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[LaLight]

Welcome to M128: Dragonborn Mafia

This game is for 13 players, and is classified as normal. It uses open setup called Fire and Ice.

Comod and flavor writer: Dylan32

Players:

1. 2.71828.....
2. A Drowned Kernel
3. Galzria
4. Swowl
5. jotheonah
6. shraeye
7. WestCoastDidds
8. Robz888
9. MiX
10. scolapasta
11. mcmcsalot
12. yuma
13. mail-mi

Tags:


The Rules:

The Golden Rule:
This is a game. Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun. Once the game starts, having signed up is a commitment: inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments.

The Standard Rules:
1. No communication between players outside of the game thread or shared QTs at any time. This includes passing references, jokes, or cases in other games or threads, whether in context or not.
2. If the game thread is locked, do not post. If you are unsure if something is locked, ask the mod by PM.
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay.
4. Actions with instructions that do not specify a game state will be resolved in the order they are received.
5. All night actions must be submitted within 24 hours of day ending.
6. Players must post once every 24 hours.
7. Do not edit or delete posts, ever. If you need to clarify or correct something, post again.
8. Invisible text, font size less than 10, and spoiler tags are not allowed.
9. Cryptography is not allowed.
10. The time between a lynch being reached and a flip being provided is called twilight. All players may continue posting during this time, including the lynched player.
11. Dead players may not post in thread or QT, except their Role QT. A lynched player is not "dead" until a flip has been provided.
12. Personal multimedia, such as video or audio recordings, are not allowed in the game thread.

The Voting Rules:
1. Votes should be in this format: Vote: Playername. Unambigiuous nicknames are acceptable, or any string that uniquely identifies a user. Note that the point of voting is, in fact, unambiguity, and attempting to make it unclear to other players (or, of course, mods) which user you are voting for is very ill-advised.
2. Unvotes should be in this format: unvote or Unvote: Playername.
3. Unvotes are not required if changing your vote from one player to another.
4. You may vote: no lynch.
5. Lynches occur when a simple majority (rounded up) of living players is reached. Once reached, a lynch cannot be undone.
6. If a majority lynch is not reached by the Day's deadline, no lynch occurs.

The Rest:
1. Bold, purple 'AA00AA' text is reserved for the mod. Players may not use it.
2. If you have an issue or problem with the game, please PM the Mod. Do not post complaints in the game thread.
3. Mods make mistakes - please point them out gently. If they can be corrected, they will. If irreversible, they will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. If a mod error disadvantages one faction greatly, the game may be called off.
5. Ask all questions and make all requests directly to the Mod via PM. Questions deemed as "universal" (defined as questions for which the answers should be available to all players) will be requested to be re-posted in the Game Thread and answered there.
6. One prod will be issued after 48 hours without posting in the game thread. Players are subject to replacement or modkill after one prod.
7. All rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, as determined by the mod.
8. Each player will receive their own QT, regardless of role. Don't quote from it.
9. If the game goes on for 3 days and 3 nights without a lynch or nightkill, town wins.

Deadlines:
1. Days will last seven IRL days.
2. Nights will last 48 hours.

[LaLight]

Setup

Fire and Ice is an open setup game with 13 players.

Mafia players are known as two dragonborn tribes; a tribe of red dragonborns (fire dragons) and white dragonborns (ice dragons).

There will be

2 Red Dragonborn Goons
2 White Dragonborn Goons
8 Vanilla Villagers
1 Soothsayer (Doctor)

Mechanics:
- The nightkill of the Fire Mafia and the Ice Mafia will fail if both groups of mafia target the same person.
- The Mafia groups are not night kill immune.
- Fire Mafia kills and Ice Mafia kills have different kill flavor.

VT pm:

Welcome to M128, name. You are a Vanilla Townie. The only special powers you have to protect your village are your words and your vote. You have a QT to communicate with the mods if needed, here.

You win when all threats to town are eliminated and at least one town player is alive.

