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[Kirian]

What Am I Going To Do With All That Lead Anyway?

This week we will all play matches dominated by Alchemy--and therefore Potions.  Each match is seven total games.  Due to general consensus, the following rule is in effect:

Default is to play with six cards from Alchemy.  However, if you and your opponent mutually agree--and I suspect this will happen a lot--you may instead play with four cards from Alchemy.

Please report your results in this thread.  I'm going to ask you to follow a reporting style much like rspeer's post here but with some small changes.

• Please make sure the person listed first in the matchups below (or the person on top in the Challonge brackets) is listed first.
• Please make sure your scores are listed.
• Don't worry about making your scores a link to the game log, just put it in there on the line.

Feel free to add further commentary, but please put it after these opening lines!

Please have your match completed by 18:00 GMT Thursday 19 April.  Good luck and have fun!

If you wish to play future matches, feel free to do so... but wait to post the results in that week's thread.

Week Four Match-ups:

Fire Group

Titandrake vs. ednever
O vs. Insomniac-X
DGHunter79 vs. antony
shark_bait vs. Tmoiy

Air Group

Ignorantmen vs. [MAD] Mergus
coheed vs. perdhapley
Jorbles vs. tlloyd
Axxle vs. Yuma

Earth Group

mnavratil vs. BJ Penn
michaeljb vs. A_S00
CarpeDeezNuts vs. mikemike
ebEliminator vs. ninjabus

Water Group

greatexpectations vs. Mean Mr. Mustard
RisingJaguar vs. Nicki Menagerie
Brando Commando vs. AHoppy
rspeer vs. ^_^_^_^

Bracket Results (and future weeks) are here:

http://isodom.challonge.com

[michaeljb]

Is setting it to 4-6 Alchemy cards allowed?

[Kirian]

Is setting it to 4-6 Alchemy cards allowed?

If mutually agreed, yes.

[PerdHapley]

perdhapley beats coheed 6 - 1. I pulled out a few lucky victories here, and tried a few risky things that fortunately worked out. My apologies to coheed for showing up to our matchup a bit late, he was a great opponent and we had a fast-paced enjoyable match.

Game 1: coheed 43 - perdhapley 52
Game 2: coheed 20 - perdhapley 32
Game 3: coheed 50 - perdhapley 39
Game 4: coheed 20 - perdhapley 33
Game 5: coheed 8 - perdhapley 9
Game 6: coheed 18 - perdhapley 21
Game 7: coheed 40 - perdhapley 48

Game 1: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/13/game-20120413-123322-470ce0b2.html
We both use Mine to get to Hoard for Silk Road and Gardens, but I'm able to pick it up first turn with 5/2 and grab a few Provinces along the way for the victory.

Game 2: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/13/game-20120413-123944-183c4861.html
My feeling here was that Trader/BM would be faster than Alchemist in a Witch game, and I think this bears that out. Coheed has free reign over Peddlers and Alchemists while I grab Ventures and load my deck with Silver, and ultimately am able to buy Provinces at a faster clip.

Game 3: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/13/game-20120413-124357-fd3e368d.html
Coheed outplayed me here. My initial plan was to empty the Talisman pile and stuff my deck with Silver for Gardens points, and then he starts moving faster than I thought he would and I panic. He takes it pretty easily.

Game 4: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/13/game-20120413-125046-dce02837.html
Alchemist and Witch both show up again and I once again ignore Potion, taking Cutpurse to hopefully slow him down enough that I can build an economy. I manage to grab a bunch of Golds and it's enough to boost me up.

Game 5: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/13/game-20120413-125920-92f68b17.html
A University/Torturer game; I feel pretty behind for almost all of it, and then on the last turn I'm able to just barely sneak out a win on piles with one Province. I was very surprised to win this one.

Game 6: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/13/game-20120413-130534-400f76be.html
Unlucky for Coheed - I hit one of his Provinces with Swindler to wipe them out on my last turn, luckily ending the game just a turn before he surely would've hit $8 and taken the win. Shuffle luck just loved me today.

Game 7: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/13/game-20120413-131244-7f76ee20.html
This one was fun - University/Apprentice craziness on top of Witch and Margrave with Vineyards! And also another last-minute victory for me. Going into my last turn coheed and I were tied at 40 pts with two Vineyards and two Provinces remaining, and I am fortunate enough to draw into Margrave and a couple Potions to take the win.

