Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1] 2  All

Author Topic: Fan Expansion: Locomotion  (Read 10041 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Tejayes

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 176
  • Respect: +132
    • View Profile
Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« on: July 17, 2011, 05:46:01 pm »
0

A new age has entered your kingdom -- the age of rail. New technologies allow travelers to make their pilgrimages much easier than before. Large quantities of materials and other goods can be transported at once, thanks to these beautiful, heavy-duty machines. Of course, all of this convenience comes with new costs. It's no longer enough just to buy improvements to your infrastructure -- they need to be fixed, updated, protected from those obnoxious vandals... And that's just the beginning. A foolish leader will invest in the wonders of the rails without considering what is needed to use them well. You're not that foolish... are you?

In other words, I'm working on a train-themed fan expansion with utilizes resource management as the primary mechanic. Yes, I know a lot of the rail transport-based card names will not fit in with the more medieval setting of Vaccarino's official originals, but whatever.

Originally, Locomotion was just a Treasure-card-based half-expansion, but I decided that that was too much like Prosperity, so I modified the cards I've been working on to fit the resource management idea a bit better. You'll still see some of my earlier thoughts in the card drafts I show you. Anyway, many of the cards will include some added cost beyond the initial buying price. Hopefully, the designs of these cards will allow for wise players to utilize these extra costs and show just how powerful they can be.

Each card idea will have the general concept I'm aiming for in parentheses afterward, along with edit history. I still need lots of playtesting done to make sure these are priced right and not too game-breaking at any price. Anyone who wants to help on their own is certainly free to do so.

BANDITS
---
Set aside up to two Treasure cards from your hand. If you do, each other player reveals cards from his deck until he reveals a Treasure card. They trash the revealed Treasure cards, then discard the rest. You may gain any trashed copies of the set aside cards. Trash the set aside cards.
--
Action/Attack - $4


(Concept: A more targeted version of Thief, but with a bit of a caveat added to keep the power level down.)
(Still debating the price of this card. It's similar to Thief, with the bonus of almost always hitting a Treasure, but the detriment of needing to trash your own card(s) to do so, not to mention only gaining copies of said card(s). Still, you could trash two Coppers easily with this card. What do you think?)

CABOOSE (New Version)
---
Reveal your hand, then immediately play all Treasures in your hand in any order. Buy a card.
-
While this is in play, if you have no Golds in play when you buy a card this turn, gain a Gold.
--
Action - $5


(Concept: Hopefully a good card for getting quick Gold power that quickly turns less than ideal once you actually want to play said Golds. Needs more testing for sure.)
(Edit 1: Added a single word to nerf this baby a bit. Just to clarify, each Caboose in play only gets you one Gold per turn.)
(Edit 2: I still want this card to allow a player to gain multiple Golds per turn, provided they have no Golds to play. Therefore, I added a mechanic that forces play of all Treasures in your hand.)

COAL MINE
---
+1 Buy
When you play this, it's worth $1 for each token on your Coal Mine mat.
-
(Setup: During your Cleanup phase, if you have 0 Buys and at least $3 remaining in play, put a token on your Coal Mine mat.)
--
Treasure - $6


(Concept: A potentially powerful Treasure that requires quite a bit of setup to get that power. The question is, how do I balance this card out so that it is neither too easy to make stronger than Gold, nor so restrictive that it's not worth trying for?)
(Edit 1: Added a +1 Buy to the card, and added that you must have this card in play to get the token. Now I'm worried that it's too weak.)
(Edit 2: Removed the necessity to have the card in play.)

CONDUCTOR
---
$2
Each other player may reveal a Victory or Curse card from his hand. If he doesn't, he may discard a Treasure card from his hand, then gain a Curse, putting it into his hand. If he doesn't, he discards his hand.
--
Action/Attack - $5


(Concept: I've wanted to see if there was a way to have a full-discard attack without it being too powerful, as well as a card that makes Chapel decks less all-powerful. This card hopefully fulfills both roles.)
(Edit 1: I've been worried about the Treasure-discard attack and how it might be too much in 3-4P games or with TR/KC, so I added the Ticket.)
(Edit 2: Got rid of the Ticket, just made it a good old Curser, and added the Curse blocking power to the card.)

