Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 6  All

Author Topic: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!  (Read 44116 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

rinkworks

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1316
  • Respect: +938
    • View Profile
    • RinkWorks
Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« on: August 02, 2012, 04:40:14 pm »
+4

Challenge #9 is to make a Terminal Silver card.  This challenge has restrictions above and beyond what its name implies, too, as it denies you the right to include special rules or anything but on-play behavior.  It'll be tricky to come up with a good card under such restrictive parameters, but that's sort of the point.  If you prefer the more broad challenges, though, you may find #10 -- to be posted momentarily -- more to your liking.

This challenge has a rule change:  Previously, you couldn't submit the same card to more than a single challenge (although I forgot about the rule and permitted this in a couple of cases).  The new rule is that you can't submit the same card to more than one challenge that is still running.  If you submitted a card to a challenge whose results have been posted, it's fair to resubmit it to another challenge.

Meanwhile, your votes for Challenges #7 and #8 are due Monday, August 6, at 10am EDT.  Get your votes in early, as there will be other Dominion-related things to do that day (Dark Ages previews!).

--

Submission Rules

* Submit no more than one card per person per challenge.  You do not need to submit for all challenges if you don't want to, but of course you can't win if you don't compete.
* Submit your cards to me via this forum's messaging system.  Submissions made after each week's deadline cannot be accepted.
* Each card you submit must have a name, a cost, a list of types, and the exact wording that should appear on the card.  Also include a brief description of any special design considerations (e.g., Stash having a unique back), but do NOT include any other information, such as strategic commentary or examples about it would play.
* Although you must submit names for each of your cards, the names will not be listed on the voting ballots, so make sure your card's appeal does not depend on your choice of name.
* I will accept revisions to your contest entries provided they are submitted to me before the deadline.  If you submit a revision to an entry you have previously submitted to me, resubmit your revised card(s) in their entirety.  That is, don't tell me "Oh, can you make that +2 Cards say +3 Cards instead?"  Just resubmit the full card.
* Only submit cards that are your own design.
* You may submit cards that have been previously posted here in this forum, including those that have been refined by the community as a whole, provided you can still claim that the central conceit of the card -- and the majority of its final version -- is yours.  This applies to cards previously posted, however -- if your submissions aren't already posted on his board, please refrain from doing so until after the results have been announced.
* A single card might conceivably qualify for multiple challenges within this series.  However, you may not submit the same card for more than one concurrent challenge.  That is, if you have submitted a card to one challenge, you may not submit it to another challenge until the results of that first challenge have been announced.
* Do not disclose your submissions publicly, either in this thread or elsewhere

--

The deadline for this week's challenges is Thursday, August 9, at 10am EDT.

--

Challenge #9 - Terminal Silver

Objective: Create a Terminal Silver card that conforms to the following constraints:

(1) The card type must be "Action" or "Action-Attack."  No other type or dual-type combinations are permitted.
(2) The card must provide exactly +$2 each time it is played; never any more or less.  Receipt of the +$2 cannot be conditional in any way.
(3) The card must be a terminal; that is, it must never provide +Actions.
(4) The player must have one fewer card in his hand after playing the card than he did beforehand.  Edge case exceptions to this rule are permitted.
(5) The card may not gain any Treasure cards to hand.  (Gaining them elsewhere is fine.)
(6) The card must not have a horizontal line in the card text.  To put it another way, it may only have "on play" effects; no "while in play," "on buy," or "on gain" effects are permitted.  Additionally, it may not have any special rules (Duchess, Embargo) or setup instructions (Black Market).

Official Examples: Chancellor, Woodcutter, Militia, Swindler, Cutpurse, Navigator, Monument, Mountebank, Jester.

Official Non-Examples: Festival, because it provides extra Actions.  Steward, because the player may choose not to receive the +$2 bonus.  Conspirator, because sometimes the card provides +1 Action and replaces itself in your hand.  Minion, because it provides an extra Action and gives the player the choice not to receive the +$2.  Explorer, because it gains a Silver (or Gold) to hand, rather than giving +$2, and doesn't leave your hand size down a card.  Merchant Ship, because it has an "Action-Duration" type.  Goons and Haggler, because they have "while in play" effects.  Nomad Camp, because it has an "on gain" effect.  Duchess, Embargo, and Black Market, because they have special rules listed below a horizontal line.  Silver, Royal Seal, and Stash, because they are Treasure cards.

