who can save you a day?

Vig, on other hand (no one-shot, full), can get a potential mob but generally not too much helpful townie out of the way.

Sorry for jumping back a few pages - but I asked the question and wanted to respond to this.  I don't understand the difference between a lynch and a vig kill on M7. 

Either way - he's either town or he is scum.  He is just as likely to be scum as any of the rest of us.  Scum already know the answer.  If we lynched him during the day and vigged him at night, or the other way around - you have the exact same scenario when you wake up the next day.  There might not even be a vig - so if you're the type of person who doesn't want morgrim @ deadline time - then you should lynch him early - possibly during day 1 where the lynching is mostly random anyway.  Hoping that the vig takes care of him is anti town.  How would the vig's decision to shoot morgrim be any different?  You wouldn't ask a vig to shoot randomly, why would you have him shoot M7?

As for morgrim letting scum of the hook for voting for him because its so easy - thats just garbage.  Have we ever had a situation where we have caught scum driving a lynch for bad reasons?  At the end of the day we rarely go back and look at how agressively people pushed or didn't push - we just look at the votes.


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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #532 on: August 20, 2012, 05:14:24 pm »

Either way - he's either town or he is scum.  He is just as likely to be scum as any of the rest of us.  Scum already know the answer.
You forget there's two scumteams in all likelihood.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #533 on: August 20, 2012, 05:17:15 pm »

I believe I was the first to mention that Robz was in a Catch-22.

Ah yes this is true. You were the first to comment on it, and shraeye specifically mentioned it as a Catch-22.

UNVOTE: Grujah

VOTE: sparky5856


...nah, bad idea.

UNVOTE: sparky5856

VOTE: Grujah


I think Axxle's softclaim helps him more than hurts him. There could be some uber-powerful town roles in this game (although really, any town role could fill his position, although with that he's more likely to have a PR), and if Axxle is lying, that only hurts him (if evidence is found to contradict the softclaim, he's only gonna get lynched faster).

What sort of evidence are you envisioning that could contradict Axxle's softclaim? 

Good question. I was going for that if such evidence is found, it's only gonna accelerate his demise. We're gonna need more days to figure this out though. If a lot of pro-town power roles are killed in the future, for instance, that goes against Axxle. This reasoning gets trickier though if Axxle is just VT. Other than that, it'll really have to be just standard evidence. The only evidence that is the true opposite of his soft claim is if he's scum, so we DO want to lynch him. That's what we're trying to figure out though. Hey, maybe we can brainstorm this.

So, hi, sparky, nice to meet you.

So you were writing that post for almost an hour? Kinda scummy.  :o

I was distracted by phone calls in the meantime. It wasn't all writing that post  ;) I DO like to put effort in my posts though, I'm a logical kind of person.  :)
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #534 on: August 20, 2012, 05:21:14 pm »

Suspect me a lot, never even mention yuma (who is mafia, revealed day 6). Eventually settle on voting for morgrim, who then selfhammers and flips town. Yeah, the usual.

IMO, mobs should NEVER kill morgrim. Vigs, on other hand, should.

Can you explain this thinking please?


He is a mislynch waiting to happen. Only game where he wasn't mislynched was MVI because I vouched for him; otherwise he would have died.
Why kill someone who can save you a day?

Vig, on other hand (no one-shot, full), can get a potential mob but generally not too much helpful townie out of the way.

Sorry for jumping back a few pages - but I asked the question and wanted to respond to this.  I don't understand the difference between a lynch and a vig kill on M7. 

Either way - he's either town or he is scum.  He is just as likely to be scum as any of the rest of us.  Scum already know the answer.  If we lynched him during the day and vigged him at night, or the other way around - you have the exact same scenario when you wake up the next day.  There might not even be a vig - so if you're the type of person who doesn't want morgrim @ deadline time - then you should lynch him early - possibly during day 1 where the lynching is mostly random anyway.  Hoping that the vig takes care of him is anti town.  How would the vig's decision to shoot morgrim be any different?  You wouldn't ask a vig to shoot randomly, why would you have him shoot M7?

As for morgrim letting scum of the hook for voting for him because its so easy - thats just garbage.  Have we ever had a situation where we have caught scum driving a lynch for bad reasons?  At the end of the day we rarely go back and look at how agressively people pushed or didn't push - we just look at the votes.

You are probably right, and I wrong, thing is Morgrim wagons are easy to fake into and is generally not useful. (only few people that I played with in Morgrim games I could read from Morg wagon, I guess).
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #535 on: August 20, 2012, 05:24:32 pm »

This reasoning gets trickier though if Axxle is just VT.
I would never softclaim a power role as a VT.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #536 on: August 20, 2012, 05:46:50 pm »

So - if I can read this correctly - we have 11 possible VTs out of 52 cards?  (I'm not sure if cayvie drew N regular cards and M arcana, to get a desire or just mixed all of them together and then if too many arcana showed up just dialed it back)

If we don't lynch power roles - then it is likely that we won't lynch today.  I mean - we are far more likely to hit scum (~18 roles?) than we are to hit pure vanilla town.

If you think Axxle is scummy - then we should force the claim, and then monitor him.  Unless he is pro town major arcana - even knowing that he's a power role won't necessarily make him a target - since the town is likely to be mostly power roles, and scum teams want to hunt eachother first - speaking from experience as a 2 time scum in a multi scumteam game. (IV, VI)

@Axxle - can you summarize the case against you for me?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #537 on: August 20, 2012, 05:48:30 pm »

@Axxle - can you summarize the case against you for me?
I talk too much and say too little.
My push against Robz for his actions against Angrybirds was scummy (dunno why you didn't get as much flak for this)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #538 on: August 20, 2012, 05:49:52 pm »

Unvote
Axxle seems to be interested in helping town again (yay), and I'm liking the semi-wagons we have less and less. I do realize I'd need to find an alternative lynch target fast though, so I'll try to come back with a vote soon.

Seriously guys, it's too late to be not voting!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #539 on: August 20, 2012, 05:52:27 pm »

So - if I can read this correctly - we have 11 possible VTs out of 52 cards?  (I'm not sure if cayvie drew N regular cards and M arcana, to get a desire or just mixed all of them together and then if too many arcana showed up just dialed it back)
Not all the "power roles" are really power roles though. Stuff like WOSV is more like a named townie tbh, the actual role is of so little utility. Making scum lie day1 is also quite beneficial, especially because all the cards all public and counterclaims can easily happen.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #540 on: August 20, 2012, 05:56:45 pm »

Yuma, angrybirds:  You guys barely have mentioned each other. Reads?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #541 on: August 20, 2012, 06:02:05 pm »

Galzria (1): angrybirds
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7, O
Axxle (2): Galzria, Voltgloss
shraeye (1): yuma
ehunt (1): O
Eevee (1): Grujah
Grujah (1): ftl


If this is correct, we really are in a world of hurt. How are we supposed to find majority in 45 hours, especially considering how both of the "major wagons" are slowly dying.

First instinct was to vote for Frisk, but then I remembered he has been lurky in all of the games recently. I do think he looks a bit scummy here. Then I thought of ehunt, becase he is playing quite different than the town-ehunt in MVI. Why is ehunt not being questioned more?

Vote: ehunt
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #542 on: August 20, 2012, 06:03:50 pm »

Yuma, angrybirds:  You guys barely have mentioned each other. Reads?

i need to do a comprehensive list or reads on everyone, but for now I'll answer that I think he is newb townie.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #543 on: August 20, 2012, 06:42:43 pm »

Shraeye's assessment.
angrybirds: There's something weird here.  I don't like that angrybirds made this vote basically from the start and hasn't changed it since.  Even after all the explaining he's done, it's hard to believe that angrybirds actually feels this way.  That's a read that I would build up over time, not one I would jump to after about 115 posts, one-fifth of which were confirming role-receiving, one-fifth of which were complete RVS, and then continue to hold until the post count reached 500.  Maybe he's scared to peel off of his initial assessment and jump on any bandwagon, since bandwagon lynches sometimes feel scummy.  Maybe he's not actively looking for any scumtells, so can't put down solid arguments explaining why A and B were scumtells from player X.  On rereading I don't like his response to Robz in #276; his posts and behavior did not speak for themselves, he had hardly any substantiative posts except to vaguely back up his snap-judgement on Galzria.  His putting Robz on suspicious list due to Robz "suspecting" him felt less like OMGUS, and more like "when people realize I bring heat when they suspect me, they will be very hesitant to do it.  This scum's surviving 'til the end, huzzah!"  I can understand you still holding suspicions on Galzria, but move your vote to something that's gonna happen this round, because clearly other people are not behind your Galzria-read.
Axxle: Well Axxle's purposful-ignoring of any accusations/heat really rubbed me the wrong way.  I can buy the arguement in #348 if this were day 2 or later and we had things of real substance to analyze/vote on.  But frankly, Day 1 townies know nothing, and that makes this start difficult for us. I rely on seeing how people react to get reads, since there is little else, but no reaction=hiding tells=suspicious to me.  I'm not asking you to spend the whole day defending yourself, but on day one where suspicion is sprayed around with a fire-hose and evidence is hard to find, you aren't spending your time better by broadcasting your opinion while ignoring any suspicion on you.  Buuuut, I'm looking at your softclaim and the list of possible roles (excluding Major Arcana, which I can only guess at).  I really hate how softly you put this claim, but it may have been just enough.  It's possible that you are town-aligned Vengeful.  I feel less gung-ho to lynch you after this claim, so I take back my previous scoff at its effectiveness.
Eevee:  Eevee was the first one to suggest lynching someone for being in the "wrong" suit even though this is easily manipulated, that felt like it was bound to give us a town-lynch.  Another person who's only made one vote.  I don't like people who hone in on one person and keep their vote there forever, that feels like very scum-fident (confident) voting.  Also, looking through his posts, I am floored by the lack of content.  Check it out for yourself!
ehunt: Really supported getting the conversations started, and helping newer players join in.  Firm in his anti-Axxle wagon stance.  I read him as townish, but he is also in hardcore lurk mode.  No posts in almost 2 days and over 100 posts, this is suspicious enough to remove all townish reads and send him at least down to neutral.  Looks like he was content to let Axxle-wagon happen while saying he disagreed instead of pushing his own suspicions of Frisk (convince us, dude! why should we vote for Frisk?). Frisk is his only vote so far, this pushes him down to scum-read.
Frisk: Very neutral read.  He seems to be trying hard to lynch correctly, and is moving his suspicions/questions around even though his vote has mostly been on Robz.  Can you tell us some more thoughts regarding different people, Frisk?
ftl: I think ftl did the right thing in trying to start a wagon, but he did back off too early.  His terribleness at vote-counting gives me a hilarious town-read.  So there you go, egregious mistakes=towntell in my eyes I guess.  He's been very liberal at moving his vote around, and rereads old posts.  Town in my eyes; however, he is in lurk mode now.
Galzria: Galz needs to post more substantiative stuff.  He had a unique read on Axxle, that was a legitimate reason for voting Axxle I believe.  He is in lurk mode, if not in post-count, then definitely in content.
Insomniac: Insomniac's post that cleared him from previous suspicion was #247.  He really seems to disappear for periods of time, but he's almost always returning to us with content-posts instead of witticisms and one-liners.  It really irks me that Insomniac hasn't cast his vote for anyone (do it, like, do it now! even if you're the first vote on someone; make a scum-prediction and back it up with a vote).  Regardless, I get slight town read from him.
Morgrim:  I really like the change he's made towards posting a bit more, and stating his analysis.  Even if it goes against how he "normally plays" I agree with Eevee that we should encourage good behavior instead of punishing it.  He suspects Galz, votes for Insomniac, jumps on Robz bandwagon.  But he doesn't jump on the Axxle one, which is a plus, because being part of every bandwagon just seems way too eager to lynch, regardless of correctness (if we find somebody doing this, I'm thinking SK).  I'm getting a slight town read, but definitely put him in my no-lynch category.
O: O makes what looks like a gut-reaction vote on Robz after Robz questions angrybirds, but I get a neutral read off this. I don't like your take on ehunt's person-summary; "very town" is a legitimate read without tyring to buddy up to someone.  He seems to be trying really hard to make a good lynch; not as many posts as others, but they are usually full of content.  I get a slight town-read.
Robz: Robz clearly started the game very lurker-y, but for good reason.  He immediately jumps into a spat with angrybirds.  I doesn't look like he deserved as much heat as he got, but he reacted to that heat pretty badly.  I still get a pretty neutral read on Robz, leaning slight town. His quick jump off Axxle felt weird, but I think he has the right of it.
sharkbait/Grujah: Really hard to read, natually, due to the switch.  Grujah, keep posting at your current great rate.  I'm not liking how content-less his posts have been, but keep in mind he missed out on the fun RVS phase that we all got to do.  Funtime is over, Grujah. We gotta push for a good lynch soon.  I'm keeping him at a neutral-to-scum read, but I'd still be ok with a Grujah lynch based on sharky's lurking followed by Grujah's being all over the place. 
shraeye: I'm me.  I write long posts.  I have long thoughts.  I get drunk.  It doesn't stop me from posting.
sparky: Sparky's vote-count hasn't been as high as some people's, but he is the king of content per post.  In his posts, he is clearly not afraid of letting everyone know what he's been thinking and has jumped on multiple suspicious actions, and this reads as town to me.  Even if you don't agree with my town-read on sparky, I would still put him in a no-lynch category because we always want people who are willing to provide analysis and information freely.  Though I don't like that he precalled me out in case Axxle flips town.  If sparky is scum, and is therefore more likely to know that Axxle is town, he is setting himself a nice fall-guy for a day 2 lynch.
Voltgloss: Also very unafraid to put out his opinion.  This puts him in a no-lynch category, since if he's scum I feel it will be easier to tell as the game goes on as opposed to a more reticent scum.  His call for everyone voting is a super pro-town move, he also appears to be very convincable to jump on different bandwagons.  Also, he is pushing pretty hard for a lurker to be lynched, which feels as long as we count lurkers as people lacking content instead of simply people with low post counts.
yuma: I really like the way he will ask questions of people (I think he's done this to Morgrim, Insomniac, maybe others) and doesn't let go.  It's much better to push for answers than to throw out questions as accusations and then move on if they don't pick up any momentum among other players.  This feels pretty towny to me.  I read his stubbornness of keeping his vote on me instead of just jumping on a Robz/Axxle wagon that seemed inevitable as town actually.  He doesn't want a lynch of Robz or Axxle because it's convenient, he wants a good lynch.  He should reread my posts if he still gets scum vibes from me, but I appreciate his push for a good lynch.

tl;dr
Well then read it!  I don't care if it's too long.  There are 2 questions there that I want answers to, and I need Insomniac to respond to my demands of him.
Summary
Lynches I would support: angrybirds (scummy/SK?), eevee (scummy), ehunt (not willing to defend/push his convictions on Frisk+slight scum), Galzria (waaay too lurkerish), Grujah(sharkbait lurking+Grujah's late RVSing)

No-lynch: ftl (town), Insomniac (slight town+good content), Morgrim (slight-town+finally giving content), O (slight town+good content), shraeye (town), Voltgloss (town+good content)

Everyone else is in a bit of a neutral category.  I don't want to lynch them yet, but I don't think I'd defend them yet.
Axxle (slight town), Frisk (neutral read), Robz (neutral to slight town), sparky (slight town, but I feel suspicioius), yuma (slight town)

Vote: Eevee
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #544 on: August 20, 2012, 06:52:48 pm »

Axxle: Well Axxle's purposful-ignoring of any accusations/heat really rubbed me the wrong way.  I can buy the arguement in #348 if this were day 2 or later and we had things of real substance to analyze/vote on.  But frankly, Day 1 townies know nothing, and that makes this start difficult for us. I rely on seeing how people react to get reads, since there is little else, but no reaction=hiding tells=suspicious to me.  I'm not asking you to spend the whole day defending yourself, but on day one where suspicion is sprayed around with a fire-hose and evidence is hard to find, you aren't spending your time better by broadcasting your opinion while ignoring any suspicion on you.  Buuuut, I'm looking at your softclaim and the list of possible roles (excluding Major Arcana, which I can only guess at).  I really hate how softly you put this claim, but it may have been just enough.  It's possible that you are town-aligned Vengeful.  I feel less gung-ho to lynch you after this claim, so I take back my previous scoff at its effectiveness.

Axxle (slight town)
???
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #545 on: August 20, 2012, 07:13:53 pm »

Eevee:  Eevee was the first one to suggest lynching someone for being in the "wrong" suit even though this is easily manipulated, that felt like it was bound to give us a town-lynch.  Another person who's only made one vote.  I don't like people who hone in on one person and keep their vote there forever, that feels like very scum-fident (confident) voting.  Also, looking through his posts, I am floored by the lack of content.  Check it out for yourself!
I had moved my vote from Axxle to ehunt before this post. I dont remember saying "we should lynch someone from the wrong suit", I just pointed out the odds of each of the suits having scum in them. IIRC I actually did it to point out it's a bad idea, but I'm not sure about that.[/quote]

Being part of every bandwagon just seems way too eager to lynch, regardless of correctness (if we find somebody doing this, I'm thinking SK).
I'm thinking playstyle (for the most part anyways). Hunting for the SK in a setup with gazillion players when we cant even find scum is.. not pro-town. Generally mafia wants the town to focus on SK-hunting.

Two random bulletpoints full of content:
* Generally I think posting drunk looks towny. Especially if it's a huge rant you obviously didn't proofread, it makes me think you are not afraid to post your honest thought. If you can't produce a single sentence without spelling errors, how confident can you be on your abilities to not leave scum tells? Then again, if you are the cocky kind of drunk you might thing "Well surely I will be able to!".

* Not reading back feels like an anti-town move from a townie to me. Mafia does not want to draw that kind of attention.  Grujah has to realize how anti-town not bothering to read back is when some guys read these threads twice or thrice, would he really be willing to risk town getting angry and policy lynching him if he was scum? Although, since I like serial killer hunting on day 1 so much.. serial killer cares the least about reads or whats happening around town. But then there is the unfortunate meta of subbing.. who wants to get subbed out from an awesome role? And most people consider scum roles pretty awesome.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #546 on: August 20, 2012, 07:29:10 pm »

1. Insomniac: Still scummy, but now less so.
2. Voltgloss: Lurking. Which is annoying.
3. Captain_Frisk: Would like to hear his reads on everyone.
4. shark_bait Grujah: I support this lynch.
5. Eevee: This one too.
6. Robz888: ARRRGGGG People he is scum.
7. O: O is being O.
8. yuma: Please give thoughts on everyone.
9. ftl: lurking.
10. Galzria: Ultralurk. Somewhat scummy.
11. shraeye: I like him. Townish.
12. angrybirds: Oh, I dunno. Maybe slightly town?
13. sparky5856: hahaha you voted for yourself and said it was a bad idea.
14. Morgrim7: How do you guys see me?
15. Axxle: ARRG I've had enough.
16. ehunt: Slight town.
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #547 on: August 20, 2012, 07:44:23 pm »

In same order as Morgrim:

Insomniac: I'll have a better idea once he votes... and an even better idea if he continues to not vote.

Voltgloss: On the Axxle wagon which I didn't agree with. But Axxle's softclaim complicates matters. I wouldn't want to lynch Axxle today, but he is becoming more lynchable. But this is supposed to be about Voltgloss...

Frisk: I know how it feels to want to vote Morgrim, so I don't feel the irk there.

Grujah: I don't care that he doesn't want to read the previous 20 pages. No big deal for me. Waiting to see more from him.

Robz: His reaction to angrybirds to me was completely justified and normal. His reaction to people reacting to him was him showing frustration in a frustrating situation. He could be mafia, but I wouldn't lynch him just because of that. If anything I see it as more evidence of town and would alleviate anything else suspicious that he might do.

O: I forget he is playing sometimes

ftl: Want him to keep the pressure on Grujah so we can see what we can get out of it.

Galz: Not the galz I remember from Mafia III. Like Voltgloss is on the Axxle wagon. What do you think Galz of people abandoning that wagon? When will you?

shraeye: I am much less suspicious of shraeye. First: he has continued with long posts. My suspicions of him did not change his behavior, I would expect that if he were mafia to change behavior but he has been consistent throughout, except that 2. his posts have a lot more content that I see as useful for town. Could still be mafia? Yes. But more important he isn't getting lynched today.

angrybirds: O Brother Where Art Thou? I disagree with shraeye about him, but maybe that is because I personally know him. He is playing just like his personality and in my opinion as a newbie town.

sparky: not a huge read on. Wish I had more to say here... maybe later

Morgrim7: You are doing it! You are adding content to the game. I knew you could do it!

Axxle: Softclaim was interesting and actually made him more suspicious in my eyes, but I still don't think we should vote for him.

ehunt: I agree with Eevee a lot here. My wife has dinner on the table, so I have to vote: ehunt and get back to this in my next post. I promise I will
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #548 on: August 20, 2012, 07:46:25 pm »

I'm not sure why everyone keeps forgetting I'm playing. I don't feel as if I've been lurking.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #549 on: August 20, 2012, 07:47:45 pm »

My reads on Eevee were wrong. Oh, goodness. Lack of content, weird voting suggestions, the whole shebang. He looks pretty scummy. But Robz is worse. For reconfirmation, VOTE: ROBZ888
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #550 on: August 20, 2012, 07:48:00 pm »

I'm not sure why everyone keeps forgetting I'm playing. I don't feel as if I've been lurking.
Town is freaking huge. You dont have an avatar.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #551 on: August 20, 2012, 07:49:10 pm »

Why should I abandon my vote on Axxle? Because everybody else is? I think his play is inconsistent with town-Axxle play. Being D1, certainly nothing else has jumped out at me.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #552 on: August 20, 2012, 07:49:32 pm »

Also both vote counts have me voting for both Ehunt and Robz. I'm just voting for Robz.
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #553 on: August 20, 2012, 07:50:38 pm »

My reads on Eevee were wrong. Oh, goodness. Lack of content, weird voting suggestions, the whole shebang. He looks pretty scummy. But Robz is worse. For reconfirmation, VOTE: ROBZ888
Could you expand on weird voting suggestions? Because I was just accused of not voting enough.  :) Are you referring to this:

Galzria (1): angrybirds
Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7, O
Axxle (2): Galzria, Voltgloss
shraeye (1): yuma
ehunt (1): O
Eevee (1): Grujah
Grujah (1): ftl


If this is correct, we really are in a world of hurt. How are we supposed to find majority in 45 hours, especially considering how both of the "major wagons" are slowly dying.

First instinct was to vote for Frisk, but then I remembered he has been lurky in all of the games recently. I do think he looks a bit scummy here. Then I thought of ehunt, becase he is playing quite different than the town-ehunt in MVI. Why is ehunt not being questioned more?

Vote: ehunt

and if so, what about it strikes to you as weird?

Galzria, you should abandon the vote IF it seems like Axxle wagon is not picking off.. because "wasting" your vote is essentially contributing into nolynch.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #554 on: August 20, 2012, 07:51:47 pm »

It's not a waste if it's on someone I find to be scummy.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #555 on: August 20, 2012, 07:53:02 pm »

It's not a waste if it's on someone I find to be scummy.
It is a waste of the lynch is never going to happen. If you want us to remember you were suspicious of Axxle in case sad things happen, just say so. Dont forget your vote there and contribute to us sliding into nolynch.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #556 on: August 20, 2012, 07:58:27 pm »

I'm still here. Distracted by Morgrim's BM a little, it's so much easier to find useful things to say there. I don't intentionally lurk.

Here - eh. We really are near deadline, and are sort of screwed.

Hmm, someone a ways back commented that I was giving angrybirds too much slack. At the time read like townie playing their first game and being suspicious of everybody. I liked that, and so didn't want a D1 lynch of him. Still don't I guess, but I don't remember anything he's said recently. ...ok, rereading he hasn't said much recently, but I still get a townread from some of his posts.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #557 on: August 20, 2012, 08:01:01 pm »

Fine. I still think that Axxle and Robz are town so I won't be voting for either of them but if it comes to deadline and they are the only options I'll vote for either. For now Vote: angrybirds I haven't seen ANYTHING from this guy since the Robz fight.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #558 on: August 20, 2012, 08:03:27 pm »

I really don't like how multiple people abandoned their Axxle-votes in response to his incredibly soft softclaim.  I worry that's encouraging a mode of behavior that scum can very easily use to escape any possible threat of a D1 lynch.

That said:  I find the recent votes on ehunt intriguing.  I went back to reread ehunt's contributions to the thread, and his insistence on voting Frisk for Morgrim-hunting feels... y'know how it feels?  It feels like the inverse of typical Morgrim-hunting but to just as much scummy effect.  The problem with Morgrim-hunting is that it gives scum an opportunity to park their vote on someone (Morgrim) without needing to offer a rationale for their vote, beyond "Morgrim is Morgrim."  Which is exactly what ehunt has done, but in a more subtle way:  he has parked his vote on someone (Frisk) without offering any rationale for his vote beyond "Morgrim is Morgrim."  He's just swapped out the usual "Morgrim's behavior is anti-town" and replaced it with "Morgrim's behavior may be anti-town in others but it's town for Morgrim."  But the end result is the same:  ehunt gets to excuse himself from participating in wagons anywhere else, because he's voting simply on the basis of Morgrim being Morgrim.

So yeah.  ehunt is dodging the responsibilities of voting.  That, to me, reads scummy.  And it's a subtle form of scummy, which worries me more than any Day 1 "obvscum" play.  Given the nearing deadline, this is a wagon I feel comfortable supporting.  Vote: ehunt.

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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #559 on: August 20, 2012, 08:38:45 pm »

It's not a waste if it's on someone I find to be scummy.

I think this was in response to me. I didn't intend to say that you should not vote Axxle, I don't think I should vote for Axxle. Instead I was wondering what it would take for you to abandon your vote on him. I think you interpreted it as "when are you going to abandon it, everyone else is and we need your vote elsewhere" whereas it was meant to ask what would cause you to do so.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #560 on: August 20, 2012, 09:48:20 pm »

Fine. I still think that Axxle and Robz are town so I won't be voting for either of them but if it comes to deadline and they are the only options I'll vote for either. For now Vote: angrybirds I haven't seen ANYTHING from this guy since the Robz fight.

has something changed since this?
How am I lurking hardcore? I've been posting quite a bit I just don't have a strong read this game because I'm pretty sure the robz/birds/axxle thing is a big town fight like timchen v galz in mvii

and hey you are capable of posting a vote! i dont know why people consider robz and my posts a fight. we were meerely discussing how we played and how we responded, i didnt even vote for him and he unvoted me. yes i am suspicious of him, but not necessarily more so than other people

so my galz vote isn't appreciated by others? i am going to join ehunt in his vote for frisk. vote: frisk he is lurkier than i am and i dont think robz's reaction warranted a vote, not to mention his morgrim RSV confusion. was it RSV or was it not?

oh and someone asked about my read on yuma. he is hard to read. he just left his shraye vote which he seemed pretty adamant about, but i could be seeing him in a negative light since he just voted for the person that i am agreeing with in ehunt
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #561 on: August 20, 2012, 09:55:30 pm »

It's not a waste if it's on someone I find to be scummy.

I think this was in response to me. I didn't intend to say that you should not vote Axxle, I don't think I should vote for Axxle. Instead I was wondering what it would take for you to abandon your vote on him. I think you interpreted it as "when are you going to abandon it, everyone else is and we need your vote elsewhere" whereas it was meant to ask what would cause you to do so.

Well, scummy behavior elsewhere. There's more than one scum in this game afterall, so I'm not hellbent on sticking to my guns on Axxle. I just haven't seen much reason to move it yet. If there's one thing I've learned about Towns this size, is that it is SO easy to fill with backround noise - and again, I'll point to Axxle as an example here. Count does not equal content. If everybody posted at the rate I usually do (or that Axxle is), we would end up with a 150+ page thread... And quite honestly, I don't have the energy to try to build a case in a thread that size.

Honestly, even now, I've seen SO many questions asked or accusations made (and then requoted (and then requoted again)) just go unanswered because they just get buried or ignored. Because of this, it makes it difficult to scumhunt with any real drive (not to mention the ridiculous difficulty in making a case against scum that can stick D1). So with that being the case, and the precedent that Axxle has set for Scum to softclaim their way out of a lynch, where do you really suggest to turn from here? My personal take is that we need to choose someone, who a general consensus (if not perfect majority) can admit has been scummy this game in some fashion - and lynch them. Analysis from the night very well may be our best friend here - Especially with at least 3 deaths likely.

Now, I could lay out my "willing to lynch" - "not willing to lynch" lists here as seems so often so popular, but honestly my D1 reads are usually about as accurate as anyone elses here - that is to say they're generally crap. I'm not getting an omg obvtown read on anybody this game, thus "anybody but me" is probably the truest I could answer. Sure, I think some people have better odds of being scum than others (Axxle, for instance), but there isn't anybody here that I would say "Ehh... Probably town, don't wanna lynch" about.

So the short answer of "When will you change your vote" is: When someone appears that's more scummy or the deadline approaches and there's a more likely candidate.

I'm still not sold that a lynch MUST occur - far from - but there's nobody here that I think has a below average chance of being scum, so my vote is pretty free right now.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #562 on: August 20, 2012, 09:58:41 pm »

Phone post. How many votes on me? I don't see how there's a case against me that's better than my case against frisk. The axxle and robz wagons are bad. Seems like case against me is: I tried to start a wagon on likely scum, no one wants to join (why?), therefore I am avoiding controversy. I would love for there to be controversy. Everyone not voting frisk: explain yourself!

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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #563 on: August 20, 2012, 10:00:55 pm »

Phone post. How many votes on me? I don't see how there's a case against me that's better than my case against frisk. The axxle and robz wagons are bad. Seems like case against me is: I tried to start a wagon on likely scum, no one wants to join (why?), therefore I am avoiding controversy. I would love for there to be controversy. Everyone not voting frisk: explain yourself!

There's no case on him, there is on Axxle.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #564 on: August 20, 2012, 10:04:06 pm »

Phone post. How many votes on me? I don't see how there's a case against me that's better than my case against frisk. The axxle and robz wagons are bad. Seems like case against me is: I tried to start a wagon on likely scum, no one wants to join (why?), therefore I am avoiding controversy. I would love for there to be controversy. Everyone not voting frisk: explain yourself!

There's no case on him, there is on Axxle.

Case on Axxle is nonsense. Lack of evidence on Frisk is because he's lurked hardcore, for which nobody is willing to vote him.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #565 on: August 20, 2012, 10:05:19 pm »

Phone post. How many votes on me? I don't see how there's a case against me that's better than my case against frisk. The axxle and robz wagons are bad. Seems like case against me is: I tried to start a wagon on likely scum, no one wants to join (why?), therefore I am avoiding controversy. I would love for there to be controversy. Everyone not voting frisk: explain yourself!

There's no case on him, there is on Axxle.

Case on Axxle is nonsense. Lack of evidence on Frisk is because he's lurked hardcore, for which nobody is willing to vote him.

Case on Axxle is strongest here, but thanks for defending! Let's us know where to go later.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #566 on: August 20, 2012, 10:07:04 pm »

I don't get why people are worried about me setting a precedent for softclaiming.  If I do flip scum, then the next time someone does it chances are people are just going to say "Nice try, not falling for that again."


*goes to go look through scum's posts for scumminess*
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #567 on: August 20, 2012, 10:30:45 pm »

Looked through Insomniac's posts.  I don't think I need to look at anyone else.  The only content he posted was about the Robz/AngryBirds/Me argument.  And even there he flip-flopped once on me and once on AngryBirds with no explanation. I'm liking this wagon.

Vote: Insomniac

summary:
#25 - RVS
#29 - small defense of frisk (with joke)
#33 - explanation of joke
#41 - joke vote
#63 - setup speculation
#119 - joke accusation
#141 - removal of joke vote
#157 - setup speculation
#162 - "I'm terrible" defense. setup speculation. 
#222 - trying to get player modkilled
#247 - saving face regarding setup speculation
#332 - Noncommittal "I'm still here" post
#334 - "I'm terrible" defense. First true content showing suspicion on me and Robz's wagon
#366 - joke
#370 - joke
#412 - Morgrim buddying
#420 - joke after suspicion placed on him indirectly
#450 - looks like content, but really reiteration of 334
#462 - fluff, lying fluff
#467 - promises to vote for me before deadline
#486 - "How am I lurking"... look at your posts.  Also backs away from all content he's given so far calling me town along with angrybirds and robz.
#491 - Scumhunting? What?! (Really just a very safe question to Grujah as to why he isn't catching up to the thread)
#510 - calling out lurkers (lol)
#557 - Reiterates me and Robz being town.  Votes Angrybirds for lurking (even though he called him town earlier the same IRL day)

The End
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #568 on: August 20, 2012, 10:33:38 pm »

vote: FTL

I've seen like no actual content from FTL. He gave literally no reason for his vote on me, and like one fiftieth of a reason for his vote on Grujah.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #569 on: August 20, 2012, 10:40:10 pm »

Looked through Insomniac's posts.  I don't think I need to look at anyone else.  The only content he posted was about the Robz/AngryBirds/Me argument.  And even there he flip-flopped once on me and once on AngryBirds with no explanation. I'm liking this wagon.

Vote: Insomniac

summary:
#25 - RVS
#29 - small defense of frisk (with joke)
#33 - explanation of joke
#41 - joke vote
#63 - setup speculation
#119 - joke accusation
#141 - removal of joke vote
#157 - setup speculation
#162 - "I'm terrible" defense. setup speculation. 
#222 - trying to get player modkilled
#247 - saving face regarding setup speculation
#332 - Noncommittal "I'm still here" post
#334 - "I'm terrible" defense. First true content showing suspicion on me and Robz's wagon
#366 - joke
#370 - joke
#412 - Morgrim buddying
#420 - joke after suspicion placed on him indirectly
#450 - looks like content, but really reiteration of 334
#462 - fluff, lying fluff
#467 - promises to vote for me before deadline
#486 - "How am I lurking"... look at your posts.  Also backs away from all content he's given so far calling me town along with angrybirds and robz.
#491 - Scumhunting? What?! (Really just a very safe question to Grujah as to why he isn't catching up to the thread)
#510 - calling out lurkers (lol)
#557 - Reiterates me and Robz being town.  Votes Angrybirds for lurking (even though he called him town earlier the same IRL day)

The End

I'll join vote: Insomniac but am willing to go back to Frisk is this proves fruitless
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #570 on: August 20, 2012, 11:26:08 pm »

@Eevee, no, it is you wanting to lynch because of someone's suit.

Anyway,
I'll join vote: Insomniac but am willing to go back to Frisk Robz isf this proves fruitless
. yeah.
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #571 on: August 20, 2012, 11:57:02 pm »

vote: FTL

I've seen like no actual content from FTL. He gave literally no reason for his vote on me, and like one fiftieth of a reason for his vote on Grujah.

Yeah, I haven't contributed too much. There was Goko, Dark Ages, and then RMM2, and then this thread just doesn't have anything which is too serious of a scum OR towntell from, like, anybody. I voted for you at one point, O, because rereading the thread up to that point you seemed sort of scummy, like the Troll O that made a wagon on me in Medical Mafia MV. Wasn't anything concrete, I guess the Ragevote in this thread reminded me of the trollvote in that one. Hmm. Still does I guess, now that you bring it up.

At this point I'll sheep Galz in the "will vote for anybody" mentality. At the risk of sheeping scum...
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #572 on: August 21, 2012, 03:07:58 am »

vote: FTL

I've seen like no actual content from FTL. He gave literally no reason for his vote on me, and like one fiftieth of a reason for his vote on Grujah.

Yeah, I haven't contributed too much. There was Goko, Dark Ages, and then RMM2, and then this thread just doesn't have anything which is too serious of a scum OR towntell from, like, anybody. I voted for you at one point, O, because rereading the thread up to that point you seemed sort of scummy, like the Troll O that made a wagon on me in Medical Mafia MV. Wasn't anything concrete, I guess the Ragevote in this thread reminded me of the trollvote in that one. Hmm. Still does I guess, now that you bring it up.

At this point I'll sheep Galz in the "will vote for anybody" mentality. At the risk of sheeping scum...
The thing is, though, you did post, if barely. You could have added some content, but what, you decided not to? Lame.
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Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #573 on: August 21, 2012, 04:05:01 am »

vote: FTL

I've seen like no actual content from FTL. He gave literally no reason for his vote on me, and like one fiftieth of a reason for his vote on Grujah.

Yeah, I haven't contributed too much. There was Goko, Dark Ages, and then RMM2, and then this thread just doesn't have anything which is too serious of a scum OR towntell from, like, anybody. I voted for you at one point, O, because rereading the thread up to that point you seemed sort of scummy, like the Troll O that made a wagon on me in Medical Mafia MV. Wasn't anything concrete, I guess the Ragevote in this thread reminded me of the trollvote in that one. Hmm. Still does I guess, now that you bring it up.

At this point I'll sheep Galz in the "will vote for anybody" mentality. At the risk of sheeping scum...
And all you contribute here is a defense?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #574 on: August 21, 2012, 04:09:05 am »

ftl is acting scummy.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #575 on: August 21, 2012, 04:57:36 am »

And all you contribute here is a defense?

I suppose. I need to find something else to say but I don't have anything really. I should go reread the thread again, but I've already done that and ended with, like, no new reads.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #576 on: August 21, 2012, 05:05:00 am »

And all you contribute here is a defense?

I suppose. I need to find something else to say but I don't have anything really. I should go reread the thread again, but I've already done that and ended with, like, no new reads.
Thoughts on Insomniac? on eHunt? those seem to be the new wagons.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #577 on: August 21, 2012, 05:50:48 am »

I'm being prodded. K.

ehunt:
dislikes loaded questions, prefers theory to rvs
suggests relying on past-game meta
against suit-claims
votes C_F for morgrim-hunting
talk about me and the 5th vote on Galz (survivalist unvote? Nah.)
dislikes Axxle wagon, before your softclaim
has reads: Voltgloss and galz and sharaye, town, C_F scum, robz and O and me light town, grujah light scum.
was against both the axxle and robz wagons.
keeps agitating for Frisk wagon

Hmm. Seems quite reasonable to me. Why's there a wagon on him again?

Because he's playing differently than MVI town ehunt, and because morgrim-hunter-hunting is just as bad as morgrim hunting, say Eevee and Volt. Idunno, those seem like reasonable reasons, I don't find them persuasive myself though. MVI I don't remember him well, and I'm pro morgrim-hunter-hunting. Doing it this early might be a mistake.

Neutral read, not scumread.

Insomniac:
summary:
#25 - RVS
#29 - small defense of frisk (with joke)
#33 - explanation of joke
#41 - joke vote
#63 - setup speculation
#119 - joke accusation
#141 - removal of joke vote
#157 - setup speculation
#162 - "I'm terrible" defense. setup speculation. 
#222 - trying to get player modkilled
#247 - saving face regarding setup speculation
#332 - Noncommittal "I'm still here" post
#334 - "I'm terrible" defense. First true content showing suspicion on me and Robz's wagon
#366 - joke
#370 - joke
#412 - Morgrim buddying
#420 - joke after suspicion placed on him indirectly
#450 - looks like content, but really reiteration of 334
#462 - fluff, lying fluff
#467 - promises to vote for me before deadline
#486 - "How am I lurking"... look at your posts.  Also backs away from all content he's given so far calling me town along with angrybirds and robz.
#491 - Scumhunting? What?! (Really just a very safe question to Grujah as to why he isn't catching up to the thread)
#510 - calling out lurkers (lol)
#557 - Reiterates me and Robz being town.  Votes Angrybirds for lurking (even though he called him town earlier the same IRL day)

The End
he does call out a few people in scattered ways. Yeah, looks scummy. I'm not sure that scum Insomniac would have been bold enough to suggest that suitclaim thing at the beginning while forgetting about Major Arcana, but maybe.

 Prefer an ins lynch to an ehunt lynch.

Actually, both of them accuse Frisk I think. Surprised Frisk isn't a wagon, everyone sort of has a little bit of distrust towards him but not enough for a vote.



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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #578 on: August 21, 2012, 10:16:33 am »

I'm mostly taking a shot in the dark here, but for the slimmest of reasons I guess I'm most okay with a lynch of ehunt. Vote: ehunt

Somebody said something about it was too easy for ehunt to go after frisk for going after Morgrim? That resonated with me. I went after the people who went after Morgrim when I was scum in MVI.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #579 on: August 21, 2012, 10:55:57 am »

Eevee:  Eevee was the first one to suggest lynching someone for being in the "wrong" suit even though this is easily manipulated, that felt like it was bound to give us a town-lynch.  Another person who's only made one vote.  I don't like people who hone in on one person and keep their vote there forever, that feels like very scum-fident (confident) voting.  Also, looking through his posts, I am floored by the lack of content.  Check it out for yourself!
I dont remember saying "we should lynch someone from the wrong suit", I just pointed out the odds of each of the suits having scum in them. IIRC I actually did it to point out it's a bad idea, but I'm not sure about that.
Wands and pentacles have 1 scum more than the cups and swords (4/14 and 5/14). Should we perhaps lynch a wand or a pentacle day1 then?
It's a shame you don't remember things Eevee, for you did the opposite of pointing out it's a bad idea, and I don't like seeing players contradict themselves without consequences.

Is lurking the major reason for Insomniac's wagon now?  Because although he's been away a lot, he usually returns with good content.  This is the opposite case with Eevee, who has disappeared in the past and returned with the fluffiest of fluff.  And now this lie Eevee's put out there...

Does anyone else get this feeling from Eevee?
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #580 on: August 21, 2012, 10:56:36 am »

Unofficial Vote Count:

Captain_Frisk (1): ehunt
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
Axxle (1): Galzria
ehunt (4): Eevee, yuma, Voltgloss, Robz888
Eevee (2): Grujah, shraeye
Grujah (2): ftl, sparky5856
angrybirds (1): Insomniac
Insomniac (2): Axxle, angrybirds
ftl (1): O

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #581 on: August 21, 2012, 10:59:47 am »

When's the deadline?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #582 on: August 21, 2012, 11:02:37 am »

Eevee:  Eevee was the first one to suggest lynching someone for being in the "wrong" suit even though this is easily manipulated, that felt like it was bound to give us a town-lynch.  Another person who's only made one vote.  I don't like people who hone in on one person and keep their vote there forever, that feels like very scum-fident (confident) voting.  Also, looking through his posts, I am floored by the lack of content.  Check it out for yourself!
I dont remember saying "we should lynch someone from the wrong suit", I just pointed out the odds of each of the suits having scum in them. IIRC I actually did it to point out it's a bad idea, but I'm not sure about that.
Wands and pentacles have 1 scum more than the cups and swords (4/14 and 5/14). Should we perhaps lynch a wand or a pentacle day1 then?
It's a shame you don't remember things Eevee, for you did the opposite of pointing out it's a bad idea, and I don't like seeing players contradict themselves without consequences.

Is lurking the major reason for Insomniac's wagon now?  Because although he's been away a lot, he usually returns with good content.  This is the opposite case with Eevee, who has disappeared in the past and returned with the fluffiest of fluff.  And now this lie Eevee's put out there...

Does anyone else get this feeling from Eevee?

If I was scum, I would be more careful.

But you are half right! This has happened in an earlier game too, and I don't know if it's the language barrier or what, but when I say:
Wands and pentacles have 1 scum more than the cups and swords (4/14 and 5/14). Should we perhaps lynch a wand or a pentacle day1 then?
, I do not mean "I think we should do this!", I mean to ask others opinions on an idea I just had. If I say "timchen giving your vote to Galzria to use is anti-town and ridiculous", I'm stating I think that is the case. When it ends with a question mark, in my case it is an actual question "what do others think?".

Oh and even if I was suggesting we lynch like that if we wound up claiming (I'm glad we didn't), I think that would be an excellent example of bad town play rather than scum play. In general, proposing something that is obviously scummy is not a mafia tell imo, and we lynch "bad" townies (ones who made a mistake) way too often here.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #583 on: August 21, 2012, 11:08:31 am »

When's the deadline?

Thursday at 3 p.m. EDT, per the intro post.  So just under 51 hours from now.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #584 on: August 21, 2012, 11:09:01 am »

Sorry, meant to write just OVER 51 hours.  (Just under 52 hours.)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #585 on: August 21, 2012, 11:10:24 am »

Sorry, meant to write just OVER 51 hours.  (Just under 52 hours.)
Hopefully that won't make a difference.  :)
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #586 on: August 21, 2012, 12:15:16 pm »

I will be V/LA starting tomorrow night; moreover, my ability to phone-post will be spotty. I will try to make up for it by checking frequently today.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #587 on: August 21, 2012, 12:25:30 pm »

So I just noticed a few things after one of Axxle's more recent posts caught me off guard. Specifically this one.

And all you contribute here is a defense?

I suppose. I need to find something else to say but I don't have anything really. I should go reread the thread again, but I've already done that and ended with, like, no new reads.
Thoughts on Insomniac? on eHunt? those seem to be the new wagons.

I thought to myself wait there's only two new wagons, I disagree and this seems to be conversation/town leading but I decided to go back and see who started the 'two' wagons.

Looked through Insomniac's posts.  I don't think I need to look at anyone else.  The only content he posted was about the Robz/AngryBirds/Me argument.  And even there he flip-flopped once on me and once on AngryBirds with no explanation. I'm liking this wagon.

Vote: Insomniac

summary:
#25 - RVS
#29 - small defense of frisk (with joke)
#33 - explanation of joke
#41 - joke vote
#63 - setup speculation
#119 - joke accusation
#141 - removal of joke vote
#157 - setup speculation
#162 - "I'm terrible" defense. setup speculation. 
#222 - trying to get player modkilled
#247 - saving face regarding setup speculation
#332 - Noncommittal "I'm still here" post
#334 - "I'm terrible" defense. First true content showing suspicion on me and Robz's wagon
#366 - joke
#370 - joke
#412 - Morgrim buddying
#420 - joke after suspicion placed on him indirectly
#450 - looks like content, but really reiteration of 334
#462 - fluff, lying fluff
#467 - promises to vote for me before deadline
#486 - "How am I lurking"... look at your posts.  Also backs away from all content he's given so far calling me town along with angrybirds and robz.
#491 - Scumhunting? What?! (Really just a very safe question to Grujah as to why he isn't catching up to the thread)
#510 - calling out lurkers (lol)
#557 - Reiterates me and Robz being town.  Votes Angrybirds for lurking (even though he called him town earlier the same IRL day)

The End

Looks like Axxle started the Insomniac wagon, hmm ok fair enough.

And eHunt outed himself.

I'm going to look over posts later looking for these specifically:

Someone who said they don't like either wagon and did not give an alternative to lynch.
Someone who hasn't weighed in on our wagons at all.

If someone can save me the trouble of searching that'd be great.  I think scum are among these.

I'm probably violating criterion one in your list, although I have been voting for Frisk all day and am surprised nobody has joined me.



(I skipped people who are currently voting for me and Robz)

I think we'll find scum among those three.

Unvote

I'll reread all of these player's posts later and push the scummiest player for lynch.

Hmm looks like he ALSO started saying eHunt looked scummy and this was pointed out by the HOOVER DAMMIT post by sparky5856 on page 22.

So ok Axxle is currently, guiding the town into thinking there is only 2 wagons, both of which he started, he did the whole super softclaim thing which I don't think is good for the f.DS meta whether he is scum or not.

Vote: Axxle
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #588 on: August 21, 2012, 12:26:37 pm »

Prefer an ins lynch to an ehunt lynch.

Actually, both of them accuse Frisk I think. Surprised Frisk isn't a wagon, everyone sort of has a little bit of distrust towards him but not enough for a vote.

This is not true, I suspect scum Frisk would be more involved.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #589 on: August 21, 2012, 02:39:56 pm »

I thought more people were voting for you Insom.  But yeah, I did draw attention to eHunt and you, but others were the ones who really grew the eHunt wagon.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #590 on: August 21, 2012, 06:23:22 pm »

I want to remark on accusations that I am behaving differently from MVI (i will answer the argument that morgrim-hunting-hunting is a scumtell in a separate post). Very early Day One in MVI I was actually accused of hardcore lurking (by Frisk, I think, in a statistics post). However, I got into gear before the end of Day One and really pushed some analysis hard (including being the key proponent for that day's (mis)lynch).

I acknowledge that I haven't gotten into gear in the same way this game. I at least think I've put my word in on every major fight, which is more than can be said for most people (but less than can be said for some). I just haven't been as into this game. I was more or less obsessed with MVI, it was all I thought about for weeks. This game I check several times daily, but it's just not the same level of obsession.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #591 on: August 21, 2012, 06:28:58 pm »

This town is dead and I am sad because, like ehunt, I totally get the feeling of not-being-obsessive about this game, for some reason.

Vote: Insomniac
.

I had a townish read on angrybirds before, I have a townish read on Axxle now, they're both voting for Insom, I already thought insom was more scummy than ehunt. I think I want to make this my day's lynch. This is a wagon which might happen and which I could sort of get behind, at least consider it more than RVS.

Just under 2 days left. Time to rile this town up. Jump on the wagon, people. To L-1 and beyond!
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #592 on: August 21, 2012, 06:29:16 pm »

I want to remark on the argument that morgrim-hunting-hunting is a scumtell. I think that morgrim-hunting-hunting-hunting is a stronger scumtell.

[annoying f.ds mafia history]
Robz, I don't think you Morgrim-hunting-hunted in MVI. You defended Morgrim (even though he was town and you were scum), but I don't recall you FoS'ing or voting for anyone who voted for him on the basis of that alone. Maybe I am wrong. Grujah is the only one I remember Morgrim-hunting-hunting, which was a little unfair since Morgrim's townitude was mod-confirmed to Grujah in that game.
[/annoying f.ds mafia history]

I do agree that Morgrim-hunting-hunting suffers from the same problem as Morgrim-hunting (it's "too easy.") I don't agree that this gives Morgrim-hunters a blank check. I also think that Frisk's insistence that his Morgrim-hunting was pure RVS when backing away from it was independently scummy, regardless of your position on Morgrim-hunting in the abstract.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #593 on: August 21, 2012, 08:18:19 pm »


Anyway,
I'll join vote: Insomniac but am willing to go back to Frisk Robz isf this proves fruitless
. yeah.

why aren't you voting for insomniac?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #594 on: August 21, 2012, 08:37:26 pm »

unvote Ftl has since provided content.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #595 on: August 21, 2012, 08:38:20 pm »

I want to remark on the argument that morgrim-hunting-hunting is a scumtell. I think that morgrim-hunting-hunting-hunting is a stronger scumtell.

vote: ehunt for this piece of work.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #596 on: August 21, 2012, 09:05:43 pm »

How is that scummy? It might be confusing, but I don't think it's necessarily something that scum would say rather than town.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #597 on: August 21, 2012, 09:28:54 pm »

How is that scummy? It might be confusing, but I don't think it's necessarily something that scum would say rather than town.

Because it's so ridiculously contrived, and it's obviously not a scumtell to be morgrim hunting hunting hunting?

Hell, he just forced us to introduce the term Morgrim Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting. IE stupid jockeying between two people.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #598 on: August 21, 2012, 09:40:09 pm »

How is that scummy? It might be confusing, but I don't think it's necessarily something that scum would say rather than town.

Because it's so ridiculously contrived, and it's obviously not a scumtell to be morgrim hunting hunting hunting?

Hell, he just forced us to introduce the term Morgrim Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting. IE stupid jockeying between two people.

It's the unstoppable Morgrim Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Party stack!

On a serious note:  It's also a thinly veiled OMGUS.  "I'm not scummy, the people suspecting me are scummy!"
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #599 on: August 21, 2012, 09:41:01 pm »

How is that scummy? It might be confusing, but I don't think it's necessarily something that scum would say rather than town.

Because it's so ridiculously contrived, and it's obviously not a scumtell to be morgrim hunting hunting hunting?

Hell, he just forced us to introduce the term Morgrim Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting. IE stupid jockeying between two people.

It's the unstoppable Morgrim Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Party stack!

On a serious note:  It's also a thinly veiled OMGUS.  "I'm not scummy, the people suspecting me are scummy!"

I honestly can't believe I forgot to mention that. derp derp derp.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #600 on: August 21, 2012, 09:44:38 pm »

Right, it's OMGUS.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #601 on: August 21, 2012, 10:09:50 pm »

What is wrong with this game?  We're 2 days to deadline, and we can't even get a candidate to 50% of the votes required to lynch?

I'm going to go full meta and say that I will not vote for eHunt.  His lock on my scummitude reads the same way as M6, but its a lot funnier this time because he's wrong this time, and every time he says something, I just think about drunken kickball - which is the 2nd best thing to ever happen to this forum (#1 is the DXV lynching of Personman)

A few people have asked for my reads on everyone.  I apologize - but I don't have time for that tonight.

Galzria - you've only posted 10% more than me this game.  What's going on? 

mod - can we get a prod on shark_bait / grujah? 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #602 on: August 21, 2012, 10:15:12 pm »

What is wrong with this game?  We're 2 days to deadline, and we can't even get a candidate to 50% of the votes required to lynch?

I'm going to go full meta and say that I will not vote for eHunt.  His lock on my scummitude reads the same way as M6, but its a lot funnier this time because he's wrong this time, and every time he says something, I just think about drunken kickball - which is the 2nd best thing to ever happen to this forum (#1 is the DXV lynching of Personman)

A few people have asked for my reads on everyone.  I apologize - but I don't have time for that tonight.

Galzria - you've only posted 10% more than me this game.  What's going on?

mod - can we get a prod on shark_bait / grujah?

Yes, and there's already 600+ pages to slog through D1... M-VI was a nightmare in the later days trying to go back and build a case against people. Results and actions will be far more useful in days to come, I think. No need to flood with unneeded noise (like this post of mine here).
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #603 on: August 21, 2012, 10:15:41 pm »

600+ posts*, obviously.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #604 on: August 21, 2012, 10:27:46 pm »

How is that scummy? It might be confusing, but I don't think it's necessarily something that scum would say rather than town.

Because it's so ridiculously contrived, and it's obviously not a scumtell to be morgrim hunting hunting hunting?

Hell, he just forced us to introduce the term Morgrim Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting. IE stupid jockeying between two people.

It's the unstoppable Morgrim Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Hunting Party stack!

On a serious note:  It's also a thinly veiled OMGUS.  "I'm not scummy, the people suspecting me are scummy!"

Phone post. Phrase Morgrim hunting hunting hunting intended lightheartedly, thought this was clear.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #605 on: August 21, 2012, 11:09:09 pm »

What is wrong with this game?  We're 2 days to deadline, and we can't even get a candidate to 50% of the votes required to lynch?

Well, we have one candidate past the 50% mark (ehunt, with 5 votes), but you decided you won't vote for him.  :p

That said, the OMGUS discussion re: ehunt brought something else to my eye:  Insomniac's #587 reply to Axxle.  Which is really blatant OMGUS.  Rather than address Axxle's actual argument - that Insom's post history lacks content and shows flip-flopping - Insom instead turned around and attacked (and voted) Axxle for allegedly "starting two wagons."  And I have to agree with Axxle that the ehunt wagon has been driven by others (me included). 

I've been suspicious of Axxle before, but Insom's response feels even scummier to me.  I still like my ehunt vote but I think Insom just became my #2 choice.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #606 on: August 21, 2012, 11:18:36 pm »

Well, let's build pressure now, instead of within 24 hours to deadline, shall we? vote: ehunt.

Not only was he lurking early game (to the point that I quite literally forgot he was here), but he's come during the last 24 hours or so and seemed to push to disband the few wagons we did have going - wagons that I still like more than anybody here (Axxle).
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #607 on: August 21, 2012, 11:20:14 pm »

Well, let's build pressure now, instead of within 24 hours to deadline, shall we? vote: ehunt.

Not only was he lurking early game (to the point that I quite literally forgot he was here), but he's come during the last 24 hours or so and seemed to push to disband the few wagons we did have going - wagons that I still like more than anybody here (Axxle).

One post ago, you just defended the practice of not posting too much.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #608 on: August 21, 2012, 11:23:41 pm »

O's case on me scummiest (ehunt used the word hunting three times in a row, therefore i'll push his wagon over the 50% line), Galz second scummiest (I've been derailing the terrible axxle wagon for days!).
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #609 on: August 21, 2012, 11:23:53 pm »

Well, let's build pressure now, instead of within 24 hours to deadline, shall we? vote: ehunt.

Not only was he lurking early game (to the point that I quite literally forgot he was here), but he's come during the last 24 hours or so and seemed to push to disband the few wagons we did have going - wagons that I still like more than anybody here (Axxle).

One post ago, you just defended the practice of not posting too much.

Your point? Deadline is coming, and we really should lynch someone scummy. My Axxle vote is going nowhere. You're more scummy to me than Insomniac. So the vote goes on you.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #610 on: August 21, 2012, 11:25:09 pm »

O's case on me scummiest (ehunt used the word hunting three times in a row, therefore i'll push his wagon over the 50% line), Galz second scummiest (I've been derailing the terrible axxle wagon for days!).

Axxle is still, hands down no question the scummiest person ITT.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #611 on: August 21, 2012, 11:29:44 pm »

unvote - wagon on me scummier than anything cf did.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #612 on: August 21, 2012, 11:34:02 pm »

Robz eevee yuma all seem town, although robz vote on me scummy. Galzria seemed town until his recent inconsistency. Volt i'm not sure on. Scummiest on wagon is still probably O.

vote: O
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #613 on: August 21, 2012, 11:35:20 pm »

Robz eevee yuma all seem town, although robz vote on me scummy. Galzria seemed town until his recent inconsistency. Volt i'm not sure on. Scummiest on wagon is still probably O.

vote: O

What inconsistency?
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #614 on: August 21, 2012, 11:38:08 pm »

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #615 on: August 21, 2012, 11:43:59 pm »

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

It's your defense of Axxle that makes you scummy more than anything.

And yeah, I noted yesterday that I had that "holy expletive" moment when I realized you were in the game. Did you just happen to forget that post of mine?
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #616 on: August 21, 2012, 11:48:05 pm »

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

It's your defense of Axxle that makes you scummy more than anything.

And yeah, I noted yesterday that I had that "holy expletive" moment when I realized you were in the game. Did you just happen to forget that post of mine?

Before you said the axxle defense was scummy because I did it at the last minute. Now you say the defense qua the defense is scummy. I'm not going to debate somebody who shifts his arguments around instead of listening and acknowledging when he's wrong. It's not my fault that you didn't notice my earlier posts defending axxle.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #617 on: August 21, 2012, 11:52:19 pm »

I'm warming to an eHunt lynch because of recent OMGUS.

@eHunt: remind me why you were voting for Frisk?

Why are you voting for Frisk, again?

He (possibly RVS) votes Morgrim. Later, a fight about Morgrim happens; Frisk defends the case on Morgrim. I call him out for it and vote. He responds sarcastically. Time passes, and then he unvotes, saying it was just RVS, even though he had been defensive about it before. He's posted 8 times since then, and that was like a week ago. In those 8 posts, his only substantive one is IIoA. He also voted for Robz, a wagon that I don't like at all.

I did not see CF defend his case on Morgrim *at all* except for joking (bad in itself).  You calling out Morgrim seemed to be a joke, so I'm not surprised CF responded sarcastically, especially if it really was RVS.


side note: If Morgrim flips scum, eHunt is scum, but not necessarily the other way around.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #618 on: August 21, 2012, 11:56:38 pm »

I'm warming to an eHunt lynch because of recent OMGUS.

@eHunt: remind me why you were voting for Frisk?

Why are you voting for Frisk, again?

He (possibly RVS) votes Morgrim. Later, a fight about Morgrim happens; Frisk defends the case on Morgrim. I call him out for it and vote. He responds sarcastically. Time passes, and then he unvotes, saying it was just RVS, even though he had been defensive about it before. He's posted 8 times since then, and that was like a week ago. In those 8 posts, his only substantive one is IIoA. He also voted for Robz, a wagon that I don't like at all.

I did not see CF defend his case on Morgrim *at all* except for joking (bad in itself).  You calling out Morgrim seemed to be a joke, so I'm not surprised CF responded sarcastically, especially if it really was RVS.


side note: If Morgrim flips scum, eHunt is scum, but not necessarily the other way around.

194, which I didn't read as a joke.

Omgus is not a tell and I don't know why this forum thinks it is. There's a wagon on me fueled in part by terrible arguments. I'm going to assume scum are making them and call it as I see it. No regrets.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #619 on: August 22, 2012, 12:00:28 am »

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

It's your defense of Axxle that makes you scummy more than anything.

And yeah, I noted yesterday that I had that "holy expletive" moment when I realized you were in the game. Did you just happen to forget that post of mine?

Before you said the axxle defense was scummy because I did it at the last minute. Now you say the defense qua the defense is scummy. I'm not going to debate somebody who shifts his arguments around instead of listening and acknowledging when he's wrong. It's not my fault that you didn't notice my earlier posts defending axxle.

I said "cases" derailed, not "case". I cited Axxle because he's the wagon I felt had merit. Your exact statement was"Robz and Axxle wagons are bad". No explanation was given, just "they're bad, now go look somewhere else"... And this is within 72 hours to the deadline. It's intentionally stirring things up late, with no real reason, and it read scummy to me. ((#562, in case you forgot))
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #620 on: August 22, 2012, 12:03:42 am »

I wasn't responding to Axxle's accusation of me, I don't see any merit to it I haven't been any more flip floppy or lurky than anyone else here. My post was calling out Axxle for doing some super scummy things recently in his attempt to appear pro-town.
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #621 on: August 22, 2012, 12:05:54 am »

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

It's your defense of Axxle that makes you scummy more than anything.

And yeah, I noted yesterday that I had that "holy expletive" moment when I realized you were in the game. Did you just happen to forget that post of mine?

Before you said the axxle defense was scummy because I did it at the last minute. Now you say the defense qua the defense is scummy. I'm not going to debate somebody who shifts his arguments around instead of listening and acknowledging when he's wrong. It's not my fault that you didn't notice my earlier posts defending axxle.

I said "cases" derailed, not "case". I cited Axxle because he's the wagon I felt had merit. Your exact statement was"Robz and Axxle wagons are bad". No explanation was given, just "they're bad, now go look somewhere else"... And this is within 72 hours to the deadline. It's intentionally stirring things up late, with no real reason, and it read scummy to me. ((#562, in case you forgot))

Reasons for both given earlier. Through debating you, you don't read my posts then act like I didn't make any and you refuse to acknowledge when you are wrong.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #622 on: August 22, 2012, 12:09:01 am »

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

It's your defense of Axxle that makes you scummy more than anything.

And yeah, I noted yesterday that I had that "holy expletive" moment when I realized you were in the game. Did you just happen to forget that post of mine?

Before you said the axxle defense was scummy because I did it at the last minute. Now you say the defense qua the defense is scummy. I'm not going to debate somebody who shifts his arguments around instead of listening and acknowledging when he's wrong. It's not my fault that you didn't notice my earlier posts defending axxle.

I said "cases" derailed, not "case". I cited Axxle because he's the wagon I felt had merit. Your exact statement was"Robz and Axxle wagons are bad". No explanation was given, just "they're bad, now go look somewhere else"... And this is within 72 hours to the deadline. It's intentionally stirring things up late, with no real reason, and it read scummy to me. ((#562, in case you forgot))

Reasons for both given earlier. Through debating you, you don't read my posts then act like I didn't make any and you refuse to acknowledge when you are wrong.

I would need to be wrong to admit it, sorry.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #623 on: August 22, 2012, 12:10:30 am »

I wasn't responding to Axxle's accusation of me, I don't see any merit to it I haven't been any more flip floppy or lurky than anyone else here. My post was calling out Axxle for doing some super scummy things recently in his attempt to appear pro-town.
What the heck is this in response to?
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #624 on: August 22, 2012, 12:11:21 am »

What is wrong with this game?  We're 2 days to deadline, and we can't even get a candidate to 50% of the votes required to lynch?

Well, we have one candidate past the 50% mark (ehunt, with 5 votes), but you decided you won't vote for him.  :p

That said, the OMGUS discussion re: ehunt brought something else to my eye:  Insomniac's #587 reply to Axxle.  Which is really blatant OMGUS.  Rather than address Axxle's actual argument - that Insom's post history lacks content and shows flip-flopping - Insom instead turned around and attacked (and voted) Axxle for allegedly "starting two wagons."  And I have to agree with Axxle that the ehunt wagon has been driven by others (me included). 

I've been suspicious of Axxle before, but Insom's response feels even scummier to me.  I still like my ehunt vote but I think Insom just became my #2 choice.

This.
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #625 on: August 22, 2012, 12:19:18 am »

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

It's your defense of Axxle that makes you scummy more than anything.

And yeah, I noted yesterday that I had that "holy expletive" moment when I realized you were in the game. Did you just happen to forget that post of mine?

Before you said the axxle defense was scummy because I did it at the last minute. Now you say the defense qua the defense is scummy. I'm not going to debate somebody who shifts his arguments around instead of listening and acknowledging when he's wrong. It's not my fault that you didn't notice my earlier posts defending axxle.

I said "cases" derailed, not "case". I cited Axxle because he's the wagon I felt had merit. Your exact statement was"Robz and Axxle wagons are bad". No explanation was given, just "they're bad, now go look somewhere else"... And this is within 72 hours to the deadline. It's intentionally stirring things up late, with no real reason, and it read scummy to me. ((#562, in case you forgot))

Reasons for both given earlier. Through debating you, you don't read my posts then act like I didn't make any and you refuse to acknowledge when you are wrong.

The thing is, you say you explained yourself before... But what? From #562, your previous post was #512/#513 -  which weren't explanations, but almost the exact same thing as #562: "Robz & Axxle are bad, vote CF" - and prior to that you need to go back to post #383 where you posted anything that resembled a defense of those wagons - and as O pointed out, your reasons for calling them "bad" were crap then too.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #626 on: August 22, 2012, 12:19:34 am »

Robz eevee yuma all seem town, although robz vote on me scummy. Galzria seemed town until his recent inconsistency. Volt i'm not sure on. Scummiest on wagon is still probably O.

vote: O

*Still* probably O?

herp derp I just joined your wagon wat is this derp.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #627 on: August 22, 2012, 12:25:31 am »

Although Insomniac's post history is light on content, I think Axxle's summary in #567 is not accurate.  There are some things that felt contentful to me but Axxle just bundles a whole post up with the summary "im terrible defense".  The one thing that stands out here is the last part, where when Insomniac is prodded to finally vote, he puts it on angrybirds, after saying that the angrybirds/Robz situation felt town-on-town to him.

Regardless, I'm still gunning for eevee.  I'm not super sold on ehunt; he's on my will-lynch list, but he's not #1.  That's still Eevee.  Also, yuma shifted over to my feels-scummy list, as when he makes his player-by-player analysis in #547, he leaves Eevee out.  I'm feeling scumbuddies here.  Seriously.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #628 on: August 22, 2012, 12:28:51 am »

Robz eevee yuma all seem town, although robz vote on me scummy. Galzria seemed town until his recent inconsistency. Volt i'm not sure on. Scummiest on wagon is still probably O.

vote: O

*Still* probably O?

herp derp I just joined your wagon wat is this derp.