COUCHETTE CAR (NEW!)
---
Reveal your hand, then discard all of the non-Treasure cards from
your hand. Draw until you have seven cards in your hand. Each other
player may reveal a Victory card from his hand. If he does, he draws
until he has six cards in his hand.
--
Action - $5


(Concept: The set's Library variant, and I also wanted to add some more interaction. The bonus to other players won't usually be so great, at least when you compare it to the guaranteed +1 Card from Council Room. It could be much better when Militia'd with a Nobles you keep in your hand, but that's not very likely...)

DEPOT VILLAGE
---
+1 Card
+2 Actions
You may put a Victory card in your hand on top of your deck. If you do, +$2.
--
Action - $4


(Concept: Since every set needs a Village card, here's mine. Sort of like a self-imposed Bureaucrat.)

FUNICULAR
---
+2 Cards
You may discard a Treasure card costing at least $3 from your hand. If you do, +3 Cards.
--
Action - $4


(Concept: A Smithy-like card that can be more powerful if one is willing and able to pay the additional cost, but rather weak otherwise. So far, really only playtested against Smithy with Big Money decks, and Smithy has won every game. Expecting it to get much better with Villages.)

HANDCAR
---
+1 Card
+1 Action
Each player (including you) may trash a card from his hand, then draw a card if he does. If any other player trashes a card, +$1.
--
Action - $3


(Concept: Originally, a card that becomes stronger in games with more players, since I believe this game needs to encourage larger games. Apparently, people don't like that. Anyway, this card is still better in larger games, but not to such an insane degree this time.)
(Edit 1: Added the ability to have the player trash a Treasure, but to no added benefit.)
(Edit 2: Removed most of the scaling issues, as well as the Treasure-only mechanic. It's still more powerful in larger games, but hopefully not ridiculously so. Also added the $1 if opponents trash and draw.)

JUNKYARD
---
+1 Action
+1 Buy
+$1
You may convert 2 Actions, 2 Buys, or 1 Action and 1 Buy into $1.
--
Action - $2


(Concept: A way to put those extraneous Actions and Buys to better use.)
(Edit 1: Added the +1 Action, so that the card by itself isn't completely useless. Now, with no other Actions in play, this basically becomes a $2 Silver that requires an Action to play.)

MANIFEST (Second New Version)
---
+1 Action
You may immediately play up to two Treasure cards from your hand.
You may spend $2 you have in play. If you do, +2 Cards.
-
If another player plays an Attack card, you may reveal and discard this card from your hand. If you do, gain a Manifest token. Manifest tokens can be returned to the supply for $1 at any time.
--
Action/Reaction - $3


(Concept A: A card where you must spend coins in play to use to its fullest potential.)
(Concept B: A reaction card that gives you extra coinage.)

REPAIRS
---
+1 Action
Return a card from your hand to the supply. Gain a card costing the same as or less than the card trashed, putting it into your hand.
--
Action - $4


(Concept: Originally just a way to trade away crap cards for some instant gratification. Now, I can see a strategy of trading a high-cost card for something of the same or lesser value that will better allow you to use other cards in your hand. For example, got two Torturers but no Village cards in your hand? Repair one into a Bazaar or Worker's Village or something.)
(Edit 1: Instead of trashing, the card is now returned to the supply.)

STEAM ENGINE
---
If this card is played as an Action, +$3.
-
If this card is played as a Treasure, $1.
--
Action/Treasure - $5


(Concept: Since there hasn't been an Action/Treasure yet, this is my attempt at one. Why Steam Engine? Because to me, steam engines are so cool that they don't need to be in action to be worthwhile, but are obviously better when in action.)

