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[WestCoastDidds]

No reaction. I don’t remember it.

[Swowl]

Hi all.

I again apologize for my lack of posting for much of D1. Early on it was more than I didn't have anything compelling to add and then later got very busy and have been on vacation week (nothing exotic, but some visiting with friends). I did get flustered by being called "extremely rude" without being left any space for legit reasons, especially in light if the fact that I feel like I usually do an ok job of posting regularly. But whatever, faust is gone now anyway, so no sense in debating hat now.

If WCD wasn't already on X-2, I'd be willing to vote for her based on today's posts. I do need to find time to catch up on D1 some.

My guess is I won't be able to post too much tomorrow and this weekend, but I'll be back at work next week, and this is always a good 5 minute break here and there during the day. So do expect to see more of me then.

I think you should probably just vote for her, if you say you are willing to. I don't know why people are so worried about putting people on X-1 early in the day, especially if it is basically your only read.

Because Swowl will come in and hammer without thinking.

Don't tell me that's not a real possibility now.

I have literally never accidently hammered in my life.
I forgot this started today.  Out and about this evening but I will get to it tomorrow.

[2.71828.....]

OTOH, I'm a bit mad. Maybe a bit more diplomacy would've flipped e instead of Dylan.

We should have flipped math over Dylan is my thought.

To be honest, I could see all three D1 wagons being on town. We know Dylan is town. I know I am town. Math I am not sure about.

But there were just no other real wagons. Didds was voted for with no traction. Gkrieg was voted for with no traction. This is one reason I mentioned all the stagnate D1 votes. I also like Didds' responses here, so let's go to

Vote: swowl

[mathdude]

(snip)

(snip)
But my issue is not with you, it is with the piling on with no reasonable explanation. So, f that. I am done with responding to them. Mathdude still hasn't answered EFHW's question about what exactly I did to create a "deeper hole". If there is woe is me, it is frustration but in all reality, it really is cool with me if I go. I'm not trying to take my ball and go home, just saying that since I am not hatched, I am no loss. Town will learn more form a hammered exile than a plurality exile and there is pretty much no way that it will happen unless scum is voting for me. So LFG.
(more snip)

You're right, I hadn't clarified my comment about digging a deeper hole yet... a couple hours later.  Finally getting to it, and I might as well make it a good one.  I went back and read all your D2 posts, and I think almost every one of them did not sit right with me.  Yes, we have different play styles, but they just seem "not you".  So get comfy... here's a long-ish read.

I could see a Didds/MiX/X team

you doing the good drugs? that makes no sense to me at all.

I get the casual, friendly banter that you do.  But this was MiX-ian style "you're dead wrong" that I don't expect from you.  2.71 wasn't the first to pair the 2 of you... I mentioned it yesterday as well.  So unless he's sheeping my read there, which I doubt it, then there's something to it even if you don't see it.

(snip)
The reason I said it didn’t make a difference when I moved back to Dylan was because he was already going to be the exile. So, it didn’t make a difference. Obviously I could have voted for e and it would have made a difference, but I didn’t think he had done anything scummy, I don’t like his wagon, and I most trusted faust.

I said that I found Dylan’s most recent posts towny just before I moved off of him, and that was and is true. But I thought e was townier than Dylan was, so among those two, a better guess. I’m not surprised he’s town.

With the plurality exile, VCA isn’t as powerful. Scum wouldn’t even need to join one of the leading wagons unless it was to prevent one of their own. So, you think e is my partner? That was the only person I protected by voting how/when I did. And e running up a wagon on me now, right out of the gate, is smart partner play?

Just because Dylan was "already going to be the exile" doesn't mean it didn't make a difference.  Where your vote sits at any point always makes a difference of how we read you.  But also, at the time you voted, the votes weren't final, so it still could have made a difference.  Trying to shrug that off?

I disagree about plurality VCA not being powerful.  With the way it's setup here, some weird shenanigans can happen with vote changes near the end.  It's very possible that people (scum or not) can mess around with things.  So I think every single vote change, especially in the last few hours, will be very useful to look at.

I could see a Didds/MiX/X team

This is a good team call, since I feel like defending Didds now.

Does anyone think both e and Didds can be town?

For Galz to be right, I’d have to have voted to protect e. So, the better question is are both e and I scum together?

Again, this response - not something I expect out of you.  You are questioning whether you and 2.71 could be scum together, when joth just pointed out that it could be possible.  Also, I think the question that you're asking is more likely to come from scum than from town.

I could see a Didds/MiX/X team

This is a good team call, since I feel like defending Didds now.