"Still" there = "despite galzria's contradictory posts", not "despite the passage of time"
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #629 on: August 22, 2012, 12:30:02 am »

Robz eevee yuma all seem town, although robz vote on me scummy. Galzria seemed town until his recent inconsistency. Volt i'm not sure on. Scummiest on wagon is still probably O.

vote: O

*Still* probably O?

herp derp I just joined your wagon wat is this derp.

"Still" there = "despite galzria's contradictory posts", not "despite the passage of time"

and why am I scummiest? why won't you defend your ridiculous "morgrim hunting hunting hunting" comment?
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #630 on: August 22, 2012, 12:30:26 am »

in fact, this is an OMGUS vote to someone who voted for you because of your OMGUS play.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #631 on: August 22, 2012, 12:32:45 am »

Robz eevee yuma all seem town, although robz vote on me scummy. Galzria seemed town until his recent inconsistency. Volt i'm not sure on. Scummiest on wagon is still probably O.

vote: O

*Still* probably O?

herp derp I just joined your wagon wat is this derp.

"Still" there = "despite galzria's contradictory posts", not "despite the passage of time"

and why am I scummiest? why won't you defend your ridiculous "morgrim hunting hunting hunting" comment?

As I said before, it was obviously made lightly. You are scummiest because you tried to turn that into a case. With Galz there's always the possibility that he's just town who won't listen to reason. You, however, know better.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #632 on: August 22, 2012, 12:33:43 am »

in fact, this is an OMGUS vote to someone who voted for you because of your OMGUS play.

I think omgus is a terrible tell. If scum vote for me, i'm going to call them out.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #633 on: August 22, 2012, 12:35:51 am »

You, however, know better.

You have not yet been in a completed game where I was town. I'm not sure why you think I know better.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #634 on: August 22, 2012, 12:37:11 am »

Hey guys, I feel like we've reached the point where we've stopped making forward progress in this fight.  It's ridiculously hard for me to tell who's angry at whom, and now I'll have to review probably 100 posts to keep up with it.  I propose an hour break, then come back and level-headedly explain what you think and why you think it.  Stop stretching this fighting out.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #635 on: August 22, 2012, 12:38:32 am »

Sorry, I meant to say who is angry at the other for which reasons. 

Regardless, all I know is that two players are sounding really upset.  Put this on ice, fall asleep, come back in the morning where we'll have a lot of work to do.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #636 on: August 22, 2012, 12:39:15 am »

Hey guys, I feel like we've reached the point where we've stopped making forward progress in this fight.  It's ridiculously hard for me to tell who's angry at whom, and now I'll have to review probably 100 posts to keep up with it.  I propose an hour break, then come back and level-headedly explain what you think and why you think it.  Stop stretching this fighting out.

this game is called mafia. If you give people less time to prepare their remarks thats better, not worse, because we WANT someone (scum) to slip up.

Also I don't believe any players are actually upset here.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #637 on: August 22, 2012, 12:39:34 am »

You, however, know better.

You have not yet been in a completed game where I was town. I'm not sure why you think I know better.

I mean that I think I understand the way you think about this game well enough to deduce that you can't genuinely have thought saying "morgrim hunting hunting hunting" is a tell.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #638 on: August 22, 2012, 12:40:22 am »

You, however, know better.

You have not yet been in a completed game where I was town. I'm not sure why you think I know better.

I mean that I think I understand the way you think about this game well enough to deduce that you can't genuinely have thought saying "morgrim hunting hunting hunting" is a tell.

of course I don't. I just think it's stupid. But I think you're scum anyways.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #639 on: August 22, 2012, 12:40:57 am »

Sorry, I meant to say who is angry at the other for which reasons. 

Regardless, all I know is that two players are sounding really upset.  Put this on ice, fall asleep, come back in the morning where we'll have a lot of work to do.

I'm upset that there's a wagon on me, but not like  suffering emotional distress. I agree with O that spontaneous posting is best. You'll be able to catch up.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #640 on: August 22, 2012, 12:49:34 am »

Hey eHunt! I just went back and read every post you've made. Care to point me where your great cases for why Axxle and Robz wagons are bad were actually made? You know, instead of calling me unreasonable and wrong, you might want to do some research of your own posts.

Maybe you're referencing this great post?

I don't like the Axxle wagon at all. Robz, I think definitely you were in the right in your spat with Axxle, but you weren't like, so overwhelmingly in the right that anybody seeing it differently must be scum. Can you give more reasons for the vote?

Or maybe this one on Robz?

Robz's absence from earlier is due to well-documented V/LAness. His hard press on angrybirds, followed by his backing off, does not strike me as scummy at all. It's very typical day one play for anyone, especially for Robz. I don't understand why he's got so many votes.

Wow. Great stuff. Compelling.

.....

You wanna call me wrong? Fine. Show me. Where are these great cases that you've made that I choose not to read?
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #641 on: August 22, 2012, 12:50:39 am »

O: 629 and 638 ridiculous contradiction.

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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #642 on: August 22, 2012, 12:51:57 am »

O: 629 and 638 ridiculous contradiction.

I want you to defend the comment. No, it's not the primary reason I'm voting for you.

Not really a ridiculous contradiction.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #643 on: August 22, 2012, 12:52:55 am »

Galz: you left out an axxle defense. Phone posting, will find tomorrow morning. Yes, that was my robz defense. Don't know why you don't like it.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #644 on: August 22, 2012, 12:54:23 am »

Actually no, that's it on axxle, my bad.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #645 on: August 22, 2012, 12:55:21 am »

There are two wagons, and I think both of them are on town. A lot of y'all say Axxle's softclaim means nothing; I disagree and moreover I think it's a pro-town move (given that he was the likeliest lynch) to make it now instead of later.

You must be referring to this one? The one that was "in the last 24 hours or so"?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #646 on: August 22, 2012, 12:59:51 am »

O: 629 and 638 ridiculous contradiction.

I want you to defend the comment. No, it's not the primary reason I'm voting for you.

Not really a ridiculous contradiction.

The "of course" is what makes the contradiction. I think this is devastating.

Also, "not the primary reason?" It's the ONLY reason cited in the post you vote for me.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #647 on: August 22, 2012, 01:02:08 am »

The "of course" is what makes the contradiction. I think this is devastating.


Regardless of your alignment the desperation you're showing here is digging you a deep, deep hole.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #648 on: August 22, 2012, 01:03:28 am »

The "of course" is what makes the contradiction. I think this is devastating.


Regardless of your alignment the desperation you're showing here is digging you a deep, deep hole.

I don't follow. Anyway, I'm going to bed, please don't anyone hammer before I wake up.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #649 on: August 22, 2012, 01:36:08 am »

@modS: Need more Vote Count

Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
Axxle (1): Insomniac
ehunt (5): Eevee, yuma, Voltgloss, Robz888, O, Galzria
Eevee (2): Grujah, shraeye
Grujah (1): sparky5856
Insomniac (3): Axxle, angrybirds, ftl
O (1): eHunt

(think it's accurate)

@eHunt: I'll concede what you're doing isn't really OMGUS. 

It'd be nice if you do more quoting (or linking) instead of just mentioning post numbers.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #650 on: August 22, 2012, 03:12:05 am »

Vote Count
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
Axxle (1): Insomniac
Eevee (2): Grujah, shraeye
Grujah (1): sparky5856
ehunt (6): Eevee, yuma, Voltgloss, Robz888, O, Galzria
Insomniac (3): Axxle, angrybirds, ftl
O (1): ehunt


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #651 on: August 22, 2012, 03:13:05 am »

36 hours until deadline.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #652 on: August 22, 2012, 04:21:03 am »

Would prefer insomniac but would lynch eHunt.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #653 on: August 22, 2012, 07:44:00 am »

Ok, i am the ten of wands (doctor). (I'm claiming now because if I wait till last minute it's going to be doctor-lynch or no-lynch.)

I think it's clear from O's scummy case on me and subsequent denial of that case that he is scum. I like that case much better than the wagons on Robz and Axxle and I think there's still time to build that wagon. Does no one else agree?
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #654 on: August 22, 2012, 07:56:33 am »

ehunt being a doctor does explain why he played differently than in M VI too.. doctors certainly want to avoid the spotlight. Meh, inclined to believe him if there are no counterclaims, we can probably deduct if he was lying from night happenings anyways.

Vote: O because simon says.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #655 on: August 22, 2012, 08:08:19 am »

Vote: Insomniac

Don't see a reason to press ehunt's lynch Day 1 in the face of that claim.  Already said Insom was my #2 choice, so it's time to go to that.  Though if an Axxle wagon reforms, I remain interested therein.
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #656 on: August 22, 2012, 08:11:46 am »

I somehow missed that Insomniac had a semi-wagon too, ugh. Rather him than nolynch, I'll try to be online to change my vote if needed.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #657 on: August 22, 2012, 08:16:50 am »

K, will read some history and post opinions as I go.

#1 - Insomniac's suit claim mistakes, in pops's voice : "Mistakes are scumtell not a nulltell".
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #658 on: August 22, 2012, 08:19:17 am »

#2 - ehunt's recent claim.

Very bad claim. He's just getting himself killed. There is only 1 other possible doctor in a setup. Should have kept his mouth shut and took it, it's a freaking doc. And he knows how to handle a doc, he handled PPS being doc perfectly in MVI.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #659 on: August 22, 2012, 08:19:40 am »

(only one other possible doc except Major Arcana)*.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #660 on: August 22, 2012, 10:11:18 am »

Shraeye... Really seeing scum pairs day 1? Are you scum or just dumb? Mistakes aren't scum reads, saying that they are? Well maybe...

And with the ehunt claim, which I am not too happy about-although not all of uscan be tinas-I will unvote him.

I said before that my read on insomniac was dependent on his voting. Immediately after that he voted for angrybirds-this isn't me being a protective big brother-that vote looked too covienent and as abirds noted contradicted i's previous read. Fir that I will move to vote: insomniac
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #661 on: August 22, 2012, 10:52:04 am »

Wow, that was a terrible reveal.

Well, I'm gong to reVote: Axxle for now, and hope we can get this scumwagon moving again. If not though, I'm down with Insomniac or O.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #662 on: August 22, 2012, 10:57:46 am »

Doctor, eh?

Back to Axxle, I guess. I am realizing now that it wasn't good to let him get away with that incredibly soft claim. Vote: Axxle
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #663 on: August 22, 2012, 11:32:26 am »


I'm still gunning for eevee.  Also, yuma shifted over to my feels-scummy list, as when he makes his player-by-player analysis in #547, he leaves Eevee out.  I'm feeling scumbuddies here.  Seriously.
Shraeye... Really seeing scum pairs day 1? Are you scum or just dumb? Mistakes aren't scum reads, saying that they are? Well maybe...
Wow man, that's an incredibly hostile defense for this level of suspicion that I threw at you.  I'm going to go with neither scum nor dumb, though you conveniently left out that option.  In my book, noticing relationships between two players is fair game even on day 1.  I'm still more suspicious of Eevee, which I mentioned.  Another alternative to this defense would be to say, "oh man I can't believe I forgot!  It's very difficult with 16 players; here's my analysis on Eevee....."  But I guess that's not what you did.

Are we really going to reform Axxle?  I think we should reevaluate his softclaim later, but if a wagon just makes him out his role as well, then a crappy town or clever scum have outed two PRs on day 1.  I don't want that.  I'm reinspecting Insomniac due to people's consensus on his lack of content.  Maybe I read this wrong?  Also, there is his voting of angrybirds after clearing him on the same IRL day by saying Robz/angrybirds was town-town disagreement.  He's now slightly lynchable, as he was previously the least confident entry on my no-lynch list.  But I'd still prefer to see Eevee or Grujah votes over Insomniac.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #664 on: August 22, 2012, 11:48:34 am »

Vote Count
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
Axxle (3): Insomniac, Galzria, Robz888
Eevee (2): Grujah, shraeye
Grujah (1): sparky5856
ehunt (1): O
Insomniac (5): Axxle, angrybirds, ftl, Voltgloss, yuma
O (2): ehunt, Eevee


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #665 on: August 22, 2012, 11:50:00 am »

~27 hours til deadline
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #666 on: August 22, 2012, 11:52:27 am »


I'm still gunning for eevee.  Also, yuma shifted over to my feels-scummy list, as when he makes his player-by-player analysis in #547, he leaves Eevee out.  I'm feeling scumbuddies here.  Seriously.
Shraeye... Really seeing scum pairs day 1? Are you scum or just dumb? Mistakes aren't scum reads, saying that they are? Well maybe...
Wow man, that's an incredibly hostile defense for this level of suspicion that I threw at you.  I'm going to go with neither scum nor dumb, though you conveniently left out that option.  In my book, noticing relationships between two players is fair game even on day 1.  I'm still more suspicious of Eevee, which I mentioned.  Another alternative to this defense would be to say, "oh man I can't believe I forgot!  It's very difficult with 16 players; here's my analysis on Eevee....."  But I guess that's not what you did.

Are we really going to reform Axxle?  I think we should reevaluate his softclaim later, but if a wagon just makes him out his role as well, then a crappy town or clever scum have outed two PRs on day 1.  I don't want that.  I'm reinspecting Insomniac due to people's consensus on his lack of content.  Maybe I read this wrong?  Also, there is his voting of angrybirds after clearing him on the same IRL day by saying Robz/angrybirds was town-town disagreement.  He's now slightly lynchable, as he was previously the least confident entry on my no-lynch list.  But I'd still prefer to see Eevee or Grujah votes over Insomniac.

I would be happy to get behind Eevee/Grujah if they had steam, although I still think that Axxle is not only NOT playing like town Axxle, but that letting that sort of softclaim go is setting a ridiculous precedent for scum to get off - and if Axxle gets away with it then it doesn't matter what his alignment is - that precedent will be set.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #667 on: August 22, 2012, 11:54:11 am »

So you are all saying Axxle should have full claimed or not claimed at all?
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #668 on: August 22, 2012, 12:00:09 pm »

Shraeye... Really seeing scum pairs day 1? Are you scum or just dumb? Mistakes aren't scum reads, saying that they are? Well maybe...

And with the ehunt claim, which I am not too happy about-although not all of uscan be tinas-I will unvote him.

I said before that my read on insomniac was dependent on his voting. Immediately after that he voted for angrybirds-this isn't me being a protective big brother-that vote looked too covienent and as abirds noted contradicted i's previous read. Fir that I will move to vote: insomniac

I voted to get him out of lurking he still is.

So you are all saying Axxle should have full claimed or not claimed at all?

Not the main reason I'm voting for Axxle but he shouldn't have full claimed necessarily but he definetly shouldn't have claimed how he did.

Also RE: eHunt is anybody else forgetting that there is a possibility of mafia doctors?
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #669 on: August 22, 2012, 12:03:05 pm »

So you are all saying Axxle should have full claimed or not claimed at all?

He should not have claimed at all. There were multiple wagons brewing, and no certainty that any claim would be necessary. "Once I reveal, I promise you won't want to lynch me" is almost as bad a town move as claiming Doctor at L-3 - but as a scum move? Why the hell not say that? If it disband pressure - great! - If not, you can still fakeclaim. What's more, from the scum perspective, a claim like that leaves the door wide open to claim whatever is convenient down the line.

Town has little reason to be shady. If you've got something, hold onto it until it's beyond clear that if you don't release it'll mean your grave. Claiming early, or softclaiming is purely anti-town, and in the latter case, very easily pro-scum.

I'll give eHunt a LITTLE bit of slack due to the impending deadline, but Axxle's play is more synonymous with scum play than bad-town play.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #670 on: August 22, 2012, 12:06:19 pm »

Ok, I get it now, and agree.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #671 on: August 22, 2012, 12:28:32 pm »

Shraeye... My reaction to you was perfectly on level with your accusation. To get the reaction you were looking for "oops, I missed it. Here is my read in eevee" then you should have pointed it out. But you didn't. You accused me of being scum partners which is such a groundless and stupid accusation that I reacted as such. I can't make an eevee read now due to being at work and phone posting.  I will later.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #672 on: August 22, 2012, 12:31:32 pm »

My axxle thoughts. First I did not find him scummy before his claim 2. His claim was weird and I'll timed. 3. I don't think we should give him a free pass on it this game 4. But I don't think we should day 1 lynch him. Let's get through tonight see what night actions occur and then progress from there with him high on the potential to day 2 lynch list
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #673 on: August 22, 2012, 12:34:55 pm »

My axxle thoughts. First I did not find him scummy before his claim 2. His claim was weird and I'll timed. 3. I don't think we should give him a free pass on it this game 4. But I don't think we should day 1 lynch him. Let's get through tonight see what night actions occur and then progress from there with him high on the potential to day 2 lynch list
I agree with this, suspicion can remain on Axxle, but I do not think he is a sound day 1 lynch at this point.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #674 on: August 22, 2012, 02:09:25 pm »

I am traveling today, am not back till next Tuesday, and won't have time for another big computer post till then. I may be able to phone post more, but sniping phone post fights without the ability to look up references are annoying, especially when your old posts are being willfully misrepresented or ignored and you can't look them up. In particular I'm unlikely to be very active early Day 2 of this game.

I'm very happy with my O wagon. He made a case on me that seemed unserious (the you said hunting three times in a row case). I said that the "hunting hunting hunting" phrase was obviously light-hearted. He ignored that, then said why didn't you answer my hunting hunting hunting argument? I repeated my answer. He said that OF COURSE this wasn't why he was voting for me, he was just calling out the phrase as being "stupid." I said that he was being contradictory; instead of answering my argument, he called it desperate "regardless of alignment" (why did he say that?). I think he's scared cause he knows he made a mistake, so he acts overwhelmingly dismissive of the arguments in the hope that if you say something with strong enough language, it becomes true.

Many complaints about my claim. Look, I was going to get one or two more chances to make a computer post before deadline. Realistically without my claim there was no chance of someone getting lynched aside from me, at least two people who weren't voting for me had expressed willingness, and there's still Morgrim lurking to quickhammer. At best I could have waited and then phone posted my claim at L - 1 resulting in a no lynch (if no accident happened). We can argue about Mafia strategy till we're blue in the fact but at the end of the day it's a distraction from scumhunting. If you think my claim is FALSE, say that. If you just think it's bad strategy, eh, try not to aggressively push a wagon on the doctor over nothing next time.

Finally, yes, the doctor role is part of why I was lurking (in particular it's why I wasn't pushing wagons), although I also meant it when I said I was genuinely less obsessed with this game than I was with MVI (more obsessed now, but still not at MVI levels of obsession).

I can't say I understand the case against Insomniac. I will do some reading on it now then decide whether to vote him (to avoid no lynch) or keep my vote on O (and hope somebody comes around). Would strongly prefer the latter.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #675 on: August 22, 2012, 02:41:14 pm »

You were acting scummy as **** and you know that. OMGUSes everywhere, half-baked logic. I see you as incredibly calm and clearheaded under pressure, in MV.

but unvote anyways. and you really really dont want to wagon me ehunt.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #676 on: August 22, 2012, 02:51:34 pm »

You were acting scummy as **** and you know that. OMGUSes everywhere, half-baked logic. I see you as incredibly calm and clearheaded under pressure, in MV.

but unvote anyways. and you really really dont want to wagon me ehunt.

Again, observe that O doesn't answer my arguments and instead asserts that things are obvious (I was scummy as **** and I know it). This is an extremely effective technique for dismissing arguments you can't answer in a game with this much distraction and noise, because people who are only skimming will believe that the extremeness in the tone is reflective of an extremeness in reality which isn't there. I would ask everyone to read my argument with O last night carefully, starting from the post where O votes for me. Ask yourself: why is O voting for ehunt? What evidence is he providing? Which of his arguments does he think are serious and which do he think are "of course" unserious? I claim you will not be able to formulate a coherent narrative of his play.

I have said several times that OMGUS is not a scumtell and I have not been rebutted. I think that OMGUS is actively a good thing. It is absolutely essential that a townie point out the scum on a misleading wagon against him. All a dead townie has is his voice. If I'm mislynched or NKed and haven't specifically pointed to who on my wagon is scum, then when it comes time to figure out who the scum is, misleading scum will do "statistical analysis" or cite old games or whatever they need to do and argue that the seventh vote or the voter with the least post count or the voter who was on the most or fewest other wagons is scummy, and not enough people will go back and check and notice, hey, O was the one voting ehunt without evidence and with contradictory posts. Now that I've made lots of noise over O, at least something good will come out of my impending nightkill. That is why if you are a townie you should always call out scummy arguments on you.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #677 on: August 22, 2012, 02:55:41 pm »

I acknowledge that I haven't gotten into gear in the same way this game. I at least think I've put my word in on every major fight, which is more than can be said for most people (but less than can be said for some). I just haven't been as into this game. I was more or less obsessed with MVI, it was all I thought about for weeks. This game I check several times daily, but it's just not the same level of obsession.

"I acknowledge that I've been mostly contentless, really, but I've been chiming in with what I thought was the requisite number of posts to not be scummy"

I'll get more and build a case for why I voted, but don't try and spin it that I'm trying to lynch a claimed doctor.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #678 on: August 22, 2012, 02:57:56 pm »

A lot of y'all say Axxle's softclaim means nothing; I disagree and moreover I think it's a pro-town move (given that he was the likeliest lynch) to make it now instead of later.

This is the type of contrarianism that can be used later to say "I wasn't buddying up" when infact you WERE buddying up to Axxle. It also supports earlier claims instead of later, which completely ignores the fact that many wagons dissipate quickly.

TINAS refusal to claim D1 while at L-1 gave us a win.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #679 on: August 22, 2012, 02:58:02 pm »

Ah, that makes sense for claim then, if ehunt's going to be away until deadline. That makes it the right play IMO.

Glad I didn't vote for ehunt, sad I couldn't put up better arguments so that he wouldn't have to claim. Will have to reread O.
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #680 on: August 22, 2012, 02:59:40 pm »

but unvote anyways. and you really really dont want to wagon me ehunt.

Whatcha doing O?  :P
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #681 on: August 22, 2012, 03:00:07 pm »

I don't like the Axxle wagon at all. Robz, I think definitely you were in the right in your spat with Axxle, but you weren't like, so overwhelmingly in the right that anybody seeing it differently must be scum. Can you give more reasons for the vote?

Buddying, or so I thought
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #682 on: August 22, 2012, 03:00:34 pm »

but unvote anyways. and you really really dont want to wagon me ehunt.

Whatcha doing O?  :P

softclaiming townie (possibly with, possibly without PR)  ;)
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #683 on: August 22, 2012, 03:01:46 pm »

Trying to read through case on Insomniac before I go - the claim is that he said angrybirds was town then voted him shortly later in the same day. I can't find the post where he says angrybirds is town and I think the reference is wrong in whoever posted it with numbers - does anybody know off hand?
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #684 on: August 22, 2012, 03:02:56 pm »

Trying to read through case on Insomniac before I go - the claim is that he said angrybirds was town then voted him shortly later in the same day. I can't find the post where he says angrybirds is town and I think the reference is wrong in whoever posted it with numbers - does anybody know off hand?

I said multiple times the robz v abirds fight looks like town on town, then when asked to vote I voted for abirds to try and bring him out of lurking but people don't like that I voted for someone I thought was town.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #685 on: August 22, 2012, 03:03:36 pm »

(because I'm not allowed to be wrong on my reads as well even though only scum can ever be sure of a read)
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"It is one of [Insomniacs] badges of pride that he will bus anyone, at any time, and he has done it over and over on day 1. I am completely serious, it is like the biggest part of his meta." - Dsell

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #686 on: August 22, 2012, 03:05:47 pm »

1. Insomniac - I did not totally follow the suggest-we-suit-claim incident, but as I believe I said at the time, I don't think Insomniac's behavior was anti-town (even though suit-claiming is bad). He's been pretty absent lately.

2. Voltgloss - strong town read. Really appreciate how he has kept the conversation alive, which is what's killing this town.

3. Captain_Frisk - scum read. Morgrim-bashes, which is a scumtell since Frisk knows how Morgrim acts. When I call him out on it, he argues sarcastically, waits a while, then unvotes, saying it was just an RVS vote. Now lurking. My vote remains on him.

4. shark_bait/ Grujah - Grujah wants it to be RVS all over again even though the game's been going on for a week. Light scum read.

5. Eevee - no read. Unlike eevee to post so little, but there's so much noise.

6. Robz888 - light town read. I've already explained my position on him elsewhere.

7. O - barely realize he's in this game, which gives me a light scum read. I also disagreed with his vote on Robz.

8. yuma - doing hard detective work, although I disagreed with his reads.

9. ftl - I already explained my position on the "fifth vote" issue. Neutral to town read.

10. Galzria - very town. Could be more helpful.

11. shraeye - very town.

12. angrybirds - I did not get a scum read on Robz off the Robz/angrybirds fight. I did get a town read off AB though.

13. sparky5856 - very town, although I confuse sparky and shraeye which is bad.

14. Morgrim7 - Morgrim being Morgrim. Wish he would post more.

15. Axxle - I believe I addressed the Axxlewagon above and there are no new developments.

16. ehunt - hi.

mostly contentless. "barely realize he's in the game" is contrived when it's you, not me, whose been lurky, too many "very towns".

also, FWIW everyone keep in mind that doctor is the go-to fakeclaim of choice.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #687 on: August 22, 2012, 03:13:02 pm »

doctor is the go-to fakeclaim of choice.
Truth.  It's very hard to verify.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #688 on: August 22, 2012, 03:22:11 pm »

doctor is the go-to fakeclaim of choice.
Truth.  It's very hard to verify.

Two quick responses:
1. note that including the card name is an important part of my claim (see "named townie" on mafiascum wiki for theory).
2. i agree that doctor is a good fakeclaim if there's one scumfaction. with multiple scumfactions it doesn't matter,  claimants are going to get nightkilled. a scumfaction will say, ok, either ehunt is telling the truth, or he's lying in which case he's on the other scumfaction. either way he's a good kill. i'm very unlikely to survive the night.

Quick response to O quoting my long post: I answered that argument a long time ago, when you made it the first time. My long post was the first post in many hours and I was trying to make conversation happen in a dead room, even though I didn't have much to say on most of the folks. The people I said were very town were people I felt were very town and I am not going to lie about my positions. I still feel that way about all of them except for Galzria, and even Galzria I still have a somewhat town read on.

Again, people, read O's fight with me last night in order, starting with where he votes me for saying "morgrim hunting hunting hunting." Don't let him mislead you, especially after I am gone. He is bringing up old arguments (and not quoting my responses to them) because he needs to create as much misinformation and noise as possible for when people go back over my case against him.

I think my O case is better than the Insomniac case, so not moving my vote. Will try to phone check. Adios for now.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #689 on: August 22, 2012, 03:33:54 pm »

A very quick skim after the last few pages reveals that I haven't even been put on the chopping block once after my recent lurkerish activities. I am quite baffled.

I'll read more thoroughly through the last few pages to see who deserves my final vote.
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #690 on: August 22, 2012, 03:35:42 pm »

fwiw i think its very freaking likely ehunt is the doctor he claims to be.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #691 on: August 22, 2012, 03:46:31 pm »

I looked back through ehunt/O arguments and it seems like they were both doing the same thing.  Trying pretty hard on the fly to show why the other is more suspicious.  They both started making summaries I didn't agree with, and things kept escalating.  I'm still not taking back what I said about them needing to back down, wait a bit, and summarize their arguments.  Now we're just looking at 3 pages of mess, and it all feels town-on-town to me.  Catching someone in a lie when they haven't had a long time to prepare seems like a reasonable plan, but this just ended up being tons of noise that let other people hide in the background.  Now we've got under a day (right?) left to find a lynch candidate and everyone is busy sifting through that fight. 

I'm going to put out one more reminder that Eevee still looks very scummy to me, so that people don't forget this in Day 2.  Then I'll
vote: Insomniac
because I'm currently getting a scum read and a lynch needs to happen.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #692 on: August 22, 2012, 03:50:53 pm »

Vote Count
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
Axxle (3): Insomniac, Galzria, Robz888
Eevee (1): Grujah
Grujah (1): sparky5856
ehunt (1): O
Insomniac (6): Axxle, angrybirds, ftl, Voltgloss, yuma, shraeye [L-3]
O (2): ehunt, Eevee


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.

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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #693 on: August 22, 2012, 03:53:33 pm »

What's our deadline?
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #694 on: August 22, 2012, 03:54:11 pm »

L-3 is both the new L-1 and the new L-5! Ins lynch is wins lynch!

The deadline is in just under  24 hours, I think.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #695 on: August 22, 2012, 03:55:45 pm »

insomniac claim now tbh because waiting till you're at L-1 is just going to derp us into nolynch.

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #696 on: August 22, 2012, 03:57:46 pm »

My claim won't be believed but I am a doctor. I was tryin to discern whether or not that makes eHunt a liar or not that's why I haven't revealed.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #697 on: August 22, 2012, 03:59:50 pm »

Umm.... wtf?!

This day 1 just got a whole lot weirder. Card/suit?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #698 on: August 22, 2012, 04:01:14 pm »

I believe you over ehunt 100%. Though certainly 2 doctors isn't impossible.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #699 on: August 22, 2012, 04:03:40 pm »

Eight - Ninja Doctor
Ten - Doctor

these are the only town doctors and are Wands. I doubt we have two Wands doctors that we managed to run wagons on D1.

vote: ehunt
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #700 on: August 22, 2012, 04:06:57 pm »

insomniac claim now tbh because waiting till you're at L-1 is just going to derp us into nolynch.

And we derp to a massclaim.

My claim won't be believed but I am a doctor. I was tryin to discern whether or not that makes eHunt a liar or not that's why I haven't revealed.

Or, not.

Vote: eHunt

Insom's reveal is much more town here.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #701 on: August 22, 2012, 04:07:35 pm »

I suppose two doctors is possible; the ninja doctor is also pro-town, right?  But the mafia also have  a doctor.  But I'm not sure I believe this is true.  Odd that Insomniac didn't object to the card claim by ehunt, and just said that he was also doctor.  It wouldn't make ehunt a liar unless Insomniac also had the 10 of Wands.  And if Insomniac has a 10 of Wands, he should have had to wait any time at all to know and tell us all that ehunt has lied.  So you're correct, Insomniac.  I don't believe you; my vote will stay on you.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #702 on: August 22, 2012, 04:07:55 pm »

Fascinating. Insomniac, need that card claim please. For now, back to my scum read: Vote: eHunt
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #703 on: August 22, 2012, 04:09:07 pm »

I'm the eight of wands. (ninja doctor)
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #704 on: August 22, 2012, 04:09:27 pm »

doctor is the go-to fakeclaim of choice.
Truth.  It's very hard to verify.

Two quick responses:
1. note that including the card name is an important part of my claim (see "named townie" on mafiascum wiki for theory).
2. i agree that doctor is a good fakeclaim if there's one scumfaction. with multiple scumfactions it doesn't matter,  claimants are going to get nightkilled. a scumfaction will say, ok, either ehunt is telling the truth, or he's lying in which case he's on the other scumfaction. either way he's a good kill. i'm very unlikely to survive the night.
Scum don't really care that much about doctors in a group this size unless there's a revealed detective power role.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #705 on: August 22, 2012, 04:11:15 pm »

doctor is the go-to fakeclaim of choice.
Truth.  It's very hard to verify.

Two quick responses:
1. note that including the card name is an important part of my claim (see "named townie" on mafiascum wiki for theory).
2. i agree that doctor is a good fakeclaim if there's one scumfaction. with multiple scumfactions it doesn't matter,  claimants are going to get nightkilled. a scumfaction will say, ok, either ehunt is telling the truth, or he's lying in which case he's on the other scumfaction. either way he's a good kill. i'm very unlikely to survive the night.
Scum don't really care that much about doctors in a group this size unless there's a revealed detective power role.
And in a group where most people are power roles.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #706 on: August 22, 2012, 04:13:14 pm »

So I'm the only one who thinks Insomniac is scummier of the two?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #707 on: August 22, 2012, 04:13:24 pm »

Agree with people saying two doctors both outed Day 1, no way. I get no scum read from Insomniac--I'm on Axxle right now--but was on ehunt before that. So back to ehunt. Vote: ehunt
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #708 on: August 22, 2012, 04:14:19 pm »

So I'm the only one who thinks Insomniac is scummier of the two?

don't worry, you just derped your way into obvtown.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #709 on: August 22, 2012, 04:14:29 pm »

I suppose two doctors is possible; the ninja doctor is also pro-town, right?  But the mafia also have  a doctor.  But I'm not sure I believe this is true.  Odd that Insomniac didn't object to the card claim by ehunt, and just said that he was also doctor.  It wouldn't make ehunt a liar unless Insomniac also had the 10 of Wands.  And if Insomniac has a 10 of Wands, he should have had to wait any time at all to know and tell us all that ehunt has lied.  So you're correct, Insomniac.  I don't believe you; my vote will stay on you.

He wouldn't have come out and said "LOL OBVLIE" right away because it outs himself unnecessarily. He made his claim now, at L-3, so there would be time to react. If he were scum, why the hell would he make this claim? To get eHunt lynched? That's retarded. If he were scum he would kill eHunt at night and make a more believable claim today. What do you think happens if eHunt flips town Doc?

A) Insomniac gets NK'd because he's Doc #2,
B) Insomniac lives because he's scum and gets lynched tomorrow,
C) Insomniac is scum but gets NK'd by the other faction because they don't know if he's A or B.

This would be a retarded claim for a scum Insomniac to make.

Now, does town Doctor Insomniac make eHunt a liar? No, but it makes it damn more likely.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #710 on: August 22, 2012, 04:15:50 pm »

don't worry, you just derped your way into obvtown.

I have no idea what this means.  O, you use derp a lot, though it is not a word.  What does it mean?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #711 on: August 22, 2012, 04:16:20 pm »

vote: ehunt
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #712 on: August 22, 2012, 04:17:22 pm »

don't worry, you just derped your way into obvtown.

I have no idea what this means.  O, you use derp a lot, though it is not a word.  What does it mean?

it means to be clueless or stupid, interweb slang.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #713 on: August 22, 2012, 04:20:49 pm »

Omighosh 2 doc claims D1, it doesn't get worse than this.

ehunt is how much away from lynch? L-1? L-0?

vote: shraeye
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #714 on: August 22, 2012, 04:21:53 pm »

don't worry, you just derped your way into obvtown.

I have no idea what this means.  O, you use derp a lot, though it is not a word.  What does it mean?

it means to be clueless or stupid, interweb slang.
I'm quite pro at derping.


Can someone explain to me why we are all voting for ehunt all of a sudden? Insomniac didnt even claim a card ffs, and you all seem like this is a slam dunk now? How can Insomniac claiming doctor without the card name make ehunt's claim THAT much less credible? Watch that wagon before you accidentally lynch him and cut out the discussion, would you?
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #715 on: August 22, 2012, 04:22:38 pm »

Omighosh 2 doc claims D1, it doesn't get worse than this.

ehunt is how much away from lynch? L-1? L-0?

vote: shraeye

This is an EXCELLENT example of a derp. Ehunt is at L-4.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #716 on: August 22, 2012, 04:23:11 pm »

So I'm the only one who thinks Insomniac is scummier of the two?

No...
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #717 on: August 22, 2012, 04:25:09 pm »

don't worry, you just derped your way into obvtown.

I have no idea what this means.  O, you use derp a lot, though it is not a word.  What does it mean?

it means to be clueless or stupid, interweb slang.
I'm quite pro at derping.


Can someone explain to me why we are all voting for ehunt all of a sudden? Insomniac didnt even claim a card ffs, and you all seem like this is a slam dunk now? How can Insomniac claiming doctor without the card name make ehunt's claim THAT much less credible? Watch that wagon before you accidentally lynch him and cut out the discussion, would you?

Insomniac has since claimed 8.

Because what the hell are the odds that both of the two town doctor slots (which were in the same suit) were picked and that they were our primary wagons?

Because Ehunt was always really freaking scummy, so much so that I ALMOST didn't take my vote off after he claimed.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #718 on: August 22, 2012, 04:25:51 pm »

Question for everyone!

ehunt vs insomniac, your take on the situation. More than just the vote please, I really want to understand & see your reasons. Who is more scummy, and why? How likely do you see the possibility of both of them being town?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #719 on: August 22, 2012, 04:29:56 pm »

Question for everyone!

ehunt vs insomniac, your take on the situation. More than just the vote please, I really want to understand & see your reasons. Who is more scummy, and why? How likely do you see the possibility of both of them being town?

To expand on what O said a bit, my immediate reaction to Ehunt's doctor claim was: "Psh, predictable." I didn't have that reaction when Insomniac said it; it was more genuine. Ehunt's was scripted. He even had the "this is why I was lurking, I was doctor" answer all ready to go.

I doubt they are both town. Probably scum and town, probably one will be lynched and the other nightkilled by some other scum.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #720 on: August 22, 2012, 04:30:00 pm »

don't worry, you just derped your way into obvtown.

I have no idea what this means.  O, you use derp a lot, though it is not a word.  What does it mean?

it means to be clueless or stupid, interweb slang.
I'm quite pro at derping.


Can someone explain to me why we are all voting for ehunt all of a sudden? Insomniac didnt even claim a card ffs, and you all seem like this is a slam dunk now? How can Insomniac claiming doctor without the card name make ehunt's claim THAT much less credible? Watch that wagon before you accidentally lynch him and cut out the discussion, would you?

Insomniac has since claimed 8.

Because what the hell are the odds that both of the two town doctor slots (which were in the same suit) were picked and that they were our primary wagons?

Because Ehunt was always really freaking scummy, so much so that I ALMOST didn't take my vote off after he claimed.
You seem to disagree with me, I'm quite confused as to how I derped my way into obvtown?

If cayvie did the draw randomly, they can both still be doctors, but I agree it is not worth concentrating on. But yeah, I'm actually starting to understand why Ins is more credible. (I felt Ins was scummy and ehunt wasnt, but the actual facts are indeed on his side. Brain triumphs over gut. Thanks O.)

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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #721 on: August 22, 2012, 04:30:03 pm »

Question for everyone!

ehunt vs insomniac, your take on the situation. More than just the vote please, I really want to understand & see your reasons. Who is more scummy, and why? How likely do you see the possibility of both of them being town?

I suppose two doctors is possible; the ninja doctor is also pro-town, right?  But the mafia also have  a doctor.  But I'm not sure I believe this is true.  Odd that Insomniac didn't object to the card claim by ehunt, and just said that he was also doctor.  It wouldn't make ehunt a liar unless Insomniac also had the 10 of Wands.  And if Insomniac has a 10 of Wands, he should have had to wait any time at all to know and tell us all that ehunt has lied.  So you're correct, Insomniac.  I don't believe you; my vote will stay on you.

He wouldn't have come out and said "LOL OBVLIE" right away because it outs himself unnecessarily. He made his claim now, at L-3, so there would be time to react. If he were scum, why the hell would he make this claim? To get eHunt lynched? That's retarded. If he were scum he would kill eHunt at night and make a more believable claim today. What do you think happens if eHunt flips town Doc?

A) Insomniac gets NK'd because he's Doc #2,
B) Insomniac lives because he's scum and gets lynched tomorrow,
C) Insomniac is scum but gets NK'd by the other faction because they don't know if he's A or B.

This would be a retarded claim for a scum Insomniac to make.

Now, does town Doctor Insomniac make eHunt a liar? No, but it makes it damn more likely.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #722 on: August 22, 2012, 04:30:42 pm »

Question for everyone!

ehunt vs insomniac, your take on the situation. More than just the vote please, I really want to understand & see your reasons. Who is more scummy, and why? How likely do you see the possibility of both of them being town?
You've voted for eHunt.  You haven't voted for insomniac.  What is *your* take on the situation?  What made it change?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #723 on: August 22, 2012, 04:30:58 pm »

Because what the hell are the odds that both of the two town doctor slots (which were in the same suit) were picked and that they were our primary wagons?
We also wagonned Axxle for a bit.  Are we now faced with a choice between ehunt and Insomniac?  I'd still like to push for Eevee, which never seemed to gain any ground.  Or angrybirds, who is missing again.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #724 on: August 22, 2012, 04:31:54 pm »

Question for everyone!

ehunt vs insomniac, your take on the situation. More than just the vote please, I really want to understand & see your reasons. Who is more scummy, and why? How likely do you see the possibility of both of them being town?

To expand on what O said a bit, my immediate reaction to Ehunt's doctor claim was: "Psh, predictable." I didn't have that reaction when Insomniac said it; it was more genuine. Ehunt's was scripted. He even had the "this is why I was lurking, I was doctor" answer all ready to go.

I doubt they are both town. Probably scum and town, probably one will be lynched and the other nightkilled by some other scum.
He even had other explanations in the wing.  "Look, I named my card, I'm basically named townie"
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #725 on: August 22, 2012, 04:33:10 pm »

Answer to Eevee:
Initially I felt like ehunt's claim was real, and suspected Insomniac's claim, since I would have sorted out the "is he lying, should I tell or not" question faster.  Insomniac gives a reason for his hesitance (or someone did, can't remember).  Then Galz posts explanation as to why Insomniac false-claiming now is a bad play for scum.  This makes me believe Insomnia is telling the truth.  But I still feel like ehunt's was also genuine.  I'm for lynching a third person if possible.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #726 on: August 22, 2012, 04:34:46 pm »

Question for everyone!

ehunt vs insomniac, your take on the situation. More than just the vote please, I really want to understand & see your reasons. Who is more scummy, and why? How likely do you see the possibility of both of them being town?
You've voted for eHunt.  You haven't voted for insomniac.  What is *your* take on the situation?  What made it change?

In the heat of the moment I legitimately got just confused as to why you all just jumped on voting ehunt (who is not even here). Now that I re-read Galria's explanation, I do realize how Insomniac is just very unlikely to be lying. So, even though I felt ehunt's claim was genuine at the time, I am now accepting I once again was wrong in that read and he is probably scum. Insomniac delivered the claim in a scummy way imo (just my initial gut reaction), which is why I demanded explanations. I do see it now, and will vote for ehunt when we are done talking.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #727 on: August 22, 2012, 04:35:59 pm »

If we have time and that third person is not me, lynching someone else entirely would indeed not be the worst of the ideas. We'd force scum to waste kills on both of the two, which would mean more townies alive? It's not like the lynch would fall on a mafia member today anyways..
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #728 on: August 22, 2012, 04:36:46 pm »

Lol scratch that last sentence, that joke makes no sense there. NOT A SCUMSLIP I SWEAR, I just got distracted while writing the post.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #729 on: August 22, 2012, 04:41:53 pm »

If we have time and that third person is not me, lynching someone else entirely would indeed not be the worst of the ideas. We'd force scum to waste kills on both of the two, which would mean more townies alive? It's not like the lynch would fall on a mafia member today anyways..
This road leads to massclaim.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #730 on: August 22, 2012, 04:43:30 pm »

Vote Count
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
Axxle (1): Insomniac
Grujah (1): sparky5856
ehunt (5): O, Axxle, Galzria, Robz888, yuma [L-4]
Insomniac (4): angrybirds, ftl, Voltgloss, shraeye [L-5]
O (2): ehunt, Eevee
shraeye (1): Grujah


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2012, 04:58:18 pm by jotheonah »
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #731 on: August 22, 2012, 04:44:52 pm »

Jo, you have Insomniac voting for two people.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #732 on: August 22, 2012, 04:46:54 pm »

And doesn't have Axxle's vote on there.
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #733 on: August 22, 2012, 04:47:04 pm »

If we have time and that third person is not me, lynching someone else entirely would indeed not be the worst of the ideas. We'd force scum to waste kills on both of the two, which would mean more townies alive? It's not like the lynch would fall on a mafia member today anyways..
This road leads to massclaim.

.. until we hit someone who is a vanilla townie or something to that effect, after which we decide "better him than a power role" and lynch one of our own. What, is this day 1 of mafia in f.ds?
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #734 on: August 22, 2012, 04:47:44 pm »

Phone post. I agree Insomniac is probably not lying (zero reason for scum to do so). Very bad luck for town. Not sure what else I can say. Please go after O and not Insom next in the unlikely event both survive the night. Robz says I prepared my claim, that's true, I don't think that's scummy.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #735 on: August 22, 2012, 04:53:13 pm »

Shray spark and eevee are town. Frisk might be town, I appreciate his seeing through the garbage case on me. volt townish, robz scummy, galz townish, yuma townish, angry townish. Insomniac probtown, axxle idk.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #736 on: August 22, 2012, 04:54:18 pm »

Gruj idk, who else?
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #737 on: August 22, 2012, 04:56:30 pm »

Sorry kids. Looking into it.

I had typed Insomniac's name a second time instead of Axxle's. Corrected now.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2012, 04:58:52 pm by jotheonah »
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #738 on: August 22, 2012, 04:58:25 pm »

Shray spark and eevee are town. Frisk might be town, I appreciate his seeing through the garbage case on me. volt townish, robz scummy, galz townish, yuma townish, angry townish. Insomniac probtown, axxle idk.

I'm the only scum in the game!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #739 on: August 22, 2012, 04:59:17 pm »

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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #740 on: August 22, 2012, 05:03:58 pm »

I'm still not sure eHunt is lying but he is one of the only possible lynches. He could be lying but I would rate the likelihood so low that I'm willing to Vote: eHunt. I would rather lynch someone who didn't claim but it's likely they would claim if they go to L-1 in this crazy setup.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #741 on: August 22, 2012, 05:10:09 pm »

Gruj idk, who else?

me

Dunno. Insomniac weren't you already voting me?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #742 on: August 22, 2012, 05:10:29 pm »

If ehunt is mafia. My day 2 suspicion will be on shraeye for trying to get us to focus away from the two wagons and for all the reasons I was suspicious of him earlier in the day.

Oh and abirds started school yesterday, that might be why he is pulling a disappearing act.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #743 on: August 22, 2012, 05:15:39 pm »

Gruj idk, who else?

me

Dunno. Insomniac weren't you already voting me?
No, I had messed up the vote count.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #744 on: August 22, 2012, 05:33:45 pm »

I'm still not sure eHunt is lying but he is one of the only possible lynches. He could be lying but I would rate the likelihood so low that I'm willing to Vote: eHunt. I would rather lynch someone who didn't claim but it's likely they would claim if they go to L-1 in this crazy setup.
sorry, what likelihood are you rating low? You say is is unlikely that he is lying?  Then you shouldn't vote for him.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #745 on: August 22, 2012, 05:55:11 pm »

If ehunt is mafia. My day 2 suspicion will be on shraeye for trying to get us to focus away from the two wagons and for all the reasons I was suspicious of him earlier in the day.
Here's why town should stop looking at either of these two wagons.  First, there are people who think Insomniac is telling the truth, and there are people who think ehunt is telling the truth.  It's possible that everyone is correct about their respective horse.

Second,
C) Insomniac is scum but gets NK'd by the other faction because they don't know if he's A or B.
This is equally true of ehunt now that Insomniac's claimed.  Either he's telling the truth and all factions will be thinking about NK'ing him this evening.  Or he is lying and is actually mafia/werewolf/SK.  Regardless of what faction he's with, there are two factions who don't know that he's scum, and they will probaly NK him anyway because either way it's rival scum or a town PR.

Both doctor-claimers are really dead tonight, so why would we help scum factions by killing them before the night even starts?  Plus, if they both trust the other, they may be able to protect eachother and still be helpful to town later. Leave the doctor-claimers for the night time and we can reassess if they don't die tonight.  For now, I want to lynch somebody who I feel is scummy, and neither Insomniac or ehunt are on that list anymore.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #746 on: August 22, 2012, 05:56:42 pm »

Let me back that up by moving my vote.

Vote: Eevee I'm back to the vote I was making before the double-doctor claim fiasco.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #747 on: August 22, 2012, 05:58:06 pm »

HERE WE GO!

I'll just "think out loud" here in this post since there's a lot to think about.

First, what I said what I was going to do in my last post: analyze eHunt from the very beginning. Through the beginning just gives a very neutral read, which is why i haven't mentioned him thus far. eHunt then encourages the new folks to read though the older threads, stating you could learn a lot. This puts him slightly more towards the clean side; I don't think scum would be willing to give much advice on how to play; makes them much more likely to be tracked down.

Quote
To angrybirds, shraeye, other new folks - in MVI when I was brand new I found the constant references to old mafia games annoying and not helpful,  but you do actually learn a lot from them if you sit down and read through them. They are pretty hard to skim, though, and long.

In the next couple posts...

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I'm going to confuse sparky and shraeye for the foreseeable future. How can I differentiate them? What's your playstyle? Angrybirds I can remember because he's twinclaimed by yuma.
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As far as I'm concerned, the value of the old mafia games is less "seeing good mafia games" and more "learning people's behavior patterns." The primary example so far is Morgrim, whose play is very eccentric. It's easy to mistake the eccentricity for scumminess. Galzria tends to be verbose.

It's sort of boring to dig in, though.

...he very clearly seems involved in knowing the specific behavior patterns of everyone. I can understand this, it's very easy to mistaken certain behavior patterns as scum-reads, when in reality that's how they play. Unfortunately this puts me at a disadvantage in trying to read everyone... but I'm trying my best. So, so far town-reads from eHunt.

Through the first third of the thread, he doesn't seem to have any major suspicions. He votes for Frisk, and I initially picked that up as a joke vote. Voltgloss even asks for a confirmation of the vote though, and eHunt replies:

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It's not an rvs vote, if that's what you're asking.

Next he defends Robz in the grand Robz vs. angrybirds debate:

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Robz's absence from earlier is due to well-documented V/LAness. His hard press on angrybirds, followed by his backing off, does not strike me as scummy at all. It's very typical day one play for anyone, especially for Robz. I don't understand why he's got so many votes.

And here he's opposed to the Axxle wagon. It seems that he really does not want to jump into anything without sufficient reason first (but the Frisk vote still doesn't make sense in this regard).

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I don't like the Axxle wagon at all. Robz, I think definitely you were in the right in your spat with Axxle, but you weren't like, so overwhelmingly in the right that anybody seeing it differently must be scum. Can you give more reasons for the vote?

At last, he provides his beliefs on everyone, and explains his Frisk vote. It basically relies on behavior patterns of Frisk and Morgrim. He does this because

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Nobody posted for a day, so I listed my thoughts.

Here he believes Axxle's softclaim was a good move. I said this as well.

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There are two wagons, and I think both of them are on town. A lot of y'all say Axxle's softclaim means nothing; I disagree and moreover I think it's a pro-town move (given that he was the likeliest lynch) to make it now instead of later.

And now this:

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I'm probably violating criterion one in your list, although I have been voting for Frisk all day and am surprised nobody has joined me.

Scrolling on, he seems pretty sound in his reasons to vote for Frisk, and is extremely hesitant to remove his vote. It WAS a very early serious vote...

INTERMISSION. CAPTAIN_FRISK. He was the very first post this day, and it was a vote for Morgrim. Since, he provided very vague reasons for voting (at least to me, I can't read the whole forum to gather how Morgrim plays XD)

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Quote from: Morgrim7 on August 09, 2012, 06:38:30 pm
Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever.

I have a whole forum full of reasons!

His playstyle seems very vague altogether, not providing reason and just charging into his thoughts:

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Quote from: Galzria on August 09, 2012, 10:15:57 pm
Well, 16 players in a non-BM game! Not bad... Hope you're up for the work Cayvie. You've got a 4000 post behemoth coming your way!

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Sorry galz, I am not scum.
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Quote from: shark_bait on August 10, 2012, 12:22:03 pm
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Dude... Frisk, you can't really count BMIV.  I was only able to play that way b/c you explicitly omitted the player list.  Everyone knows that I'm actually playing in this game.

So you are admitting that you're going to play scum differently here.  Got it.

Back to eHunt, here reading this post:

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Phone post. How many votes on me? I don't see how there's a case against me that's better than my case against frisk. The axxle and robz wagons are bad. Seems like case against me is: I tried to start a wagon on likely scum, no one wants to join (why?), therefore I am avoiding controversy. I would love for there to be controversy. Everyone not voting frisk: explain yourself!

Now, I would perfectly understand eHunt in this situation. Everyone seemed to be focused on Robz, angrybirds, Insomniac, and Axxle, completely ignoring eHunt's case. This is partially my fault as well, but as I cannot rely on behavior patterns to see who is scum (seeing that this is my first game), I couldn't really see a case on Captain_Frisk.

Here is where I will reread the thread from my latest post. seeing that I'm at that point anyway. I might as well mention my new suspicion right here: EEVEE. He seems to be "worrysome" about the town having too many people, which I'm gathering as losing hope for the town:

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I suspect playing like I have thus far (not posting much and drawing zero attention) is exceptionally favorable for mafia in this game, because it's so huge it's very easy to blend in. In smaller games, I think lurkers often get called out when the active guys lynch the one or two guys who seem scummy and start realizing "wait.. all of these active guys sort of look towny to me" and then there is almost nothing the lurker can do. Well, here we have so so many people, that there is always going to be someone active that accidentally says something others interpret as scummy and then its easy for the lurkers to quietly steer the town towards lynching them.
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Also, following a game with this many players is haaard.
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If this is correct, we really are in a world of hurt. How are we supposed to find majority in 45 hours, especially considering how both of the "major wagons" are slowly dying.

And now this:

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Vote: Axxle

Appears to be posting just for the sake of not lurking. I feel he isnt helping town as much as he could.

If I'm correct, the first vote on Axxle. We all now know that this reason is rubbish to vote for someone, given that we are now on page 30 almost and we all have had plenty of opportunities to help out. With this massive a thread now, we should vote to KILL SCUM, not to kill unhelpful town. (If I play again, I gotta keep this thought in mind. I acted a similar way early on but I'm now rectifying myself. Eevee should have played multiple games by now and realized this.)

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Day 1 is hard! Especially with a town this size. Tomorrow, we'll have the night kills to analyze, maybe some power role results or claims, hopefully a wagon. One could almost say "that's when the real game begins".

Day 1 is just a free opportunity to kill (unhelpful) townies, according to this LOL

Let me go back to rereading the thread from my last post. First, Axxle appears to not be VT. Good for that. By shraeye:

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Looks like he was content to let Axxle-wagon happen while saying he disagreed instead of pushing his own suspicions of Frisk (convince us, dude! why should we vote for Frisk?).

He DID, now reading back. But, on Eevee:

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Eevee was the first one to suggest lynching someone for being in the "wrong" suit even though this is easily manipulated, that felt like it was bound to give us a town-lynch.  Another person who's only made one vote.  I don't like people who hone in on one person and keep their vote there forever, that feels like very scum-fident (confident) voting.  Also, looking through his posts, I am floored by the lack of content.  Check it out for yourself!

I completely agree about the lack of content in Eevee's posts.

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Sparky's vote-count hasn't been as high as some people's, but he is the king of content per post.

I agree even more so with this. Although, despite Axxle's softclaim, I have no idea what he is.

This is back to Eevee:

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Not reading back feels like an anti-town move from a townie to me.
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Generally I think posting drunk looks towny.

I already referred to both of these in my last post. Posting things that seem good to post because the "king of content per post" thinks the same?

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13. sparky5856: hahaha you voted for yourself and said it was a bad idea.

 ;D

yuma:

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ehunt: I agree with Eevee a lot here. My wife has dinner on the table, so I have to vote: ehunt and get back to this in my next post. I promise I will

Agrees with Eevee. Not so good in my book now. This is the point where I saved this whole post in Notepad because I'm afraid of my computer automatically restarting, and I do NOT want to type all of this again.

Later on, Volt nabs eHunt for being stubborn in his voting, only for Morgrim reasons, but eHunt DID mention other reasons to vote for Frisk.

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He (possibly RVS) votes Morgrim. Later, a fight about Morgrim happens; Frisk defends the case on Morgrim. I call him out for it and vote. He responds sarcastically. Time passes, and then he unvotes, saying it was just RVS, even though he had been defensive about it before. He's posted 8 times since then, and that was like a week ago. In those 8 posts, his only substantive one is IIoA. He also voted for Robz, a wagon that I don't like at all.

ftl doesn't get a scumread from eHunt. Neutral reads from him so far, although this pushes him more towards the clean side. Pretty much all the ehunt voters at this point go on the watch list. I say this because reading back I believe eHunt's accusations and thoughts to be genuine.

I want to remark on the argument that morgrim-hunting-hunting is a scumtell. I think that morgrim-hunting-hunting-hunting is a stronger scumtell.

vote: ehunt for this piece of work.

Gotta admit, I lol'ed at this. All this means, though, is a confirmation of eHunt's reliance on theory to find scum. And that O is being O it seems like. I only need to play ONE day to figure that one out.

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That said, the OMGUS discussion re: ehunt brought something else to my eye:  Insomniac's #587 reply to Axxle.  Which is really blatant OMGUS.  Rather than address Axxle's actual argument - that Insom's post history lacks content and shows flip-flopping - Insom instead turned around and attacked (and voted) Axxle for allegedly "starting two wagons."  And I have to agree with Axxle that the ehunt wagon has been driven by others (me included).


Hmm... very good observation. The Axxle wagon is pretty much dead by now. I would have made a defense if I were Insomniac.

Now THIS is intriguing. eHunt UNVOTES from Frisk. This I can also perfectly understand given his situation. Frisk hasn't been the center of attention in the last few pages. So, let's refocus. He attacks Galzria for inconsistencies in his arguments. The O vote was an improper move though. I wouldn't have held him accountable for voting because of a (Hunting * Graham's Number) Morgrim debacle.

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@modS: Need more Vote Count

YES.

Much of the last few pages just seem to be Galzria, O, and eHunt all making pointless attempts to argue. I don't feel it's worthy to change my position on anything uhhhh you just suitclaimed. why did you do that. i thought we were well past that argument. This made things rather tricky if you vote on eHunt. If eHunt IS the ten of wands, then everyone who voted really IS on the chopping block now. OR, he has a Major Arcana role that really depends on eHunt not dying, and he doesn't want people to vote for him. And of course, he can't reveal that because that is super-unknown. You can't just claim Major Arcana because that could mean anything, it only attracts attention to yourself I ALREADY RAMBLED ABOUT THIS IN LIKE MY FIRST POST

If he's lying, then he's lying, that's that. Well, it seems to be working thus far. People seem to be going for insomniac now. And Axxle? WHY? And THIS!

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My claim won't be believed but I am a doctor. I was tryin to discern whether or not that makes eHunt a liar or not that's why I haven't revealed.
Quote
Also RE: eHunt is anybody else forgetting that there is a possibility of mafia doctors?

Here's my thoughts on Insomniac: his posts seem poorly constructed, as noticed by a few other people. Notice how he doesn't say what KIND of doctor he is, mafia or town. eHunt already claims to be town doctor. What other doctors are there!? So now, this can only mean one thing. It's either Insomniac or eHunt who's scum. They can't both be the town doctor. And in the second quote... maybe he hasn't forgotten the possibility of mafia doctors, because he knows there is one? I'm solid in my position that eHunt is innocent.

But wait. What the heck is a ninja doctor? I read on Mafia Scum that he's anti-town. Someone want to clarify on this position? It doesn't make sense. Insomniac's claiming of ninja doctor sounds desperate, like "oops I shouldn't have done that". And wasn't he against suit-claiming in the first place?

TLDR

eHunt is innocent. Major suspicions lie in Eevee and Insomniac. I have been typing this for a couple hours now and I am tired. I'm pretty solid on my suspicions. I was gonna go for Eevee today, but Insomniac's claim just seems too contradictory, I'm going for him instead.

UNVOTE: Grujah

VOTE: Insomniac


I really hope I'm right to do this. I'm tired.

Quote
Warning - while you were typing 54 new replies...

yeah yeah I read them.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #748 on: August 22, 2012, 05:59:53 pm »

How many hours do we have left until the deadline?
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #749 on: August 22, 2012, 06:09:47 pm »

sparky, a "Ninja Doctor" would be a Doctor whose use of the Doctoring ability can't be seen by a Tracker or Watcher.  If I recall correctly, the only Tracker and/or Watcher in the setup are scum roles.  That would make Ninja Doctor a Town role.

vote: ehunt.  I moved my vote from him to Insom because of ehunt's claim; now Insom has (almost literally) balanced that scale.  Taking both doctor claims out of the equation, I'm going back to my strongest scumread.

I believe we have about 21 hours to deadline.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #750 on: August 22, 2012, 06:17:44 pm »

Day 1 deadline = Aug 23, 3 PM Forums Time
OP
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #751 on: August 22, 2012, 06:21:14 pm »

Honestly, is quite simple:

Compare the two claims from the perspective of:

Scum lying
Town telling the truth

See if you can reconcile eHunts claim with either of the above... It should be clear that both fit as possibilities. Now do the same for Insomniac... Only one that fits is town Insomniac. I've already spelled out why.

This leaves two outcomes:

Both are town, in which case we managed to force <i>the only two possible town doctor roles in the entire game</i> to claim D1,

OR

eHunt is scum and Insomniac is a deadman. (Well, he's a deadman regardless I suppose).

In any case, I have SUCH a hard time buying that:

A) Both Doctor roles were drawn
B) We found them both on our first two claims.

Not lynching one of these claims and instead pushing to force even more people to claim is fairly idiotic and borderline extreme scummy. And the logical lynch here is eHunt.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #752 on: August 22, 2012, 06:23:00 pm »

Quote from: sparky5856
f I'm correct, the first vote on Axxle. We all now know that this reason is rubbish to vote for someone, given that we are now on page 30 almost and we all have had plenty of opportunities to help out. With this massive a thread now, we should vote to KILL SCUM, not to kill unhelpful town. (If I play again, I gotta keep this thought in mind. I acted a similar way early on but I'm now rectifying myself. Eevee should have played multiple games by now and realized this.)
This is 100% absolutely INCORRECT.
I did not vote for Axxle for policy reasons. I voted for him because I thought he could have been of more help if he wanted but chose not to -> he was scum. I voted for him because I got a scum read on his behavior. Since, he has changed his ways, so I suppose he was just in a trolly mood in the beginning of this game.

Another section of your book about me I dont understand / agree with:

First you said I dont provide any content, ok. Then you quoted these two points from me:

"(Grujah) not reading back feels like an anti-town move from a townie to me."

"Generally I think posting drunk looks towny."

and say
Quote from: sparky
I already referred to both of these in my last post. Posting things that seem good to post because the "king of content per post" thinks the same?

What do you mean by this? You do not want me to state my opinions in my posts? What kind of content are you hoping for?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #753 on: August 22, 2012, 06:24:46 pm »

I think I get what Ehunt's doing here. He's tunnelling me hard so that when he flips scum there's WIFOM as to whether or not he tunneled his scumbuddy to make them look better.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #754 on: August 22, 2012, 06:26:36 pm »

Told you already I'd rather Insomiac, but with eHunt's behavior.......I dunno. Vote: Insomniac
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #755 on: August 22, 2012, 06:30:01 pm »

Not lynching one of these claims and instead pushing to force even more people to claim is fairly idiotic and borderline extreme scummy. And the logical lynch here is eHunt.
100% agree with the rest of your post, and people who vote for Insomniac atm (hint:sparky) should seriously read it with thought.

However, this is not as black and white as you say imo. I agree we might be better off just lynching ehunt, but fakeclaiming is actually quite risky for mafia here. 16 players and 52 cards, counterclaims are a very real threat (looks like bit less than 30%). Getting counterclaimed really sucks for mafia, because individual power roles are not as big of a deal here than they would be say in your standard two power role setup.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #756 on: August 22, 2012, 06:31:06 pm »

Not lynching one of these claims and instead pushing to force even more people to claim is fairly idiotic and borderline extreme scummy. And the logical lynch here is eHunt.
100% agree with the rest of your post, and people who vote for Insomniac atm (hint:sparky) should seriously read it with thought.

However, this is not as black and white as you say imo. I agree we might be better off just lynching ehunt, but fakeclaiming is actually quite risky for mafia here. 16 players and 52 cards, counterclaims are a very real threat (looks like bit less than 30%). Getting counterclaimed really sucks for mafia, because individual power roles are not as big of a deal here than they would be say in your standard two power role setup.

but he had to fakeclaim? I don't understand your point. If he didn't claim we'd just lynch him.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #757 on: August 22, 2012, 06:35:08 pm »

Not lynching one of these claims and instead pushing to force even more people to claim is fairly idiotic and borderline extreme scummy. And the logical lynch here is eHunt.
100% agree with the rest of your post, and people who vote for Insomniac atm (hint:sparky) should seriously read it with thought.

However, this is not as black and white as you say imo. I agree we might be better off just lynching ehunt, but fakeclaiming is actually quite risky for mafia here. 16 players and 52 cards, counterclaims are a very real threat (looks like bit less than 30%). Getting counterclaimed really sucks for mafia, because individual power roles are not as big of a deal here than they would be say in your standard two power role setup.

but he had to fakeclaim? I don't understand your point. If he didn't claim we'd just lynch him.
my point is, forcing people to claim is not as bad as it would be if we didnt have the cards. for scum, fakeclaiming is riskier here because they might actually get caught right away. for town, one individual power role (especially non-major arcana one) is less vital, so forcing the claims is also less detrimental.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #758 on: August 22, 2012, 06:37:24 pm »

Vote Count
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
ehunt (7): O, Axxle, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Insomniac, Voltgloss [L-2]
Insomniac (4): angrybirds, ftl, sparky5856, Morgrim7 [L-5]
O (2): ehunt, Eevee
shraeye (1): Grujah
Eevee (1): shraeye


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.

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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #759 on: August 22, 2012, 06:38:42 pm »

eHunt is at L-2? I'd vote for him now, if you want.
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Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #760 on: August 22, 2012, 06:39:53 pm »

eHunt is at L-2? I'd vote for him now, if you want.
Me too, but everyone is still talking so dont see the need to hurry. Although it would be fun to be in a mafia wagon for once..
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #761 on: August 22, 2012, 06:40:03 pm »

eHunt is at L-2? I'd vote for him now, if you want.
You can hammer him Morgrim.  I believe in you.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #762 on: August 22, 2012, 06:40:59 pm »

Not lynching one of these claims and instead pushing to force even more people to claim is fairly idiotic and borderline extreme scummy. And the logical lynch here is eHunt.
100% agree with the rest of your post, and people who vote for Insomniac atm (hint:sparky) should seriously read it with thought.

However, this is not as black and white as you say imo. I agree we might be better off just lynching ehunt, but fakeclaiming is actually quite risky for mafia here. 16 players and 52 cards, counterclaims are a very real threat (looks like bit less than 30%). Getting counterclaimed really sucks for mafia, because individual power roles are not as big of a deal here than they would be say in your standard two power role setup.

I agree that counterclaimed would suck for scum in this situation, because at best it's a 1-1 trade, but not claiming anything and just getting lynched accomplished nothing for your scumfaction. Now, you could argue that it wasn't clear eHunt was going to get lynched, as he was only at L-3... But that argument holds true for both scum eHunt and town eHunt. Claiming then was just poor play (obviously he disagrees with me).