...Very interesting set overall, with the last three games being decided by some last turn insanity. Coheed was very pleasant about all of it, but I'm sure that must have been frustrating. We played with four Alchemy cards in every game, and I think that was the perfect number. The same ones kept showing up though - lots of Alchemist and Apothecary and University and even Apprentice, NOT A SINGLE GAME WITH FAMILIAR OR POSSESSION. Just continues the trend in my matches of these set-biases leading to unexpected results. I can't wait to see the first set of logs in which Familiar shows up in every single game, this is going to be a really fun week to see what everyone's kingdoms looked like.

[Kirian]

That may be the fastest match ever posted to a tournament.  Obviously you had the time picked out beforehand given you were playing while I typed this.

[PerdHapley]

That may be the fastest match ever posted to a tournament.  Obviously you had the time picked out beforehand given you were playing while I typed this.

I always like getting my matches in early . If possible I would've raced through all 7 rounds of this thing on the first day, I'm already getting jazzed for Prosperity now

[CoheedandCambria]

ggs perdhapley! Alchemy is just not my strong suit. I fell for the alchemist trap way too often and I didn't know how to use apothecary effectively (I auto veto it because I normally play on a device that cannot reorder cards.)

Those swindlers in game 6 were really brutal for me. Turned into a 6 province game instead of 8 and I felt if it were a little bit longer I would've won. Our kingdoms weren't all that fun and it didn't feel like the games were dominated by alchemy. Most of the games, going for the potion cards was the wrong decision. I guess it was mainly because we only got the weak potion cards and when we got golems or scrying pools there was nothing to pair well with them. No familiars or possessions was kind of disheartening I was prepared for a war.
 
Can't wait for next week, long colony games are my favorite

[Brando Commando]

Oi, I had some painful games against AHoppy, who had 5 wins in this series to my 2. He took full advantage of early possessions...

Game 1: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-112831-246db92f.html

AHoppy 40 - Brando Commando 32

Game 2: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-111630-7949f453.html

AHoppy 42 - Brando Commando 36

Game 3: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-115314-e88ce7ab.html

AHoppy 18 - Brando Commando 28

Game 4: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-114353-a3d4b4eb.html

AHoppy 31 - Brando Commando 33

Game 5: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-121710-38897985.html

AHoppy 50 - Brando Commando 23

Game 6: I don't have this game log, but AHoppy won it.

AHoppy ? - Brando Commando ?

Game 7: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/14/game-20120414-124327-33a3bf91.html

AHoppy 45 - Brando Commando 29

Thanks for the games...

[AHoppy]

I had a good time Brando, I'm sorry that possession made some of the games painful.  I'm still never sure when I should go for possession or when i should build a deck that defends well against it.  We definitely had some interesting interactions in game 2 with possessions and Golems.  I believe that there were two occasions where the Golems hit 2 possessions while the person was being possessed.  And I know there was one instance where I accidentally clicked the throne room with a possession in hand while possessing his hand...  That said, I think that I did get lucky in a couple of the games.  It was great playing with you Brando, and maybe i'll see you around. 

I definitely think that Alchemy cards get a lot more interesting when you have more than one or two of them in a set.  Then you don't feel as bad throwing a potion into your deck to grab an action when there are other things to spend it on too.  After playing these games, I started liking the Alchemy set a lot more, especially when played with other alchemy cards.

[Mergus]

[MAD] Mergus wins against ignorantmen 4 (8 points) - 3 (6 points)

Thank you ignorantmen! We played with 4 Alchemy cards. Here are the logs.
Mergus 48 vs 36 ignorantmen Apprentice works okay against Familiar but Philosopher Stone decides the game.
Mergus 31 vs 40 ignorantmen Apprentice and Hoard are promising. I add Herbalists but they don't show up in my big hand.
Mergus 24 vs 7 ignorantmen Again Apprentice (and Haggler) are able to compensate his Familiar advantage.
Mergus 12 vs 6 ignorantmen I think having two Stewards was the key here.
Mergus 37 vs 44 ignorantmen We're both aiming for Bishops and Scheme. When he gets to Gold earlier than me I try to compensate with a Merchant Ship, which is a bad idea. The simpler way is more effective again.
Mergus 30 vs 42 ignorantmen I forget how strong Vinyards can be with University in long games.
Mergus 46 vs resigned ignorantmen He goes for big Money and Wharves -> Duchy/Duke. I get many Scrying Pools and discard his Wharves continously managing to split the Duchies and he gives up once I picked two Provinces.

Good games, I thought Alchemy would be less fun. The last game was actually really interesting. I didn't think Duchy/Duke would stand a chance, but it was close. I liked that Apprentice was in the games rather than Possession (one irrelevant appearance). None of the games was decided by Familiar luck, which was pleasant.

