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Author Topic: Demon - My first attempt at a fan card  (Read 1082 times)

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GeoLib

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Demon - My first attempt at a fan card
« on: August 01, 2012, 10:32:43 pm »
+1

Hello. This is my first attempt at a fan card. I was thinking about a duration card that lasts more than one turn and provides a repeated benefit as well as incurring a repeated cost. So here goes:

Demon
$4 - Action-Duration
If this is in play at the beginning of your turn +1 Card.
If this is in play at the start of your cleanup phase, trash a card from your hand. If you do, leave Demon in play. If you don't, trash Demon and gain a curse.

Maybe the wording would be better as:

Demon
$4 - Action-Duration
Now and at the start of every subsequent turn, +1 Card
If this is in play at the start of your cleanup phase, trash a card from your hand. If you don't, trash Demon and gain a curse.

I'm not sure if this wording encounters the weird throned feast behavior where, because Dominion doesn't have a "lose track" rule, the card continues to operate even after being trashed. Also, is it weird to have an "if you do/if you don't" when there's no may. The idea is that it forces you to trash if you can, but if you can't, you lose the card. Maybe it would be better with "may."

So sort of like an alchemist or a permanent caravan except that you have the cost (or benefit) of trashing.

Thoughts? I've had no opportunity to playtest this. Feel free to inform me that it is the stupidest idea ever, but please try to say it in a nicer way and explain why.  :)
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qmech

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Re: Demon - My first attempt at a fan card
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2012, 05:28:07 am »
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The first wording matches your intentions better, as the +1 Card probably would stick around after the card had been trashed.

Whilst you're still feeding it this card is a cantrip trasher every turn.  A cantrip trasher itself would be a good $4, so this might be a little overpowered.  The fix looks like removing the extra card so that there really is a cost to keeping the Demon around.

This is very thematic, and a lovely little card.
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FishingVillage

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Re: Demon - My first attempt at a fan card
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2012, 08:43:39 am »
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Regarding word usage, I would say your first example works better. I don't think it is necessary to have to mention the card being in play to do something. Refer to Caravan's line on +1 Card on the next turn.

Same for the trashing line, I don't think it's necessary to mention the card being in play. I'm not sure if there is official or well accepted word usage for recurring durations, but I would word it like this:

"At the start of Clean-up this turn, you may trash a card from your hand. If you do, play this once. If you don't, trash this and gain a Curse."

As for power level, I think it is fine at $4. I might pick it up if no other trashers are available, but the mandatory Curse for playing a Demon will sting.
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GeoLib

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Re: Demon - My first attempt at a fan card
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2012, 12:23:59 pm »
0

Thank you both for you feedback.

Do you really think it's overpowered qmech? I thought its power as a an every-turn cantrip trasher would be balanced by the fact that you have to use it every turn. So if you get a good hand early on, but you still have tons of junk in your deck, you have to decide whether its worth making that hand a little worse in order to keep demon around. The curse is just an extra sting on that. I suppose I could bump it up to 5, but then it just seems sort of weak.

I agree the "in play" thing does seem awkward since it isn't really an "in play" effect (like goons or something). I used that wording to make it clear that its effects wouldn't last once it was trashed, but I don't really like it. FishingVillage, your wording seems like it would make you draw during clean-up after trashing a card, which seems really weird... How about this:

Demon
$4 - Action-Duration
Now and at the start of every turn where this card is in play, +1 Card.
At the start of Clean-up this turn, you may trash a card from your hand. If you do, leave this in play. If you don't, trash this and gain a curse.

Edit: Also, thank you on the thematic complement. I was pretty pleased with how that turned out. When I originally thought of the long term duration with a cost, I thought of a demon you summoned in some dark ritual and had to keep making sacrifices too, but as the card reads now I picture more of an imp that you have to keep feeding as he does small tasks for you (+1 Card)
« Last Edit: August 04, 2012, 12:29:27 pm by GeoLib »
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qmech

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Re: Demon - My first attempt at a fan card
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2012, 01:04:35 pm »
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Do you really think it's overpowered qmech? I thought its power as a an every-turn cantrip trasher would be balanced by the fact that you have to use it every turn. So if you get a good hand early on, but you still have tons of junk in your deck, you have to decide whether its worth making that hand a little worse in order to keep demon around. The curse is just an extra sting on that. I suppose I could bump it up to 5, but then it just seems sort of weak.
It might not be: I'd have to see how it plays to get a better feeling for it.  Early on though there's almost no risk to playing Cantrip trashers: if you don't then you have a 4 card hand, if you do you still have a 4 card hand, but it's the best 4 from 5 (and you're down a Copper or Estate to boot).  In that sense this is slightly stronger, as it gives you the option of working with the 6 card hand if you take the Curse and trash the Demon.

I think Demon is strong, but lots of cards are and that's OK.  I also think it would be fun to play with.
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