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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #763 on: August 22, 2012, 06:41:37 pm »

Not lynching one of these claims and instead pushing to force even more people to claim is fairly idiotic and borderline extreme scummy. And the logical lynch here is eHunt.
100% agree with the rest of your post, and people who vote for Insomniac atm (hint:sparky) should seriously read it with thought.

However, this is not as black and white as you say imo. I agree we might be better off just lynching ehunt, but fakeclaiming is actually quite risky for mafia here. 16 players and 52 cards, counterclaims are a very real threat (looks like bit less than 30%). Getting counterclaimed really sucks for mafia, because individual power roles are not as big of a deal here than they would be say in your standard two power role setup.

but he had to fakeclaim? I don't understand your point. If he didn't claim we'd just lynch him.
my point is, forcing people to claim is not as bad as it would be if we didnt have the cards. for scum, fakeclaiming is riskier here because they might actually get caught right away. for town, one individual power role (especially non-major arcana one) is less vital, so forcing the claims is also less detrimental.

Eevee, your vote for me is currently implying you would like a wagon on me and end with me claiming. Is that what you wish?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #764 on: August 22, 2012, 06:44:42 pm »

I do not wish that O, just forgot it there.

Vote: ehunt, but I'd like to wait for sparky to answer my questions before anyone hammers.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #765 on: August 22, 2012, 06:45:09 pm »

I do not wish that O, just forgot it there.

Vote: ehunt, but I'd like to wait for sparky to answer my questions before anyone hammers.

OK
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #766 on: August 22, 2012, 06:45:41 pm »

I do not wish that O, just forgot it there.

Vote: ehunt, but I'd like to wait for sparky to answer my questions before anyone hammers.

derp thats not what I meant we have morgrim here....

PPE: ZOMG MORGRIMS NOT HAMMERING@#!#@!@ OBVSCUM
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #767 on: August 22, 2012, 06:46:56 pm »

eHunt is at L-2? I'd vote for him now, if you want.
You can hammer him Morgrim.  I believe in you.
I do not wish that O, just forgot it there.

Vote: ehunt, but I'd like to wait for sparky to answer my questions before anyone hammers.

OK
My world is shattered.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #768 on: August 22, 2012, 06:51:55 pm »

Cayvie published all the possible roles. There's three possible doctors: a mafia doctor, a ninja doctor, and a plain town doctor, with the ninja doctor also being town.

I'm not sure what to make of it. I could see Insomniac as scum panicking and thinking that since ehunt claimed, he's next up on the chopping block, and thus trying to counterclaim and being bad at it. I could see Insomniac being town and remembering he's doctor but not remembering his card suit and thus having to look that up. And obviously ehunt could be fakeclaiming too, everyone seems to be sold on an ehunt lynch and I must be missing something. I'll reread ehunt. 

I sure hope they're not both town docs.

...anyone know what Insomniac is like under pressure? Would he be super-careful as scum, or rushed?

...oh, lol, I just noticed that ehunt brought up the whole "Named Townie" thing reeeeally early in the day.

Quote
I don't really mind anything to get the talking going, btw, even if it's loaded questions. I prefer theory to RVS and general hollering but don't much care. I'm too exhausted to theorize about the setup right now though. One thing to note - the decks function to give vanilla townies a bit of a "named townies" role like Jo unintentionally got for himself in MVI. This will probably be very helpful to town.
and way later
Quote
Two quick responses:
1. note that including the card name is an important part of my claim (see "named townie" on mafiascum wiki for theory).

Thinking about the fakeclaim early, eh?

But still, I don't know, I just can't bring myself to vote ehunt. His play just reminds me of mine, which is going to really suck for me if he flips scum :( I suppose I'll do it if I have to to avoid nolynch, but it just doesn't read THAT scummy, and yet everyone seems to be so sure...

...but well, insomniac didn't claim until prompted either, when it looked like he was the natural second choice after ehunt. And he didn't give his card immediately either.

...and in the time it takes me to reread ehunt's posts and write this, ehunt gets to L-1, and Morgrim doesn't hammer him, lol nice! Well, I certainly ain't gonna be the hammer on that wagon since I'm not entirely sold on it and there seem to be no dearth of people who are.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #769 on: August 22, 2012, 06:56:13 pm »

I do not wish that O, just forgot it there.

Vote: ehunt, but I'd like to wait for sparky to answer my questions before anyone hammers.


So if I don't respond, eHunt won't get hammered. That's great!  ;) It's a pretty flimsy reason for me to not respond though.

I don't know if you got those "shraeye drunk" and "Grujah not reading back" points from me or not, it could have just been coincidence. I just find it odd how similar it was to my previous post before that. It's a possibly that those thoughts could have been from me, but I don't know that. They could have been original.

As for the first part of your post, I appreciate the clarification. I can't be 100% accurate in that gigantic post. I've seen players in the past though who were town and didn't help the town as much as they should have. That's why I'm so cautious over that. Regardless, eHunt is almost dead >_< so maybe the discussions can continue later.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #770 on: August 22, 2012, 06:57:07 pm »

Vote: eHunt

Hammered!
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #771 on: August 22, 2012, 06:58:06 pm »

:)
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #772 on: August 22, 2012, 06:58:35 pm »

Cause EVERYONE knows Axxle's votes count multiple times.
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #773 on: August 22, 2012, 06:59:18 pm »

Vote: eHunt

Hammered!

ITT: Axxle pretends to hammer
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #774 on: August 22, 2012, 06:59:45 pm »

Oh I didn't realize you had said those things before me, I understand now. I need to check the timestamps (might not have even read your post before posting mine).  They really were my original own thoughts, I wasnt copying anyone  :( Although saying something someone already said is not scummy to me either, sort of like "I too think this".
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #775 on: August 22, 2012, 07:00:11 pm »

Vote: eHunt

Hammered!

ITT: Axxle pretends to hammer
Bah, reaction test ruined.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #776 on: August 22, 2012, 07:00:49 pm »

Vote: eHunt

Hammered!

ITT: Axxle pretends to hammer

Incidentally, this may be a good tactic for preventing Morgrim hammers: Convince Morgrim the hammer already happened.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #777 on: August 22, 2012, 07:02:34 pm »

Yo, seriously.  Why are we lynching ehunt.  Do not do it.  He is as good as gone this night anyway, and it is very critical that we vote to kill scum.  People are saying ehunt is scummier than Insomniac and that may be true.  But he's not scummy, I'm pretty certain he is exactly what he claims to be.

as Sparky says, "we should vote to KILL SCUM".  Insomniac and ehunt aren't scum as far as I see it, and it will be a terrible mistake when either of them flip and we realize they are telling the truth.  Take a good hard look at the people on those lists.  Scum want to lynch those town PR badly.  We need to make them waste a night kill on that.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #778 on: August 22, 2012, 07:03:15 pm »

Yo, seriously.  Why are we lynching ehunt.  Do not do it.  He is as good as gone this night anyway, and it is very critical that we vote to kill scum.  People are saying ehunt is scummier than Insomniac and that may be true.  But he's not scummy, I'm pretty certain he is exactly what he claims to be.

as Sparky says, "we should vote to KILL SCUM".  Insomniac and ehunt aren't scum as far as I see it, and it will be a terrible mistake when either of them flip and we realize they are telling the truth.  Take a good hard look at the people on those lists.  Scum want to lynch those town PR badly.  We need to make them waste a night kill on that.

Shraeye after ehunt flips scum.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #779 on: August 22, 2012, 07:04:47 pm »

Yo, seriously.  Why are we lynching ehunt.  Do not do it.  He is as good as gone this night anyway, and it is very critical that we vote to kill scum.  People are saying ehunt is scummier than Insomniac and that may be true.  But he's not scummy, I'm pretty certain he is exactly what he claims to be.

as Sparky says, "we should vote to KILL SCUM".  Insomniac and ehunt aren't scum as far as I see it, and it will be a terrible mistake when either of them flip and we realize they are telling the truth.  Take a good hard look at the people on those lists.  Scum want to lynch those town PR badly.  We need to make them waste a night kill on that.
Why is he as good as gone? what incentive to scum have for lynching doctors? they want to lynch investigative roles.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #780 on: August 22, 2012, 07:05:36 pm »

People are saying that it is really unlikely to draw two town doctors and end up getting claims from both of them.  This is true, ONLY IF we look at that event occuring from the outset without any extra information given.  Like if this argument were made at post #50.

The question that we need to ask is "given that we did receive two claims and both are doctors, what is the likelihood that they are telling the truth?"  This is a completely different question than "how likely is it to draw two town doctors, and then pressure them both into claiming."  Conditional probability.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #781 on: August 22, 2012, 07:05:40 pm »

Yo, seriously.  Why are we lynching ehunt.  Do not do it.  He is as good as gone this night anyway, and it is very critical that we vote to kill scum.  People are saying ehunt is scummier than Insomniac and that may be true.  But he's not scummy, I'm pretty certain he is exactly what he claims to be.

as Sparky says, "we should vote to KILL SCUM".  Insomniac and ehunt aren't scum as far as I see it, and it will be a terrible mistake when either of them flip and we realize they are telling the truth.  Take a good hard look at the people on those lists.  Scum want to lynch those town PR badly.  We need to make them waste a night kill on that.
Why is he as good as gone? what incentive to scum have for lynching doctors? they want to lynch investigative roles.
Or scum, or just WIFOM him to a lynch tomorrow.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #782 on: August 22, 2012, 07:06:22 pm »

People are saying that it is really unlikely to draw two town doctors and end up getting claims from both of them.  This is true, ONLY IF we look at that event occuring from the outset without any extra information given.  Like if this argument were made at post #50.

The question that we need to ask is "given that we did receive two claims and both are doctors, what is the likelihood that they are telling the truth?"  This is a completely different question than "how likely is it to draw two town doctors, and then pressure them both into claiming."  Conditional probability.
eHunt says he was lurking because he was a doctor.  Terrible.  Everyone's a power role.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #783 on: August 22, 2012, 07:06:28 pm »

Yo, seriously.  Why are we lynching ehunt.  Do not do it.  He is as good as gone this night anyway, and it is very critical that we vote to kill scum.  People are saying ehunt is scummier than Insomniac and that may be true.  But he's not scummy, I'm pretty certain he is exactly what he claims to be.

as Sparky says, "we should vote to KILL SCUM".  Insomniac and ehunt aren't scum as far as I see it, and it will be a terrible mistake when either of them flip and we realize they are telling the truth.  Take a good hard look at the people on those lists.  Scum want to lynch these town PR badly.  We need to make them waste a night kill on that.

In this post: Shraeye would rather continue to build more wagons and out more PR's, believing the most likely outcome of events to date are that we were dealt both town doctors, and managed to push both to claim as our first two wagons!
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #784 on: August 22, 2012, 07:07:17 pm »

Yo, seriously.  Why are we lynching ehunt.  Do not do it.  He is as good as gone this night anyway, and it is very critical that we vote to kill scum.  People are saying ehunt is scummier than Insomniac and that may be true.  But he's not scummy, I'm pretty certain he is exactly what he claims to be.

as Sparky says, "we should vote to KILL SCUM".  Insomniac and ehunt aren't scum as far as I see it, and it will be a terrible mistake when either of them flip and we realize they are telling the truth.  Take a good hard look at the people on those lists.  Scum want to lynch those town PR badly.  We need to make them waste a night kill on that.
Why is he as good as gone? what incentive to scum have for lynching doctors? they want to lynch investigative roles.

lynching investigative roles would be better for them than lynching a doctor, but lynching doctors is better than lynching VT.  BOTH ARE BAD FOR TOWN.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #785 on: August 22, 2012, 07:08:40 pm »

Assume if scum need to fakeclaim they will pick doctor 60% of the time (as it's the easiest goddamn fakeclaim)

we have 4+ scum prolly, IDK, conditional probability says one of these two is very likely scum versus picking two doctors.

Bam.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #786 on: August 22, 2012, 07:08:44 pm »

Yo, seriously.  Why are we lynching ehunt.  Do not do it.  He is as good as gone this night anyway, and it is very critical that we vote to kill scum.  People are saying ehunt is scummier than Insomniac and that may be true.  But he's not scummy, I'm pretty certain he is exactly what he claims to be.

as Sparky says, "we should vote to KILL SCUM".  Insomniac and ehunt aren't scum as far as I see it, and it will be a terrible mistake when either of them flip and we realize they are telling the truth.  Take a good hard look at the people on those lists.  Scum want to lynch those town PR badly.  We need to make them waste a night kill on that.
Why is he as good as gone? what incentive to scum have for lynching doctors? they want to lynch investigative roles.

lynching investigative roles would be better for them than lynching a doctor, but lynching doctors is better than lynching VT.  BOTH ARE BAD FOR TOWN.
All VT are basically named town because they have a card suit and number.  Mafia will rarely if ever claim VT in this setup.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #787 on: August 22, 2012, 07:09:12 pm »

In this post: Shraeye would rather continue to build more wagons and out more PR's, believing the most likely outcome of events to date are that we were dealt both town doctors, and managed to push both to claim as our first two wagons!

Given that we had two claims of doctors, it is actually somewhat likely that we were dealt two doctors and sucked our way into pressuring them.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #788 on: August 22, 2012, 07:09:47 pm »

In this post: Shraeye would rather continue to build more wagons and out more PR's, believing the most likely outcome of events to date are that we were dealt both town doctors, and managed to push both to claim as our first two wagons!

Given that we had two claims of doctors, it is actually somewhat likely that we were dealt two doctors and sucked our way into pressuring them.
Bus your scummate already shraeye, save some face.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #789 on: August 22, 2012, 07:10:33 pm »

In this post: Shraeye would rather continue to build more wagons and out more PR's, believing the most likely outcome of events to date are that we were dealt both town doctors, and managed to push both to claim as our first two wagons!

Given that we had two claims of doctors, it is actually somewhat likely that we were dealt two doctors and sucked our way into pressuring them.

No, it's really not, because remember scum like to fakeclaim doctor, and there are far more scum slots than doctor slots.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #790 on: August 22, 2012, 07:12:30 pm »

In this post: Shraeye would rather continue to build more wagons and out more PR's, believing the most likely outcome of events to date are that we were dealt both town doctors, and managed to push both to claim as our first two wagons!

Given that we had two claims of doctors, it is actually somewhat likely that we were dealt two doctors and sucked our way into pressuring them.
Bus your scummate already shraeye, save some face.

I guess I can understand the backlash that you guys are giving me for this stance, but how in the world could ehunt be my scumbuddy?  With this vociferous of a defense of him, I know that if he flips scum I'm as good as gone tomorrow.  But I fully believe in the truth of his claim.  I ain't voting for ehunt.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #791 on: August 22, 2012, 07:13:06 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #792 on: August 22, 2012, 07:13:43 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions
yes, yes we have.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #793 on: August 22, 2012, 07:14:17 pm »

In this post: Shraeye would rather continue to build more wagons and out more PR's, believing the most likely outcome of events to date are that we were dealt both town doctors, and managed to push both to claim as our first two wagons!

Given that we had two claims of doctors, it is actually somewhat likely that we were dealt two doctors and sucked our way into pressuring them.
Bus your scummate already shraeye, save some face.

I guess I can understand the backlash that you guys are giving me for this stance, but how in the world could ehunt be my scumbuddy?  With this vociferous of a defense of him, I know that if he flips scum I'm as good as gone tomorrow.  But I fully believe in the truth of his claim.  I ain't voting for ehunt.

because that leads to WIFOM and the only real thing we have is that you are steadfastly standing in his defense.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #794 on: August 22, 2012, 07:14:26 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions
tell me one better fakeclaim eHunt.  Any at all.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #795 on: August 22, 2012, 07:14:46 pm »

Gotta go and can't keep up on phone. Wish Frisk was here to talk sense into people. I've voiced all my reads I think. Don't let O trick you twice.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #796 on: August 22, 2012, 07:15:30 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions

I agree man, that's why I keep saying these aren't fakeclaims. #745 and Galz in #709 actually makes this argument but never applies it to ehunt for some reason.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #797 on: August 22, 2012, 07:15:47 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions
tell me one better fakeclaim eHunt.  Any at all.

Vig
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #798 on: August 22, 2012, 07:15:55 pm »

Gotta go and can't keep up on phone. Wish Frisk was here to talk sense into people. I've voiced all my reads I think. Don't let O trick you twice.

Jesus christ stop trying to give them WIFOM i'm not your goddamn scumbuddy.

And I'm not tricking anyone, the argument against you is solid.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #799 on: August 22, 2012, 07:16:20 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions

I agree man, that's why I keep saying these aren't fakeclaims. #745 and Galz in #709 actually makes this argument but never applies it to ehunt for some reason.
tell me one better fakeclaim shraeye.  Any at all.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #800 on: August 22, 2012, 07:16:54 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions
tell me one better fakeclaim eHunt.  Any at all.

Vig
I'd kill that 5 times faster as scum than I'd kill the doc.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #801 on: August 22, 2012, 07:17:43 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions
tell me one better fakeclaim eHunt.  Any at all.

Vig

easily confirmable towards endgame, generally makes people suspicious because it's a killing role, Scum would want to kill you if they're opposing scumteam. next.

oh, and also a vig wouldn't need to counterclaim, they could just vig you.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #802 on: August 22, 2012, 07:18:02 pm »

Gotta go and can't keep up on phone. Wish Frisk was here to talk sense into people. I've voiced all my reads I think. Don't let O trick you twice.

Jesus christ stop trying to give them WIFOM i'm not your goddamn scumbuddy.

And I'm not tricking anyone, the argument against you is solid.

No WIFOM. You tricked them today but they'll see it plain tomorrow.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #803 on: August 22, 2012, 07:18:50 pm »

Gotta go and can't keep up on phone. Wish Frisk was here to talk sense into people. I've voiced all my reads I think. Don't let O trick you twice.

Jesus christ stop trying to give them WIFOM i'm not your goddamn scumbuddy.

And I'm not tricking anyone, the argument against you is solid.

No WIFOM. You tricked them today but they'll see it plain tomorrow.

who did I trick? why is Axxle not suspicious in this tricking?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #804 on: August 22, 2012, 07:19:12 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions
tell me one better fakeclaim eHunt.  Any at all.

Vig

easily confirmable towards endgame, generally makes people suspicious because it's a killing role, Scum would want to kill you if they're opposing scumteam. next.

oh, and also a vig wouldn't need to counterclaim, they could just vig you.
There have been so many fake vig claims on this forum that I might just policy lynch the next one.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #805 on: August 22, 2012, 07:20:13 pm »

Joth didn't get away with it, Dsell only got away with it because they suspected he was SK and they needed to lynch mafia.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #806 on: August 22, 2012, 07:20:26 pm »

 already  laid out case on O which he knows, he's asking me to repeat so it gets buried in noise while I can only phone post.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #807 on: August 22, 2012, 07:21:33 pm »

Axxle may be scummy but the only confidence I have is O. Read all my posts carefully.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #808 on: August 22, 2012, 07:21:56 pm »

already  laid out case on O which he knows, he's asking me to repeat so it gets buried in noise while I can only phone post.
I'll dig it up
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #809 on: August 22, 2012, 07:22:42 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions

I agree man, that's why I keep saying these aren't fakeclaims. #745 and Galz in #709 actually makes this argument but never applies it to ehunt for some reason.

Because those arguments don't apply to eHunt's claim. They apply to a counterclaim, as scum, when so many better routes were available. The only reason to essentially COUNTERCLAIM the same role in such a role-rich game (and that is essentially what Insomniacs claim must be viewed as) is because you're town, telling the truth. Do you REALLY believe scum would counterclaim the same role just to get eHunt lynched? LOL!

eHunt was headed towards a lynch, he had to claim something eventually.  As town he would've waited, not wanting to out himself. As scum he would claim early to draw counterclaims. I absolutely think that eHunt = scum > two truthful doctor claims, and for scum Insomniac to make that claim would've been idiotic.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #810 on: August 22, 2012, 07:23:47 pm »

I am traveling today, am not back till next Tuesday, and won't have time for another big computer post till then. I may be able to phone post more, but sniping phone post fights without the ability to look up references are annoying, especially when your old posts are being willfully misrepresented or ignored and you can't look them up. In particular I'm unlikely to be very active early Day 2 of this game.

I'm very happy with my O wagon. He made a case on me that seemed unserious (the you said hunting three times in a row case). I said that the "hunting hunting hunting" phrase was obviously light-hearted. He ignored that, then said why didn't you answer my hunting hunting hunting argument? I repeated my answer. He said that OF COURSE this wasn't why he was voting for me, he was just calling out the phrase as being "stupid." I said that he was being contradictory; instead of answering my argument, he called it desperate "regardless of alignment" (why did he say that?). I think he's scared cause he knows he made a mistake, so he acts overwhelmingly dismissive of the arguments in the hope that if you say something with strong enough language, it becomes true.

Many complaints about my claim. Look, I was going to get one or two more chances to make a computer post before deadline. Realistically without my claim there was no chance of someone getting lynched aside from me, at least two people who weren't voting for me had expressed willingness, and there's still Morgrim lurking to quickhammer. At best I could have waited and then phone posted my claim at L - 1 resulting in a no lynch (if no accident happened). We can argue about Mafia strategy till we're blue in the fact but at the end of the day it's a distraction from scumhunting. If you think my claim is FALSE, say that. If you just think it's bad strategy, eh, try not to aggressively push a wagon on the doctor over nothing next time.

Finally, yes, the doctor role is part of why I was lurking (in particular it's why I wasn't pushing wagons), although I also meant it when I said I was genuinely less obsessed with this game than I was with MVI (more obsessed now, but still not at MVI levels of obsession).

I can't say I understand the case against Insomniac. I will do some reading on it now then decide whether to vote him (to avoid no lynch) or keep my vote on O (and hope somebody comes around). Would strongly prefer the latter.
You were acting scummy as **** and you know that. OMGUSes everywhere, half-baked logic. I see you as incredibly calm and clearheaded under pressure, in MV.

but unvote anyways. and you really really dont want to wagon me ehunt.

Again, observe that O doesn't answer my arguments and instead asserts that things are obvious (I was scummy as **** and I know it). This is an extremely effective technique for dismissing arguments you can't answer in a game with this much distraction and noise, because people who are only skimming will believe that the extremeness in the tone is reflective of an extremeness in reality which isn't there. I would ask everyone to read my argument with O last night carefully, starting from the post where O votes for me. Ask yourself: why is O voting for ehunt? What evidence is he providing? Which of his arguments does he think are serious and which do he think are "of course" unserious? I claim you will not be able to formulate a coherent narrative of his play.

I have said several times that OMGUS is not a scumtell and I have not been rebutted. I think that OMGUS is actively a good thing. It is absolutely essential that a townie point out the scum on a misleading wagon against him. All a dead townie has is his voice. If I'm mislynched or NKed and haven't specifically pointed to who on my wagon is scum, then when it comes time to figure out who the scum is, misleading scum will do "statistical analysis" or cite old games or whatever they need to do and argue that the seventh vote or the voter with the least post count or the voter who was on the most or fewest other wagons is scummy, and not enough people will go back and check and notice, hey, O was the one voting ehunt without evidence and with contradictory posts. Now that I've made lots of noise over O, at least something good will come out of my impending nightkill. That is why if you are a townie you should always call out scummy arguments on you.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #811 on: August 22, 2012, 07:24:17 pm »

I am traveling today, am not back till next Tuesday, and won't have time for another big computer post till then. I may be able to phone post more, but sniping phone post fights without the ability to look up references are annoying, especially when your old posts are being willfully misrepresented or ignored and you can't look them up. In particular I'm unlikely to be very active early Day 2 of this game.

I'm very happy with my O wagon. He made a case on me that seemed unserious (the you said hunting three times in a row case). I said that the "hunting hunting hunting" phrase was obviously light-hearted. He ignored that, then said why didn't you answer my hunting hunting hunting argument? I repeated my answer. He said that OF COURSE this wasn't why he was voting for me, he was just calling out the phrase as being "stupid." I said that he was being contradictory; instead of answering my argument, he called it desperate "regardless of alignment" (why did he say that?). I think he's scared cause he knows he made a mistake, so he acts overwhelmingly dismissive of the arguments in the hope that if you say something with strong enough language, it becomes true.

Many complaints about my claim. Look, I was going to get one or two more chances to make a computer post before deadline. Realistically without my claim there was no chance of someone getting lynched aside from me, at least two people who weren't voting for me had expressed willingness, and there's still Morgrim lurking to quickhammer. At best I could have waited and then phone posted my claim at L - 1 resulting in a no lynch (if no accident happened). We can argue about Mafia strategy till we're blue in the fact but at the end of the day it's a distraction from scumhunting. If you think my claim is FALSE, say that. If you just think it's bad strategy, eh, try not to aggressively push a wagon on the doctor over nothing next time.

Finally, yes, the doctor role is part of why I was lurking (in particular it's why I wasn't pushing wagons), although I also meant it when I said I was genuinely less obsessed with this game than I was with MVI (more obsessed now, but still not at MVI levels of obsession).

I can't say I understand the case against Insomniac. I will do some reading on it now then decide whether to vote him (to avoid no lynch) or keep my vote on O (and hope somebody comes around). Would strongly prefer the latter.

Quote
Again, observe that O doesn't answer my arguments and instead asserts that things are obvious (I was scummy as **** and I know it). This is an extremely effective technique for dismissing arguments you can't answer in a game with this much distraction and noise, because people who are only skimming will believe that the extremeness in the tone is reflective of an extremeness in reality which isn't there. I would ask everyone to read my argument with O last night carefully, starting from the post where O votes for me. Ask yourself: why is O voting for ehunt? What evidence is he providing? Which of his arguments does he think are serious and which do he think are "of course" unserious? I claim you will not be able to formulate a coherent narrative of his play.

I have said several times that OMGUS is not a scumtell and I have not been rebutted. I think that OMGUS is actively a good thing. It is absolutely essential that a townie point out the scum on a misleading wagon against him. All a dead townie has is his voice. If I'm mislynched or NKed and haven't specifically pointed to who on my wagon is scum, then when it comes time to figure out who the scum is, misleading scum will do "statistical analysis" or cite old games or whatever they need to do and argue that the seventh vote or the voter with the least post count or the voter who was on the most or fewest other wagons is scummy, and not enough people will go back and check and notice, hey, O was the one voting ehunt without evidence and with contradictory posts. Now that I've made lots of noise over O, at least something good will come out of my impending nightkill. That is why if you are a townie you should always call out scummy arguments on you.

Two quick responses:
1. note that including the card name is an important part of my claim (see "named townie" on mafiascum wiki for theory).
2. i agree that doctor is a good fakeclaim if there's one scumfaction. with multiple scumfactions it doesn't matter,  claimants are going to get nightkilled. a scumfaction will say, ok, either ehunt is telling the truth, or he's lying in which case he's on the other scumfaction. either way he's a good kill. i'm very unlikely to survive the night.

Quick response to O quoting my long post: I answered that argument a long time ago, when you made it the first time. My long post was the first post in many hours and I was trying to make conversation happen in a dead room, even though I didn't have much to say on most of the folks. The people I said were very town were people I felt were very town and I am not going to lie about my positions. I still feel that way about all of them except for Galzria, and even Galzria I still have a somewhat town read on.

Again, people, read O's fight with me last night in order, starting with where he votes me for saying "morgrim hunting hunting hunting." Don't let him mislead you, especially after I am gone. He is bringing up old arguments (and not quoting my responses to them) because he needs to create as much misinformation and noise as possible for when people go back over my case against him.

I think my O case is better than the Insomniac case, so not moving my vote. Will try to phone check. Adios for now.

PPE: GOD DAMNIT AXXLE
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #812 on: August 22, 2012, 07:25:17 pm »

L - 1 with morgrim expressing willingness = bad news bears...

Please go after O next, not Insomniac.

No one answered my arg that fakeclaiming doc is bad  scum play with multiple scum factions

I agree man, that's why I keep saying these aren't fakeclaims. #745 and Galz in #709 actually makes this argument but never applies it to ehunt for some reason.
tell me one better fakeclaim shraeye.  Any at all.
I don't know man, I'm not an experienced player in mafia.  Apparently it is standard practice to fakeclaim doctor, and I honestly didn't know that.  It seems that whatever answer I give you'll say that you'd kill them 5 times faster than you'd kill the doc, but you are also trying as hard as you can to kill the doc.  Are you telling me that you would have been trying as harder as you can to kill a different fakeclaim?  What if the mafia doesn't claim?  What if they claim VT?  With ehunt having to claim a specific card, a 10 Wands claim is just as tough as a 6 Wands claim.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #813 on: August 22, 2012, 07:25:21 pm »

i'll join shraeye and vote eevee

yes school is starting, but i'll try to post more
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #814 on: August 22, 2012, 07:26:52 pm »

The case is our fight from last night, not what O and Axxle block quoted.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #815 on: August 22, 2012, 07:27:59 pm »

i'll join shraeye and vote eevee

yes school is starting, but i'll try to post more
You should sheep your brother instead.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #816 on: August 22, 2012, 07:29:06 pm »

All theory arguments assuming only one scumfaction irrelevant. O knows this and is misleading. He thinks i'm the other scum faction from him which will vindicate him, but in fact I am town and vote for him as soon as you see it.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #817 on: August 22, 2012, 07:30:25 pm »

I want to remark on the argument that morgrim-hunting-hunting is a scumtell. I think that morgrim-hunting-hunting-hunting is a stronger scumtell.

[annoying f.ds mafia history]
Robz, I don't think you Morgrim-hunting-hunted in MVI. You defended Morgrim (even though he was town and you were scum), but I don't recall you FoS'ing or voting for anyone who voted for him on the basis of that alone. Maybe I am wrong. Grujah is the only one I remember Morgrim-hunting-hunting, which was a little unfair since Morgrim's townitude was mod-confirmed to Grujah in that game.
[/annoying f.ds mafia history]

I do agree that Morgrim-hunting-hunting suffers from the same problem as Morgrim-hunting (it's "too easy.") I don't agree that this gives Morgrim-hunters a blank check. I also think that Frisk's insistence that his Morgrim-hunting was pure RVS when backing away from it was independently scummy, regardless of your position on Morgrim-hunting in the abstract.


602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

It's your defense of Axxle that makes you scummy more than anything.

And yeah, I noted yesterday that I had that "holy expletive" moment when I realized you were in the game. Did you just happen to forget that post of mine?

Before you said the axxle defense was scummy because I did it at the last minute. Now you say the defense qua the defense is scummy. I'm not going to debate somebody who shifts his arguments around instead of listening and acknowledging when he's wrong. It's not my fault that you didn't notice my earlier posts defending axxle.

602 galzria doesn't post much therefore galzria is good
606 ehunt doesn't post much therefore ehunt is bad

Also missing that I've been defending axxle for a lot longer than a day.

Robz eevee yuma all seem town, although robz vote on me scummy. Galzria seemed town until his recent inconsistency. Volt i'm not sure on. Scummiest on wagon is still probably O.

vote: O

O's case on me scummiest (ehunt used the word hunting three times in a row, therefore i'll push his wagon over the 50% line), Galz second scummiest (I've been derailing the terrible axxle wagon for days!).
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #818 on: August 22, 2012, 07:31:22 pm »

Obvi don't be schooled by O selectively quoting my case against him, read argument in order .
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #819 on: August 22, 2012, 07:31:28 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #820 on: August 22, 2012, 07:31:51 pm »

Meant fooled not schooled.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #821 on: August 22, 2012, 07:32:17 pm »

Obvi don't be schooled by O selectively quoting my case against him, read argument in order .

....are you paranoid?
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #822 on: August 22, 2012, 07:32:33 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.

Agreed, also vote for O.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #823 on: August 22, 2012, 07:33:16 pm »

Obvi don't be schooled by O selectively quoting my case against him, read argument in order .

....are you paranoid?

No, ten of wands.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #824 on: August 22, 2012, 07:33:44 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.

Agreed, also vote for O.

except that he referred to me as a townie. bit awkward there.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #825 on: August 22, 2012, 07:34:29 pm »

All theory arguments assuming only one scumfaction irrelevant. O knows this and is misleading. He thinks i'm the other scum faction from him which will vindicate him, but in fact I am town and vote for him as soon as you see it.
And he was one of the first ones to set me up as your buddy, be sure to note that piece, as it may also be very relevant.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #826 on: August 22, 2012, 07:35:28 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.

Do you think you will be dying tonight?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #827 on: August 22, 2012, 07:35:33 pm »

All theory arguments assuming only one scumfaction irrelevant. O knows this and is misleading. He thinks i'm the other scum faction from him which will vindicate him, but in fact I am town and vote for him as soon as you see it.
And he was one of the first ones to set me up as your buddy, be sure to note that piece, as it may also be very relevant.

don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships

LOLOLOLOLOL
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #828 on: August 22, 2012, 07:37:31 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.

Agreed, also vote for O.

except that he referred to me as a townie. bit awkward there.
Well I don't have the time to look back right now because I need to cook dinner, but I think you may fall into both categories.  Looking for scumbuddies is something everyone should be trying to do I suppose, but this strange push to lynch a doctor is really really misguided.  I want to know, WHO is misguiding it?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #829 on: August 22, 2012, 07:37:51 pm »

All theory arguments assuming only one scumfaction irrelevant. O knows this and is misleading. He thinks i'm the other scum faction from him which will vindicate him, but in fact I am town and vote for him as soon as you see it.
And he was one of the first ones to set me up as your buddy, be sure to note that piece, as it may also be very relevant.

don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships

LOLOLOLOLOL

This is complete town O you guys.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #830 on: August 22, 2012, 07:38:15 pm »

Morgrim, Morgrim, Morgrim.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #831 on: August 22, 2012, 07:39:09 pm »

I mean, I almost want to lynch shraeye after such a blatant contradiction. Surely Ehunt agrees that was a blatant contradiction?
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #832 on: August 22, 2012, 07:40:30 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.

Do you think you will be dying tonight?

For a long time, I suspected I would be because I've been so obviously pro-town, so I always knew I'd be trying to post my last thoughts at the deadline.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #833 on: August 22, 2012, 07:41:36 pm »

O will say tomorrow that I was crazy so don't listen to me but when I went crazy in mvi I was right. Read my case, not his distraction, my case.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #834 on: August 22, 2012, 07:42:05 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.

Do you think you will be dying tonight?

For a long time, I suspected I would be because I've been so obviously pro-town, so I always knew I'd be trying to post my last thoughts at the deadline.

You've never been "obvpro-town".
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #835 on: August 22, 2012, 07:42:35 pm »

O will say tomorrow that I was crazy so don't listen to me but when I went crazy in mvi I was right. Read my case, not his distraction, my case.

it's not a distraction. I want your answer: was Shraeye's blatant contradiction scummy or not, or do you not think of it as a contradiction?
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #836 on: August 22, 2012, 07:44:05 pm »

Not as scummy as your contradiction, plus his defense of me is pro-town, but yes, it's weird.  He would explain.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #837 on: August 22, 2012, 07:45:04 pm »

Hey, note to people still alive tomorrow.  Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum), don't be distracted by people who are pushing suspicion to me, they are just townies looking for scumbuddies and relationships (which according to yuma was RIDICULOUS when I tried to do the same with him and Eevee, who I still suspect...irony), and I hope they realize they are wrong so that they can lynch actual scum one of these times.

Do you think you will be dying tonight?

For a long time, I suspected I would be because I've been so obviously pro-town, so I always knew I'd be trying to post my last thoughts at the deadline.
You have not been obviously pro town at all.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #838 on: August 22, 2012, 07:45:50 pm »

I mean, I almost want to lynch shraeye after such a blatant contradiction. Surely Ehunt agrees that was a blatant contradiction?
Hey mate, you're incorrect here.  Your posts #699 and #698 are exactly what I think is most suspicious.  Voting for ehunt and using Insomniac being more believable as your reason

This is what I originally said (and it's the part you clipped out of the quote you made of me in LOLOL post)
"Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum)"
and this is the category you fall into, which is why you setting me up as buddy with ehunt could be relevant.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #839 on: August 22, 2012, 07:47:26 pm »

I mean, I almost want to lynch shraeye after such a blatant contradiction. Surely Ehunt agrees that was a blatant contradiction?
Hey mate, you're incorrect here.  Your posts #699 and #698 are exactly what I think is most suspicious.  Voting for ehunt and using Insomniac being more believable as your reason

This is what I originally said (and it's the part you clipped out of the quote you made of me in LOLOL post)
"Look at the people who pushed hardest for ehunt to be lynched (especially those that justified it not by saying that ehunt was lying, but by saying that Insomniac was telling the truth and THEREFORE ehunt is scum)"
and this is the category you fall into, which is why you setting me up as buddy with ehunt could be relevant.

Slight problem with this: I've been the MAIN PERSON tying you to Ehunt as possible scumpair. Axxle did it a bit too, but it was mostly in jest.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #840 on: August 22, 2012, 07:48:39 pm »

#838 continued...
and in the rush of posting (this is the most posts per minute I've put anywhere for any reason) I said that suspecting me was townie, but I meant to call it not a scumtell, i.e. nulltell.  There's a lot of noise running around, and I'm just trying to get people focused on the right thing.  Which is post #698 and #699 and others like it.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #841 on: August 22, 2012, 07:49:49 pm »

#838 continued...
and in the rush of posting (this is the most posts per minute I've put anywhere for any reason) I said that suspecting me was townie, but I meant to call it not a scumtell, i.e. nulltell.  There's a lot of noise running around, and I'm just trying to get people focused on the right thing.  Which is post #698 and #699 and others like it.

So you backtrack. Ok.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #842 on: August 22, 2012, 07:50:04 pm »

I gotta go. Shraeye doesn't contradict. My last words will be:

Read last nights posts in order, starting with O voting for me over "hunting hunting hunting."
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #843 on: August 22, 2012, 07:50:18 pm »

Slight problem with this: I've been the MAIN PERSON tying you to Ehunt as possible scumpair. Axxle did it a bit too, but it was mostly in jest.
Frankly, it's been really flippin hard for me to see who's said what when.  I know you had tied me, I think Axxle did too, but I thought a third person also parrot-ed this idea.  I've got no time to sort that out now, I have to cook.

Final thoughts: don't lynch ehunt, if you do heed mine and ehunts words tomorrow.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #844 on: August 22, 2012, 07:51:28 pm »

Morgrim, Morgrim, Morgrim.
this didn't work  :(
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #845 on: August 22, 2012, 07:53:47 pm »

so two people have basically made it an ultimatum that I'm scum. Interesting... verrrry interesting...
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #846 on: August 22, 2012, 07:57:26 pm »

can someone conjure up a current vote count? >.>
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #847 on: August 22, 2012, 07:58:09 pm »

shraeye, there is a huge difference between what I said: that if ehunt flips, the suspicion should be on you

and what you said: yuma forgot to post his thoughts on eevee, therefore they must be scum buddies.

Mine has a clause attached to it, as well as a call for more thorough investigation.

You just called me out and attached meaning to nothing.

And I agree with O. Am I a suspicious townie that should be lynched? Do you want to lynch townies?
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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #848 on: August 22, 2012, 08:00:44 pm »

ehunt (8): O, Axxle, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Insomniac, Voltgloss, Eevee [L-1]

did it all by myself. arent yall proud?

FOS: CAPTAIN FRISK for ignoring this debacle while being online, mostly.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #849 on: August 22, 2012, 08:03:06 pm »

Not a lot has changed since last vote count, Eevee voted for eHunt and angrybirds sheeped shraeye to Eevee

unofficial Vote Count
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, Morgrim7
ehunt (8): O, Axxle, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Insomniac, Voltgloss, Eevee [L-1]
Insomniac (3): ftl, sparky5856, Morgrim7 [L-6]
O (1): ehunt
shraeye (1): Grujah
Eevee (2): shraeye, angrybirds


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #850 on: August 22, 2012, 08:06:25 pm »

after reading through shrayes' posts the only thing i agree with it that i dont think a lynch of either insomniac or ehunt is a good idea, they will probably both be targeted tomorrow and if they aren't that would be interesting and potentially mean mafia???? but i don't agree with anything else shraye is saying and dont feel comfortable being on the same wagon, so i will change my vote to vote:  shraeye
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #851 on: August 22, 2012, 08:07:12 pm »

Taking a good hard look at angrybirds tomorrow.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #852 on: August 22, 2012, 08:23:38 pm »

Taking a good hard look at angrybirds tomorrow.

Agreed.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #853 on: August 22, 2012, 08:39:08 pm »

I actually think Angrybirds is town.  :o
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #854 on: August 22, 2012, 08:42:10 pm »

I actually think Angrybirds is town.  :o
If he hammers eHunt I'll believe he's town.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #855 on: August 22, 2012, 08:44:01 pm »

Vote Count
Robz888 (1): Captain_Frisk
ehunt (8.): O, Axxle, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Insomniac, Voltgloss, Eevee [L-1]
Insomniac (3): ftl, sparky5856, Morgrim7
O (1): ehunt
shraeye (2): Grujah, angrybirds
Eevee (1): shraeye


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.

Sorry guyz I was writing PMs for my game.

« Last Edit: August 22, 2012, 10:02:45 pm by jotheonah »
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #856 on: August 22, 2012, 08:48:00 pm »

Eh, I never got the benefit of being a town noob, but I think I would be hesitant to cast the D1 hammer under such strenuous circumstances.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #857 on: August 22, 2012, 08:52:19 pm »

joth your vote count has Morgrim voting for both Robz and Ins


that ain't right
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #858 on: August 22, 2012, 08:57:06 pm »

Eh, I never got the benefit of being a town noob, but I think I would be hesitant to cast the D1 hammer under such strenuous circumstances.
No chance we slide into a nolynch anymore though. Just a matter of time, I think.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #859 on: August 22, 2012, 08:59:28 pm »

I actually think Angrybirds is town.  :o
If he hammers eHunt I'll believe he's town.

you trying to turn me into the next morgrim?

what is everyone else waiting for?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #860 on: August 22, 2012, 09:01:32 pm »

I actually think Angrybirds is town.  :o
If he hammers eHunt I'll believe he's town.

you trying to turn me into the next morgrim?

what is everyone else waiting for?
If you hammered him after I said that it would have been *incredibly* scummy.  Good job.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #861 on: August 22, 2012, 09:07:35 pm »

you trying to turn me into the next morgrim?

Morgrim got started by self-hammering. You're not the next morgrim as long as you don't suicide :)
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #862 on: August 22, 2012, 09:12:10 pm »

I actually think Angrybirds is town.  :o
If he hammers eHunt I'll believe he's town.

you trying to turn me into the next morgrim?

what is everyone else waiting for?
If you hammered him after I said that it would have been *incredibly* scummy.  Good job.

um thanks? would i have been scummy if he flipped mafia?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #863 on: August 22, 2012, 09:14:13 pm »

I actually think Angrybirds is town.  :o
If he hammers eHunt I'll believe he's town.

you trying to turn me into the next morgrim?

what is everyone else waiting for?
If you hammered him after I said that it would have been *incredibly* scummy.  Good job.

um thanks? would i have been scummy if he flipped mafia?
yes
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #864 on: August 22, 2012, 09:14:44 pm »

ftl: thoughts on the current situation?
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #865 on: August 22, 2012, 09:17:14 pm »

Everyone who's super-convinced ehunt is scum is on the wagon already. Everyone else is unconvinced or is sort of convinced but doesn't want to hammer because hammers are scary.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #866 on: August 22, 2012, 09:20:43 pm »

Hammers shouldn't be as scary as people make them out to be.

...anyone know what Insomniac is like under pressure? Would he be super-careful as scum, or rushed?

IIRC he reacts to pressure very very very very poorly as town (don't know if he's been scum yet)
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #867 on: August 22, 2012, 09:26:12 pm »

Hammers shouldn't be as scary as people make them out to be.

...anyone know what Insomniac is like under pressure? Would he be super-careful as scum, or rushed?

IIRC he reacts to pressure very very very very poorly as town (don't know if he's been scum yet)

Cant say anything else but I was scum in rmm1
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #868 on: August 22, 2012, 09:35:15 pm »

Surprised I'm still here, maybe most scum already on wagon. I decided read on ftl is not scum. Frisk, where are you, please stop this madness. Axxle looking scummy, don't let O trick you into voting axxle before O though.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #869 on: August 22, 2012, 09:38:53 pm »

When's the deadline?
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #870 on: August 22, 2012, 09:40:28 pm »

In about 20 hours or so? Tomorrow during the day I think.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #871 on: August 22, 2012, 09:40:47 pm »

so two people have basically made it an ultimatum that I'm scum. Interesting... verrrry interesting...
No, I'm not making an ultimatum to the same degree as ehunt, you're overblowing it.  I'm calling out all people in your situation (which was the one I linked to to make more obvious my LOLOLOLOL "contradiction"), to help town on day 2.  My vote this round still stays on Eevee.  I'm fine moving my vote, but not to ehunt, Axxle, Insomniac, or ftl.

Also @yuma, yeah, I see how my suspicion of scumbuddies read like a direct accusation, I still want to hear your analysis of Eevee. Did you give it? Was it buried in the noise?  I agree that ehunt flipping scum will reflect poorly on me.  But I'm really certain he won't.  Agreeing that ehunt is more suspicious than Insomniac is not by itself grounds for a vote against you.  I strongly believe that both Insomniac and ehunt are pro-town.  Some people think ehunt feels scummier, some feel like Insomniac is scummier.  Even (especially) townies can be misguided and wrong often; feelings and thoughts are allowed.  I'm just saying that suspicion should be cast on people who say that Insomniac feels truthful, and THEREFORE ehunt must be lying.  It is completely possible that there are two doctors, and it seems to me that lots of people have either willfully or accidently overlooked this.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #872 on: August 22, 2012, 09:46:54 pm »

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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #873 on: August 22, 2012, 09:52:10 pm »

Two cases:

A) Both are telling the truth. You guys realize that that means we WIN? Like, almost impossible to lose? I think there is no strongman scum (expect maybe Major Arcanas) and they can just protect each other during the whole game and are impossible to kill and can just lynch everyone else.
(didn't read all, maybe this has been said)

B) One lies. I would say ehunt cuz Ins lying makes no sense, he is dead any any case, and mafias do not need to do 1 for 1 swaps D1. Why would 1 claim the only other doc.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #874 on: August 22, 2012, 09:54:46 pm »

I mean, A) is so broken and awesome that I don't want to lynch ehunt solely on that, that we can just freaking win, or at least HEA, with no sweat at all.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #875 on: August 22, 2012, 09:58:23 pm »

A) Both are telling the truth. You guys realize that that means we WIN? Like, almost impossible to lose? I think there is no strongman scum (expect maybe Major Arcanas) and they can just protect each other during the whole game and are impossible to kill and can just lynch everyone else.
(didn't read all, maybe this has been said)
Holy f*king crap.  Tell us this earlier!

UNVOTE
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #876 on: August 22, 2012, 10:00:20 pm »

There's two scumteams, and the doc only protects against one shot. If the two scumteams shoot the same doc, he'll die.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #877 on: August 22, 2012, 10:01:39 pm »

There's two scumteams, and the doc only protects against one shot. If the two scumteams shoot the same doc, he'll die.
There would have to be coordination though, there might be tells during the day
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #878 on: August 22, 2012, 10:03:04 pm »

Why not:

Vote: shraeye
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #879 on: August 22, 2012, 10:05:57 pm »

There's two scumteams, and the doc only protects against one shot. If the two scumteams shoot the same doc, he'll die.
There would have to be coordination though, there might be tells during the day
there are other things that can kill the autowin too, like mafia roleblocker.  And if one of the doctors is actually the mafia doc, then we just gave mafia the win.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #880 on: August 22, 2012, 10:06:23 pm »

There's two scumteams, and the doc only protects against one shot. If the two scumteams shoot the same doc, he'll die.
There would have to be coordination though, there might be tells during the day
there are other things that can kill the autowin too, like mafia roleblocker.  And if one of the doctors is actually the mafia doc, then we just gave mafia the win.
this isn't looking as good.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #881 on: August 22, 2012, 10:11:29 pm »

A) Both are telling the truth. You guys realize that that means we WIN? Like, almost impossible to lose? I think there is no strongman scum (expect maybe Major Arcanas) and they can just protect each other during the whole game and are impossible to kill and can just lynch everyone else.
(didn't read all, maybe this has been said)
Holy f*king crap.  Tell us this earlier!

UNVOTE
uhhhhh, remember how I said I disliked tons of posts per hour because noise hides important stuff?

If ehunt is mafia. My day 2 suspicion will be on shraeye for trying to get us to focus away from the two wagons and for all the reasons I was suspicious of him earlier in the day.
Here's why town should stop looking at either of these two wagons.  First, there are people who think Insomniac is telling the truth, and there are people who think ehunt is telling the truth.  It's possible that everyone is correct about their respective horse.

Second,
C) Insomniac is scum but gets NK'd by the other faction because they don't know if he's A or B.
This is equally true of ehunt now that Insomniac's claimed.  Either he's telling the truth and all factions will be thinking about NK'ing him this evening.  Or he is lying and is actually mafia/werewolf/SK.  Regardless of what faction he's with, there are two factions who don't know that he's scum, and they will probaly NK him anyway because either way it's rival scum or a town PR.

Both doctor-claimers are really dead tonight, so why would we help scum factions by killing them before the night even starts?  Plus, if they both trust the other, they may be able to protect eachother and still be helpful to town later. Leave the doctor-claimers for the night time and we can reassess if they don't die tonight.  For now, I want to lynch somebody who I feel is scummy, and neither Insomniac or ehunt are on that list anymore.

This was said, just not as cogently.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #882 on: August 22, 2012, 10:12:43 pm »

And, like, what if one of them dies. Then we basically have to lynch the other and possibly waste a day doing that. And we'll have just given scum a free night, as long as they can figure out a way to kill one of them, with roleblockers or major arcana or whatever.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #883 on: August 22, 2012, 10:14:52 pm »

And, like, what if one of them dies. Then we basically have to lynch the other and possibly waste a day doing that. And we'll have just given scum a free night, as long as they can figure out a way to kill one of them, with roleblockers or major arcana or whatever.

Aha, yeah we wouldn't want to give scum a free night.  I agree, so let's lynch a doctor now and give them a free night...wait...
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #884 on: August 22, 2012, 10:25:22 pm »

OK let's nolynch then, shraeye
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #885 on: August 22, 2012, 10:51:32 pm »

Two docs = win is a solid argument, although I guess it means we should trust insom less. It's also a little scummy that he forgot to disclose ninja doctor till O coached him into it. Still I will protect Insom tonight if I'm alive; he should protect me.
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shraeye

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #886 on: August 22, 2012, 10:52:23 pm »

OK let's nolynch then, shraeye
No, clearly a lynch is still a good goal, I just think it shouldn't be either doctor claim.  Sorry that you were on the receiving end of some bitterness that's been building up, I always try to restrain bitterness and stay level-headed, tonight was not a success in the level-headed department.  I was frustrated that I had been saying it was bad idea to lynch the doctors and give scum a free night, hoping that the doctors could believe eachother's claim and really help town, and I caught a lot of flak for it.  Finally, it seems like people are starting to say "hey, free nights for scum are bad" instead of "I trust Insomniac, therefore vote ehunt, when he flips scum let's lynch shraeye."  Well i'm glad people are starting to arrive on the page I've been hanging out on for a while, but if we had been here earlier tonight, we'd have that much more chance to pull together to lynch someone.  I'm still going to try for a scum lynch today, we have a little more than 16 hours, some of which I'll have to sleep for.

I'm going to try to make some post-doctor-fiasco thoughts on people, mostly to see if any previous reads need to be updated (I'm sure they do).  Until then, a list of people who have featured on my lynch-list are angrybirds, Eevee, Galzria, and sharkbait/Grujah.  I'm sticking with
vote: eevee
for now.

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O

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #887 on: August 22, 2012, 10:54:34 pm »

... two docs = win is inane. Roleblockers (there are roleblockers right?), etc. it doesn't work
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #888 on: August 22, 2012, 10:54:47 pm »

Crap.  Who can we realistically lynch today?

Vote Count
Robz888 (1): Captain_Frisk
ehunt (8.): O, Axxle, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Insomniac, Voltgloss, Eevee [L-1]
Insomniac (3): ftl, sparky5856, Morgrim7
O (1): ehunt
shraeye (2): Grujah, angrybirds
Eevee (1): shraeye


not voting (0):

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.

Sorry guyz I was writing PMs for my game.


Morgrim?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #889 on: August 22, 2012, 10:55:06 pm »

... two docs = win is inane. Roleblockers (there are roleblockers right?), etc. it doesn't work
only one mafia roleblocker.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #890 on: August 22, 2012, 10:57:56 pm »

Two docs = win is a solid argument, although I guess it means we should trust insom less. It's also a little scummy that he forgot to disclose ninja doctor till O coached him into it. Still I will protect Insom tonight if I'm alive; he should protect me.

True, he claimed doctor at first, not ninja doctor.

I can't say I trust either of you docs. Or shraeye.
 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #891 on: August 22, 2012, 10:59:21 pm »

... two docs = win is inane. Roleblockers (there are roleblockers right?), etc. it doesn't work

ah, look who's still pushing the doctor lynch...

@"no realistic wagons" folks: why not O?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #892 on: August 22, 2012, 11:16:38 pm »

So, anyone who unvoted:

1) You've just given Ehunt/Insomniac a reason to LIVE THROUGH THE REST OF THE GAME. If one of them is scum basically that means you want to give them an insta-win
2) You've just assumed that there both EXISTS a breaking strategy in this game and that you are WILLING TO USE IT.
3) You just assumed that there are no scum-based roles that can prevent this.
4) You just fell for the most moronic and bullshit trap ever played.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #893 on: August 22, 2012, 11:19:42 pm »

Angrybirds is a tough read.  I'm not getting major scumminess from him, but I just keep hearing things that don't sit right with me.  I've talked about some of this in #543.  He is also very very good at being vote #2 on people, this is probably a coincidence.  He was #2 on Galz until O voted elsewhere; #2 on Frisk briefly with ehunt; he was #2 on Insomniac with Axxle; #2 onto Eevee following me; #2 on me voting after Grujah did.  That's interesting.

more to come, but time is of the essence, so I'm posting as I'm writing these.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #894 on: August 22, 2012, 11:22:08 pm »

guys, roleblockers, both scum teams hitting the same guy, MAJOR ARCANA&their abilities, the downside of just handing mafia the win if we are wrong.. that plan just doesnt work! unvoting bexause of THE PLAN is.. not good play.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #895 on: August 22, 2012, 11:22:30 pm »

I'd rather do Axxle instead than O. His reaction to 2 docs was like "Mafia doesn't care about docs unless there is investigative role". And when I said the only thing that makes sense his like "WHY NOT SAY IT EARLIER".


Or ehunt. Ehunt is still a good lynch.
I am not convinced of his doctorness at all. Reveal time is IDIOTIC for a doc. Actually, doc is prolly the one that shouldn't reveal at all.
Plus, yeah, now I see that there are stuff that can screw up 2 docs. Worse being Ins is Mafia Doc, or RB, or doubleshot,


Ins calling Doc and O couching him into a suit was weird too. Quite. hmmm..

PPE: this was before O's post.
Also, if there is Town breaking stratagy, of course I am willing to use it.

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #896 on: August 22, 2012, 11:23:22 pm »

So, anyone who unvoted:

1) You've just given Ehunt/Insomniac a reason to LIVE THROUGH THE REST OF THE GAME. If one of them is scum basically that means you want to give them an insta-win
2) You've just assumed that there both EXISTS a breaking strategy in this game and that you are WILLING TO USE IT.
3) You just assumed that there are no scum-based roles that can prevent this.
4) You just fell for the most moronic and bullshit trap ever played.
Well I think there's a strong strategy and am willing to use it.  I trust cayvie, so I bet there's a way to prevent it.  But preventable and easily prevantable are two seperate things.  I want them to live through day 1, and we can see if this strategy holds up and reassess later.  I think all 4 of those points are off target.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #897 on: August 22, 2012, 11:27:01 pm »

If one of them is scum basically that means you want to give them an insta-win
There is more than one scumfaction.  Both are going to try to break the protective bubble we've layed down.  It'll buy us time, but won't be an instant win since doctors only block one bullet.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #898 on: August 22, 2012, 11:27:24 pm »

shraeye... I haven't been online long enough to go back and take a long hard look at eevee like I would like... so for now I will say that he reads slight scummy (just off pure off the head feelings) but you will have to wait for a more in depth look til tomorrow.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #899 on: August 22, 2012, 11:27:42 pm »

We have a confirmed SK, right?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #900 on: August 22, 2012, 11:29:55 pm »

Insom probably scum. Plan is op without blockers. Also can't get over O coaching his roleclaim. Still, only clear scum itt is O.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #901 on: August 22, 2012, 11:30:18 pm »

We have a confirmed SK, right?
True.  That's three shots.  Not nearly as breaking as I thought.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #902 on: August 22, 2012, 11:31:05 pm »

(by "plan" I mean "two doctors protecting each other") O is scum but he's right that this setup would be imba
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #903 on: August 22, 2012, 11:32:19 pm »

We have a confirmed SK, right?
True.  That's three shots.  Not nearly as breaking as I thought.

But would have to overlap another scum faction without prior planning and even though both have incentive to target other instead. It's just implausible. Insomniac probably lying.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #904 on: August 22, 2012, 11:33:17 pm »

Nobody else find O's coaching insomniacs roleclaim scummy?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #905 on: August 22, 2012, 11:34:01 pm »

Insom probably scum. Plan is op without blockers. Also can't get over O coaching his roleclaim. Still, only clear scum itt is O.
Three shots, queen of pentacles is a mafia roleblocker, major arcana can probably do whatever the f they want.. even if we somehow knew you both were town doctors, plan would not be op. especially so given how the first doc cant even know there is a 2nd one before claiming (and if there isnt, it's bye bye doctor).
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #906 on: August 22, 2012, 11:34:05 pm »

One thing in ehunt's favor is that he claimed suit/number imediatelly and wasn't counterclaimed. But still, WHY CLAIM DOC. At all. And at that time.

Why is it implausible? Its right there in the setup, sigh.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #907 on: August 22, 2012, 11:35:14 pm »

Nobody else find O's coaching insomniacs roleclaim scummy?
i found the way ins claimed scummy.
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ehunt

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #908 on: August 22, 2012, 11:36:59 pm »

Cayvie said she'd rebalance if setup is imba. I already explained why I claimed, can't find explanation while phone posting.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #909 on: August 22, 2012, 11:38:34 pm »

I can explain my "coaching": I was so excited to find out that my original scumread on Ehunt was true that I went a bit overboard.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #910 on: August 22, 2012, 11:39:37 pm »

" (I'm claiming now because if I wait till last minute it's going to be doctor-lynch or no-lynch.)"

That's why you claimed?

Thats a stupid reason to claim doc.

And YOU know it after MVI. You did everything in your power to hide PPS.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #911 on: August 22, 2012, 11:41:12 pm »

I'm having trouble understanding why scum-Insom would lie in the way he did.  Wasn't this analyzed already?  And the consensus that, if Insom is scum, he would have no reason to claim Doctor?  What, if anything, has changed to render that analysis incorrect?

In fact, didn't ehunt himself say after Insom claimed that he (Insom) was probably telling the truth?  ehunt, what has happened to change your mind?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #912 on: August 22, 2012, 11:41:54 pm »

Axxle; I'm still leaving him off my lynch-list because of the soft-claim he made.  Galzria in #669 puts an argument down that Axxle's softclaim was a really anti-town move; I agree that it may have been a bad play, but I'm still thinking Axxle is on the town's side.

Eevee; has recently upped post count a lot.  Comes up with a false statement in #545 (he says that he never called for lynching people in the wrong suit),  Explanation comes in #582 but rereading his original statement
Quote
Wands and pentacles have 1 scum more than the cups and swords (4/14 and 5/14). Should we perhaps lynch a wand or a pentacle day1 then?
it still feels like he is supporting this lynch, although he claims he was only asking if it's a good idea.  I think it's the word "perhaps" that makes it feel like question+opinion.  Since then he has also been a (much more silent) proponent of finding an alternative to ehunt/Insomniac.  A curious note is that he supports finding alternatives in #727 and was on both the Insom wagon, then switched to ehunt with an explanation (Galzria's?) of why Insomniac's claim is probably not a fakeclaim.  Are you still for finding alternatives, Eevee?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #913 on: August 22, 2012, 11:43:05 pm »

I can explain my "coaching": I was so excited to find out that my original scumread on Ehunt was true that I went a bit overboard.
overboard = tell insom what role to claim? How did you know he wasn't ten of wands? If you believed I was lying, you'd think that was likely.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #914 on: August 22, 2012, 11:43:46 pm »

Scum Insom claiming doc doesn't really make sense cuz SK or other team will just kill him. And Insomniac setting himself up to die N1, after everything?

Unless he wanted for us to go for this "PLAN", and him just stabbing ehunt in the end, but not saying anything until I said it now.. reeeally?


I'm basiclly here torn against lynch badclaim ehunt or try to push for breaking strategy.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #915 on: August 22, 2012, 11:44:12 pm »

(in fairness to O can't find the coach cause phone posting, my last argument may be wrong)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #916 on: August 22, 2012, 11:44:40 pm »

I didn't claim ninja right away because I was doing a stream of conciousness thing and the ninja part didn't really matter.

Unvote although I don't like that its sooo close to deadline with not a real chance at any other lynch.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #917 on: August 22, 2012, 11:45:30 pm »

Eight - Ninja Doctor
Ten - Doctor

these are the only town doctors and are Wands. I doubt we have two Wands doctors that we managed to run wagons on D1.

vote: ehunt


EVERYONE GO BACK AND LOOK. EHUNT JUST CLAIMED I TOLD INSOMNIAC WHAT NUMBER TO CLAIM. I DID NOT DO THIS IN THIS SLIGHTEST.

EHUNT IS CAUGHT LYING SCUM.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #918 on: August 22, 2012, 11:45:42 pm »

(in fairness to O can't find the coach cause phone posting, my last argument may be wrong)
Yeah, I'm not sure there was any coaching going on.  If there was, it didn't pop out to me as looking scummy.  I'll look it over very shortly.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #919 on: August 22, 2012, 11:46:34 pm »

Scum Insom claiming doc doesn't really make sense cuz SK or other team will just kill him. And Insomniac setting himself up to die N1, after everything?

Unless he wanted for us to go for this "PLAN", and him just stabbing ehunt in the end, but not saying anything until I said it now.. reeeally?


I'm basiclly here torn against lynch badclaim ehunt or try to push for breaking strategy.

I agree that insomniacs claim is weird, scum or town. How do you feel about O's coaching? Do you think it's weird that insomniac shifted claim from doc to ninja doc?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #920 on: August 22, 2012, 11:46:59 pm »

Eight - Ninja Doctor
Ten - Doctor

these are the only town doctors and are Wands. I doubt we have two Wands doctors that we managed to run wagons on D1.

vote: ehunt
Hey man, no need to get excited.  Somebody said that Insomniac should be more specific.  Ehunt felt super-persecuted because he was super-persecuted.  Maybe it wasn't you saying this, but I can forgive him making that mistake.

EVERYONE GO BACK AND LOOK. EHUNT JUST CLAIMED I TOLD INSOMNIAC WHAT NUMBER TO CLAIM. I DID NOT DO THIS IN THIS SLIGHTEST.

EHUNT IS CAUGHT LYING SCUM.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #921 on: August 22, 2012, 11:47:45 pm »

Eight - Ninja Doctor
Ten - Doctor

these are the only town doctors and are Wands. I doubt we have two Wands doctors that we managed to run wagons on D1.

vote: ehunt


EVERYONE GO BACK AND LOOK. EHUNT JUST CLAIMED I TOLD INSOMNIAC WHAT NUMBER TO CLAIM. I DID NOT DO THIS IN THIS SLIGHTEST.

EHUNT IS CAUGHT LYING SCUM.

Already said I didn't remember exact wording of the coach and can't look it up on phone.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #922 on: August 22, 2012, 11:47:49 pm »

Eight - Ninja Doctor
Ten - Doctor

these are the only town doctors and are Wands. I doubt we have two Wands doctors that we managed to run wagons on D1.

vote: ehunt
Hey man, no need to get excited.  Somebody said that Insomniac should be more specific.  Ehunt felt super-persecuted because he was super-persecuted.  Maybe it wasn't you saying this, but I can forgive him making that mistake.

EVERYONE GO BACK AND LOOK. EHUNT JUST CLAIMED I TOLD INSOMNIAC WHAT NUMBER TO CLAIM. I DID NOT DO THIS IN THIS SLIGHTEST.

EHUNT IS CAUGHT LYING SCUM.
well that's awkwardly placed.

Hey man, no need to get excited.  Somebody said that Insomniac should be more specific.  Ehunt felt super-persecuted because he was super-persecuted.  Maybe it wasn't you saying this, but I can forgive him making that mistake.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #923 on: August 22, 2012, 11:49:24 pm »

Eight - Ninja Doctor
Ten - Doctor

these are the only town doctors and are Wands. I doubt we have two Wands doctors that we managed to run wagons on D1.

vote: ehunt
Hey man, no need to get excited.  Somebody said that Insomniac should be more specific.  Ehunt felt super-persecuted because he was super-persecuted.  Maybe it wasn't you saying this, but I can forgive him making that mistake.

EVERYONE GO BACK AND LOOK. EHUNT JUST CLAIMED I TOLD INSOMNIAC WHAT NUMBER TO CLAIM. I DID NOT DO THIS IN THIS SLIGHTEST.

EHUNT IS CAUGHT LYING SCUM.
well that's awkwardly placed.

Hey man, no need to get excited.  Somebody said that Insomniac should be more specific.  Ehunt felt super-persecuted because he was super-persecuted.  Maybe it wasn't you saying this, but I can forgive him making that mistake.

bullshit. you just have to be his scumbuddy if you believe this. He's pretending to be so convinced I'm scum (or is so convinced I'm the other scum team) that he's wlling to lie to try to get a wagon on me.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #924 on: August 22, 2012, 11:50:07 pm »

I cannot look up old posts because I am phone posting from a train station. I apologize for mis-summarizing O's coach. The rest of my case on O stands.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #925 on: August 22, 2012, 11:50:34 pm »

ehunt: no way would I lynch him
Frisk: where has he been? I know it's been just a single day, but it's been a pretty important one.  He hasn't posted for about 25 hours by my count.  Did he perhaps say he would be gone?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #926 on: August 22, 2012, 11:52:15 pm »

@shraye
already on bed but quick phone answer: i doubt we will have time to find an alternative lynch target. change of mind was because i realized how little insomniac had to gain from the lie and how, despite my gut read, ehunts claim was actually quite opportunistic and convenient. brsin over heart sort of a realization.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #927 on: August 22, 2012, 11:52:28 pm »

vote: ehunt

Also, shraeye is his scumbuddy.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #928 on: August 22, 2012, 11:52:59 pm »

Very torn between lynch ehunt now and lynch him tomoz if "THE PLAN" doesn't work.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #929 on: August 22, 2012, 11:53:23 pm »

@shraye
already on bed but quick phone answer: i doubt we will have time to find an alternative lynch target. change of mind was because i realized how little insomniac had to gain from the lie and how, despite my gut read, ehunts claim was actually quite opportunistic and convenient. brsin over heart sort of a realization.