TERMINUS (New Version)
---
Set aside a card from your hand onto your Terminus mat.
-
At the end of the game, this card is worth 1 VP for every Victory card on your Terminus mat. Trash all cards from your Terminus mat.
--
Action/Victory - $5


(Concept: The set's requisite big VP card. Yes, it's very Island-like, but whatever. Also, to clarify, any Terminus cards on the mat are not worth any points themselves, because they are returned to the deck AFTER your deck's Termini are valued.)
(Edit 1: Terminus-mat cards are now trashed, but you can put other cards on the mat to trash at the end of the game. I might add points for multiples of non-Victory card.)

Feel free to share your thoughts on yet another fan's attempt to get in on the creativity of this fantastic game.
« Last Edit: October 09, 2011, 10:52:08 am by Tejayes »
Logged

minced

  • Coppersmith
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 49
  • Respect: +1
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2011, 07:50:05 pm »
0

COAL MINE
---
This card is worth $1 for each token on your Coal Mine mat.
-
(Setup: During your Clean-up phase, if you have no Buys and at least $3 remaining in play, put a token on your Coal Mine mat)
--
Treasure - $6

Really interesting idea. It's certainly weak in a Province game, because not buying a $6 card with $6 is likely suicide, but in cursing games, it will likely break the game because most turns will be around $3 and no buys.

CONDUCTOR
---
$2
Each other player may reveal a Victory card from his hand. If he doesn't, he discards a Treasure card from his hand. If he doesn't, he discards his hand.
--
Action/Attack - $5

I like this card because it's almost harmless on its own, but devastating with militia/torturer. The first thing a player does when hit by a militia attack is to discard victory cards, after which this attack virtually ruins his/her turn. I don't really see why it's a "conductor" though.

FUNICULAR
---
+2 Cards
You may discard a Treasure card costing at least $3 from your hand. If you do, +3 Cards
--
Action - $4

Interesting effect, gives net +4 cards if you discard a silver. That's just about as good as Envoy in early game but much better than Envoy late. A little strong but well-conceived.

HANDCAR
---
+1 Card
+1 Action
Each other player may trash a Treasure card from his hand. If he does, both he and you draw a card.
--
Action - $3

This card is junk in multiplayer because it only takes one player to refuse the trashing to deny you the lab effect. Other than that, it's kind of cool as a self-replacing trasher. 

JUNKYARD
---
+1 Buy
+$1
You may convert 2 Actions, 2 Buys, or 1 Action and 1 Buy into $1
--
Action - $2

It's half a diadem. I can see this card doing very, very well in city games. In most games it's probably worse than herbalist though.

Overall, you've put an impressive effort into writing cards that are not broken and have interesting mechanics, so keep posting.
Logged

Tejayes

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 176
  • Respect: +132
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2011, 12:11:37 am »
0

Thanks for the commentary and confidence, minced. Just to clarify, Coal Mine adds tokens to the mat if you have no Buys remaining -- as in, you used up all of your Buys during your Buy phase. Also, Handcar is stronger in multiplayer because you get to draw a card for each opponent that trashes a Treasure. If all three of your opponents choose to trash a Copper, that means you draw a total of 4 cards (the one automatically, and one for each trashed Copper), and you also get the Action. True, each opponent gets to draw as well, but still...

As to why Conductor is named Conductor, it's because he's a train conductor, of course. He gets paid ($2) to check passengers (opponents) for tickets (Victory cards). If they don't have one, they have to pay up (discard a Treasure). If they can't pay, the Conductor has to kick them out (discard the hand).
Logged

Censure

  • Pearl Diver
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 14
  • Respect: +1
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2011, 04:09:17 am »
0

COAL MINE
---
This card is worth $1 for each token on your Coal Mine mat.
-
(Setup: During your Clean-up phase, if you have no Buys and at least $3 remaining in play, put a token on your Coal Mine mat)
--
Treasure - $6

Simply put, I do not like this card. It undervalues an already overvalued +Buy (making Woodcutters and Markets, already rather poor cards) even worse. The premise of this card is interesting, but it supports big money in a rather sickening way.