--

The Ballot
The Results
« Last Edit: August 16, 2012, 12:06:45 pm by rinkworks »
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9709
  • Respect: +10765
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2012, 05:02:47 pm »
0

Based on the winning card of the Peddler variant contest; I would assume that a card that gains a silver directly into hand would count? Assuming that you end up with one less card than before you played it.
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

Tdog

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 230
  • Respect: +133
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2012, 05:03:23 pm »
0

Would Minion be an example?
Logged

Archetype

  • Jester
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 992
  • Suffers from Fancy Play Syndrom
  • Respect: +690
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2012, 05:16:54 pm »
0

I'm assuming no.

It gives you 1 Action and gives you the choice not to receive the +2$
Logged

Tdog

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 230
  • Respect: +133
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2012, 05:18:02 pm »
0

I'm assuming no.

It gives you 1 Action and gives you the choice not to receive the +2$

Oh yeah I forgot about the action nm.
Logged

popsofctown

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5477
  • Respect: +2860
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2012, 05:44:05 pm »
0

Time to submit Exile Isle..
Logged

Polk5440

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1708
  • Respect: +1788
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #6 on: August 02, 2012, 05:46:33 pm »
0

This challenge has a rule change:  Previously, you couldn't submit the same card to more than a single challenge (although I forgot about the rule and permitted this in a couple of cases).  The new rule is that you can't submit the same card to more than one challenge that is still running.  If you submitted a card to a challenge whose results have been posted, it's fair to resubmit it to another challenge.

Thanks. Maybe we'll see some interesting resubmissions of cards that fit better in other categories!
Logged

nopawnsintended

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 220
  • Respect: +186
    • View Profile
    • My Website
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2012, 07:07:14 pm »
0

I like it.  I think all the constraints will have people dig deep for interesting cards.
Logged

jonts26

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2746
  • Shuffle iT Username: jonts
  • Respect: +3671
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2012, 07:23:14 pm »
0

Can a Action-Reaction card be submitted? I am guessing no, now that I have read the line about additional text not being allowed...

(1) The card type must be "Action" or "Action-Attack."  No other type or dual-type combinations are permitted.
Logged

Schneau

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1174
  • Shuffle iT Username: Schneau
  • Respect: +1461
    • View Profile
    • Rainwave
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2012, 08:57:20 pm »
+1

Meanwhile, your votes for Challenges #5 and #6 are due Monday, August 6, at 10am EDT.

I think you mean #7 and #8.
Logged

NoMoreFun

  • Mountebank
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2013
  • Respect: +2131
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2012, 10:46:36 pm »
0

To clarify, is gaining a silver in hand ok (as long as you also satisfy the "at least one less card" rule)?

EDIT: I'm guessing no because you can choose not to play the silver
« Last Edit: August 02, 2012, 10:50:44 pm by NoMoreFun »
Logged

Morgrim7

  • Torturer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1701
  • Torturer chains? How primitive.
  • Respect: +749
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2012, 11:04:02 pm »
0

Shoot, I just realized that I could have submitted my reaction idea if I didn't post it. :(
Logged
"Oh sweet merciful heavens.

I sit here, lost amongst the cloud, that which is the brain of the Morgrim Mod. Perhaps I will learn the inner workings of that storied mind. Perhaps I will simply go mad.

Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
Dominion Notation: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=7265.msg206246#msg206246

eHalcyon

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8689
  • Respect: +9187
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2012, 11:44:42 pm »
0

Shoot, I just realized that I could have submitted my reaction idea if I didn't post it. :(

But reactions have things below a line, so it doesn't fit this particular contest.
Logged

WheresMyElephant

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 135
  • Respect: +63
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2012, 11:49:39 pm »
0

To clarify, is gaining a silver in hand ok (as long as you also satisfy the "at least one less card" rule)?

