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Author Topic: Fan Expansion: Locomotion  (Read 11408 times)

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rinkworks

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2011, 07:46:29 am »
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I think that card is safe from that trick, or at least can be.  With a horizontal line there, and "When you buy a card this turn..." being not so dissimilar from "While this is in play...", that suggests that particular effect doesn't duplicate with King's Court.

But that trick doesn't involve duplicating the card with King's Court—or rather, all the King's Court duplicates is the +1 Buy. All that trick depends on is having Caboose in play, and buying 10 cards (which are Peddlers because they're cheap enough) and gaining a Gold for each buy. Actually, if Caboose worked the same way Goons did, Jack Rudd's trick would have gained three Golds for each Peddler since there are three copies of Caboose in play. I think that would be too powerful, but if it could be constrained to—unlike Hoard—give only one Gold per buy even if multiple Cabooses are in play, I think it's fine. I don't think Jack Rudd's trick is broken; if someone can get a hand of KC-KC-Caboose-Caboose-Caboose while there are still 10 Peddlers in the supply, I say more power to them.

Ah right, I misread that.
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Thinkaman

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2011, 07:58:47 am »
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Coal Mine is crazy strong, and has anti-synergy with everything including itself.  At best, it's like a non-interactive Pirate Ship.  At worst, it actively discourages all players from buying fun cards.

It's way strong with cheap cantrips, makes +Buy cards bad, and is a pretty self-contained strategy by itself.  Playing Big Coal Mine is more or less just a better Big Money that can compete on Colonies and Dukes.  Probably not desirable?

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Conductor is really confusing to read thanks to it's nested conditionals.  All else aside, that has to go.

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with this attack, but it's not really that compelling either.  It's sort of an odd combo--a weak Montebank mixed with a Cutpurse?  I'm not sure it merits adding a new fat-free Curse card to the game.  On that note, you would really need 10/20/30 copies of it if you want it to scale at all evenly in multiplayer.

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Funicular is really powerful!  Neat and simple concept, but might need some power tweaking.  It could cost 5 as written and I'd still buy several.  Keep in mind that at +5 cards it becomes really easy to draw your whole deck and then some, getting you those Treasure right back.  Just have a few villages around and it's off to the races.

Consider Council Room, for comparison.

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Handcar is political and scales like crazy with number of players.  On the whole though, Copper-trashing cantrip isn't really compelling, especially when--as written--it has occasional "crap I don't have coppers in my hand but there are some in my deck, should I play this?" AP.

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Junkyard feels weak, even for a non-terminal $2 cost.  It just feels like a raw deal, as it's rare to actually have the surplus needed to make this remotely valuable--again, even by $2 standards.  It's especially awkward early game, when you can't play it after your Woodcutter or Herbalist.

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I think Repairs is going to be a lot more narrow than you might expect; on so many boards it's just not going to have an important use.  A good $2 option helps it a lot, but in general there isn't much use for it outside of fringe cases like Peddler.  Non-terminality isn't enough to make it better than Remodel, which isn't exactly the strongest $4 in the universe.

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Steam Engine is slick, I love it.

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Manifest confuses me.  So it's a Reaction to an attack that does nothing but gives you $2 after jumping through a couple of hoops?  Oh, or +2 cards, I see.  That's still not very compelling, it doesn't compare favorably to Moat or Silver.  The only thing working for Manifest is fringe interactions with Treasures, Black Market style. 

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Depot Village is interesting, hmm.  Not sure how fun it would be to play, but the value of it is interesting.

I'd be curious to see direct comparisons with Mining Village.  It would go great with trashers almost like a Haven alternative, and might even be a really wacky combo with Baron. (I'd want to play that and see.)

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Bandits is really high variance, even more than Thief. (Which is saying something...) The steeper cost and higher late-game benefit makes it scale even more badly across number of players.  Personally I wouldn't investigate this direction much further.