[LaLight]

Reserved

[2.71828.....]

/in. First setup I played here in f.ds!

[LaLight]

/in. First setup I played here in f.ds!

Funny, I thought it haven't been here at all! Well, this is even more amazing

[2.71828.....]

/in. First setup I played here in f.ds!

Funny, I thought it haven't been here at all! Well, this is even more amazing

Mafia XXXIII: Toy story mafia

[A Drowned Kernel]

/in

[Galzria]

Oh, def /in

[Swowl]

/In sauce

[mail-mi]

/in

[LaLight]

Dylan and I decided to change the name to Dragonborn Mafia, as D&D is a cool name for RMM. Also, VT pm is in opening post now.

[faust]

It's all multiball these days

[LaLight]

It's all multiball these days

believe it or not, but like 30 minutes ago I thought "why have faust still not joined? ah, Multiball. Oh, and the other game is multiball. Damn"

[MiX]

The setups are actually incredibly similar, all that changes is the single town PR and in this one you know who did what kill. Oh and you can cancel kills I guess.

I will in eventually but there's like 3 ongoing games and lynchpool, seems like we're booked.

[LaLight]

I still think it will be fun. I myself like Multiball a lot, and we have not nearly enough of those on this site, in my opinion

[faust]

I still think it will be fun. I myself like Multiball a lot, and we have not nearly enough of those on this site, in my opinion

Well, a lot of RMMs are some flavor of multiball, to be fair. But we do it more rarely as open or semi-open setups, that much is true.

[shraeye]

/in

[WestCoastDidds]

/in

Shraeye!

[WestCoastDidds]

/in

[mail-mi]

/out for now, hoping to in again soon.

[jotheonah]

always /in for some multiball.

[Dylan32]

Just commenting so it'll show up in my new posts instead of all.

[yuma]

/tag

[Robz888]

/in

[LaLight]

/in

heyyy

[Robz888]

/in

heyyy

 

[MiX]

Official /in now that 2 games ended (and I remembered this existed).

[WestCoastDidds]

I am currently in NO GAMES with Swowl and MiX and this hurts my head. Unthinkable! I am bereft!  Let's make this happen, people!

[jotheonah]

I am currently in NO GAMES with Swowl and MiX and this hurts my head. Unthinkable! I am bereft!  Let's make this happen, people!

I'm in no games AT ALL.

[scolapasta]

Can I manage 3 games?? Well, willing to try.

/in

[Dylan32]

L-3

[WestCoastDidds]

I am currently in NO GAMES with Swowl and MiX and this hurts my head. Unthinkable! I am bereft!  Let's make this happen, people!

I'm in no games AT ALL.

We are bereft!! Save us, friends!!

[mcmcsalot]

/in

[Galzria]

Whoo boy. Excited about this game.

[yuma]

/in

Life gets less crazy in 5 days

[Galzria]

L-1. Just need a Hammer.

[Robz888]

YESSSSS

[mail-mi]

Oh what ever.

/In

[WestCoastDidds]

Hooray!!!!

[LaLight]

Thread locked other than for tags. As today is my first work day after quarantine, expect pms in 8-9 hours.

[LaLight]

pms are going out now. Please, /confirm in you personal or factional QT that you read and understood your role. Day 1 will start in 24 hours, or later if there will not be all the confirmation at that time.

[LaLight]

"My lord, our soothsayer has had a most troubling vision. By their word, there are members of not one, but two Dragonborn tribes attempting to infiltrate and destroy our village so that they may claim our land for their respective tribes."

"Go, investigate and verify the soothsayer's words. If you find the scum who would do this, eliminate them, permanently. And if the soothsayer is able to discern who the Dragonborn's victims are to be, take heed and protect the targets at once. May you find this Dragonborn scum quickly, or may they wipe each other out in their recklessness."

"Consider it done, my lord."

Day 1 starts now!

