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Author Topic: Allies is online  (Read 9353 times)

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AJD

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #25 on: March 09, 2022, 12:15:15 pm »
+1

Capital City has a Mill option, a Storyteller option, or—sneakily—a Cellar option.
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Violet CLM

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #26 on: March 09, 2022, 01:08:02 pm »
+1

Carpenter sounds really nice. Using an empty supply pile as a proxy test for how far along the game is and whether your needs from an action card have changed.
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mxdata

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #27 on: March 09, 2022, 02:17:11 pm »
0

Sycophant seems like in most kingdoms it would mostly be useful for the on-gain and on-trash effects. Having to discard 3 cards, without even any draw, seems a steep price for +$3
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Jeebus

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #28 on: March 09, 2022, 02:46:02 pm »
0

The rotating split piles online (and I assume, in the rules) let you see exactly how many of each card there is in the pile. Now, that has never been the case (by design!) with something like Ruins. But now you can rotate ruins? Someone make this make sense.

For Ruins, you take the top card, and reveal the one below. If it's a different card, that means you put just the top card at the bottom, end of rotating. If it is the same card, you put it to the top card, and reveal the one below. If that is a different card, you put the 2 top cards at the bottom, end of rotating. This goes on for as long as the "just uncovered top card" is the same as the previously uncovered cards, until you finally hit a different one, or find that all of your Ruins pile was just one card.

Are you offering a theory, basing it on the rulebook, or something else?

Jeebus

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #29 on: March 09, 2022, 02:47:43 pm »
+4

pretty sure i can guess the answer to this, but the Pay keyword on Capital City: You have to have the coin to use it? It's not like the '–$1 for each treasure card revealed' on Poor House, where you can really embrace that $0 floor, get stuff for free?

I think the only other instance of Pay is on Storyteller, which just spends all your money regardless.

Also Pageant. It means what it says, you pay.

Commodore Chuckles

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #30 on: March 09, 2022, 05:01:35 pm »
+1

Specialist looks very good. I like how it avoids the Way of the Rat problem of having to decide whether to get the card's benefit or gain a copy of it.
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michaeljb

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #31 on: March 09, 2022, 05:08:23 pm »
+3

Barbarian
$5; Action-Attack
+$2
Each other player trashes the top card of their deck. If it costs $3 or more they gain a cheaper card sharing a type with it; otherwise they gain a Curse.

This sounded familiar, had to track down the outtakes page--not too far from its early form! https://dominionstrategy.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/small-dark-ages-1.png (second row from the bottom, third column from the left)
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grrgrrgrr

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #32 on: March 09, 2022, 05:09:12 pm »
+1

Specialist looks very good. I like how it avoids the Way of the Rat problem of having to decide whether to get the card's benefit or gain a copy of it.

Specialist is also going to be one of the few cards that really synergies with Elder.
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vidicate

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #33 on: March 09, 2022, 05:34:18 pm »
+2

Sycophant seems like in most kingdoms it would mostly be useful for the on-gain and on-trash effects. Having to discard 3 cards, without even any draw, seems a steep price for +$3

Indeed. Priced cheap to compensate. Nice synergy with discard strats and/or draw-to-X.
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AJD

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #34 on: March 09, 2022, 05:59:43 pm »
+3

Specialist looks very good. I like how it avoids the Way of the Rat problem of having to decide whether to get the card's benefit or gain a copy of it.

Specialist is also going to be one of the few cards that really synergies with Elder.

It takes an Elder to turn a Specialist into a Disciple? Thematically it seems like that should work the other way around, oh well.
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vidicate

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #35 on: March 09, 2022, 06:03:49 pm »
+1

The rotating split piles online (and I assume, in the rules) let you see exactly how many of each card there is in the pile. Now, that has never been the case (by design!) with something like Ruins. But now you can rotate ruins? Someone make this make sense.

For Ruins, you take the top card, and reveal the one below. If it's a different card, that means you put just the top card at the bottom, end of rotating. If it is the same card, you put it to the top card, and reveal the one below. If that is a different card, you put the 2 top cards at the bottom, end of rotating. This goes on for as long as the "just uncovered top card" is the same as the previously uncovered cards, until you finally hit a different one, or find that all of your Ruins pile was just one card.