Will you vote O when I flip town?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #930 on: August 22, 2012, 11:53:44 pm »

Gruj - same question
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #931 on: August 22, 2012, 11:54:46 pm »

ehunt (8.): O, Grujah, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Insomniac, Voltgloss, Eevee [L-1]
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #932 on: August 22, 2012, 11:54:57 pm »

I hate these stupid questions.

No. I will vote whom I think is scum then.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #933 on: August 22, 2012, 11:55:14 pm »

F.ds terrible history of failing to sheep reads of day one

Remember O and Insomniac are scum, especially O
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #934 on: August 22, 2012, 11:55:26 pm »

@shraye
already on bed but quick phone answer: i doubt we will have time to find an alternative lynch target. change of mind was because i realized how little insomniac had to gain from the lie and how, despite my gut read, ehunts claim was actually quite opportunistic and convenient. brsin over heart sort of a realization.

Will you vote O when I flip town?
he could still be just a townie in that scenario, but i promise i'll consider that!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #935 on: August 22, 2012, 11:56:15 pm »

I hate these stupid questions.

No. I will vote whom I think is scum then.

you really won't even suspect O?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #936 on: August 22, 2012, 11:56:34 pm »

ehunt (8.): O, Grujah, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Insomniac, Voltgloss, Eevee [L-1]
Insom unvoted.

Vote: eHunt

I feel it's too late to try to do anything else.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #937 on: August 22, 2012, 11:56:58 pm »

It is town suicide to lynch me if you won't at least learn O is scum from it.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #938 on: August 22, 2012, 11:57:29 pm »

I hate these stupid questions.

No. I will vote whom I think is scum then.

you really won't even suspect O?
O will look scummier if you flip town, sure, but it's not the only piece of evidence we have.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #939 on: August 22, 2012, 11:57:53 pm »

Why are you so sure O is scum again?

I am new guy, so I don't know.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #940 on: August 22, 2012, 11:57:57 pm »

Vote Count
Robz888 (1): Captain_Frisk
ehunt (8.): O, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, Grujah, Axxle [L-1]
Insomniac (3): ftl, sparky5856, Morgrim7
O (1): ehunt
shraeye (1): angrybirds
Eevee (1): shraeye


not voting (1): Insomniac

with 16 alive, it's 9 to lynch.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2012, 12:00:45 am by cayvie »
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #941 on: August 22, 2012, 11:58:17 pm »

Shrae town, robz scummy, cf softscum for disappearing, insom prob lying
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #942 on: August 22, 2012, 11:58:47 pm »

As I said in my last post we can't do much else today and eHunt is being super frantic and scummy now. O didn't coach me at all he just gave information that was freely available to everyone already.

Vote: eHunt

Le hammered.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #943 on: August 22, 2012, 11:59:18 pm »

that's a hammer.

thread closed.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #944 on: August 22, 2012, 11:59:46 pm »

phoneposting sucks (i would know), but reasons wouldnt hurt.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #945 on: August 23, 2012, 12:00:40 am »


bullshit. you just have to be his scumbuddy if you believe this. He's pretending to be so convinced I'm scum (or is so convinced I'm the other scum team) that he's wlling to lie to try to get a wagon on me.
Hey man, you gotta lay off the hostility.  I know you feel like you're hot on the case, but you've jumped on a few "mistakes" as if they're the last drops of water on Earth.  Here is ehunt's terrible mistake, he mistook this for you telling Insomniac which card he would have to be.  Keep in mind that ehunt had already claimed 8 of Wands.  Everybody should calmly turn to posts #696-699. 

Insomniac claims to be "a doctor"
ftl asks "card/suit?"
O says he believes Insom over ehunt 100% but that two doctors isn't an impossibility
O points out that this isn't impossible because "Eight-Ninja Doctor and Ten-Doctor; these are the only town doctors and they are wands"

In #703 Insomniac says he's the "8 of wands (ninja doctor)"

I interpre this as you being really excited because you thought you had just found a sure scum in ehunt.  But it is totally understandable to interpret this as you saying which card is the other town doctor, leading Insomniac to make the full claim.  That interpretation may be wrong, but it's not OW-WOW-I-FOUND-SCUM!-wrong
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #946 on: August 23, 2012, 12:01:00 am »

people. thread closed.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #947 on: August 23, 2012, 12:02:52 am »

sorry, mate.  I was working on finding things and posted without reading the 16 replies that came.  Didn't see the closure.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #948 on: August 23, 2012, 12:13:34 am »


And that was that.

ehunt had worked very hard for his lot in life, but apparently the rest of the town resented him for his success. Or at least they ganged up and killed him for some reason.

ehunt has been lynched.
He was the Ten of Wands, Doctor.


Send in your night actions; Day 2 starts August 25, 1:00 AM Forums Time.


Final Day 1 Vote Count

Robz888 (1): Captain_Frisk
ehunt (9): O, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, Insomniac
Insomniac (3): ftl, sparky5856, Morgrim7
O (1): ehunt
shraeye (1): angrybirds
Eevee (1): shraeye


not voting (0)
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #949 on: August 24, 2012, 03:27:59 pm »

Looks like you guys had a good reason to lynch someone! Just look at this pile of corpses.

Insomniac was a super nice lady... in a crime family... and someone left a knife in her back.
Insomniac has been killed. He was Queen of Cups, Mafia Doctor.

shraeye was heartbroken and whiny, maybe, but surely that was no reason to fill him with dozens of machine gun bullets.
shraeye has been killed. He was the Three of Swords, Vanilla Townie.

O has been found strangled to death, amidst the trappings of a savage religion. Entrails, sacrificial implements, that kind of stuff.
O has been killed. He was the Werewolf High Priestess.

Well! There's 12 of you left alive. Looks like it takes 7 to lynch.

Thread Open
« Last Edit: August 24, 2012, 03:35:59 pm by cayvie »
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #950 on: August 24, 2012, 03:31:13 pm »

So thread is open or what?

Either way, this was the best night 1 for town in the history of mafia here!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #951 on: August 24, 2012, 03:31:38 pm »

Cults (?), Werewolves, Mafia, and Serial Killers?  This is going to be a fast game.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #952 on: August 24, 2012, 03:32:25 pm »

Cults (?), Werewolves, Mafia, and Serial Killers?  This is going to be a fast game.
Cults don't usually kill though? Maybe he was asked to join and he declined?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #953 on: August 24, 2012, 03:48:25 pm »

Guys, I don't think the thread is open yet. We don't have a 'day 2 start' post or a 'thread is open' post.
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Bah, that was edited in! OK, open then.
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ftl

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Well done to eHunt for drawing out two scum with his death, O and insomniac! So if you're still reading this (and I bet you are), give yourself a ghostly pat on the back! O was a scum major arcana, too!

OK, so according to the flavor, mafia killed shraeye, a serial killer killed Insomniac... but that would leave werewolves killing O which is impossible because O was werewolf. Maybe O got into a fight with another Major Arcana and got his own death reflected back at him? There's no werewolf-flavored kill, maybe Insomniac doctored whoever the Werewolf kill targeted.

...the funny thing is, O and insomniac weren't even on the same team, so there was no coaching going on. Lol. Ins looking scummy for not claiming suit/card/full role immediately was valid.

Let's keep scumhunting yesterday's eHunt wagon. That place looks like it was filled with scum. Who hammered? ...oh, insomniac. OK, that's unhelpful. FoS: Galzria, Robz, yuma, voltgloss, eevee, grujah, axxle .

Especially Robz, because eHunt called him out before dying. And the people who were defending O at the end of the day yesterday. Robz, Axxle, Grujah, who do you suspect and why?
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Galzria

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Personally, I need to go back and reread. All my D1 scum reads based on eHunt's flip are dead.

Well, I'm still highly suspicious of Axxle. Guess I'll do two rereads: One to scumhunt in general, and one to scumhunt with a bias against Axxle. ;D

No, really though, I know eHunt didn't like his wagon, but where does Axxle stand in relation to how O felt? Or Insomniac? Any protection going on? (If they were both going for the throat on that I'll have to *Mostly* clear him, although SK he could be).
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Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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It's a good thing we didn't go down the route of double-doctor-protection.  That would have ultimately played right into the Mafia's hands.  I need to reread the discussion of that concept.
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Robz888

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Well, good thing we had a highly scum-killing night, because uh, guys, we lynched the doctor. The town doctor. That's... a new low.

To me, Insomniac's claim looked more credible, but it's clear that was just, like, a really good fake out on Insomniac's part.
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yuma

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Initial thoughts

Part of me wants to try to defend myself and those on the lynch wagon for choosing the "all things being equal" lynch target out of ehunt and insomniac. But I don't know if I really should and I don't think I will.

However, I do think that out of all of us on the wagon, I would put Eevee at the top of my suspicious list. He took a lot of convincing to get on the ehunt lynch. And once he was on the ehunt wagon he still expressed suspicion of insomniac (perhaps he knew that insomniac was mafia and wanted to get cred.)


As for the shraeye death: myself, Grujah and Axxle all had implicated him as potentially scum partners with ehunt. Neither ended up being scum. So both grujah and axxle are suspicious. But they did the exact same thing I did, and I am town. The biggest difference is that the other two were very specific that they thought shraeye was scum-partners, I alluded a lot more. I don't know if that makes a difference

Axxle is also pretty suspicious. His unvote reaction to the two doctors idea was ... odd.... as was his attempt to start a shraeye wagon. I also expressed mid day yesterday that he would be worth looking into more fully day 2.

Last question:
Do we think that any other deaths were prevented by power roles? I would think it is likely.
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ftl

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There wasn't a werewolf-flavor kill, so it seems quite possible that the werewolf kill was thwarted somehow.
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Voltgloss

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What I want to know is:  why the Mafia didn't target Axxle, who had softclaimed a power role.  With ehunt lynched, and with Insom being Mafia himself, if the Mafia wanted to kill a power role their logical target was Axxle. 

A few possible answers:

A.  Axxle is Mafia
B.  Axxle is not Mafia, but the Mafia players felt shraeye was more likely to be opposing scum than Axxle
C.  Axxle is not Mafia, but the Mafia players felt they could get Axxle lynched today and preferred to do that rather than nightkill him

Axxle being Mafia could also explain why there was no WW kill:  the Werewolves had good reason to target Axxle (as a likely power role and/or likely opposing scummember), but Insom Doctored him.

I have to finish rereading to see if an Axxle-Insom pairing fits Day 1.
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Axxle

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I have to finish rereading to see if an Axxle-Insom pairing fits Day 1.
I'll save you the time: No.
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Axxle

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No werewolf kill probably means it was doctored by insom, Werewolf-Immune Serial Killer seems likely too.
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ftl

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If it was doctored by insom, we probably don't need to worry about it. WW will kill their target some other day.
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Axxle

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Wolves, who did you target yesterday? We promise to lynch him today.
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Morgrim7

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Eevee, oh, gee. He hammered, he made huge arguments against eHunt, which turned out to be the doctor, and hasn't shown up, even though he is online now. Extremely suspicious. FoS: Eevee.

BTW, I'm still okay with a Robz lynch.
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ftl

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Insomniac hammered, not eevee, I think. Eevee was the L-3 vote maybe?
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Morgrim7

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oh i'm thinking of a different game  :-[
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Mad, I tell you.

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Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

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Eevee, oh, gee. He hammered, he made huge arguments against eHunt, which turned out to be the doctor, and hasn't shown up, even though he is online now. Extremely suspicious. FoS: Eevee.

BTW, I'm still okay with a Robz lynch.
Yeah this has nothing to do with this game. Or any other game actually, but especially not this.  ;D

I'm online, but I'm quite confused. I feel we got really lucky, but I also feel I have no idea what to do next. Axxle surviving the night looks relatively scummy, especially considering how the "missing death" is probably a scum player.
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ftl

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Well, missing death could also be due to a roleblock.

I think I'd be a bit hesitant to lynch due to a 'missing death' because, well, we had 3 deaths, maybe it's only the flavor of one of them that's weird.
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Morgrim7

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I don't know what to think.  :(
Do we think that any other deaths were prevented by power roles? I would think it is likely.
Maybe, probably.

Do we think that any NKs were performed by the town?
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

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I would guess one of those is probably a vig. Looks like mafia + vig + serial killer, and werewolves missed.
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ftl

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It seems plausible that we have vigs around. 2 of the 3 deaths were of people who would be pretty likely scum (O, Ins) to a vig.  Either of them could have been a vig.

Flavor-wise, I think the machine gun bullets have to be mafia, and the knife might be either SK or Vig but probably SK, and the weird cult stuff around O.

...OHHH!!! WAIT!!! I've been misreading O's flavor.

"O has been found strangled to death, amidst the trappings of a savage religion. Entrails, sacrificial implements, that kind of stuff."

 O was found STRANGLED. The 'savage religion' trappings were just the fact that he was werewolf high priestess.

So our 3 deaths are:
A mafia stabbed in the back
A townie machine-gunned to death
A werewolf strangled

I guess if I had to guess, the machine-gun is obviously mafia, the knife is probably SK and the strangulation is probably vig but those two could be flipped around. Or maybe we have 2 SKs and no vig. There's no werewolf-flavored kill.

Obviously, if we have a vig, they should not claim.
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Who would strangle? I mean its a brutal way to kill, would a town-aligned vigilante STRANGLE someone? I mean seems most probable, but also weird!

I misread that also, that clears the confusion regarding cults killing people all of a sudden. Good.
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Morgrim7

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Voltgloss: post please
Captain_Frisk: post please
Grujah: I don't know
Eevee: Scummy for arguments on eHunt
Robz888: Still okay with lynching him
yuma: townish
ftl: also townish
Galzria: slightly town.
angrybirds: slightly town
sparky5856: noread
Morgrim7: What are your reads on me?
Axxle: Scummy
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

ftl

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Who would strangle? I mean its a brutal way to kill, would a town-aligned vigilante STRANGLE someone? I mean seems most probable, but also weird!

I misread that also, that clears the confusion regarding cults killing people all of a sudden. Good.

Yeah, depends on flavor. Knife to the back doesn't seem like a vig either.

Really, naively I would expect a vig flavor would also be someone getting shot execution-style, or maybe hanged, or something. So maybe flavor-wise we should guess at 2 sks, but it's sort of a weak implication, flavor-tells are iffy.

Anyway, it doesn't matter at the moment I think. Vig shouldn't claim, SKs want to shoot Mafia/Werewolves anyway, mafia want to lynch both SKs and Vigs, meh.
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Captain_Frisk

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@morgrim - it's weekend time, where I am in phone/ pad lurk mode.  I have some rl gamers coming over - so unlikely to see any real content from me until Sunday evening.

Good catch ftl - that does seem more plausible than cults.
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ftl

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Morgrim7: What are your reads on me?

A read on you is difficult, I find. You're playing way more townie than in many of your other games... scumhunting, posting lists, not quickhammering as soon as you can. You voted for insomniac pretty early and he was scum. But in those many other games you were town, and now you're playing differently and so maybe you're scum overcompensating and trying to be way too superficially townish?

I would be sad if that is true, but I don't know how to exclude it. I hope that we have an investigative role that will at some point either clear you or lead to your lynch, or that at some point you have something to claim which would clear you. If we never find out more about you via power roles, I think we'll have to lynch you at some point before it gets to lylo, just because "playing differently than all those other games where you were town" seems like a pretty solid scumtell. But I don't want to because, well, your posts on D1 seemed pretty townish, all things considered. And I don't want f.ds to basically make a policy where once you play a few games as town you're locked into a personality or else people will think you're scummy.

So yeah, those are my reads on you. Based on this one game, mild to strong townread. Based on meta, a little bit of confusion because I've never gotten reads like this off of you even when you *were* town, so I'm not sure what to make of it. Definitely not interested in lynching you at this time.
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Morgrim7

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Morgrim7: What are your reads on me?

A read on you is difficult, I find. You're playing way more townie than in many of your other games... scumhunting, posting lists, not quickhammering as soon as you can. You voted for insomniac pretty early and he was scum. But in those many other games you were town, and now you're playing differently and so maybe you're scum overcompensating and trying to be way too superficially townish?

I would be sad if that is true, but I don't know how to exclude it. I hope that we have an investigative role that will at some point either clear you or lead to your lynch, or that at some point you have something to claim which would clear you. If we never find out more about you via power roles, I think we'll have to lynch you at some point before it gets to lylo, just because "playing differently than all those other games where you were town" seems like a pretty solid scumtell. But I don't want to because, well, your posts on D1 seemed pretty townish, all things considered. And I don't want f.ds to basically make a policy where once you play a few games as town you're locked into a personality or else people will think you're scummy.

So yeah, those are my reads on you. Based on this one game, mild to strong townread. Based on meta, a little bit of confusion because I've never gotten reads like this off of you even when you *were* town, so I'm not sure what to make of it. Definitely not interested in lynching you at this time.
Thanks!
hmmm, thats interesting.... wish I could do something about that.
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Axxle

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Morgrim7: What are your reads on me?

A read on you is difficult, I find. You're playing way more townie than in many of your other games... scumhunting, posting lists, not quickhammering as soon as you can. You voted for insomniac pretty early and he was scum. But in those many other games you were town, and now you're playing differently and so maybe you're scum overcompensating and trying to be way too superficially townish?

I would be sad if that is true, but I don't know how to exclude it. I hope that we have an investigative role that will at some point either clear you or lead to your lynch, or that at some point you have something to claim which would clear you. If we never find out more about you via power roles, I think we'll have to lynch you at some point before it gets to lylo, just because "playing differently than all those other games where you were town" seems like a pretty solid scumtell. But I don't want to because, well, your posts on D1 seemed pretty townish, all things considered. And I don't want f.ds to basically make a policy where once you play a few games as town you're locked into a personality or else people will think you're scummy.

So yeah, those are my reads on you. Based on this one game, mild to strong townread. Based on meta, a little bit of confusion because I've never gotten reads like this off of you even when you *were* town, so I'm not sure what to make of it. Definitely not interested in lynching you at this time.
I think he's getting all his trolling done in RMM2.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

sparky5856

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It's either Insomniac or eHunt who's scum.

Hey I was right!

Quote
eHunt is innocent.

Hey I was right!

That's two of my three big thoughts of my giant post, with the last one being that Eevee is scum. Hmmm...... I won't jump into anything yet though, seeing that we have like 10 days to make up our minds.

Very vague reasons for deaths, although I suppose that adds to the fun of the game. All three of them were very obvious targets. I was gonna go back and reanalyze O since he seemed so certain eHunt was scum, but now I don't have to apparently. He seems to have been a Major Arcana role too. But I can't find anywhere what his specific role means... or are we not supposed to know yet?

We have a cult in this game? I didn't even know what that meant until I looked it up, sounds dangerous to everyone if they aren't eradicated fast enough. So now everyone has to worry about four opposing parties? Awesome sauce.

But wait, I looked it up on Mafia Scum and cultists can't kill? I found something called a Cultafia though, that can both kill and recruit. This MUST be the other Major Arcana role if there are cults in this game (also consider that I can't find cults in the Minor Arcana list). If the Werewolves didn't kill, it's very likely that the Ace of Wands is in this game, aka, the Werewolves targeted the SK and he didn't die. Interesting.

I also remember that the host mentioned there's AT LEAST one SK, there could be more than one (as ftl mentioned), and one of them is the Ace of Wands. How would Werewolves kill? Clawed to death? Eaten alive? I lack imagination.



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Eevee

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Werewolves usually claw people to death, yes.

The current consensus is that there is no cult, the religious stuff was just because O was a priestess.
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ftl

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If the Werewolves didn't kill, it's very likely that the Ace of Wands is in this game, aka, the Werewolves targeted the SK and he didn't die.

Well, there could be other explanations.
1) Werewolves targeted a mafia, and Insomniac the mafia doctor saved his scumbuddy.
2) Werewolves targeted a major arcana which was bulletproof
3) The werewolf that was doing the kill got roleblocked. (Eight of cups, Queen of Pentacles, Eight of Swords all have roleblocking powers.)
4) The target was either saved by a Ninja Doctor (OK, that would require us to have rolled all 3 possible doctors) or by a jailkeeper (Eight of swords).

I would laugh so hard if we still had a ninja doctor. It's possible!

All of the above are plausible. If there were FOUR potential kills going around, it's not surprising that at least one of them got blocked due to either a roleblock, a doctoring, or hitting a bulletproof.
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sparky5856

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Ah yes, I just reread the day so far more thoroughly and just remembered that Insomniac was a doctor. His mafia friend may have been targeted. I also forgot about roleblockers. Anyways, too many possibilities to think about, so I won't think about it too hard. How many anti-town roles could there be? 2/3 mafia players, 2/3 werewolves, one SK, one possibly extra SK/Cultafia...

Cultafia sounds highly unlikely now due to the fact that there would be five total factions. I'm just gonna hunt for the mafia/werewolves. That sounds basic enough to be good for me.

Getting a huge town vibe from ftl, being helpful with the killing speculation and all.
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Grujah

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Kinda drunk. Ok, now, this is very important, and I'll give all details later. Butm need answer, from all players, to these question:

1) What do you think of Morgrim?
2) What do you think of shark_bait/Grujah?
3) Who is the most likely scum in this town (exclude Grujah)?
4) Can you give me an answer to Pop Quiz (Right now, who is your "Wanna lynch" "would support lynch" "will not lynch"
5) Your ideas on whom killed who last night
6) If you were Vigilante of sorts last night, whom would you target and, more importantly, WHY? (Kinda worthless cuz you know aligments of some dead people now, but do me a favor)

I promise this will be of great use.
Everyone answer.
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Grujah

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5) explain - which faction killed whom (SK, WWs, Mafias, possible Vig)
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Grujah

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3) must be a single person, also.
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Grujah

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4) of course you "can" give an answer, but here I ask that you do.
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Grujah

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Oh, and for completion's sake:
7) Who's alignment would you most be interested in (exclude Grujah).
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Grujah

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Guess it's only fair that I answer first

1) Morg is more involved than usually. It's good, and I actually think he'd be different scum
2) Town obv.
3) ftl
4) Want: angrybirds, ftl Would: everyone else Not: Eevee, Grujah
5) Vig killed O. WWs killed Ins, Mafia killed shaeye. SK doubled on somebody or was stopped.
6) O. Cuz it was ehunt's dying wish.
7) ftl's
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sparky5856

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1) He is Morgrim. I DON'T KNOW. HE IS COMPLEX >___<
2) I previously pegged Grujah as scum before my novel of a post, for his unwillingness to read back in the thread. Let's see, he defended O, supported an eHunt lynch, my initial thought points more towards bad than good, but the day is still young, that can change.
3) The 133rd Pokemon.
4) Doing this in the end since I want all of these bulletpoints to be short. XD
5) Hmmm good question. A SK probably killed Insomniac HEY I just had a thought. By Grujah:

Quote
Scum Insom claiming doc doesn't really make sense cuz SK or other team will just kill him. And Insomniac setting himself up to die N1, after everything?

What if multiple teams targeted Insomniac? Though, wouldn't there be flavor hinting towards such? Either way, mafia probably killed shraeye. O... um... a 2nd SK is my guess.
6) O probably.
7) Captain Frisk.

Wanna lynch:
Eevee

Would support lynch:
Captain_Frisk
Grujah
Robz888
angrybirds

Can I have an iffy catergory?:
Axxle
Galzria
Morgrim
sparky5856

Will NOT lynch:
Voltgloss
ftl
yuma
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Galzria

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Too drunk to focus on questions, but...

I like this Morgrim. Could be scum, but we can find out through investigation hopefully. Not worth lynching now.

Gruj is like, most obvscum ever (I keeed - no read)

Axxle scummiest ITT

Would lynch Axxle, dunno who else. Nobody I wouldn't lynch.

I think scum killed Insomniac - well, WW's knew he wasn't a WW, so he was a doctor or Mafia (or both, LOL), so absolutely worth killing. But I guess it wasn't a WW kill scene? So SK? I don't know. Vig killing possible Doctor seems ridiculous. So SK kills Insomniac.

Vig probably kills O, sheeping eHunt so the town doesn't have to deal with his antics today. That leaves Mafia to kill Shraeye.

What questions have I missed? I don't know. Will answer more after.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Oh, I would like to know Voltgloss's alignment because even though he's never won he scares me more than any other player.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

yuma

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@Gruj

Will answer tomorrow
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ftl

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Kinda drunk. Ok, now, this is very important, and I'll give all details later. Butm need answer, from all players, to these question:

1) What do you think of Morgrim?

What I said in my post: playing differently than usual, in a good way, but perhaps playing differently is a scumtell. I hope I don't have to make this decision at lylo, but while there's still time I'm happy leaving him alive.

Quote
2) What do you think of shark_bait/Grujah?

Shark - said basically nothing memorable while he was here.
Gruj - lots of talk of morgrim. Townread on eevee after eevee accuses him of something... and then votes for him a few posts later. Tells vigs to kill morgrim?

Thinks ehunt shouldn't have claimed at L-1. In general thinks people shouldn't claim at L-1? Votes shraeye when there's two docclaims. Thought ehunt was lying and not insomniac when push came to shove. Would rather kill axxle instead of O (another bad call - O was scum. But not scum aligned with insomniac!) Eventually voted for ehunt.

...yeah, quite scummy. Defended scum, attacked people who are now confirmed town, killed a townie. Some of them might be genuine bad reads of course, lord knows everyone has lots of terrible reads in this game, but maybe some of them were just not wanting to bus his scumbuddy D1.

Quote
3) Who is the most likely scum in this town (exclude Grujah)?

Not sure. Will need to go back and
a) see who was on the ehunt wagon
b) see who was suspected by the people who are now confirmed town (ehunt, shraeye)

and start from there. If there's anyone at the intersection of all 3 of those, then that's my top pick.

Let's see. The last place where I find shraeye posting a scumlist is when he says "angrybirds, Eevee, Galzria, and sharkbait/Grujah. " and votes Eevee.
Those still alive on the ehunt wagon are "Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, Grujah, Axxle" .
Of the people still alive, ehunt said "robz scummy, cf softscum for disappearing"
No intersection. Grujah, Eevee, Robz are the top picks. Can't pick between them without rereading all three... ..oh, hell, might as well do that now, I've got time, and I just reread you.

Robz - meh, hasn't posted in FAR too long.
Eevee - started the ehunt wagon! Jumped off of it as soon as the claim happened. Was convinced to go back on it by insomniac's claim.

Robz scummier.

Still need to reread to see whether there were people egging on the ehunt wagon but not on it.

Quote
4) Can you give me an answer to Pop Quiz (Right now, who is your "Wanna lynch" "would support lynch" "will not lynch"

Ooh, putting me on the spot. Well,  "Wanna lynch:" You, actually. Vote: Grujah .  "Would support lynch:" Eevee, Galz, Robz, yuma, volt, axxle. "Would not lynch:" me, angrybirds. Hmm, and sparky I guess. And maybe not morgrim.

Quote
5) Your ideas on whom killed who last night

Mafia killed shraeye. Two SKs or an SK and a Vig killed O and Insomniac.

Quote
6) If you were Vigilante of sorts last night, whom would you target and, more importantly, WHY? (Kinda worthless cuz you know aligments of some dead people now, but do me a favor)

O. I was going to sheep ehunt's death reads, like he asked. After the night ended, they were so good (O and Ins scum) that I'm even doing that for his more minor reads.

Quote
I promise this will be of great use.
Everyone answer.

Says the scum who wants to know everyone's suspicions so you know who to daykill.

Quote
7) Who's alignment would you most be interested in (exclude Grujah).

Oh hey. Any scum's, really! Or the experienced players. Or the active players. Probably Galz or Axxle. Probably Galz, since Axxle had his weird softclaim. I'll say Galz.
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ftl

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I look forward to the reason for this questionnaire.
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sparky5856

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Eh, I participated for the heck of it, needed to organize my brain more. I do find it intriguing that Grujah's lynch list is nearly opposite that of mine.
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Axxle

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Kinda drunk.  Ok, now, this is off the top of my head, and I'll give all details later.  But I'll answer, from the heart, to these questions.

1) What do you think of Morgrim?
Most town I've ever seen him.  I think scum Morgrim would have stuck to his old ways.  Or he's the SK.

2) What do you think of shark_bait/Grujah?
Lurker to the nth degree.  Very nice pro-town questions though.

3) Who is the most likely scum in this town (exclude Grujah)?
I'd have to look over everything again, instinct says angrybirds.

4) Can you give me an answer to Pop Quiz (Right now, who is your "Wanna lynch" "would support lynch" "will not lynch"
Wanna lynch: none.
Would support lynch: anyone but Morgrim.  No one else has struck me as so pro town I wouldn't lynch.  I'd need convincing for most people though.
Will not lynch: Morgrim.

5) Your ideas on whom killed who last night
Shraeye killed by Mafia by flavor.
Insomniac killed by SK by flavor
O killed by The Hanged Man by flavor. (or vig or second SK)

6) If you were Vigilante of sorts last night, whom would you target and, more importantly, WHY? (Kinda worthless cuz you know aligments of some dead people now, but do me a favor)
Definitely someone on the wagon: O, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, Grujah, Axxle
I actually trusted O, a lot.  I probably would have targeted Robz, because I really don't remember much from him.

7) Who's alignment would you most be interested in (exclude Grujah).
The person who is the most benefit if they're town, and the most detriment if they're scum.  And that person is... Galz, as always.

I hope this will be of great use.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Morgrim7

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Kinda drunk. Ok, now, this is very important, and I'll give all details later. Butm need answer, from all players, to these question:

1) What do you think of Morgrim?
2) What do you think of shark_bait/Grujah?
3) Who is the most likely scum in this town (exclude Grujah)?
4) Can you give me an answer to Pop Quiz (Right now, who is your "Wanna lynch" "would support lynch" "will not lynch"
5) Your ideas on whom killed who last night
6) If you were Vigilante of sorts last night, whom would you target and, more importantly, WHY? (Kinda worthless cuz you know aligments of some dead people now, but do me a favor)

I promise this will be of great use.
Everyone answer.
1. hi.
2. I think SB should contribute more. You are not so bad.
3. Maybe Robz or Eevee.
4. Wanna lynch: Robz
Would support: Lurkers, Eevee
Don't wanna: myself. sparky, too.
5. I think mafia killed O, Vig or SK killed insomniac, and WW killed shraeye. Or maybe Vig/sk-inso, vig/sk shraeye, and werewolf blocked.
6. In truth? Insomniac.
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Grujah

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More, there is also 7).

Who's alignment would you like to know the most.
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Morgrim7

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More, there is also 7).

Who's alignment would you like to know the most.
A lot of people. Robz, Eevee, Axxle is up there.
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Grujah

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Too drunk to focus on questions, but...

Omigosh obvscum, you claimed Wednesday too.
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Galzria

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Too drunk to focus on questions, but...

Omigosh obvscum, you claimed Wednesday too.

Good thing alignment isn't based on that. Otherwise Frisk, Axxle, you and I would be scum like, all the time. ;D
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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Too drunk to focus on questions, but...

Omigosh obvscum, you claimed Wednesday too.

Good thing alignment isn't based on that. Otherwise Frisk, Axxle, you and I would be scum like, all the time. ;D

Would be fun to have a game where scum must post with BAC of 0.5 permile or more. :D

These still didn't answer.

2. Voltgloss
3. Captain_Frisk
5. Eevee
6. Robz888
8. yuma
12. angrybirds

angrybirds megalurks, Robz and Eevee are V/LA again?
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angrybirds

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Why are we all answering Grujah's quesitons?

tell me the reason and then maybe I'll answer them. as it is I am just going to explain my read and then my vote. i am highly suspicious of Axxle. The biggest reason is from when he tried to egg me into hammering ehunt by saying i would be less scummy if i did, it felt like he was trying to pressure a newb into joining the wagon he was in, but then when i voted for him, axxle could pull out and say, "he did exactly what i said, so he would look less suspicious, he must be scum!!!"

Axxle was scummy yesterday. Although i never voted for him, he was one that i was willing to vote for and I still am vote: axxle

I am also suspicious more of yuma, Grujah and sparky
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Grujah

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Cuz I asked them.

You answer the questions (any) to get more info out, which is always beneficial for town. I didn't see anybody refusing to answer similar questioneers in earlier games, so that's a scum point for you.

There is a hidden agenda reason, as well, but it wouldn't be hidden agenda if I told you before, would it?
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Grujah

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Quote
Thinks ehunt shouldn't have claimed at L-1. In general thinks people shouldn't claim at L-1? Votes shraeye when there's two docclaims. Thought ehunt was lying and not insomniac when push came to shove.

Wanna get this clear:
He wasn't at L-1 at that point, IIRC. (maybe wrong).
I was arguing that this is wrong: people vote someone to L-1, he autoclaims, they unvote. And so on. It's bad town behavior. It reveals PRs. And it is a f.ds policy. You should only claim if it is town-beneficial. Docclaim is always bad.

I was wrong on Ins, but I was one of many.

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angrybirds

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whatever, i dont like one person directing town. it is too easy for town, they dont have enough original thought and too easy to get mislead

1) What do you think of Morgrim?   --- i try to not think about morgrim

2) What do you think of shark_bait/Grujah?   ---- annoying and probably scum

3) Who is the most likely scum in this town (exclude Grujah)?     ---- axxle

4) Can you give me an answer to Pop Quiz (Right now, who is your "Wanna lynch" "would support lynch" "will not lynch"          wanna lynch grujah and axxle   would support insomniac, yuma,  sparky, galz  and I will only give a probably wont' lynch  in frisk, ftl, eevee, robz, morgrim

5) Your ideas on whom killed who last night   ---   no idea, my analysis of that would just throw more confusion into the mixture

6) If you were Vigilante of sorts last night, whom would you target and, more importantly, WHY? (Kinda worthless cuz you know aligments of some dead people now, but do me a favor)   i cant answer that. to go back and try and retroactively figure out who i would like after knowing new information, sorry my brain doesnt work that way. but if i was vig tonight and everyone was still alive, i would kill axxle

7) i want to know eevee's alignment
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Grujah

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why am I probscum?  :(
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Grujah

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Second though:

ehunt's claim turned out not to be as stupid as I though, as it caught 2 scum. Ehunt, props on that, if you are reading this. <3

But it is generally bad move.
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yuma

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Grujah here you are:

1) I am glad that he is taking a more proactive town role.
2) I have no opinion of SB--he didn't contribute enough. You on the other hand--I didn't think your refusal to go back and read 20 pages to be scummy. That just seemed like you. No big deal. I imagine I am as suspicious to you as you are to me, which is fairy high, as we were both on the ehunt wagon and had both expressed a high level of suspicion to shareye--both are dead and both were townie. Doesn't look good for you, doesn't look good for me.
3) Eevee
4) Will lynch: Eevee, Axxle, Grujah  may lynch: everyone else
5) Or are you more interested in which faction killed which person? To the first I say I really have no clue. If it is the second, I don't think it is that important. They are dead and flavor sometimes has meaning and sometimes it doesn't. Unless we got a confirmation from cayvie saying that flavor had meaning I wouldn't read anything into it, It is too easy a distraction and allows for mafia to appear to be contributing w/o actually doing anything.
6) If I were vig..... hmmm.... What kind? A one-shot? I wouldn't have done anything. I would have saved it.
7) I am actually most interested in knowing a-birds alignment
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Grujah

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Yeah, shareye just seemed scummy, but ehunt's flip cleared him a lot (and would be great if he didn't get killed.  :'().
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Grujah

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(scummy on hunch/guts only*)
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Galzria

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Yeah, shareye just seemed scummy, but ehunt's flip cleared him a lot (and would be great if he didn't get killed.  :'().

Oh Grujah, you and your scumtells. But I won't fall for it! You're tryin too hard.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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2) I previously pegged Grujah as scum before my novel of a post, for his unwillingness to read back in the thread. Let's see, he defended O, supported an eHunt lynch, my initial thought points more towards bad than good, but the day is still young, that can change.

I defended O?

I actually found coaching Ins weird.
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Grujah

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Yeah, shareye just seemed scummy, but ehunt's flip cleared him a lot (and would be great if he didn't get killed.  :'().

Oh Grujah, you and your scumtells. But I won't fall for it! You're tryin too hard.

I'm obvtown, you'll see.
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Axxle

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I didn't think your refusal to go back and read 20 pages to be scummy.
I probably would have tried to catch up myself, and get lynched for lurking.  *cough* Mafia VI *cough*
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Axxle

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I didn't think your refusal to go back and read 20 pages to be scummy.
I probably would have tried to catch up myself, and get lynched for lurking.  *cough* Mafia VI *cough*
Oh, wait, I was NKed there.  Same difference.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Grujah

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But you were in there from start, no?  :o
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Axxle

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But you were in there from start, no?  :o
Axx1e was a survivor, Axx2e wasn't.  Axx1e wasn't paying attention, Axx2e needed to.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Galzria

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Yeah, shareye just seemed scummy, but ehunt's flip cleared him a lot (and would be great if he didn't get killed.  :'().

Oh Grujah, you and your scumtells. But I won't fall for it! You're tryin too hard.

I was referring to the "and would be great if he didn't get killed :'(" which is a form of "Well that sucked". Obvscumtell is obv. ;)
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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That scumtell only works if it is first post of the day  :P
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Grujah

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Grujah here you are:

1) I am glad that he is taking a more proactive town role.
2) I have no opinion of SB--he didn't contribute enough. You on the other hand--I didn't think your refusal to go back and read 20 pages to be scummy. That just seemed like you.

Wait? What? How?

It is like me to not read stuff?
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jotheonah

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Vote Count 2.1
Grujah (1): ftl
Axxle (1): angrybirds

not voting (10): Captain_Frisk, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, sparky5856, Morgrim7
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"I know old meta, and joth is useless day 1 but awesome town day 3 and on." --Teproc

He/him

sparky5856

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Okay, so Grujah and angrybirds are most likely not on the same team. The way angrybirds responded seems like he genuinely disliked that everyone's answering Grujah's questionnaire. angrybirds is more likely to be town than anything else I believe, and he has a "charge!" attitude and likes to get things done quickly it seems like. Nothing wrong with that, just that it's unique from all the other play-styles I've seen so far.

Grujah has been extremely active this day, seemingly dictating the town's actions, asking questions about practically everything that comes up. Is that a good thing? I would change my answer to #7 to him if I could XD
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yuma

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Grujah here you are:

1) I am glad that he is taking a more proactive town role.
2) I have no opinion of SB--he didn't contribute enough. You on the other hand--I didn't think your refusal to go back and read 20 pages to be scummy. That just seemed like you.

Wait? What? How?

It is like me to not read stuff?

You just seem like the type of player with the personality of "I do what I want" If you wanted to go back and reread you would, if you didn't you didn't.  I am not implying that otherwise you don't read the games, I think you generally do. Just in that instance I could understand why you didn't want to.
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Morgrim7

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Okay, so Grujah and angrybirds are most likely not on the same team. The way angrybirds responded seems like he genuinely disliked that everyone's answering Grujah's questionnaire. angrybirds is more likely to be town than anything else I believe, and he has a "charge!" attitude and likes to get things done quickly it seems like. Nothing wrong with that, just that it's unique from all the other play-styles I've seen so far.
I agree. And because I think that ABirds is less scummy than Grujah, that means Grujah is some other faction. Maybe a scum faction. Vote: Grujah
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Grujah

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Low drunkish stage..
------

Now, I wanted everybody to answer the questioner (particularly 3 and 7) before I reveal this, but I am just anxious and cannot wait anymore! Eevee/Robz/CF are V/LA for weekend, and Volt is lurking. Few reveals:


1 & 2) I am Five of Pentacles: One-Shot Strongman Vigilante. I killed O last night.
---Now, why O and why use power on Night 1?
Well, I went for O cause it was ehunt's death request (pre-ehunt death my #1 targ was shraeye). He wanted O and Ins dead. I figured, if BOTH are Mobs, and Ins didn't lie about being a doc, it would be much better for me to target O cause Ins would protect him otherwise, and I go through protection.
Now, I used my power on Night 1 cause I didn't want it ending like MIV (Where I was OSV as well) or BMMMM (Where I was 1 shot "choose your faction") - and in both games I died without using my power. So, to prevent that , I used it Night 1.
---What proofs do I have?
Few.
This is a breadcrum from my first post:
I know, I know you'd never steal, Jack.
Before I even joined, I decided I'll crum my role like this:
For each of these, take appropriate comic/book:
Cups - Batman Adventures - Mad Love (Cuz I love Harley's.. "cups")
Pentacles - Starman (v.2, Pentagram = star)
Wands - Hellblazer (He's a magician)
Sword - A Game of Thrones (It has swords)
Major Arcana - Sandman

Now, opet the first issue on the number that your card is, and post it.
So, I am Five of Petnacles. This is straigh from Starman #00, page 5:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/20240121/claim.png

Another proof is that O is stranged. I cannot find it on Mafiawiki, but strangling flavor means Strongman. (Idea is, Doctor can stich you up if you get shot/stabbed/mauled but he cannot do anything if you are strangled).

Now, third proof, is actually very provable, and here it comes:

3) By killing a Major Arcana, I got a power to use during D2 only
This power is that I can ask a yes/no question, and it will be answered publicly in thread.
That is why I made this questioneer. Main questions were 3 and 7, rest were kinda red harrings (which, at time of making it, significially more drunk, I though was a good idea).
Idea was to gather info about whom to investigate.
My idea was, and still is, to ask a question like this:

Are (player A) and (player B) both town - aligned?
I think 2 is a good number. Better than 3 or 1. Canidates for A and B, are now, I think, angrybirds and Eevee.
(can somebody collect all answers to 3) and 7) ?

Does anyone have a better idea for a question format?

4) My question answering was bogus.
I.e. the fact that I choose ftl/angry as scummy and Eevee as town.
Those were random as I had no idea, joining late and all.
Now, by questineer answers, angry and Axxle seemed scummish.
I also liked idea of examining Galz, cuz he is ... well, good player :D

5)We have a missing kill (werewolf flavored)
It means that WW either hit a WW immune SK, or was blocked/jailed, or target was doctored/jailed, or they've hit bulletproof townie or.. well, that's mostily it.




And I don't think that angry and I are necessarily on opposing teams. It might be just that we are townies fighting each other.
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angrybirds

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so you think I might be a townie that is fighting you or do you think i am scum, so that is why you want to ask the question?

which one?
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Grujah

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You poped out on many people's lists for 3 and 7. I think.

Wait, gonna collect all info now.
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Grujah

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3) Eevee x2, Axxle, angry, Robz
7) angry, Eevee, Galz x2, Frisk

+ Morg who didn't give exact, he was 3)  Robz/Eevee, 7) Robz/Eevee/Axxle

And I am on angry/axxle.

So, I think you 2 pop up the most?
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Grujah

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Grujah here you are:

1) I am glad that he is taking a more proactive town role.
2) I have no opinion of SB--he didn't contribute enough. You on the other hand--I didn't think your refusal to go back and read 20 pages to be scummy. That just seemed like you.

Wait? What? How?

It is like me to not read stuff?

You just seem like the type of player with the personality of "I do what I want" If you wanted to go back and reread you would, if you didn't you didn't.  I am not implying that otherwise you don't read the games, I think you generally do. Just in that instance I could understand why you didn't want to.

K, I think this is valid, I had that kind of a stance somewhere, in RMM1 I think.
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angrybirds

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3) Eevee x2, Axxle, angry, Robz
7) angry, Eevee, Galz x2, Frisk

+ Morg who didn't give exact, he was 3)  Robz/Eevee, 7) Robz/Eevee/Axxle

And I am on angry/axxle.

So, I think you 2 pop up the most?

i am game
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sparky5856

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Quote
...but I am just anxious and cannot wait anymore!

Ah, so this also explains why you've been so active recently. Master plan much? XD

As for the collections:
3)
(3) Eevee: sparky5856, ftl?, Morgrim?, yuma
(2) Axxle: Galzria, angrybirds
(2) angrybirds: Axxle, Grujah
(1) Robz888: ftl?, Morgrim?

?'s count as half votes, they listed multiple people

7) is all over the map but Galz has the most votes.

So Eevee/Galz is the consensus?
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Grujah

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You can also suggest other (yes/no) questions, maybe somebody has a smarter one that I do.

I can also include myself as 3rd, but for my point of view, its pointless.
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Galzria

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My suggestions would be Axxle/Eevee, but I'm happy with it being Me/Eevee. Will post more in a bit, gotta drive.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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I apologize for not being around today.  It's been a far more busy Saturday than I anticipated.  I also see I have a lot to catch up on and will be doing so tonight.

But first off, I see answers to Grujah's #3 and #7 questions are most pressing.  Well, at this point (as in, before I've had a chance to fully reread the thread like I was hoping) - and without having read how other people answered - I still suspect Axxle most; so he's my answer to #3.  As for #7?  Captain_Frisk. 
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Eevee

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Ohkay, here again!

I was going to post Grujah seems super town here even before the claim, and even more so now. Absolutely not suspecting him one bit.

Would most want to know Axxle's alignment (because of the softclaim).
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Galzria

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Alright, I'm back (though a bit drink)... What can I do for ya?

I get a very strong (probably larger than most others here) town read on ABirds, and actually DON'T think he's a good target for this form of pseudo investigation because of it.

Now, I can understand why people might want to check me (and am flattered for the reasons listed!), so if you want to hot two birds (ha!) with one stone I would recommend just investigating me and then trusting my read.

Now, since you can only ask one question (Oh my God, ahaha, O breadcrumbed this role by accusing ME of having it and being unsubtle D1! He even linked the damn role after his Ragevote! Ahahaha. +1 O) and you don't know my alignment to be town before your results come in, I would suggest Eevee/Axxle since they are highly suspect to so many. My personal preference is Volt, but I understand you can't sheep me not knowing 100% that I'm town.

Anyway, I'm here and available, so "fire" away!
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ftl

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haven't gotten through all of the text but I got to the claim and unvote
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ftl

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hmm, well, I like pairwise investigations ,that's a good idea I think, a tad easier to work with than a triple investigation and a little more info than a single one-shot cop.

Pick Galz/someone
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yuma

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Grujah I would have preferred that you sat on this for a bit. It looked like for a while that a wagon had a chance to develop on you. It would have been interesting to see who would have joined it. As is, we should point out that both sparky and Morgrim cast suspicions at you, as did I as well... before your reveal.

I would take my vote off angrybirds if there is an actual way to confirm someone's alignment. He is the one I-personally am most interested in discovering--but as for the town itself. Eevee and Galz are at the top of my list to learn alignment.

Could we use these lists later on down the road to see who was willing to out who's alignment? Say a mafia is lynched and sparky was willing to let us discover that person's alignment, doesn't that give at least a little bit of credibility to them, or am I reading too much into that?
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Galzria

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Grujah I would have preferred that you sat on this for a bit. It looked like for a while that a wagon had a chance to develop on you. It would have been interesting to see who would have joined it. As is, we should point out that both sparky and Morgrim cast suspicions at you, as did I as well... before your reveal.

I would take my vote off angrybirds if there is an actual way to confirm someone's alignment. He is the one I-personally am most interested in discovering--but as for the town itself. Eevee and Galz are at the top of my list to learn alignment.

Could we use these lists later on down the road to see who was willing to out who's alignment? Say a mafia is lynched and sparky was willing to let us discover that person's alignment, doesn't that give at least a little bit of credibility to them, or am I reading too much into that?

What about ABird's play makes you question his alignment? I haven't heard a real case except that he's "lurky", which is such a BS reason to truly suspect SCUMMINESS. Is it "Not-do-great" town play? Yeah, maybe. But how many lurkers have actually been scum? 1? 2? Out of how many games?

And he hadn't even been completely absent lurky either. He posts once a day and usually gives reasonable opinions at the time. He didn't think eHunt was all that scummy afaik, and preferred the Insomniac lynch (despite the logic stating otherwise) which is more than most of us (myself included) can say!

Seriously, he appears very quiet, but townie, to me. What's the case for him being a serious question mark on alignment?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Eevee

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That is absolutely true. Scum is very unlikely to name their scumbuddy there (even more so if they realized what Grujah was doing).
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yuma

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Galz I think you are misunderstanding me... or rather i mistyped...

I do not have a suspicion vote on him. In my response to Grujah I said I would like to know his alignment. And just now when I said I would take my vote off him, I meant to remove my vote from him being the one Grujah reveal's alignment of.

I do not find him scummy. I find him town. I-personally-wanted to know his alignment, but in regards of providing town the best info, it wouldn't be best to use it on a-birds. Sorry if that was confusing.
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Galzria

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Galz I think you are misunderstanding me... or rather i mistyped...

I do not have a suspicion vote on him. In my response to Grujah I said I would like to know his alignment. And just now when I said I would take my vote off him, I meant to remove my vote from him being the one Grujah reveal's alignment of.

I do not find him scummy. I find him town. I-personally-wanted to know his alignment, but in regards of providing town the best info, it wouldn't be best to use it on a-birds. Sorry if that was confusing.

Sorry, bit drunk, but my question wasn't just to you (I just quoted since you were most current), but to everyone who has put Abirds on #3 or #7 of Grujah's questionnaire... Why? I just have a stronger town read on him personally than most here, although I admit I forgive lurkiness as more town than scum (based on past results). I just don't think I've seen a case on him that shows why he's scum outside of that reason - so I'm curious if there is one?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Eevee

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Galz, you think lurkiness is a slight town tell because scum is afraid of doing it too much or what?
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Galzria

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Galz, you think lurkiness is a slight town tell because scum is afraid of doing it too much or what?

I find it a slight town tell because in the history of f.DS lurkers have by and far been town, not scum. There have been TWO lurker scum that really jump to mind: Glooble and MAYBE Young_Nick. Ever other instance has been town.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Galz, you think lurkiness is a slight town tell because scum is afraid of doing it too much or what?

I find it a slight town tell because in the history of f.DS lurkers have by and far been town, not scum. There have been TWO lurker scum that really jump to mind: Glooble and MAYBE Young_Nick. Ever other instance has been town.

To clarify, I don't find the act itself more townie than not, or more scummy than not. I find it has a history of showing town at game end more often than scum.

But that's (imo) neither here nor there in regards to Abirds who - while a light poster - I don't consider a lurker.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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Grujah I would have preferred that you sat on this for a bit. It looked like for a while that a wagon had a chance to develop on you. It would have been interesting to see who would have joined it. As is, we should point out that both sparky and Morgrim cast suspicions at you, as did I as well... before your reveal.

Ah, you are right. Wagon would be informational. But, blah.

So, everybody agrees that form of question is a good one?

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Grujah

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Oh, just realized.

When cayvie posted "There is an SK in the game" That was O asking question "Is there an SK in the game".  ;D

So, he could have done everyday what I can do today.
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Morgrim7

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Ok, makes sense. Unvote
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

ftl

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Dang, the major arcana ARE pretty nice. Having that as a town power would be pretty powerful. And now it is! For one day only!
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jotheonah

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Vote Count 2.2

Axxle (1): angrybirds

not voting (11): Captain_Frisk, Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, sparky5856, Morgrim7, ftl

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"I know old meta, and joth is useless day 1 but awesome town day 3 and on." --Teproc

He/him

Grujah

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Galz seems to be a bit protective; like he doesn't want himself/angrybirds investigated.

So I guess one of them two, (most likely Galz)

And one of Axxle/Eevee.
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Galzria

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Galz seems to be a bit protective; like he doesn't want himself/angrybirds investigated.

So I guess one of them two, (most likely Galz)

And one of Axxle/Eevee.

Did you not read this post of mine where I said you should probably investigate me and either Eevee/Axxle (exactly what you just proposed)?

Alright, I'm back (though a bit drink)... What can I do for ya?

I get a very strong (probably larger than most others here) town read on ABirds, and actually DON'T think he's a good target for this form of pseudo investigation because of it.

Now, I can understand why people might want to check me (and am flattered for the reasons listed!), so if you want to hot two birds (ha!) with one stone I would recommend just investigating me and then trusting my read.

Now, since you can only ask one question (Oh my God, ahaha, O breadcrumbed this role by accusing ME of having it and being unsubtle D1! He even linked the damn role after his Ragevote! Ahahaha. +1 O) and you don't know my alignment to be town before your results come in, I would suggest Eevee/Axxle since they are highly suspect to so many. My personal preference is Volt, but I understand you can't sheep me not knowing 100% that I'm town.

Anyway, I'm here and available, so "fire" away!
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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Oh, right, sorry, I was focusing on another post of yours.
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Galzria

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Oh, right, sorry, I was focusing on another post of yours.

I know I seem defensive over ABirds, it's just that I've seen a lot of "he's suspicious" but no legitimate reasons given, and I personally have a town read on him (even though he parked his vote on me most of D1 and kept trying to push others to vote for me too. >.>)

I could be wrong, I just really don't think that I am.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Eevee

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Oh, right, sorry, I was focusing on another post of yours.

I know I seem defensive over ABirds, it's just that I've seen a lot of "he's suspicious" but no legitimate reasons given, and I personally have a town read on him (even though he parked his vote on me most of D1 and kept trying to push others to vote for me too. >.>)

I could be wrong, I just really don't think that I am.
I certainly don't have a townread on him, but I don't think his behavior is a result of his alignment but rather how he would play any role.
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Grujah

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Axxle/Eevee, you both obviously, whatever faction you are, know it's more beneficial to investigate the other one. Now, convince me.
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Grujah

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(Actually, give me something that will make me wanna investigate you less).
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Grujah

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sparky seems to be going under the radar but it is probably cuz I don't really know him yet.
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Axxle

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Axxle/Eevee, you both obviously, whatever faction you are, know it's more beneficial to investigate the other one. Now, convince me.
I can full claim now, and it should be pretty convincing.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT

Eevee

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I can't really prove my claim, so in that way I'm probably an ok investigate target.
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Grujah

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Blah, I didn't mean claims. I think I was pretty clear on my stance about claims - only do it if it benefits town. (more than hiding it benefits).

I do not want to force a claim out of anyone with this.
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Eevee

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Yeah but claiming is the only other way to "clear one's name", and the alignment information on guys who'd otherwise be unclear is more useful (I think).
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Robz888

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Hi guys, I'm back!

Cool reveal, Grujah. I definitely vote for Eevee/Axxle as the right investigation combo.
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

Captain_Frisk

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Kinda drunk. Ok, now, this is very important, and I'll give all details later. Butm need answer, from all players, to these question:

1) What do you think of Morgrim?
2) What do you think of shark_bait/Grujah?
3) Who is the most likely scum in this town (exclude Grujah)?
4) Can you give me an answer to Pop Quiz (Right now, who is your "Wanna lynch" "would support lynch" "will not lynch"
5) Your ideas on whom killed who last night
6) If you were Vigilante of sorts last night, whom would you target and, more importantly, WHY? (Kinda worthless cuz you know aligments of some dead people now, but do me a favor)

I promise this will be of great use.
Everyone answer.
Ok - I'm back - I started writing this when I saw Grujah's question.  I kept adding to it as I read and saw things that I found scummy or otherwise interesting... I hit Grujah's claim about 1/2 through.  Posting it anyway - because why not?

#1 - Behavior is out of line with previous games
#2 - I think you two lurked hard day 1 - but maybe you just didn't post because the transition wasn't official yet.
#3 - To be honest - I'm not sure.  The people who are standing out are in #4 below.
#4 -
Wanna - no sure fire "lynch them now" candidates

Maybe -
Axxle - provided no info in his survey
Morgrim - is lack of crazy play indicative of more maturity, or being extra careful because he's scum?
Angrybirds for his first post post survey to anti answering
Grujah - conducting this survey looks protown (scumhunting).  With so many scumteams - this doesn't necessarily mean town. - WAS writing this answer as catching up - and then i hit the claim! 

Will not -
Grujah

#5 - You mean factions?  Or do you want me to say: I think that Galz killed O in the closet with a hammer?  The factions seem pretty clear via flavor - except for the strangulation - but that could be vigging I suppose.  As for calling out which person did which kill - that's an awefully specific request that is so unlikely to be correct its just a waste of time.
#6 - Without re-reading day 1 - if cayvie called me up and said "hey listen dude - you need to kill someone now, I'd probably just default to Morgrim or Galz".  Otherwise, I'd have to fully reread day 1. 
#7 - Morgrim per above.

I agree that a search for scum pairings seems like a good idea.  I obviously support Axxle.  I would honestly keep morgrim out of such a pairing.  I like Axxle / Angrybirds, but eevee is fuzzy enough for me.
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I support funsockets.... taking as much time as they need to get it right.

sparky5856

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sparky seems to be going under the radar but it is probably cuz I don't really know him yet.

Heh, it's day 2 any nobody knows me yet  ;D I've been curious to see what people think of me so far, but no major reads on me thus far. eHunt said I was town but didn't go into much detail at all. shraeye said I was scum when he was woozy. A lot more idunnolol's than anything though.

In all honesty no one really ever suspects me whenever I play mafia for some reason, I guess it's just the way I play, whatever that is. I've been concentrating much more on eliminating the scum than on self-defense, cause that matters more.

I'm thinking... if you're scum, you DON'T want people to know who you are. Galz is okay with Grujah investigating him, Axxle is okay with full-claiming now, and Eevee gives a "probably ok" that it's good to investigate him. Eevee sounds the most uncertain of the three. I've already pegged him multiple times, so I think he is good to investigate. Galz and Axxle are town-ish-ier, if that's a word. A town-aligned person would WANT to be investigated, since they won't draw suspicion anymore, and they can concentrate fully on scumhunting.

Of course, the fact that there's a doctor genocide this game does not bode well for those who are confirmed town. Ninja doctor, if you're out there... you know who to protect in the upcoming night!

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sparky5856

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Wow look at this awesome little gem that I wrote XD

Quote
I'm thinking... if you're scum, you DON'T want people to know who you are.
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Grujah

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se, the fact that there's a doctor genocide this game does not bode well for those who are confirmed town. Ninja doctor, if you're out there... you know who to protect in the upcoming night!

Tell me about it, I've basically hammered ehunt.

Hi guys, I'm back!

Cool reveal, Grujah. I definitely vote for Eevee/Axxle as the right investigation combo.

So, that's all that we get from you? :(
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Morgrim7

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Morgrim - is lack of crazy play indicative of more maturity, or being extra careful because he's scum?
Waitwaitwaitwait. I'm scummy because I'm acting normal? What, would you rather I act crazy? Ok, Vote: Captain_Frisk>:( No more Mr. Nice Guy.








Just kidding, Unvote but seriously.
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Robz888

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se, the fact that there's a doctor genocide this game does not bode well for those who are confirmed town. Ninja doctor, if you're out there... you know who to protect in the upcoming night!

Tell me about it, I've basically hammered ehunt.

Hi guys, I'm back!

Cool reveal, Grujah. I definitely vote for Eevee/Axxle as the right investigation combo.

So, that's all that we get from you? :(

Sorry, I thought your questions were just aimed at getting that answer. What questions do you have for me? I'll answer them.

I mean, Eevee is my top concern right now. He wiggled around a lot at the end of yesterday. He was right about ehunt at first, and then I thought he was way way way too easily persuaded to get in favor of ehunt.

Axxle was the person I most thought was scummy for most of yesterday, but his behavior changed eventually and then I thought he was actually doing useful scumhunting work. So, I would definitely like to know if he's town or not.
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

Eevee

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For me, ehunt vs insomniac was heart vs brain. You caught me at a very vulnerable time (wounds from bmmm and VII still hurting)  and I was easily convinced Ins being the real doctor was the logical scenario. If i was Insomniacs team, would I have behaved the way I did?
But alas, this time I should have listened to my heart. Sorry ehunt.
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angrybirds

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i think we need to recollect information for grujah's reveal i will try to do it now
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cayvie

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You beg of the spirits; we grant you this favor
(we're regular afterlife info conveyors).
Our voices are one and they never shall waver:
both Axxle and Eevee are town-aligned players.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

she/her

Grujah

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Vote: Robz888
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angrybirds

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3rd question
Eevee 2 (sparky, yuma)
Axxle  3 (Galz, angrybirds, Voltgloss)
angrybirds 1 (Axxle)
Galz 1 (ftl)

7th question
Frisk 2 (spark, Voltgloss)
Voltgloss 1 (Galz)
Galz 1 (Axxle)
Eevee 1 (angrybirds)
morgrim 1 (frisk)

full totals (including robz's two)
Axxle (4)
Eevee (4)
Galz (2)
Frisk (2)
abirds (1)
Morgrim (1)
Voltgloss (1)
sparky (0)
yuma (0)
Grujah (0)
ftl (0)
robz (0)


Need clarification:
ftl didn't answer 3 fully or 7 fully, he didn't answer anything fully now that i look over it. but then he changed to Galz/someone
Morgrim had both eevee and robz on question 3. and 3 people, robz, eevee, axxle on 7
robz just said that a combo of eevee/axxle would wokr
Frisk didn't fully answer #3,

don't have full answers from ftl (1more), morgrim (2 more), frisk (1 more) or robz (although robz did provide 2 people to investigate and grujah did you have two to put into the vote.


ppedit: i just did all this work! Did we already decide and I somehow missed it? Both Axxle and Eevee or town
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Grujah

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I went for E/A. I got slightly more townish read of Galz after I posted my Galz + 1 thing, so I though these 2 are good as any.

Well, we missed scum, but it ain't all that bad, we got confirmed townies.

Eevee/Axxle, we need to, in jo's words, scumhunt as we never scumhunted before.  ;D

As I said, I've got a townish read of Galz. Which is strange, as I find him scummy most of the time. For others, I really don't know, I kinda focused on you two. :D
I think I should look into Volt, Frisk, Robz, sparky, ftl, yuma.. and Morg if that is possible at all.
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Voltgloss

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Time now to peruse the thread from the start, through the lens of all known flips (at least 6, and effectively 7 assuming Gruj is Town, which the Strongman kill flavor and the "spirits' answer" both support).  Reading from the beginning is something we should do more often.  Planning to give summary analysis tonight.
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Grujah

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Time now to peruse the thread from the start, through the lens of all known flips (at least 6, and effectively 7 assuming Gruj is Town, which the Strongman kill flavor and the "spirits' answer" both support).  Reading from the beginning is something we should do more often.  Planning to give summary analysis tonight.

Also, my awesome breadcrum too!
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Eevee

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Time now to peruse the thread from the start, through the lens of all known flips (at least 6, and effectively 7 assuming Gruj is Town, which the Strongman kill flavor and the "spirits' answer" both support).  Reading from the beginning is something we should do more often.  Planning to give summary analysis tonight.
+1.

I have no idea whatsoever who to suspect because the town is huge and remembering anyone is freaking hard. But now, given that I was cleared as town, I sort of a have a responsibility to be of more use while I still live, because at least I will be listened to. I'll try to attack the ridiculous task of reading through
Time now to peruse the thread from the start, through the lens of all known flips (at least 6, and effectively 7 assuming Gruj is Town, which the Strongman kill flavor and the "spirits' answer" both support).  Reading from the beginning is something we should do more often.  Planning to give summary analysis tonight.
+1.

I have no idea whatsoever who to suspect because the town is huge and remembering anyone is freaking hard (I should not be in 6 games simultaneously, but I am). Now, given that I was cleared as town, I sort of a have a responsibility to be of more use while I still live, because at least I will be listened to. I'll try to attack the daunting task of reading through 44 pages of random voting and accusations to find something real, starting now! I encourage everyone else to do the same, it's pretty rewarding in the end!
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Eevee

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What happened there? Well, the 2nd version is the correct one.
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Captain_Frisk

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What happened there? Well, the 2nd version is the correct one.

You wrote it twice because you're scum and had to review and revise your words multiple times?
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Robz888

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What happened there? Well, the 2nd version is the correct one.

You wrote it twice because you're scum and had to review and revise your words multiple times?

Hey Frisk, might want to check a few posts back...
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Captain_Frisk

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What happened there? Well, the 2nd version is the correct one.

You wrote it twice because you're scum and had to review and revise your words multiple times?

Hey Frisk, might want to check a few posts back...

DOH!
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Axxle

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What happened there? Well, the 2nd version is the correct one.

You wrote it twice because you're scum and had to review and revise your words multiple times?
...
Vote: Captain_Frisk for suspecting mod confirmed town.
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Captain_Frisk

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Does the mod lie in this game?
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Axxle

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Does the mod lie in this game?
Not bastard...
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Robz888

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Does the mod lie in this game?

I'm assuming no.
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Voltgloss

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What happened there? Well, the 2nd version is the correct one.

You wrote it twice because you're scum and had to review and revise your words multiple times?

...did CF just accuse Eevee of being scum less than 10 posts after the mod confirmed Eevee to be town?

PPE:  I'm late to the party with this news
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Captain_Frisk

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I deserve it for being snarky and not fully re-reading.
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Eevee

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I was SO hoping someone would do that. No town points for Frisk today.
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Robz888

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The question is whether it was a stupid, snarky mistake, or whether he was scum trying to advance an anti-Eevee agenda.
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Voltgloss

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The question is:  would town-CF check the thread, see Eevee's post, and fire off an accusation of Eevee without making any effort to read upthread before doing so?  (I do not believe that anyone could miss the size-18-pt bold blue text cayvie used, unless they literally did not read upthread at all.)
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Axxle

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The question is:  would town-CF check the thread, see Eevee's post, and fire off an accusation of Eevee without making any effort to read upthread before doing so?  (I do not believe that anyone could miss the size-18-pt bold blue text cayvie used, unless they literally did not read upthread at all.)

I have absolutely no idea how he could have missed it.
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yuma

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The question is:  would town-CF check the thread, see Eevee's post, and fire off an accusation of Eevee without making any effort to read upthread before doing so?  (I do not believe that anyone could miss the size-18-pt bold blue text cayvie used, unless they literally did not read upthread at all.)
yeah: another question is this: would mafia be more likely to just fire out votes to be snarky or would they be more cautious with them? hard to answer... I don't think we can get much out of analyzing it to death.

Of greater interest was Grujah's vote on Robz. Grujah would you be nice enough to explain your vote?
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Robz888

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The question is:  would town-CF check the thread, see Eevee's post, and fire off an accusation of Eevee without making any effort to read upthread before doing so?  (I do not believe that anyone could miss the size-18-pt bold blue text cayvie used, unless they literally did not read upthread at all.)
yeah: another question is this: would mafia be more likely to just fire out votes to be snarky or would they be more cautious with them? hard to answer... I don't think we can get much out of analyzing it to death.

Of greater interest was Grujah's vote on Robz. Grujah would you be nice enough to explain your vote?

I assume it's because with Eevee/Axxle clear, there are only so many people left who've had suspicion against them already, and me chief among them.
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Grujah

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Why are you drilling me? I'm obvtown.


I just choose one of the rest of the group (one that wasn't on the ab/galz/eevee/axxle bench) at random.