Vote Count 1.0

Not Voting (13): 2,71828....., A Drowned Kernel, Galzria, Swowl, jotheonah, shraeye, WestCoastDidds, Robz888, MiX, scolapasta, mcmcsalot, yuma, mail-mi

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

Thread unlocked!

[LaLight]

Note, that we strongly suggest using the word "Exile" in this game where you used "Lynch" earlier.

[mail-mi]

Lords and Ladies, welcome to another game of Mafia.

vote: No Exile let's see what happens

[mcmcsalot]

Vote: mail-mi

In multi ball we have an extremely limited effect on the game with exiles, there couldn’t be a worse time to no exile.

It’s good to be back!

[MiX]

My second favourite brother pair is back!

Vote: mcmc, I miss you slightly more.

Hey yuma, ready to redeem yourself? You haven't lynched scum willingly yet since your revival

[mail-mi]

Vote: mail-mi

In multi ball we have an extremely limited effect on the game with exiles, there couldn’t be a worse time to no exile.

It’s good to be back!

I'm just seeing if it'll appear as "no  exile" in the vote counts.

[jotheonah]

hiiieee

Psyched to be in another game.

MiX, which scum team are you on?

[MiX]

hiiieee

Psyched to be in another game.

MiX, which scum team are you on?

The town team, destined to exile everyone!

Also (ongoing game).

[mail-mi]

So doctor should claim, yes? Creates an IC and some WIFOM cause if both scumteams kill them they don't actually die.

[MiX]

So doctor should claim, yes? Creates an IC and some WIFOM cause if both scumteams kill them they don't actually die.

No, because we don't need an IC. We should definitely wait for claims at L-1, however.

I will also abstain from further setup talk.

[A Drowned Kernel]

vote: joth

[A Drowned Kernel]

So doctor should claim, yes? Creates an IC and some WIFOM cause if both scumteams kill them they don't actually die.

I don't think this is a good idea. They can always claim at a later date, and we don't really gain anything from knowing who they are ahead of time

[mcmcsalot]

So doctor should claim, yes? Creates an IC and some WIFOM cause if both scumteams kill them they don't actually die.

I don't think this is a good idea. They can always claim at a later date, and we don't really gain anything from knowing who they are ahead of time

Ooh but if we find scum they 100% claim doctor and then we have to wait for a counter claim and then the doctor is outed anyway. So there is that to take into consideration. The doctor should be pretty safe claiming since the two scum teams absolutely want least to double up their nk.

Also we should be very very careful weighing in on if we believe the doctor should or should not claim, the last thing we want is to sort of Poe who could and could not be the doctor based on their thoughts on if the doctor should or should not claim.

I think part of it certainly depends on who the doctor is, if they are more or less likely to be nk’d and if they are more or less likely to be around to counter claim and some other things that depend on the player. Setup wise there are definitely reasons for and against.

[mcmcsalot]

Either way unvote

[A Drowned Kernel]

Either way unvote

What changed your mind?

[mcmcsalot]

Either way unvote

What changed your mind?

I think mail-mi’s post about the doctor claim was at best towny and at lest pro-town. He gave also gave an explanation for why he voted no exile which was not that he actually wanted to not exile.

[mcmcsalot]

Why the joth vote ADK?

[jotheonah]

I'm usually anti-claim for D1, but I can see the logic in this case. The setup almost seems made for it.

The risk is that the scum teams find some way to signal to each other about which one of them is going to take the shot. But even that's not a terrible scenario because then we can find scum by going back and finding the signal.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Either way unvote

What changed your mind?

I think mail-mi’s post about the doctor claim was at best towny and at lest pro-town. He gave also gave an explanation for why he voted no exile which was not that he actually wanted to not exile.

I can see it being towny, though I don't think it's pro-town. Why is an insincere vote towny?

Why the joth vote ADK?

It's always joth

I'm usually anti-claim for D1, but I can see the logic in this case. The setup almost seems made for it.