Are you offering a theory, basing it on the rulebook, or something else?

It seems clear from DXV’s explanation of Rotate from Preview #2.
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WHERE ARE THE TURTLES?!!! …WHERE ARE THEY?!
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allanfieldhouse

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #36 on: March 09, 2022, 06:16:24 pm »
+2

Sycophant seems like in most kingdoms it would mostly be useful for the on-gain and on-trash effects. Having to discard 3 cards, without even any draw, seems a steep price for +$3

Indeed. Priced cheap to compensate. Nice synergy with discard strats and/or draw-to-X.
Sycophant + Plateau Shepards is crazy. They're just instantly worth 2 points, and your Estates are worth 3.

If the other person does something normal like buy Witches and curse you, you just win with those two piles.
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Jeebus

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #37 on: March 10, 2022, 03:34:52 am »
+1

The rotating split piles online (and I assume, in the rules) let you see exactly how many of each card there is in the pile. Now, that has never been the case (by design!) with something like Ruins. But now you can rotate ruins? Someone make this make sense.

For Ruins, you take the top card, and reveal the one below. If it's a different card, that means you put just the top card at the bottom, end of rotating. If it is the same card, you put it to the top card, and reveal the one below. If that is a different card, you put the 2 top cards at the bottom, end of rotating. This goes on for as long as the "just uncovered top card" is the same as the previously uncovered cards, until you finally hit a different one, or find that all of your Ruins pile was just one card.

Are you offering a theory, basing it on the rulebook, or something else?

It seems clear from DXV’s explanation of Rotate from Preview #2.

DXV wrote: "This puts all copies of whatever's on top onto the bottom."

I don't see it. From that explanation it could just as well be how I described it, or that you grab them all at once and therefore you can't rotate Ruins (you can rotate split piles because the cards there are open information).
« Last Edit: March 10, 2022, 03:36:19 am by Jeebus »
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vidicate

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #38 on: March 10, 2022, 04:50:00 am »
0

I love you, Jeebus/PunchBall; you’re an over-thinker. Perfect for maintaining the FAQs and stuff like you do. But then sometimes caught in the trees, and not quite seeing the forest, am I right?
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WHERE ARE THE TURTLES?!!! …WHERE ARE THEY?!
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Grif: Prepare to be sorely disappointed.
-----
Who da man? I da man. I always suspected. -Dr. House

Jeebus

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #39 on: March 10, 2022, 04:56:50 am »
+6

I love you, Jeebus/PunchBall; you’re an over-thinker. Perfect for maintaining the FAQs and stuff like you do. But then sometimes caught in the trees, and not quite seeing the forest, am I right?

Actually, when I'm wrong (which is quite often) it's mostly because I didn't think it through. But this is a peculiarity of Dominion. Go back to the Throne Room + Mining Village thread on BGG where Donald introduced "lose track", and the Ironworks + Trader thread where the question was what "it" means. I am what Donald has wrought!

vidicate

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #40 on: March 10, 2022, 05:05:07 am »
+2

I love you, Jeebus/PunchBall; you’re an over-thinker. Perfect for maintaining the FAQs and stuff like you do. But then sometimes caught in the trees, and not quite seeing the forest, am I right?

Actually, when I'm wrong (which is quite often) it's mostly because I didn't think it through. But this is a peculiarity of Dominion. Go back to the Throne Room + Mining Village thread on BGG where Donald introduced "lose track", and the Ironworks + Trader thread where the question was what "it" means. I am what Donald has wrought!

Hahaha! I relish every word of this reply. Please don’t ask me to go down those rabbit holes again lmao! The “blueness” of the dog you walked ;D
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WHERE ARE THE TURTLES?!!! …WHERE ARE THEY?!
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Jeebus

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #41 on: March 10, 2022, 07:51:00 am »
+1

So... Counterfeit + Contract, the Contract will disappear, but you will set aside two cards, so I guess that solves the tracking problem mentioned in the secret histories:
Quote
I tried a Treasure - Duration. To not be wonky with cards like Counterfeit, it had to have an "if this is in play" clause on the next turn's +$2. That looks weird though. So then it had the penalty of leaving play if someone bought a Province, which gave the "if this is in play" part meaning. Then it got a bonus instead, you could discard it from play to Moat one Attack. And well. It was a dud, it showed up at the bottom of people's lists of cards sorted by how much they liked them. I did better Treasures.

