Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Blooki]

This one is quite the doozy. I reserve the right to keep amending the constraints to redirect people towards the intended spirit of the puzzle.

Our Villain and our Hero are playing a two-player Dominion game and our Villain has our Hero right where he wants him. After playing several other cards, our Villain plays Throne Room-Saboteur sabotaging your lone Province to pulp, but failing to sabotage ANYTHING else. Dejected, our Villain immediately ends his turn. Our Hero looks down at his hand and sees 4 Estates and a 5th card and then proceeds to end and win the game, to our Villain's absolute horror. What's the highest VP total our Hero can end the game with?

All mats are empty. There are no tokens or duration cards currently in play. There are no Islands set aside. There are no Bridges, Universities, Jesters, Masquerades, Black Markets in the kingdom. There are no cards in the trash other than the Hero's Province. All rules of Dominion apply (i.e. 10 kingdom cards --- 2 of which are TR & Saboteur, 10 copies of each fewer than 3 empty piles to start Hero's turn, at least 7 Coppers & 3 Estates in Hero's deck).

By my estimate, my initial solution is 472 VP. I'm sure there are mistakes in my solution, but I think the ballpark should be around there.

Hint #1: What card can interact with Saboteur?

Hint #2: My intended solution involves an attack card as the 5th card accompanying the Estates.

[Thisisnotasmile]

Note: When this was posted, the puzzle involved having only 1 card in hand due to double-torturer and and being KC-KC-KC-KC-Sab-Sab-Sab'd, which hit absolutely nothing in your deck. All 3 of these cards had to be in the kingdom, leaving space for only 7 others.

The hero's deck contains 7 Vineyards, 10 Cellars, 9 Chapels, 9 Moats, 9 Courtyards, 9 Pawns, 8 Secret Chambers, 8 (+3 starting) Estates, and any number of Coppers. He holds a Potion in his hand. He buys a Vineyard to end the game on piles (Vineyards, Cellars, Estates). He scores 54/3 x 8 = 18 x 8 = 144 for Vineyards. 11 for Estates. Grand total of 155 VP.

Obviously, I've just picked the first 7 $2-cost actions from the card lists on DominionStrategy.com. These could be any $2-cost actions.

Alternatively He's already got an arbitrary number of VP tokens from past Monument plays and so there is no limit to the solution

These solutions assume a 2 player game.

[Blooki]

The hero's deck contains 7 Vineyards, 10 Cellars, 9 Chapels, 9 Moats, 9 Courtyards, 9 Pawns, 8 Secret Chambers, 8 (+3 starting) Estates, and any number of Coppers. He holds a Potion in his hand. He buys a Vineyard to end the game on piles (Vineyards, Cellars, Estates). He scores 54/3 x 8 = 18 x 8 = 144 for Vineyards. 11 for Estates. Grand total of 155 VP.

Obviously, I've just picked the first 7 $2-cost actions from the card lists on DominionStrategy.com. These could be any $2-cost actions.

Alternatively He's already got an arbitrary number of VP tokens from past Monument plays and so there is no limit to the solution

Not bad. My solution is different, though you've touched upon a very key cog in my solution. I haven't tallied the points of mine yet.

Regarding your second statement, there is a limit to the solution because I stipulated no tokens prior to the start of our Hero's turn.

[Thisisnotasmile]

Ah. No tokens in play. I thought we were talking trade route/embargo. My mistake.

I also might have thought of a way to improve on my solution, will add it up and post it up if it is better.

Edit: Actually, I don't think that's worth pursuing because I was thinking of having something like Shanty Town in my hand to start, and playing a lot of my $2-cost actions before buying a load more, and already having the whole Vineyard stack. However that means I've got 1 less $2-cost stack to play with. It MIGHT be possible to get over 57 actions this way, but it's going to be a lot more long winded than I first thought.

[Blooki]

Ah. No tokens in play. I thought we were talking trade route/embargo. My mistake.

I also might have thought of a way to improve on my solution, will add it up and post it up if it is better.

I'm merging our solutions. Hope you don't mind. I didn't think of Vineyards at all.

[Thisisnotasmile]

Haha. Go for it! I look forward to seeing what you can do.

[Blooki]

Argh, I need too many kingdom cards. I think I'm going to have to make a significant modification to the original puzzle.

[Thisisnotasmile]

Hmm.... I'm not entirely sure how that can change anything, seeing as your Province is being Sabotaged 9 times it's going to become nothing more than a $2-cost card. This is what we were allowed in our deck originally. Doesn't change my solution but I'll wait and see what you've got.