The risk is that the scum teams find some way to signal to each other about which one of them is going to take the shot. But even that's not a terrible scenario because then we can find scum by going back and finding the signal.

We don't lose anything by waiting for the doctor to claim when they feel it's necessary, and don't gain anything by it happening early

[jotheonah]

One interesting thing about this setup is our odds of hitting scum off a random exile are better than normal. If the doctor claims and isn't counterclaimed then we have an IC, who could be trusted to make a random selection, which would then have a 1/3 chance of hitting scum.

1/3 isn't great odds, but it's better than normal and it would completely remove scum's ability to manipulate the town's kill.

But misexiles are also pretty punishing in this setup. If we hit town nights 1 and 2, and fail to prevent the nightkills, we lose at the start of Day 3. Well I guess we don't lose, but we're outnumbered by scum.

[jotheonah]

I'm not really suggesting a random exile. I'm just spitballing and thoerycrafting while I wait for people to show up and make a scumslip.

[mcmcsalot]

 @adk because I’m too old for fancy quoting on mobile.

There is nothing about mail-mi’s vote that is insincere. He said let’s see what happens and explained he wanted to see if no exile was included in vote counts and how. I didn’t realize that’s what he we doing initially but upon clarification it makes sense and isn’t scummy.

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It’s always joth is however a terrible reason for a vote especially if you find mail-mi’s vote insincere.

In fact vote: ADK

[Robz888]

Hello, all! Well my suggestion to use "fire" for our new word really, really does not work given the flavor in this setup, eh? Oh well.

I'm mildly in favor of the Doctor claiming, though I would like to see more discussion of it. And if I were the Doctor, I would not be claiming right now, until there was more discussion of it. If we manage to E-1 (?) scum, we are probably going to end up with dueling Doctor claims anyway, as has been noted. In the last few games I played it seems like we were doing, er, exiles, at the very last minute, not leaving a lot of time to adjudicate claims, which would be especially bad here. Just having the Doctor claim eliminates this possibility, and we get an IC. And scum have to be a little afraid about taking the shot, since it could duplicate. I realize I'm not saying anything novel but I had these thoughts as well and thus I am going to voice them! Trying to be helpful town!Robz, turning over a new leaf, watch me go.

[A Drowned Kernel]

@adk because I’m too old for fancy quoting on mobile.

There is nothing about mail-mi’s vote that is insincere. He said let’s see what happens and explained he wanted to see if no exile was included in vote counts and how. I didn’t realize that’s what he we doing initially but upon clarification it makes sense and isn’t scummy.

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It’s always joth is however a terrible reason for a vote especially if you find mail-mi’s vote insincere.

In fact vote: ADK

Are you saying that mail-mi's suggestion is pro-town, or that starting the discussion at all is pro-town? (I would dispute both

I don't have a strong opinion about mail-mi's vote, what I'm concerned with is the sincerity of your vote and unvote, which to me looks like faked activity

[Robz888]

Either way I think we should be looking to get an exile early, or at least earlier than we were getting them in the games we were playing before my last absence.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

[jotheonah]

vote: mcmcsalot

[Robz888]

@adk because I’m too old for fancy quoting on mobile.

There is nothing about mail-mi’s vote that is insincere. He said let’s see what happens and explained he wanted to see if no exile was included in vote counts and how. I didn’t realize that’s what he we doing initially but upon clarification it makes sense and isn’t scummy.

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It’s always joth is however a terrible reason for a vote especially if you find mail-mi’s vote insincere.

In fact vote: ADK

Are you saying that mail-mi's suggestion is pro-town, or that starting the discussion at all is pro-town? (I would dispute both

I don't have a strong opinion about mail-mi's vote, what I'm concerned with is the sincerity of your vote and unvote, which to me looks like faked activity

I do think the "in fact" before the vote has the ring of false outrage.

[Robz888]

Other than that I guess I agree with mcmc, though.

[scolapasta]

Hi all.

vote: Robz888

I don't see nearly enough positive of Doctor revealing so early.