I mean, sure. Unvote.
I'm also gonna Vote: Captain_Frisk on this scumslip. This is kinda what O done in MIV too.
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Axxle

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Grujah

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Analysis?
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Captain_Frisk

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Why are you drilling me? I'm obvtown.


I just choose one of the rest of the group (one that wasn't on the ab/galz/eevee/axxle bench) at random.

I mean, sure. Unvote.
I'm also gonna Vote: Captain_Frisk on this scumslip. This is kinda what O done in MIV too.

Isn't a scumslip when you make a mistake that reveals you are scum because you know something that others don't? 

My calling out a mod confirmed townies obvious editing of content as appearing scummy is just dumbassery.  It just looked to me like scum seriously editing their posts (I did it in 4 and 6), being careful with word choices etc.  I got excited and didn't even make it back to catch up.

My bad.
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yuma

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Why are you drilling me? I'm obvtown.

Why are you drilling me? I'm obvtown.

asking why you voted for someone isn't drilling. sheesh... If you are such obvtown (which I agree you are) then sharing your information and logic for voting someone is useful as it can help others discover what another townie is thinking. That is all I wanted.
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Grujah

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Why are you drilling me? I'm obvtown.


I just choose one of the rest of the group (one that wasn't on the ab/galz/eevee/axxle bench) at random.

I mean, sure. Unvote.
I'm also gonna Vote: Captain_Frisk on this scumslip. This is kinda what O done in MIV too.

Isn't a scumslip when you make a mistake that reveals you are scum because you know something that others don't? 

My calling out a mod confirmed townies obvious editing of content as appearing scummy is just dumbassery.  It just looked to me like scum seriously editing their posts (I did it in 4 and 6), being careful with word choices etc.  I got excited and didn't even make it back to catch up.

My bad.

(in popsvoice): Mistakes are scumtells.

Remember this:
There are I counted, all of zero posts where I found him make useful, new analysis.

Bullcrap. I made the point that survivalist tell isn't scumtell.

What analysis have you made?

Also I've been in Hawaii for a week. Still posted a bunch but I really hate Ipads and won't post anything long on them.

Vote:Tables for lurking, then redirection for bad reasons.

?
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Galzria

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Goodness, how have I not posted here yet today? *Erm*...

So, I have a bone to pick with Axxle:

Why were you so not helpful D1 like town Axxle usually is?? Yeah yeah, I've got a personal history of lynching you for trying to be to obviously building town cred, but man - at the end of the day all those articles you link are useful!

Alright, umm... Yeah.

Much like everybody I need to read back in light of certain flips. Especially taking note (I think) of interactions with Insomniac/O. While I don't exactly expect scum to be all buddy-buddy, they probably did a decent job of simply avoiding each other D1. Town this size, it's likely to go unnoticed.

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Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Goodness, how have I not posted here yet today? *Erm*...

So, I have a bone to pick with Axxle:

Why were you so not helpful D1 like town Axxle usually is?? Yeah yeah, I've got a personal history of lynching you for trying to be to obviously building town cred, but man - at the end of the day all those articles you link are useful!

Alright, umm... Yeah.

Much like everybody I need to read back in light of certain flips. Especially taking note (I think) of interactions with Insomniac/O. While I don't exactly expect scum to be all buddy-buddy, they probably did a decent job of simply avoiding each other D1. Town this size, it's likely to go unnoticed.
I wasn't really feeling this game for whatever reason.  Maybe burning myself out.
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Axxle

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Much like everybody I need to read back in light of certain flips. Especially taking note (I think) of interactions with Insomniac/O. While I don't exactly expect scum to be all buddy-buddy, they probably did a decent job of simply avoiding each other D1. Town this size, it's likely to go unnoticed.
Insom/O weren't on the same scumteam...
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Axxle

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Much like everybody I need to read back in light of certain flips. Especially taking note (I think) of interactions with Insomniac/O. While I don't exactly expect scum to be all buddy-buddy, they probably did a decent job of simply avoiding each other D1. Town this size, it's likely to go unnoticed.
Insom/O weren't on the same scumteam...
Oh, wait. Misread that I think.
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Galzria

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Much like everybody I need to read back in light of certain flips. Especially taking note (I think) of interactions with Insomniac/O. While I don't exactly expect scum to be all buddy-buddy, they probably did a decent job of simply avoiding each other D1. Town this size, it's likely to go unnoticed.
Insom/O weren't on the same scumteam...
Oh, wait. Misread that I think.

Yeah, I meant in general, looking for interactions with them (or lack thereof) from everybody. Not how they interacted with each other.

Interesting, O was a WW Major Arcana, with the flavor of a Cult.

What do people think of the idea that he was the bitey-kind of WW that recruited instead of killing?  We're missing a WW flavor kill after all...
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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I don't know, but I would assume, cayvie determined Major Arcana before hand.

I am pretty sure Cult is not the case. I mean, I cannot say it with 100% certainty, but jeez, I find it very unlikely that it was Cult.

It is not BM, and hidden, non-expected factions are Bastard.
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ftl

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Catching up on thread.

Doubt there's a cult. Unless we by chance happened to roll zero werewolves, so cayvie made werewolf a major-arcana-based cult instead, or something. If that's the case then there's probably one wolf around now, who may or may not be able to recruit. I think we'll have to wait 'till N2 to know for sure.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1114 on: August 27, 2012, 06:25:19 pm »

I really really doubt there's a cult, and even if there was it wouldn't be someone with the investigative power that O had.  I think that was High Priestess flavor, not cult flavor.
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ftl

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If I had time right now I'd go back and look for scumparings, but not at the moment I don't, not to go reread a whole D1 :(

Mistakes are scumtells, is there anything else to implicate C_F though?

At the moment I'll sheep obvtown grujah and Vote: Captain_Frisk though it's tentative because even though I think grujah is obvtown now, his D1 reads were sort of terrible in this game (no offense!)
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1116 on: August 27, 2012, 06:43:04 pm »

So I see shraeye starting to attack the specific wording of peoples' posts, which is a common approach by eager new players (it certainly was mine!), and I'm about to dismiss it as such when I see this:

Now new information is given, where Insomniac says this:
I never said we should suit claim I was saying a select few claiming could reveal if there are multiple factions. Quite the contrary I oppose suit claiming especially en masse
Well he had never made a select few/en masse distinction before despite this claim.  Also, he makes it sound like he's now very opposed to something he previously suggested he was for.  Convenient switch now that consensus has come out that town doesn't want suitclaims.

And shraeye makes a pretty good point here.  Insom's "explanation" raises more questions than it answers.  He didn't say anything about "a select few claiming" in his initial post on the subject.  So why make that response?  It feels like trying too hard in response to some early suspicion. 

Insom's latest has me scratching my head some more.  I flat out don't understand what he's getting at in his second-to-last paragraph.  It continues to feel like too much of a response to first-day semi-RVS suspicion.  Which makes me want to ratchet up the pressure some more to see what else we get.

Vote: Insomniac

Very non-mafia post. +1 point non-mafia point for Volt.
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angrybirds

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it seems i logged off before unvote: axxle
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sparky5856

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So now my major suspicion has been thrown into the toilet. Can't successfully get them all I suppose >__<

I like Volt's idea of reading back since we have new confirmed info that both Eevee and Axxle are town. I mentioned Captain_Frisk a little bit in my novel post, so I'll go back to that at least. Later though, I'm lazy now XD Don't want to jump into anything just yet.
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Axxle

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Can I have an iffy catergory?:
Axxle
Galzria
Morgrim
sparky5856

Will NOT lynch:
Voltgloss
ftl
yuma

wat.
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Galzria

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Can I have an iffy catergory?:
Axxle
Galzria
Morgrim
sparky5856

Will NOT lynch:
Voltgloss
ftl
yuma

wat.

How the heck did that one slip by? Lol!
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

yuma

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Insomniac: suggested there would be a benefit in discerning multiple factions--right after the cayvie serial killer.

a history of votes--at least according to ctrl F in Print... didn't shraeye do one of these earlier... mabye I can steal that:

Yes he did:
Frisk->Morgrim (R)
Axxle->Eevee (R)
Insom->Axxle (R)
ftl->Galzria (R)
shraeye->Morg (R)
yuma->angry (R)
Insom->yuma
ftl->Morg
O->Frisk (R)
Morg->Frisk (R)
angry->Shraeye (R)
O->Galz
ftl->Axxle
Volt->ehunt (R)
angry->Galz
yuma->shark/G
Axxle->Galz
ftl->Galz
shraeye->Insom
Volt->Insom
Morg->Insom

ehunt->Frisk
O->Volt
Axxle->ftl
Volt->Robz
Robz->angry
Eevee->Axxle
sparky->shark/G
shraeye->Axxle
ftl->Axxle
Galz->Axxle
sparky->Axxle
O->Robz
Axxle->Robz
yuma->shraeye
ftl->Robz
Frisk->robz
Morg->Robz
Volt->Insom
Galz->Volt
Volt->Galz
ftl->O (R)
Galz->Axxle
Volt->Axxle
Robz->Axxle
Grujah->yuma (R)
O->ehunt

Since that point

O->Axxle
ftl->Axxle
O->ftl
Grujah->Eevee
ftl-> grujah
O->Robz
sparky->Grujah
eevee-> ehunt
shraeye-> eevee
yuma->ehunt
morgim->robz
isnomniac->angrybirds
voltgloss->ehunt
angrybirds-> frisk
axxle -> insomniac
O -> ftl
angrybirds -> insomniac
robz -> ehunt
insomniac -> axxle
ftl -> insomniac

O -> ehunt
Galz -> ehunt
ehunt -> O
eevee -> O

voltgloss -> insomniac
yuma -> insomniac

Galz -> axxle
robz -> axxle
shraeye -> insomniac
O -> ehunt
axxle -> ehunt
Galz -> ehunt
robz -> ehunt
yuma -> ehunt
grujah -> shraeye
insomniac -> ehunt
shraeye -> eevee
sparky -> insomniac
voltgloss -> ehunt
morgrim -> insomniac
eevee -> ehunt
axxle -> ehunt
angrybirds -> shraeye
axxle -> shraeye
shraeye -> eevee
grujah -> ehunt
axxle -> ehunt
insomniac -> ehunt

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Axxle

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Oh, I'm going to go back and see O and Insom's stance on the whole Angrybirds/Robz/Me situation.  If anyone remembers anything let me know.
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Axxle

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Actually, you know what that votecount tells me? That yuma didn't vote for O or insom, helped kill eHalc, and was never on the radar long enough to get a vote.  Sounds like scum-yuma to me.  Will go through his posts to verify though.
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Frisk only had 1 vote. Hmm.. off to sleep now.

and really sparky, why would you lynch yourself?
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Grujah

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Actually, you know what that votecount tells me? That yuma didn't vote for O or insom, helped kill eHalc, and was never on the radar long enough to get a vote.  Sounds like scum-yuma to me.  Will go through his posts to verify though.

yuma was also budding up with me, maybe even after my reveal.
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Axxle

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Actually, you know what that votecount tells me? That yuma didn't vote for O or insom, helped kill eHalc, and was never on the radar long enough to get a vote.  Sounds like scum-yuma to me.  Will go through his posts to verify though.
err, he had one vote from insom early, ctrl-F failed me since the arrows weren't consistently spaced.
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yuma

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yuma -> insomniac

read more carefully
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Got to page 12 in my reread, lots of interesting stuff. Got a scummy vibe from Frisk (going after morgrim, unvoting saying it was just RVS when the wagon dies) and yuma (seemed to be protective of Ins when shraye went after him), but I actually might be unfairly harsh to Frisk because him mistakenly accusing me was still fresh on my mind.
Shraye looks towny  (and can't be on Insomniacs team because he called Ins out on his scumslip way back in day 1 and actually started a wagon that got reasonably far). Volt and morg joined that insomniac wagon early, which implicates neither is mafia (might ofc be other scum).

Interestingly, yuma calls shraye out frist for voting Ins (to which shraye responds by laying out a pretty nice case I think) and then for changing his vote from Ins to Morgrim. (This happened aroun post 166 and a bit earlier if anyone wants to reread)

Gals got up to 4 votes very quickly. Morgrim keeps his vote on Insomniac (the biggest wagon) but says he also finds Galzria "really scummy", which to me looks scummy (although likely not mafia scummy because of the insomniac vote).
Page 11, Axxle wagon turbo formed. Like, it was way too fast, Axxle would look very towny even without the mod confirmation I think. That wagon might be an ok place to hunt for scum. (Some town points for yuma for saying he doesn't like the Axxle wagon here.)

Okay, that's something, back to reading.
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Grujah

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"Shraye looks towny  (and can't be on Insomniacs team because he called Ins out on his scumslip way back in day 1 and actually started a wagon that got reasonably far)."

Uhm, eevee, shraeye is dead and conftown.
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Eevee

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"Shraye looks towny  (and can't be on Insomniacs team because he called Ins out on his scumslip way back in day 1 and actually started a wagon that got reasonably far)."

Uhm, eevee, shraeye is dead and conftown.
Haha yeah, that's how well I was caught up lolol. Sorry guys, maybe I shouldnt post before I'm done reading back. Glad my initial read was correct at least.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1132 on: August 27, 2012, 09:06:33 pm »

So here were my brief thoughts on Captain_Frisk earlier.

INTERMISSION. CAPTAIN_FRISK. He was the very first post this day, and it was a vote for Morgrim. Since, he provided very vague reasons for voting (at least to me, I can't read the whole forum to gather how Morgrim plays XD)

Quote
Quote from: Morgrim7 on August 09, 2012, 06:38:30 pm
Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever.

I have a whole forum full of reasons!

His playstyle seems very vague altogether, not providing reason and just charging into his thoughts:

Quote
Quote
Quote from: Galzria on August 09, 2012, 10:15:57 pm
Well, 16 players in a non-BM game! Not bad... Hope you're up for the work Cayvie. You've got a 4000 post behemoth coming your way!

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Sorry galz, I am not scum.
Quote
Quote from: shark_bait on August 10, 2012, 12:22:03 pm
Quote
Dude... Frisk, you can't really count BMIV.  I was only able to play that way b/c you explicitly omitted the player list.  Everyone knows that I'm actually playing in this game.

So you are admitting that you're going to play scum differently here.  Got it.

Let me see what else I can find on him.

Quote
I have a very strong case against someone who consistently displays anti-town behavior, but you'll have to trust me.  Just vote for who I vote for - and all will be ok when that person flips.

So he's asking for trust only four (real) days into the game, kinda fast imo. He's also one of the most notable lurkers in this game thus far.

Later on though, he actually begins to play seriously, voting for Robz and sticking with it, analyzing how many posts people had in the thread at that point, and acknowledging that he's been lurking, also asking questions to get caught up. Maybe he's not lurking to try to avoid the action and to just let all of us kill each other. Real life can intrude too.

Ughhhhhhh, I gotta find someone else who's scummy, this game is hard sometimes >___<. Assuming maybe four scum left (one more werewolf maybe; three werewolves with O's power seems completely out of line, one to two more mafia maybe, and one SK), and with eight people besides me (eliminating Grujah, Eevee, Axxle, and myself (seriously voting myself does not sound like a good idea. if I do vote myself it's all for fun  ;D )) that's like a 50/50 shot of hitting scum.

Can I go back to my "THE MAFIA IS AMONG EVERYONE" theory?
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Voltgloss

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...reading from the beginning, Part I...

Well, I didn't have time to read everyone's Day 1 posts yet, but here's the first two people I looked at: CF and Robz.  (I'm going down the list of players in the intro post in order, skipping myself, conf-towns, and the deceased.) 

Captain_Frisk - posts that jumped out at me:

- opens the game by voting Morgrim (#22)
- #131, about shark_bait/Grujah:  "So you are admitting that you're going to play scum differently here.  Got it."
- #308, votes Robz for backing off of Abirds too quickly
- #339, notes that Insom claiming day 1 bad play is a "cop out"
- #426, defends Morgrim-hunting, defends Robz vote, gives post count
- #531, challenges Grujah's theory that Morgrim should be vigged, not lynched
- #536, suggests forcing Axxle to claim and monitoring him; comments that "f we don't lynch power roles - then it is likely that we won't lynch today"
- #601, bemoans not having a candidate at 50% votes (though ehunt was already there), says he won't vote ehunt, asks for prod on Grujah, asks for input from Galz

...and that's pretty much it.  CF does not post at all for the rest of Day 1.  So we have absolutely nothing from him dealing with the double-doctor-debate.  His vote was left parked on Robz even well after the Robz-Abirds issue had died down.

Interesting factoid:  after the mod's revealing at least one serial killer exists (#62), O's next post is to cite CF as obv-SK (#66).  CF never responds to that or even acknowledges it. 

In fact, CF never mentions, addresses, or even acknowledges O once in any of his posts.  Despite O's throwing suspicion at him - not just #62, but also #848 (for ignoring the double-doctor-debate).  And CF only mentions Insom the one time, at #339.

CF's general lurking, plus studious avoidance of anything O-related and pretty much anything Insom-related, plus the complete disengagement from the double-doctor-debate, all add up to quite a bit of suspicion in my eyes.  Which is why I listed CF as the person whose alignment I was most interested to know.

Turning to Robz888, key posts:

- #168, questions case against Insom
- #261, votes Abirds to get him to post
- #291, unvotes Abirds, defends "a little jumpy" comment
- #295, comments Axxle isn't paying very good attention to the Robz-Abirds events
- #300, continued Abirds discussion - questions Axxle's and ftl's voting for him as a result
- #329, defends self further in response to growing wagon
- #364, votes Axxle (to L-2) while his own wagon is at L-4
- #372, defends vote on Axxle, contrasting Axxle's behavior to that of others on the Robzwagon; also comments about how "no Day 1 lynch is ever correct" and "Day 1 with so many people is tough stuff"
- #463, notes Axxle hasn't been lurky, but doesn't want to unvote because he doesn't want No Lynch and "I don't know what other direction we could go (other than me)"; suggests pressuring a lurker
- #470, unvotes Axxle in response to softclaim
- #483, comments scum are probably lurkers - notes Morgrim, Eevee, ehunt, Insom, Abirds
- #488, removes Insom from lurker list
- #578, votes ehunt for going after Frisk for going after Morgrim
- #662, unvotes ehunt after doctor claim, votes Axxle
- #707, revotes ehunt after Insom's doctor claim
- #719, comments Insom's claim seemed more genuine, and that one would probably be lynched and the other nightkilled

...hmm.  I'm not seeing a tremendous amount here to raise my suspicions.  Robz's actions read to me more like a town player trying to come out of lurk mode (and I recall he had V/LA and/or illness issues over the course of Day 1) and then having to unexpectedly defend himself from a lot of suspicion over something that STILL seems to me to be rather innocent exchange (Robz/Abirds).  I can't fault his thinking re: ehunt/Insom as it was generally in line with my own.  Given the presence of other more likely scum options around, I'm not seeing myself voting for Robz today.

Will move on to yuma and ftl in my next post.  May not complete it tonight; if not, will likely post in the morning.
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Voltgloss

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Ugggh, my apologies for the italics, had an "i" in brackets that screwed up the formatting.  Text is right though.
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sparky5856

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Yeah, reading the middle of Day 1 did give me more of a clean feeling about Captain_Frisk...

Quote
...and that's pretty much it.  CF does not post at all for the rest of Day 1.  So we have absolutely nothing from him dealing with the double-doctor-debate.  His vote was left parked on Robz even well after the Robz-Abirds issue had died down.

...but I can't get THIS out of my mind. Of course I was the same way, not posting for like the last ten pages of Day 1, but I did address my main concerns in one post. I felt like what I wanted to get out (Eevee and Insomniac were suspicious & eHunt was innocent. Now we know I was only right two out of three) was done. Captain_Frisk didn't even acknowledge the doctor-claims. IS he just letting us kill each other lol

And nice find Volt about this!

Quote
Interesting factoid:  after the mod's revealing at least one serial killer exists (#62), O's next post is to cite CF as obv-SK (#66).  CF never responds to that or even acknowledges it.

He even posted something completely off-topic to this THREE MINUTES after O's post.

Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever.

I have a whole forum full of reasons!


And he responds to Galz here?

Well, 16 players in a non-BM game! Not bad... Hope you're up for the work Cayvie. You've got a 4000 post behemoth coming your way!

Frisk, I need to know up front, are you scum?

Sorry galz, I am not scum.
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Morgrim7

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All right...hmmm.... weird scumslip by C_F which has turned into a wagon. I did suspect Axxle, but Cayvie ruined everything. No idea who to lynch now. If you guys think we should lynch C_F I'm up for it.

Voltgloss: Being pretty helpful. Slight town read.
Captain_Frisk: Scummy. I would lynch him
Grujah: probably Town
Eevee: Town
Robz888: IDK
yuma: ditto volt
ftl: voted C_F... hmmmm
Galzria: help me out with this one, guys
angrybirds: Well...since Grujah is probably town...
sparky5856: pretty helpful
Morgrim7: anyone's reads on me?
Axxle: town
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Morgrim7

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And actually, I wanna Vote: Captain_Frisk...waitwait unvote how close are we to a lynch
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Axxle

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And actually, I wanna Vote: Captain_Frisk...waitwait unvote how close are we to a lynch
You just Morgrimed him.

(actually have no clue, just felt like saying that)
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Grujah

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We need 7 to lynch.

Did we just see Morg whom cares about whom and when we hammer? Wow.
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Morgrim7

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and mine would be the fourth vote?
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1141 on: August 28, 2012, 08:46:45 am »

(seriously voting myself does not sound like a good idea. if I do vote myself it's all for fun  ;D ))

Is he serious?
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Captain_Frisk

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All right - apparently I have to take this game seriously now?

1. Insomniac Queen of Cups, Mafia Doctor, Stabbed in the Back Night 1
2. Voltgloss
3. Captain_Frisk
4. Grujah - effectively VT now?
5. Eevee - Mod confirmed townie
6. Robz888
7. O Werewolf High Priestess, Strangled Night 1
8. yuma
9. ftl
10. Galzria
11. shraeye Three of Swords, Vanilla Townie, Shot Night 1
12. angrybirds
13. sparky5856
14. Morgrim7
15. Axxle - mod confirmed townie
16. ehunt Ten of Wands, Doctor, Lynched Day 1

So that leaves:

2. Voltgloss
3. Captain_Frisk
6. Robz888
8. yuma
9. ftl
10. Galzria
12. angrybirds
13. sparky5856
14. Morgrim7

16 players - and a 4.5 / 13 chance of scum - we're probably looking for at least 5 scum? (serial killer + 2 scum teams of at least 2 people - although mafia doctor with no teammate would be pretty hilarious)

That leaves at least 3 scum (and I assume 4 to be safe) remaining among those 9.

Clearly I'm scummy.  Apologies for the lurking.  I blame goko.  Now that the goko madness seems to have died down, mafia is alot more compelling.

The others:

2. Voltgloss - Attempted to paint Axxle as scum doctors protection.  I also thought Axxle was scummy, so I can't really blame him here.
6. Robz888 - Has a "well that sucked" scum tell to start Day 2.  Otherwise not alot to comment on day 2 - he jumped on me for my eevee debacle - just as I jumped on eevee (doh!)  I still like him for my D1 reasons - and nothing much has changed. 
8. yuma - Kindof a null read.  This raises my hackles a bit.
9. ftl - vote on me feels hedgy, otherwise nothing jumps out oat me
10. Galzria - hasn't jumped on me for mistake - suspicious of axxle pre reveal - floated a WW recruitment theory - no read
12. angrybirds - nothing since the big reveal other than an unvote.  Nervous now because he was on the list of people to investigate?
13. sparky5856 - when he quotes my (very thinly) veiled anti morgrim joke in post #1132 - he seems to take it seriously.  As for not acknowledging O's claim that I am obv. SK - I was also surprised to notice that I had never mentioned O.  I've learned to generally tune O out - because I never feel like I can trust him.  I assumed he was making a crack about M4 - where I actually was a serial killer - full claimed it - and nobody believed me.
14. Morgrim7 - one of these days he's going to be scum.

After this reread - my gut tells me to:

Vote: RobZ
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Eevee

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The "aw that sucks!" is not a scum tell, especially on anyone as experienced as robz. Come on now!
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Voltgloss

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Apologies I didn't have time to complete the next part of my "reading from the beginning" analysis yet - it was a rather hectic morning.  Will try to get the bulk of that analysis completed and posted today.

...deadline is Monday 5 p.m., so we have less than a week.  Is anyone going to be V/LA over the weekend (including Monday, as it's a holiday in the U.S.)? 
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Grujah

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You blame goko? Really? That lasted much shorter than this game.
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Captain_Frisk

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You blame goko? Really? That lasted much shorter than this game.

Actually made me laugh out loud.  When the goko threads were hot, there were lots of people who were wrong on the internet (on both sides).  I had to keep my popcorn ready.
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ftl

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...deadline is Monday 5 p.m., so we have less than a week.  Is anyone going to be V/LA over the weekend (including Monday, as it's a holiday in the U.S.)?

I won't be able to post much, but I'll read and be able to chime in with one-liners or votes at times, but won't have time to do any rereads or analysis if it'll need to be done. (But, well, that's actually how I've been playing anyway recently, been sort of busy).  I'll be around Monday.

Still ok with my vote on frisk atm. Would be okay with any of the 9 unconfirmed being lynched except me; would prefer not Galz, and I guess not angry, but not sure.
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Galzria

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I just think... Looking at who the confirmed town, and who's left... It's kinda scary. There are some known power players on the list of possible scum.

I'm thinking strategy wise here... O played M-IV by designing multiple "scum personalities" (i.e. The noisy one, the quiet one, the lurker, etc.). With O and Insomniac, even though they were on different teams, they were both fairly visible players. While I don't know if we should expect two or three member teams, I think it's reasonable to expect that their scummates probably weren't quite as visible D1.

CF certainly, to an extent, fits that bill, so I would be willing to lynch him. I'm going to put together vote totals and post totals as well, and see if there were others flying under the radar.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Do we have a votecount? 
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jotheonah

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Vote Count 2.3

Captain_Frisk (3): Axxle, Grujah, ftl
Robz888 (1): Captain_Frisk

not voting ( 8 ): Galzria, Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, sparky5856, Morgrim7, angrybirds

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @5 p.m..

« Last Edit: August 28, 2012, 04:24:07 pm by jotheonah »
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1151 on: August 28, 2012, 06:20:24 pm »

so my galz vote isn't appreciated by others? i am going to join ehunt in his vote for frisk. vote: frisk he is lurkier than i am and i dont think robz's reaction warranted a vote, not to mention his morgrim RSV confusion. was it RSV or was it not?

Remember my suspicion of Frisk earlier? Because of that and more recent developments I will vote: frisk
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Grujah

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FoS: ftl for quoting without linking to the post, and only taken parts of posts that are unrecognizable by themselves, makes reading back so much harder.




(not really, just makes me frustrated!)
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Grujah

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Sparky too. Next one to do it gets a policy vote locked in.

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

Ugh. I don't like this post at all. It like calling people out for bloodshed.
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Axxle

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Sparky too. Next one to do it gets a policy vote locked in.

Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.

Ugh. I don't like this post at all. It like calling people out for bloodshed.

Pressure doesn't work if you say you're doing it.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1155 on: August 28, 2012, 07:06:42 pm »

There's something going on with Axxle, and I don't know what. Vote: Axxle I don't know the vote count but I'm pretty sure that's not L-2 or L-1 or anything yet.

Ugh. Terrible vote.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1156 on: August 28, 2012, 08:00:14 pm »

In mafia IV, O RVS'ed Dsell (his scummate) and then never mentioned him again.  In mafia IX, O RVS'ed CF and then never mentioned him again.  I think he might play similarly here.  I'll have to go reread CF's posts in this light but I'm very happy with my vote here.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1157 on: August 28, 2012, 08:07:22 pm »

In mafia IV, O RVS'ed Dsell (his scummate) and then never mentioned him again.  In mafia IX, O RVS'ed CF and then never mentioned him again.  I think he might play similarly here.  I'll have to go reread CF's posts in this light but I'm very happy with my vote here.

That's an interesting outlook, and fits with the narrative of CF playing the "quiet" scumbuddy in this game like was set up in similar fashion by O in M-IV as well. Hmm.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ftl

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FoS: ftl for quoting without linking to the post, and only taken parts of posts that are unrecognizable by themselves, makes reading back so much harder.




(not really, just makes me frustrated!)

Sorry about that. If I'm doing a reread of the whole thread, I'll usually click on the "Print" button and do "Ctrl-f" to find posts by specific people; but then that page doesn't have a quote button so I don't actually have the link.
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Axxle

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FoS: ftl for quoting without linking to the post, and only taken parts of posts that are unrecognizable by themselves, makes reading back so much harder.




(not really, just makes me frustrated!)

Sorry about that. If I'm doing a reread of the whole thread, I'll usually click on the "Print" button and do "Ctrl-f" to find posts by specific people; but then that page doesn't have a quote button so I don't actually have the link.

If you want to quote things use "All" if you want to quickly scan the thread use "Print".
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Grujah

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And its not like it's pages away, its on same page! (or few before). No need for All either.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1161 on: August 28, 2012, 08:44:18 pm »

Cults (?), Werewolves, Mafia, and Serial Killers?  This is going to be a fast game.
Intentional misdirection?

Absolutely silent on anything Insom, O, eHunt related.
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Galzria

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Morgrim is Morgrim. He has 40 posts. CF is not Morgrim. He has 42 posts.

Yes, ABirds and Sparky sneak under in the high 30's, but everybody else (including lurky Robz) comes in above 50.

CF keeps apologizing for his lurkiness, but I have NEVER seen him lurk this hardcore. And he's active elsewhere.

CF as a player is never a lynch I like because I enjoy his personality, but this just isn't the CF I know.

So I'll put #5 down. Vote: Captain_Frisk.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Captain_Frisk

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Hey guys - we're getting close here.  I really think you might be making a mistake here.

RobZ is where its at.
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Axxle

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Hey guys - we're getting close here.  I really think you might be making a mistake here.

RobZ is where its at.
Don't listen to the snake.
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Axxle

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RobZ is where its at.
What's the case for Robz?
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ftl

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Hey guys - we're getting close here.  I really think you might be making a mistake here.

RobZ is where its at.

I have no idea whether that's a townie softclaiming something or a scum trying to pretend to be a townie softclaiming something.  It doesn't make me any more likely to vote for someone other than C_F, though...

Maybe Robz is scum too, and maybe they're on opposite scumteams.
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Vote Count 2.4

Captain_Frisk (5): Axxle, Grujah, ftl, angrybirds, Galzria {L-2}
Robz888 (1): Captain_Frisk

not voting (6): Robz888, yuma, Voltgloss, Eevee, sparky5856, Morgrim7

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m.

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yuma

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Can someone outline the full case against C-Frisk...? lurkiness, day 1 suspicions and a mistake aren't enough for me. And remember morgrim hasn't voted yet--although he has shown signs of improvement--so we do need to consider him at L-1.
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Axxle

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Can someone outline the full case against C-Frisk...? lurkiness, day 1 suspicions and a mistake aren't enough for me. And remember morgrim hasn't voted yet--although he has shown signs of improvement--so we do need to consider him at L-1.
O's interactions with CF matches his MO when dealing with scummates.

lurking during the most critical time, when we are scrambling for someone to lynch at the end of the day, sets of huge red flags, especially after saying this:
What is wrong with this game?  We're 2 days to deadline, and we can't even get a candidate to 50% of the votes required to lynch?
He didn't think to come back and help?
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sparky5856

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FoS: ftl for quoting without linking to the post, and only taken parts of posts that are unrecognizable by themselves, makes reading back so much harder.

Sparky too. Next one to do it gets a policy vote locked in.

Well I'm sorry I haven't been playing properly. Did I do it correct for those quotes or am I still missing something? I'm only trying to help by bringing up evidence and I get yelled at for it.

You know what, VOTE: Captain_Frisk, I'm really not in the mood for anything right now. Let's ****ing go to bed.
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yuma

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Major FOS at sparky right now. Remember Morgrim? He is in this game and I for one am NOT done talking today. Someone unvote.
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sparky5856

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FINE, I'll UNVOTE, I'll let you all do your thing. I'm not in the mood to do anything tonight and I shouldn't vote just because I'm feeling terrible. Sorry for charging, but I'm really not feeling well.
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yuma

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So sparky's L2 to L1 vote got me interested in him. I decided to have a look and see what I could find out about him. I found that he was very silent on the topic of O. Now I haven't gone back to check myself on this very issue, but I don't remember being very vocal about O at all throughout the game, but then again I haven't been very vocal about everyone else in the way that sparky has been. His long posts eventually talk about everyone a lot more than O. And when he did talk about O, it had nothing important.  Here are the quotes:

I believe I was the first to mention that Robz was in a Catch-22.
Ah yes this is true. You were the first to comment on it, and shraeye specifically mentioned it as a Catch-22.

Gotta admit, I lol'ed at this. All this means, though, is a confirmation of eHunt's reliance on theory to find scum. And that O is being O it seems like. I only need to play ONE day to figure that one out.

--SNIP--

Now THIS is intriguing. eHunt UNVOTES from Frisk. This I can also perfectly understand given his situation. Frisk hasn't been the center of attention in the last few pages. So, let's refocus. He attacks Galzria for inconsistencies in his arguments. The O vote was an improper move though. I wouldn't have held him accountable for voting because of a (Hunting * Graham's Number) Morgrim debacle.

That was it for day 1... here is day 2 quotes
I was gonna go back and reanalyze O since he seemed so certain eHunt was scum, but now I don't have to apparently. He seems to have been a Major Arcana role too. But I can't find anywhere what his specific role means... or are we not supposed to know yet?

And in answer to Grujah's who to Night kill question he answered
6) O probably.

The only other time was this:

(one more werewolf maybe; three werewolves with O's power seems completely out of line, one to two more mafia maybe, and one SK), and with eight people besides me (eliminating Grujah, Eevee, Axxle, and myself (seriously voting myself does not sound like a good idea. if I do vote myself it's all for fun  ;D )) that's like a 50/50 shot of hitting scum.

In summary, sparky has long posts about everyone and everything... sure he doesn't post often, but when he does they are huge. But they are devoid of anything really about O. They don't analyze him. They don't question him. They briefly glaze over or completely ignore him.

And then after he is dead, sparky announces he is suspicious of him and would have killed him.
Perfect timing. He says he is in a bad mood right now. I wonder what vote: sparky would do?
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Eevee

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Y'know what this game needs?  More votes.

They'll give us something more concrete to discuss.
And they'll put pressure on people to MAKE them discuss.

So I call on everyone who hasn't voted yet to cast a vote in their next post.  And everyone who HAS voted to either affirmatively confirm their current vote or cast a new vote. 

I'll start.

Vote: Robz888

The man said himself he's been skating by.  Let's see what happens when the ice starts to thin.
I on the other hand do like this post. We need votes to have things to analyze.

Case on Frisk is not bad I think, but not slamdunk-excellent either. yuma's case on sparky is really interesting, but it's good to remember we have a lot of players, so not talking much about one of them is less of a tell than it would be in a smaller game. I'm undecided whether I want to have my vote on Frisk or sparky at this point. For now, I'll join Vote: sparky to prod him into responding to get more info (also because I don't want to see Frisk hammered just yet even if I decide on him eventually).
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Eevee

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OH and I got to say, sparky getting angry and using that as an excuse to put Frisk L-1 was definitely at least as scummy as Frisk's mistake with me earlier.
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cayvie

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Vote Count 2.4

Captain_Frisk (5): Axxle, Grujah, ftl, angrybirds, Galzria
Robz888 (1): Captain_Frisk
sparky5856 (2): yuma, Eevee

not voting (4): Robz888, Voltgloss, Morgrim7, sparky5856

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @5 p.m.

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sparky5856

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I'll wait until I'm fully rested to give a proper response. I do know that I owe you guys an apology. Anyone that was wondering if I pretended to get mad for strategic purposes btw is wrong, I seriously got mad, purposes unrelated to this game. In doing that however, I have broken the Golden Rule and quite frankly I'm surprised I haven't been banned from the forum. And for doing that, I need to say that I'm sorry, to everyone. I nearly ended the day on my stunt for no reason. That is not cool at all, no matter what alignment I am or could possibly be.
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Grujah

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FoS: ftl for quoting without linking to the post, and only taken parts of posts that are unrecognizable by themselves, makes reading back so much harder.

Sparky too. Next one to do it gets a policy vote locked in.

Well I'm sorry I haven't been playing properly. Did I do it correct for those quotes or am I still missing something? I'm only trying to help by bringing up evidence and I get yelled at for it.

You know what, VOTE: Captain_Frisk, I'm really not in the mood for anything right now. Let's ****ing go to bed.

Yeah, those are correct. Don't just write [ quote] [ /quote], click on the pos to get [ quote author=sblah blah] thing.
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angrybirds

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I seriously got mad, purposes unrelated to this game.
That is not cool at all, no matter what alignment I am or could possibly be.

i for one forgive you, hey life happens, hope you are able to resolve whatever in your life is upsetting you. i know that the people here are for the most part only virtual acquaintances, but if you are desperate for someone to lend an ear or an eye i would guess that people in this game would be willing to help out if there is someway we can. i know i would


in the game, i'll keep my vote on frisk for now
anyone else interested in what voltgloss to say about all of this? he has been surpisingly missing from nearly all of day 2.
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Captain_Frisk

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I'll put some stuff together on RobZ today - but if my primary crime is lurking - then RobZ is right there with me.

What is the golden rule that sparky broke that should result in banning from forum?  Did he edit his post within the X second window that doesn't flag it as an edit?

I mean - if scummy voting was a crime, then I don't think any of us would be allowed to play, and theory would have banned Morgrim from the entire forum.
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Eevee

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The Golden Rule:
Please remember that this is a game and your main objective is to have fun! Be considerate of each other, don’t get personal, and enjoy the game.
And no worries sparky, I'm sure no one had their fun ruined because your post! It's all good.
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Morgrim7

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Not safe to vote for frisk…unless you wanna lynch him?
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I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Captain_Frisk

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The Golden Rule:
Please remember that this is a game and your main objective is to have fun! Be considerate of each other, don’t get personal, and enjoy the game.
And no worries sparky, I'm sure no one had their fun ruined because your post! It's all good.

Oh - you can't get banned for that!
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Captain_Frisk

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Not safe to vote for frisk…unless you wanna lynch him?

Well - i suppose its safe to vote for me if you are you - because nobody else would be crazy enough to quick hammer me.  I just intimated a while back that lynching me would be a bad idea.  Maybe you really want to force me explain why that would be.

The case against me is (i think): Lurking + snark @ eevee.  Is that compelling enough for a lynch for you?
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Grujah

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Unvote

Won't gonna lynch until I reread day 1.
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Eevee

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Not safe to vote for frisk…unless you wanna lynch him?

Well - i suppose its safe to vote for me if you are you - because nobody else would be crazy enough to quick hammer me.  I just intimated a while back that lynching me would be a bad idea.  Maybe you really want to force me explain why that would be.

The case against me is (i think): Lurking + snark @ eevee.  Is that compelling enough for a lynch for you?
Good thing is you claimed you are only possibly town:
Hey guys - we're getting close here.  I really think you might be making a mistake here.
When will you know, so we can decide accordingly?
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Grujah

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Frisk, can you tell me who's your

a) number #1 suspect general
b) number #1 suspect from people on your wagon

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Voltgloss

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anyone else interested in what voltgloss to say about all of this? he has been surpisingly missing from nearly all of day 2.

Been trying to get my thoughts together re: yuma.  I personally find him to be a tricky one to read.  Also took a bit longer to compile my post as I strove to include all quotes.  But I do plan to have that up today (by early afternoon hopefully). 

I don't take much from sparky's outburst.  It reads to me as genuine - that something frustrating in RL spilled over into the forum.  That could happen just as easily whether he's scum or town.  (And I think the "Golden Rule" he mentions is the "have fun, be civil, it's just a game" admonition in the intro post of each one of these games.)  That doesn't mean sparky should get a pass though, and I agree with yuma's doing a reread of his Day 1 behavior.  I'll be doing the same myself.

I am interested to see CF's case on Robz.  From my re-read of both of them Day 1 (which happened to take place back-to-back), I didn't find Robz to be lurking nearly as hardcore as CF (at least from mid-day onward). 
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Grujah

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Also, what do you people thing about ab/Robz fight on pages 11/12?
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Captain_Frisk

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My general reads were in post 1142 - although re-reading them they were pretty damn useless.

a. #1 in general: RobZ
b. On my wagon FTL: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=JEEP's_Tells_for_Finding_Mafia - Wishywashing voting, voting in 3rd position.
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Grujah

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b. On my wagon FTL: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=JEEP's_Tells_for_Finding_Mafia - Wishywashing voting, voting in 3rd position.

We agree on something, at least.

And he has done it before, once on Robz, when he joined a wagon (page 12), and once before that, where he voted and than unvoted cuz he didn't want to be in a bad place in a wagon, or something like that.
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Captain_Frisk

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b. On my wagon FTL: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=JEEP's_Tells_for_Finding_Mafia - Wishywashing voting, voting in 3rd position.

We agree on something, at least.

And he has done it before, once on Robz, when he joined a wagon (page 12), and once before that, where he voted and than unvoted cuz he didn't want to be in a bad place in a wagon, or something like that.

Well - you and Axxle are now obvtown... so in addition to the "tells" that cuts us down to 3 possible suspects.  I'm neutralish on angry birds.  As for Galz, well I have been lurking, we do have to move forward, and with 2 scum dead - we're not in that bad of a position.  I can see myself putting a vote on him in a similar situation.  In fact - I was convinced he was scum in M7 for not being as active as he had been in previous games.
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Grujah

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Vote: ftl

He seemed wagon friendly from start. Wasn't on ehunt, though.

Angry seems strangely level-headedly confident, prob town.
Volt, Galz, and to a lesser Degree Robz seem townish.
Sparky I am not sure of. Yuma too. So, both kinda scummish. Sparky a bit more scummish.
Frisk as-is, in the same league.


Really got no strong reads this game. :/
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Grujah

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And I completely forgot about Morg. God, who knows.


As for Frisky, I wouldn't oppose his lynch, and I actually have an semi-useful if we decide to go on with it.


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Galzria

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And I completely forgot about Morg. God, who knows.


As for Frisky, I wouldn't oppose his lynch, and I actually have an semi-useful if we decide to go on with it.

Erm, your last sentence wasn't composed quite right. Not sure what you're trying to get across there.

As for the switch overall... Well, there are two scumteams, and while I can't exactly suggest to seeing multiple scum at this time...

I'm not sure. I don't put much credit in "position" tells because I can link you articles that say it's #3, #4, or #5, and oh yeah, watch out for scum starting wagons at #1 or #2, but be wary of the hammer and hammer -1 votes too!

It's just, I think a better question to ask there is: Where and when would scum ftl get aboard a wagon? He was my scumbuddy in BMMM, but I'm drawing blanks on him being scum in a regular, "balanced" game of Mafia, so I'm not sure what his meta is.

On that note though, what's CF's scum meta? I tend to discount M-VI since it's pretty terrible as a teaching guide given it's imbalance and the scum teams blowing eachother up - So has he ever been scum outside that?

Both ftl and CF are probably good enough players to not crack under any pressure, and both are probably good enough to spin a web of lies and misdirections. I don't particularly see CF's "mistake" as a scumtell - although it isn't a towntell either. It's something I think he would do under either alignment. I don't really think that anybody from the list of "non-confirmed town" are weak players, and I don't think any of them will likely "slip".

Unfortunately for CF then (and I don't know about ftl), I'm left to look at the scumteam meta of O and Insomniac.

In M-V, O played very vocally and forward, getting into a spat with Robz and Zxcvbn2 (eHunt). His partner, Yuma, played very quiet and reserved. Popping in to offer little tidbits here and there, but largely staying away. The two of them had little interaction.

In M-IV, O played very vocally and forward, getting himself lynched D2. One of his partners, Glooble, said extremely little all game, popping in every now and then to offer tidbits here and there, but largely staying away. The two of them had little interaction.

Here, O played a rather vocal and forward game. His downfall was in a setup this large and multiple ways to be killed, he made himself a nice pretty target. The case on CF then isn't entirely based on CF's own meta, but rather how he fits the bill in many ways of an O scummate. Quiet, popping in only every so often, not offering anything substantial and having little to no interaction with O.

He's certainly not the ONLY player to behave this way re: O, but from the perspective of the CF that I know and have played with as TOWN CF, this doesn't match his town meta.

So I think my vote will stay here, unless there is credible, compelling evidence that it should not be.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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As for Frisky, I wouldn't oppose his lynch, and I actually have an semi-useful idea if we decide to go on with it.

Forgot a word there.
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Voltgloss

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On that note though, what's CF's scum meta? I tend to discount M-VI since it's pretty terrible as a teaching guide given it's imbalance and the scum teams blowing eachother up - So has he ever been scum outside that?

He was SK in M-IV.  Without the benefit of any sort of exhaustive reread of M-IV, I don't think his play there matches his play here (for one thing, I recall him being significantly more active in M-IV).  So I would be surprised to see CF flip SK... but I understand the O-scummeta arguments as to why CF could very well flip WW.
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Voltgloss

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...reading from the beginning, Part II...

Here we go.  Next down the line:  yuma.  And as there is interest in having all referenced posts quoted in their entirety, I have done that here, as an addendum at the bottom of my post.  Feel free to ignore that addendum if you just want the analysis;  it simply gathers together in one place each of yuma's posts I mention below.

My impressions/thoughts in response to the posts of yuma's that stood out on reread:

- #154, defends Insom against shraeye's vote
- #165 and #181 and #192 and #219, calls out Morgrim for Morgrimity
- #184, pressing shark_bait/Grujah
- #228, #232, #234, #254, more Morgrim
- #240, FOS's ftl for... not quite sure but I think for miscounting the votes on Robz
- #260, maintains vote on shark_bait/Grujah to get him to post
- #286, unvotes in response to shark_bait's needing to replace out; doesn't like Axxle or Robz wagons; votes shraeye, taking long posts as covering up scumminess
- #314, responds to my question comparing shraeye and sparky
- #327, further defends/supports vote on shraeye; notes shraeye's vote on Insom was suspicious
- #416, repeats previous positions - dislikes Axxle/Robz wagons; keeps vote on shraeye
- #542, reads Abirds as newbie town
- #547, summarizes thoughts on everyone:  less suspicion of shraeye b/c shraeye did not change behavior in face of suspicion AND because "his posts have a lot more content that I see as useful for town", supports ftl pressuring Grujah, says Robz's behavior was not suspicious, votes ehunt in agreement with Eevee - "My wife has dinner on the table, so I have to vote: ehunt and get back to this in my next post. I promise I will", says about O "I forget he is playing sometimes"
- #660, back to shraeye - "Are you scum or just dumb?" unvotes ehunt in face of claim; votes Insomniac
- #672, comments Axxle claim is weird but says we shouldn't lynch him Day 1
- #711, votes ehunt in response to Insom's claim - no commentary, just the vote
- #742, says if ehunt is mafia he will suspect shraeye Day 2
- #847, argues against shraeye's linking yuma and Eevee as scumbuddies
- #898, says Eevee reads "slight scummy (just off pure off the head feelings)"

What does this show?  Well, it shows that yuma, not happy with either of the Robz or Axxle wagons, focused on a third option: shraeye.  Who has since been revealed town anyway, but by the Mafia's nightkill.  Would Mafia-yuma focus so much attention on a target during the day and then kill that same target at night?  There's WIFOM involved here but I have to think the answer is more likely to be "no."  It deprives him of a main argument to use going into Day 2 - and it doesn't help "clear" him as scum; he could just as easily be on another scumteam.  Furthermore, if yuma were Mafia, he had an excellent and reasonable opportunity to NOT vote for his scumbuddy Insom at post #660 - he could have voted shraeye instead.  But he voted Insom.  Based on these facts, I am disinclined to believe a yuma-as-Mafia theory. 

What about yuma-as-WW?  First, the O-scummeta question:  I saw yuma reference O exactly once, in #547, to say "I forget he is playing sometimes."  O responded immediately with incredulity (#548): 

I'm not sure why everyone keeps forgetting I'm playing. I don't feel as if I've been lurking.

Now, yuma had more activity than CF, so it's possible I missed something (and if I did someone please correct me) - but based solely on the "people ignoring/not interacting with O" rubric, yuma could certainly be his scummate.  O's calling immediate attention to yuma's forgetting about him fits right in line with O's rather brazen play.

There's also the fact that yuma votes ehunt in #547 without explanation, saying only he agrees with Eevee and promises to get back to this later... but never does.  And Eevee's rationale for voting ehunt at the time (#541) was simply that ehunt is playing different from town-ehunt in MVI and asks why he isn't being questioned more.  That's certainly an understandable reason for putting early votes on someone... but is that enough reason to add your vote to an actual lynch?  Note that when yuma revotes ehunt (after the competing doctor claims) he does so with no analysis.  And his only detailed analysis after that involves shraeye (again), not ehunt.

I guess my difficulty with Day 1 yuma is that I am looking for his rationale for having been a part of ehunt's lynch - O's ultimate lynch-choice - and I'm not finding it.

Is yuma more suspicious than CF?  Going just by Day 1, I'd say it's close - but if you held a gun to my head at the end of Day 1 and demanded I pick one to lynch, it would have been CF for the tremendous lurking.  (Coupled incidentally with CF being active in other threads around that same time - I find his "goko made me lurk" excuse a bit weak.)  In order to judge between them now, I will have to review their Day 2 actions.

Next post will analyze Day 1 behavior by ftl, Galz, and (if time permits) angrybirds.  Post after that:  sparky and (shudder) Morgrim.  Final post will add in Day 2 behavior through the lens of the Day 1 reread, and present my vote.

---

Addendum

Referenced yuma posts:

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac

You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.

Ok, thats enough to convince me. Vote: Insomniac

Why do you never have unique information to add to a game? Why why why?

Ok, thats enough to convince me. Vote: Insomniac

Why do you never have unique information to add to a game? Why why why?
Morgrim I want a response to this.

I would like to say that I plan on doing upping my game.  After poor showings in BMMMMM1 and RMM1 and my recent death in BMIV, I'm done with that style of mafia.  The new and improved shark_bait is here.  And yes ehunt, I am already starting to get quite aware of some players' idiosyncrasies.  Hopefully that will help me in this game.

So by upping your game do you mean to continue to be lurky and not post?

Yes I am pressing you again (you think I would have learned my lesson when you ended up being cop in BMM1), but I guess I haven't. But then again, neither have you!

Ok, thats enough to convince me. Vote: Insomniac

Why do you never have unique information to add to a game? Why why why?
Morgrim I want a response to this.

Morgrim! You are online now and you were earlier after I posted this. Do you have a mod-restriction that doesnt' allow you to answer my questions?

Please answer

Hi.

I am waiting to hear more from sharkbait before I do much else.

And morgrim... That wasn't what I was looking for. I am asking why you don't contribute. Do you have so little faith in your own reads on people that you can only piggyback on the reads of others. I really want to hear more. If you agree with someone tell us why you agree before voting. If you think someone is mafia tell us why before voting. This game thrives in content and context. You provide neither.

I am not posting this as demands to change or else I will vote. Instead I am asking if you can post more to lessen the confusion you add to the game and instead shed some light into it

Let's not talk about Morgrim.

Ok, I am done, but I would like him to respond more... That is it, I won't mention him again all game unless I actually find him scummy.

I can't talk about myself.  :(

Ever? or now? Because your voting w/o explanation isn't new in this game. So if it is a restriciton, it is an aptly applied restriction that merely reflects your previous play styles. (if true, nice one cayvie)

...dammit.

how I feel... now I am really, seriously done here.

sorry I haven't posted much

GOKO f5 took over my entire day today
you've posted more than some.  a lot more than some.
We're not supposed to talk about me.

AAAAAARRRRRGGGGGGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!


Galzria (4): O, angrybirds, Axxle, ftl


From last vote count; I dont' think angrybirds has unvoted since then. FOS:FTL (first time ever using that)

I will keep mine on sharkbait for basically the same reason

I have to profusely apologize.  My laptop died on me this morning (I'm posting from a friend's computer).  So either I need a replacement for me or I need to be removed.  I don't know how soon I'll be able to get it fixed/get a new one so it does not make sense for me to stay in this game.

I guess I should unvote. it is hard to read and then vote for someone that isn't in the game anymore...

I don't like either the Axxle wagon or the Robz wagon that is building. I don't think a-birds fully addressed Robz, and Robz is trying to further elicit a response.

As for Axxle he doesn't seem scummy, he seems ?distracted? that doesn't scream mafia to me.

The person who does seem most mafia to me is actually the complete opposite of my previous post, and disagrees with a couple other townspeople.

vote: shraeye

With all of the voting toward lurkers--both in this game and in others--it seem to me that mafia members would be very aware of not lurking. shraeye seems to have an astute enough mind to recognize this and is doing everything to make sure (she/he?) isn't put into the lurker category. I don't buy all of the long, long posts as evidence of town, but perhaps instead is evidence of covering up being mafia.

But Volt wanted votes, so there is mine

This is an interesting take, yuma.  My question for you:  Why is shraeye more suspicious to you than sparky?  I have gotten a similar vibe from both shraeye and sparky so far this game - both new players, both verbose - and I have the sense that both of them fit the characterization you've described.  So I am curious to hear why your vote went to shraeye and not sparky.
Good question

I'm pretty sure I talked about werewolves and the sk in an earlier post. I do think saying mafia when I mean scum is a bad habit, I'll try to fix it.
But also this answer sits with me better than Axxle's dismiss-it-out-of-hand style.  I'm getting a good pro-town vibe from you.  You know who I'm not getting pro-town vibes from at all? Insomniac.

Vote: Insomniac

You want to list any specific examples or quotes to back up your vote?

Or are you simply voting because he isn't "pro-town" instead of voting for "scummy-behavior"?

Because to me there is very little that is more confusing than trying to describe what pro-town is and match it up to real townies.

He's already expressed his disagreement with one of Insomniac's posts.


There was this ^earlier... although sparky did show that shraeye had disagreed with insomniac in the past.

Furthermore, shraeye has been much more active--with much longer posts that were long, but lacked a lot of content--where as sparky's posts have been less active, with some long posts, but not nearly as long or as many. Sparky seems more real, shraeye seems more forced.

@shraeye/sparky
Quoting makes posts messy so I am not going to quote your quotes of my quotes, etc....

In answering Volt's question, I pointed out that I found shraeye's vote of Insomniac--the style of it--the way he said (not exact quotes) "who know who I do find scummy??? Insomniac" w/o providing explanation there and then for why you did." I quoted sparky to say that while he pointed out that shraeye had in fact shown some disagreement prior to your vote, it wasn't enough to resolve my suspicion of you.

As for content:

you have had a couple of ginormous posts, these are mainly the ones I am referring to,

#248 is large, but at the end of it I am thinking so what?
1. you talk about insomniac with "probaby" "golly, gee whiz" "I'm paranoid of everbody"

2. then you start talking about ftl... I don't know what you have to say about ftl, lots of words, and I am left with "what?" you then move onto ehunt and galz (again what are you trying to say, other than put down words"

3. you talk about scumhunting and conclude with "those guys are my town reads, or will be, or mightnot if i can't tell whose sufficiently scared." they are your town reads? or they will be? or they won't be? Why even write this if you are so unsure?

4. then you talk about yourself and sparky in relation to voltgloss's vote about suitclaiming? and again conclude with "this is what I think, but then again, maybe it isn't"

5. then you say sparky and axxle are your main suspects... but don't hold me accountable because I am tired.


post #265 is better, I like the highlights because they help me understand what you think is important, but still lacking in the so what department

1. insomniac is clear for me, except he isn't

2. you don't like people voting for ftl !yea, content!

3. more content, yea! but you say something yourself about axxle that I will hold you up to "Maximum vagueness=maximum future flexibility"

4. you talk about your own conflicts regarding sparky 

so just from these two posts it seems that you do have content--as anyone playing this game should--but it is spread so thin that it is hard to take anything away from it.

vote: shraeye

With all of the voting toward lurkers--both in this game and in others--it seem to me that mafia members would be very aware of not lurking. shraeye seems to have an astute enough mind to recognize this and is doing everything to make sure (she/he?) isn't put into the lurker category. I don't buy all of the long, long posts as evidence of town, but perhaps instead is evidence of covering up being mafia.


The above quote is why I voted for you.

You seem to be trying very hard to make sure that you are visible, that you are playing, but not leading or exciting anybody, long and frequent posts with minimal content accomplish this.

Back:

I don't agree with the Axxle wagon, nor do I like the Robz wagon that was forming.

I am still getting the same read from shraeye, but it appears that no one agrees with me... voltgloss mentioned getting a similar vibe a while back but I don't think I have seen anything else since then... added to that is shraeye's vote for Axxle.

As such, I am keeping my vote on shraeye, but could be persuaded to vote elsewhere, but unless something drastic changes, not for Axxle or Robz. I just dont' see the scumminess that everyone else is so sure about.

Yuma, angrybirds:  You guys barely have mentioned each other. Reads?

i need to do a comprehensive list or reads on everyone, but for now I'll answer that I think he is newb townie.

In same order as Morgrim:

Insomniac: I'll have a better idea once he votes... and an even better idea if he continues to not vote.

Voltgloss: On the Axxle wagon which I didn't agree with. But Axxle's softclaim complicates matters. I wouldn't want to lynch Axxle today, but he is becoming more lynchable. But this is supposed to be about Voltgloss...

Frisk: I know how it feels to want to vote Morgrim, so I don't feel the irk there.

Grujah: I don't care that he doesn't want to read the previous 20 pages. No big deal for me. Waiting to see more from him.

Robz: His reaction to angrybirds to me was completely justified and normal. His reaction to people reacting to him was him showing frustration in a frustrating situation. He could be mafia, but I wouldn't lynch him just because of that. If anything I see it as more evidence of town and would alleviate anything else suspicious that he might do.

O: I forget he is playing sometimes

ftl: Want him to keep the pressure on Grujah so we can see what we can get out of it.

Galz: Not the galz I remember from Mafia III. Like Voltgloss is on the Axxle wagon. What do you think Galz of people abandoning that wagon? When will you?

shraeye: I am much less suspicious of shraeye. First: he has continued with long posts. My suspicions of him did not change his behavior, I would expect that if he were mafia to change behavior but he has been consistent throughout, except that 2. his posts have a lot more content that I see as useful for town. Could still be mafia? Yes. But more important he isn't getting lynched today.

angrybirds: O Brother Where Art Thou? I disagree with shraeye about him, but maybe that is because I personally know him. He is playing just like his personality and in my opinion as a newbie town.

sparky: not a huge read on. Wish I had more to say here... maybe later

Morgrim7: You are doing it! You are adding content to the game. I knew you could do it!

Axxle: Softclaim was interesting and actually made him more suspicious in my eyes, but I still don't think we should vote for him.

ehunt: I agree with Eevee a lot here. My wife has dinner on the table, so I have to vote: ehunt and get back to this in my next post. I promise I will

Shraeye... Really seeing scum pairs day 1? Are you scum or just dumb? Mistakes aren't scum reads, saying that they are? Well maybe...

And with the ehunt claim, which I am not too happy about-although not all of uscan be tinas-I will unvote him.

I said before that my read on insomniac was dependent on his voting. Immediately after that he voted for angrybirds-this isn't me being a protective big brother-that vote looked too covienent and as abirds noted contradicted i's previous read. Fir that I will move to vote: insomniac

My axxle thoughts. First I did not find him scummy before his claim 2. His claim was weird and I'll timed. 3. I don't think we should give him a free pass on it this game 4. But I don't think we should day 1 lynch him. Let's get through tonight see what night actions occur and then progress from there with him high on the potential to day 2 lynch list

vote: ehunt

If ehunt is mafia. My day 2 suspicion will be on shraeye for trying to get us to focus away from the two wagons and for all the reasons I was suspicious of him earlier in the day.

Oh and abirds started school yesterday, that might be why he is pulling a disappearing act.

shraeye, there is a huge difference between what I said: that if ehunt flips, the suspicion should be on you

and what you said: yuma forgot to post his thoughts on eevee, therefore they must be scum buddies.

Mine has a clause attached to it, as well as a call for more thorough investigation.

You just called me out and attached meaning to nothing.

And I agree with O. Am I a suspicious townie that should be lynched? Do you want to lynch townies?

shraeye... I haven't been online long enough to go back and take a long hard look at eevee like I would like... so for now I will say that he reads slight scummy (just off pure off the head feelings) but you will have to wait for a more in depth look til tomorrow.
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Captain_Frisk

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@Volt - regarding my lurk:

My big lurk comes at the end of the day.

My last post is #601 8/21 @ 10:09 pm
The day ends @ #948 8/23 @ 12:13 am

So I've effectively lurked all of 8/22.

It appears that I posted 29 times.  I was active in Role Madness 1 - which was at a critical time and I was a critical role.

I posted 1 real post in MX - which was clearly a catchup up post @ nearly 6p- which puts it around post #750.  At this point - I'm 150 posts behind and going into evening time.  The 22nd was a lawn mowing day - so i was off for a few hours - looks like I posted a couple of quickies around 7:50 - probably during bathtime - not an appropriate time to catch up on pages and pages of forum mafia - I don't mega post from the ipad typically.

Deadline isn't until 3pm the next day - and I'm voting for RobZ.

The accusations of me lurking make it look like I ignored this thread for an extended period of time.  In reality - it was more like 1 day when other stuff was going on.  It's not that crazy.

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I support funsockets.... taking as much time as they need to get it right.

Morgrim7

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Sorry guys, I didn't have time to get on yesterday. Except to quickpost something.
@Frisk: Well, we don't really have much of a target for lynch, and that is not all that good, correct? We have to lynch someone, correct? And somebody who makes a scumslip, lurks, and is snarky to Eevee, well, yeah.
why don't you claim? Please answer these questions everybody:
1. Would you support a Captain_Frisk lynch?
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target?
3. What are your thoughts on Robz?
4. What are your thoughts on me?

And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Galzria

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Sorry guys, I didn't have time to get on yesterday. Except to quickpost something.
@Frisk: Well, we don't really have much of a target for lynch, and that is not all that good, correct? We have to lynch someone, correct? And somebody who makes a scumslip, lurks, and is snarky to Eevee, well, yeah.
why don't you claim? Please answer these questions everybody:
1. Would you support a Captain_Frisk lynch?
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target?
3. What are your thoughts on Robz?
4. What are your thoughts on me?

And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)

1. Yes, I'm voting for him. ;D
2. Follow the confirmed town? I don't know. I would consider the case on ftl more closely, but I don't have a strong second. Maybe Morgrim.
3. Robz hasn't stood out to me, but then, he's one of the "lurkers" who don't usually lurk through games. So it's hard to me to pin him. Is he doing it for scummy reasons? Or PR reasons? Or just because he's busy? I don't know. This is our second dual-scum game, and some of these people were scum that blasted each other in the first go. So maybe they're trying to change things up and not shoot themselves in the foot? Anyway, distracted. No strong read here.
4. He's... different. And I wouldn't mind seeing him killed at night. I don't know if I could really get behind a lynch here because he APPEARS to be wanting to help town. But I've never seen a scum Morgrim play, so he's dangerous when unquantified.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Morgrim7

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two more:
5. Why does everyone suspect me for playing normal?
6. If you don't like it, would you rather me go back to being crazy?
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Galzria

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two more:
5. Why does everyone suspect me for playing normal?
6. If you don't like it, would you rather me go back to being crazy?

5. I suspect anything that isn't meta.
6. No, I would love for this to be a new meta town Morgrim. It's just the first time seeing it, so by default I HAVE to suspect it.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Morgrim7

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two more:
5. Why does everyone suspect me for playing normal?
6. If you don't like it, would you rather me go back to being crazy?

5. I suspect anything that isn't meta.
6. No, I would love for this to be a new meta town Morgrim. It's just the first time seeing it, so by default I HAVE to suspect it.
understandable.



*sigh*
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Axxle

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Sorry guys, I didn't have time to get on yesterday. Except to quickpost something.
@Frisk: Well, we don't really have much of a target for lynch, and that is not all that good, correct? We have to lynch someone, correct? And somebody who makes a scumslip, lurks, and is snarky to Eevee, well, yeah.
why don't you claim? Please answer these questions everybody:
1. Would you support a Captain_Frisk lynch?
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target?
3. What are your thoughts on Robz?
4. What are your thoughts on me?

And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)
1. Yes.
2. Probably sparky.
3. Hes a pure lurker.  No read on him.  There are different types of lurkers, the scummiest being "active lurker" but Robz is just a not-posting lurker.  I'll have to poke him later to get some kind of response, but thats not today.
4. If you were anyone else I'd have a good town read on you, but you not being classic Morgrim puts me a bit on edge.

two more:
5. Why does everyone suspect me for playing normal?
6. If you don't like it, would you rather me go back to being crazy?
5. Because it's not normal for *you*.
6. I like it, it just makes me wary.  I really hope you're town though, because if you flip scum I'd be so confused in later games on how I want you to behave.
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Grujah

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1. Yes
2. Ftl
3. I think when they called him out on voting only cuz Volt said so, they were right. When they called him on "jumpy" thing, it was an overblown thing. Kinda townish, but than again.. I wouldn't be sad to see him go, could be talked into a lynch.
4. You are different than before and as always unreadable. Trying to help instead of just sheeping reads and hammering is much more pro-town, which is good.
5. Cuz we expect different Morgrim and came out surprised. Surprise leads to suspicion.
6. No, this Morgrim is an awesome Morgrim.
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Grujah

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2. Probably sparky.

I'm drawing blank on sparky, any opinions on him are welcomed.
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Galzria

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2. Probably sparky.

I'm drawing blank on sparky, any opinions on him are welcomed.

Yuma put together this post on him, but I haven't seen anything substantial one way or another:

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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Morgrim7

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1) Yes
2) so few options...ftl maybe. would like to see suspicions on sparky.
3) lurking. heavily. ugh
4) I would be thinking I was abnormal, maybe even suspicious, for being so pro-town.
5) ...
6) ...
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Morgrim7

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2. Probably sparky.

I'm drawing blank on sparky, any opinions on him are welcomed.

Yuma put together this post on him, but I haven't seen anything substantial one way or another:

Thats...pretty heavy. I would support a sparky lynch.
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Grujah

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And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)

About this.

I think forced claims are bad. He should claim in case he thinks its better for town to claim, goes for anyone.
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Morgrim7

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And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)

About this.

I think forced claims are bad. He should claim in case he thinks its better for town to claim, goes for anyone.
right. C_F, scratch that
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1213 on: August 29, 2012, 07:04:47 pm »

Here's my thoughts on Insomniac: his posts seem poorly constructed, as noticed by a few other people. Notice how he doesn't say what KIND of doctor he is, mafia or town. eHunt already claims to be town doctor. What other doctors are there!? So now, this can only mean one thing. It's either Insomniac or eHunt who's scum. They can't both be the town doctor. And in the second quote... maybe he hasn't forgotten the possibility of mafia doctors, because he knows there is one? I'm solid in my position that eHunt is innocent.