EDIT: I'm guessing no because you can choose not to play the silver

More likely no because of the "must give an unconditional $2" rule in tandem with the "player must have one fewer card in hand" rule. If your hand is CCCCX (with X your proposed silver-gaining card) how do you gain a Silver in hand and still wind up with 4 cards? You will have to discard two Coppers. But now X was worth $0. I don't think you could come up with any card wording convoluted enough to cover cases like this and still meet the requirements.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2012, 11:52:10 pm by WheresMyElephant »
Logged

Kirian

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7096
  • Shuffle iT Username: Kirian
  • An Unbalanced Equation
  • Respect: +9413
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2012, 02:00:48 am »
0

Would Embargo be safe if it handed out Curses directly when trashing the card?  Or Duchess if it couldn't be gained for free with a Duchy?
« Last Edit: August 03, 2012, 02:02:11 am by Kirian »
Logged
Kirian's Law of f.DS jokes:  Any sufficiently unexplained joke is indistinguishable from serious conversation.

rinkworks

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1316
  • Respect: +938
    • View Profile
    • RinkWorks
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #15 on: August 03, 2012, 08:21:41 am »
0

Based on the winning card of the Peddler variant contest; I would assume that a card that gains a silver directly into hand would count? Assuming that you end up with one less card than before you played it.

I'm going to say no this time, just because I'm trying to be super strict with this one, just to see what people can do within those constraints.  In any case, others have beaten me to pointing out the convolutions you'd have to go through to satisfy the other requirements of the challenge with a Silver gainer.

Can a Action-Reaction card be submitted? I am guessing no, now that I have read the line about additional text not being allowed...

Correct.

Meanwhile, your votes for Challenges #5 and #6 are due Monday, August 6, at 10am EDT.

I think you mean #7 and #8.

Oops.  Fixed.

Would Embargo be safe if it handed out Curses directly when trashing the card?  Or Duchess if it couldn't be gained for free with a Duchy?

I believe so, yes.
Logged

WanderingWinder

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5275
  • ...doesn't really matter to me
  • Respect: +4386
    • View Profile
    • WanderingWinder YouTube Page
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #16 on: August 03, 2012, 01:28:20 pm »
0

Some hypothetical abilities to see if stuff is sufficiently edge case for rule 4:
+1 card, discard one card - this fails if your deck is empty. Does it make a differs ce if it is more than 1 card each way/how many is too many?
Discard 1 card, +1 card - fails if hand was already empty. Here, even if it's fine for one, it obviously is too much if it would go up to say 5. I would guess 2 might be the limit here...
Discard a card, gain an X in hand (where X is some particular card. Could also be in opposite order.) Has same issues as above, also fails if the X pile is empty. And obviously isn't always +2 if gained card is a treasure.

Graystripe77

  • Tactician
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 421
  • 1.61803398874989...
  • Respect: +94
    • View Profile
    • Dreamkeeperscomic.com
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #17 on: August 03, 2012, 01:48:33 pm »
0

Some hypothetical abilities to see if stuff is sufficiently edge case for rule 4:
+1 card, discard one card - this fails if your deck is empty. Does it make a differs ce if it is more than 1 card each way/how many is too many?
Discard 1 card, +1 card - fails if hand was already empty. Here, even if it's fine for one, it obviously is too much if it would go up to say 5. I would guess 2 might be the limit here...
Discard a card, gain an X in hand (where X is some particular card. Could also be in opposite order.) Has same issues as above, also fails if the X pile is empty. And obviously isn't always +2 if gained card is a treasure.

I believe edge cases would be permitted, it was mentioned in the rules.
Logged

rinkworks

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1316
  • Respect: +938
    • View Profile
    • RinkWorks
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #18 on: August 03, 2012, 01:53:10 pm »
0

Some hypothetical abilities to see if stuff is sufficiently edge case for rule 4:
+1 card, discard one card - this fails if your deck is empty. Does it make a difference if it is more than 1 card each way/how many is too many?

This is fine.  It never occurred to me that there would have to be a hard limit, though, but you're right:  +10000 cards, discard +10000 cards is unlikely to leave you with the right number.  But anything reasonable should be fine.  What's the most cards any official card lets you draw (when a fixed number is provided)?  5?  5 is fine.