GendoIkari

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #42 on: March 10, 2022, 10:22:52 am »
0

The rotating split piles online (and I assume, in the rules) let you see exactly how many of each card there is in the pile. Now, that has never been the case (by design!) with something like Ruins. But now you can rotate ruins? Someone make this make sense.

For Ruins, you take the top card, and reveal the one below. If it's a different card, that means you put just the top card at the bottom, end of rotating. If it is the same card, you put it to the top card, and reveal the one below. If that is a different card, you put the 2 top cards at the bottom, end of rotating. This goes on for as long as the "just uncovered top card" is the same as the previously uncovered cards, until you finally hit a different one, or find that all of your Ruins pile was just one card.

Are you offering a theory, basing it on the rulebook, or something else?

It seems clear from DXV’s explanation of Rotate from Preview #2.

DXV wrote: "This puts all copies of whatever's on top onto the bottom."

I don't see it. From that explanation it could just as well be how I described it, or that you grab them all at once and therefore you can't rotate Ruins (you can rotate split piles because the cards there are open information).

I agree with this, especially since cards that allow you to trash or play a card from your discard pile have to also give you specific permission to look through your discard pile first. You normally can't look through your discard pile, so a simple "play a card from your discard pile" instruction wouldn't work. In the same way, a simple "rotate a supply pile" wouldn't necessarily work to allow you to see more than just the top Ruins card. It certainly could work that way, but it's not obvious just from the definition of rotate given in the original preview.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #43 on: March 10, 2022, 10:24:44 am »
+3

Have people talked yet about how Battle Plan combos with things like Fortune?
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AJD

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #44 on: March 10, 2022, 10:53:49 am »
+3

Fortunately the Allies rule book is out now, and the Battle Plan FAQ explicitly says it works on Ruins. (And "rotate" is defined as "taking the top card, and all copies of it directly under it, and putting them on the bottom.")
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Ingix

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #45 on: March 10, 2022, 12:09:01 pm »
0

The rotating split piles online (and I assume, in the rules) let you see exactly how many of each card there is in the pile. Now, that has never been the case (by design!) with something like Ruins. But now you can rotate ruins? Someone make this make sense.

For Ruins, you take the top card, and reveal the one below. If it's a different card, that means you put just the top card at the bottom, end of rotating. If it is the same card, you put it to the top card, and reveal the one below. If that is a different card, you put the 2 top cards at the bottom, end of rotating. This goes on for as long as the "just uncovered top card" is the same as the previously uncovered cards, until you finally hit a different one, or find that all of your Ruins pile was just one card.

Are you offering a theory, basing it on the rulebook, or something else?

As usual, my understanding of how something works.
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Timinou

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #46 on: March 10, 2022, 12:17:38 pm »
+1

I’m foreseeing a lot of rage quits with Barbarian; it could be quite brutal with Rabble.
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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #47 on: March 10, 2022, 12:30:44 pm »
+2

I’m foreseeing a lot of rage quits with Barbarian; it could be quite brutal with Rabble.

had a barbarian/hunter/KC game and hit $7 + a lucky draw first. game ended with something like 60 cards in the trash. frankly we need larger banlists, and maybe combinatoric banlists on shuffleit.
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Timinou

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #48 on: March 10, 2022, 12:34:43 pm »
0

I’m foreseeing a lot of rage quits with Barbarian; it could be quite brutal with Rabble.

had a barbarian/hunter/KC game and hit $7 + a lucky draw first. game ended with something like 60 cards in the trash. frankly we need larger banlists, and maybe combinatoric banlists on shuffleit.

Yeah, I think banlists for specific combinations would be a good idea.
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Freddy10

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Re: Allies is online
« Reply #49 on: March 10, 2022, 08:28:18 pm »
+2

Rotating the Castles sounds like fun. And I can imagine someone rotating the Ruins, searching desperately for a +Buy.

Is Clash now the first card type that nothing actually refers to or depends on?

Gathering? Reaction?
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