[MiX]

Hi all.

vote: Robz888

I don't see nearly enough positive of Doctor revealing so early.

Vote: scolapasta, participating in RVS without saying anything about it.

[scolapasta]

Hi all.

vote: Robz888

I don't see nearly enough positive of Doctor revealing so early.

Vote: scolapasta, participating in RVS without saying anything about it.

Whew, everything is right in this world again, now that MiX has voted for me D1. Whew.

My vote wasn't strictly RVS.

[MiX]

Saying "whew" twice is a scumslip, haven't you heard?

What's the reasoning then?

[mcmcsalot]

@adk because I’m too old for fancy quoting on mobile.

There is nothing about mail-mi’s vote that is insincere. He said let’s see what happens and explained he wanted to see if no exile was included in vote counts and how. I didn’t realize that’s what he we doing initially but upon clarification it makes sense and isn’t scummy.

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It’s always joth is however a terrible reason for a vote especially if you find mail-mi’s vote insincere.

In fact vote: ADK

Are you saying that mail-mi's suggestion is pro-town, or that starting the discussion at all is pro-town? (I would dispute both

I am saying that at I think mail-mi’s suggestion is potentially pro-town and the suggestion which creates discussion is definitely pro-town.

I don't have a strong opinion about mail-mi's vote, what I'm concerned with is the sincerity of your vote and unvote, which to me looks like faked activity

You literally called mail-mi’s vote insincere...which I don’t think it was and I think you are painting mail-no in a scummy light by calling the vote insincere.

Either way unvote

What changed your mind?

I think mail-mi’s post about the doctor claim was at best towny and at lest pro-town. He gave also gave an explanation for why he voted no exile which was not that he actually wanted to not exile.

I can see it being towny, though I don't think it's pro-town. Why is an insincere vote towny?

This has to be in reference to mail-mi’s vote. Because this is after he explained he was seeing what voting no exile did and not seeing if voting no exile would get any traction.

Now you claim to not have a about mail-mi’s vote but it’s my vote and unvote that seems like faked activity. It sure makes my activity seem more fake when you blow off the fact that mail-mi votes something I thought was very bad then followed up with an explaination that made perfect sense.

You are just painting everyone you can as scummy for terrible reasons aren’t you.

[2.71828.....]

Vote: robz

Was scum last time we played this setup.

[MiX]

mcmc wants to be town, so he's null. Not bad of a read for mcmc.

Vote: robz

Was scum last time we played this setup.

Wasn't that your first game? Did he win?

[2.71828.....]

Also, doctor can do what doctor wants to do.

Claim, no claim, it's all WIFOM.

[2.71828.....]

mcmc wants to be town, so he's null. Not bad of a read for mcmc.

Vote: robz

Was scum last time we played this setup.

Wasn't that your first game? Did he win?

He did not win, the other scums won. And it was my first game, I read robz as scum D1 but then was talked out of it. I mean, I was a noob trying to exile robz. It was never going to end well

[mcmcsalot]

Either way I think we should be looking to get an exile early, or at least earlier than we were getting them in the games we were playing before my last absence.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

I agree 100% we have enough old guard people around let’s try a soft deadline. Remember those.

July 2nd at 11pm is 12 hours before deadline. Let’s treat that as deadline for all intents and purposes.

[2.71828.....]

Either way I think we should be looking to get an exile early, or at least earlier than we were getting them in the games we were playing before my last absence.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

I agree 100% we have enough old guard people around let’s try a soft deadline. Remember those.

July 2nd at 11pm is 12 hours before deadline. Let’s treat that as deadline for all intents and purposes.

I expect post counts as well then

[MiX]

Soft deadline, wow. Does that mean people were trying to be pro-town before?

PPE: Yessss mcmc-certified post counts!

[mcmcsalot]

Hi all.

vote: Robz888

I don't see nearly enough positive of Doctor revealing so early.

