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Author Topic: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Game Over! Town Wins!  (Read 130560 times)

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hypercube

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #850 on: May 23, 2021, 07:44:16 am »

The poison stuff doesn't make sense to me, there was no active timeline N0 so how could anyone take an action?
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #851 on: May 23, 2021, 08:23:26 am »

I have a thought.

I wonder if the baddies are choosing the kills a night in advance.

That would make sense as to why the players on the opposite timeline keep dying, and also why gkrieg died first. In fact, I would go so far as to say that I know at least part of that theory is true.


(Cue Awaclus saying I know this because I am scum)

Why does it explain that gkrieg died first? Maybe they targeted lurkers so the game would be more interesting.

Is that a confession or just an odd argument?

I postulated that they would choose a wildcard player that thy deemed as strong.

Obviously that would have been me, but I wasn’t in the game at night 0.

This is all based on the idea that they had to choose a player to kill before knowing anything.

Wouldn't faust be an even better target then?
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #852 on: May 23, 2021, 08:30:30 am »

So...

The poison as mafia's (only) NK argument only works if mafia was allowed to poison someone on N0.  If mafia has players in both timelines but they share a QT, easy enough to make that work.

Except...

We didn't have a timeline announced on N0, right?  So how was that resolved?  Was it just a free-for-all?

So one thing would be, if anyone could take an action on N0, please claim that specific tidbit.  Just one is enough, but it would help immensely.  Maybe you were 1-shot and used it; that's even better.  Just don't tell us that part.

Basically, I think a normal game where mafia can only poison has zero kills on N1.  In a normal game where there are multiple mafias and one is poisoner and the other isn't, you'd have one kill on N1 and then two each night unless blocking/doctoring.

So...uncle could have messed up his fakeclaim here.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #853 on: May 23, 2021, 09:03:41 am »

Pffft. I don’t think I drop poison into a game unprompted without thinking it through as scum.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #854 on: May 23, 2021, 09:05:12 am »

Two teams would also explain shooting across timelines.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #855 on: May 23, 2021, 09:07:25 am »

Killing in the alternate timeline N1 makes perfect sense to me because it is essentially a N0 kill for that timeline. There is no POE to be gained from it for those in that timeline.

The shot at chairs is the real mystery. It's effectively the only reason I am not immediately voting Eddie. Why would scum force a 1v1 on themselves when it is completely avoidable unless that 1v1 doesn't really exist and they want it to appear as such?

One possibility I thought of is redirection. I think redirection is typically anti town but it seems somewhat thematic for this game, maybe? At any rate, maybe scum did not mean to kill chairs but rather someone else? If town did redirect last night then I think they should claim even if outside their timeline. Whoever they targeted is scum and so is Eddie. If true, redirection here would be supremely pro town.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #856 on: May 23, 2021, 09:10:17 am »

I have not played with poison in maybe ever? How does it typically work? Does a poisoned player know they are poisoned? Obviously it's a delayed kill.

Maybe I missed the thrust of the poison claim. Eddie, are you suggesting chairs died of poisoning and there wasn't a NK?
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #857 on: May 23, 2021, 09:26:12 am »

My role gives me no information other than implications that poison exists and that it works as a delayed kill.

So I am unfortunately lost when it comes to the intricacies of how it functions on this game (how many poisons are expected, etc.)

I fully expected two people to die last night, and when that didn’t happen (and I was being pushed) decided to throw that out there.

All other thoughts about N0 choosing (I didn’t know there wasn’t a timeline for N0, I wasn’t in the game yet) and other theaters are just speculation.

*shrug*
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #858 on: May 23, 2021, 09:50:22 am »

Poison seems ill fitting thematically? I'm asking because I recall no such mechanic in the movie. Eddie, are you willing to claim your character name?
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #859 on: May 23, 2021, 09:52:54 am »

My ability is very thematic. I assure you.

I watched the film and when my character was explained, I was very pleased. Swowl did good.

There is an odd thematic break in it, but such sacrifices are worth it.

I would want to reveal my whole role if I gave the name, not just the poison part, but still.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #860 on: May 23, 2021, 10:55:56 am »

I think the rules are pretty clear that no-one would be able to take an action N0, so any poison kills would be extra kills. If there is a poisoner in this game, either they're in this timeline and the kill got blocked N1 or they're in the other timeline and we wouldn't see the extra kill until tomorrow. That would be kind of a cute interaction with the timeline mechanic, the poisoner gets to act N2 and Eddie gets a chance to block the poison N3.

So, Eddie suggesting that all the NKs are poison kills could be a townslip, although I'd also sort of expect him to have thought through this if that's his actual role. It's enough to get me to reconsider my read on him at least. I'm hoping my head will be less foggy tomorrow and I'll do a reread.

unvote
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #861 on: May 23, 2021, 11:52:39 am »

I'm here too. The weekend has been busier than normal, but I'm following along. Agree that a redirector claiming now would be very good for town here.