[Lekkit]

I'm sad that the first game has the wrong log. I would like to see you play Philosopher's Stone, as you might guess.

[ignorentmen]

My quick take:
Thank you ignorantmen! We played with 4 Alchemy cards. Here are the logs.
Mergus 48 vs 36 ignorantmen I didn't anticipate the game going as long as it did so didn't think Pstone would be worth the buy...
Mergus 31 vs 40 ignorantmen Got lucky here I think. Mergus had way more golds than me at the end and drew 4 on his last turn but had no +buy around. My festival +buy payed off turn 16 for buying 2 Duchies rather than get the pentultimate province
Mergus 24 vs 7 ignorantmen This game kind of boggled my head. If anyone wants to tell me how this game got so out of hand please feel free. I felt like I was doing ok and then everything collapsed quick.
Mergus 12 vs 6 ignorantmen I agree the two steward made this game for mergus and I probably should have gone potion into familiar rather than university into witch... But I felt that my witches would be more powerful late game. Mergus agreed as he ended up with way more than me obtaining them even after the curses were gone.
Mergus 37 vs 44 ignorantmen Bishop looked lovely here, especially as a solid counter if for some reason he decided to go Possession. I was thrilled that card didn't come up. It gives me a headache.
Mergus 30 vs 42 ignorantmen University into Vineyards was scary without any plus buys around. University treated me nice though... I ended up with 26 actions cards.
Mergus 46 vs resigned ignorantmen I didn't play well. But this game made me furious. I couldn't believe that I never ever drew my Wharfs! I thought they would work well against Scrying Pool as the turn after effect isn't affected by the attack... But He kept making me discard them. You would think I would have drawn them at least once after turn 7... And I hit $4 way too often. But going this route and ignoring Scrying Pool was a major mistake.

Fun game, but I am glad to get Alchemy out of the way and we can move onto my favorite three sets!

[Mergus]

I'm sad that the first game has the wrong log. I would like to see you play Philosopher's Stone, as you might guess.

I updated the link It's cool that after you play so many games you can still remember some particular games, like the one when you killed me with your Philosopher stones. Since then my consideration for that card has greatly increased.

[Lekkit]

To be honest I remember the game with the Adventurer more. I tend to remember my opponents rather than the games. And you, sir, are one of the nicer people I've played. It could also help that you played luliin in the IsoDom after we played each other.

[rspeer]

^_^_^_^ and I are late getting started in scheduling the round. I know ^_^_^_^ is pretty active on here so it shouldn't be long before I hear back from him, but we may end up playing our round a day or so late.

[rspeer]

On the other hand, from the missing matches thread, it looks like ^_^_^_^ is actually MIA for a couple of weeks now.

What happens when an opponent disappears anyway? I know the optimal outcome is to find two players with missing opponents and match them up, but I'm unclear on what happens otherwise. Nobody gets the points? Their opponent gets 7 points? Both of those are pretty extreme in their effect on the scores.

[blueblimp]

I'd imagine the least unfair option is just to eliminate all that player's games. That's bad for people who already got points from those games, but I can't imagine anything else making sense.

[yuma]

On the other hand, from the missing matches thread, it looks like ^_^_^_^ is actually MIA for a couple of weeks now.

I think the last time ^_^_^_^ disappeared he said it was because his computer broke... I wonder if he is having the same problems again... Or it could have been the fact that he got beat 6-1 in the first round...

[Kirian]

I believe the intent was that someone missing would simply be wiped completely, like blueblimo suggests, as that simply decreases the number of matches everyone in that group plays.

This is a bit more of a problem, though, when the three most-missing people are all in the same group.  I'm not sure it's any less unfair, though.

RisingJaguar, greatexpectations, have you guys been able to contact Nicki and Mustard respectively?

[greatexpectations]

I believe the intent was that someone missing would simply be wiped completely, like blueblimp suggests, as that simply decreases the number of matches everyone in that group plays.

This is a bit more of a problem, though, when the three most-missing people are all in the same group.  I'm not sure it's any less unfair, though.

RisingJaguar, greatexpectations, have you guys been able to contact Nicki and Mustard respectively?

i was just going to post a similar comment.  i have tried contacting MMM but haven't gotten a response.  i do have next week's matchup with Brando Commando setup already though.

should we begin looking for replacements for MMM and ^_^_^_^? if your bracket is current than it seems like no one in our group will have to replay any games as they conveniently have only played each other.

[Kirian]

I believe the intent was that someone missing would simply be wiped completely, like blueblimp suggests, as that simply decreases the number of matches everyone in that group plays.