CONDUCTOR
---
$2
Each other player may reveal a Victory card from his hand. If he doesn't, he discards a Treasure card from his hand. If he doesn't, he discards his hand.
--
Action/Attack - $5

So many expansion cards punish early victory card buying, so I liked this card up until the final clause. The probability of drawing nothing but action cards is extremely rare (Minion/Conspirator combos you may be after?). In any case, I like this card but 99% of the time it's a rather useless terminal action, punished by the fact that at $2, it's rather useless outside of trashing games and loses a lot of worth in the late game. That said, the fact that it punishes early trashing is refreshing.


FUNICULAR
---
+2 Cards
You may discard a Treasure card costing at least $3 from your hand. If you do, +3 Cards
--
Action - $4

Interesting spin on the Smithy/Envoy model, but it gives silver a more long-term appeal, which I personally dislike.

HANDCAR
---
+1 Card
+1 Action
Each other player may trash a Treasure card from his hand. If he does, both he and you draw a card.
--
Action - $3

Meh. So it's a inoffensive card to your deck (1 card, 1 action), but it benefits your opponents as much as you? Completely useless in a 2-player game and only marginal in multiplayer games due to the shared benefit.

(Another one of those cards meant to be stronger in 3+ player games.)

Which should probably be avoided. Too many of those as it is.

JUNKYARD
---
+1 Buy
+$1
You may convert 2 Actions, 2 Buys, or 1 Action and 1 Buy into $1
--
Action - $2

I have to say, I really like this one. It's a cheap +Buy alternative and gives value to the mentioned useless cards. Maybe if it converted as many +Buys as you wanted directly into +Coins? Food for thought, but I love the originality of this card.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2011, 04:13:37 am by Censure »
Logged

danshep

  • Navigator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 70
  • Respect: +15
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2011, 03:14:21 am »
0

The conductor's final "discard his hand" clause should be reduced to one of:
 - discard a card from hand.
 - discard down to 3 cards.
 - gain a curse.

Or some other penalty. Having anybody discard their entire hand is not a fun thing to happen (there's a good reason why torturer has the 'or gain a curse' clause).
Logged

kazztawdal

  • Salvager
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 63
  • Respect: +7
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #5 on: July 20, 2011, 12:59:47 pm »
0

Handcar is better if you also allow yourself to trash a Treasure card.

Then it has potential to be a very cheap Laboratory with trashing, if your opponent elects to trash his own Copper to it (which is pretty likely).

Otherwise Censure is correct.
Logged

Tejayes

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 176
  • Respect: +132
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2011, 10:52:24 pm »
0

Just bumping this up, since I finally found some time to make a few changes. Added a few new cards, tweaked the ones I had, and just generally looking to stave off my boredom. Keep up the feedback, because I need it.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3207
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4287
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #7 on: September 22, 2011, 11:16:57 pm »
0

I don't understand how Coal Mine is supposed to work without the requirement that it be in play. Does it mean that you put a token on your Coal Mine mat every turn that you meet the stated requirement about money and buys, even if you didn't play Coal Mine that turn?
Logged

Tejayes

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 176
  • Respect: +132
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #8 on: September 22, 2011, 11:21:03 pm »
0

I don't understand how Coal Mine is supposed to work without the requirement that it be in play. Does it mean that you put a token on your Coal Mine mat every turn that you meet the stated requirement about money and buys, even if you didn't play Coal Mine that turn?