PPS's other points in that post are good points that I had been thinking about too, but I do worry that him being the one to make them means it's scum trying to nudge us away from the 1v1.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #862 on: May 23, 2021, 12:17:51 pm »

I'm here too. The weekend has been busier than normal, but I'm following along. Agree that a redirector claiming now would be very good for town here.

PPS's other points in that post are good points that I had been thinking about too, but I do worry that him being the one to make them means it's scum trying to nudge us away from the 1v1.

I could imagine a passive redirector maybe? i.e. if you target one member of that TL QT, it redirects to the other (if still living). So maybe the actual target was chair's Timeline QT partner?
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #863 on: May 23, 2021, 04:33:02 pm »

Pffft. I don’t think I drop poison into a game unprompted without thinking it through as scum.

It seems like you didn't think it through as town either?
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #864 on: May 23, 2021, 05:37:23 pm »

Pffft. I don’t think I drop poison into a game unprompted without thinking it through as scum.

It seems like you didn't think it through as town either?

I thought through what ramifications would come about by me claiming that, and deemed it worth claiming.

As scum, I probably wouldn’t have just blurted out “poison” without it being something that either exists (because I would be a poisoner or something) or I knew what exactly I was claiming.

Basically: it’s a dumb thing for me to fake and get wrong as scum.

I also wasn’t in this game from the start, so I have no idea how night 0 was handled. I don’t even know what Faust did N0 (nothing, he did nothing).
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #865 on: May 23, 2021, 06:46:19 pm »

When Eddie fake claims, it tends to be more robust.

So, let’s look harder at PPS
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #866 on: May 23, 2021, 07:20:45 pm »

When Eddie fake claims, it tends to be more robust.

So, let’s look harder at PPS

I haven’t finished yet, though.

👀
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #867 on: May 23, 2021, 08:21:33 pm »

Are you gonna?
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #868 on: May 23, 2021, 08:58:52 pm »

Are you gonna?

I doubt I will today.

I announced the bit that woulda been sad if it died with me.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #869 on: May 23, 2021, 09:08:23 pm »

Are you gonna?

I doubt I will today.

I announced the bit that woulda been sad if it died with me.

To be clear your flip alone would reveal nothing about poison in the game?
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #870 on: May 23, 2021, 10:03:20 pm »

Are you gonna?

I doubt I will today.

I announced the bit that woulda been sad if it died with me.

To be clear your flip alone would reveal nothing about poison in the game?

It is not in the name of my ability, no.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #871 on: May 23, 2021, 10:03:39 pm »

(But im town, so you can trust me)
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #872 on: May 23, 2021, 11:04:49 pm »

Are you gonna?

I doubt I will today.

I announced the bit that woulda been sad if it died with me.

To be clear your flip alone would reveal nothing about poison in the game?

The more I look at this post the more confused I get.

This seems like an attempt to call me a liar, but the only time that’s relavent is if I’m dead, which will confirm that I am town and telling the truth, or that I was lying, which would be clear regardless of the word “poison” appearing in my ability name. Because my name would be red.

This feels like it could be from a scum unable to look at outcomes right, or a scum trying to pivot to scumreading me.

I dunno, it’s been scratching at the back of my head for the past chunk of time, and I don’t like it.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 3!
« Reply #873 on: May 24, 2021, 07:02:58 am »

You are claiming something exists that should scare town into keeping you alive that cannot be verified in any way whatsoever. You suggest that flipping you would give a black and white resolution to that existence but it hinges upon you having claimed it to begin with. The point of my clarification is that were you to be NK'd with no chance to claim town would still be unaware of a poison element. This seems unlikely to me unless another town can come forward to confirm additional knowledge of poisoning.

Your suggestion about how I must be scum for seeing through this fallacy is the real scumread pivot. You've gone from reluctantly voting me out of self preservation to seeking veiled substantiation to convince others into it as well.

Of course, if you flipped town we'd be forced to believe the poison element whether we could otherwise see it or not. Acting as if I can't grok that and that makes me scum is blatantly disingenuous and an obvious scum ploy.

Vote: Eddie
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #874 on: May 24, 2021, 07:48:17 am »

Ok, so I just spent a solid half an hour going over the rest of Eddie's day 1 posts and then accidentally deleted the whole thing. I don't have the energy to do it again plus my roomates are now downstairs and being loud so I'm just going to summarize my thoughts as best I can.

Basically, I came out of it feeling a lot better about voting for Eddie. His statement about looking at QT partners comes off really scummy with the knowledge that his partner is scum. It really seems like a setup to defend himself in the event of a joth flip. This quote really seals that impression for me:

Eddie or Glooble, whichever of you are scum...
Does scum have day-chat this game? Are you QT buddies with a scum-mate? Will you be coordinating your votes with them?

(I'd ask scola too, but he's not Active timeline... guess you can still answer the first two questions).

I’m pretty suspicious I have daychat with scum, yes.

I want to look more at his interactions with joth on day 2 with that in mind.

The other thing about the end of day 1 is mathdude's strong scumreading of Eddie's opinions on how to use the vengeful cop power, which I think I more or less agree with.

The poison doctor claim reeks of desperation to me.

What E are we at?
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

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