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Author Topic: How to get around "verification failed"  (Read 12808 times)

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Brando Commando

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How to get around "verification failed"
« on: June 24, 2012, 04:37:13 pm »
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I have both a google and a yahoo account I've used with isotropic, but right now only my google account is working -- with my yahoo account, when I click on the yahoo button (on the page you normally land on with dominion.isotropic.org/play), I directed to a page that simply says "verification failed." I'm logged into my yahoo e-mail account already, so it seems like I should be able to get on, no problem. What should I do?
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WanderingWinder

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2012, 04:51:52 pm »
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Dunno, but I have the same problem.

WanderingWinder

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2012, 07:06:14 pm »
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Still an issue for me. I s no one else having this trouble? I guess you all use Google....

Morgrim7

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2012, 07:21:00 pm »
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I'm having this same problem...
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DG

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2012, 07:42:01 pm »
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Same problem
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WanderingWinder

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2012, 09:01:18 pm »
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Now is working.

Brando Commando

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2012, 11:06:34 pm »
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So now it's working for me, too, but I've noticed that the super-detailed card counting -- where the number each person has of each card is displayed next to the icons on the card list to the left -- is gone. (I think was/is part of the chrome extension.) ? Am I missing something?
« Last Edit: June 24, 2012, 11:13:40 pm by Brando Commando »
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WanderingWinder

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2012, 11:32:41 pm »
+1

So now it's working for me, too, but I've noticed that the super-detailed card counting -- where the number each person has of each card is displayed next to the icons on the card list to the left -- is gone. (I think was/is part of the chrome extension.) ? Am I missing something?
They HAVE this??????!!!!!! They shouldn't!

Eevee

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2012, 11:47:15 pm »
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So now it's working for me, too, but I've noticed that the super-detailed card counting -- where the number each person has of each card is displayed next to the icons on the card list to the left -- is gone. (I think was/is part of the chrome extension.) ? Am I missing something?
They HAVE this??????!!!!!! They shouldn't!
Makes my gaming experience much more enjoyable.
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Young Nick

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2012, 11:54:19 pm »
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Where do I get this magical extension?
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Eevee

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2012, 11:57:36 pm »
+1

Where do I get this magical extension?
http://goo.gl/iDihS , works only on chrome afaik.
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Thisisnotasmile

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2012, 03:55:05 am »
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Does that extension have the auto status message that the unofficial point counter does? And is it automatically blocked from being matched against people prohibiting point counters?

If the answer to either of these questions is no then I guess I quit Isotropic and wait for FunSockets.
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qmech

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2012, 04:03:34 am »
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It is the unofficial point counter, but I didn't know it had been changed to make the deck contents information more easily available.

The extension as written will always announce itself at the start of the game, but in principle you could modify it so that it doesn't.  You can also query the "official" unofficial point counter for any of the information that it's user can see, in a slightly less convenient form.
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DStu

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2012, 04:05:06 am »
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If the answer to either of these questions is no then I guess I quit Isotropic and wait for FunSockets.

Do you really expect dougz to check for browser type and extension, and watch the extension market to look witch extensions are around and to which he must react?

And after all, it is a quite trivial thing to write once you know how to write extensions for Chrome, and especially given there is an extensions around for some years now that only needs to be "improved". So "everybody" potentially has such an extension since some time now, and it should be no big surprise.
Of course, one could discuss if using a point counter is cheating (I would prefer not to again, but if I remember correctly there somewhere is a thread with my opinion), but that this possibly-cheating is possible on isotropic is not a big surprise.

AND, given that Funsockets will be played in a browser, it would be a big surprise if the possibly-cheating is not possible in their game.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2012, 04:07:48 am by DStu »
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Thisisnotasmile

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2012, 04:35:05 am »
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If the answer to either of these questions is no then I guess I quit Isotropic and wait for FunSockets.

Do you really expect dougz to check for browser type and extension, and watch the extension market to look witch extensions are around and to which he must react?

And after all, it is a quite trivial thing to write once you know how to write extensions for Chrome, and especially given there is an extensions around for some years now that only needs to be "improved". So "everybody" potentially has such an extension since some time now, and it should be no big surprise.
Of course, one could discuss if using a point counter is cheating (I would prefer not to again, but if I remember correctly there somewhere is a thread with my opinion), but that this possibly-cheating is possible on isotropic is not a big surprise.