Quote
Discard 1 card, +1 card - fails if hand was already empty. Here, even if it's fine for one, it obviously is too much if it would go up to say 5. I would guess 2 might be the limit here...

2 sounds good to me too.

Quote
Discard a card, gain an X in hand (where X is some particular card. Could also be in opposite order.) Has same issues as above, also fails if the X pile is empty. And obviously isn't always +2 if gained card is a treasure.

This is a lot tougher to examine, but my initial thoughts are something like this:

(1) No gaining Treasure to hand, as that violates the spirit, if not the letter, of the fixed +$2 benefit.
(2) No gaining specific kingdom cards to hand, nor Curses, as these piles are likely to run out.
(3) No gaining Estates or Duchies to hand, as these piles are likely to run out.
(4) Gaining Provinces or Colonies to hand should be fine, since, if one of these piles are out, you're clearly playing your last turn anyway, so that's a lot more of an edge case.
(5) Gaining an Action or Victory card of your choice to hand is fine, provided whatever restriction(s) there are aren't too narrow.  For example, "gain a Victory card costing up to $2" (or even "up to $4") is almost always just a fancy way of saying "gain an Estate."  But "up to $5" would include at least Estates and Duchies, and that feels okay to me.  As for Action cards, $3 feels like the lowest reasonable price cap.  Sure, some games will only have 0-1 eligible piles, but most will have plenty of choices.

I'm sure there are lots of other gray areas of this sort, but hopefully this gives you a sense of what I'm going for.  My tendency is going to be to err on the permissive side.

If anyone has a card they're uncertain about in terms of eligibility, feel free to PM me the card and ask.
Logged

Schneau

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1174
  • Shuffle iT Username: Schneau
  • Respect: +1461
    • View Profile
    • Rainwave
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #19 on: August 03, 2012, 02:08:09 pm »
0

I assume Bridge is out, since even though it effectively gives $2 when buying 1 card, it gives more with multiple buys?
Logged

andwilk

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 201
  • Respect: +152
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #20 on: August 03, 2012, 02:24:53 pm »
0

Hmmmm... after reading all of those constraints, here's my submission to this contest:

Strictly Worse than Silver
Action, Cost: $3
+$2

(just having a little fun!)
Logged

Tdog

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 230
  • Respect: +133
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #21 on: August 03, 2012, 02:35:19 pm »
0

Is a change is cost like Peddler allowed? It would be more text, but wouldn't have to do with the actual playing of the card.
Logged

jonts26

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2746
  • Shuffle iT Username: jonts
  • Respect: +3671
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #22 on: August 03, 2012, 02:45:21 pm »
0

Is a change is cost like Peddler allowed? It would be more text, but wouldn't have to do with the actual playing of the card.

I'm pretty sure that's the point of no under the line text. The card can ONLY have on play effects.
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9709
  • Respect: +10765
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #23 on: August 03, 2012, 03:39:13 pm »
0

Hmmmm... after reading all of those constraints, here's my submission to this contest:

Strictly Worse than Silver
Action, Cost: $3
+$2

(just having a little fun!)

Look up in the sky it's... Pedantic Man!!!

This card isn't strictly worse than silver for the following reasons:

It can activate Peddler and Conspirator
It can be Throne Room'd and King's Courted
It can be gained with University
It can be put back on top of your deck with Scheme
It can be found and played with Golem
It can be drawn with Scrying Pool
It powers up Vineyards
It cannot be stolen by Thief or Nobel Brigand

 ;D
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

LastFootnote

  • Board Moderator
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7495
  • Shuffle iT Username: LastFootnote
  • Respect: +10722
    • View Profile
Re: Mini-Set Design Contest, Challenge #9: Terminal Silver!
« Reply #24 on: August 03, 2012, 03:49:18 pm »
+2

It cannot be stolen by Thief or Nobel Brigand

Nobel Brigand: someone who won the Nobel Prize for Brigandry?
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 6  All
 

Page created in 2.192 seconds with 22 queries.