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So uh, Caboose is crazy good.  You said you nerfed it, but it's still amazing.  Free Golds!  None of that Hoard Duchy/Estate-buying nonsense, these suckers come with Havens and Villages!  The +Buy lets it combo with itself, which is probably good and fun... but only makes the power level issues worse.  Try higher costs?
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Tejayes

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #27 on: September 26, 2011, 09:00:07 pm »
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Added a new card, added concept information to each card, and made a few changes based on the comments seen so far. Thanks for all of the help, guys.
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Thinkaman

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #28 on: September 27, 2011, 12:59:27 am »
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Terminus is pretty interesting and super powerful as written at $5.  It's the combined super child of Duke and Island--like seriously, it's a Duke that "trashes" and also works with Estates, only requiring you to carry out the Actions to make it work.  You pretty much have to contest them.  Making it $6 would slow it down considerably and make it a lot more reasonable on general boards, if my hunch on the current power level is right.
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biopower

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #29 on: September 27, 2011, 03:44:21 am »
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Terminus is pretty interesting and super powerful as written at $5.  It's the combined super child of Duke and Island--like seriously, it's a Duke that "trashes" and also works with Estates, only requiring you to carry out the Actions to make it work.  You pretty much have to contest them.  Making it $6 would slow it down considerably and make it a lot more reasonable on general boards, if my hunch on the current power level is right.

I'd agree that it probably should be priced higher than $5, because it doesn't take extra work to hit 3VP with this; unlike duke which requires you to green your deck with duchies, you start off with three estates to get rid of, and the effect is beneficial to the player. I'd say it's much more like a Chapel/Duke/Island because cards placed on the mat aren't valued, so you wouldn't want to get rid of your provinces.
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Thinkaman

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #30 on: September 27, 2011, 03:49:53 am »
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As written, only "Terminus cards themselves" count for zero when on the mat.  The other cards are returned. (Terminus cards return too, but they were not around at the time their value changed.)
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Tejayes

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #31 on: September 30, 2011, 12:33:19 am »
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Added a new card, changed Terminus around, and tweaked the wording of some of the others. I'm going to keep this fan expansion at 13 cards, so if I come up with something else, it will replace one of the cards already posted.

Also, I added a poll to help me determine what my "fix this card" priorities are. Those that get more votes will be playtested much more, and you'll be allowed to change your vote once, hopefully, the goofier cards become more solid.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2011, 12:37:23 am by Tejayes »
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Tejayes

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #32 on: October 09, 2011, 10:59:05 am »
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I change Caboose around again. Mostly, it's in response to comments about WanderingWinder's Investment card. It's basically the same, both cards allowing the gain of one Gold. However, Investment's Gold-gaining can be augmented by TR and KC, while mine can't. Also, Investment doesn't have the caveat of not being able to play Golds to get the Gold. Since people don't seem to think Investment is overpowered, I decided to go back to my original idea of allowing multiple Gold gains, provided the bonus costs. Hopefully this card will make things more interesting while still being fairly priced at $5.
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Tejayes

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #33 on: October 28, 2011, 10:46:46 am »
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Here's a new version of Bandits, still very early in the testing phase.

BANDITS
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Every player (including you) reveals cards from his deck until he reveals a Treasure. Choose one: each player puts his revealed Treasure into his hand; or each player returns his revealed Treasure to the top of his deck; or each player gains a copy of his revealed Treasure, then discards the revealed Treasure; or trash all of the revealed Treasures. Discard the other revealed cards.
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Action/Attack - $4

Just to clarify, the effect the player chooses applies to everyone. You cannot choose a different effect for each player.
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ChaosRed

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Re: Fan Expansion: Locomotion
« Reply #34 on: October 28, 2011, 04:00:03 pm »
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COAL MINE
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This card is worth $1 for each token on your Coal Mine mat.
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(Setup: During your Clean-up phase, if you have no Buys and at least $3 remaining in play, put a token on your Coal Mine mat)
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Treasure - $6

Really interesting idea. It's certainly weak in a Province game, because not buying a $6 card with $6 is likely suicide, but in cursing games, it will likely break the game because most turns will be around $3 and no buys.

I'll chime in here and say I thought this card was really interesting too. It has situations where I think it could be quite useful. I really like the idea of a card that collects your "loose change" after the buy phase. Cool idea.
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