But wait. What the heck is a ninja doctor? I read on Mafia Scum that he's anti-town. Someone want to clarify on this position? It doesn't make sense. Insomniac's claiming of ninja doctor sounds desperate, like "oops I shouldn't have done that". And wasn't he against suit-claiming in the first place?


Seems scummy too.


Also, distancing is a big scumtell.
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Grujah

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I could see my vote changing.

And I completely missed the whole D2 sparky shenanigans, cuz I though it will be over his RL things.. blah.

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Grujah

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Also, Ins was #1 for suit-claiming, how was he against it. Heck, there was a case against him for wanting to suitclaim, than saying he said only some people should claim and so on, maybe even sparky lead that case. Lemme check.
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Robz888

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Sorry for lurking, nothing much to add to the discussion at present. Frisk and ftl are acceptable lynches to me.

If everyone would stop changing their avatars all the time, that would be helpful...
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Grujah

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You're just jealous for not playing CE.
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angrybirds

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i am getting annoyed with all of these survey questionnaires they seem to easy to put together and aren't really effective at singling out a player and putting pressure on them. they seem like a cop out--grujah's i now understand as it was used to get us to help him decide who to reveal...

1 - already voting for
2 - ftl
3 - still suspicious of but i have a hard time being suspicious of people for "lurking" what is lurking? Am I lurky because I only get on a few times a day?
4 - you are townie i suppose
5 - i have never seen you play before fully, so i dont' know if you are
6 - i would like to see you more active but others probably want the same out of me
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Grujah

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A thing.


There is a role called Vengeful townie.
Cayvie won't be specific of what it does, but mainly, when he dies, he shoot somebody. Now, can he choose or can he only kill the hammerer?
In original "Great Idea Mafia" there is no vengeful townie, but there is a Super Saint, which is Vengeful Townie that can only kill it's hammerer.

My idea is that, if it is possible, when we decide on lynch, get a scummy player to hammer, just in case.


(Vengeful Lover I don't know what he does. Maybe kills whomever kill his lover or soemthing).
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Grujah

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Also I don't know how Mafia Godfather would show up upon High Priestess powers, but I think they are beyond investigation-immunity, cuz it's not an investirole but ask any possible question role.
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Captain_Frisk

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iPad lurking. Full response to new morgrims survey later, but I think the answers are obvious given my previous posts.
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ftl

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Same, I think my answers to mogrim's questionnaire is obvious too, but might as well respond anyway:

Sorry guys, I didn't have time to get on yesterday. Except to quickpost something.
@Frisk: Well, we don't really have much of a target for lynch, and that is not all that good, correct? We have to lynch someone, correct? And somebody who makes a scumslip, lurks, and is snarky to Eevee, well, yeah.
why don't you claim? Please answer these questions everybody:
1. Would you support a Captain_Frisk lynch?

Am voting for it right now, so yes. C_F has hinted that town would hate this, but, well, he might be scum just saying that.

Quote
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target?

Robz maybe. Sparky maybe.

I suppose I'm probably going to just be lazy and sheep the obvtown, in the end. I've been sort of busy lately and have not been giving these games my due diligence.

And wow, a lot of people put me second. Sadface. Can't blame 'em, I suppose, I'm among the not-confirmed-town group and have been sort of not contributing much lately.

Quote
3. What are your thoughts on Robz?

There aren't so many people on the list of people to lynch, I wouldn't object to a robz lynch. Not like obvscum or anything, not changing my vote to him, but I wouldn't be a defender of his.

Quote
4. What are your thoughts on me?

Same as they were yesterday. Playing townish, but differently than all those other times that you were town. Maybe seeming a bit scummier now because you keep asking what people think of you.

Quote
And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)

Ooh! Ooh! I can answer this one! C_F is a ...wait I don't know. Nevermind. <-- was joke, plz don't lynch me for it.

two more:
5. Why does everyone suspect me for playing normal?

Because all those times that you played crazy, you turned out town. So now you're playing differently, so there's a cognitive dissonance there for us - on one hand, "playing differently than all those times you were town" is definitely a scumtell, on the other hand "playing less scummy than usual" is a strange reason to lynch someone. Hence, all of us sort of looking at you warily.

Quote
6. If you don't like it, would you rather me go back to being crazy?

Nope. There's no way to change your meta from one playstyle to another without going through a game where everyone suspects you because you're playing differently, and at the end of the game being like "see, I played like this and I was town" and then you can play either way and people won't suspect you for it. If you want to change your meta to a new morgrim that doesn't spontaneously hammer, lynch, and then get lynched, this is the right way of doing it and I certainly encourage it. You're okay for now - lots of people are eyeing you warily but it's not turning into a wagon yet.
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Grujah

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vote: sparky

Off to sleep.
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Captain_Frisk

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vote: sparky

Off to sleep.

Wait - i mean - i  know you're obvtown and all - but would you care to make your  reasons known?
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Grujah

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Discussed it eariler, what yuma said and what I said on this page.
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Grujah

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Yuma said few pages back.
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Grujah

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Though yuma could just be covering for his buddy. Dunno.
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Robz888

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Sorry guys, I didn't have time to get on yesterday. Except to quickpost something.
@Frisk: Well, we don't really have much of a target for lynch, and that is not all that good, correct? We have to lynch someone, correct? And somebody who makes a scumslip, lurks, and is snarky to Eevee, well, yeah.
why don't you claim? Please answer these questions everybody:
1. Would you support a Captain_Frisk lynch?
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target?
3. What are your thoughts on Robz?
4. What are your thoughts on me?

And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)

1. Yes
2. Ftl
3. Lurker Scum
4. Considerably different from previous games.
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Axxle

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Robz888

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3. What are your thoughts on Robz?
3. Lurker Scum
Wat.

I'm trying to establish my new meta "Class Clown Robz." How'm I doing?
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yuma

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morgrim, i'll get to your questions later you little punk
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Captain_Frisk

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Ok - the case against RobZ:

He's been away for the last 2 full days (prior post #1099 - 8/27 @ 4pm) .  He popped in to say nothing (#1216 - 8/29 @ 7:14).  Any accusation of my missing 24 hours in this game has been trumped.  He has no meaningful contributions today - he avoided the grujah survey - but he's been watching closely enough to bust me on my eevee mistake.

He even admits that lurking is anti-town in this very game:

If he fiasco of mafia VII taught me something, it is that lurkers are like really bad for town. Screw lynch all liars, lynch all lurkers imo.

Yes. Lurkers are anti-town, and sometimes turn out to be mafia, and we don't kill them enough.

So far - he's voted for angry birds (very early to draw out a (poor) response, Axxle (confirmed town), eHunt (confirmed town)  He's barely even mentioned any other players.

There's nothing else to build a case on because he's not even in the game.  At least when I leave the game alone for a while - I try to bring back something after I catch up.
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Robz888

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Ok - the case against RobZ:

He's been away for the last 2 full days (prior post #1099 - 8/27 @ 4pm) .  He popped in to say nothing (#1216 - 8/29 @ 7:14).  Any accusation of my missing 24 hours in this game has been trumped.  He has no meaningful contributions today - he avoided the grujah survey - but he's been watching closely enough to bust me on my eevee mistake.

He even admits that lurking is anti-town in this very game:

If he fiasco of mafia VII taught me something, it is that lurkers are like really bad for town. Screw lynch all liars, lynch all lurkers imo.

Yes. Lurkers are anti-town, and sometimes turn out to be mafia, and we don't kill them enough.

So far - he's voted for angry birds (very early to draw out a (poor) response, Axxle (confirmed town), eHunt (confirmed town)  He's barely even mentioned any other players.

There's nothing else to build a case on because he's not even in the game.  At least when I leave the game alone for a while - I try to bring back something after I catch up.

The Grujah survey was requested so that he could figure out who to do his investigation of. By the time I saw it, he had already decided it should be Eevee/Axxle. I highly agreed that this was the right call, and said so.
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Robz888

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Well, the people I suspect keep coming up town. You should be thanking me that I'm not offering reads.
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Captain_Frisk

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Sorry guys, I didn't have time to get on yesterday. Except to quickpost something.
@Frisk: Well, we don't really have much of a target for lynch, and that is not all that good, correct? We have to lynch someone, correct? And somebody who makes a scumslip, lurks, and is snarky to Eevee, well, yeah.
why don't you claim? Please answer these questions everybody:
1. Would you support a Captain_Frisk lynch?
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target?
3. What are your thoughts on Robz?
4. What are your thoughts on me?

And a special one for C_F:
1. What is your role? (I think you should roleclaim)

two more:
5. Why does everyone suspect me for playing normal?
6. If you don't like it, would you rather me go back to being crazy?

I'll start with #1-frisk:
Rolefishing is bad-mmmmkay? 

Now the questions for everyone
#1 - of course not.  Only a complete anti town player would support his own lynch.  I can't believe I'm even writing this with a straight face.
#2 - I am not scum.  RobZ is #2 - and frankly - given that we can afford it after the double scum death, you might be third.  Ftl is a close 4th - but I havne't reviewed him closely.
#3 - I think he's a tasty lynch - see my previous post.
#4 - I think you're a decent backup.  I hate to lynch you for playing differently than you have in every other game - but I have enough meta to support that this game is out of alignment with your other games - and there has to be a reason.
#5 - I think others have answered this.  If you start playing like this in any other game - or are confirmed town in this game - I will never bother you again in any future game.
#6 - Of course not - I like this morgrim - but I'd also like to win.  I wish that Grujah had used his super power on you so that we wouldn't have to have this conversation.
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Robz888

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The biggest thing I have to analyze is something that happened to ME--that brief wagon against me that included Axxle, Frisk, Ftl, and Morgrim. I know I'm town, so I find all these people suspicious, and I think their arguments were table. But that's pretty unsatisfying, probably for these people and anyone I would need to convince (and hey, Axxle is confirmed town). So I'm interested in voting for Frisk and Ftl, who I think got on my wagon with a bad case and it's a wagon on town (from my perspective). Oh, and I'm ignoring Morgrim right now, because that's where I am in life. But anyway, I understand if this isn't very persuasive tot he powers that be (Grujah), and certainly it's not persuasive to you, Frisk.
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Robz888

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*Their arguments were terrible, not table. Table arguments are pretty good, except we screwed up MIV together.
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ftl

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By the way, to people saying that we can afford to mislynch, it might be true but we shouldn't get too cocky. Like, there could be 3 nightkills going around, and if all 3 hit town we'll be back to being far behind, and every lynch counts. We did well with 2 nightkilled scum and 2 town deaths so far, but this game can swing fast.

Robz - that sounds suspiciously like OMGUS. There's been a lot going on - d1 wagons on ehunt, insom, o, talk about those wagons, axxle and eevee and grujah being cleared... and the "biggest thing to analyze" is an early wagon on you?

Yeah, I'm definitely okay with a Robz lynch. Vote: Robz though I'd be ok with a frisk lynch too.
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Axxle

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Well, I would be very very surprised if there wasn't scum between CF, FTL and Robz.  The question is who to get first and when to stop.
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Robz888

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Well, I would be very very surprised if there wasn't scum between CF, FTL and Robz.  The question is who to get first and when to stop.

In the order you listed, and stop after Ftl.
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Voltgloss

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I just read Morgrim's survey request in #1200 and am posting my answers without having read beyond that.

1.  Only after I finish my Day 1 rereads, and then only if he stands out as scummiest (or there is no hope of a wagon on whoever is scummiest).  That said, at present (without my having completed Day 1 rereads yet) CF is indeed looking scummiest to me.

2.  At present, yuma, but again this may change after I finish my Day 1 rereads.  In particular, I have zero read on ftl at present, and I need to change that (for better or for worse).

3.  I gave my thoughts on Robz in my Day 1 reread post re: him and CF. 

4.  I wish you played the way you're playing now in all of your Mafia games.

PPE:  I see supplemental questions at #1202:

5.  Because it's different from how you behaved in every other game so far, and in all of those games that went to completion, you were town (except BM-IV which doesn't really count in my book).  A new style of playing automatically gets read as "he must have a different alignment."

6.  No, I much prefer you playing this way.

And now I will read the rest of what has gone on this evening.
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sparky5856

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Yeah, I still have a major headache IRL, sorry for not participating that much. But I'll try to do what I can here. And yes I realize that that does not excuse me from being suspected, puts me in a position I'm not used to yet, but I'll try to help out all the same.

I suppose the first obvious thing I should do is respond to Morgrim's survey. Maybe he has some master plan like Grujah lol

1. Would you support a Captain_Frisk lynch? At this point idunno. There's evidence against him but now he's playing to help out. I also do not like that if we lynch him it'll be a mistake as C_F calls it.
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target? Well too bad Eevee is confirmed-town now. Darn you Grujah >_< It's intriguing that everyone is looking into ftl now, I'll have to read the case on him. What about Robz? I feel uneasy about:

Well, the people I suspect keep coming up town. You should be thanking me that I'm not offering reads.

Well isn't offering reads the point of the game? seems like a table argument (btw that was intentional). But I still have to reanalyze everyone to get a final opinion.

3. What are your thoughts on Robz? Not a big help to the scumhunting. Lurkerish activities + quote above. Fixated on the Day 1 wagon? If C_F is not scum, it's most likely Robz.
4. What are your thoughts on me? I would have to reread the previous games to see how the Morgrim-like Morgrim plays. Pretty evident you're playing differently this game by what people are saying. Overall I've been getting a neutral-townish read from this behavior.
5. Why does everyone suspect me for playing normal? Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition.
6. If you don't like it, would you rather me go back to being crazy? If you did, Day 2 would be over by now >___<

In responce to yuma's post #1173:

In summary, sparky has long posts about everyone and everything... sure he doesn't post often, but when he does they are huge. But they are devoid of anything really about O. They don't analyze him. They don't question him. They briefly glaze over or completely ignore him.

And then after he is dead, sparky announces he is suspicious of him and would have killed him.

I do have long posts about, well, mostly everyone and everything I'll call it. I've focused a lot more on certain others during Day 1. I completely ignored eHunt until my final giant post of Day 1. And after that, I felt like I had already gotten out my thoughts (main one being Insomniac was scum) so I didn't add more. O was one of the people I didn't acknowledge much on Day 1. Over Night 1 I thought, "well, eHunt flipped Doctor, and O seemed so sure that he was scum, why was he so confident?" I WOULD have addressed this concern in Day 2 (along with many others I'm sure).

But then he is killed. So now, I don't have to. I did state that I was going to, but it would have been useless. If he had survived, I WOULD have declared him an easy candidate for lynching. But that's not how it turned out.

With my long posts I try to analyze as much as I can but unfortunately I don't get to everyone. It's good that people are asking for everyone's opinions on a specific person, so that I know who to focus on. Btw Grujah, thank you for the help on the quoting, sorry that I snapped earlier.

That's all the time I have for now.
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yuma

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1. I don't think C-Frisk is the best direction for us to go atm. His case seems baseless.
2. I am voting for sparky, his response didn't move me any way or the other. Grujah and Eevee--again, two confirmed townies were quick to jump on. What do others think?
3. Robz? Honestly it seems like Robz might have too much going on in all mafia games and rl. He is present but not nearly the old robz that I remember
4. I am mad at you. but trying to not let it affect my game play.

5. Look, here is the thing. I want you to play as you. I want you to stop trying to play crazy, or play normal. Just play as you are. Honestly I think this might be a good discussion for after the game is over, because I am a bit frustrated with you.
6. see above
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Robz888

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3. Robz? Honestly it seems like Robz might have too much going on in all mafia games and rl. He is present but not nearly the old robz that I remember

Look, when I agree to play a game, I am not implicitly promising that I will post X number of times. Actually, there's a game you played with me, MV, where I didn't do much after the beginning. That's because I had little in the way of insights. I fought my own death (as I did here), since I knew my death was bad for the town. Knowing nothing else, I didn't say much about anything else. That's how I play.

In MIV I had a big handle on what was going on, so I was hyperactive. In MVII, I didn't have much original to offer, and I didn't want to make myself a target because I had an obligation as the Jailkeeper, so again I was super quiet on Day 1, and then dead unfortunately.

I'm staying up to date on the thread. If I saw a post I loved or hated, I'll comment on it. For now it's "meh, kill Frisk or Ftl."
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

yuma

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3. Robz? Honestly it seems like Robz might have too much going on in all mafia games and rl. He is present but not nearly the old robz that I remember

Look, when I agree to play a game, I am not implicitly promising that I will post X number of times. Actually, there's a game you played with me, MV, where I didn't do much after the beginning. That's because I had little in the way of insights. I fought my own death (as I did here), since I knew my death was bad for the town. Knowing nothing else, I didn't say much about anything else. That's how I play.

In MIV I had a big handle on what was going on, so I was hyperactive. In MVII, I didn't have much original to offer, and I didn't want to make myself a target because I had an obligation as the Jailkeeper, so again I was super quiet on Day 1, and then dead unfortunately.

I'm staying up to date on the thread. If I saw a post I loved or hated, I'll comment on it. For now it's "meh, kill Frisk or Ftl."

I am sorry if my post was offensive or caused you to feel defensive. What I mostly meant to say here was that I am having a hard time getting a feel off you. I have no cause to complain about you not posting, because you always post more than me. I am simply saying that you aren't posting as much as I was used to in this game. If Morgrim hadn't specifically asked about you, I wouldn't have said anything at all.
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Robz888

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3. Robz? Honestly it seems like Robz might have too much going on in all mafia games and rl. He is present but not nearly the old robz that I remember

Look, when I agree to play a game, I am not implicitly promising that I will post X number of times. Actually, there's a game you played with me, MV, where I didn't do much after the beginning. That's because I had little in the way of insights. I fought my own death (as I did here), since I knew my death was bad for the town. Knowing nothing else, I didn't say much about anything else. That's how I play.

In MIV I had a big handle on what was going on, so I was hyperactive. In MVII, I didn't have much original to offer, and I didn't want to make myself a target because I had an obligation as the Jailkeeper, so again I was super quiet on Day 1, and then dead unfortunately.

I'm staying up to date on the thread. If I saw a post I loved or hated, I'll comment on it. For now it's "meh, kill Frisk or Ftl."

I am sorry if my post was offensive or caused you to feel defensive. What I mostly meant to say here was that I am having a hard time getting a feel off you. I have no cause to complain about you not posting, because you always post more than me. I am simply saying that you aren't posting as much as I was used to in this game. If Morgrim hadn't specifically asked about you, I wouldn't have said anything at all.

I wasn't offended, sorry if that's what my tone conveyed! Really, I don't think it's pro-town to do posts if I don't have much to say, especially in a town as big as this one.
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

Grujah

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Why did Frisk wagon die?

Cuz case is weak or cuz he is scum?

Case was iffy, but still..
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Galzria

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Why did Frisk wagon die?

Cuz case is weak or cuz he is scum?

Case was iffy, but still..

Because you left me here all aloooone!
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Grujah

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You are Void.

Get used to being alone.
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Morgrim7

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Hmmm, the ftl argument seems to be getting pretty popular. considerable.
Robz, never ignore anyone. Especially not me.
Ya know what? Tell me if you guys ever wanna lynch C_F; I would be happy to contribute. For now, Vote: ftl.
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

cayvie

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Vote Count 2.5

Captain_Frisk (3): Axxle, angrybirds, Galzria
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, ftl
sparky5856 (3): yuma, Eevee, Grujah
ftl (1): Morgrim7

not voting (3): Robz888, Voltgloss, sparky5856

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @5 p.m.
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angrybirds

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Hmmm, the ftl argument seems to be getting pretty popular. considerable.
Robz, never ignore anyone. Especially not me.
Ya know what? Tell me if you guys ever wanna lynch C_F; I would be happy to contribute. For now, Vote: ftl.

in your own words morgrim, what is the ftl argument?
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angrybirds

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I guess my difficulty with Day 1 yuma is that I am looking for his rationale for having been a part of ehunt's lynch - O's ultimate lynch-choice - and I'm not finding it.

Is yuma more suspicious than CF?  Going just by Day 1, I'd say it's close - but if you held a gun to my head at the end of Day 1 and demanded I pick one to lynch, it would have been CF for the tremendous lurking.  (Coupled incidentally with CF being active in other threads around that same time - I find his "goko made me lurk" excuse a bit weak.)  In order to judge between them now, I will have to review their Day 2 actions.

interesting that this was completely ignored. did anyone respond to it. I don't think I saw any
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Axxle

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I guess my difficulty with Day 1 yuma is that I am looking for his rationale for having been a part of ehunt's lynch - O's ultimate lynch-choice - and I'm not finding it.

Is yuma more suspicious than CF?  Going just by Day 1, I'd say it's close - but if you held a gun to my head at the end of Day 1 and demanded I pick one to lynch, it would have been CF for the tremendous lurking.  (Coupled incidentally with CF being active in other threads around that same time - I find his "goko made me lurk" excuse a bit weak.)  In order to judge between them now, I will have to review their Day 2 actions.

interesting that this was completely ignored. did anyone respond to it. I don't think I saw any
This sounds like a rhetorical question.
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Morgrim7

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-He was on many wagons. Like a lot.
-Was lurky, and when he posted, he wasnt helpful (D1)
-Never even responded to Grujah
wow, going through that made me feel odd...robz could be a good lynch
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

yuma

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I guess my difficulty with Day 1 yuma is that I am looking for his rationale for having been a part of ehunt's lynch - O's ultimate lynch-choice - and I'm not finding it.

Is yuma more suspicious than CF?  Going just by Day 1, I'd say it's close - but if you held a gun to my head at the end of Day 1 and demanded I pick one to lynch, it would have been CF for the tremendous lurking.  (Coupled incidentally with CF being active in other threads around that same time - I find his "goko made me lurk" excuse a bit weak.)  In order to judge between them now, I will have to review their Day 2 actions.

interesting that this was completely ignored. did anyone respond to it. I don't think I saw any

I guess I had better respond to it at least...

I think the most pressing concern is that I voted for both insomniac and ehunt w/o very much explanation. This is true I did.

To be honest in looking back I am flummoxed about not having put down my rationale for voting ehunt. I feel like I did at one point and am wondering if I wrote it and never published it? But either way that is a poor excuse and I will be fully accountable for it.

I voted off ehunt when he claimed and then moved my vote to insomniac. I think my explanation here was justified, if not long because I was at work. I felt a vote on a-birds was reactionary and contradicted his read a short time before.

I voted off him when he claimed and then moved back to ehunt, who I still read scummy about--only the claim had changed that before--and continued to feel that the explanations that were being offered about insomniac's claim being better than ehunt's which I still believe to be true, despite the roles being reversed, however, as you point out I did not mention that in my post, because again I was at work--that time I wasn't even on break, just walking in the hallway trying to catch up and provide some input.

Is there anything else you would like me to directly respond to Volt?
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yuma

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So I know that a handful of us are heavily involved in the MVIII end of day 3 stages, but players not in that game--and even those that are--no comments for 16 hours? That is awesomely not pro-town.
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Voltgloss

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I've come to the conclusion that I am overcommitted forum-game-wise (taking RL into account), as my efforts to reread Day 1 last night wound with my falling asleep on the couch.  I am trying my level best to do better at that this evening.  I'm also going to bow out of semi-blitz mafia.

As it is, I see your response to my concerns yuma and acknowledge them.  To clarify, I don't recall finding your vote on Insomniac to be unexplained - it was your vote (and revote) on ehunt, as you noted.

I expect that the end of M-VIII's Day today, as well as BM-IV's possibly ending today in its entirety, will free people up to refocus here in time for Monday's lynch deadline.
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jotheonah

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Volt, you have no obligation to continue tertiary-modding/trolling in BMV if you don't want to.
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Voltgloss

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Volt, you have no obligation to continue tertiary-modding/trolling in BMV if you don't want to.

But that's so much fun!  (And not really much of a time commitment)

Also, I meant Morgrim's RMM-II instead of "BM-IV" in my last post.
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ftl

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So I know that a handful of us are heavily involved in the MVIII end of day 3 stages, but players not in that game--and even those that are--no comments for 16 hours? That is awesomely not pro-town.

I mean, I'm fine with either a Robz or C_F lynch. Prefer Robz. If I get pressured, and get to L-X, for some small X, I'll deal with that as it happens. I have nothing to add really.

I suggest that we all put down our votes and go from there, there's still a few nonvoters.
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Galzria

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So I know that a handful of us are heavily involved in the MVIII end of day 3 stages, but players not in that game--and even those that are--no comments for 16 hours? That is awesomely not pro-town.

I mean, I'm fine with either a Robz or C_F lynch. Prefer Robz. If I get pressured, and get to L-X, for some small X, I'll deal with that as it happens. I have nothing to add really.

I suggest that we all put down our votes and go from there, there's still a few nonvoters.

Well I'm on CF now. I would switch to Sparky, or you. Robz is a distant 4th for me today.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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I will definitely be voting tonight no matter how far (or not) I get with my Day 1 reread analysis.  Given the circumstances, I will swap my planned order around and evaluate sparky and ftl first. 
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Morgrim7

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When do you plan on lynching? I might not be here. I'll be gone all day today and some of tomorrow
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

ftl

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We have a few days, but as always, getting to near-lynch will draw out a claim and we'll have to evaluate whether it's truthful or not and so on.

I'll reread sparky, I've already reread C_F and Robz so I don't need to redo that.
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ftl

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Not seeing the case on sparky, sry.
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ftl

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Well, it's true, he didn't mention O at all. He went after Insomniac.  OK, he could be O's scumbuddy.
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sparky5856

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Initial case on me was the hasty L-1 vote for C_F. Then yuma points out how I barely mentioned O in the 1st day and then mention I wanted him dead in the 2nd. Something I've noticed about yuma is that he acknowledges his flaws (such as, post #1256), saying "this is true and I'm fully accountable" and all that. I've been acting the same way about my thoughts on O; it was a mistake that I didn't offer as much of my thoughts as I could have on him.

If I was O's scumbuddy though, I wouldn't have acted the same way that I did in the beginning of this day, saying that I would probably target him if I was vig. I wouldn't have wanted him dead if he was my scumbuddy. I wouldn't set myself up for something obvious like that, unless my response was genuine which it was.

I believe I mentioned this before, but I played a few games of mafia over on other forums back in the day, and I was mafia more often than not by chance. First time ever being mafia, I was the last survivor and won. Because I ended up being mafia a lot I had to become a skilled mafia player in order to survive in most of those games. Lying seemed like too obvious of a scumtell for me. I don't like to lie. I hate liars IRL as well. My playstyle thus morphed into highly-analytic posts that remained hidden from suspicion most of the time, few and far in between. And I ended up playing like that as town too, since I got used to my playstyle as mafia. Although I'll say that when I'm town, I tend to be more interrogative with my posts, since I need to find out everything. But yeah, if I was WW I would have responded differently to Grujah's question #6. I might have considered putting "O?" with the question mark for uncertainty, along with a couple other candidates (speaking generally here), but not just "...yeah, probably O". Way too obvious of a WW giveaway. The mafia I played at other forums was more informal, this is real man's mafia here. (Bottom line, I'm not O's scumbuddy. I hate to spend time on defense but since most people are wondering I might as well provide my own feedback.)

But I completely understand that I'm one of the ones on the chopping block now, one of the major reasons being that we're running out of suspects and so I have to be considered eventually. My L-1 vote was my biggest mistake thus far, the spectator topic is probably yelling at me for my irrational thinking >__< And of course I wish that I hadn't made that one post, that's obvious, but things happen I suppose.

Anyways, I just wanted to provide a bit more info on me. Votes. I don't have a vote. I'll wait for Volt's analysis on ftl before I consider ftl, so that I can see if I can agree with Volt's reasoning or not. I'll be curious on the analysis on me of course. Did Grujah say why he voted me? Oh yeah something about suitclaiming or something, plus the O-scumbuddy possibility. Could you explain a bit more on your suitclaim argument Grujah so that I have a better idea? C_F seems more and more townie the more I look into him, especially considering that he questioned Grujah's vote on me. If he was, say, the SK, why would he care? Robz has some good arguments against him. Morgrim is blah blah Morgrim. Volt is over-committing to be helpful; that reads more town than scum. Who else is in this game. yuma I feel like I shouldn't go after because of OMGUS, there's no case on him now anyway; maybe on a later day. angrybirds and Galz are the ones I need to look into more along with ftl.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1269 on: September 01, 2012, 03:24:45 am »

Why is this dead?

Wanna lynch (from most to least): sparky, ftl, Frisk
Would lynch (from most scummy to least): yuma Robz
Wont lynch (again, least town to most): Voltgloss, Galzria, angrybirds, Morgrim, Axxle, Eevee, Grujah
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1270 on: September 01, 2012, 04:11:49 am »

Beats me. It's getting close to the deadline, like about 62 hours am I correct?

Here's my thoughts on Insomniac: his posts seem poorly constructed, as noticed by a few other people. Notice how he doesn't say what KIND of doctor he is, mafia or town. eHunt already claims to be town doctor. What other doctors are there!? So now, this can only mean one thing. It's either Insomniac or eHunt who's scum. They can't both be the town doctor. And in the second quote... maybe he hasn't forgotten the possibility of mafia doctors, because he knows there is one? I'm solid in my position that eHunt is innocent.

But wait. What the heck is a ninja doctor? I read on Mafia Scum that he's anti-town. Someone want to clarify on this position? It doesn't make sense. Insomniac's claiming of ninja doctor sounds desperate, like "oops I shouldn't have done that". And wasn't he against suit-claiming in the first place?


Seems scummy too.


Also, distancing is a big scumtell.

Just saw this, and looked up distancing on the wiki cause of my noob status. I can see your viewpoint, but I really did feel Insomniac was scum much more so than eHunt (and my boldness certainly shows in that particular snippet >_<), it's hard to be genuine in this game >_<. My experience when playing is that whenever someone did something town-tell-ish, chances were that a mafia player would very soon do that very same thing. That's just my experience, so I sound forceful in that quote there. Reading back though, that does sound like distancing (the boldness especially made it stand out) so I can understand your argument. I feel like defending myself is concentrating my efforts away from scumhunting, that's why I don't like to defend myself >_<. but I feel like it's necessary.

I may just be tired, but how could I be both Insomniac's and O's scumbuddy, when one is mafia and the other werewolf? Kinda an unfair justification I just noticed... eh I'll sleep now, anything questions you have for me Grujah I'll answer them, unless you've had enough and ultimately want to see me dead lol. I feel like I coulda been more help if I wasn't defending so much, but eh it was necessary .
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1271 on: September 01, 2012, 06:47:16 am »

No one posting is bad bad bad, and I'm more guilty than most. Sorry town! I have some people over from the USA this week, they are leaving on sunday so if I make it to day 3, I'll have more time reread and post then. I've gotten weirdly little computer time the whole week, and today will be no different. I'll be on all of sunday though I hope, given their plane leaves in the morning.

Sparky still looks very scummy to me (guys, two obvtowns want him dead, might want to sheep if you have no original ideas! anyone opposed to sparky lynch, other than sparky?). His defense is basically just a whole bunch of WIFOM "I would do that and that if I was scum", it's impossible for us to know what you would and would not do so that's not very helpful. Often, when someone posts long defense posts like this, I'm able to get a town read from them and unvote. Not happening here.

Vote: sparky again just to prod others to join me. Lets get this game moving!
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1272 on: September 01, 2012, 10:47:32 am »

...reading from the beginning, Part 3...

Eeeh, I think part of the reason for the delays is my knowing how long it took to gather together all of yuma's quotes and paste them into my last post.  Nobody seemed to care about that, so I'm not doing it again here.  Sorry all.  I just don't have the hours to spare.  :p

ftl's Day 1 posts!  Once we get past RVS, I see...

- #144 and #145: voting Galz "to get things going."  4th vote on Galz at the time (with O, abirds, and Axxle).
- #179: challenges Insom's explanation of his response re: suitclaiming
- #210: says he voted Galz to get a reaction
- #214: says he tends to write long posts when scum and short posts as town; reiterates interest in response from Insom
- #229 and #230: asks abirds to explain why he thinks Galz is scummy
- #237: unvotes to prevent the votes on Galz from reaching 5, in case abirds votes on him 
- #244: notes "there's no more wagon on galz and I still know nothing about him, got a town vibe of angrybirds though"
- #268: votes Axxle, joining wagon revved up by Eevee and shraeye
- #289: unvotes Axxle and votes Robz, saying he (and shark_bait and CF and O "all look scummier on reread")
- #335: says he's been in "hardcore lurk mode," his vote on Robz is "meh" but he doesn't have a better place for it
- #354: votes O out of nowhere
- #407: votes Axxle for a joke about Morgrim; unvotes at #417
- #419: "mafia among lurkers/nonvoters" (at the time he is a nonvoter)
- #451: votes Grujah, not joining Axxle wagon
- #556: reiterates townread on abirds
- #571: cites Goko, Dark Ages, and RMM2 as reasons why "I haven't contributed too much"; says O vote was because he seemed like scum O from M-V; says he'll "sheep Galz in the 'will vote for anybody' mentality"
- #575: says he doesn't have anything else to say
- #577: lists reads: ehunt neutral, prefers Insom lynch, surprised at no wagon on CF
- #591: votes Insom, preferring that to ehunt lynch, and following abirds and Axxle votes
- #596: questions O's reason for voting ehunt
- #716: agrees with Eevee he thinks Insom is scummier than ehunt (even after both doctor claims)
- #768: analyzing double-doctor debate, no solid conclusion, notes that ehunt is at L-1 and says he won't hammer him because not entirely sold on that wagon
- #876: notes that mutual-doctor-protection fails if two scumteams target same doc
- #882: notes that if both doctors survive day and one dies at night, town would "basically have to lynch the other and possibly waste a day doing that"
- #890: cites distrust of ehunt, Insom, and shraeye

Hmmm.  Well, up until around #577, I don't see very much real content from ftl at all.  He's joining wagons and casting votes for not very much reason other than to provoke reactions.  After #577 he's more directly engaged, giving his views on ehunt vs. Insom, weighing in on the double-doctor issues.  Preferring Insom's lynch to ehunt's lynch and questioning O's approach both tend to make him less likely mafia or WW.

Summary: Day 1 ftl reads like someone who wasn't very engaged in the game up until close to deadline, and then revved up at deadline - but also wasn't aligned with (or ignoring) the known scum parties.  Maybe a slight town read.  In any case, I see much less to raise suspicions than I do on rereading CF or yuma.   

So let's look at the other existing wagon: sparky.  His Day 1 posts that jumped out at me are...

- #146: questions Galzria's "interrogatory quintuple post"
- #156: cites "pro-town vibes about shraeye," noting his vote on Insom had support
- #176: math about number of nighttime deaths; challenges Insom's position on suitclaims
- #182: responds to shraeye re: nighttime death math
- #211: cites "longer posts = pro-town" theory; suspects Axxle, shark_bait, and Robz for lack of contribution; notes Galz's theory that scum look more like town suggests that Galz himself is suspicious
- #242: proposes going after a lurker or Morgim on Day 1, which is "Stab-In-The-Dark Day"
- #258: refers to himself twice as "on the chopping block" despite having no votes on him - I think responding to shraeye's having expressed suspicion of him in #248?  Tells shraeye that he (shraeye) i's posting while tired, cites his typos, instructs him to clarify when he "feel{s} more refreshed"
- #263: votes shark_bait for lurking
- #275: unvotes shark_bait after he announces need for replacement, votes onto Axxle bandwagon
- #285: debating Axxle vs. Robz after the "a little jumpy" exchange
- #318: supporting Robz's behavior re: abirds
- #321: notes Axxle and CF voted Robz for contradictory reasons
- #418: unvotes Axxle to promote discussion of yuma's suspicion of shraeye
- #526: dislikes both Robz and Axxle wagons, supports Axxle's softclaim, two paragraphs wondering how SK would play, votes Grujah for not rereading rest of thread
- #689: is surprised he wasn't suspected for lurking
- #747: rereads from beginning, long analysis ultimately concluding that ehunt is town, Insom scum (votes for him), and Eevee also scummy

Rereading sparky Day 1 has me scratching my head about the wagon on him now.  Is it primarily based on his "having a bad day" vote putting CF to L-1?  Because, looking at voting patterns and results of Day 1, I'm not seeing much reason to suspect him.  Certainly less reason to suspect him compared to CF or yuma. 

I still need to reread abirds and Morgrim.  In the meantime though, Vote: Captain_Frisk.  He's still my strongest scumread based on Day 1 behavior and results.

Eevee, Grujah:  as confirmed town and 99%-confirmed town respectively, help me understand your thinking:  what makes a sparky lynch better than a Frisk lynch?
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1273 on: September 01, 2012, 10:53:22 am »

Hey guys - on v/la so my posting will be limited up to deadline.  Obviously I'm still in favor of RobZ.

Not sure I understand the sparky case either, although I obviously disagree with the rest of Volt's post.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1274 on: September 01, 2012, 01:21:35 pm »

Trying to bring myself up to date so ill make a list you all seem so fond of
will not vote for eevee, axxle, grujah (duh) me

don't think is mafia: neither the FTl case or the sparky case carry weight.i find it odd that so many confirmed town are on sparky.

Could be: yuma (the only thing here is his case on sparky) volt i need to go back and take a harder look at same fir galz

willing and am voting for: robz, thecaptain and morgrim

hopefully I will bring more to the table later this weekend
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1275 on: September 01, 2012, 01:41:21 pm »

Vote Count 2.6

Captain_Frisk (4): Axxle, angrybirds, Galzria, Voltgloss
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, ftl
sparky5856 (3): yuma, Eevee, Grujah
ftl (1): Morgrim7

not voting (2): Robz888, sparky5856

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @5 p.m. 51 hours remain.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1276 on: September 01, 2012, 03:54:22 pm »

Vote: sparky again just to prod others to join me. Lets get this game moving!

You know what's a really good idea? OMGUS! Yeah, that'll totally save my skin and all... won't it?  :)

About ftl, I'm not seeing much reason to vote him. Reading from day 2, he was very quick to congratulate the town on two scum deaths over the night, and also very quick to prod the suspicions to eHunt voters.

Let's keep scumhunting yesterday's eHunt wagon. That place looks like it was filled with scum. Who hammered? ...oh, insomniac. OK, that's unhelpful. FoS: Galzria, Robz, yuma, voltgloss, eevee, grujah, axxle .

Something quirky I noticed... all three confirmed-town were on eHunt. Two now-known scum (O and Insomniac) were on the eHunt wagon as well. Are the odds favorable that at least one more scum was on that wagon? Volt I already stated has been leaning much more towards town, that leaves: Galz, Robz, yuma. Scum among those three? Robz is the only one with a wagon currently on him. Of course, all of this is invalid if ftl truly is scum and he just wrote that to prod attention off of himself. Although I don't see much purpose for that; he didn't have a single vote at the end of Day 1.

#960, LOL yuma suspects all three confirmed town and is now dead wrong. I just found this funny lol

However, I do think that out of all of us on the wagon, I would put Eevee at the top of my suspicious list. He took a lot of convincing to get on the ehunt lynch. And once he was on the ehunt wagon he still expressed suspicion of insomniac (perhaps he knew that insomniac was mafia and wanted to get cred.)

As for the shraeye death: myself, Grujah and Axxle all had implicated him as potentially scum partners with ehunt. Neither ended up being scum. So both grujah and axxle are suspicious. But they did the exact same thing I did, and I am town. The biggest difference is that the other two were very specific that they thought shraeye was scum-partners, I alluded a lot more. I don't know if that makes a difference

This probably does make yuma a lot more town lolol. Also, why express the need there to attempt to confirm that you're town, when no major suspicions have been place on you yet? I don't think scum yuma would have said that.

Reading onward, ftl is attempting to be super-helpful with who-killed-whom with the night 1 deaths. And hey, I already stated this , post #985. No need to convince myself of things I already said. I pegged Grujah and Eevee as scum, iffy on Axxle. Bleh. I guess that's why Grujah did his survey in the first place, to clear up info on the suspicious ones and himself.

GALZ is the SK? I don't know why I'm so focused on the SK. The SK's playstyle has to be unique, completely against everyone, no teammates no nothing.  You would think he would be easy to spot then. So, first post of the day:

Personally, I need to go back and reread. All my D1 scum reads based on eHunt's flip are dead.

Well, I'm still highly suspicious of Axxle. Guess I'll do two rereads: One to scumhunt in general, and one to scumhunt with a bias against Axxle. ;D

No, really though, I know eHunt didn't like his wagon, but where does Axxle stand in relation to how O felt? Or Insomniac? Any protection going on? (If they were both going for the throat on that I'll have to *Mostly* clear him, although SK he could be).

No real reaction to the night deaths. Of course the SK doesn't care, he just wants to see everyone dead. He speculates Axxle as SK. Good luck trying to convince that to me now. Further on, he's rather defensive of angrybirds but he did mention that he as a bit drunk, I won't look into that too much. I also want to comment on this:

I think scum killed Insomniac - well, WW's knew he wasn't a WW, so he was a doctor or Mafia (or both, LOL), so absolutely worth killing. But I guess it wasn't a WW kill scene? So SK? I don't know. Vig killing possible Doctor seems ridiculous. So SK kills Insomniac.

Vig probably kills O, sheeping eHunt so the town doesn't have to deal with his antics today. That leaves Mafia to kill Shraeye.

I believe that this is spot on. He rambles on a bit about the SK-possibility though, and raises uncertainty along with it. He ultimately concludes with the SK killing Insomniac... maybe because HE killed him? Conspiracy theories for the loss. I'm not gonna delve too much deeper into this right now, it's too specific a possibility. Say Galz is scum, but he flips WW instead, I was still wrong. Volt has no analysis on Galz yet either lol. On the other hand, I'm seriously running out of possibilities for potential scum.

I'm still peeved that the main evidence on me points towards me being both WW and Mafia, seeing that I'm apparently both O's and Insomniac's scumbuddy. Let's say that I am scum, which faction would I be a part of and why? Might give everyone a better idea on the wagon on me.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1277 on: September 01, 2012, 07:58:26 pm »

Wow. Ghost town. If this was Isotropic I would make you all resign in a heartbeat  ;D

One other thing I thought of that I didn't mention earlier: the fact that two confirmed townies are on me hardly means anything imo, as all three now-confirmed townies were on eHunt. Of course they weren't confirmed back then, and it doesn't completely excuse me from suspicion by any means. If you are going to attempt to lynch me though, I wouldn't use just that as my reason.  :P

I noticed Robz also does not have a vote. Do you want to offer thoughts as to who you want to vote on or no? Hey, might steer me towards someone as well. Or maybe one of you Frisk voters want to re-convince me to vote Frisk? We're almost at deadline and I'm surprised that I'm the most active lol

Trying to bring myself up to date so ill make a list you all seem so fond of

angrybirds is really anti-conformist. I like that about him  ;D
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1278 on: September 01, 2012, 09:01:51 pm »

Ok, I'm gonna Vote: frisk for two reasons.
1) We are being way too quiet. And coming up on the deadline...not good.
2) Because the deadline is in two days, I don't see an ftl lynch going over today. Maybe tomorrow.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1279 on: September 01, 2012, 09:48:21 pm »

Vote Count 2.7

Captain_Frisk (5): Axxle, angrybirds, Galzria, Voltgloss, Morgrim7
Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, ftl
sparky5856 (3): yuma, Eevee, Grujah

not voting (2): Robz888, sparky5856

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m. 43 hours remain.

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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1280 on: September 01, 2012, 09:54:14 pm »

alright let's take a look at frisk shall we? I know Volt already did this, but I wanted to look for myself and do a full catch up on him.

August 09, 2012, 12:44:45 pm- So Frisk starts out on Morgrim: He has a vote on him really early. I don't mind this at all. Now the question is... is morgrim reacting to this pressure by changing his behavior, is Morgrim changing his behavior because he is scum or is he changing his behavior to actually be useful?

August 13, 2012, 03:02:34 pm - He then unvotes Morgrim--saying it was an RVS vote.

August 15, 2012, 11:39:29 am - He then votes Robz for backing down too quickly in the a-birds, robz controversy.

August 17, 2012, 09:33:04 pm - He uses goko to excuse his low profile play style

August 19, 2012, 07:22:01 pm - He then does a list of everyone with one of his classic post counts; Maintains vote on Robz

August 21, 2012, 08:09:50 pm - posts that he will not vote for ehunt, is disgusted with town's performance thus far

Day 1 summary -- really quite, not a lot, was completely absent for the Day doctor claims, voting, etc... He ended the day as the only vote on Robz.

Day 2

August 26, 2012, 07:36:57 pm - responds to Grujah's questions; Answered, angrybirds, axxle, Morgrim for question #3 (no robz here!) and Morgrim for number 7

August 27, 2012, 01:51:16 pm - missed the reveal and accused Eevee of being scum

August 28, 2012, 07:33:31 am - says now is the time to take the game serious; does a full analysis of the entire town; goes back to voting robz;

August 28, 2012, 07:09:25 pm - At four votes he says this "Hey guys - we're getting close here.  I really think you might be making a mistake here."

August 29, 2012, 07:42:45 am - and then says this "I just intimated a while back that lynching me would be a bad idea.  Maybe you really want to force me explain why that would be."

August 29, 2012, 08:13:44 am - calls out ftl for being wishywashy and the scummy third vote on his wagon

August 29, 2012, 12:07:42 pm - explains that he wasn't lurking end of Day 1, just gone or busy with other more important threads at that time

August 29, 2012, 07:12:26 pm - reiterates case on Robz, saying that if he is being voted for being lurky so should robz, in addition to voting for townies, adding nothing to town and having the a-birds bad reaction

August 29, 2012, 07:19:21 pm - in response to Morgrim gives the following as lynch candidates: Robz, Morgrim, ftl


Here is volt's initial summary of C-Frisk
"...and that's pretty much it.  CF does not post at all for the rest of Day 1.  So we have absolutely nothing from him dealing with the double-doctor-debate.  His vote was left parked on Robz even well after the Robz-Abirds issue had died down.
Interesting factoid:  after the mod's revealing at least one serial killer exists (#62), O's next post is to cite CF as obv-SK (#66).  CF never responds to that or even acknowledges it. 
In fact, CF never mentions, addresses, or even acknowledges O once in any of his posts.  Despite O's throwing suspicion at him - not just #62, but also #848 (for ignoring the double-doctor-debate).  And CF only mentions Insom the one time, at #339.
CF's general lurking, plus studious avoidance of anything O-related and pretty much anything Insom-related, plus the complete disengagement from the double-doctor-debate, all add up to quite a bit of suspicion in my eyes.  Which is why I listed CF as the person whose alignment I was most interested to know."

Followed by his vote for him

"In the meantime though, Vote: Captain_Frisk.  He's still my strongest scumread based on Day 1 behavior and results."

My summary:

I in no way buy the C-Frisk lynch wagon. Major suspicion at those on the wagon. Who are they? Axxle, angrybirds, Galzria, Voltgloss (So not at axxle, but still). Also, sparky, Morgrim, ftl and ?some others? have voted for him, but abandoned ship. There is nothing there! He has lurked, yes, but not as much as other people, He made a stupid mistake with eevee... not a scum read, O's vague reference to him early one... really? Is that all it really is?

Man, I feel like I just FOS the entire town excluding me, Frisk, Robz and those already cleared...
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1281 on: September 01, 2012, 10:30:42 pm »

Meh, this is a precarious situation for me because no new wagons are gonna develop this late in the day.

Quote
In Volt's analysis...

In fact, CF never mentions, addresses, or even acknowledges O once in any of his posts.  Despite O's throwing suspicion at him - not just #62, but also #848 (for ignoring the double-doctor-debate).  And CF only mentions Insom the one time, at #339.

Hey, sounds a lot like the case on me.

The only two others with votes are Frisk and Robz. So what do you two say? What are your defenses? Frisk I'm not feeling super-confident that he's scum, Robz is more so in my eyes but he has less of a wagon than either of us. I really hate to vote for Frisk for survival purposes.

Agh, unless anyone has any new leads I'm kinda stuck here. As soon as Frisk said "it's time to get serious", he got good at avoiding suspicion to me. Maybe I should only look at his prior behavior? Which WAS scummy to me.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1282 on: September 01, 2012, 10:56:03 pm »

Now a look at morgrim

August 09, 2012, 04:38:30 pm - First post is interesting since it is in RVS; "Hi guys. Vote: Captain_Frisk for voting for me with absolutely no reason whatsoever." Random voting state is called random voting stage because it is random... you don't need to have a reason. Reading too much into this? Maybe....

August 12, 2012, 01:14:35 am - sheep vote on Insomniac

August 13, 2012, 05:42:02 am - says galz is scummy because he is being quieter than usual

August 13, 2012, 07:12:22 am - "Why do I never have unique info to add? I let you guys do the hard thinking, and choose which case is better. But is someone really jumps out to me as scum, I'll vote for that person."

August 15, 2012, 04:46:39 pm - sheep's frisk and axxle's read and votes Robz after angrybirds controversy for being jumpy

August 18, 2012, 03:19:20 pm - list analyzing everyone; scummy people=scum, insomniac a little bit

August 20, 2012, 05:29:10 pm - another list: only robz is scummy; but would support an eevee and grujah lynch, frustrated with axxle

August 20, 2012, 05:47:45 pm - Robz is scummier than eevee, reconfirms vote

August 21, 2012, 02:09:05 am - ftl is being scummy, no explanation

August 22, 2012, 04:26:36 pm - votes insomniac; on wagon after angrybirds, ftl, Voltgloss, sparky

Doesn't put ehunt at L-2; or hammer him! Day ended with his vote on insomniac

Day 2:

August 24, 2012, 06:44:39 pm - another list; eevee scummy; okay with lynching robz; axxle scummy

August 25, 2012, 04:22:28 am - answers Grujah's list vaguely with q #3 being Robz or eevee and #7 Robz, Eevee, Axxle

August 25, 2012, 05:40:58 pm - votes Grujah right before Grujah reveal

August 27, 2012, 05:10:12 am - votes; unvotes Frisk

August 28, 2012, 03:21:14 am - another list! holy moly--tangent did anybody see the Kent State football game where the guy started running the wrong direction on the field?-- Frisk is scummy; Robz=IDK; and then votes and unvotes Frisk

August 29, 2012, 07:18:22 am - "Not safe to vote for Frisk unless you want to lynch him"

August 29, 2012, 04:35:31 pm - conducts his own survey asking about Robz, Frisk, who people would lynch, and does some rolefishing on Frisk (interesting phenomenon occurs; a lot of town answers ftl to his question who besides c-frisk would you like to lynch... this suspicion appears to have been started by c-frisk and a grujah vote that he later unvoted... angrybirds, morgrim, grujah, robz, c-frisk,

August 30, 2012, 05:56:16 pm - votes ftl; Wow! First vote on him! Grujah had voted, but voted off before this...

August 30, 2012, 06:23:18 pm - answers a-birds query about ftl saying "-He was on many wagons. Like a lot.
-Was lurky, and when he posted, he wasnt helpful (D1)
-Never even responded to Grujah
wow, going through that made me feel odd...robz could be a good lynch"

September 01, 2012, 07:01:51 pm - Votes frisk for being quiet and deadline is coming up; at this point he was the only vote on ftl and joined Axxle, angrybirds, Galzria, Voltgloss on the frisk wagon...

full analysis:

This is not the Morgrim we are used to, but it still isn't super useful. Morgim isn't being purposefully unhelpful. He is making lists, making surveys, voting around; he has voted on: Frisk, Insomniac, Robz, ftl, & Grujah. He didn't hammer ehunt and started his own wagon.

It really appears that he is trying to appear helpful. But I am not so sure that I buy it. I don't feel that Morgrim is an idea day 2 lynch, but I think--taking into account his behavior in the next few days until deadline--he could be an ideal target to put pressure on Day 3. I want to see more behavior from him to try and get a full analysis.

For now, my vote will stay on sparky. I haven't given his responses a full thorough read through yet, but I will.


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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1283 on: September 02, 2012, 04:35:39 am »

morg has chosen tendencies lime that in other games as well, i dont think he is scummy. not hammering ehunt with morg's meta looks towny to me. also not like super excited about the frisk case. he has done very little, but so is the situation been for him lately elsewhere too. the mistake with me is scummy but doesnt mean he has to be scum.

i would hope that the case on sparky was stronger, but what can you do. my gut says he reacted to the pressure like scum does and he has been suspicious of townies left and right. i dont consider the O or the Ins evidence the main part of the case, although yeah the fact he can be from either scum team is damning as well. lots of small things adding up + no better targets. i am open to changing though. i guess i'd prefer frisk to nolynch but it's meh.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1284 on: September 02, 2012, 07:08:19 am »

Listen folks - I'm v/la... not sure if I'm going to be able to post again.

It looks like sparky would be unlynchable  unless someone is willing to unvote me.  I'll claim @ L-1 if folks really want me to.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1285 on: September 02, 2012, 07:16:05 am »

Obv it will be Frisk or sparky, no?
We don't have much time. I'm willing to go Frisk, i suggest sparky or FTL hammer.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1286 on: September 02, 2012, 07:27:46 am »

All right Grujah - that looks scummy as hell - but since you are obv town I'll claim - since i'm not sure.

I'm eight of pentacles (backup).

Happy?  Want to lynch the doctor again?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1287 on: September 02, 2012, 07:28:19 am »

I'm not sure that i'll be able to post again is what that first line should have said.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1288 on: September 02, 2012, 07:36:56 am »

Ughhh, Frisk's soft claims obviously had me expect this but it's still bad to have him spell it out. Do not want him lynched today.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1289 on: September 02, 2012, 07:40:49 am »

All right Grujah - that looks scummy as hell - but since you are obv town I'll claim - since i'm not sure.

I'm eight of pentacles (backup).

Happy?  Want to lynch the doctor again?

Happy? I though I said before what I think of Doc claims.

You threatening to claim basically whole D2 is bad. Now you wanna make me look bad, like.. "here, I gotta claim now, look at what trying to lynch me gets you!" . I said I'm willing to do you, I was still more willing to do sparky, my vote was there. Now I am not sure.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1290 on: September 02, 2012, 10:15:19 am »

Is it helpful for Frisk to tell us who he targeted last night?  Maybe he stopped the WW kill?  (far from certain I know)

I'll reread Day 2 now with an emphasis on sparky to see if his actions today read any scummier to me than his actions Day 1.  I still have trouble wrapping my head around sparky's lynch being a good lynch.

In the meantime, in light of Frisk's claim, I will move my vote to my second strongest scumread.  Vote: yuma
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1291 on: September 02, 2012, 11:09:28 am »

Man: I am a little frustrated that Frisk claimed immediately after I had posted what I thought was a pretty convincing post analyzing why he wasn't not scummy to me. Did he have so little faith in us that I and and the others against the wagon could keep him from being lynched? I do understand his rationale for it if he is going to be gone from now until deadline.  On the slightly brighter side, if the claims from yesterday taught us anything it is that fakeclaims by scum end up in the other mafia faction killing them off, so yeah, let's hope he is scum and gets killed during the night.... rather than being town and being killed during the night. Oh and did no one else notice his soft claims "you are really making a huge mistake" that he did twice...?

I am also not surprised to see volt move the wagon in my direction. The question, volt should be asking, but apparently didn't is how do I stand in relation to Frisk? If Frisk is town, I feel that you will all see me as fairly town as I argued strongly against a Frisk lynch; FOS and voted someone (sparky) for L-1ing Frisk; voted for Insomniac (scum). If he is scum, well I don't know where that would leave me (could the scum teams be made up of more than 2 players?)

So let's present volt's case on me. He thinks (and is correct) in that I am not scum with Insomniac. (I voted for him during the ehunt/insomniac claims, eventually switching over to ehunt.) He then wonders if I am WW with O. But instead of voting for me, he votes for Frisk (and gives as one of his reasons that he could be partners with O)

Interesting factoid:  after the mod's revealing at least one serial killer exists (#62), O's next post is to cite CF as obv-SK (#66).  CF never responds to that or even acknowledges it. 

In fact, CF never mentions, addresses, or even acknowledges O once in any of his posts.  Despite O's throwing suspicion at him - not just #62, but also #848 (for ignoring the double-doctor-debate).  And CF only mentions Insom the one time, at #339.

CF's general lurking, plus studious avoidance of anything O-related and pretty much anything Insom-related, plus the complete disengagement from the double-doctor-debate, all add up to quite a bit of suspicion in my eyes.  Which is why I listed CF as the person whose alignment I was most interested to know.

So my question to you, is that if I am WW, why would I interfere with the lynch of someone (Frisk) else who is also being suspected of being a WW and then start another wagon on another person for voting for Frisk? It doesn't make sense. If anything I could have said, I am ambivalent to the lynch and watch it ride into the sunset from a safe distance. But I didn't, I was adamant from early in the day that it was an incorrect lynch and have continued to say so up until now.

Volt's whole case seems to revolve around my voting w/o explanation. I have no excuse for that except that I was at work and in a rush. It isn't a great excuse and combined with other scummy behavior could be attached to a reasonable lynch rationale. But as it is, it is a crappy reason to vote for someone.... FOS (again) at Volt
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1292 on: September 02, 2012, 12:11:35 pm »

it appears that Grujah did not realize another wagon could just as easily form on Robz. i think either way frisk will likely die tonight, as such lynching him doesn't make much sense.

i will vote: robz. his reaction to me continues to be scummy and his lack of participation here. Perhaps getting him up to 3 votes will motivate him to post more [i know, i know, who am i to be asking someone to post more?]
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1293 on: September 02, 2012, 12:15:04 pm »

In light of Frisk's claim, I will Vote: Ftl, my other scum read.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1294 on: September 02, 2012, 12:17:32 pm »

i think either way frisk will likely die tonight, as such lynching him doesn't make much sense.
I still think CF is our guy, but this is a good point.

I'm also VLA till day end, so I'll just sheep Eevee and Grujah at this point.

Vote: sparky
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1295 on: September 02, 2012, 12:26:26 pm »

wow, votes are just flying all over the place now!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1296 on: September 02, 2012, 12:27:41 pm »

i think either way frisk will likely die tonight, as such lynching him doesn't make much sense.
I still think CF is our guy, but this is a good point.

I'm also VLA till day end, so I'll just sheep Eevee and Grujah at this point.

Vote: sparky
It's quite obvious anyone having their vote on Frisk is just wasting it at this point! Give us a vote, everyone.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1297 on: September 02, 2012, 12:46:20 pm »

i think either way frisk will likely die tonight, as such lynching him doesn't make much sense.
I still think CF is our guy, but this is a good point.

I'm also VLA till day end, so I'll just sheep Eevee and Grujah at this point.

Vote: sparky
It's quite obvious anyone having their vote on Frisk is just wasting it at this point! Give us a vote, everyone.

How? Why?

Why do we autobuy this claim?
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1298 on: September 02, 2012, 01:18:33 pm »

Because I'll most likely get night killed anyway?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1299 on: September 02, 2012, 02:02:16 pm »

Okay now I'm just baffled. How many doctors can one game possibly have??? I'm really not sure if I buy this claim, and I was having faith in C_F too. Apparently the secret to not getting lynched is to try to doctor-claim.

I mean, what if he's lying, and he's the last of whatever faction he is. That guaranteed saves us a kill! I'm not seeing the story of why we should let him get killed during the night.

Really, three doctors sounds insane. How does a backup doctor even function anyway?

-thinks-

Okay so Frisk himself doesn't expect to survive the night. Why put yourself in this position if you're scum? He's basically doomed now from what I can gather, which only hurts scum if he's scum. Unless he has some Major Arcana-like power that depends on him dying CONSPIRACY THEORIES

I'm not claiming. There's gotten to be too much of that already. I don't even have any special powers (i.e. killing, saving, investigating etc.), so why does it matter. If I claim it's not gonna change things. I'm in quite a stupid position though XD

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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1300 on: September 02, 2012, 02:23:51 pm »

Robz (or others), what is the case on ftl?  I think I've missed it and if someone could summarize I would appreciate it. 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1301 on: September 02, 2012, 02:24:05 pm »

Vote Count 2.8

Captain_Frisk (2): Galzria, Morgrim7
Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, ftl, angrybirds
sparky5856 (4): yuma, Eevee, Grujah, Axxle
yuma (1): Voltgloss
ftl (1): Robz888


not voting (1): sparky5856

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m. 27 hours remain.

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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1302 on: September 02, 2012, 02:29:48 pm »

Robz (or others), what is the case on ftl?  I think I've missed it and if someone could summarize I would appreciate it.

Well, I didn't like his vote (and Frisk's) on me in response to the now-way-over-discussed Abirds/Robz feud on Day 1. Looked like a lurker-wagon-joiner to me.

Admittedly, it's not much, and I'm not married to an Ftl vote. But other people seem to have suspicions of him, too.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1303 on: September 02, 2012, 02:58:14 pm »

My vote still on robz. I like it there. Lurking, opportunistic voting.

Re: backup doctor - he wasn't originally a doctor, he's a backup, he takes on whatever (town?) power role dies first.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1304 on: September 02, 2012, 03:11:00 pm »

Ohhh okay, makes much more sense then. Thank you ftl.

Voltgloss - overanalytical, townish I guess but yuma's points in #1291 are interesting.
Captain_Frisk - WHO ARE YOU
Grujah- Wants me dead.
Eevee- Ditto.
Robz888- leaning more towards scum than town
yuma- town imo
ftl- townish more so than others
Galzria- leaning more towards scum than town
angrybirds- town imo
sparky5856- burp.
Morgrim7- leaning more towards town than scum, I suppose
Axxle- the most obvious scum obviously amirite

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1305 on: September 02, 2012, 03:31:24 pm »

i think either way frisk will likely die tonight, as such lynching him doesn't make much sense.
I still think CF is our guy, but this is a good point.

I'm also VLA till day end, so I'll just sheep Eevee and Grujah at this point.

Vote: sparky
It's quite obvious anyone having their vote on Frisk is just wasting it at this point! Give us a vote, everyone.

How? Why?

Why do we autobuy this claim?
The other scumteam will nightkill him anyways if he is lying.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1306 on: September 02, 2012, 03:41:49 pm »

i think either way frisk will likely die tonight, as such lynching him doesn't make much sense.
I still think CF is our guy, but this is a good point.

I'm also VLA till day end, so I'll just sheep Eevee and Grujah at this point.

Vote: sparky
It's quite obvious anyone having their vote on Frisk is just wasting it at this point! Give us a vote, everyone.

How? Why?

Why do we autobuy this claim?
The other scumteam will nightkill him anyways if he is lying.

That is false. It's why scum lost in M-VI. They cannot go balls-to-the-wall all out to kill the other scum team or town will overwhelm them. It's a balancing act and right now, "scum" (as a whole) are well behind. They absolutely do NOT want to kill each other tonight.
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Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1307 on: September 02, 2012, 03:53:55 pm »

As I understand it, yuma's rebuttal to my suspicion is, in very brief summary, "I fought against CF's lynch Day 2 - and if I were scum I'd have let it ride."  Do I have that right, yuma?

yuma, what do you think of the case on ftl?  If you think sparky is a better lynch candidate than ftl - why?

I am still trying to understand the case against sparky.  I saw Eevee responded to that question from me but I frankly didn't find his comments that compelling.  "Suspected a lot of townies" describes a lot of us (including confirmed townies!) and "acted scummy when suspected" I don't think I agree with.  sparky's behavior in the face of suspicion Day 2 feels more like ehunt's behavior to me than anyone else.  ehunt.  Who was town!
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1308 on: September 02, 2012, 04:03:33 pm »

Man you guys changing avatars all the time makes following these games impossible. >_>

@Volt, I agree the case on sparky is not perfect, but.. I just dont see anything better. I admit I should/could have a better idea of what is going on though. :/
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1309 on: September 02, 2012, 04:35:21 pm »

Yes. Why do the avatars keep changing? Can it stop?
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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1310 on: September 02, 2012, 04:50:46 pm »

Yes. Why do the avatars keep changing? Can it stop?
Cosmic Encounter I guess. I guess we'll just have to manage.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1311 on: September 02, 2012, 04:55:05 pm »

Yes. Why do the avatars keep changing? Can it stop?
Cosmic Encounter I guess. I guess we'll just have to manage.

Boooo.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1312 on: September 02, 2012, 04:57:27 pm »

Have there ever been cases on this forum where someone claimed a certain role and they were lying and ended up being scum? (Insomniac was kinda one, he half-lied. He was a doctor but the wrong kind.) I'm not tempted to read every nook and cranny of every mafia thread lol.

How did I forget to respond to Eevee's #1283? Like Volt stated, everyone suspects townies "left and right" all the time. Because, well, that's the game. At least I actually nailed ONE of the scum. That's a start for me. So Eevee is only on me because I have the strongest evidence against me although it's very weak evidence? The reason *I* haven't voted yet is because I don't have strong enough evidence to accuse anybody outright, although I have ideas. Should "ideas" just be enough? Or is it too risky?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1313 on: September 02, 2012, 05:02:23 pm »

Have there ever been cases on this forum where someone claimed a certain role and they were lying and ended up being scum? (Insomniac was kinda one, he half-lied. He was a doctor but the wrong kind.) I'm not tempted to read every nook and cranny of every mafia thread lol.

The answer is yes. I lied about being a Doctor in MII. Dsell lied about being a One-Shot Vig in MVI. Further lying happened in MIII and MVI.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1314 on: September 02, 2012, 05:02:52 pm »

Have there ever been cases on this forum where someone claimed a certain role and they were lying and ended up being scum? (Insomniac was kinda one, he half-lied. He was a doctor but the wrong kind.) I'm not tempted to read every nook and cranny of every mafia thread lol.

The answer is yes. I lied about being a Doctor in MII. Dsell lied about being a One-Shot Vig in MVI. Further lying happened in MIII and MVI.

and those people turned out to be scum, if that isn't clear.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1315 on: September 02, 2012, 05:03:30 pm »

Have there ever been cases on this forum where someone claimed a certain role and they were lying and ended up being scum? (Insomniac was kinda one, he half-lied. He was a doctor but the wrong kind.) I'm not tempted to read every nook and cranny of every mafia thread lol.

How did I forget to respond to Eevee's #1283? Like Volt stated, everyone suspects townies "left and right" all the time. Because, well, that's the game. At least I actually nailed ONE of the scum. That's a start for me. So Eevee is only on me because I have the strongest evidence against me although it's very weak evidence? The reason *I* haven't voted yet is because I don't have strong enough evidence to accuse anybody outright, although I have ideas. Should "ideas" just be enough? Or is it too risky?
Deadline september 3rd.. it is already september 3rd where I live!  :) I think not having your vote anywhere is almost criminal at this point.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1316 on: September 02, 2012, 05:05:03 pm »

If Ftl isn't going anywhere, I'll switch to sparky or yuma or whatever. Town is doing fine, no reason to squander it on a No Lynch.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1317 on: September 02, 2012, 05:20:18 pm »

Have there ever been cases on this forum where someone claimed a certain role and they were lying and ended up being scum? (Insomniac was kinda one, he half-lied. He was a doctor but the wrong kind.) I'm not tempted to read every nook and cranny of every mafia thread lol.