This is a bit more of a problem, though, when the three most-missing people are all in the same group.  I'm not sure it's any less unfair, though.

RisingJaguar, greatexpectations, have you guys been able to contact Nicki and Mustard respectively?

i was just going to post a similar comment.  i have tried contacting MMM but haven't gotten a response.  i do have next week's matchup with Brando Commando setup already though.

should we begin looking for replacements for MMM and ^_^_^_^? if your bracket is current than it seems like no one in our group will have to replay any games as they conveniently have only played each other.

I'd really like to give the guy theoretically running the tournament, at the least, the greatest possible benefit of the doubt.  I mean, at the very least MMM was here to set up his bracket Thursday before last.  Also, Brando would be an exception, he played Nicki in Week 1.

If we hear nothing from any of them by Friday, I'll look into replacing them, though I may advertise for potential alternates before that.

[dghunter79]

dghunter wins 5 games, antony wins 2 games

dghunter79, 49; antony, 38
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120416-203810-063847c6.html

I liked the idea of myself not buying a potion in the first Alchemy game, so I opened Fool's Gold/Workshop.  Antony opened Fool's Gold/Potion.  I won Fool's Gold, 6-4, and though his Universities gained him a lot of Stableses, it wasn't enough to overcome his economic disadvantage.

antony, 12; dghunter79, 33
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120416-204559-1ef1f963.html

Antony got the short end of the stick with 5/2 on a Familiar board with no 2s.  He bought Minion, and then kept buying Minion on 5, ignoring Curses.  He got out to an early lead, but the Familiars caught up to him.


antony, 36; dghunter79, 38
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120416-205413-29db33f5.html

Again, Antony is stuck with 5/2 on a board you don't want it.  This time, Golems, Markets, and Bridges are hot, and we both play for big turns.  It goes back and forth for a while, until I find myself with the perfect number of buys and coin to grab the last Duchy, the last two Bridges, and the last two Estates and win by two points.  Antony starts and finishes with bad luck.

antony, 15; dghunter79, 41
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120416-210830-46c68a94.html

This time, it is my turn to start with 5/2.  Except this time, it is great.  With 'Aggler/Herbalist, Quarry and Potion, I'm able to quickly build a large, violent engine.

antony, 51; dghunter79, 50
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120416-212756-11e3adaf.html

Universities, Golems, Ghost Ships, and Monuments.  I miss a chance to three-pile and win, as Antony pointed out after it was too late to help me.

dghunter79, 38; antony, 25
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120416-213308-0ff9bb48.html

Jack of All Trades; everything else gets ignored.  He keeps getting stuck on 5 and buying silver, and I get three Golds before he gets one.

antony, 18; dghunter79, 17
http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120416-214959-e7cd73b2.html

We both played Familiar until the Curses ran out.  Then he played Apprentices to clean his deck out, trashing Familiars for 5 cards.  I played for a Vineyards rush and got Ironworks, plus extra Potions and Herbalists, but never drew those two together.  Meanwhile, he trashed all his Curses and had a much stronger deck, and killed me with it.


Antony's on top of the scoreboard, so I was glad to take the series.  He's a top-notch opponent who got unlucky a lot.  Hooray!

[RisingJaguar]

I believe the intent was that someone missing would simply be wiped completely, like blueblimo suggests, as that simply decreases the number of matches everyone in that group plays.

This is a bit more of a problem, though, when the three most-missing people are all in the same group.  I'm not sure it's any less unfair, though.

RisingJaguar, greatexpectations, have you guys been able to contact Nicki and Mustard respectively?

Nicki is alive and well (aka Duck Sauce on the boards).  We talked a couple days ago but we are lagging because of my busy schedule. 

[ednever]

Titandrake wins 4 games (8 points), ednever wins 3 games (6 points)

Titandrake, 35; ednever, 29
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/17/game-20120417-182006-2238a1ff.html

I tried an apothecary deck (with Coppersmith and Warehouse) that started strong but ended weak. Purchased Border Villages which was a mistake (should have just got Duchies - the BV stopped my ap. from working as effectively as they could). Three Golds for Titandrake has him breaking PPR and then flying past for the win.


ednever, 33; Titandrake, 18
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/17/game-20120417-183601-df9088b4.html

I opened 5/2 with Familiar and then didn't draw my Potion until turn 5. Still managed to keep curses to a 6/4 split. Then my Herbalist opening + Philosopher's Stone (my first purchase ever) gives me three turns with a +5 Stone to end the game with a win. Don't know where that came from.


