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Author Topic: The Contest Set Card List  (Read 179394 times)

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eHalcyon

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #175 on: September 23, 2012, 12:10:53 am »
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I think it would be easier to get 3 Silvers because of the pinata effect and all those cards like Trader, JOAT, and Squire that can get you Silvers easier.

What if it had an on-buy Mint effect? Not the trashing part, the copy of Treasure part.

But what if the board doesn't have a Silver-gainer?  Pinata isn't always helpful because you'd lose your Feodum, and there won't always be a trasher anyway.

On-buy minting is probably changing it too much... even my suggestion is probably too much.
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Schneau

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #176 on: September 23, 2012, 09:42:09 pm »
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I like the any-sets-of-three option, especially considering the alt-treasures in this expansion. But, I definitely defer to Captain Frisk in whatever he thinks is best.

As for the Talisman combo: It's fun having combos like this. It won't come up that often, and to tell the truth, Talisman could use a boost.
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popsofctown

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #177 on: September 24, 2012, 02:42:51 pm »
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If we go to any set of three, why restrict it to treasures? 
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eHalcyon

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #178 on: September 24, 2012, 03:47:17 pm »
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If we go to any set of three, why restrict it to treasures?

To keep it close to the original.  If it was any set of X cards, X would need to be so much bigger to be balanced... and then it steps heavily on the toes of Garden.
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popsofctown

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #179 on: September 24, 2012, 04:16:47 pm »
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It would still be close to the original because you would still mostly use it for treasures anyway.  Alt VP and treasure are homies.
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rinkworks

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #180 on: September 25, 2012, 10:10:38 am »
+5

You're kidding, right?  Allowing any set of three alt-treasure stacks is pretty close to the original, because most games would be Copper-Silver-Gold anyway, and most exceptions would still require two of the three.  But ANY three?  How would that not just be Province + your primary engine card + Copper most of the time?  Province-Hunting Party-Copper, done.  With trashing, substitute your second engine card.  Province-Fishing Village-Torturer, done.  Or would you buy Provinces at all?  I guess if you rush Museums, you'd really be counting Museums + primary engine card + X.  IGG-Copper-Museum.  Horse Traders-Copper-Museum.

The running theme here is that they're all things you would have done anyway.  Museum doesn't change up these games, like, at all, except that you buy Museum instead of Province and/or Duchy, depending.  Certainly you wouldn't be forcing a particular kind of deck -- a Treasure deck -- like the original card does; rather, you could do just about anything you want this side of Fairgrounds.
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popsofctown

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #181 on: September 25, 2012, 03:16:56 pm »
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Er.. In my post I somehow I forgot that Victory cards are, well, cards.  I meant any 3 actions or treasures. 

Fishing Village being an exception, most 3$ cards won't get along with Museum as well as Silver would, either they are terminal and can't be spammed, or they are villages and won't like that Museums in deck makes it harder to line Villages up with Smithies.  Oasis is going to be an exception, and Fishing Village, but in general, nonterminal Silver at 3-4$ is rare.

5$ cards replacing Gold is admittedly a problem though, as there are lots of nonterminal mighty well be Golds like Stables, Lab, Hunting Party and Highway, and so forth, and 5$ is a more accessible price point.  Even so, most of those cards are cantrippy and get cranky when you damage your mean deck value with green cards.  So I think we'd still see Copper - Silver - Gold as a favorite, or at the very least Copper X Gold or Copper Silver X.

IGG breaks dominion itself, that's not much of a talking point.  Horse Traders would lead to HT/Silver/Copper which isn't far from the spirit of the card, at least.
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rinkworks

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #182 on: September 25, 2012, 03:33:01 pm »
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Er.. In my post I somehow I forgot that Victory cards are, well, cards.  I meant any 3 actions or treasures. 

Fishing Village being an exception, most 3$ cards won't get along with Museum as well as Silver would, either they are terminal and can't be spammed, or they are villages and won't like that Museums in deck makes it harder to line Villages up with Smithies.  Oasis is going to be an exception, and Fishing Village, but in general, nonterminal Silver at 3-4$ is rare.

5$ cards replacing Gold is admittedly a problem though, as there are lots of nonterminal mighty well be Golds like Stables, Lab, Hunting Party and Highway, and so forth, and 5$ is a more accessible price point.  Even so, most of those cards are cantrippy and get cranky when you damage your mean deck value with green cards.  So I think we'd still see Copper - Silver - Gold as a favorite, or at the very least Copper X Gold or Copper Silver X.

IGG breaks dominion itself, that's not much of a talking point.  Horse Traders would lead to HT/Silver/Copper which isn't far from the spirit of the card, at least.

Removing Victory cards from consideration is a big improvement, but I think you're overestimating how significantly even this much of a change -- which I think you are underplaying anyhow -- will change the spirit of the original card.  Museum would go from rewarding you for building the kind of deck it wants, whether or not you would have done so anyway, to rewarding you for...well, almost whatever the heck you want to build.

In any case, asking us "Why restrict it to Treasures?" puts the onus in the wrong place.  It's up to you to answer that question and justify why removing the restriction makes it a better, more interesting card.  In the absence of any argument either way, the card would stay as it was designed and elected.

For my part, I could go along with an "any three Treasures" variant, and here's my own justification:  (1) Doesn't substantially change the original card in most games; (2) Adds variety in that it plays a little differently with Platinum and/or kingdom Treasures on the board but still imposes the same sort of restrictions on the kind of deck it rewards.
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Polk5440

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #183 on: September 25, 2012, 05:07:43 pm »
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Has anyone actually play tested Museum, yet?
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Saucery

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #184 on: September 27, 2012, 07:35:52 pm »
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I would happily take the more expensive treasures out, because they're so desirable already. Other alt treasures you may or may not necessarily want three of, and could lead to some interesting decisions.