Vote: scolapasta, participating in RVS without saying anything about it.

Whew, everything is right in this world again, now that MiX has voted for me D1. Whew.

My vote wasn't strictly RVS.

No truly it was “robz voting stage” as is the true meaning of rvs

[A Drowned Kernel]

@mcmc

mail-mi's posts, both the vote and the explanation, have been null for me, so I found your vote and unvote surprising, and a little unconvincing

[A Drowned Kernel]

And if mail-mi's vote is for a reason other than trying to get to get the thing he's voting for through them that means it's insincere

And an insincere vote can certainly come from town but I wanted to know what about mail-mi's explanation convinced you that he's town

[A Drowned Kernel]

And also

vote: mcmc

[mcmcsalot]

And if mail-mi's vote is for a reason other than trying to get to get the thing he's voting for through them that means it's insincere

And an insincere vote can certainly come from town but I wanted to know what about mail-mi's explanation convinced you that he's town

This is a logical fallacy. Mail-mi made a vote that he did not explain his reasoning for initially. People do that all the time. I interpreted the reasoning incorrectly and found it scummy. He clarified and I unvoted.

Perhaps we have differing opinions on what the word insincere means.

Lastly gotta love you calling me out for making “fake content” and then watch you spam post three separate messages in a row that were clearly one thought immediatly after seeing there would be post counts this game.

People should join me on this ADK wagon

[MiX]

Do people think about the post counts harming them as scum? Is that a thing?

I can join you on ADK as soon as scola stops being scum.

[A Drowned Kernel]

And if mail-mi's vote is for a reason other than trying to get to get the thing he's voting for through them that means it's insincere

And an insincere vote can certainly come from town but I wanted to know what about mail-mi's explanation convinced you that he's town

This is a logical fallacy. Mail-mi made a vote that he did not explain his reasoning for initially. People do that all the time. I interpreted the reasoning incorrectly and found it scummy. He clarified and I unvoted.

Perhaps we have differing opinions on what the word insincere means.

Lastly gotta love you calling me out for making “fake content” and then watch you spam post three separate messages in a row that were clearly one thought immediatly after seeing there would be post counts this game.

People should join me on this ADK wagon

Think of them as postscripts, I kept thinking of more things I wanted to say

If "making a vote on a wagon you don't actually want to happen" isn't insincere I don't know what is

[Robz888]

Either way I think we should be looking to get an exile early, or at least earlier than we were getting them in the games we were playing before my last absence.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

I agree 100% we have enough old guard people around let’s try a soft deadline. Remember those.

July 2nd at 11pm is 12 hours before deadline. Let’s treat that as deadline for all intents and purposes.

That's cutting it way too close! I miss the era of a bajillion posts flying in all the time as much as anyone, but sadly we are not there anymore.

I think we should try to exile by like Monday.

[Robz888]

(And anyone who works against this is scum!)

[A Drowned Kernel]

Either way I think we should be looking to get an exile early, or at least earlier than we were getting them in the games we were playing before my last absence.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

I agree 100% we have enough old guard people around let’s try a soft deadline. Remember those.

July 2nd at 11pm is 12 hours before deadline. Let’s treat that as deadline for all intents and purposes.

That's cutting it way too close! I miss the era of a bajillion posts flying in all the time as much as anyone, but sadly we are not there anymore.

I think we should try to exile by like Monday.

Join me on your brother, let's see how quickly we can make this happen

[2.71828.....]

(And anyone who works against this is scum!)

Anakin Skywalker: If you're not with me, then you're my enemy.
Obi-Wan Kenobi: [realizing that Anakin is consumed by evil and there's no reasoning with him anymore] Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

Yup, and everyone opposed to the plan is scum. Out yourselves, scum.

vote: robz

[MiX]

I am now against outing the Doctor, as I learned it's an ash!plan.

[Robz888]

Omg that is beautiful. Wow. 7 years ago I staked out the exact same position, and applied the same militancy! This is a good argument for thinking I am mafia, actually.