Titandrake, 58; ednever, 46
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/17/game-20120417-185530-d4c2ee73.html

I tried something a little crazy here. It almost worked. Tried a Gardens/Develop/University deck. I got ahead and it was looking good, but Titandrake did not contest and played hard BM (8 Silvers, 5 Golds) to pick up all the Provinces in 25 turns. I should have waited to start picking up Gardens so I could have used my Develops on my $4 purchases. Instead I killed my Potion after only one University. I would love to find a way to make this combo work someday... But not today...


ednever, 34; Titandrake, 42
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/17/game-20120417-193442-6fa84fa3.html
Alchemists/Peddlers/Possessions. I got ahead on the Peddlers. Titandrake got ahead on the Possessions. He picked up a Remodel to turn those Peddlers into Provinces and I followed - which was my undoing. He Possessed me and Remodeled cards into three Provinces. Which is 3 more than I managed to use my own Remodel...


ednever, 23; Titandrake, 20
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/17/game-20120417-194605-68035578.html
Familiar board again, but the Lighthouse keeps her at bay. Instead the game is decided by Fishing Village+Rabble, with a couple of Apprentices to kill and replace Provinces to end the game before Titandrake can get his engine going. I think TD over-invested in Lighthouses (so much that I Apprenticed my Familiar) and would have been better served with Fishing Villages which made my Rabble chains draw my entire deck more than once.


Titandrake, 49; ednever, 31
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/17/game-20120417-200045-9c131e09.html
Hoard+Apprentice. Only the key buy turns out to be Herbalist who's +1 buy lets TD pick up huge Golds for her Apprentice. I should have seen that coming, but by the time I did I was drawing $13 and picking up Estates and Potions (for Vineyards) in a lame attempt to catch up.


ednever, 45; Titandrake, 18
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201204/17/game-20120417-201525-412bd6d2.html
Crazy board to look at, but the strategy ended up being simple. Ambassador away coppers and use Alchemists to draw the rest of the deck (with a Golem or two thrown in). Use three silvers to pick up a Grand Market, then proceed to buy more and more of them and play them all every turn. Then explode. I think TD was trying something with Forge, but it never got off the ground.


A really fun set of games. First Player won all the games except TD's Possession/Remodel masterpiece.

It definitely felt like Alchemy. Different cards were important in each game, but there was always an alchemy card that was very important to the outcome. My only disappointment was that Vineyards only came up once - and it was on a board where it would never work.

Looking forward to the next round!

Ed

[Titandrake]

My thoughts:

Game 1: My plan was to play Oracle-BM. The problem was that I came up with that plan partway through the game. Warehouse opening was to hedge bets, in case ednever opened YW - Warehouse isn't a terrible opening card anyways. Then I was a bit too worried about collisions so I held off Oracle, probably too long. But in the end, it didn't matter. Apothecary engine just didn't quite work out against the safer BM strategy.

Game 2: The random NV I pick up in attempts to pseudo-trash kinda help, but don't really do much. Herbalist returning Philosopher's Stone is pretty good when you know Stones are going to be worth it. Gives you more $ output.

Game 3: Not really anything to say. I was planning on straight up Courtyard-BM, but picked up a Potion along the way. Possession gets better the more times you play it, and in an 8 Province game...Got some nice luck with decent Possessed turns against a clogged deck by using University.

Game 4: Going into it I wanted to do some weird Embargo-important cards with Remodel to get around it. Don't pick up Remodel until the Peddlers are emptied (which I totally missed was possible this game). This game is why I don't like Possession; incentivizes slowing down deck improvement.

Game 5: I had 5 Apprentices at the end? I really don't remember buying that many. Anyway, trashing Golds and Duchies knowing that you'll get more Golds and Duchies thanks to +Buy is nice.

Game 6: I don't pick up FV and trash the only Rabble I bought to Apprentice. Then I lose to Rabble chains. Essentially I was in a bind all game: I need Lighthouse to block Familiar, then later I needed it to block Rabble ruining my next hands. Probably could have switched to Silver/FV at some point, but once the engine got going it was done.

Game 7: I delay potion buying. I'm not sure if this is the right call with $3P as the lowest potion cost. Doesn't work. I was thinking I could get some Forged-GM with big Alchemist hands. Uh...yeah that was way too slow to work.

I think it's interesting how much divergent strategy we had. It made the whole series pretty interesting. And I also didn't feel any unfair luck regarding Possession/Familiar (although me getting T5 potion is better with lighthouse out), which was surprising to me.

Nice playing with you