How did I forget to respond to Eevee's #1283? Like Volt stated, everyone suspects townies "left and right" all the time. Because, well, that's the game. At least I actually nailed ONE of the scum. That's a start for me. So Eevee is only on me because I have the strongest evidence against me although it's very weak evidence? The reason *I* haven't voted yet is because I don't have strong enough evidence to accuse anybody outright, although I have ideas. Should "ideas" just be enough? Or is it too risky?
Deadline september 3rd.. it is already september 3rd where I live!  :) I think not having your vote anywhere is almost criminal at this point.

I realize that >_<

If Ftl isn't going anywhere, I'll switch to sparky or yuma or whatever. Town is doing fine, no reason to squander it on a No Lynch.

Ftl isn't going anywhere. Although both of your alternatives are unfortunate to me. Then again what else do we have at this point lol. I wish I wouldn't have died for such lame reasons, but we're so far in now.

VOTE: Captain_Frisk is stupid at this point, but it's all I'm equipped to do. If I somehow last to the third day, I'll try to be more focused/helpful and less self-introverted with my posts, as with the D1 sparky.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1318 on: September 02, 2012, 06:45:12 pm »

i think either way frisk will likely die tonight, as such lynching him doesn't make much sense.
I still think CF is our guy, but this is a good point.

I'm also VLA till day end, so I'll just sheep Eevee and Grujah at this point.

Vote: sparky
It's quite obvious anyone having their vote on Frisk is just wasting it at this point! Give us a vote, everyone.

How? Why?

Why do we autobuy this claim?
The other scumteam will nightkill him anyways if he is lying.

That is false. It's why scum lost in M-VI. They cannot go balls-to-the-wall all out to kill the other scum team or town will overwhelm them. It's a balancing act and right now, "scum" (as a whole) are well behind. They absolutely do NOT want to kill each other tonight.

But the other scum team doesn't know if Frisk is actually another scum faction or a real doctor (now) and neither do we. Not killing Frisk leaves the door open for him actually having doc powers that can be used not only tonight, but tomorrow night as well to potentially block their night kills.... I don't think that is a risk scum would be willing to take.

Lynching Frisk now does reveal his actual alignment, but if he is a doc it prevents him from using his power (at least once) and potentially saving himself or another townie from being killed.
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1319 on: September 02, 2012, 06:55:06 pm »

As I understand it, yuma's rebuttal to my suspicion is, in very brief summary, "I fought against CF's lynch Day 2 - and if I were scum I'd have let it ride."  Do I have that right, yuma?

Sure, if you want to simplify, that is what it says. But that turns into W--and whatever other letters follow for the abbreviation of whatever that thing is that I still don't fully understand...

But my point is that I didn't just let it ride, I fought against it hard. And it isn't just if I were scum, but more if I were O's partner--which is specifically what you called me out to be.

How do you respond to my questions to you?

oh.... and I'll get to ftl later
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1320 on: September 02, 2012, 07:08:20 pm »

I am mostly likely to Vote: Captain_Frisk
for the same reason I did ehunt:
It is a stupid claim.
And I HATE that he threatened "I'll claim! You don't want me lynched!"

I don't like sparky voting him too, but well.

Maybe it would be better to let Frisk live this night and maybe lynch him tomorrow, but I have am totally fine with straight-out lynching him now.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1321 on: September 02, 2012, 07:48:55 pm »

I am mostly likely to Vote: Captain_Frisk
for the same reason I did ehunt:
It is a stupid claim.
And I HATE that he threatened "I'll claim! You don't want me lynched!"

I don't like sparky voting him too, but well.

Maybe it would be better to let Frisk live this night and maybe lynch him tomorrow, but I have am totally fine with straight-out lynching him now.

Well, I'm still on CF, but I think that Yuma's case on Sparky is just as sound. That's a lynch that I could see being decent and letting things with Frisk hopefully decide themselves tonight/tomorrow.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1322 on: September 02, 2012, 08:27:05 pm »

Frisk lynch is baad, yuma looks really towny to me, sparky time people!
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1323 on: September 02, 2012, 08:36:43 pm »

Frisk lynch is baad, yuma looks really towny to me, sparky time people!

Well, it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other to me. I don't really buy the claim, but can't exactly disapprove it, so I'm willing to wait and see for a day. Vote: Sparky
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1324 on: September 02, 2012, 08:51:19 pm »

ftl:

So he successfully navigated the doc claims by only voting insomniac, a feat very few of us that voted were able to do...

FoS: Galzria, Robz, yuma, voltgloss, eevee, grujah, axxle very early day 2 for being on ehunt wagon; crazy that three confirmed townies were on that wagon...

Nobody has really put together a solid case on him.I think the most comprehensive case I have found was from Morgrim!? in response to a-birds. His case is below in quotes. It seems like a lot of people but him as a possible lynch target instead of Frisk to Morgrim's questions.

"-He was on many wagons. Like a lot."   Not really... he voted around day 1, but I don't really think that is a bad thing, and he wasn't on the ehunt wagon.
-Was lurky, and when he posted, he wasnt helpful (D1).   Helpful? What does that mean? I think he put pressure on people, voted, probed, asked questions, answered question.
-Never even responded to Grujah. This is a flat out lie. He did, I think he was the first to respond and even voted Grujah...

I personally find ftl to be a bad lynch.

Now in response to why I voted sparky. I felt the the vote on Frisk to put him to L-1 prematurely was odd and I felt it warranted a closer look at sparky. I looked back on him and well, let's all be completely honest here... I didn't find much.

Here I took a risk. I decided to vote him, to 1. get a response from him and 2. see who else would join this wagon.

Sparky's responses have been fine, nothing bad has really come out of them.
But a lot of people have voted for him. I was hoping to find scum among the players voting for him, joining a wagon and catch them voting for someone with a pretty weak case. Because hey, the case on sparky isn't great. This plan backfired somewhat as confirmed townies, eevee, axxle and grujah voted onto it. But now it has been joined by Galz.

I know I am likely to raise suspicion on myself for doing this, but I honestly felt that this town needed some shaking up.

Right now I am going to change my vote to vote: Galzria. And will be going back and taking a good hard look at him, I know off the top of my head he was on the ehunt wagon, and has been quiet/lurky this game. I would be doing the same for Eevee, Axxle and Grujah as well if they weren't confirmed town.

Town what think ye?
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1325 on: September 02, 2012, 09:00:32 pm »

FoS: Galzria, Robz, yuma, voltgloss, eevee, grujah, axxle very early day 2 for being on ehunt wagon; crazy that three confirmed townies were on that wagon...

and this looks confusing, I apologize... mostly I was saying that early in the day ftl FOS: this group. I am obviously not FOSing myself, eevee, axxle, etc...
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1326 on: September 02, 2012, 09:18:44 pm »

Just to be clear then, you're voting for me because, less than 24 hours to deadline I switched my vote from someone I'm iffy on to someone else I'm iffy on, since the first has claimed some form of Doc and the second is realistically the only person likely to be lynched at this point? Sorry, but I would rather NOT present the scum with a free night to do their thing - and leaving my vote on Frisk at this time is only going to contribute to a no-lynch.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1327 on: September 02, 2012, 10:22:45 pm »

Vote Count 2.9

Captain_Frisk (2): Morgrim7, sparky5856
Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, ftl, angrybirds
sparky5856 (4): Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, Galzria
yuma (1): Voltgloss
ftl (1): Robz888
Galzria (1): yuma

not voting (0):

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m. 17 hours remain.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1328 on: September 02, 2012, 10:59:21 pm »

@#1324

L-2? That was a ballzy experiment  ;D

And Frisk has only two votes. What the heck am I doing? UNVOTE: Captain_Frisk, seems like I play differently under pressure. I'm still all for my "Galz as SK" conspiracy theory. Or, as any scum really at this point. VOTE: Galz, now that he has a potential wagon it makes more sense to vote him.

yuma's move is even ballzier if he is scum. If I was scum I would have just left the vote on me. This clears him up even more.
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1329 on: September 02, 2012, 11:03:01 pm »

Hopefully we can settle all this by 1PM EST, that's the latest I'll be on this day. FYI
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1330 on: September 03, 2012, 12:24:15 am »

Just to be clear then, you're voting for me because, less than 24 hours to deadline I switched my vote from someone I'm iffy on to someone else I'm iffy on, since the first has claimed some form of Doc and the second is realistically the only person likely to be lynched at this point? Sorry, but I would rather NOT present the scum with a free night to do their thing - and leaving my vote on Frisk at this time is only going to contribute to a no-lynch.

To be clear, I am voting for you because, as you say, I do not want to leave the mafia with a no-lynch and the other two viable wagons--C-Frisk and sparky--are ones I am not interested in. C-Frisk due to his claim. Sparky because the case against him--and the case I made up--is not sufficient reason for me to vote him. Furthermore because I do not believe his wagon to be a good one it seems to me that you used his wagon and the impending lynch deadline as a convenient excuse to put a vote onto him and melt into the background as day 2 came to an end. I do not buy any argument that there is not enough time to start a new wagon. Because, well I am starting one now. There is still time, certainly more time than others have had in previous games in attempting to start new wagons while other lesser wagons existed. I do wish that I had been able to start a wagon against a sparky voter earlier. But my plan backfired as only confirmed townies joined on--ironic yes--and other votes did not accumulate as fast as I had anticipated, perhaps it wasn't as clever of a trap as I had thought it? And perhaps it wasn't the best plan, but it is something I wanted to try.

I am glad that the person who came into it was a person who was on the ehunt wagon, as that is where my focus of suspicion has been throughout the day.

I am still interested in what the rest of the town thinks.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1331 on: September 03, 2012, 12:41:49 am »

Just to be clear then, you're voting for me because, less than 24 hours to deadline I switched my vote from someone I'm iffy on to someone else I'm iffy on, since the first has claimed some form of Doc and the second is realistically the only person likely to be lynched at this point? Sorry, but I would rather NOT present the scum with a free night to do their thing - and leaving my vote on Frisk at this time is only going to contribute to a no-lynch.

To be clear, I am voting for you because, as you say, I do not want to leave the mafia with a no-lynch and the other two viable wagons--C-Frisk and sparky--are ones I am not interested in. C-Frisk due to his claim. Sparky because the case against him--and the case I made up--is not sufficient reason for me to vote him. Furthermore because I do not believe his wagon to be a good one it seems to me that you used his wagon and the impending lynch deadline as a convenient excuse to put a vote onto him and melt into the background as day 2 came to an end. I do not buy any argument that there is not enough time to start a new wagon. Because, well I am starting one now. There is still time, certainly more time than others have had in previous games in attempting to start new wagons while other lesser wagons existed. I do wish that I had been able to start a wagon against a sparky voter earlier. But my plan backfired as only confirmed townies joined on--ironic yes--and other votes did not accumulate as fast as I had anticipated, perhaps it wasn't as clever of a trap as I had thought it? And perhaps it wasn't the best plan, but it is something I wanted to try.

I am glad that the person who came into it was a person who was on the ehunt wagon, as that is where my focus of suspicion has been throughout the day.

I am still interested in what the rest of the town thinks.

So your basing your scumreads on a nonexistent flip and of the alignment of a player that isn't known? Mmk.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1332 on: September 03, 2012, 12:49:29 am »

By the way, Yuma, before accusing someone of being quiet and lurky, you should check to make sure that they haven't posted almost 50% more than you (91 posts compared to 67).
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1333 on: September 03, 2012, 01:01:56 am »

Just to be clear then, you're voting for me because, less than 24 hours to deadline I switched my vote from someone I'm iffy on to someone else I'm iffy on, since the first has claimed some form of Doc and the second is realistically the only person likely to be lynched at this point? Sorry, but I would rather NOT present the scum with a free night to do their thing - and leaving my vote on Frisk at this time is only going to contribute to a no-lynch.

To be clear, I am voting for you because, as you say, I do not want to leave the mafia with a no-lynch and the other two viable wagons--C-Frisk and sparky--are ones I am not interested in. C-Frisk due to his claim. Sparky because the case against him--and the case I made up--is not sufficient reason for me to vote him. Furthermore because I do not believe his wagon to be a good one it seems to me that you used his wagon and the impending lynch deadline as a convenient excuse to put a vote onto him and melt into the background as day 2 came to an end. I do not buy any argument that there is not enough time to start a new wagon. Because, well I am starting one now. There is still time, certainly more time than others have had in previous games in attempting to start new wagons while other lesser wagons existed. I do wish that I had been able to start a wagon against a sparky voter earlier. But my plan backfired as only confirmed townies joined on--ironic yes--and other votes did not accumulate as fast as I had anticipated, perhaps it wasn't as clever of a trap as I had thought it? And perhaps it wasn't the best plan, but it is something I wanted to try.

I am glad that the person who came into it was a person who was on the ehunt wagon, as that is where my focus of suspicion has been throughout the day.

I am still interested in what the rest of the town thinks.

So your basing your scumreads on a nonexistent flip and of the alignment of a player that isn't known? Mmk.

Yes my alignment isn't known. That was the whole point of his plan; start a poorly-constructed wagon against possible scum and see who joins. Evidence on me is bogus and contradictory, I've already stated that.

Man this is nothing like the last day. Everyone is snoozing away. It might be too late at this point.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1334 on: September 03, 2012, 01:21:50 am »

I don't know what to do. Deadline in less than a day, and I'm the only one on frisk. Ok, Vote: Sparky. I might not be available for a bit. Lets see what happens. P.S., I like yuma's argument about Galz.
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I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1335 on: September 03, 2012, 01:48:19 am »



Almost Homage To The Best Card Thread worthy  ;D
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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1336 on: September 03, 2012, 02:30:27 am »

Off to bed, I'll be on one final time this day, try to keep me alive until then.  ;) I'm not sure how much progress we'll make these final hours, I was expecting a mad rush of posts like Day 1 >_<
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1337 on: September 03, 2012, 05:35:32 am »

Sparky trying too hard to get another wagon going.
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1338 on: September 03, 2012, 10:53:15 am »

Vote Count 2.10


Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, ftl, angrybirds
sparky5856 (5): Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, Galzria, Morgrim7 {L-2}
yuma (1): Voltgloss
ftl (1): Robz888
Galzria (1): yuma, sparky5856

not voting (0)

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m. 6 hours remain.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1339 on: September 03, 2012, 11:05:31 am »

I wish I had time to finish my "...reading from the beginning..." posts, but unfortunately real life has conspired against that - so let me summarize recent thoughts as:

- (yuma's gambit) Exactly the kind of thing I tried to do in a recent (not yet finished) game where I was Town.

- (sparky case) Like it not.  yuma's case on Galz makes a lot more sense to me.  Galz citing raw statistics in response (post counts) feels slightly scummy to me - citing raw numbers without taking into account how many posts were RVS or non-substantive?  Misleading. 

yuma and I have had our different views in the past but I approve of his thinking here.

Vote: Galzria

(yuma:  you asked what my response was to your points - I apologize but which post #s are you referencing that you wanted me to address?)
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1340 on: September 03, 2012, 11:55:51 am »

Vote: Galzria

Like that better than sparky lynch. Sparky is typical eager newbie. More so than angry birds, who I also suspect is town.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1341 on: September 03, 2012, 12:10:54 pm »

Jeez, one of the few games where I don't want to lynch Galz and everybody are jumping him. He struck me sincere, esp. standing up for angrybirds.


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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1342 on: September 03, 2012, 12:31:06 pm »

Well, I'm in too many games anyway, so feel free to watch the scum derail their own wagons to lynch a town member.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1343 on: September 03, 2012, 12:32:56 pm »

It's 3 conf town on sparky. Come on, guys.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1344 on: September 03, 2012, 12:41:03 pm »

That leaves Captain_Frisk, ftl, and angrybirds not voting either of us. I'm still more likely to go. Maybe I was a bit TOO eager of a newbie lol. That one mistake I made where I yelled at everyone was the perfect opportunity for yuma to form his plan. Funny how one mistake completely nullifies everything.

Sparky trying too hard to get another wagon going.

All that I got going for me at this point. I wasn't confident in Galz cause no one even touched him. Now that there's at least a shred of evidence that someone else has come up with, it increased my confidence.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1345 on: September 03, 2012, 01:03:42 pm »

Probably the last time I'll get to post this day. How likely is it that C_F, angrybirds, and ftl will be able to be here within the next four hours? Idk.

But I feel particularly sour about this death because I feel like it wasn't for good reason. I mean, I would feel totally honorable about dying against legit evidence because that means, hey I lost legit, gg guys. But I don't feel that way here, real life intruded and that set me to my downfall. It's like when I try to go for an IGG rush and I hit less than $5 on turns 1-4 and end up losing. Kinda.

But hey, if I do die, then this game definitely had its fun moments, so thanks all for letting me take a part of it. Idk if I'll join another game due to college looming, I'll see. And if I don't die, then that's great too lol. I'll just see when I come back. Again, I apologize about yelling. I'll try not to let it happen again  :)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1346 on: September 03, 2012, 01:50:30 pm »

Vote Count 2.11


Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, ftl, angrybirds
sparky5856 (5): Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, Galzria, Morgrim7 {L-2}
Galzria (4): yuma, sparky5856, Voltgloss, Robz888

not voting (0)

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m. 3 hours remain.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1347 on: September 03, 2012, 02:07:29 pm »

Trying to bring myself up to date so ill make a list you all seem so fond of
will not vote for eevee, axxle, grujah (duh) me
don't think is mafia: neither the FTl case or the sparky case carry weight.i find it odd that so many confirmed town are on sparky.
Could be: yuma (the only thing here is his case on sparky) volt i need to go back and take a harder look at same fir galz
willing and am voting for: robz, thecaptain and morgrim
hopefully I will bring more to the table later this weekend

as I mentioned before I don't think the sparky case is any good. Let's see if my early day 1 reD turned out to be correct afterall. vote: galz
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1348 on: September 03, 2012, 02:27:39 pm »

The good news is, with 3 confirmed town, it'll be REALLY easy to find scum aboard my wagon.

Sparky absolutely is. Read his last post. He's worried that he was going to get caught and lose for non-legitimate reasons. He even says that he wouldn't have minded if it was because he messed up somehow - but that he felt he didn't really make any real mistakes. That's scum justifying their play, not town (especially because town doesn't lose by having one of it's members lynched, whereas a scum team could potentially at this point).

Yuma... I don't think is scum, but really, really don't hold me to that. It's hard not to OMGUS his terrible lying gambit, but I just can't see why scum would do that. Eh.

Volt - not sure.

Robz - WAY to opportunistic and lurky this game. Probably the best place for an investigation because scum Robz COULD play this way.

ABirds is town.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1349 on: September 03, 2012, 02:32:22 pm »

Phone posting, but Galzria is absolutely right--Sparky's statement reads scum confession to me. Vote: Sparky
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1350 on: September 03, 2012, 02:35:00 pm »

Vote Count 2.12


Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, ftl
sparky5856 (6): Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, Galzria, Morgrim7, Robz888 {L-1}
Galzria (4): yuma, sparky5856, Voltgloss, angrybirds

not voting (0)

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m. ~2 hours remain.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1351 on: September 03, 2012, 02:35:35 pm »

Phone posting, but Galzria is absolutely right--Sparky's statement reads scum confession to me. Vote: Sparky

Scummish vote, but I'd like sparky lynch waaay more. Except Robz, all those I trust (Morg too!) are on him.

Somebody hammer while we still can.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1352 on: September 03, 2012, 02:36:17 pm »

But I feel particularly sour about this death because I feel like it wasn't for good reason. I mean, I would feel totally honorable about dying against legit evidence because that means, hey I lost legit, gg guys. But I don't feel that way here, real life intruded and that set me to my downfall. It's like when I try to go for an IGG rush and I hit less than $5 on turns 1-4 and end up losing. Kinda.

This is the part Galzria and Robz are talking about. Now, they could very well both be scum but it looks like a scum that's giving up (why though, looks like a no-lynch more than anything??) to me too. Weird.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1353 on: September 03, 2012, 02:37:09 pm »

Sparky D1 is super-scum, if he doesn't die I blame myself for not pushing too hard.  :'(
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1354 on: September 03, 2012, 02:48:26 pm »

Phone posting, but Galzria is absolutely right--Sparky's statement reads scum confession to me. Vote: Sparky

Agreed.  Vote: Sparky.  I realize this is the hammer.  But man, Sparky's last is a scum confession, plain and simple.  There's just no getting around it.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1355 on: September 03, 2012, 02:48:37 pm »

Sparky trying too hard to get another wagon going.
It's 3 conf town on sparky. Come on, guys.
This is terrible.  It's too late for a Grujah lynch today, but I'm looking at it tomorrow.

@Robz: ftl's reasons for voting on you might be very bad, but doesn't necessarily make him scum. I'm not exactly sure why others are voting for you.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1356 on: September 03, 2012, 02:49:12 pm »

But I feel particularly sour about this death because I feel like it wasn't for good reason. I mean, I would feel totally honorable about dying against legit evidence because that means, hey I lost legit, gg guys. But I don't feel that way here, real life intruded and that set me to my downfall. It's like when I try to go for an IGG rush and I hit less than $5 on turns 1-4 and end up losing. Kinda.

This is the part Galzria and Robz are talking about. Now, they could very well both be scum but it looks like a scum that's giving up (why though, looks like a no-lynch more than anything??) to me too. Weird.

I think it's weird too, but it just can't be ignored. It looks too bad, and we need to lynch someone, and I don't know we should let it slide in case it's exactly what it appears to be.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1357 on: September 03, 2012, 02:51:06 pm »

Hammer.

Thread closed.

Bigger text this time >:|
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1358 on: September 03, 2012, 02:57:49 pm »


sparky5856 had the best role PM in all of role PM history, but they killed him anyway.

sparky5856 has been lynched.
He was the Page of Pentacles, Mafia Goon.


Send in your night actions; Day 3 starts September 4, 3:00 PM Forums Time.


Final Day 2 Vote Count

Robz888 (2): Captain_Frisk, ftl
sparky5856 (7): Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, Galzria, Morgrim7, Robz888, Voltgloss
Galzria (3): yuma, sparky5856, angrybirds

not voting (0)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1359 on: September 04, 2012, 01:08:16 pm »

You lynched Mafia! Surely this game will end soon in a town victory! So you thought, before checking the obits. And by obits, I am referring to the pile of bodies in the middle of town.

Grujah was a homeless dude with an exceptionally strong grip. And now he's been ripped into several chunks.
Grujah has been killed. He was the Five of Pentacles, One-shot Strongman Vigilante.

Eevee had a sweet laboratory full of sweet futuristic weapons, and a body full of sweet bullet holes.
Eevee has been killed. He was the Ace of Swords, One-shot Weak Vigilante.

yuma's body was found in the office where he spent most of his time working. Apparenly he had a heart attack.
yuma has been killed. He was the Two of Wands, Vanilla Townie.

Well! There's 8 of you left alive. Looks like it takes 5 to lynch.

Thread Open
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 01:13:53 pm by cayvie »
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1360 on: September 04, 2012, 02:22:45 pm »

captain frisk is still alive? what does that mean?
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1361 on: September 04, 2012, 02:30:39 pm »

captain frisk is still alive? what does that mean?

Either that he is a scum, or the scum left him alive so that we would think that. Which is not a terribly helpful answer, but it's the answer.

Incidentally, Sparky's death should be instructive: sometimes the simplest answer is the best answer. Sparky appeared to confess to being scum, we lynched him, and he was indeed scum.

In the flavor text for the deaths, I see evidence of at least 1 more mafia and 1 more werewolf. We've already seen 2 mafia dispatched, am I right in assuming there is only 1 more? It's probably useful to speculate about how many scum we have left. Of the people left alive, Axxle is the only one we can definitively conclude is town, I believe.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1362 on: September 04, 2012, 02:31:37 pm »

CF, who did you target?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1363 on: September 04, 2012, 02:34:24 pm »

CF, who did you target?

Both Night 1 and Night 2.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1364 on: September 04, 2012, 03:37:36 pm »

Grujah looked like WW kill.  Eevee was the mafia kill. One-shot weak vig isn't that bad of a power role to lose, that wasn't so bad. Yuma was the SK kill then, since we know we have an SK.

Pretty bad but at least they weren't too powerful power roles.  Total dead so far is 5 town, 3 scum? We're still doing ok I think?

That's the thing with the multiple scumteams, it sort of self-balances, the scumteams have to either gun for the opposing scumteam or town depending on how they're doing.

Potentially likely remaining numbers: 1 mafia, 1 SK, 2 WW, 4 town. Either a Town or Mafia major arcana in there somewhere. Or maybe the SK is a major arcana.

Best-case scenario for town: we lynch a WW, and then the mafia/sk/ww shoot each other and all die at night and town wins. Worst-case scenario for town: we lynch town, and three town die at night, and there's just three scumteams vying for the win. This is a swingy game...
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1365 on: September 04, 2012, 06:41:25 pm »

Ooof, that hurt. Who thinks there might be a vig out there?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1366 on: September 04, 2012, 06:50:42 pm »

Ooof, that hurt. Who thinks there might be a vig out there?

There's the Morgrim we know and love.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1367 on: September 04, 2012, 07:05:40 pm »

waiting for frisk's answer before I speculate what happened.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1368 on: September 04, 2012, 08:54:57 pm »

Phone posting.

I protected axle. I thought that the obv town players would be targets after the disaster that was m6 (remember I was scum there)

I figured Grujah was the obvious target for me - especially since he might have more powers -  so scum might go after one of the cleared townies.   Clearly I picked the wrong wine.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1369 on: September 04, 2012, 08:59:48 pm »

[yuma] had a heart attack.
Does everyone think this was the serial killer?  I'm not so sure. Last night we had a stabbing. I don't really see any poisoning roles though, unless it's some kind of Major Arcana.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1370 on: September 04, 2012, 09:00:49 pm »

Phone posting.

I protected axle. I thought that the obv town players would be targets after the disaster that was m6 (remember I was scum there)

I figured Grujah was the obvious target for me - especially since he might have more powers -  so scum might go after one of the cleared townies.   Clearly I picked the wrong wine.
Who did you target the night before last?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1371 on: September 04, 2012, 09:20:28 pm »

[yuma] had a heart attack.
Does everyone think this was the serial killer?  I'm not so sure. Last night we had a stabbing. I don't really see any poisoning roles though, unless it's some kind of Major Arcana.

I'm wondering if this might have been Eevee's kill.  Note the flavor in Eevee's death about him having a laboratory and futuristic weapons.  Perhaps his futuristic weapon was a death-ray-like-thing or biochemical weapon, that could give someone a heart attack - but if that someone was scum, he (Eevee) would have a heart attack too?

I realize Eevee cited yuma as reading town (at least towards the end of Day 2 - I haven't reread in full yet), but maybe sparky's flip and yuma's refusal to get on that wagon led Eevee to change his mind during the night? 

Either way, I think Eevee likely used his nightkill last night (after being modconfirmed as town he could expect to be a prime scum target, so it's reasonable that he wouldn't want to take a town-aligned nightkill to the grave with him).  So whether it's Eevee's kill or the SK's kill, we seem to be missing a kill that should have happened. 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1372 on: September 04, 2012, 09:22:56 pm »

[yuma] had a heart attack.
Does everyone think this was the serial killer?  I'm not so sure. Last night we had a stabbing. I don't really see any poisoning roles though, unless it's some kind of Major Arcana.

I'm wondering if this might have been Eevee's kill.  Note the flavor in Eevee's death about him having a laboratory and futuristic weapons.  Perhaps his futuristic weapon was a death-ray-like-thing or biochemical weapon, that could give someone a heart attack - but if that someone was scum, he (Eevee) would have a heart attack too?

I realize Eevee cited yuma as reading town (at least towards the end of Day 2 - I haven't reread in full yet), but maybe sparky's flip and yuma's refusal to get on that wagon led Eevee to change his mind during the night? 

Either way, I think Eevee likely used his nightkill last night (after being modconfirmed as town he could expect to be a prime scum target, so it's reasonable that he wouldn't want to take a town-aligned nightkill to the grave with him).  So whether it's Eevee's kill or the SK's kill, we seem to be missing a kill that should have happened.
Good enough for me.  CF probably saved me last night then... or chose not the target anyone as SK, heh.
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1373 on: September 04, 2012, 10:43:09 pm »

Phone posting.

I protected axle. I thought that the obv town players would be targets after the disaster that was m6 (remember I was scum there)

I figured Grujah was the obvious target for me - especially since he might have more powers -  so scum might go after one of the cleared townies.   Clearly I picked the wrong wine.
Who did you target the night before last?

Angry birds. I didn't have any strong reads.  Sorry for delay - been enjoying teaching my father about quality beer. He is a colors light drinker.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1374 on: September 05, 2012, 04:36:10 am »

[yuma] had a heart attack.
Does everyone think this was the serial killer?  I'm not so sure. Last night we had a stabbing. I don't really see any poisoning roles though, unless it's some kind of Major Arcana.

Major arcana SK seems like a plausible role. Maybe investigation immune or x-shot bulletproof or something.

Is axxle the only obvtown left?

Still FoSing Robz

we need a seer to help us find a ww :(

buying C_F's claim, maybe I'm stupid but lol so many docs

what on earth happened to "there's a scum among ftl, C_F, robz" from back when?
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1375 on: September 05, 2012, 10:32:17 am »

what on earth happened to "there's a scum among ftl, C_F, robz" from back when?

I don't even remember who raised that theory or what was its basis.  But the comment got me thinking... thinking about the end of Day 2, and sparky's lynch, and the identity of his (probably last) remaining Mafioso confederate.

This is the votecount immediately after sparky's "confession" post from Day 2 (before anyone else changed their votes or posted further):

Vote Count 2.11


Robz888 (3): Captain_Frisk, ftl, angrybirds
sparky5856 (5): Eevee, Grujah, Axxle, Galzria, Morgrim7 {L-2}
Galzria (4): yuma, sparky5856, Voltgloss, Robz888

not voting (0)

With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 3 @ 5 p.m. 3 hours remain.


After this, the following things happen in rapid succession, in the last couple of hours before the lynch deadline:

- abirds changes his vote from Robz to Galz
- Galz points out sparky's last post was a confession
- Robz agrees, changes his vote from Galz to sparky
- I agree, changing my vote from Galz to sparky, hammering

We also now know that there is at least one still-living Mafioso, who was allied with sparky and Insom.

Up until sparky basically committed seppuku with the confession post, it was not at all clear he was going to be lynched.  The largest wagon was on him, sure, but multiple players had said publicly they didn't like it, with most of the town (7 of us) split between the Robz and Galz wagons.  From this I conclude that it is unlikely the last Mafioso was on sparky's wagon at the time of the confession post.  What incentive would he have to bus?  His colleague's lynch was by no means a certainty, the deadline was fast approaching, and with multiple scumfactions around he gets no "town cred" by being on a successful scum-lynching wagon.

And then sparky imploded, and Robz and I put the nails in his coffin in response.  I know I'm not Mafia (or WW or SK for that matter), and I rather doubt Robz is Mafia because there was so little time left to go before the deadline - if he were Mafia, all he had to do to very likely save his partner's life was to keep quiet.

That leaves three living people who weren't on the sparky wagon at Day 2's end:  Captain_Frisk, ftl, and angrybirds.  I strongly suspect we will find Mafia among those three.

And now that we know that whoever is the likely-last Mafioso was on a scumteam with Insom and sparky, I think it's time to reread Days 1 and 2 with this information in hand, particularly with respect to CF, ftl, and abirds. 
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1376 on: September 05, 2012, 02:42:53 pm »

had a longer post but comp crashed and lost it i was on insomniac wagon, ftl was as well I think. As for sparky I didn't notice the scumslip at all
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1377 on: September 05, 2012, 02:47:26 pm »

I rather doubt Robz is Mafia because there was so little time left to go before the deadline
Maybe, but I'm not so sure.  He may have been trying for some last minute towncred.  I just know I'm not letting you or Robz off the hook just yet.

You're post is good in general, I'm also pretty sure mafia isn't bussing here.  But I'm also concerned a bit on how tunneling toward mafia this seems.  I'm going to be looking for mafia connections between ftl, robz, angrybirds, and you as mafia.  Also at you as WW.

Solely from your post though it seems like angrybirds might be the primary suspect for mafia.  I'll definitely have to reread though.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1378 on: September 05, 2012, 03:30:28 pm »

had a longer post but comp crashed and lost it i was on insomniac wagon, ftl was as well I think.

Yes, you both were.  Along with sparky. 

Unlike bussing sparky Day 2, "bussing" Insom late in Day 1 makes more sense as a Mafia move.  By that time the lynchwagon was rolling on a collision course with ehunt, and Insom - having claimed Doctor - was a likely nightkill target by competing scum.  So sparky (and maybe his teammate) wasn't actually CONTRIBUTING to Insom's death, and so his/their vote(s) were risk-free and would pay towncred dividends if Insom was nightkilled, thus flipping scum (as he did).

Will reread the order and timing of Day 1 votes re: Insom/ehunt.  There may be some further clues there.

But I'm also concerned a bit on how tunneling toward mafia this seems.  I'm going to be looking for mafia connections between ftl, robz, angrybirds, and you as mafia.  Also at you as WW.

Fair enough.  The reason I'm focused on Mafia right now is that we have new information available about the last Mafioso; we know he was a partner with Insom and sparky.  And now we have sparky's behavior throughout Day 2 to analyze through the lens of his flip. 

At present, I suspect we have 1 each of Mafia, WW*, and SK left.  Our goal today is to lynch one of them.  I think, because we have the most information about the last Mafioso today, we have the best chance at finding the last Mafioso today.  So that's where I'm scrutinizing now.

Also, I think it's premature to strike CF from the suspicion list.  It's possible he's a backup doctor but far from proven.  I especially don't like how he didn't reveal his Night 1 protection choice at the same time as his Night 2 choice, despite having been asked for both.  If CF were a real (backup) doctor, why wouldn't he have revealed both night protection choices together?  What, did he need to quickly look back to the end of Day 1 and pick someone who might make sense as a doctor target choice?  Feels eerily similar to Insom's claiming "doctor" Day 1 without simultaneously claiming his actual card.  Doling out information piecemeal could be because it's being manufactured.

* I know ftl posited 2 WWs remaining.  That would be 7 scum out of a town of 16.  Almost half?  That doesn't feel balanced to me, especially when we know that of the "9" town, at least 2 were VT and 2 were one-shots.  I think 6 scum out of 16 players is the more likely allocation.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1379 on: September 05, 2012, 04:52:48 pm »

* I know ftl posited 2 WWs remaining.  That would be 7 scum out of a town of 16.  Almost half?  That doesn't feel balanced to me, especially when we know that of the "9" town, at least 2 were VT and 2 were one-shots.  I think 6 scum out of 16 players is the more likely allocation.
You can't think of it as town v. everyone else.  It's town v. mafia v. WW v. SK.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1380 on: September 05, 2012, 04:54:16 pm »

Also, I think it's premature to strike CF from the suspicion list.  It's possible he's a backup doctor but far from proven.
I'm willing to give it one more day.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1381 on: September 05, 2012, 07:49:07 pm »

I think one of C_F, ftl, and Angrybirds should be our lynch targets. I would support any of these three. It is odd, all three had votes on Robz. Can we assume Robz to be town?
Out of the three targets, I would rank them like this from scummiest to least: ftl, Abirds, C_F. So for now, Vote: ftl. Will be gone until nightfall at my place, busy day today.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1382 on: September 06, 2012, 10:18:48 am »

So voltgloss is suspecting ftl, frisk and myself for being mafia.

the reason for this suspicion is that we werent on the sparky wagon at the time of confession post. but he does not point out that neither was Voltgloss. at the time of sparky's confession, volt's vote was on Galz. Galz then pointed out the confession and Robz and voltgloss jump onto it and lynch scum.  is it possible that voltgloss was the final buss vote for his own partner? it seems as plausible as ftl, myself or frisk being sparky's partner. i realize that the deadline was in 2 hours, but that was a pretty quick hammer for someone who was obviously going to be lynched by deadline. he didnt even offer a "does anyone have anything else left to say before I hammer" post. Voltgloss seemed to be extremely worried that another player would hammer sparky instead resulting in voltgloss becoming one of us that didn't vote that he is now suspicious of.

Two more things that volt fails to point out: 1 that I voted sparky before Galz showed his statement as a scumtell. I didn't see it as a scumtell at that time and was not on again until after day2 was done. Voltgloss had the advantage of being online and seeing Galz' interpretation and being there for the opportunity for the hammer I wasnt.

Second, I highly doubt that mafia sparky would put frisk to L-1 if he was his partner, especially with morgram in the game.

one more point: voltgloss feels that voting for insomniac day 1 is not enough evidence against being partners with sparky and insomniac. instead he implies that scum would be on that wagon early day1 to establish town cred. ftl and myself were on that wagon. but so was voltgloss.

vote: voltgloss for not telling the whole story and trying to lead town in potentially the wrong direciton
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1383 on: September 06, 2012, 11:26:30 am »

I don't mind being suspected, but I do mind the facts being misrepresented. 

the reason for this suspicion is that we werent on the sparky wagon at the time of confession post. but he does not point out that neither was Voltgloss. at the time of sparky's confession, volt's vote was on Galz. Galz then pointed out the confession and Robz and voltgloss jump onto it and lynch scum.

My post lays out the votecount as of the confession post and then states what changed afterwards:  abirds moved his vote to Galz, Galz pointed out the confession, Robz and I agreed and moved our votes to abirds.  abirds saying I didn't "point [this] out" is simply wrong.

Two more things that volt fails to point out: 1 that I voted sparky before Galz showed his statement as a scumtell. I didn't see it as a scumtell at that time and was not on again until after day2 was done. Voltgloss had the advantage of being online and seeing Galz' interpretation and being there for the opportunity for the hammer I wasnt.

1.  You have never voted sparky.  At all.  The entire game.
2.  I did not "fail[] to point out" that you changed your vote to Galz before Galz called out sparky's statement as a confession.  I made that perfectly clear in describing the events that occurred, in the order they occurred.

Second, I highly doubt that mafia sparky would put frisk to L-1 if he was his partner, especially with morgram in the game.

This sounds like sparky put CF to L-1 and left his vote there for someone to hammer.  In fact, sparky put CF to L-1 and then unvoted 12 minutes later.  Tell the whole story, abirds.

one more point: voltgloss feels that voting for insomniac day 1 is not enough evidence against being partners with sparky and insomniac. instead he implies that scum would be on that wagon early day1 to establish town cred. ftl and myself were on that wagon. but so was voltgloss.

Notice my post refers to bussing Insom late in Day 1.  As in, after Insom's doctor claim.  "By [which] time the lynchwagon was rolling on a collision course with ehunt."  My point is that Insom's partners could comfortably leave their votes on Insom while the rest of the town lynched ehunt, knowing that if Insom was nightkilled (which was likely) they would look good the following day - and also knowing that their votes weren't actually causing the lynch of their teammate.  Was my vote on Insom then?  No, it was with the bulk of the town on ehunt.  Whose votes were on Insom then?  His scummate sparky; and abirds and ftl.

vote: voltgloss for not telling the whole story and trying to lead town in potentially the wrong direciton

The person "not telling the whole story" isn't me.  It's you.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (ALL NIGHT ACTIONS RECEIVED, PROCESSING)
« Reply #1384 on: September 06, 2012, 11:31:09 am »

Addendum: 

Notice my post refers to bussing Insom late in Day 1.  As in, after Insom's doctor claim.  "By [which] time the lynchwagon was rolling on a collision course with ehunt."  My point is that Insom's partners could comfortably leave their votes on Insom while the rest of the town lynched ehunt, knowing that if Insom was nightkilled (which was likely) they would look good the following day - and also knowing that their votes weren't actually causing the lynch of their teammate.  Was my vote on Insom then?  No, it was with the bulk of the town on ehunt.  Whose votes were on Insom then?  His scummate sparky; and abirds and ftl.

On reread I see abirds also changed his vote from Insom to shraeye before the very end of the day.  So this argument holds most strongly for ftl, not abirds. 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1385 on: September 06, 2012, 12:17:37 pm »

It looks to me Voltgloss has the right of it in his argument with Abirds. My own cursory analysis shows that Abirds never voted for Sparky (contrary to what he said). He did vote for Insomniac on Day 1, and Insomniac voted for him at about the same time. This is actually the strongest evidence that Abirds is not part of the same scumteam as Insomniac and Sparky, because Insomniac is the most purely retaliatory voter in Forum Games. So I see him voting for Abirds in response as something he would do to somebody not aligned with him.

Now, that's not such a strong piece of evidence, but it's something. However, Sparky did vote for Insomniac at some point, so we know these mafia people are doing at least a bit of voting for each other.

On the other hand, ftl never voted for Insomniac or sparky as far as I can tell, nor did either of them vote for him.

As an aside, I will say that I am almost certain Voltgloss is town. He's one of the players I feel more adept at reading, compared to others (I correctly deduced he was scum very early in MIII, and late in BMMMI).
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1386 on: September 06, 2012, 01:31:08 pm »

Back from travelling - still on vacation though - so posting to be odd.  I need to do a re-read. 

As for Volt and not answering my protection questions to his satisfaction - I was phone posting and did not clearly read the request for both days.  I do agree that there's no way to validate my claim, but I don't know what to do about that.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1387 on: September 06, 2012, 07:00:58 pm »

So sorry I've been lurking. Busy busy busy busy....yeah. Anyway, no new reads, abirds became slightly scummier after volt's rebuttal.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1388 on: September 06, 2012, 08:03:54 pm »

that is what i get for trying to rush a post before class, i apologize for mistakes, lets see if we can clear the air

(1) Yes, I never voted for sparky, I meant to say that I had voted for Galz. It was a simple mistake and one that you just made as well. I confused sparky/Galz while you confused me and sparky, so this is a mute point
Robz and I agreed and moved our votes to abirds.

(2) all i was trying to say about your vote not being on sparky at the time of Galz's scumslip detection was that you weren't on the wagon either at the time of the detection. You do give a timeline of the events, but you do not bring specific attention to it in the way that you brought attention to frisk, ftl and myself.

Up until sparky basically committed seppuku with the confession post, it was not at all clear he was going to be lynched.  The largest wagon was on him, sure, but multiple players had said publicly they didn't like it, with most of the town (7 of us) split between the Robz and Galz wagons.  From this I conclude that it is unlikely the last Mafioso was on sparky's wagon at the time of the confession post.  What incentive would he have to bus?  His colleague's lynch was by no means a certainty, the deadline was fast approaching, and with multiple scumfactions around he gets no "town cred" by being on a successful scum-lynching wagon.

From this I took that it is very easy to include you with us three, but you don't. Is it because you "know" you aren't mafia? Well I don't know you aren't mafia, so I am including you with us.


(3) these quotations seem to be in disagreement
My point is that Insom's partners could comfortably leave their votes on Insom while the rest of the town lynched ehunt, knowing that if Insom was nightkilled (which was likely) they would look good the following day - and also knowing that their votes weren't actually causing the lynch of their teammate.  Was my vote on Insom then?  No, it was with the bulk of the town on ehunt.  Whose votes were on Insom then?  His scummate sparky; and abirds and ftl.

On reread I see abirds also changed his vote from Insom to shraeye before the very end of the day.  So this argument holds most strongly for ftl, not abirds.

according to the first a scum angrybirds would have been smart to leave his vote on insomniac to the end of day, but I didn't as you point out in the second quote; i changed my vote to shraeye who was a townie, but was acting scummy at day end. But the second quote says that changing my vote from insomniac to shraeye invalidates an argument that I am town

(4) the vote on C-frisk by sparky was removed only because of some immediate, major pressure from yuma. w/o his criticism I could see sparky leaving that vote there just hoping that morgrim would come along and hammer and then we would all blame morgrim and forget sparky
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1389 on: September 06, 2012, 09:11:10 pm »

(3) these quotations seem to be in disagreement
My point is that Insom's partners could comfortably leave their votes on Insom while the rest of the town lynched ehunt, knowing that if Insom was nightkilled (which was likely) they would look good the following day - and also knowing that their votes weren't actually causing the lynch of their teammate.  Was my vote on Insom then?  No, it was with the bulk of the town on ehunt.  Whose votes were on Insom then?  His scummate sparky; and abirds and ftl.

On reread I see abirds also changed his vote from Insom to shraeye before the very end of the day.  So this argument holds most strongly for ftl, not abirds.

according to the first a scum angrybirds would have been smart to leave his vote on insomniac to the end of day, but I didn't as you point out in the second quote; i changed my vote to shraeye who was a townie, but was acting scummy at day end. But the second quote says that changing my vote from insomniac to shraeye invalidates an argument that I am town

No, the second quote is saying that on reread, I see you changed your vote from Insomniac to shraeye before day's end, which means that MY argument - that sparky's partner, like sparky himself, may likely have tried to bus Insomniac late Day 1 - applies more strongly to ftl than it does to you. 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1390 on: September 07, 2012, 09:32:04 am »

Where is Galz?  I recall him saying he's been busy in RL, but he hasn't posted at all since Day 3 started despite having at least SOME time to post in the forum (see CE-II).  cayvie/jo, could we have a prod please?  Thanks.

Also folks, note that the deadline is next Friday - a week from today.  We didn't get the standard 2 weeks; we got only 10 days.  Not sure if that was by design or by accident, but if by design we shouldn't be resting on our laurels.

abirds and CF have both responded regarding my suspicions.  ftl has not.  Whatever the merits of abirds' and CF's arguments, they certainly carry more weight than the total LACK of an argument.  Plus, as my discussion with abirds made clear, ftl's end-of-Day-1 vote best matches sparky's "bus the probably-NK'd-teammate at no actual cost" vote.  Vote: ftl.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1391 on: September 07, 2012, 09:51:24 am »

On the other hand, ftl never voted for Insomniac or sparky as far as I can tell, nor did either of them vote for him.

Robz, see #591.  ftl votes Insomniac (before either Day 1 Doctor claim) and leaves his vote there for the rest of the day.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1392 on: September 07, 2012, 10:36:20 am »

Galz has expressed repeatedly that the DNC is keeping him super busy and he hasn't been able to participate much in his various games. I'll prod him, but I'm not worried.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1393 on: September 07, 2012, 11:47:45 am »

Yeah, sorry. I'm going to get a major post in each game by the time I get home tonight. I've been following along/reading them all however, so I'm not behind content wise. This well has just been ridiculous (so much busier than last!)
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1394 on: September 07, 2012, 11:48:21 am »

Well = Week
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1395 on: September 07, 2012, 01:40:34 pm »

I have no plans for tomorrow, so I'll reread and give my opinion on who's next to go.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1396 on: September 08, 2012, 01:33:50 am »

Home again. So exhausted. That post will have to wait until I wake up in the morning. Too much traveling, too much beer (well, maybe not - but to much to post anything truly reasonable). But home nonetheless, so this weekend will see me regaining my footing in these games.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1397 on: September 08, 2012, 01:11:12 pm »

i thought for sure there would be new content to read and respond to but there is nothing going on here. Where is everyone Did scum kill off all our big talkers?
looks like there are 2 votes on ftl with still no response
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 2! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 3, 5 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1398 on: September 08, 2012, 02:00:26 pm »

Vote Count 3.1

ftl (2): Morgrim7, Voltgloss
Voltgloss (1): angrybirds

not voting (5): Captain_Frisk, ftl, Axxle, Galzria, Robz888

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Deadline is Sept. 14 @ 2 p.m.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1399 on: September 08, 2012, 02:31:22 pm »

Well, unfortunately not a whole heck of a lot has occurred since the start of D3. I guess I should say:

Eevee! See how much that role suuuuuuucks!?!

So, 3 deaths. 1 WW flavor, 1 Mafia flavor, 1 ... ? flavor.

Are we missing a kill, or is the SK flavor what caused Yuma to have a heart attack? Doesn't seem natural to me. If Yuma was killed by a 1-shot town role, should that player claim?

I actually think that the catch on Sparky was pretty damning, so I cannot in good faith clear anybody that joined the wagon after it was pointed out. Put yourself in the shoes of a Sparky scumbuddy there - are you going to sit back and argue that scumslip, with the deadline looming, and a decent chance after it was called out that Sparky would be the lynch (thus revealing his alignment, and putting anybody who defended him in real hot water)? Would you not say anything and hope that the deadline slips by with no lynch (not likely to happen as we almost always lynch at deadline)? Or would you go "Oh shit, that sucks - well, here's my chance to gain some town cred? -- BUS!"?

Now, some people weren't online at that time. Maybe his partner(s) weren't online at all. I doubt that at the time of the reveal his partner was *already* voting him - not when my wagon was sitting there as a possible alternative. Would scumbuddies both have been on MY wagon together (Sparky//???)? It's not unheard of. In M-II Robz and I voted together on every lynch (although in retrospect we were SOOOO obvscum). On my wagon before they switched:

Yuma, Volt, Robz, ABirds.

Volt and Robz switched. Yuma did not appear to be around (and is town), and ABirds wasn't around/wouldn't have switched most likely? (Did I get that correct?)

From a Sparky partner perspective, I wouldn't have wanted to be left on the same wagon as Sparky when Sparky flipped. In my mind, that somewhat clears ABirds, who I think could've switched if he wanted to (I don't entirely buy that he wasn't around - or that he wouldn't have checked in before the deadline). Again, given my belief that a Sparky partner was most likely to bus at that point, I think Robz/Volt are my biggest suspects on that count.

Now, Frisk/ftl/Morgrim remain undiscussed. Morgrim is cleared from being the last Mafia to me because he was already on Sparky before the case was concrete.

This leaves Frisk/ftl/Volt/Robz as the last Mafiosi - Frisk/ftl fit more closely to me as an O partner based on O's meta-game scum play strategy. He (O) played M-IV and M-V in a "Quiet/Loud" team fashion - by which I mean each member of the Scum team filled a different role - from very vociferous to very placid.

Now, Frisk has claimed already, and he's effectively claimed Doctor - why didn't he die last night? Well, there are two thoughts:

He's scum, and wasn't going to target himself - Nor was the other team going to target him knowing how far they (the combined scum) are behind town

or

He's town, and neither scum team (nor the SK?) targeted him because they know how far they (the combined scum) are behind town and were afraid of taking out another scum.

Does the second option *really* seem all that viable? Am I missing something?

Anyway, for Mafiosi, I have to suspect Volt/Robz
For WW I have to suspect ftl/Frisk
For SK I have to suspect almost anybody, since SK can happily survive almost anywhere (ie - they don't have to worry about avoiding being tied to other scum directly).

This post went from being streamlined thought to free flowing thought, so I apologize if it got a bit messy in the middle.

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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1400 on: September 08, 2012, 02:42:41 pm »

I'm seriously considering CF scum.  Seriously, you don't protect shraeye the first night?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1401 on: September 08, 2012, 02:45:20 pm »

I'm seriously considering CF scum.  Seriously, you don't protect shraeye the first night?
or insom
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1402 on: September 10, 2012, 01:55:15 am »

still day here, fyi
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1403 on: September 10, 2012, 01:58:30 am »

cayvie/jo, can we get a prod for ftl?  Thanks.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1404 on: September 10, 2012, 02:05:24 am »

I'm around, I just haven't been spending much time at all on mafias lately and so I don't have anything to say :(

I'll reread and post right now, promise
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1405 on: September 10, 2012, 02:26:54 am »

Reread D3!

I suppose I trust Volt as town based on Robz's read, unless Robz flips scum. But he might? Vote: Robz . But no srsly Robz hasn't seemed townie to me here. And his vote after the confession fit with the bus theory.

Volt FoSed me/angry/C_F. I'm not scum, I don't think angry is, and C_F might be with teh gutsy tripledoctor claim. Don't think so but not sure.

I remember in BMMMMMMMM, a scumtell on Galz was that he was being too nice and not going after people like he usually does. His last post here didn't call people out. But I think I remember checkign him against that tell early this game and him passing. Not fosing him I think.

who are the people who made a big deal about hunting the last MAFIA rather than hunting werewolves? They might be WW/SK.

Plz nobody quicklynch me I would want last words, how many is it to lynch and how many are on me now? But I'm not scum so y'all should unvote and sheep whoever's obvtown and still alive. Or vote robz.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1406 on: September 10, 2012, 04:17:38 am »

still day here, fyi
looooool.

I ended up not being lame and not rereading the thread.  :(
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1407 on: September 10, 2012, 07:46:08 am »

Request Replacement - No time for forum mafia any more.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1408 on: September 10, 2012, 10:07:47 am »

Request Replacement - No time for forum mafia any more.

You will be sorely missed, but family should always come first.  (I assume that's the cause here.)

ftl's response has me scratching my head.  He claims he has reread Day 3.  But his last paragraph doesn't jive with that:

Plz nobody quicklynch me I would want last words, how many is it to lynch and how many are on me now? But I'm not scum so y'all should unvote and sheep whoever's obvtown and still alive. Or vote robz.

If ftl had reread the thread, surely he would know:
- the current votecount, a mere 7 posts before ftl's post (ftl is at L-3); and
- the identity of "whoever's obvtown and still alive" (Axxle). 

I'm not seeing anything in ftl's response to make me less suspicious of him, and so my vote stays.  I would also support a CF lynch.   
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1409 on: September 10, 2012, 02:23:56 pm »

pingpongsam replaces Captain_Frisk
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1410 on: September 10, 2012, 02:33:14 pm »

 8)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1411 on: September 10, 2012, 02:39:33 pm »

pingpongsam! What's your role, and who (if anyone) did you target the first 2 nights? (You should know that, right?)
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1412 on: September 10, 2012, 02:40:46 pm »

Vote: ftl for rolefishing
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1413 on: September 10, 2012, 02:43:58 pm »

...C_F already claimed.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1414 on: September 10, 2012, 02:46:36 pm »

Also, that puts me at L-2, with at least 3 scum around. Stop that! Unvote! Should I claim?

Also, Axxle, who do you want to lynch?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1415 on: September 10, 2012, 02:52:28 pm »

Also, that puts me at L-2, with at least 3 scum around. Stop that! Unvote! Should I claim?

Also, Axxle, who do you want to lynch?

Would your claiming mean the death of somebody else at night?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1416 on: September 10, 2012, 03:24:54 pm »

No idea? My claiming won't have any night effects as far as I know. It might keep me alive, depending on whether you believe me.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1417 on: September 10, 2012, 03:38:05 pm »

I will also Vote: Ftl. That's L-1.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1418 on: September 10, 2012, 03:41:23 pm »

Well, I claim then. I'm the five of Wands. I'm town. I have a one-shot daykill, which I can use by posting "Beat Up: [my target]" in the thread in bold.

I'm happy to let the rest of the town direct it as long as you don't tell me to kill myself with it, I won't do that.

Unvote me so scum don't quickhammer me from L-1
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1419 on: September 10, 2012, 03:51:05 pm »

no srsly please someone unvote
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1420 on: September 10, 2012, 03:52:15 pm »

Unvote
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1421 on: September 10, 2012, 03:53:27 pm »

Daykill PPS I think.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1422 on: September 10, 2012, 03:53:38 pm »

Browsing over the deck list, it looks like there isn't any scum role that could dayvig, unless he is a scum major arcana. This would mean the claim is true. Correct?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1423 on: September 10, 2012, 03:54:38 pm »

Five - One-Shot Day Vigilante
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1424 on: September 10, 2012, 03:54:59 pm »

Oh, misread.  Yes you're correct Robz.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1425 on: September 10, 2012, 03:55:22 pm »

Daykill PPS I think.
I think scum was on your wagon and CF was independently scummy anyway.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1426 on: September 10, 2012, 03:59:39 pm »

sounds good. I'll still let him get in here and have a chance to say something before he dies, though.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1427 on: September 10, 2012, 04:00:35 pm »

Unvote

For obvious reasons.  Unless ftl's Major Arcana, this role is impossible to fakeclaim.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1428 on: September 10, 2012, 06:04:58 pm »

Ok, ftl has turned into the problynch. My vote is already on him, and I'm keeping it there because I don't see L-3 dangerous at this point. About pingpongsam: do you think we should give him a clean slate? And one more thing, from a mafia n00b to mafia pros: because of all the vigilantes and scum factions, should we really believe ftl's claim?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1429 on: September 10, 2012, 06:07:21 pm »

Ok, ftl has turned into the problynch. My vote is already on him, and I'm keeping it there because I don't see L-3 dangerous at this point. About pingpongsam: do you think we should give him a clean slate? And one more thing, from a mafia n00b to mafia pros: because of all the vigilantes and scum factions, should we really believe ftl's claim?
It's super super easy to verify.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1430 on: September 10, 2012, 06:07:53 pm »

And no, PPS should not get a clean slate.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1431 on: September 10, 2012, 06:10:03 pm »

Ok, ftl has turned into the problynch. My vote is already on him, and I'm keeping it there because I don't see L-3 dangerous at this point. About pingpongsam: do you think we should give him a clean slate? And one more thing, from a mafia n00b to mafia pros: because of all the vigilantes and scum factions, should we really believe ftl's claim?
It's super super easy to verify.
thats a lot of deaths
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I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1432 on: September 10, 2012, 06:16:47 pm »

Okay, I see that CF had already claimed so I spose trying to play sneaky quiet doctor is not going to work well here. I had interpreted FTL's request for "who I targeted" as an over the top claim that I was Mafia. I'm guessing he meant "who did you protect". Cayvie has not let me know who I protected in the past and I'm not entirely sure those reads would be of much use to me now. Reading through my posts it appears I protected Angry Birds one night and Axxle the next.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1433 on: September 10, 2012, 06:24:33 pm »

trying to play sneaky quiet doctor
Hmm... that actually seems like a very town thing to say.

I'll try to find someone else to dayvig.

Ok, ftl has turned into the problynch. My vote is already on him, and I'm keeping it there because I don't see L-3 dangerous at this point. About pingpongsam: do you think we should give him a clean slate? And one more thing, from a mafia n00b to mafia pros: because of all the vigilantes and scum factions, should we really believe ftl's claim?
It's super super easy to verify.
thats a lot of deaths

So? The game was randomly generated, not built for balance.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1434 on: September 10, 2012, 08:41:50 pm »

does a day kill end the day and should we all vote for it formally as in punch: robz?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1435 on: September 10, 2012, 08:45:20 pm »

I don't think it will end the day. I can ask cayvie.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1436 on: September 10, 2012, 08:45:44 pm »

does a day kill end the day and should we all vote for it formally as in punch: robz?

Nope, dayvig just pops someone off. Day continues.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1437 on: September 10, 2012, 10:10:00 pm »

yep it doesn't end the day, got confirmation from cayvie
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1438 on: September 11, 2012, 12:38:13 am »

yep it doesn't end the day, got confirmation from cayvie

ok i still think robz would be best to use it on and would prefer that either you decide who to use it on completely on your own or have every player cast a pseudo vote like I did in italics
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1439 on: September 11, 2012, 12:45:09 am »

yep it doesn't end the day, got confirmation from cayvie

ok i still think robz would be best to use it on and would prefer that either you decide who to use it on completely on your own or have every player cast a pseudo vote like I did in italics

I think Robz/Voltgloss are both fine choices to try and hit the last* Mafia, or PPS (Frisk) to hit a potential WW. Any of those three would be fine choices to me.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1440 on: September 11, 2012, 12:45:50 am »

*Assuming only 3 Mafia which seems reasonable.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1441 on: September 11, 2012, 02:06:08 am »

OK cool, I'll shoot Robz then if Axxle gets is ok with that.

Any last words Robz?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1442 on: September 11, 2012, 02:31:52 am »

No problems.  Null read.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1443 on: September 11, 2012, 12:39:20 pm »

"Last Active:
    Today at 09:30:57 am"

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1444 on: September 11, 2012, 12:54:18 pm »

OK cool, I'll shoot Robz then if Axxle gets is ok with that.

Any last words Robz?

If I clean it up it's not really a sentence.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1445 on: September 11, 2012, 01:14:23 pm »

Final thoughts:

Voltgloss IS town, I'm positive, and I never say that lightly.

The one time I really thought Morgrim was scum--MX--it turned out he wasn't. But keep in minding that he claimed VT immediately there and lost interest in the game. So he may be something in this game, since he's still around.

I have no idea whether Frisk's claim is truthful, but... it probably isn't. I actually think Frisk/PPS is a much better choice for the shot--certainly better than me, arguably better than anyone else--but whatever.

Oh, and booooooo at you, Ftl and Axxle, for wasting a shot on a townie and bringing us one step closer to a likely loss, as there are just too many scum in this game.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1446 on: September 11, 2012, 01:27:37 pm »

Final thoughts:

Voltgloss IS town, I'm positive, and I never say that lightly.

The one time I really thought Morgrim was scum--MX--it turned out he wasn't. But keep in minding that he claimed VT immediately there and lost interest in the game. So he may be something in this game, since he's still around.

I have no idea whether Frisk's claim is truthful, but... it probably isn't. I actually think Frisk/PPS is a much better choice for the shot--certainly better than me, arguably better than anyone else--but whatever.

Oh, and booooooo at you, Ftl and Axxle, for wasting a shot on a townie and bringing us one step closer to a likely loss, as there are just too many scum in this game.
If you flip town.  We will lynch PPS.  I promise.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1447 on: September 11, 2012, 01:33:06 pm »

Final thoughts:

Voltgloss IS town, I'm positive, and I never say that lightly.

The one time I really thought Morgrim was scum--MX--it turned out he wasn't. But keep in minding that he claimed VT immediately there and lost interest in the game. So he may be something in this game, since he's still around.

I have no idea whether Frisk's claim is truthful, but... it probably isn't. I actually think Frisk/PPS is a much better choice for the shot--certainly better than me, arguably better than anyone else--but whatever.

Oh, and booooooo at you, Ftl and Axxle, for wasting a shot on a townie and bringing us one step closer to a likely loss, as there are just too many scum in this game.
If you flip town.  We will lynch PPS.  I promise.

Okay, but he's not obvscum or anything. This could very well just be two town deaths and into the night. There's no reason to believe "one of Robz/PPS is scum." I think he's a more likely scum than others, and certainly more than me, the townie you are about to kill. But okay, I hope he's scum.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1448 on: September 11, 2012, 01:37:57 pm »

OK lets have this game keep moving

Beat up: Robz888


and now we wait for cayvie
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1449 on: September 11, 2012, 01:46:45 pm »

I feel like I'm always fighting for my life. Town as usual, you jerks.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1450 on: September 11, 2012, 02:14:37 pm »

Wait! Not everyone has had a voice. oh well if you felt that was best then ok. but my suggestion was that either you decide on your own or we get a consensus from town
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1451 on: September 11, 2012, 02:16:20 pm »

Wait! Not everyone has had a voice. oh well if you felt that was best then ok. but my suggestion was that either you decide on your own or we get a consensus from town

Oh shut up scum. Don't try to wiggle out of your responsibilities here. You and Galzria are just as guilty of getting me killed. Ftl and Axxle are hasty fools, but we know they're town (Axxle certainly, Ftl probably). Do you have a mitigating excuse?
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1452 on: September 11, 2012, 02:55:45 pm »

Wait
No.  We only have a few days.  I do not want to have to scramble for a lynch yet again.  f.DS does this *way* too often.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1453 on: September 11, 2012, 03:00:34 pm »

Wait
No.  We only have a few days.  I do not want to have to scramble for a lynch yet again.  f.DS does this *way* too often.

Yeah, I don't know where this terrible meta of "we must go to deadline and over-talk everything" started, but more time to talk is NOT always beneficial for town. I would hazard a guess that at some point just stalling or dragging out out becomes rather detrimental.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1454 on: September 11, 2012, 03:26:44 pm »

Rather than wait for cayvie without doing anything - and thus burning away precious hours - I suggest we keep discussing under the assumption that ftl's dayvig will activate and that Robz will indeed flip town.

In that vein:  I support the Frisk/PPS lynch.  Now that ftl is most likely town, my scumspicions remain between abirds and Frisk/PPS for the reasons I've previously stated.  And Frisk/PPS is the scummier of the two.  In particular, I really don't like the piecemeal way he told us who he "protected" each night.  Fakeclaiming to have protected Axxle Night 2 was the obvious choice (as Axxle was the only obvtownie left alive), but fakeclaiming who to protect Night 1 was far trickier, requiring him to spend more time rereading and concocting a reasonable claim.  Which is still suspect anyway as Axxle pointed out.

So I will vote: PPS.  If votes are reset when the dayvig happens, I'll reinstate my vote.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1455 on: September 11, 2012, 03:32:47 pm »

Oh yeah, Vote: Pingpongsam

I wonder if mine continues to count after I die...

And a million curses on Ftl and Axxle, once again. But the scum are PPS/abirds.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1456 on: September 11, 2012, 03:51:14 pm »

Robz, can you claim and tell us what you found out the last few nights, if anything?
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1457 on: September 11, 2012, 03:51:31 pm »

Robz, can you claim and tell us what you found out the last few nights, if anything?
Otherwise, I think you're just ranting scum.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1458 on: September 11, 2012, 03:51:43 pm »

Oh yeah, Vote: Pingpongsam

I wonder if mine continues to count after I die...

And a million curses on Ftl and Axxle, once again. But the scum are PPS/abirds.

PPS - maybe. ABirds? Really don't think so.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1459 on: September 11, 2012, 03:53:47 pm »

Robz, can you claim and tell us what you found out the last few nights, if anything?
Otherwise, I think you're just ranting scum.

If I had useful information beyond what I've already said, I would tell you. I have no night information, I'm a VT.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1460 on: September 11, 2012, 03:58:52 pm »

sry robz :( really thought you were scum. Guess I need to read the game more closely :(

also cayvie needs to get in here with a deathpost/votecount to confirm, not gonna vote until then
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1461 on: September 11, 2012, 04:02:35 pm »

sry robz :( really thought you were scum. Guess I need to read the game more closely :(

also cayvie needs to get in here with a deathpost/votecount to confirm, not gonna vote until then

You are absolutely not forgiven.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1462 on: September 11, 2012, 04:03:43 pm »

sry robz :( really thought you were scum. Guess I need to read the game more closely :(

also cayvie needs to get in here with a deathpost/votecount to confirm, not gonna vote until then

You are absolutely not forgiven.

I HATE being mis-lynched. Being mis-killed because of a minority mob consensus is even more annoying.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1463 on: September 11, 2012, 04:10:39 pm »

Personally? I still think he's scum and just randomly flailing for the fun of it. Robz, you DO realize that there were likely only 3 Mafia in this setup, yes? And that 2 are dead? You DO realize that there were likely only 2 WW's (given one was Major Arcana), and 1 is dead? There's also an SK - but I can't really feel that town is struggling here thusfar. And your accusations of scum pairs here make little to no sense.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1464 on: September 11, 2012, 04:13:03 pm »

Personally? I still think he's scum and just randomly flailing for the fun of it. Robz, you DO realize that there were likely only 3 Mafia in this setup, yes? And that 2 are dead? You DO realize that there were likely only 2 WW's (given one was Major Arcana), and 1 is dead? There's also an SK - but I can't really feel that town is struggling here thusfar. And your accusations of scum pairs here make little to no sense.

No, the town has done amazingly well so far, but the setup is just sort of tricky. There will be 3 more deaths tonight after my townie death and PPS's possible townie death. Then we'll see what great shape we're in.