[Robz888]

Seriously, Vote: Robz

[A Drowned Kernel]

I am now against outing the Doctor, as I learned it's an ash!plan.

I mean if anyone makes a plan that's genuinely good for town, as scum, it's ash

(It's not a good plan though)

[A Drowned Kernel]

Seriously, Vote: Robz

Man, don't be like that

[mcmcsalot]

Seriously, Vote: Robz

I really don’t want to exile you day one but come on man you know this isn’t good.

Vote: robz

[Robz888]

Oh everyone calm down I’m not being seriously.

Which mcmc should know, really.

Vote: mcmcsalot for false concern

[yuma]

Didn't mail-mi mod a version of this game a long, long time ago. I think town lost. Maybe? Who knows. So maybe his insight is from that.

Regardless any discussion about planning out a claim is ultimately fruitless as the only person that gets to decide is the doctor. Maybe people can give advice, but being in favor or against a plan is weird. We, as a whole, don't get to decide what the doctor does. Only the doctor gets to. Your opinion only matters as far as the doctor. And they probably already know what they are going to do.

But.... it does get the game moving. And reactions are something? I guess.

[MiX]

Hi town!yuma! Who's scum so I can townread them?

[yuma]

My second favourite brother pair is back!

Vote: mcmc, I miss you slightly more.

Hey yuma, ready to redeem yourself? You haven't lynched scum willingly yet since your revival

False! I willingly lynched Joseph! I just happened to know he was scum at the time, so I guess that doesn't count.

But I am ready to redeem myself!

[yuma]

Hi town!yuma! Who's scum so I can townread them?

At this point everyone is scum. We should exile them...

man.... remembering that is going to be hard. But I think I can do it.

[MiX]

My second favourite brother pair is back!

Vote: mcmc, I miss you slightly more.

Hey yuma, ready to redeem yourself? You haven't lynched scum willingly yet since your revival

False! I willingly lynched Joseph! I just happened to know he was scum at the time, so I guess that doesn't count.

But I am ready to redeem myself!

Ah, I didn't know that. That'll help me read you.

Hi town!yuma! Who's scum so I can townread them?

At this point everyone is scum. We should exile them...

man.... remembering that is going to be hard. But I think I can do it.

I know right? I think it's possible to never screw it up.

[yuma]

Either way I think we should be looking to get an exile early, or at least earlier than we were getting them in the games we were playing before my last absence.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

I agree 100% we have enough old guard people around let’s try a soft deadline. Remember those.

July 2nd at 11pm is 12 hours before deadline. Let’s treat that as deadline for all intents and purposes.

Soft deadlines are hard. They went away for a reason. They just end up punishing people that have real life stuff and were generally more enforced by scum pretending their were being helpful town, but just steered into misexile.

At least that is my memory? I haven't really looked at the data of the games that used them (probably not enough to be very significant), but I felt like it more often led to misexiles and was how I used it as scum.

[Dylan32]

Vote Count 1.1

mcmcsalot (3): jothenonah, A Drowned Kernel, Robz888
Robz888 (3): scolapasta, 2.71828....., mcmcsalot
scolapasta (1): MiX
Not Voting (6): Galzria, Swowl, shraeye, WestCoastDidds, yuma, mail-mi

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

[yuma]

(And anyone who works against this is scum!)

Anakin Skywalker: If you're not with me, then you're my enemy.
Obi-Wan Kenobi: [realizing that Anakin is consumed by evil and there's no reasoning with him anymore] Only a Sith deals in absolutes.

Yup, and everyone opposed to the plan is scum. Out yourselves, scum.

vote: robz

I am against lynching 2.7 until at least Day 3.

Wipes tears away!

[yuma]

Also.... hello old friends.

[yuma]

vote: joth

[WestCoastDidds]

Hi hi hi hi!

I’m sorry I’m so late to the party! Especially since I have missed you all so much!