That's correct. I'm still trying to find the right amount of leftover money so that Coal Mine doesn't become too easily broken. I worry that the "have it in play" caveat makes it too hard to get it to its full potential. This one needs a lot of work, I know.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3207
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4287
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #9 on: September 23, 2011, 12:22:12 am »
0

...Even if you haven't gained a Coal Mine yet?
Logged

guided

  • Jester
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 940
  • Respect: +93
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #10 on: September 23, 2011, 12:44:15 am »
0

There's precedent in Trade Route for tracking stuff for cards that haven't been gained yet. It's not a totally wacko, out-of-the-question mechanic or anything.
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3207
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4287
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #11 on: September 23, 2011, 12:51:36 am »
0

True, although it seems a lot weirder for Coal Mine than for Trade Route, since the Trade Route mat belongs to the game as a whole, rather than to individual players. I'm not saying it's out of the question, but it is kind of weird; and moreover if it is what Tejayes intends, it's not all that clear from the card description.
Logged

guided

  • Jester
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 940
  • Respect: +93
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #12 on: September 23, 2011, 01:30:27 am »
0

True, although it seems a lot weirder for Coal Mine than for Trade Route
It doesn't strike me as even a tiny little bit weirder. If anything, Trade Route is the weirder case, since it's the only mat in the game that doesn't belong to the individual players. (see: Native Village, Island, Pirate Ship, VP chips...)

This is, like, not even remotely out-there as fan variant ideas go.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2011, 01:34:14 am by guided »
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3207
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4287
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #13 on: September 23, 2011, 02:56:36 am »
0

Trade Route just works complementarily to City, though—instead of "X happens if Y supply piles are empty", it's "X happens if Y supply piles are not full" (roughly speaking). The mat is just to make it easy to tell at a glance how many Victory piles have been gained from.

It just seems odd and a little inconvenient to have every player in the game individually having to keep track something, from the beginning of the game, for the sake of a card they may never gain (and, indeed, that there may even be only one of, in the Black Market deck), is all.
Logged

biopower

  • Young Witch
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 149
  • Respect: +4
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2011, 03:51:08 am »
0

MANIFEST (NEW!)
---
+1 Card
+1 Action
You may spend $2 you have in play. If you do, play this card again.
-
If another player plays an Attack card, you may reveal and discard this card from your hand. If you do, +1 Card, and gain a Manifest token. At the start of each turn, you receive $1 for each Manifest token in your possession.
--
Action/Reaction - $2


So basically, if you react to an attack 8 times and thus get 8 Manifest tokens, you always get +$8 every turn? That seems a bit overpowered, especially given that this card is cheap, nonterminal, and self-replacing as a reaction. You could easily spam Manifests so that you can react more than one time to any attack, and thus gain an insane amount of extra money at the end of every turn.
Logged

guided

  • Jester
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 940
  • Respect: +93
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2011, 09:11:14 am »
0

Yeah, Manifest is brokenly strong and would probably remain brokenly strong at a cost of $5. Suggestions:

First, I don't like the Action effect. Powerful, cheap reaction cards shouldn't be cantrips in general IMO; people will just buy them like candy with little to no consequence, making them even more powerful. When you buy a $2 card that's awesome against attacks, it should pretty much suck to have it in hand and not get attacked (see: Moat). Lighthouse is awesome, but at least it misses shuffles and doesn't draw cards.

Secondly, while I'm on board with the concept of spending coin to gain extra benefit from a card, as written that's going to be a very niche usage, requiring setup either with Black Market or +$ effects on action cards. Would you really want to blow a Festival just to power up this card? I think you need to allow for the possibility of using treasure cards as a possible source of coin for the extra benefit. In cases where this is useful, the possibility of gaining the benefit over and over again by paying more is kind of insane too.

Finally, your reaction effect is ridiculously too good. Either it will scare anyone away from ever playing an attack, or whoever manages to get lucky enough to have the most of these in hand against attacks will walk away with the game by getting like +$8 every turn after not too long!