But of course you know that, scum.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1465 on: September 11, 2012, 04:21:35 pm »

Wait! Not everyone has had a voice. oh well if you felt that was best then ok. but my suggestion was that either you decide on your own or we get a consensus from town

Oh shut up scum. Don't try to wiggle out of your responsibilities here. You and Galzria are just as guilty of getting me killed. Ftl and Axxle are hasty fools, but we know they're town (Axxle certainly, Ftl probably). Do you have a mitigating excuse?

i'll accept responsibility sure... and credit when you flip scum. but I am disappointed we didn't allow the rest of the town to have a voice. all we needed was one most from people with their punch vote, it would not have taken that long and would provide more information for town to use.

axxle I am frustrated with you, it is like you think you can just play crazy and randomly since you are confirmed town, are you taking this game seriously (yes it is a game so don't take it too seriously) I just don't get you
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1466 on: September 11, 2012, 04:28:19 pm »

Wait! Not everyone has had a voice. oh well if you felt that was best then ok. but my suggestion was that either you decide on your own or we get a consensus from town

Oh shut up scum. Don't try to wiggle out of your responsibilities here. You and Galzria are just as guilty of getting me killed. Ftl and Axxle are hasty fools, but we know they're town (Axxle certainly, Ftl probably). Do you have a mitigating excuse?

i'll accept responsibility sure... and credit when you flip scum. but I am disappointed we didn't allow the rest of the town to have a voice. all we needed was one most from people with their punch vote, it would not have taken that long and would provide more information for town to use.

axxle I am frustrated with you, it is like you think you can just play crazy and randomly since you are confirmed town, are you taking this game seriously (yes it is a game so don't take it too seriously) I just don't get you
This is how I play, and one of the reasons I'm frequently mislynched.  I am taking this game somewhat seriously and don't think I'm being particularly crazy.  What I don't want is having a huge discussion on who to daykill and not having enough time to react to the flip so we can find someone to lynch.  I also don't want ftl to "daykill" late in the day and lying about it and not having enough time to grab everyone to lynch ftl.  Time used to discuss a daykill is time taken away from discussing a lynch.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1467 on: September 11, 2012, 04:43:00 pm »

Daykill is over. I'm dead. I'm town. Discuss.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1468 on: September 11, 2012, 04:50:22 pm »

If true are still mafia between:

Captain_Frisk, Voltgloss, angrybirds

Everyone still alive, not conftown, and not voting for sparky till sparky exploded.  We'll lynch one of these today.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1469 on: September 11, 2012, 04:51:09 pm »

If true are still mafia between:

Captain_Frisk, Voltgloss, angrybirds

Everyone still alive, not conftown, and not voting for sparky till sparky exploded.  We'll lynch one of these today.

Voltgloss is town. Frisk is probably not.
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pingpongsam

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1470 on: September 11, 2012, 04:52:54 pm »

ftl daykills a Townie, Town looks elsewhere for scum, pure genius.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1471 on: September 11, 2012, 04:53:42 pm »

ftl daykills a Townie, Town looks elsewhere for scum, pure genius.
I don't think you understand the setup.  scum can't daykill.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1472 on: September 11, 2012, 04:54:49 pm »

Vote: Angry Birds
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1473 on: September 11, 2012, 05:06:06 pm »

Vote: Angry Birds

Tell me, which faction does he belong to?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1474 on: September 11, 2012, 05:59:13 pm »

Thread Locked
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1475 on: September 11, 2012, 06:02:48 pm »

Robz888 has been daykilled. He was the Page of Cups, Mafia Goon.

Votes are reset.

With 7 alive, it's 4 to lynch.

Thread opened.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1476 on: September 11, 2012, 06:04:47 pm »

See? I told you it was all flailing for fun. Volt/Robz were the only Mafia options (see my first post of today).

Now, PPS as WW?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1477 on: September 11, 2012, 06:05:03 pm »

So long and thanks for all the WIFOM.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1478 on: September 11, 2012, 06:07:06 pm »

So long and thanks for all the WIFOM.

He didn't place any wine. It's HIGHLY likely he was the last Mafia, thus had no information to distract/confuse us with.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1479 on: September 11, 2012, 06:09:16 pm »

So long and thanks for all the WIFOM.

He didn't place any wine. It's HIGHLY likely he was the last Mafia, thus had no information to distract/confuse us with.
You're assuming cayvie balanced the setup.  She only made it not super unbalanced.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1480 on: September 11, 2012, 06:11:03 pm »

So long and thanks for all the WIFOM.

He didn't place any wine. It's HIGHLY likely he was the last Mafia, thus had no information to distract/confuse us with.
You're assuming cayvie balanced the setup.  She only made it not super unbalanced.
We'll see after tonight I guess.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1481 on: September 11, 2012, 06:11:17 pm »

So long and thanks for all the WIFOM.

He didn't place any wine. It's HIGHLY likely he was the last Mafia, thus had no information to distract/confuse us with.
You're assuming cayvie balanced the setup.  She only made it not super unbalanced.

Yes, I am. At this point until NK's disprove that assumption I think it's fair to make it. If the NK's don't add up we can go back and reevaluate. For now I think shifting to WW hunting (ie. O's teammate) to be the most productive use of our time.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1482 on: September 11, 2012, 06:13:25 pm »

Oh hey pretty cool, my daykill hit a Mafia! I'm excited, I was right, I'd sort of been gunning for Robz for a while. Good to know.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1483 on: September 11, 2012, 06:13:50 pm »

My thoughts were most succinctly summed up in #1399 - Does anything else to date stand out?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1484 on: September 11, 2012, 06:27:42 pm »

My thoughts were most succinctly summed up in #1399 - Does anything else to date stand out?
link for the lazy: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=3907.msg103642#msg103642
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1485 on: September 11, 2012, 06:37:46 pm »

My thoughts were most succinctly summed up in #1399 - Does anything else to date stand out?
link for the lazy: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=3907.msg103642#msg103642

Sorry, didn't want to requote the whole thing. ;D Yeah, link is helpful. :)
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1486 on: September 11, 2012, 06:38:55 pm »

Galz, someday you need to teach me in the finer arts of reading Robz, because I clearly have a blind spot where he is concerned.

Vote: PPS.  Nothing has changed regarding his scummy behavior.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1487 on: September 11, 2012, 08:37:58 pm »

Galz, someday you need to teach me in the finer arts of reading Robz, because I clearly have a blind spot where he is concerned.

Vote: PPS.  Nothing has changed regarding his scummy behavior.

except that one of the main focal points of your argument was that he was mafia. apparently that is highly unlikely. does he also fit the mold for ww?

I stll find you to be the scummiest of everyone alive.
vote: voltgloss
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1488 on: September 11, 2012, 09:22:54 pm »

except that one of the main focal points of your argument was that he was mafia.

No.  Obviously my theory about the remaining Mafioso was flawed because I gave too much credit to what was, in hindsight, a bus by Robz.   But as I said in my post:  "Nothing has changed regarding [Frisk/PPS's] scummy behavior."  His actions are scummy independent of his scumteam. 

See my most recent post before the one you quote, regarding Frisk/PPS's piecemeal revelation of who he supposedly protected each night.  Plus Axxle's skepticism that Frisk/PPS's claimed Night 1 protection choice doesn't make sense.  Plus the "loud/quiet" meta for O-scumteams.  Plus all the analysis Day 2 driving the wagon on Frisk up to his claim.  Plus also the fact that, with three confirmed or almost-confirmed townies alive going into Night 2, Frisk just so happened to NOT protect either of the 2 of those 3 who were nightkilled.

Plus also, nothing about PPS's behavior since swapping in for Frisk offers any reason to un-suspect him.  Look at his response to Axxle's "we're going to lynch one of Frisk/PPS, Volt, or abirds" post.  He immediately votes for you.  Without any explanation or rationale - and without responding to Axxle's follow-up question.

Nothing has changed regarding Frisk/PPS's scummy behavior.  Hence, my vote.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1489 on: September 12, 2012, 01:59:16 am »

Oh my. Oh my oh my oh my. So Robz is scum, huh. I guess ftl may be cleared? Unless he is the daykill SK...which, with the this game is set up, isn't that unlikely? Vote: ftl
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1490 on: September 12, 2012, 02:23:34 am »

Wait, daykill SK? Why would it be "not unlikely" for me to be daykill sk? Is there even a daykill SK? According to the list of cards, the ace of wands and pentacles are werewolf- and mafia-immune SKs. There isn't a daykill sk, unless it's a major arcana.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1491 on: September 12, 2012, 02:34:32 pm »

Plus also, nothing about PPS's behavior since swapping in for Frisk offers any reason to un-suspect him.  Look at his response to Axxle's "we're going to lynch one of Frisk/PPS, Volt, or abirds" post.  He immediately votes for you.  Without any explanation or rationale - and without responding to Axxle's follow-up question.

Misspoke here.  Meant to say "Galzria's" follow-up question.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1492 on: September 12, 2012, 02:43:15 pm »

So this place is an absolute ghost town - and I'm not sure why? We've been on a roll, good things have been happening, and we still have leads from previous days, right? I mean, there's still quite a few people alive and not more than... 1 SK, 1-2 WW, and MAYBE 1 Mafia left - so absolute extreme, 4 scum? Likely 3 or even just 2?

This has been one of Towns most successful games to date as far as early days go - why isn't there excitement to keep the momentum rolling?

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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1493 on: September 12, 2012, 02:49:23 pm »

Ok... Didn't realize there were only six left alive. Really? Where did everyone go? I've felt fairly on top of this game. I guess it's prolonged nature has made it seem like less has happened than actually has.

List:

Axxle - confirmed town
ABirds -
Morgrim -
Volt
ftl - confirmed town? Need to look at the list of daykill powers
PPS
Me - Howdy.

So 4 scum from the analysis above is out. Mafia must be dead. 3 is still possible though. This really shouldn't be to hard then to figure out.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1494 on: September 12, 2012, 02:50:02 pm »

I can't count, btw. Six = seven.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia
« Reply #1495 on: September 12, 2012, 02:52:58 pm »

For Reference:

Setup Info

So here's how this works. This is a Semi-Open setup.

I've divided my Tarot deck into two piles, the Major and Minor Arcana. As seen below, I've assigned specific, fairly traditional Mafia roles to the Minor Arcana. The Major Arcana, however, have been assigned secret abilities that range from "Oh, that's new and interesting" to "What on Earth was that?" in power and strangeness. Some Major Arcana are town-aligned, some are Mafia, some are Werewolf, and some are other.

In order to keep the Major Arcana roles feeling appropriately special, I've separated them from the rest of the deck. For every seven players that join the game, one Major Arcana role is added to the setup. After that is done, I deal enough Tarot cards to give everyone a role.

Minor tweaking is done afterward to ensure some semblance of balance. It usually comes out pretty balanced, but sometimes there's six werewolves out of 16 players and that's just no good.

The Deck

Cups
Ace - Lover
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - Vengeful Lover
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Cop
Eight - Roleblocker
Nine - Innocent Child
Ten - Lover
Page - Mafia Goon
Knight - Mafia Goon
Queen - Mafia Doctor
King - Mafia Watcher

Pentacles
Ace - Mafia-Immune Serial Killer
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - One-Shot Strongman Vigilante
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Cop
Eight - Backup
Nine - Jack of all Trades
Ten - Spy
Page - Mafia Goon
Knight - Mafia Goon
Queen - Mafia Roleblocker
King - Mafia Godfather

Wands
Ace - Werewolf-Immune Serial Killer
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - One-Shot Day Vigilante
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Seer
Eight - Ninja Doctor
Nine - Bulletproof Townie
Ten - Doctor
Page - Werewolf
Knight - Werewolf
Queen - Werewolf Rolecop
King - Alpha Werewolf

Swords
Ace - One-Shot Weak Vigilante
Two - Vanilla Townie
Three - Vanilla Townie
Four - Mason
Five - Vengeful Townie
Six - Vanilla Townie
Seven - Seer
Eight - Jailkeeper
Nine - FBI Agent
Ten - Vigilante
Page - Werewolf
Knight - Werewolf
Queen - Ninja Werewolf
King - Werewolf Tracker

Major Arcana

0: The Fool
I: The Magician
II: The High Priestess
III: The Empress
IV: The Emperor
V: The Hierophant
VI: The Lovers
VII: The Chariot
VIII: Strength
IX: The Hermit
X: The Wheel of Fortune
XI: Justice
XII: The Hanged Man
XIII: Death
XIV: Temperance
XV: The Devil
XVI: The Tower
XVII: The Star
XVIII: The Moon
XIX: The Sun
XX: Judgment
XXI: The World

Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1496 on: September 12, 2012, 03:08:00 pm »

Ok... Didn't realize there were only six left alive. Really? Where did everyone go? I've felt fairly on top of this game. I guess it's prolonged nature has made it seem like less has happened than actually has.

List:

Axxle - confirmed town
ABirds -
Morgrim -
Volt
ftl - confirmed town? Need to look at the list of daykill powers
PPS
Me - Howdy.

So 4 scum from the analysis above is out. Mafia must be dead. 3 is still possible though. This really shouldn't be to hard then to figure out.

Axxle - confirmed town
ftl - confirmed town
PPS - Alleged doctor.  No SK kill last night lends itself to this.  Yuma's heart attack hasn't been attributed to any role yet, but might have been Eevee's OSWV?
ABirds - definitely not mafia because of Robz interaction.  Will have to look at possible WW or SK.
Morgrim - started of very strong, but has been crazy as of late. 
Volt - blah
Galz - blah

I am very surprised at how many people still suspect ftl (PPS, Morgrim, slightly Galz).  Read the setup again!

Vote: Morgrim I do not want him near lylo, sorry Morgrim.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1497 on: September 12, 2012, 03:14:23 pm »

Alright, I tentatively must believe ftl is town aligned based on his power. There are a few Major Arcana's that might fit a command like "Beat up: X", but it's not worth pursuing today.

The Mafia NK's are explained. Last night there was still "torn to pieces" and "heart-attack" kills. While I can't really fit the heart-attack flavor to a SK, I'm going to have to assume that it was, else we're missing a kill and that means an ADDITIONAL scum party out there, which really, really seems off.

PPS/Frisk has claimed Doctor. I don't believe the claim. There are 7 of us and very likely 2 NK's coming. Can we afford to let him live another night? His claim is the only thing keeping him alive or he would've been lynched yesterday. It's not verifiable, and it's been unsuccessful so far. Thoughts?

Volt - I'm smelling SK buddy, no offense. SK doesn't have a lot of tells, so even if I go back and reread you I'm not sure I could make a strong case. But it's what my gut says here.

Morgrim. Oh so helpful this game Morgrim. You're a sly one. You've fought being town for so many games, and now here you are. Not acting like the town Morgrim we know... And surviving. This is becoming more and more concerning to me. I've come to loath lynching Morgrim, but this is not, I think, a bad lynch now.

I'm fairly sure there's two scum amongst you three. The only question is: where?
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1498 on: September 12, 2012, 03:16:51 pm »

Ok... Didn't realize there were only six left alive. Really? Where did everyone go? I've felt fairly on top of this game. I guess it's prolonged nature has made it seem like less has happened than actually has.

List:

Axxle - confirmed town
ABirds -
Morgrim -
Volt
ftl - confirmed town? Need to look at the list of daykill powers
PPS
Me - Howdy.

So 4 scum from the analysis above is out. Mafia must be dead. 3 is still possible though. This really shouldn't be to hard then to figure out.

Axxle - confirmed town
ftl - confirmed town
PPS - Alleged doctor.  No SK kill last night lends itself to this.  Yuma's heart attack hasn't been attributed to any role yet, but might have been Eevee's OSWV?
ABirds - definitely not mafia because of Robz interaction.  Will have to look at possible WW or SK.
Morgrim - started of very strong, but has been crazy as of late. 
Volt - blah
Galz - blah

I am very surprised at how many people still suspect ftl (PPS, Morgrim, slightly Galz).  Read the setup again!

Vote: Morgrim I do not want him near lylo, sorry Morgrim.

Axxle, my suspicion of ftl isn't really that - it's just being cautious because of Major Arcana. I'm not at all interested in lynching him.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1499 on: September 12, 2012, 03:38:54 pm »

PPS - Alleged doctor.  No SK kill last night lends itself to this.  Yuma's heart attack hasn't been attributed to any role yet, but might have been Eevee's OSWV?

I know I was the one to initially suggest this as a possibility, but I've since reread Eevee's Day 2 posts, and based on those I don't think it's a likely possibility.  Eevee has pretty much nothing bad to say about yuma and repeatedly referred to him as townish throughout Day 2.  True, Eevee didn't weigh in regarding yuma's gambit (pushing what he felt was a weak case on sparky to see if scum would join it), but I doubt that would have been enough by itself to change Eevee's perceptions so dramatically as to decide to Vig yuma.

So, I'm thinking it's more likely that yuma's death was the SK's kill.  Which would mean there were no missing kills last night.  Which further supports why I think PPS/Frisk is the right lynch today.

Volt - I'm smelling SK buddy, no offense. SK doesn't have a lot of tells, so even if I go back and reread you I'm not sure I could make a strong case. But it's what my gut says here.

No offense taken Galz.  Your gut is wrong, but I take no offense.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1500 on: September 12, 2012, 03:44:33 pm »

I am very surprised at how many people still suspect ftl (PPS, Morgrim, slightly Galz).

As soon as I understood the ftl situation I switched my vote to abirds.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1501 on: September 12, 2012, 04:05:22 pm »

No idea why it's been so dead :( but it seems to be becoming not-dead now, slightly. Rising from the grave.

Maybe it's because so many scum have died that we don't have any new leads, and the existing scum are just lurking? Total dead to date is 4 scum, 5 town, correct? Town could be in good shape but with 2 (3?) nightkills going around you never know. And since we're looking for WW/SK now, not mafia, pairings/wagon analysis doesn't really help, since WW/SK could be on mafia wagons or off them, like townies.

We should have one more major arcana somewhere.

OK, scumhunting.. PPS definitely scummy since he's appeared. Hard to tell because he's basically playing a D1 game when we're already on D3. Dunno about C_F before the  switch, he was making obvious "I'm not paying attention" tells but that's not necessarily scumtells since he did get replaced later. I suppose I could be okay with that lynch, but not sold on it.

Morgrim back to being his old morgrimy self, no read anymore. He keeps wanting to lynch me though. I was rereading abirds and even a while back, Morgrim wanted to lynch me. Like 2 weeks ago. And he's still sticking to it after my claim and dayvigging a scum. Maybe he's scummy, but who ever knows with Morg. Would be willing to lynch now, since he hasn't been playing crazy most of the game that might be a scumtell, sticking to a vote on a probably-confirmed-town. Ugh, or not. Morg's always town, and always a mislynch. Maybe he's just getting sloppy after trying so hard all game to play a good town game. Or maybe he's sheeping his scumbuddies who voted for me?

 I've had a town read on abirds all along... yep, rereading abirds now didn't change that. Not voting abirds. Obviously could be SK or something.

What clears Galz? Galz is always so active and I find it so hard to read him. And there's so much to read that I can't go back and like reread everything he posted. Anything in particular anyone remembers about him? I remember a towntell being that he was willing to be investigated by Grujah's modconfirmation, but that could have been a bluff... anyone else remember anything else that was scumtell or towntell off Galz? We can guess he's not mafia so parings/wagons with the 3 dead mafia don't help.

 OK, I think I agree with galz that there are likely scum are likely in (Morg, Volt, PPS). Gots to read volt... well, he's not on CF's scumteam, but might be scummy.

Yeah, I guess I'd be okay with a lynch on any one of those three at the moment.  Anyone have any good reasoning for why galz is/isn't trustworthy?

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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1502 on: September 12, 2012, 04:29:19 pm »

ftl, I'm not cleared. Although I've been fairly obvious I think throughout the game - especially starting D2. Grujah had cleared me because Grujah put it together. But then, he had an advantage.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1503 on: September 12, 2012, 04:51:36 pm »

my vote stays on voltgloss, to echo axxle or galz o maybe both I could see him easily as sk. morgrim is an option but I see it less, I mean voting ftl doesn't seem like something scum would do. it looks like typical morgrim town play. In addition, and this is mostly metabat this point, followed mx pretty close where morgrim was frustrated to be vanilla townie again! he posted as such and then ended up being so. this game started before mx so if he had been given a role other than vt in this game why would he be frustrated in the next.

PPS would be my second choice. But I far away prefer a volt lynch.
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1504 on: September 12, 2012, 04:55:14 pm »

Unvote

Probably scum in ABirds, Volt, PPS.

I think it's worth keeping PPS alive one more night


Some things against ABirds:

Response Morgrim's question:
2. If Captain_Frisk somehow convinced us that he wasn't scum, who would be your next target?
2. Follow the confirmed town? I don't know. I would consider the case on ftl more closely, but I don't have a strong second. Maybe Morgrim.
2. Probably sparky.
2. Ftl
2) so few options...ftl maybe. would like to see suspicions on sparky.
2 - ftl
Seems to be following the consensus.  And here's thelLast time he mentioned ftl (before answering Morgrim's question):
I will only give a probably wont' lynch  in frisk, ftl, eevee, robz, morgrim

I was going to vote for Abirds here, but I just realized that these posts were 200 posts and 4 days apart.  I'll have to read the filler to see if he had good reasons to switch his read.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1505 on: September 12, 2012, 05:07:22 pm »

my vote stays on voltgloss, to echo axxle or galz o maybe both I could see him easily as sk.

Axxle posted "blah" about me, same as he posted about Galz.

Galz said his "gut" has him smelling SK about me - while simultaneously saying he doesn't believe PPS/Frisk's claim and also saying he is becoming more and more concerned about Morgrim.

abirds, you've explained why you don't think Morgrim is scum.  But you haven't explained why you "far away prefer" lynching me over lynching PPS.  Do you have a reason, other than sheeping someone else's gut?*

*not to be confused with gutting someone else's sheep   
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1506 on: September 12, 2012, 06:25:30 pm »

Soo... ? This is my only active game. I'm going to Vote: Voltgloss because Axxle wants to give PPS another day, and I agree with Abirds note regarding Morgrim flipping out in M-X over yet another VT role - when this game had already started.

Interesting note though: he subbed out of that game, but not this one. Hmm. Still willing to vote Morgrim I think, but my ordering goes: PPS > Volt > Morgrim - and I'll respect Axxle's desire to put off PPS for a day.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1507 on: September 12, 2012, 06:48:33 pm »

Voltgloss (2): Angrybirds, Galzria
ftl (1): Morgrim
PPS (1): Voltgloss

not voting (3): PPS, ftl, Axxle
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1508 on: September 12, 2012, 06:52:40 pm »

Oh! That setup. I completely forgot about that, bad on my part. I guess ftl is almost confirmed town now. Unvote. Volt is at L-2, no more votes on him please, unless you are sure we want to lynch.
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I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1509 on: September 12, 2012, 07:21:54 pm »

Axxle, with all of the scummy behavior Frisk/PPS has exhibited, why do we want to give him one more day? 

Galz, it appears your vote on me is driven in part by process-of-elimination across all potential scum players.  But I looked over your recent posts, and see one person you haven't analyzed:  abirds.  Are you confident he's town?  If so, why?  (If you have this in an earlier post and I missed it, apologies)

I think there are, in all likelihood, only 2 scum remaining.  I think PPS is probably scum (most likely WW).  Axxle is town, ftl is very likely town, and I agree that Morgrim is also probably town.  That means the last scum is, most likely, either abirds or Galz - both of whom are presently voting for me.  Time to analyze both before scum wagons me off a cliff and town to a loss.*

* A loss?  Yes.  This could be MyLo, right here, right now.  Assuming the minimum 2 scum, there are 5 town and 2 scum alive now.  If we mislynch today, and scum get 2 townkills in the night, that leaves 2 town and 2 scum alive tomorrow.  Even if we lynch scum tomorrow, the other scum will still have the opportunity to win by killing town in the night and winning 1-vs-1 the following day.  Of course, this assumes scumkills don't double up on the same target, and that no scumkills are blocked.  But that's a distinct possibility and one we should keep in mind.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1510 on: September 12, 2012, 07:32:00 pm »

Yes Volt, I've already given my feelings on ABirds. And yes, I'm leaving him off because I consider him town.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1511 on: September 12, 2012, 07:44:57 pm »

Sigh.

Vote: PPS

Might as well go with the scumread.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1512 on: September 12, 2012, 07:47:57 pm »

Sigh.

Vote: PPS

Might as well go with the scumread.

I'll Vote: PPS over Volt, as I stated before. If he's not scum though Volt and Morgrim ARE.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1513 on: September 12, 2012, 07:54:44 pm »

Vote Count

pingpongsam (3): Voltgloss, Axxle, Galzria [L-1]
Voltgloss (1): angrybirds

Not Voting (3): pingpongsam, Morgrim7, ftl

With 7 alive, it's 4 to lynch
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1514 on: September 12, 2012, 08:25:25 pm »

I always wanted to hammer, I prefer Volt, but am ok with this.

vote: PPS
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1515 on: September 12, 2012, 08:29:53 pm »

Thread Locked
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME)
« Reply #1516 on: September 12, 2012, 08:40:55 pm »

Killing people is fun!

That seems to be the opinion of this town, and who can blame them with this kind of reinforcement?

pingpongsam has been lynched. He was the Knight of Wands, Werewolf.

Final Vote Count

pingpongsam (4): Voltgloss, Axxle, Galzria, angrybirds

Not Voting (3): pingpongsam, Morgrim7, ftl

Night 3 has begun. 24 Hours on this one; get those actions in by 8:30 PM Forums Time September 13.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (NIGHT 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 13, 8:30 PM)
« Reply #1517 on: September 13, 2012, 07:54:13 pm »

Whooooo's dead?

Let's go check!

ftl had a brain aneurysm!
ftl has been killed. He was the Five of Wands, One-Shot Day Vigilante

Galzria has been stabbed in the back!
Galzria has been killed. He was the Ten of Cups, Unrequited Lover

With 4 alive, it's 3 to lynch.

THREAD OPEN
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1518 on: September 13, 2012, 07:59:27 pm »

Massclaim time!


angrybirds
Voltgloss
Morgrim7
Axxle
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1519 on: September 13, 2012, 07:59:55 pm »

Massclaim time!


angrybirds
Voltgloss
Morgrim7
Axxle
Actually, I might change up the order later.  Abirds first though.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (NIGHT 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 13, 8:30 PM)
« Reply #1520 on: September 13, 2012, 10:09:15 pm »

for starters I am the two of swords, vanilla townie

in respect to the night kill information, something struck me that I had been mildly aware of all game in how galz perceived me. if you remember i was on him pretty hard at the beginning of this game, but he has been protown toward me throughout all of it, this is what i think is going on

galz was an urequited lover. From wiki mafia a lover is someone who is tied to another person and dies if that person commits suicide "Lovers are players who are linked to each other. If one Lover dies, the Lover(s) linked to it die simultaneously." but he was stabbed in the back, not something you do for suicide! Unrequited I would imagine means that other person doesn't realize it. from what i understand this typically means that the two lovers are both similarly aligned.
Galzria has been stabbed in the back!
Galzria has been killed. He was the Ten of Cups, Unrequited Lover


i believe that i was galz's unrequited love, with that in mind i went back and reread galz's posts and here is what i found

Yes Volt, I've already given my feelings on ABirds. And yes, I'm leaving him off because I consider him town.

Vote: Angry Birds

Tell me, which faction does he belong to?

Oh yeah, Vote: Pingpongsam

I wonder if mine continues to count after I die...

And a million curses on Ftl and Axxle, once again. But the scum are PPS/abirds.

PPS - maybe. ABirds? Really don't think so.

ABirds is town.
Oh, right, sorry, I was focusing on another post of yours.

I know I seem defensive over ABirds, it's just that I've seen a lot of "he's suspicious" but no legitimate reasons given, and I personally have a town read on him (even though he parked his vote on me most of D1 and kept trying to push others to vote for me too. >.>)

I could be wrong, I just really don't think that I am.

Galz I think you are misunderstanding me... or rather i mistyped...

I do not have a suspicion vote on him. In my response to Grujah I said I would like to know his alignment. And just now when I said I would take my vote off him, I meant to remove my vote from him being the one Grujah reveal's alignment of.

I do not find him scummy. I find him town. I-personally-wanted to know his alignment, but in regards of providing town the best info, it wouldn't be best to use it on a-birds. Sorry if that was confusing.

Sorry, bit drunk, but my question wasn't just to you (I just quoted since you were most current), but to everyone who has put Abirds on #3 or #7 of Grujah's questionnaire... Why? I just have a stronger town read on him personally than most here, although I admit I forgive lurkiness as more town than scum (based on past results). I just don't think I've seen a case on him that shows why he's scum outside of that reason - so I'm curious if there is one?

Grujah I would have preferred that you sat on this for a bit. It looked like for a while that a wagon had a chance to develop on you. It would have been interesting to see who would have joined it. As is, we should point out that both sparky and Morgrim cast suspicions at you, as did I as well... before your reveal.

I would take my vote off angrybirds if there is an actual way to confirm someone's alignment. He is the one I-personally am most interested in discovering--but as for the town itself. Eevee and Galz are at the top of my list to learn alignment.

Could we use these lists later on down the road to see who was willing to out who's alignment? Say a mafia is lynched and sparky was willing to let us discover that person's alignment, doesn't that give at least a little bit of credibility to them, or am I reading too much into that?

What about ABird's play makes you question his alignment? I haven't heard a real case except that he's "lurky", which is such a BS reason to truly suspect SCUMMINESS. Is it "Not-do-great" town play? Yeah, maybe. But how many lurkers have actually been scum? 1? 2? Out of how many games?

And he hadn't even been completely absent lurky either. He posts once a day and usually gives reasonable opinions at the time. He didn't think eHunt was all that scummy afaik, and preferred the Insomniac lynch (despite the logic stating otherwise) which is more than most of us (myself included) can say!

Seriously, he appears very quiet, but townie, to me. What's the case for him being a serious question mark on alignment?

I get a very strong (probably larger than most others here) town read on ABirds, and actually DON'T think he's a good target for this form of pseudo investigation because of it.

I actually think Angrybirds is town.  :o

wow, that was a really long post and hard to put together
but in summary i believe i am galz's unrequited lover, which would make me very much town one of has to be right--although I suppose ftl could be as well? but again, galz didn't suicide, he was back stabbed.

could i be wrong? perhaps, but i feel pretty strongly about this

at this point i would vote for voltgloss, but I guess we are following axxle so i will wait to vote until i get an all clear?



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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1521 on: September 13, 2012, 10:15:45 pm »

I'll wait till everyone claims to respond to you Abirds.

Volt will reveal next
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1522 on: September 13, 2012, 10:42:12 pm »

I'm the Ten of Swords, Vigilante

The knife kills are mine.  I don't know why cayvie gave me serial-killer-esque kills - when I saw the results of my killing Insomniac Night 1, I thought the serial killer must have picked the same target as me and his kill flavor trumped mine.

But when I targeted yuma Night 2 (in retrospect of sparky's flip, I thought yuma's pushing sparky's wagon along only to abandon it towards day's-end was scummy) and saw the "heart attack" flavor, I was even more confused.  It was only after rereading Eevee and realizing he would never have targeted yuma that I concluded the serial killer is, in all likelihood, Major Arcana and able to use otherworldly killing abilities.  His flavor trumped mine on Night 2.  I don't know what happened to his kill on Night 1 - maybe Insom doctored it in his last gasps as Mafia Doc.

Last night finally cleared things up.  I killed Galz as my next biggest scumread after pps.  The serial killer killed conf-town ftl. 

It's either abirds or Morgrim.  Reserving judgment until after Morgrim claims.

I realize of course I'm walking right into the meta of "serial killers always claim vig lol."  I can't do anything about that.  The role I'm claiming is the truth.  Apparently cayvie found it amusing to have a setup with every possible vig in it. 

At least this means we have a chance to win.  Otherwise we'd be looking at, what, two townies and two SK's?  Even if we lynched one of the SK's today, the other one would kill a townie at night and then win the 1-vs-1 tomorrow.  Our only chance in that scenario would be to no-lynch and hope the SK's kill each other in the night. 
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1523 on: September 14, 2012, 12:55:56 am »

Morgrim, go go go!
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1524 on: September 14, 2012, 06:54:24 pm »

{twiddling thumbs}

Morgrim generally gets on at about 6 or 7 forum time i believe, hopefully he will post soon
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1525 on: September 15, 2012, 12:44:28 am »

Vote: Voltgloss. I am the ten of swords. I targeted Insomniac N1, and Grujah day two. I thought that because there were so many vigilantes, he was fakeclaiming. I was wrong. :( N3 I targeted Galz. Volt's argument on him was good, and there was really no better target. There can't be two tens of swords. Volt is scum.
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I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1526 on: September 15, 2012, 12:44:59 am »

You're the Vig, Morgrim?  Let's find out.

Vote: Morgrim7
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1527 on: September 15, 2012, 12:47:07 am »

You're the Vig, Morgrim?  Let's find out.

Vote: Morgrim7
Indeed. Lemme just say, once you lynch me and the scum win (which will probably happen  :(), I told ya.
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1528 on: September 15, 2012, 12:51:40 am »

THREAD LOCKED.

Your mod is V/LA on weekends, but I will send an email to try to get her here sooner than Monday.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 4! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 20, 8:00 PM)
« Reply #1529 on: September 15, 2012, 03:23:38 am »

Vote Count

Morgrim7 (1): Voltgloss

Yep, that's a lynch. What?

Morgrim7 has been lynched. He was the Ten of Swords, Vigilante.

Axxle and Angrybirds get endgamed.

Axxle was the Four of Wands, Lonely Mason
Angrybirds was the Two of Swords, Vanilla Townie

Congratulations to Voltgloss, whose role was Death, the Serial Killer

QTs and roles and night actions to follow.

Thanks for playing! Thread open for comments and criticism now.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1531 on: September 15, 2012, 03:36:31 am »

Serially KILLED it.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1532 on: September 15, 2012, 03:37:40 am »

Voltgloss:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

You are Death.

You bring major transformation. The world is tainted, and you are here to cleanse it.

Each night, you may send me the name of a fellow player. That player will die. If you kill someone who belongs to the suit of Wands, you gain an extra, secret vote. PM the mod to use it. It will not show up in any vote counts, and does not change the number needed to lynch.

This power is cumulative; if you kill multiple Wands, you get multiple extra votes.

You win when the world is cleansed and you are the only one left alive.

Confirm in the game thread.

Secret info: if Death dies during the day, all nightkills the following night will fail. If Death dies at night, all deaths (lynch and daykills) will fail the following day.

angrybirds:
Your card is the Two of Swords.

You are an anxious townsperson. You feel the weight of choice upon your back. You are paralyzed by indecision. You keep a lid on your emotions.

Your tendency toward inaction means you have no abilities other than your voice and your vote.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.

Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

yuma:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Two of Wands.

You are career-minded and enterprising, and it’s off to a good start! You have the whole world ahead of you. You are ambitious and (rightfully) proud. Good luck in your new ventures!

Your focus on business means you have no abilities other than your voice and your vote.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.

shraeye:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Three of Swords.

You have recently had your heart broken. That sucks. Sometimes you feel as though nobody could possibly understand the depths of your pain. Why don’t you whine about it a little? That might help.

You’re too focused on the shattered shards of your soul to have any abilities other than your voice and your vote.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.

Axxle:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Four of Wands.

You’ve just finished building a house with your own hands, and you think it’s time for a rest. You belong to the brotherhood of masons; however, you’re the only one in town. It’s kind of lonely; sorry about that.

Without any friends, you have no power other than your voice and your vote.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1533 on: September 15, 2012, 03:40:58 am »

Eevee:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Ace of Swords.

Your keen and inventive mind has just had a breakthrough! Huzzah! If the plans for this device you’ve designed work just right (and you’ve checked them three times), you will be able to use it to fight evil! You’ll be a superhero like you’ve always dreamed! A force of order in the world.

Once this game, you may PM me (at night) the name of one player to fry with your sonic lance. That player will die. If they are a Mafioso or werewolf, so will you. Such is life. Maybe you can get a doctor to tend to your injuries.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.

Morgrim7:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Ten of Swords.

You’ve come to the end of your rope. You’re ready to bring this town to its irrevocable ending. It’s time to take matters into your own hands and force a decisive change.

Each night, you may PM me the name of one player to stab in the back. That player will die.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.


ehunt:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Ten of Wands.

You’ve worked hard to get to where you are. You worked hard in school, in college, in med school, and at the hospital. It’s finally paid off; you’ve achieved your dream of setting up a private practice in a small town. Too bad it turned out to be infested with organized crime and werewolves.

You’re a doctor. You may send me the name of another player to protect from night kills every night.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.


shark_bait/Grujah:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Five of Pentacles.

You’re homeless, down and out. Nobody looks at you, much less knows your name. But somewhere deep inside you, there’s still a kernel of goodness. Kill the bad people before it gets destroyed by the cold.

One night this game, you may send me the name of a player to strangle. That player will die. Nothing can stop this ability from working.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.

ftl:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Five of Wands.

You’re a local football player. You’re on the same team as Captain_Frisk, not that that tells you anything about their alignment in this game. Boy, does this upcoming rash of lynchings and maulings and hits look like fun! You can’t wait to get in on the action!

During one day this game, you may post “Beat up: <target>” in the game thread. The player you target will die.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.


Galzria:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Ten of Cups.

Oh man, angrybirds would make a wonderful life partner to start a family with. They’re beautiful, kind, and wholesome. You know they’re protown (yes, this is mod confirmation). Too bad they don’t know you exist.

If they die, you will attempt suicide the following night out of grief. Sorry about that.

You win with the town.

Confirm in the game thread.

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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1534 on: September 15, 2012, 03:44:04 am »

O:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

You are the High Priestess.

You have keen intuitive awareness. You represent the archetype of the virginal daughter. Of love without sex. Of unrevealed secrets and hidden wisdom.

You are also a werewolf, with Captain_Frisk. Talk here (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/R4LQX4i4bs4) at night.

Once per day, you may call upon the spirits to answer a question truthfully. Do this by PMing it to the mod. This must be a yes/no question. The question and its truthful answer will be made public to the town. You, however, will remain anonymous.

You win when only werewolves remain alive, or when nothing can prevent this from happening.

Confirm in the game thread.

Secret info: whoever kills the High Priestess (including hammer vote) gets a 1-shot usage of her ability the following day

Captain_Frisk/pingpongsam:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Knight of Wands.

You’re the local football star. You’re on the same team as ftl, not that that tells you anything about their alignment in this game. Charismatic, optimistic, athletic and sexy, you have a grand old time.

You are also a werewolf, with O. Talk here (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/R4LQX4i4bs4) at night.

You win when only werewolves remain alive, or nothing can prevent this from happening.

Confirm in the game thread.


Insomniac:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Queen of Cups.

You’re a caring woman. Your family is just the greatest thing in the world to you, and you’d do anything for them.

You’re in the mafia, with Robz888 and Sparky5856. Talk here (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/MKyAzas7pPYDS) at night.

Once a night, you may send me the name of another player to dress their wounds. If they would die that night, instead they don’t die. Neat.

You win when only Mafiosi are left alive, or nothing can prevent this from happening.

Confirm in the game thread.


Robz888:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Page of Cups.

New friendship! Attraction! Warmth! Invitation! I’m sick of writing these!

You’re in the mafia, with Insomniac and Sparky5856. Talk here (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/MKyAzas7pPYDS) at night.

You win when only Mafiosi are left alive, or nothing can prevent this from happening.

Confirm in the game thread.


sparky5856:
Welcome to Mafia IX, Major Arcana Mafia.

Your card is the Page of Pentacles.

ZOOOOOOOOOOMMMMM EDUCATION IS AWESOME ZOOOOOOOOMMM

YOU’RE IN THE MAFIA WITH Robz5856 AND Insomniac

TALK HERE (http://www.quicktopic.com/48/H/MKyAzas7pPYDS) AT NIGHT

You win when only Mafiosi are left alive, or nothing can prevent this from happening.

Confirm in the game thread.

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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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Eevee

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1535 on: September 15, 2012, 03:46:21 am »

Haha reading through the role pm's was funny. Well done cayvie.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1536 on: September 15, 2012, 03:49:49 am »

Night 1:
Morgrim stabs Insomniac
Voltgloss kills Insomniac
Frisk mauls Robz888
sparky5856 shoots shraeye
Grujah strangles O
Insomniac protects Robz888

Night 2:
Morgrim stabs Grujah
Voltgloss kills yuma, gaining an extra vote.
Frisk mauls Grujah
Robz888 shoots Eevee

Night 3:
Morgrim stabs Galzria
Voltgloss kills ftl, gaining an extra vote.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1537 on: September 15, 2012, 03:54:12 am »

Town MVP: Galzria, for taking a very weak role and using it well.
Scum MVP: Voltgloss. Got 2 wands out of 3 kills!
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1538 on: September 15, 2012, 04:00:54 am »

And a big thank you to jotheonah, a most excellent backup mod!
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1539 on: September 15, 2012, 04:05:31 am »

Little things:

Death's special ability is tied to whichever suit there are the most cards of.
Morgrim7's Vig flavor might be explained if you do a Google Image Search for Ten of Swords.
We could have had seven deaths night 1. Yikes.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1540 on: September 15, 2012, 04:50:45 am »

Killed by Death, I suspected that must have been the role causing all the natural deaths.

Well done Volt!

It made me sad to be the only member of my Mason guild.
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1541 on: September 15, 2012, 05:21:12 am »

Oh, Morgrim, why me?  :'( But I was like... obvtown. I killed a WW and a Mafia! I would still die, though, but you could have done in Frisk. Why not Frisk, Morgrim?

Volt, from QT, whole D3, you stank SO MUCH of SK. I had an iside knowledge that Eevee didn't shoot, sure, but you speculating that his futuristic weapons have done a heart attack, it was just.. too obvious!
I just knew that hearth attack must be Kira, i.e. SK :P

I am happy with my play, and town generally played very good, and my reads were generally good expect ftl. I sheeped ehunt and killed O, and pushed for sparky, I knew Galz was town early D2 and that he had mod-confirmed knowledge about Abirds.

My biggest mistake was not investigating Volt. And once I realized Galz was town, and you were his top "to be investigated" - I considered it heavily. Problem was that I though that Galz is cop and putting too much trust in him publicly seemed dangerous, plus, he could investigate you anyway.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2012, 05:35:04 am by Grujah »
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1542 on: September 15, 2012, 07:53:27 am »



(Hilariously, I stayed up late last night waiting for the inevitable Morgrim post, and then pounced, and then... fell asleep in front of the computer waiting for the results  :P )
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1543 on: September 15, 2012, 08:20:29 am »

But you didn't really have to wait, right? You could win anyhow :P
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1544 on: September 15, 2012, 08:24:20 am »

But you didn't really have to wait, right? You could win anyhow :P

I actually expected Axxle to be Roleblocker or Jailkeeper, meaning that he would block my kill at night and the following day I'd have to be on right when the day opens to plunk down my secret votes before Axxle and abirds could lynch me.

I would have caused a lynch right at daystart but when I saw two bodies I realized I needed to find the Vig (or "human" SK) today.  Hence the Vig claim to draw the Vig out of the woodwork (or convince the "human" SK to fakeclaim Vig).

I actually expected Morgrim to flip "human" SK.  For reasons of his meta, I'm really glad he didn't.  Morgrim, you played a good game as town!  You should play this way as town more often!!
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1545 on: September 15, 2012, 08:28:21 am »

Actually, I think Morg was a little trigger-happy, but he did shoot insomniac (even though it was double-kill). My kill was also double-kill so it didn't matter much, but his Galz was less than ideal :/ But it was better than insane Morg  ;D

Were your secret votes permanent or one-shot, Volt?
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Grujah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1546 on: September 15, 2012, 08:29:18 am »

Also, what would have happened if Volt died?

Also if O was lynched?


nvm, answered already.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2012, 08:31:14 am by Grujah »
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1547 on: September 15, 2012, 08:45:50 am »

Were your secret votes permanent or one-shot, Volt?

Permanent.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1548 on: September 15, 2012, 10:09:07 am »

Ahh, just woke up. So much to catch up on here. Sad it's over, and sad we lost, but well played everybody. This easily ranks in my top 3 games overall. Very, very fun.

Volt reeked of SK for some time, even in the game itself. But SK hunting is rarely ever productive, and the lead on PPS was just stronger. Plus, we couldn't really weight his Major Arcana powers into considerations. Ah well.

Town did awesome, I think. We never had an investigation role, but hit scum at every chance outside our D1 lynch.  Even our one-shot Vig's hit scum both times (and props to Grujah for doing it on night 1, regardless of the circumstances).

Gonna go back and read everything now, but well done all. Cayvie, awesome setup. Well done.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1549 on: September 15, 2012, 10:24:37 am »

Ah man!!!

too bad there was nothing we could do here, and i had even found volt out in what i think was a blatant lie! see

I wish I had time to finish my "...reading from the beginning..." posts, but unfortunately real life has conspired against that - so let me summarize recent thoughts as:

- (yuma's gambit) Exactly the kind of thing I tried to do in a recent (not yet finished) game where I was Town.

- (sparky case) Like it not.  yuma's case on Galz makes a lot more sense to me.  Galz citing raw statistics in response (post counts) feels slightly scummy to me - citing raw numbers without taking into account how many posts were RVS or non-substantive?  Misleading. 

yuma and I have had our different views in the past but I approve of his thinking here.

Vote: Galzria

But when I targeted yuma Night 2 (in retrospect of sparky's flip, I thought yuma's pushing sparky's wagon along only to abandon it towards day's-end was scummy) and saw the "heart attack" flavor, I was even more confused.  It was only after rereading Eevee and realizing he would never have targeted yuma that I concluded the serial killer is, in all likelihood, Major Arcana and able to use otherworldly killing abilities.  His flavor trumped mine on Night 2.  I don't know what happened to his kill on Night 1 - maybe Insom doctored it in his last gasps as Mafia Doc.

i remembered that before volt had agreed with yuma's stunt and decided to vote for galz; but then said later that he thought that was scummy and NKed him

i was going to post it last night, but instead decided to wait for morgrim to claim and just twiddled my thumbs instead

but volt! i was onto you! {rage}
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1550 on: September 15, 2012, 10:31:56 am »

i remembered that before volt had agreed with yuma's stunt and decided to vote for galz; but then said later that he thought that was scummy and NKed him

It didn't look scummy when yuma switched to Galz (and at the time I genuinely didn't think sparky was scum).  But when sparky actually flipped scum, yuma's switch away from him looked rather scummy indeed.

I was telling the truth there, actually.  I suspected yuma of being scum and figured the other scum would almost certainly be killing conf-town targets that night.  That's part of why I killed yuma.  (The other part was that yuma has a tendency to NOT "follow the herd" in terms of suspecting people, which made him - in my view - one of the likeliest people in the town to try to push a wagon on me.)

The fact that yuma turned out to be Wands was a happy accident.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1551 on: September 15, 2012, 11:17:36 am »

Well, I don't think there's ever been such an effective, systematic elimination of scum... that still culminated in a scum win?

Sparky, Insomniac and I did horribly, though I'm not sure where we went so wrong. I suspect Insomniac got a bit unlucky. Sparky made that huge confession slip up, that was disaster. I was under a lot of suspicion the whole game, and I was trying to play a different scum game this time by being less polished and involved. Didn't work. Oh well!

Congrats, Volt!
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I have been forced to accept that lackluster play is a town tell for you.

yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1552 on: September 15, 2012, 11:24:46 am »

It didn't look scummy when yuma switched to Galz (and at the time I genuinely didn't think sparky was scum).  But when sparky actually flipped scum, yuma's switch away from him looked rather scummy indeed.

That was one of the more embarrassing moments for me....

But I don't regret it, it got the town moving and pushing and eventually led to town getting lynched, which was my whole goal. But I do have to admit it was pretty funny to start a fake wagon on scum and then abandon it to start a real wagon on town!

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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1553 on: September 15, 2012, 11:25:22 am »

Oh, and Angrybirds. Dear, sweet Angrybirds. The hilarity of you locking onto me as scum D1 was almost too much to bear. I was convinced at one point that Cayvie must've mentioned me somehow in your PM because it was just to ironic that you would push to lynch the one person who had loved you your whole life!
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1554 on: September 15, 2012, 11:26:28 am »

But I don't regret it, it got the town moving and pushing and eventually led to town getting lynched, which was my whole goal.

And I bet you had a 0% chance of flipping town, too  ;)
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yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1555 on: September 15, 2012, 11:33:06 am »

But I don't regret it, it got the town moving and pushing and eventually led to town getting lynched, which was my whole goal.

And I bet you had a 0% chance of flipping town, too  ;)

scumslip vote: yuma
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1556 on: September 15, 2012, 11:34:57 am »

But I don't regret it, it got the town moving and pushing and eventually led to town getting lynched, which was my whole goal.

And I bet you had a 0% chance of flipping town, too  ;)

scumslip vote: yuma

I read that. But I haven't had any coffee yet so just assumed that my brain was interpreting what you were saying wrong. Guess it wasn't. post-game vote: Yuma
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

yuma

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1557 on: September 15, 2012, 11:37:00 am »

But I don't regret it, it got the town moving and pushing and eventually led to town getting lynched, which was my whole goal.

And I bet you had a 0% chance of flipping town, too  ;)

scumslip vote: yuma

I read that. But I haven't had any coffee yet so just assumed that my brain was interpreting what you were saying wrong. Guess it wasn't. post-game vote: Yuma

what you all don't know is that I did that on purpose so the next time I am scum and scumslip I can reference back to this and say, "It happens all the time, I even did it when I was town, after the game was over!" But now I just told you all that, so....
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1558 on: September 15, 2012, 11:37:37 am »

Well, I don't think there's ever been such an effective, systematic elimination of scum... that still culminated in a scum win?

Yeah, I know, right?

I think this game is really good evidence that more nightkills = bad for town, even if the nightkills are town-controlled.

Consider: N3, Morgrim didn't get his night action in until an hour before deadline. I really thought he wasn't going to shoot; and that would have resulted in a town win! (Volt had told me he was going to lynch Axxle, and then Morg shoots Volt at night).

Mostly it's that the town got to lynch a total of 3 people in a 16 person game. I think the absolute minimum should be 5.
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1559 on: September 15, 2012, 11:54:23 am »

Ack, sorry I let you down Insomniac and Robz. I was doing SO WELL for a while, but then I garnered attention with my stupid L-1 vote (which, hey, was actually on opposing scum!) and I couldn't get out of that rut  :( I also got overwhelmed by all the role-claims. I also should have tried to point out remaining scum with my flip. It was fun playing with you guys though. Lots of "what-ifs" for me, but idunno if it would have mattered. Volt pwned absolutely everyone XD

I suspected that the last Tarot card was Death actually. I'd imagine it was something like "once during the game, you can vote someone and it'll count as an instant lynch," pretty close but not quite. With the actual power, once he lasted to Day 4 the game was over, he was too powerful.

At least I brought down ONE person lol. shraeye did a good job for suspecting me at one point, even if drunk. He had to go  ;D

I said in the Spectator QT that angrybirds had a power role, because I was looking at everyone's "last active" times, and angrybirds was taking a while. At the back of my mind I thought, if it wasn't angrybirds it was Morgrim, because he wasn't very active either. Turn outs Morgrim was the last town PR.

Quote
Quote from: Voltgloss on September 03, 2012, 11:05:31 am
I wish I had time to finish my "...reading from the beginning..." posts, but unfortunately real life has conspired against that - so let me summarize recent thoughts as:

- (yuma's gambit) Exactly the kind of thing I tried to do in a recent (not yet finished) game where I was Town.

- (sparky case) Like it not.  yuma's case on Galz makes a lot more sense to me.  Galz citing raw statistics in response (post counts) feels slightly scummy to me - citing raw numbers without taking into account how many posts were RVS or non-substantive?  Misleading. 

yuma and I have had our different views in the past but I approve of his thinking here.

Vote: Galzria

Quote from: Voltgloss on September 13, 2012, 10:42:12 pm
But when I targeted yuma Night 2 (in retrospect of sparky's flip, I thought yuma's pushing sparky's wagon along only to abandon it towards day's-end was scummy) and saw the "heart attack" flavor, I was even more confused.  It was only after rereading Eevee and realizing he would never have targeted yuma that I concluded the serial killer is, in all likelihood, Major Arcana and able to use otherworldly killing abilities.  His flavor trumped mine on Night 2.  I don't know what happened to his kill on Night 1 - maybe Insom doctored it in his last gasps as Mafia Doc.

nice catch angrybirds! I knew Volt was lying somewhere once I saw his claim lol. You played well, much better than I did lol
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1560 on: September 15, 2012, 11:56:41 am »

yeah, at one point, sparky, i messaged jo to tell him i thought you were the scum doing the best job

i was very surprised that you wound up lynched that day!
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18:28 MEASURE YOUR LIFE IN LOVE: you shouldve done the decent thing and resign rather than go on being that lucky all the time

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sparky5856

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1561 on: September 15, 2012, 12:06:58 pm »

haha, well if Grujah wasn't like "It's THREE confirmed townies on him! Come on guys," I might have escaped unscathed  ;D The whole town, especially Grujah, did really well to find me out.

I've been told in the past that I'm a dangerous player when Mafia. Day 1 I did well, Day 2 not so much though lol
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1562 on: September 15, 2012, 12:10:50 pm »

It was a lot of fun to watch this one knowing the whole setup. As unbalanced as it might be, I would definitely play if cayvie ever decided to use a tarot set-up again. (There's still 3 more MA even I don't know what they do!)
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1563 on: September 15, 2012, 12:12:05 pm »

It was a lot of fun to watch this one knowing the whole setup. As unbalanced as it might be, I would definitely play if cayvie ever decided to use a tarot set-up again. (There's still 3 more MA even I don't know what they do!)

3 more?

Theres 20 more!
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1564 on: September 15, 2012, 12:19:18 pm »

I would also absolutely play another round.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1565 on: September 15, 2012, 12:21:33 pm »

Well, I don't think there's ever been such an effective, systematic elimination of scum... that still culminated in a scum win?

The thing is that, the systematic elimination of competing scum benefited me in a way that it wouldn't for a "normal" SK.  Usually a SK has some protection against the scum (bulletproof), but no protection from the lynch.  Here, I was completely vulnerable to the scum (and ALL THE OTHER NIGHTKILLS running around), but had a late-game means to manipulate the lynch.

Congrats, Volt!

Thanks!  I'm curious:  did you genuinely think I was town, or were you just throwing wine in the town's face?
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jotheonah

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1566 on: September 15, 2012, 12:23:16 pm »

It was a lot of fun to watch this one knowing the whole setup. As unbalanced as it might be, I would definitely play if cayvie ever decided to use a tarot set-up again. (There's still 3 more MA even I don't know what they do!)

3 more?

Theres 20 more!

 :o

I would recommend excluding the used ones from the deck next deal.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1567 on: September 15, 2012, 12:25:14 pm »

TBH, I'm going to be significantly revamping the deck.

Death turned out pretty much exactly like I'd hoped.

The High Priestess was really weak; I'll probably redo that one.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1568 on: September 15, 2012, 12:30:48 pm »

Also:

Hey everybody, notice the massclaim discouragement I put in this game! There's probably going to be more of that in future games I run!
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1569 on: September 15, 2012, 12:33:39 pm »

I fingered you as an SK pretty early Volt but good job none the less!
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1570 on: September 15, 2012, 12:42:52 pm »

Well, I don't think there's ever been such an effective, systematic elimination of scum... that still culminated in a scum win?

The thing is that, the systematic elimination of competing scum benefited me in a way that it wouldn't for a "normal" SK.  Usually a SK has some protection against the scum (bulletproof), but no protection from the lynch.  Here, I was completely vulnerable to the scum (and ALL THE OTHER NIGHTKILLS running around), but had a late-game means to manipulate the lynch.

Congrats, Volt!

Thanks!  I'm curious:  did you genuinely think I was town, or were you just throwing wine in the town's face?

I actually had a pretty null read on you until right before I died, at which point I was fairly certain you were scum. So yes, a bit of wine. I had trouble faking opinions in this game particularly--I didn't know what to say about anyone!--and claiming you were town was the best I could do.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1571 on: September 15, 2012, 12:43:57 pm »

but Robz, I TOLD you Volt was the SK, even invited you to hydra it, but before you said anything you got day shot  >:(
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1572 on: September 15, 2012, 12:54:18 pm »

Night 2:
Morgrim stabs Grujah

wait what
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1573 on: September 15, 2012, 12:56:01 pm »

Well, I guess it doesn't hurt to be cautious. I would have let other scum kill him though. I thought Grujah's proof was pretty adequate that he was who he was.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1574 on: September 15, 2012, 12:57:58 pm »

Night 2:
Morgrim stabs Grujah

wait what

hey, i can actually follow that logic.

morg knew that the stabs were him, and the natural causes deaths had yet to show up. therefore, the strangles seemed like the SK.
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cayvie

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1575 on: September 15, 2012, 01:01:38 pm »

i'm actually more curious why he killed Galz

i thought for sure he was either gonna kill Volt or no kill.
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Insomniac

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (DAY 3! DEADLINE SEPTEMBER 14, 2 PM FORUMS TIME
« Reply #1576 on: September 15, 2012, 01:09:12 pm »

had a longer post but comp crashed and lost it i was on insomniac wagon, ftl was as well I think.

Yes, you both were.  Along with sparky. 

Unlike bussing sparky Day 2, "bussing" Insom late in Day 1 makes more sense as a Mafia move.  By that time the lynchwagon was rolling on a collision course with ehunt, and Insom - having claimed Doctor - was a likely nightkill target by competing scum.  So sparky (and maybe his teammate) wasn't actually CONTRIBUTING to Insom's death, and so his/their vote(s) were risk-free and would pay towncred dividends if Insom was nightkilled, thus flipping scum (as he did).

Will reread the order and timing of Day 1 votes re: Insom/ehunt.  There may be some further clues there.

But I'm also concerned a bit on how tunneling toward mafia this seems.  I'm going to be looking for mafia connections between ftl, robz, angrybirds, and you as mafia.  Also at you as WW.

Fair enough.  The reason I'm focused on Mafia right now is that we have new information available about the last Mafioso; we know he was a partner with Insom and sparky.  And now we have sparky's behavior throughout Day 2 to analyze through the lens of his flip. 

At present, I suspect we have 1 each of Mafia, WW*, and SK left.  Our goal today is to lynch one of them.  I think, because we have the most information about the last Mafioso today, we have the best chance at finding the last Mafioso today.  So that's where I'm scrutinizing now.

Also, I think it's premature to strike CF from the suspicion list.  It's possible he's a backup doctor but far from proven.  I especially don't like how he didn't reveal his Night 1 protection choice at the same time as his Night 2 choice, despite having been asked for both.  If CF were a real (backup) doctor, why wouldn't he have revealed both night protection choices together?  What, did he need to quickly look back to the end of Day 1 and pick someone who might make sense as a doctor target choice?  Feels eerily similar to Insom's claiming "doctor" Day 1 without simultaneously claiming his actual card.  Doling out information piecemeal could be because it's being manufactured.

* I know ftl posited 2 WWs remaining.  That would be 7 scum out of a town of 16.  Almost half?  That doesn't feel balanced to me, especially when we know that of the "9" town, at least 2 were VT and 2 were one-shots.  I think 6 scum out of 16 players is the more likely allocation.

This was the post that had me thinking you were SK or less likely a WW Volt.
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1577 on: September 15, 2012, 02:25:53 pm »

Robz was pretty unlucky to be on a scumteam with me in joth's bastard mafia. I basically tunneled on him here because his play here seemed very similar to his scumplay in that BM. But I couldn't actually *make* that argument until we both died in that game.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1578 on: September 15, 2012, 02:34:18 pm »

Robz was pretty unlucky to be on a scumteam with me in joth's bastard mafia. I basically tunneled on him here because his play here seemed very similar to his scumplay in that BM. But I couldn't actually *make* that argument until we both died in that game.

This is unfortunately exactly true. I remember telling him in our scum QT, "You're talking too much! Just lurk. With so many people, no one is going to hold you accountable for it." And then I remembered that's what I was doing in MIX, too. Ouch!
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1579 on: September 15, 2012, 03:11:17 pm »

Also, I am *super*-glad that Morgrim turned out town here. I was really worried that if he were scum here, we'd end up with a meta where "morgrim doing things that make sense = scum, morg being random and crazy = town" and that would just be no fun for anyone.
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Robz888

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1580 on: September 15, 2012, 03:12:04 pm »

Also, I am *super*-glad that Morgrim turned out town here. I was really worried that if he were scum here, we'd end up with a meta where "morgrim doing things that make sense = scum, morg being random and crazy = town" and that would just be no fun for anyone.

Did Morgrim do things that made sense? He, uh, killed Grujah after Grujah was certainly town...
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ftl

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1581 on: September 15, 2012, 03:30:43 pm »

Well, not with his night actions, I guess. He did avoid hammering people at random though, and seemed to day-play more reasonably.
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Galzria

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1582 on: September 15, 2012, 03:34:05 pm »

Also, I am *super*-glad that Morgrim turned out town here. I was really worried that if he were scum here, we'd end up with a meta where "morgrim doing things that make sense = scum, morg being random and crazy = town" and that would just be no fun for anyone.

Did Morgrim do things that made sense? He, uh, killed Grujah after Grujah was certainly town...

Worse, he killed me when I was obvtown at the end - and I was the only one (Abirds was sheeping me D3) that saw Volt as the obvSK. Had he shot Volt instead, we would've won, and had he not shot at all we would've... probably lost still. Who knows. Depends. There would've been 5 alive, so 3 to lynch - which means Volt could still lynch whomever he chose. But hopefully I would've been able to present Volt as even more obvSK. Eh, probably wouldn't have ended in Town's favor either - but still. :-/ Death was just too powerful in the end.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1583 on: September 15, 2012, 03:40:20 pm »

Grujah only looked conf-town if you assumed his kill wasn't the SK's.  Which you all did because the knife-in-the-back flavor looked like an SK kill.  But Morgrim was the only person who knew otherwise - and so from his point of view, Grujah could indeed have been the SK, putting one over on everybody.
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1584 on: September 15, 2012, 05:48:32 pm »

Oh, wow. Congrats, Volt! And thanks, Cayvie, for my most fun mafia game yet! BTW: If Volt didn't have those extra votes, who would you have believed, me or him?
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I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

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Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1585 on: September 15, 2012, 05:51:29 pm »

Morgrim, why did you shoot me over Volt? (or not shooting at all?)
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1586 on: September 15, 2012, 05:53:09 pm »

Oh, wow. Congrats, Volt! And thanks, Cayvie, for my most fun mafia game yet! BTW: If Volt didn't have those extra votes, who would you have believed, me or him?

I think you were vastly more credible than me at the end there Morgrim.  :)  I knew that going in when I fakeclaimed Vig - my only goal in doing so was to get the Vig to counterclaim.  It was either you or Axxle, I wasn't sure which (and if it was you, you could have been a "normal" SK as well - but if so I figured you'd counterclaim Vig anyway).

cayvie, if you run this type of game again I'm definitely signing back up.
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Voltgloss

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1587 on: September 15, 2012, 05:55:12 pm »

Question for Axxle:  on Day 2 you commented about potentially fullclaiming and that it "should be pretty believable" or words to that effect.  All game long I figured you were a power role that had something to do with why the Werewolves got no kill Night 1.  Yet in the end you were a lonesome Mason, a claim that couldn't be proven at all?  Was that "pretty believable" comment just to throw wine in the scums' eyes?  (I guess it worked for that purpose as to me...)
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Morgrim7

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1588 on: September 15, 2012, 06:28:52 pm »

Morgrim, why did you shoot me over Volt? (or not shooting at all?)
I didnt know volt was scum.
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"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1589 on: September 15, 2012, 06:36:53 pm »

Morgrim, why did you shoot me over Volt? (or not shooting at all?)
I didnt know volt was scum.

Sure, and you didn't know I was town either. But were you randomly rolling a dice, or was there a reason?
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.

Faust has also been incredibly stubborn this game. In other news, it's hot in the summer, and water falls from the sky when it rains.


Mafia Record:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108, M114, M118, M120, M122, DM1, DoM1, OZ2, RM45, RM47, RM48, RM49, RM55
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31, M110, M111, M113, M117, M125, RM3, RM4, RM54
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100, DM3, RM1, RM2, RM48, RM50
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Tr), OZ1, RM55

Total Wins: 30
Total Losses: 20

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1590 on: September 15, 2012, 07:05:35 pm »

Question for Axxle:  on Day 2 you commented about potentially fullclaiming and that it "should be pretty believable" or words to that effect.  All game long I figured you were a power role that had something to do with why the Werewolves got no kill Night 1.  Yet in the end you were a lonesome Mason, a claim that couldn't be proven at all?  Was that "pretty believable" comment just to throw wine in the scums' eyes?  (I guess it worked for that purpose as to me...)

I guess it was to lure a bullet. Better him than Eevee, right?

Still, didn't work, Eevee bitten it :(
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1591 on: September 15, 2012, 07:06:24 pm »

Or he would claim mason and asked for a counterclaim (one of real masons saying he ain't one) - which wouldn't happen most likely.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1592 on: September 15, 2012, 07:37:58 pm »

Oh yeah, i thought Axxle's play under pressure was excellent this game. I was amazed he never successfully lured a nightkill.
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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1593 on: September 15, 2012, 08:50:14 pm »

Oh, and Angrybirds. Dear, sweet Angrybirds. The hilarity of you locking onto me as scum D1 was almost too much to bear. I was convinced at one point that Cayvie must've mentioned me somehow in your PM because it was just to ironic that you would push to lynch the one person who had loved you your whole life!

yes. that is funny. I decided early that I would lock onto someone day 1 and not leave it until I felt I had a pretty good reason to do so, but as the game went into day 2 & 3 you had such a townie read on me I thought you mist either know my role or be mafia buddying up to me. if there had not been so many other good options to lynch each day I probably would have pressed you harder on it.

and just to say this but if we had lynched volt day 3 instead of pps, like I wanted, we probably would have won by lynching pps day 4. sigh... I blame myself for casting the hammer vote instead of trying harder to get volt.
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angrybirds

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1594 on: September 15, 2012, 08:52:25 pm »

anyway thanks for letting me play. this will probably be my last, and only, game I play. at least until school is over.  it was fun!
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Axxle

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Re: Mafia IX: Major Arcana Mafia (CONGRATULATIONS VOLTGLOSS, aka DEATH)
« Reply #1595 on: September 16, 2012, 09:12:22 am »

Or he would claim mason and asked for a counterclaim (one of real masons saying he ain't one) - which wouldn't happen most likely.
This.  Mason is a more believable claim than most since there's so much more of a chance to be counter claimed.
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We might be from all over the world, but "we all talk this one language  : +1 card + 1 action +1 buy , gain , discard, trash... " - RTT
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