Does anyone think both e and Didds can be town?

I could definitely see them both being scum.

Cool, then vote for e.

so then you notice joth's comment, and tell him to vote for 2.71.  I get that you're frustrated with all the votes on your at this point, but this doesn't look like a great defense.  Others have commented on this response already though, so I won't add any more.

MiX, how many missexile do we get before we’re in trouble?

Again, another question I think is more likely to come from scum than town.

MiX, how many missexile do we get before we’re in trouble?

Scum has to do 3 more misexiles to win.

Cool. No danger then.

I’m going to quit fighting with y’all about my D1. There is zero that I can do to prove that I’m not scum beyond flipping. I’m unhatched so it’s no big loss.  Besides, Galz isn’t ever going to be convinced. He’s wrong, but he is stubborn in his wrongness. The piling on is probably telling, but that’s not for me to decide. It’s too frustrating to keep answering questions and be told I’m just digging deeper. I don’t even know what that means in this context.

I'm not talking about your D1... maybe others are, but it's your D2 that's big for me.  But being unhatched is definitely not "no big loss" if you are town.  As far as anyone knew, faust hadn't hatched.  Scum got lucky, and not only picked off a town that hatched, but they also eliminated a good power role.  You may have another good role, and if so, losing you would be a big loss, hatched or not (since you can only hatch and become useful if you're still alive).

Scola is my best guess for scum. From the Dylan wagon, mathdude > gkrieg. But there didn’t have to be any scum on it. Mathdude went up on my list when he voted for me with the digging deeper bit. It’s following the pack without actually making any argument at all so no skin in the game.

Enough skin in the game for you?  Basically nothing you've said D2 has felt like typical Didds that I'm used to seeing.  I guess I haven't seen you under pressure much, but you just seem off in all these quoted posts.

[mathdude]

My guess is I won't be able to post too much tomorrow and this weekend, but I'll be back at work next week, and this is always a good 5 minute break here and there during the day. So do expect to see more of me then.

Conveniently be away long enough for us to get stuck on other(s) for D2, and slide by another day?  I get that exiling inactives gives less VCA and less chance to catch scum, but I still don't know why we didn't switch to voting you yesterday.  You were actively being inactive.  And now it's happening again.

[mathdude]

OTOH, I'm a bit mad. Maybe a bit more diplomacy would've flipped e instead of Dylan.

We should have flipped math over Dylan is my thought.

To be honest, I could see all three D1 wagons being on town. We know Dylan is town. I know I am town. Math I am not sure about.

But there were just no other real wagons. Didds was voted for with no traction. Gkrieg was voted for with no traction. This is one reason I mentioned all the stagnate D1 votes. I also like Didds' responses here, so let's go to

Vote: swowl

We should have flipped 2.71 over Dylan.  Or MiX.  Or Didds.  Or pasta.  Hindsight is great to say we shouldn't have flipped Dylan.

But now if you're comparing me, you, and Dylan... I'm sure that me and Dylan are town, but I'm not sure about you.

[2.71828.....]

OTOH, I'm a bit mad. Maybe a bit more diplomacy would've flipped e instead of Dylan.

We should have flipped math over Dylan is my thought.

To be honest, I could see all three D1 wagons being on town. We know Dylan is town. I know I am town. Math I am not sure about.

But there were just no other real wagons. Didds was voted for with no traction. Gkrieg was voted for with no traction. This is one reason I mentioned all the stagnate D1 votes. I also like Didds' responses here, so let's go to

Vote: swowl

We should have flipped 2.71 over Dylan.  Or MiX.  Or Didds.  Or pasta.  Hindsight is great to say we shouldn't have flipped Dylan.

But now if you're comparing me, you, and Dylan... I'm sure that me and Dylan are town, but I'm not sure about you.

I don't feel like I am necessarily comparing as I am taking the position it is quite possible all three main wagons at EoD1 were on town.

What do you think of that possibility?

[mathdude]

I don't feel like I am necessarily comparing as I am taking the position it is quite possible all three main wagons at EoD1 were on town.

What do you think of that possibility?

Asking you or me that question is just a convoluted way of asking "do you think ther other is town or scum?" At this point, I'm unsure about you... could go either way.

[infangthief]

I'm out for most of today/tomorrow - looks like there's good stuff going on for me to catch up on when I get back.

[jotheonah]

OTOH, I'm a bit mad. Maybe a bit more diplomacy would've flipped e instead of Dylan.

We should have flipped math over Dylan is my thought.

