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Author Topic: How Dark Ages affects existing... things  (Read 42855 times)

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clb

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #75 on: August 09, 2012, 03:59:10 pm »
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Speaking of which, a friend of mine recently posted to facebook that he'd finally succeeded, with help, in finding a sentence where they're, there, and their would all work, albeit with slightly different meanings.

Find the kids, the dogs, and [they're/there/their] toast!

Does "there" work there? I'm not sure it does.

I could see how "there" would work. It's not conventional, but I believe you can use "there noun" in a way similar to "that noun." Although, I cannot say that without thinking of Young Frankenstein. "There castle!"

I'm not so convinced on "they're." If you use that, then the sentence becomes awkward. If you drop the second part of the compound sentence, then you're left with, "Find the kids, the dogs." As two objects, that just doesn't work.

On the other hand, if the kids were actually dogs, then that's valid. Perhaps if it were reworded to say, "Find my children, the dogs, and they're toast." From that point of view, it's not really more valid than "the kids, the dogs," but it does become something that is likely to be said.

Or better yet, maybe you're talking to your children. "Find the dogs, my children, and they're toast."

Using "there" is a bit shaky, but if you can accept sentences like, "I'm going to sit in this here chair" (and maybe you don't), then I could see "there" being used in such a way.

Interesting little bit on this here: http://www.grammarphobia.com/blog/2012/06/this-here.html

I think if you remove the punctuation from the sample sentence, and allow it to have variable punctuation to support the three meaning, then it works very well.
Find the kids (the dogs!), and they're toast! (the dogs is in interjected bit of name calling)
Find the kids, the dogs, and their toast. (easy peasy)
Find the kids (the dogs!), and there, toast! (two paired commands, with an interjected insult)

Maybe it would just be simpler to dissallow all contractions in written English....
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chwhite

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #76 on: August 10, 2012, 12:39:51 pm »
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I like that my first thought after we saw Poor House was, "Oh, hey, Upgrade and Remake took a big hit." Hardly! Upgrade is actually going to get a substantial boost from this set, and Remake may very well be the best $4 card in the game now.

I think the existence of $1 Shelters deals Remake a pretty substantial blow.  Yes, its trashing synergizes with a whole host of Dark Ages cards, but not being able to turn Estates into Silver-or-better hurts bad.  And if you get all these trashing synergies, you're likely to be stuck with Estate.  I have tended to think of Remake as a card I'd nearly always pick up over Steward and sometimes over Chapel, but if Shelters are in the game (and a lack of income-granting $2s like Lighthouse or Fool's Gold) that is obviously not true anymore.
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zahlman

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #77 on: August 10, 2012, 12:41:56 pm »
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I like that my first thought after we saw Poor House was, "Oh, hey, Upgrade and Remake took a big hit." Hardly! Upgrade is actually going to get a substantial boost from this set, and Remake may very well be the best $4 card in the game now.

I think the existence of $1 Shelters deals Remake a pretty substantial blow.  Yes, its trashing synergizes with a whole host of Dark Ages cards, but not being able to turn Estates into Silver-or-better hurts bad.

Yeah, the Remake-FV-PH strategy just evaporated. Now it's Remake-Hamlet/NV-PH at best. :/
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Davio

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #78 on: August 10, 2012, 12:49:30 pm »
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I like that my first thought after we saw Poor House was, "Oh, hey, Upgrade and Remake took a big hit." Hardly! Upgrade is actually going to get a substantial boost from this set, and Remake may very well be the best $4 card in the game now.

I think the existence of $1 Shelters deals Remake a pretty substantial blow.  Yes, its trashing synergizes with a whole host of Dark Ages cards, but not being able to turn Estates into Silver-or-better hurts bad.  And if you get all these trashing synergies, you're likely to be stuck with Estate.  I have tended to think of Remake as a card I'd nearly always pick up over Steward and sometimes over Chapel, but if Shelters are in the game (and a lack of income-granting $2s like Lighthouse or Fool's Gold) that is obviously not true anymore.
That's true, but it's not something I mind. You just need to rethink all the strategies that have been etched in your skull.