[Blooki]

Hmm.... I'm not entirely sure how that can change anything, seeing as your Province is being Sabotaged 9 times it's going to become nothing more than a $2-cost card. This is what we were allowed in our deck originally. Doesn't change my solution but I'll wait and see what you've got.

Yeah, you would think. I think I should've left the lone card sabotaged anonymous because it's a big hint as to where I'm going with this. Oh well...

[kn1tt3r]

I presume the 5th card in your hand isn't Possession?

[Blooki]

I presume the 5th card in your hand isn't Possession?

Correct. Thanks for the catch! Edited original post to exclude Possession and Outpost.

[Thisisnotasmile]

(By the way I am not pointing anything else out because each time I do the puzzles gets further and further away from my solution and soon my solution won't fit the puzzle at all)

[kn1tt3r]

Maybe the intended solution is something like this Vineyards thing combined with an action chain of $2 cards like Herbalist, Courtyard, Pawn, Hamlet, Secret Chamber, started by a Golem in your hand (so it's one less $2 pile). Possibly you can net some more points with this variant, but I'm too lazy right now to do the math.

EDIT: Moreover, you've also taken something like Throne Room - or for a different solution also Goons or s.th. - for the trashend Province

[Thisisnotasmile]

I thought something like that might be the case, but if you have a Golem in your hand (by the original constraints of the puzzle that I posted a solution to) that means you have no Potion in your deck (Nothing got Sab'd. Even by the current constraints your Potion doesn't get Sab'd). However, there is nothing in the trash, no Ambassadors and no Masquerades. Therefore you can't have got rid of your Potion. Thus if you have Potion cards, you MUST have your Potion in your hand.

Edit: Which also rules out Possession without it needing to be explicitly stated.

[Blooki]

I thought something like that might be the case, but if you have a Golem in your hand (by the original constraints of the puzzle that I posted a solution to) that means you have no Potion in your deck (Nothing got Sab'd. Even by the current constraints your Potion doesn't get Sab'd). However, there is nothing in the trash, no Ambassadors and no Masquerades. Therefore you can't have got rid of your Potion. Thus if you have Potion cards, you MUST have your Potion in your hand.

This is correct.

Here's a big, but cryptic, hint for everyone: What's so special about a Province and how might that interact with the Saboteur constraint? Additionally, how can I possibly integrate Thisisnotasmile's solution without having the Potion being the one card?

I'm too tired to finish solving my own puzzle. I'll finish it later. I think I'm going to end up in the 200's though. I think I should've broken this puzzle down into smaller puzzles.

[Blooki]

Edit: Which also rules out Possession without it needing to be explicitly stated.

Good point. I'm going to remove unnecessary constraints.

[Thisisnotasmile]

Nothing is in the trash pile

[Blooki]

Here's another big, but cryptic, hint to get people started: My intended solution involves an attack card as the 5th card accompanying the Estates.

[kn1tt3r]

Nothing is in the trash pile

Sorry, deleted my post right after I've written it.

[kn1tt3r]

Here's another big, but cryptic, hint to get people started: My intended solution involves an attack card as the 5th card accompanying the Estates.

Can basically only be Minion... but I'm stuck...

[Davio]

Yeah, I got Minion as well, but than it becomes just a galore of $2's.

Here's a side question: If villain had KC'd some Bridges, would Saboteur still have worked the way it does? I know Bridge lowers the costs of cards in player's hands, so I guess it doesn't work for cards revealed from player's decks, correct?

Same goes for Swindler.

[kn1tt3r]

Yeah, I got Minion as well, but than it becomes just a galore of $2's.

Plus maybe some $6 card that was gained from the trashed Province. Goons or something...

[Davio]

Yeah, I got Minion as well, but than it becomes just a galore of $2's.

Plus maybe some $6 card that was gained from the trashed Province. Goons or something...

This is not possible, because that card would have been found by the second Saboteur run through from the TR.

[Blooki]

Yeah, I got Minion as well, but than it becomes just a galore of $2's.

Plus maybe some $6 card that was gained from the trashed Province. Goons or something...

This is not possible, because that card would have been found by the second Saboteur run through from the TR.

This is correct.

[Blooki]

Yeah, I got Minion as well, but than it becomes just a galore of $2's.

Here's a side question: If villain had KC'd some Bridges, would Saboteur still have worked the way it does? I know Bridge lowers the costs of cards in player's hands, so I guess it doesn't work for cards revealed from player's decks, correct?

Same goes for Swindler.

Bridge lowers the costs of all cards everywhere. However, there are no Bridges. ::wink, wink::

Donald X comments on the ruling here: http://boardgamegeek.com/article/3609752#3609752