To be honest, I could see all three D1 wagons being on town. We know Dylan is town. I know I am town. Math I am not sure about.

But there were just no other real wagons. Didds was voted for with no traction. Gkrieg was voted for with no traction. This is one reason I mentioned all the stagnate D1 votes. I also like Didds' responses here, so let's go to

Vote: swowl

I know that some element of this is confirmation bias, but e moving off Didds here really makes me sure they're partners.

[WestCoastDidds]

Enough skin in the game for you?  Basically nothing you've said D2 has felt like typical Didds that I'm used to seeing.  I guess I haven't seen you under pressure much, but you just seem off in all these quoted posts.

That is a super long message that comes down to seems and feels. Here's the thing...I have been scum 4 out of the last 5 games we have played. And in the town game I was a mason with MiX, so there was zero doubt about my alignment from anyone. And in that game YOU were scum so I don't imagine you were developing a nuanced sense of my town game since you wouldn't have cared.  So, it has been since Mid-2020 when we played Memento that I have been for reals town. I think that since most of your play with us has been in recent years, and during the vast majority of that time I have been scum, that you may want to reassess your feels and seems. For me to be off, you have to know what on really looks like.

[WestCoastDidds]

I know that some element of this is confirmation bias, but e moving off Didds here really makes me sure they're partners.

Joth! Shhhhhh!

[WestCoastDidds]

Enough skin in the game for you?  Basically nothing you've said D2 has felt like typical Didds that I'm used to seeing.  I guess I haven't seen you under pressure much, but you just seem off in all these quoted posts.

That is a super long message that comes down to seems and feels. Here's the thing...I have been scum 4 out of the last 5 games we have played. And in the town game I was a mason with MiX, so there was zero doubt about my alignment from anyone. And in that game YOU were scum so I don't imagine you were developing a nuanced sense of my town game since you wouldn't have cared.  So, it has been since Mid-2020 when we played Memento that I have been for reals town. I think that since most of your play with us has been in recent years, and during the vast majority of that time I have been scum, that you may want to reassess your feels and seems. For me to be off, you have to know what on really looks like.

I forgot about the Wizard of Oz. I was town then.
So, town in Among us and Wizard of Oz. Scum in Groundhog Day, Mouse Mafia, BSG2, and Dwarf

[EFHW]

Vote: e

vote: mathdude

Joth, please explain why you broke the mathdude wagon a couple of hours before deadline.

Looking at the wagon analysis, this also stood out to me as a turning point. Joth answered:

{snip} But I didn't (and don't) particularly think mathdude is scum. So I don't really feel bad about it either way.

So I'm wondering why he was on the math wagon at all.

[jotheonah]

I think I did answer that.

If I had fully grokked at the time how the plurality exile worked and how ties were resolved I probably would not have moved.

But since I didn't, I wanted to move to mathdude, who I thought was more likely to be scum than Dylan, rather than stay on e and let Dylan be the exile. The e wagon did not seem to be going anywhere and Dylan was gaining traction despite, in my eyes, being a nothing wagon. The mathdude wagon wasn't much better, but people at least had reasons that made sense.

There was also a particular mathdude vote, shortly before I voted for him, that pinged me for some reason. Possibly for convoluted partnery reasons. But it made me want to pressure vote him a bit.

[EFHW]

But I'm really confused about why fang left the math wagon for e. He'd been pushing a math exile all day and when Galzria joined, it made the numbers math (5), Dylan (4), e (1), Didds (1) and scola (1).

joth leaving and MiX moving his vote yielded math (4), Dylan (4), e (2), and scola (1). There were still 4 people who could vote math, even if no one on the Dylan wagon wanted to switch. Why give up so quickly? And would math lose that tie?

This is our discussion about it:

vote: e
Mostly just to take out the "blame-free" self-preservation option for Dylan.
(Which is the reason e and mathdude joined the Dylan wagon yesterday, I assume.)

Why not just vote Dylan?

I'm not following your reasoning here.

If any of these three wagons (Dylan, e or mathdude, or any other wagon that materialises) is on scum, then we're getting good info here from people's reactions as we approach deadline.

When I turned up an hour ago (escaped from my parallel universe), no-one had said anything in like half an hour, so it seemed like things would just stay as they were, and Dylan would show up, vote mathdude, no responsibility attached because it would have been self preservation.

So it was in that context.
Since then everything has kicked off, which is probably good.

But fang seemed like he really wanted to exile math. Even if Dylan's vote was self-preservation, fang should expect that we would catch scum. Totally worth it. And if he thought Dylan was scum, too, or also likely, why vote e? I'm missing something here.