Remake's on the board: Yay!
Oh no, we're playing with shelters.
Maybe I'll open double terminal which I've been too afraid of earlier.
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Kuildeous

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #79 on: August 10, 2012, 02:14:50 pm »
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Yeah, the Remake-FV-PH strategy just evaporated. Now it's Remake-Hamlet/NV-PH at best. :/

It's not like the existence of these cards deals a deathblow to these cards. Just like any card, their efficacy is improved or lessened based on the kingdom.

Sea Hag is a pretty powerful card, but you probably wouldn't buy it if Lookout was available. Remake is still pretty good…you just  might be less likely to buy it if Shelters are out there.
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WanderingWinder

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #80 on: August 10, 2012, 02:15:21 pm »
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Yeah, the Remake-FV-PH strategy just evaporated. Now it's Remake-Hamlet/NV-PH at best. :/

It's not like the existence of these cards deals a deathblow to these cards. Just like any card, their efficacy is improved or lessened based on the kingdom.

Sea Hag is a pretty powerful card, but you probably wouldn't buy it if Lookout was available. Remake is still pretty good…you just  might be less likely to buy it if Shelters are out there.

You skip Sea Hag just because lookout is available? ???

werothegreat

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #81 on: August 10, 2012, 02:26:45 pm »
+1

If Poor House and Squire are on the board (even without an Attack), I'd be comfortable opening Remake with Shelters in my deck.
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Kuildeous

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #82 on: August 10, 2012, 03:08:23 pm »
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You skip Sea Hag just because lookout is available? ???

I'm making things up. I don't play nearly enough to get all the combos and counters.

Replace with "X may be a powerful card, but you probably wouldn't buy it if Y was available."

In reality, when I buy Sea Hag depends more on whether I'm filled with enough schadenfreude to harass my friends, whether it's a good move or not.
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Beyond Awesome

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #83 on: August 10, 2012, 03:10:59 pm »
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The only time I skip Sea Hag is if Jack is on the board or a better curser, and I have a 5/2 split.
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Qvist

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #84 on: August 10, 2012, 03:22:04 pm »
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You skip Sea Hag just because lookout is available? ???

I'm making things up. I don't play nearly enough to get all the combos and counters.

Replace with "X may be a powerful card, but you probably wouldn't buy it if Y was available."

In reality, when I buy Sea Hag depends more on whether I'm filled with enough schadenfreude to harass my friends, whether it's a good move or not.

Wow, I was really surprised to read a German word in your last sentence. I didn't know that it is one of the German words English speaking people use. Nice, you learn something everyday.

Kuildeous

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #85 on: August 10, 2012, 03:29:30 pm »
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Wow, I was really surprised to read a German word in your last sentence. I didn't know that it is one of the German words English speaking people use. Nice, you learn something everyday.

What I lack in Dominion strategy I make up for in chutzpah.

Also, schadenfreude makes for an amusing song (Avenue Q). Believe it not, I actually knew the word before I saw the show. I have my moments.
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ftl

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #86 on: August 10, 2012, 04:26:00 pm »
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I'd skip Sea Hag in a masq game pretty often, I think?
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CaptainNevada

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #87 on: August 10, 2012, 10:05:27 pm »
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Each set adds a layer of complexity.  Shelters make Remake a worse opening card.  However, it's still a great card with many of the Dark Ages cards (trashing two Rats is going to net you two $5 cards as well as drawing two cards; trashing two Squires is going to give you two attack cards plus two $3 cards).  The Shelters may check the power of the the card, as I could see somebody going crazy with a board with Remake, Village, and Poor House available. 

Still, Remake may be the right opening move depending on the board (try a kingdom set that has Hamlet, Poor House, and Remake on it).


Yeah, the Remake-FV-PH strategy just evaporated. Now it's Remake-Hamlet/NV-PH at best. :/

It's not like the existence of these cards deals a deathblow to these cards. Just like any card, their efficacy is improved or lessened based on the kingdom.

Sea Hag is a pretty powerful card, but you probably wouldn't buy it if Lookout was available. Remake is still pretty good…you just  might be less likely to buy it if Shelters are out there.
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AJD

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #88 on: August 10, 2012, 10:56:56 pm »
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I'd skip Sea Hag in a masq game pretty often, I think?

