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Author Topic: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Game Over! Town Wins!  (Read 130460 times)

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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #750 on: May 21, 2021, 10:53:42 am »

Can you explain that read, Uncle? I don't even see a "he's scum cause he's, like, scummy, you see" post and I'd like one of those.

Reread his posts from today, is it just me?
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #751 on: May 21, 2021, 10:55:06 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

He has enough “hmmm’s” that he could fill a bag with them.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #752 on: May 21, 2021, 10:56:28 am »

Assumption? That's what math died to tell us.

Right, okay, it's coming together for me now. We know it's not 2 in Mix, Cube, Gloobie, Awac. Chances of 3 seem vanishingly small to me too. Chances of 1 not so much but 2 seems like a  reasonable assumption.

Knowing my alignment I now see the POE to Eddie. I'm still stumped as to why scum would pop chairs, though, knowing it forces a 1v1. That would require some pretty adept commitment to the next day's strategy, I think.
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pingpongsam

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #753 on: May 21, 2021, 10:58:05 am »

Assumption? That's what math died to tell us.

Right, okay, it's coming together for me now. We know it's not 2 in Mix, Cube, Gloobie, Awac. Chances of timeline containing 3 scum seem vanishingly small to me too. Chances of 1 not so much but 2 seems like a  reasonable assumption.

Knowing my alignment I now see the POE to Eddie. I'm still stumped as to why scum would pop chairs, though, knowing it forces a 1v1. That would require some pretty adept commitment to the next day's strategy, I think.

Bolded fixes to clarify what my brain was doing while I typed.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #754 on: May 21, 2021, 10:58:20 am »

Assumption? That's what math died to tell us.

Right, okay, it's coming together for me now. We know it's not 2 in Mix, Cube, Gloobie, Awac. Chances of 3 seem vanishingly small to me too. Chances of 1 not so much but 2 seems like a  reasonable assumption.

Knowing my alignment I now see the POE to Eddie. I'm still stumped as to why scum would pop chairs, though, knowing it forces a 1v1. That would require some pretty adept commitment to the next day's strategy, I think.

And you and I are the opposite of communal right now.

I honestly have no idea what to make of you and it’s annoying.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #755 on: May 21, 2021, 10:59:03 am »

The chairs flip brings more credibility to a thought that Didds touched on some time ago. What if scum somehow don't actually know about each other? Say, they are all traitors such that a blind shot has a chance of recruitment?
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #756 on: May 21, 2021, 11:00:25 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #757 on: May 21, 2021, 11:05:29 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.

But he was town.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #758 on: May 21, 2021, 11:06:42 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.

But he was town.

insert eyes emoji here
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #759 on: May 21, 2021, 11:07:04 am »

The chairs flip brings more credibility to a thought that Didds touched on some time ago. What if scum somehow don't actually know about each other? Say, they are all traitors such that a blind shot has a chance of recruitment?

It's an interesting thought. It's definitely hard to make sense of the decision to kill chairs - the gkreig kill does point towards them wanting to kill unexpected targets, which could just be fear of town role powers. The case where it seems to makes sense to kill off-wagon are if there's one scum who was on-wagon, so that should be considered, but at the same time there's WIFOM.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #760 on: May 21, 2021, 11:07:26 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.

But he was town.

He was town who was trying to get people to vote for him.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #761 on: May 21, 2021, 11:09:13 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.

But he was town.

He was town who was trying to get people to vote for him.

So how was voting for him towny?
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #762 on: May 21, 2021, 11:10:21 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.

But he was town.

👀

There ya go.

May as well get some use from phone posting this whole time.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #763 on: May 21, 2021, 11:17:06 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.

But he was town.

He was town who was trying to get people to vote for him.

So how was voting for him towny?

He was acting like scum in order to accomplish this goal, and it's towny to vote for people who are acting like scum.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #764 on: May 21, 2021, 11:19:19 am »

He was also the universally agreed “scummiest vote” on M.D.

This is the line of reasoning joth tried to use - voting for mathdude was towny.

But he was town.

He was town who was trying to get people to vote for him.

So how was voting for him towny?

He was acting like scum in order to accomplish this goal, and it's towny to vote for people who are acting like scum.

Ehhhhh, he was acting more like town than scum, though.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #765 on: May 21, 2021, 11:21:51 am »

It's scummy to vote for town that act scummy.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #766 on: May 21, 2021, 11:22:15 am »

Can't say I ever read math as scum, either.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #767 on: May 21, 2021, 11:22:25 am »

Ehhhhh, he was acting more like town than scum, though.

Town doesn't normally fake their emotions like that. I voted for mathdude after MiX pointed out that that was what mathdude was doing.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #768 on: May 21, 2021, 11:32:18 am »

This is why I don’t make cases, forget o said anything about your vote on M.D. being scummy.

Let’s just stick with my gut, the fact you are bad, and a healthy dollop of “I have no idea what I am talking about but let’s just vote and see what happens”
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #769 on: May 21, 2021, 11:35:08 am »

I strongly agree with those saying we should exile either Eddie or PPS today. I've scumread each of them at different points, but they've both been relatively active, so I'd suggest we all re-read them when we have time.