AND, given that Funsockets will be played in a browser, it would be a big surprise if the possibly-cheating is not possible in their game.

Not really sure what brought this on? Of course I don't expect dougz to do that stuff, however he has made adjustments to Isotropic to do exactly what I am asking before. I don't want him to do it again now, I just wanted to know if the previous alterations still apply, or if this was a whole new extension that gets around it. At the end of the day, people are playing with an unofficial variant that I do not want to play with. I asked a couple of questions to ensure that people are not using the variant against me without my permission. What's the problem?
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DStu

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2012, 07:46:48 am »
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If the answer to either of these questions is no then I guess I quit Isotropic and wait for FunSockets.

Do you really expect dougz to check for browser type and extension, and watch the extension market to look witch extensions are around and to which he must react?

And after all, it is a quite trivial thing to write once you know how to write extensions for Chrome, and especially given there is an extensions around for some years now that only needs to be "improved". So "everybody" potentially has such an extension since some time now, and it should be no big surprise.
Of course, one could discuss if using a point counter is cheating (I would prefer not to again, but if I remember correctly there somewhere is a thread with my opinion), but that this possibly-cheating is possible on isotropic is not a big surprise.

AND, given that Funsockets will be played in a browser, it would be a big surprise if the possibly-cheating is not possible in their game.

Not really sure what brought this on? Of course I don't expect dougz to do that stuff, however he has made adjustments to Isotropic to do exactly what I am asking before. I don't want him to do it again now, I just wanted to know if the previous alterations still apply, or if this was a whole new extension that gets around it. At the end of the day, people are playing with an unofficial variant that I do not want to play with. I asked a couple of questions to ensure that people are not using the variant against me without my permission. What's the problem?

No problem there, sorry if I sounded harsh.

Formely, there was a point counter extension for the browser, so dougz gave isotropic also a point counter and the option for the matching. But the extension is still there, and it's more powerfull than the isotropic version. And there is not much dougz can do against it, except giving isotropic the possibility to tell you everything you could possibly know. E.g. what's left in your deck, what's in your discard, how many cards, how many VY, etc. pp, so nobody needs this extension. But if you want to play unfair, you can still have it and pretend you play without point counter.

I just think that as this game is played in a browser, there is no way of preventing the browser to count data which is (or was) known to him. And as the browser must display the game state at some point to you, it can just remember.
There is the possibility of checking which addons are installed for the server, but this can be easily circumvented.

And I think if you don't want to live with the risk that someone uses these unfair* means against you, you should better not expect to much from Funsockets, because, in a browser, they have exactly the same problem. They must display the game to you, therefore the browser knows what's happening, therefore you can write an extension that remembers this data. Maybe it's obfuscated enough that no one want's to take the work, but I would not count on this.

*no discussion here please.
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Brando Commando

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2012, 08:21:34 am »
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To clarify how this new counter came about, let me explain: At some point -- I can't remember when, a few months ago? -- the Chrome extension, without any prompting on my part, began displaying information next to the card icons about how many of each card everyone had. In other words, the new functionality just became part of the standard Chrome extension, as far as I understand.

Presumably, people who weren't using the Chrome extension didn't realize that there was this new functionality...and only apparently now is it coming to light, since if the single most dedicated player and forum user (WW, naturally) didn't now about it (see above), then I can only suppose most other people didn't either.

Which all may be a moot point, since this whole card county thing is apparently non-functional. I'd be interested in other reports about whether other people are still seeing it when they play on Iso with Chrome.
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DStu

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2012, 08:44:20 am »
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I also don't have councilroom logs of my yesterdays games, so maybe output format changed and messed things up?
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WanderingWinder

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2012, 08:45:09 am »
0

So now it's working for me, too, but I've noticed that the super-detailed card counting -- where the number each person has of each card is displayed next to the icons on the card list to the left -- is gone. (I think was/is part of the chrome extension.) ? Am I missing something?
They HAVE this??????!!!!!! They shouldn't!
Makes my gaming experience much more enjoyable.
It makes mine much less available when people cheat.l, especially when it is unequal and when n I don't know...

Eevee

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2012, 10:07:07 am »
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It makes mine much less available when people cheat.l, especially when it is unequal and when n I don't know...
Yeah, I agree everyone should definitely know about it (and have a chance to use it if they so desire). I would actually add it to the isotropic / funsockets interface, but I understand I might be alone with this opinion.