Also often in an Ambassador game?
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Cuzz

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #89 on: August 10, 2012, 11:27:53 pm »
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You skip Sea Hag just because lookout is available? ???

I'm making things up. I don't play nearly enough to get all the combos and counters.

Replace with "X may be a powerful card, but you probably wouldn't buy it if Y was available."

In reality, when I buy Sea Hag depends more on whether I'm filled with enough schadenfreude to harass my friends, whether it's a good move or not.

Wow, I was really surprised to read a German word in your last sentence. I didn't know that it is one of the German words English speaking people use. Nice, you learn something everyday.

That's an incredibly useful word, with no good English translation. Though after seeing Avenue Q I can't hear or read it without the song playing in my head.

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CaptainNevada

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #90 on: August 10, 2012, 11:28:00 pm »
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Trading Post is another card that provides silver and trashes two cards at once.  I can imagine the exchange...

I'll trade you this Squire and a Hermit for quick Silver in Hand, a Madman, and a Bureaucrat. 

Are you sure you want a Bureaucrat?  We have a nice selection of Pirate Ships?

Positive.  I need him to administrate my Feodum. 
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Squidd

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #91 on: August 10, 2012, 11:38:25 pm »
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You only get Madman if Hermit trashes itself from play, not if you trash it as a result of some other card.
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ftl

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #92 on: August 10, 2012, 11:41:55 pm »
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Play an Upgrade, Upgrade a Squire to a Silver (gaining a goons), play a hermit (gaining a silver) and not buying anything (gaining a madman).

2 silvers (though none in hand), a goons, and a madman.
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Coone

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #93 on: August 11, 2012, 05:43:10 pm »
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Doublejack with Feodum becomes crazy.  The most expensive card that needs to be bought is 4 coins.  From the second reshuffle every hand can be buying a feodum. On the off chance that you have too many feodums and not enough silvers, use a Jack to trash one of them to improve the rest.

I was curious about how he said shelters games would only have one Victory Card pile (I'm assuming not counting random kingdom cards).  Any predictions on how that will play out?
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ftl

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #94 on: August 11, 2012, 05:46:21 pm »
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No, that's not what he said. He said DARK AGES (the set) had only one victory card, and it's Feodum. Dark Ages games will still have estate/duchy/province like normal.
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werothegreat

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #95 on: August 11, 2012, 05:54:26 pm »
+1

Doublejack with Feodum becomes crazy.  The most expensive card that needs to be bought is 4 coins.  From the second reshuffle every hand can be buying a feodum. On the off chance that you have too many feodums and not enough silvers, use a Jack to trash one of them to improve the rest.

The same principle applies to Gardens (and to a lesser extent, Silk Road) games.

I was curious about how he said shelters games would only have one Victory Card pile (I'm assuming not counting random kingdom cards).  Any predictions on how that will play out?

It's not one Victory pile - the Estates, Duchies and Provinces will still be there.  You just don't start with Estates in your deck - you start with these Shelters instead.  And there aren't any piles for the Shelters - they're not from the supply.  You only have the ones you start with.
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Coone

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #96 on: August 11, 2012, 06:45:12 pm »
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Oh OK thanks for the correction.

And ya, double-jack does do the same for Garden/ Silk Road strategies, but I just think it's cool how the on-gain silver directly ties into feodum.
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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #97 on: August 11, 2012, 08:10:24 pm »
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Bishop got quite a boost here I think?
« Last Edit: August 12, 2012, 08:20:12 am by Eevee »
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eHalcyon

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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #98 on: August 11, 2012, 08:19:59 pm »
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Bishop got quite a boost here too I think?

I'm kind of interested in Bishop-Rats.
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Re: How Dark Ages affects existing... things
« Reply #99 on: August 13, 2012, 07:29:20 am »
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Which, hey, is sort of cool, because it means that the set is shaping up to be a lot more tactical than the ones that came before.

Off topic, but, does anyone else get the sense that WW is actually DXV?  Makes sense, right?  Sounds like him, plays the most Dominion, etc.  I mean, that sentence is vintage DXV.
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