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Author Topic: Clasic_Cards #7 - Tilted Scales  (Read 1966 times)

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Rush_Clasic

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Clasic_Cards #7 - Tilted Scales
« on: July 22, 2012, 06:54:00 pm »
+3

Tilted Scales (5)
Action - Attack
Each player (including you) trashes a card from his or her hand. You gain a card costing exactly $1 more than your trashed card, putting it into your hand. Each other player gains a card costing exactly $1 less than his or her trashed card, putting it into his or her hand.



  • I'm a fan of the Remodel family of cards. I'm also a fan of Swindler. This is somewhat of a child created from those two likes.
  • I wanted the abilities to mirror each other. Most cards in the Remodel family don't put the card in your hand, but I felt it made sense here. I pushed the cost up to balance that factor, though I'm not sure it needs it.
  • Cards that trash other player's cards have always interested me. For the most part, they don't do a whole lot of benefit as an attack (save perhaps against Chapel-esque players). But the interaction is still interesting.

ftl

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Re: Clasic_Cards #7 - Tilted Scales
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2012, 08:08:20 pm »
+3

This seems pretty nice!

It may be a bit weak, because usually, the other player can trash a copper or estate and not pick up anything. And mid-game, they might do things like trash a terminal action and gain a village or trash a village and get a  card-drawer (if they have a hand of like torturer-torturer, maybe the can trash a torturer for a workers village, if they have a hand of like festival-festival-festival, maybe they can trash a festival and gain a smithy).

On the other hand, if they trash a copper, then they've cutpursed themselves, and it's not optional. If forcing them to trash a copper shuts them out of a gold or a powerful $5, that's pretty strong. And late-game, you might force them to trash a silver in a hand of like Gold-Silver-[good terminal action] - province-duchy.

It works well when stacked, too. If you  play like four of these, you're not going to destroy their entire hand, you'll probably just force them to downgrade a bunch. Which is a big hit because expensive cards are hard to get, but it's not going to be a pin, they'll still have a hand, unless, like it's a four player game and EVERYONE can play like four of these each turn.

Like develop, its strength is going to depend on whether there is a smooth progression of costs; if there are good things at a variety of costs, then it's power to you is strengthened, but its attack part is weakened (since the opponent isn't forced into a gap).

It doesn't seem like a power $5 to me; I would think it might be okay at $4. I guess you'd have to playtest it to see for sure whether it's good at $4, or whether it needs to be $5 but have some sort of minor bonus like +1 or 2 cards or coin or something. I would suspect that as it is, it would be a bit weak of a 5-cost card.
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razorborne

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Re: Clasic_Cards #7 - Tilted Scales
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2012, 02:30:27 am »
0

I wouldn't put it at 4, it seems too easy to do stupid things early if you can pick it up in a 4-3 hand, like trashing an estate to pick up a silver in your hand, although that's balanced a bit by giving them a free trash. I'd put it at 5 and add like +1 card or something, since drawing cards is synergistic with the ability.
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zahlman

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Re: Clasic_Cards #7 - Tilted Scales
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2012, 02:36:17 am »
0

I wouldn't put it at 4, it seems too easy to do stupid things early if you can pick it up in a 4-3 hand, like trashing an estate to pick up a silver in your hand, although that's balanced a bit by giving them a free trash.

You can do far better than that early with, say, Remake.

Okay, not strictly better. But if a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush...

(Consider also that Trading Post will be much, much better early, and that's a $5 also.)

Quote
I'd put it at 5 and add like +1 card or something, since drawing cards is synergistic with the ability.

I think it might need more than that. That said, I think it makes more sense to make this more powerful and also more expensive, than to try to price it as is.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2012, 02:37:52 am by zahlman »
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Rush_Clasic

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Re: Clasic_Cards #7 - Tilted Scales
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2012, 02:49:25 am »
0

I'm not all that certain of this card's general power level. It's okay to have some weaker cards as long as they have a purpose and can reasonably be played. If this card were truly beneath that level, drawing cards is the most immediately synergistic base stat to give it. This is also one of the few attack ideas that I find intriguing to staples additional Actions onto.

DStu

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Re: Clasic_Cards #7 - Tilted Scales
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2012, 08:17:04 am »
0

First impression: I really like it.

Some thoughts: a) "Exactly $1 less" for your opponent.  In the case where you are forced to trash a Province, it's gone without replacement (usually). Now that might be quite rare, but nevertheless, "at most $1 less" might be a bit weaker attack. On the other hand, it doesn't trash opponents Coppers with this wording, so maybe "exactly" is exactly right.
b) It being terminal and putting into hand has a lot of anti-synergy. Especially with the "exactly $1 more". You will often be forced (or want to) go into actions, but it's likely that you won't play them, despite them being in hand. But I think it's probably too strong to give it +1 action or even a Cantrip (compare: Upgrade). Especially because of the attack, which will get nastier the more you are hitten.

So the strength: I think it's worth a try as it is. It has nice self-synergy, as it turns itself into Gold (or GM). In hand! It helps the opponent trashing, but on the expense of the current turn. Like in Bishop. But it's mandatory. Now think about playing multiple of this, maybe after an discard-attack, this attack might really feal like an attack.
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