Here's one possible rework, with some room for improvement on how treasures from the hand are "spent":

-
+1 Action
If you do not have $2, you may play Treasures until you have a least $2.
You may pay $2. If you do, +2 Cards.
-
When another player plays an Attack card, you may reveal this from your hand. If you do, discard it and gain a Manifest token. A Manifest token may be expended for +$2 any time you could play an action or treasure card.
-
Action/Reaction - $3



Possibly you want to restrict it to basic treasures, if you're worried about Quarry/Ironworks or Horn of Plenty fueling new engine cards mid-turn or making it way too easy to run a double-Tactician deck with this thing or whatever. It would require playtesting. Another possibility that came to mind is discarding or setting aside treasure cards to pay for the extra benefit, but I couldn't think of any really satisfying way to handle that. "Set aside two treasures" is brutal (more or less requiring 2 Coppers in hand, when you kind of want to allow payment with 1 Silver instead), "Discard 2 cards" is boring (ooooh, a crappy cellar...), etc.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2011, 09:16:54 am by guided »
Logged

Tejayes

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 176
  • Respect: +132
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #16 on: September 23, 2011, 05:43:14 pm »
0

Here's one possible rework, with some room for improvement on how treasures from the hand are "spent":

-
+1 Action
If you do not have $2, you may play Treasures until you have a least $2.
You may pay $2. If you do, +2 Cards.
-
When another player plays an Attack card, you may reveal this from your hand. If you do, discard it and gain a Manifest token. A Manifest token may be expended for +$2 any time you could play an action or treasure card.
-
Action/Reaction - $3


I like that. I have to admit that I forgot about the whole "don't make reactions cantrips" thing from Rinkworks' guide. I'll go with your suggestion, guided, with a little bit of an edit...

MANIFEST (new version)
---
+1 Action
You may immediately play two Treasure cards from your hand, or return a Manifest token to the supply for $2.
You may spend $2 you have in play. If you do, +2 Cards.
-
When an opponent plays an Attack card, you may reveal and discard this card from your hand. If you do, gain a Manifest token.
--
Action/Reaction - $3


How does that sound? I know the Action part still allows the use of cards like Horn of Plenty, but I'll playtest this (when I can, which unfortunately is not nearly as often as I'd like) to see whether it does goof things up so much.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2011, 12:25:11 am by Tejayes »
Logged

rinkworks

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1316
  • Respect: +936
    • View Profile
    • RinkWorks
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #17 on: September 23, 2011, 08:22:07 pm »
0

That's a pretty neat idea.  By the way, my guess is that the non-terminality of this one is fine, as is potential powerful combos with Horn of Plenty, et al.  When it's just a small number of cards that you can do a powerful thing with, that's not broken, it's just a combo.  Chancellor/Stash is a great example of that.  Tough combo to beat, but it's fine.
Logged

Hamlet

  • Chancellor
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 21
  • Respect: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #18 on: September 23, 2011, 08:38:50 pm »
0

Still, Manifest should be nerfed. Imagine a train (no pun intended) of Manifest cards. For $3, it shouldn't have the Swiss-Army-Knife power of Goons or Market. I would rather use this for a milder effect:

MANIFEST ---
+ 1 Buy
-
When an opponent plays an Attack card, you may reveal and discard this card from your hand. If you do, gain a Manifest token. At the beginning of your next turn, +$ equal to the number of Manifest tokens. At the end of of that turn, return all those Manifest tokens to the supply.
--
Action/Reaction - $4

Logged

rinkworks

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1316
  • Respect: +936
    • View Profile
    • RinkWorks
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #19 on: September 23, 2011, 11:48:08 pm »
0

That version is borderline useless without attack cards in the game.
Logged

Tejayes

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 176
  • Respect: +132
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #20 on: September 24, 2011, 01:33:47 am »
0

Bumping again, since I have three new card concepts to show off and get feedback for. Also, finishing the final touches on a Curser and a Victory card, which will get me to a nice half-expansion size.
Logged

Jack Rudd

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1286
  • Shuffle iT Username: Jack Rudd
  • Respect: +1333
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #21 on: September 24, 2011, 05:24:09 pm »
0

CABOOSE (NEW!)
---
+1 Buy
-
When you buy a card this turn, if you have no Golds in play, gain a Gold.
--
Action - $5

Jack Rudd plays a King's Court
...and plays a King's Court
...and plays a Caboose
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays a Caboose again
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays a Caboose a third time
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays the King's Court again
...and plays a Caboose
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays a Caboose again
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays a Caboose a third time
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays the King's Court a third time
...and plays a Caboose
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays a Caboose again
...gaining +1 buy
...and plays a Caboose a third time
...gaining +1 buy
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Jack Rudd buys a Peddler
...gaining a Gold
Logged
Centuries later, archaeologists discover the remains of your ancient civilization.