I would be ok with getting DQ'd from the leaderboard for using it if it makes competetive dominion unfair. I would be ok with only playing guys who use it (my status message announces I do). Whatever, I play the game for fun, I dont find remembering stuff very fun at all. I'm quite surprised to see you take that strong of a stance against it. Would you be ok with people marking that stuff with paper and pen to help them remember?
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Death to Sea Hags

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #20 on: June 25, 2012, 10:43:47 am »
+1

and when n I don't know...

The extension announces its presence in the game in the chat box before the first move.

Any player in a Point Counter Game can type "!status" in the chat box to get the current score. Similarly, any player in a game where at least one player has the extension can type "!details" for the current counts of all cards for each player.

Further, if your opponent has selected the "allow disabling" option, YOU can disable their extension in the first five moves with "!disable".  If a player has NOT allowed disabling, their status message in the lobby will include "Auto Count" so you know to avoid them - or just play "no point counter."  So you CAN avoid these players.

So if you are playing against an extension-using player, it won't (shouldn't) be a surprise once the game has started.  All in all, the current implementation is very community-friendly.

------

But to get back to the original topic, which I think is at least more likely to be resolved to the satisfaction of all players...

Just had two games where the other player "resigned", even though they were playing quite rapidly.  Any further info on this new behavior from Iso?
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Brando Commando

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2012, 10:56:06 am »
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Similarly, any player in a game where at least one player has the extension can type "!details" for the current counts of all cards for each player.

The !details command (the ability to see the card counts) has been around for a long time -- the only "new" thing was that the card counting was actually displayed right there next to the supply information.
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WanderingWinder

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2012, 11:55:06 am »
+1

and when n I don't know...

The extension announces its presence in the game in the chat box before the first move.
Yes, but I didn't know that it does THIS. What it tells you is that the game is being scored by the counter blah blah blah.

Quote
Any player in a Point Counter Game can type "!status" in the chat box to get the current score. Similarly, any player in a game where at least one player has the extension can type "!details" for the current counts of all cards for each player.
I'm not 100% but I think there is a version that this isn't true for...

Quote
Further, if your opponent has selected the "allow disabling" option, YOU can disable their extension in the first five moves with "!disable".  If a player has NOT allowed disabling, their status message in the lobby will include "Auto Count" so you know to avoid them - or just play "no point counter."  So you CAN avoid these players.
Well, firstly, I think it ought always be disableable, because this makes the playing field even. Even if I use the details thing, it tells it to me in a less clear manner, than it does you. And you get to see that I'm looking at that, which means that you get that information on me. Further, I can't avoid these players so well in auto-match, I would need to know that this is what "Auto Count" means, as opposed to just the tracker, and they need to not remove this from their status, which quite frankly isn't difficult to do.

WanderingWinder

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2012, 11:56:48 am »
+1

It makes mine much less available when people cheat.l, especially when it is unequal and when n I don't know...
Yeah, I agree everyone should definitely know about it (and have a chance to use it if they so desire). I would actually add it to the isotropic / funsockets interface, but I understand I might be alone with this opinion.

I would be ok with getting DQ'd from the leaderboard for using it if it makes competetive dominion unfair. I would be ok with only playing guys who use it (my status message announces I do). Whatever, I play the game for fun, I dont find remembering stuff very fun at all. I'm quite surprised to see you take that strong of a stance against it. Would you be ok with people marking that stuff with paper and pen to help them remember?
Of course I would not be ok with that!
I DO find remembering enjoyable, and I find it to be an important part of the game, so I don't really like it when people have machines do it for him. Perhaps not coincidentally, I've been blessed with a pretty good memory talent.

zxcvbn2

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Re: How to get around "verification failed"
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2012, 12:33:06 pm »
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So Fabian suggested using it in the first One Day Cup. It is, as others have mentioned, disableable, and it's quite common for my opponents to do so. If you disable it, you can still see the score via the isotropic version.

I find it's not very broken except with certain cards (like Wishing Well). In games without it, and even without a point counter at all, I find I play the same way. This might not be true for other players, but I'm just giving my own anecdotal evidence.

And in all fairness, a point counter itself is "cheating." This DOES give you more information (a quick reference to how many duchies, total cards, unique cards, etc.) than a point counter, but I don't know that it's really that much worse of a crime than a point counter in itself.
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