[EFHW]

I think I did answer that.

If I had fully grokked at the time how the plurality exile worked and how ties were resolved I probably would not have moved.

But since I didn't, I wanted to move to mathdude, who I thought was more likely to be scum than Dylan, rather than stay on e and let Dylan be the exile. The e wagon did not seem to be going anywhere and Dylan was gaining traction despite, in my eyes, being a nothing wagon. The mathdude wagon wasn't much better, but people at least had reasons that made sense.

There was also a particular mathdude vote, shortly before I voted for him, that pinged me for some reason. Possibly for convoluted partnery reasons. But it made me want to pressure vote him a bit.

thanks

[Galzria]

But I'm really confused about why fang left the math wagon for e. He'd been pushing a math exile all day and when Galzria joined, it made the numbers math (5), Dylan (4), e (1), Didds (1) and scola (1).

joth leaving and MiX moving his vote yielded math (4), Dylan (4), e (2), and scola (1). There were still 4 people who could vote math, even if no one on the Dylan wagon wanted to switch. Why give up so quickly? And would math lose that tie?

This is our discussion about it:

vote: e
Mostly just to take out the "blame-free" self-preservation option for Dylan.
(Which is the reason e and mathdude joined the Dylan wagon yesterday, I assume.)

Why not just vote Dylan?

I'm not following your reasoning here.

If any of these three wagons (Dylan, e or mathdude, or any other wagon that materialises) is on scum, then we're getting good info here from people's reactions as we approach deadline.

When I turned up an hour ago (escaped from my parallel universe), no-one had said anything in like half an hour, so it seemed like things would just stay as they were, and Dylan would show up, vote mathdude, no responsibility attached because it would have been self preservation.

So it was in that context.
Since then everything has kicked off, which is probably good.

But fang seemed like he really wanted to exile math. Even if Dylan's vote was self-preservation, fang should expect that we would catch scum. Totally worth it. And if he thought Dylan was scum, too, or also likely, why vote e? I'm missing something here.

Interesting food for thought.

[scolapasta]

yeah, gkrieg's suggestion I vote WCD already to X-1 seems sketch.

WCD, what's your reasoning for thinking I'm scum? Is it just my lack of posting D1?

[WestCoastDidds]

yeah, gkrieg's suggestion I vote WCD already to X-1 seems sketch.

WCD, what's your reasoning for thinking I'm scum? Is it just my lack of posting D1?

Agree

Mostly yes, and the tentativeness of the content when you did post.

[Galzria]

yeah, gkrieg's suggestion I vote WCD already to X-1 seems sketch.

WCD, what's your reasoning for thinking I'm scum? Is it just my lack of posting D1?

Is it sketch if WCD is scum? Or only if she's town?

[Swowl]

I can think of a reason faust might have died, but not one I'd be so certain of as MiX is. Scum might have had a reason to want to nk  on wagon, like they could have all been off wagon and didn't want to narrow down that field. Or they want to make it look like they were all off wagon. That seems less likely to me.

Faust seems like a good choice regardless. Your reasoning makes sense, but like... did you think faust was skummy?
I certainly did not think so reading back at night.

[Swowl]

I could see a Didds/MiX/X team

This is a good team call, since I feel like defending Didds now.

Does anyone think both e and Didds can be town?

For Galz to be right, I’d have to have voted to protect e. So, the better question is are both e and I scum together?

you forgot to include the possibility that E! could be skum and you could be town...
I mean so did Galz... but he is pushing you specifically.

[Swowl]

Looking at the wagons, I see a few options.

If e is town:

• Scum has no real reason to see either exile happen, so I would expect they would hang back, or try to spread out onto different wagons.

If e is scum:

• Scum is likely late on Dylan's wagon, like WCD or mathdude.
• Joth expertly moved exiles to ensure Dylan was exiled.

To me, it looked more like e is town, which also plays into my slight townread on mathdude, and my perception of how joth plays.

I think we should probably look at the mathdude wagon + scola for scum today.

So ifsofactso - you are leaning all town wagons eod1?

[Swowl]

You say you had found faust more grumpy/adament/cranky (which is town!faust).

I was *highly* suspicious of faust when he didn’t rage!vote my Mathdude vote towards the end of the day (his response is at #465). I had read and caught up, analyzed my preference to Wagon, etc. A small part of my singular vote after the prod was to see how faust reacted.

What’s your take on his reaction to my vote (but not really post)?

So did you not think that Math was the best of the options? like did you forego voting your best skum read just to get a reaction from faust by voting math?