Evidence of thriving towns, Pottery, roads, and a centralized government amaze the startled scientists.

Finally, they come upon a stone tablet, which contains but one mysterious phrase!

'ISOTROPIC WILL RETURN!'

Hamlet

  • Chancellor
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 21
  • Respect: 0
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #22 on: September 24, 2011, 06:40:44 pm »
0

That version is borderline useless without attack cards in the game.

Moat is borderline useless unless there are attack cards in the game. Some cards are built for specific situations. Maybe adding +1$ would help.
I don't know how to fix Caboose without nerfing by a retarded amount.
Logged

rinkworks

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1316
  • Respect: +936
    • View Profile
    • RinkWorks
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #23 on: September 24, 2011, 07:39:16 pm »
0

CABOOSE (NEW!)
---
+1 Buy
-
When you buy a card this turn, if you have no Golds in play, gain a Gold.
--
Action - $5

Jack Rudd plays a King's Court
...

I think that card is safe from that trick, or at least can be.  With a horizontal line there, and "When you buy a card this turn..." being not so dissimilar from "While this is in play...", that suggests that particular effect doesn't duplicate with King's Court.

Still, for that to be unambiguous, I'd recommend cribbing from Goons:  "While this is in play and no Gold cards are in play, when you buy a card, gain a Gold."

Still might be too strong, though, possibly even without the ability to play multiples with Villages.  Possibly even without the +1 Buy, which is a monster of a bonus on that particular card.  It's basically half the effect of activated Treasure Maps, every single time you play the card (because if you have this and a Gold in hand on your turn, you're probably not playing that Gold until gaining Golds doesn't matter anymore).

By the way, Depot Village is a pretty cool idea.  I'm suspicious about it being worth it very often -- returning a victory card costs more than just a card slot in the next turn, as it's also a cycling disadvantage.  But certainly it would be worth it sometimes.  Even if not, a $4 Village is sometimes a desirable thing in the absence of the vanilla version anyway.

Bandits is a great idea, but I'm not sure about it working in practice.  It's too difficult to visualize without playtesting.  But I do really like the mechanic of setting aside cards and making opponents hunt for them.  Seems like a lot of different kinds of attacks could be made with that idea.
« Last Edit: September 24, 2011, 07:46:36 pm by rinkworks »
Logged

AJD

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3207
  • Shuffle iT Username: AJD
  • Respect: +4287
    • View Profile
Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2011, 12:10:08 am »
0

I think that card is safe from that trick, or at least can be.  With a horizontal line there, and "When you buy a card this turn..." being not so dissimilar from "While this is in play...", that suggests that particular effect doesn't duplicate with King's Court.

But that trick doesn't involve duplicating the card with King's Court—or rather, all the King's Court duplicates is the +1 Buy. All that trick depends on is having Caboose in play, and buying 10 cards (which are Peddlers because they're cheap enough) and gaining a Gold for each buy. Actually, if Caboose worked the same way Goons did, Jack Rudd's trick would have gained three Golds for each Peddler since there are three copies of Caboose in play. I think that would be too powerful, but if it could be constrained to—unlike Hoard—give only one Gold per buy even if multiple Cabooses are in play, I think it's fine. I don't think Jack Rudd's trick is broken; if someone can get a hand of KC-KC-Caboose-Caboose-Caboose while there are still 10 Peddlers in the supply, I say more power to them.
Logged
Pages: [1] 2  All
 

Page created in 0.095 seconds with 21 queries.