It would take a lot for me to vote on-wagon today. Not saying I won't, but it would take a really good case or someone acting really scummy.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #770 on: May 21, 2021, 11:58:13 am »

But PPS is being so much townier than some other person we got floating around.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #771 on: May 21, 2021, 11:59:04 am »

Hey, MiX, where do you land on the whole “PPS/Uncleeurope has a baddie in it”
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #772 on: May 21, 2021, 12:00:51 pm »

I've been mulling over how it could resolve if all of either alignment were eliminated from a timeline. I think such a gamestate might result in a timeline convergence. In the case of town elimination scum likely have the game in the bag anyhow but if not yet then assuming the timelines publicly converge the remaining scum from that timeline are effectively known. In the case of scum elimination it seems possible for timelines to converge there as well. I suppose town could get a huge boost to no exile every day and focusing PRs on the other timeline during their night but it seems like a boring way to play out the game for those stuck in a timeline with no adversary.

At any rate, such an idea lends some credence to asymmetrical scum loading. If my theory is at all worthwhile, with 1 scum gone from the forward timeline and no public convergence we could assume multiple scum on forward timeline but not necessarily assume multiple scum on the reverse timeline. This is about the only way I can perceive ignoring the must lynch off wagon campaign for today.
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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Day 1!
« Reply #773 on: May 21, 2021, 12:06:03 pm »

Ok, so faust/Eddie. The first notable thing is faust's "no real votes" plan and his desire to keep timelines secret for day one.

One clear downside of timeline claiming is that it allows scum to target the PRs that can be active that Night with roleblocking, killing etc.

So here is my plan: noone votes. Instead, we use italics to Vote: xy. I agree to do vote count for italic votes. If a majority of living players agrees on an exile, then the people in the active timeline try to exile them. Otherwise, there will be no exile.

Was this plan scummy? Was it towny but just ill-advised? Was it a brilliant plan that we should have followed? Who knows. Reading back at the discussion around it, it's easy to see it as a scum play for town points. Especially with snap-backs like this one:

Maybe it wasn't best to mention this, so I'll rephrase to say: No, I do not expect that.

Okay then your plan is anti-town.
At least I have a plan and am not just blurting out random bits of information to the enemy.

I think the italics plan by faust is a good one. Obviously overtly helpful faust is scum faust, so vote: faust.

I also don't know if not timeline claiming is a good thing. Not just for the targeting reasons that have been mentioned, but because we will have at least partially timeline claimed by the end of the day when the people from the current timeline vote for the person who has been hammered by italics votes. Not sure if it is good to let some people be unclaimed from a timeline while others get to not be timeline claimed.

gkrieg, who was town, found the plan, or at least faust's presentation of it scummy, or at least that's how I interpret this statement- that gkrieg thought the plan was a ploy for townpoints. Unless he was being tongue-in-cheek here, I honestly can't tell.

mathdude strongly opposes faust's plan and in fact acitvely undermines it with a bold vote on faust. So far 2/2 dead townies agree- faust is scummy.

faust responds:

I am extremely frustrated and annoyed at mathdude's play.

Which is pretty much in character regardless of alignment.

Confirmed scum joth supports faust's plan. Make of that what you will - could be buddying from joth to get town!faust to like him, could be the plan had some hidden benefit to scum that made it worth two scum players tying themselves together.

We're all so stuck on whether this plan is good or not, we're actually not getting anywhere useful. Good job faust. Your plan is working.

We could just move on quickly if everyone claims Timeline, votes for themselves (or if Reverse, you can vote me or faust), then let's get on with the actual game.

I think faust is scummy. And I know he can be voted for today.  Anyone else have scum reads?

mathdude raises the possibility that faust's plan was mostly to distract town from actually scumhunting which, honestly, is seeming like a not-terribly unlikely scenario to me right now.

Almost-certainly confirmed town Ashersky agrees with mathdude's assessment of faust and the motivation behind the plan as well.

Now this interaction:

It would be easier because this is an RMM with supercharged investigative PRs.

Also re. faust - what is this? Either it's creating WIFOM for no obvious reason or it's rolefishing bait. Feels scummy to me in any case.
Every investigative role has a QT, i.e. they can share their results without having to claim.

Except they have no idea if their QT-mate is town, so they may not want to reveal to that person that they have an investigative role.

Exactly this. But I can see why faust wants investigative roles to share with their partners... or helps out him and his team if one of them can get info from town.

mathdude here basically accusing faust of trying to get townies with investigative roles to out themselves to their QT partners- that seems a little bit unsubtle for faust, but I can certainly see mathdude's point.

I was apparently townreading faust at this point, but as we all know from how day 2 panned out, my reads are shit. He certainly seems less-than-towny to me on this reread.

Vote: faust

Timeline hiding is worthless.

And chairs weighs in! 3 out of 3 dead townies agree- faust is scum!

And now we reach the point where faust subbed out for Eddie, so I'm going to take a break and pick this up later. So far, and Eddie Exile is looking pretty decent to me though.

PPE: 3


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Re: RMM 58: Memento Mafia - Night 2
« Reply #774 on: May 21, 2021, 12:08:11 pm »

And in case anyone doesn't want to read my wall of text, here's the big takeaway - all three of the dead townies thought faust was scummy before Eddie replaced faust day one.
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