"Worth 1 VP for each set of treasures costing $5 or less in your deck"

So tailored for IGG rushes...
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Drab Emordnilap

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #185 on: September 27, 2012, 07:55:06 pm »
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I would happily take the more expensive treasures out, because they're so desirable already. Other alt treasures you may or may not necessarily want three of, and could lead to some interesting decisions.

"Worth 1 VP for each set of treasures costing $5 or less in your deck"

So tailored for IGG rushes...
What's a set, in this case?
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Saucery

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #186 on: September 27, 2012, 08:08:04 pm »
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I would happily take the more expensive treasures out, because they're so desirable already. Other alt treasures you may or may not necessarily want three of, and could lead to some interesting decisions.

"Worth 1 VP for each set of treasures costing $5 or less in your deck"

So tailored for IGG rushes...
What's a set, in this case?
It would be 3 treasures of the same name. a set of 3 talismans, two sets of 3 coppers (6 total), a set of 3 ventures... maybe not so clear on that phrasing?
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NoMoreFun

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #187 on: September 28, 2012, 01:18:36 am »
+1

Some possible images for Missionary

Missionary:




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eHalcyon

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #188 on: September 28, 2012, 01:37:52 am »
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I would happily take the more expensive treasures out, because they're so desirable already. Other alt treasures you may or may not necessarily want three of, and could lead to some interesting decisions.

"Worth 1 VP for each set of treasures costing $5 or less in your deck"

So tailored for IGG rushes...
What's a set, in this case?
It would be 3 treasures of the same name. a set of 3 talismans, two sets of 3 coppers (6 total), a set of 3 ventures... maybe not so clear on that phrasing?

So it would count Copper triplets?  So it's worth 2VP off the bat.  And it counts Silver too?  Strictly better than Feodum.

The point of the original is to get you to buy a variety of Treasure.  Switching to sets of the same card is too big a change.
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Saucery

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #189 on: September 28, 2012, 02:00:57 am »
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Wait nevermind, for some reason I had it in my head they would end up being close to the same...
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PenPen

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #190 on: September 28, 2012, 10:37:30 am »
+1

Some possible images for Missionary

Missionary:
Quote
pics

I like the third one best. The second one feels more like...something else totally different.
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Graystripe77

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #191 on: September 29, 2012, 02:02:29 pm »
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Some possible images for Missionary

Missionary:
Quote
pics

I like the third one best. The second one feels more like...something else totally different.

That would definitely work. Awesome.
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Polk5440

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #192 on: October 04, 2012, 11:06:16 am »
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A couple of thoughts:

1) The phrase "When the game ends" is probably unnecessary on Canal. I originally put it there for clarity, but rules-wise, I am not sure if it is needed since Victory points are counted when the game ends, anyway. It's not a problem and doesn't bother me that it's there, but I know some people were concerned about the amount of text on the card.

2) How do we go about printing the cards? (Or at least one copy of each card to have on the table when play-testing with blanks?) I tried copying the images from the first post in this thread into a Word document and printing, but the text comes out grainy. I think this is because the pictures aren't high resolution enough. The higher resolution cards linked to in later posts are not "card sized," either, so I am a little confused on how to do this.
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werothegreat

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #193 on: October 04, 2012, 02:51:34 pm »
+1

Mountain Pass:

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werothegreat

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #194 on: October 04, 2012, 02:53:34 pm »
+2

Panacea:

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popsofctown

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #195 on: October 04, 2012, 04:06:08 pm »
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I'd like mountain pass to have a more prominent road, like Bridge or Highway.
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eHalcyon

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #196 on: October 04, 2012, 04:13:52 pm »
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Sources?  And are they in the public domain?  They look like they would be, but sometimes it's hard to tell.

I agree with pops, though wero's image for Mountain Pass is not bad at all.  I was thinking of trying to paint something myself, when I had time.  The problem is that I'm not much for actual drawing.  Decent with Photoshop, but that's it.

The one for Panacea might work too.  I have no idea! :P
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AJD

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #197 on: October 04, 2012, 04:30:46 pm »
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...I guess if Soothsayer is in the Black Market deck, then even if no one ever gains it, they can still discard a treasure at the beginning of their buy phase if they want to? (I could, for example, discard a Potion in hopes that it would get me +$1 on my Philosopher's Stone.)

"In games using this" gives me the willies.
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Drab Emordnilap

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #198 on: October 04, 2012, 04:33:35 pm »
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"In games using this" gives me the willies.
Hm. When Duchess is in the Black Market, and I gain a Duchy, can I choose to gain a Duchess (and fail because there aren't any in the supple)?
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eHalcyon

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Re: The Contest Set Card List
« Reply #199 on: October 04, 2012, 04:37:09 pm »
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...I guess if Soothsayer is in the Black Market deck, then even if no one ever gains it, they can still discard a treasure at the beginning of their buy phase if they want to? (I could, for example, discard a Potion in hopes that it would get me +$1 on my Philosopher's Stone.)

"In games using this" gives me the willies.

I believe you are correct.  I don't think that particular interaction is problematic to allow at the start of each turn.  It just adds a nice touch of strategy to other cards.  That ability is also good for Menagerie, fixed draw (e.g. Library) and maybe certain edge cases (e.g. two Smithies collide and there is only one card left in deck; discard one so that it doesn't miss the reshuffle when you play the other).

Duchess also has "In games using this". :)
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