Mcmc.....hi, friend! Congratulations on the new arrival. I’m so happy for you! And I’m glad you’re back!!

Mix and Swowl, I specifically joined this game because being in NO games together is just wrong. Same with Joth. Bereft! I was bereft!

Yams, scola, ADK, galzy, Yuma....hi! I hope that you are all doing well! (Yams is a nickname for mail-mi. I use it often)

Shraeye! It’s been a minute. I hope the semester ended well. Is there time in the summer for math?

Robs, I hardly know you, buy as one of the OGs you just be made of awesome. So, hi!

[WestCoastDidds]

And as for the wisdom of the doc claiming or not claiming...y’all are funny thinking you can get the doc to do anything at all unless s/he wants to. One thing I have learned about this game is that we never agree on a plan and thus the plan never happens.

[MiX]

s/he/adk

Also Didds' right, although that's why I'm against the plan.

[WestCoastDidds]

s/he/ADK

Good catch! I’ll do better.

[Swowl]

Hey All!

Apologizing ahead of schedule for messing up exile/lynch.

Galz and me kinda spotty today and tomorrow, just a heads up.

Also without a doubt have to Vote: Robz

[shraeye]

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It's not pro-town, AND not necessarily something a town would do more than scum.  Or vice versa.  It's the way every game starts, with an overwrought, not helpful in any way discussion about setup.  No thanks.

Didn't mail-mi mod a version of this game a long, long time ago. I think town lost. Maybe? Who knows. So maybe his insight is from that.

Regardless any discussion about planning out a claim is ultimately fruitless as the only person that gets to decide is the doctor. Maybe people can give advice, but being in favor or against a plan is weird. We, as a whole, don't get to decide what the doctor does. Only the doctor gets to. Your opinion only matters as far as the doctor. And they probably already know what they are going to do.

But.... it does get the game moving. And reactions are something? I guess.

This is exactly it.  Except more cynicism over whether it's useful at all.

[shraeye]

what I'm concerned with is the sincerity of your vote and unvote, which to me looks like faked activity

pssshaaaw; "that looks like faked activity" is lame.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

First good point, great!

Let’s treat that as deadline for all intents and purposes.

For all intensive purposes as well!


Vote: Swowl

[yuma]

vote: swowl!!!

[Galzria]

Heads up y’all: As per the VLA thread Swowl and I are generally out until probably Monday. Might have a little time while at the cabin, but not much.

[Galzria]

Hey All!

Apologizing ahead of schedule for messing up exile/lynch.

Galz and me kinda spotty today and tomorrow, just a heads up.

Also without a doubt have to Vote: Robz

Lol hadn’t seen this post. This.

[Galzria]

MiX, why should I believe that you’re not scum this game?

[2.71828.....]

Seriously, Vote: Robz

Are we all trying to embrace our inner ashersky since he isn't playing?

[2.71828.....]

I call all hammers

#hammerstats

[2.71828.....]

MiX, why should I believe that you’re not scum this game?

Such accusations. MiX is clearly always scummy, yet never scum. Or clearly townie, and then scum. His alignment will be revealed to all in due time

Vote: Galzria

[MiX]

MiX, why should I believe that you’re not scum this game?

Can't you read me without asking this specific question? I'm running out of clever ways to answer it.

I'm not scum this game because I got a town QT. You'll believe it when you read me correctly.

[WestCoastDidds]

Good morning!

I’m super envious of the Swozria Tahoe trip. The lack of ability to go to fun places has been tough. We’re playing board games today with debatepro’s bestie, who is our only regular guest. I think it’s gonna be Scythe, but maybe Carnival of Monsters.

Right now, scola is at the top of my exile list. Feels like it might be a scummy start for him.

For my askersky ability, I’ll claim shameless appeal to emotion. Oh, wait....

[mcmcsalot]

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

[mcmcsalot]

I call all hammers

#hammerstats

This is scummy

[mcmcsalot]

Also.... hello old friends.

Hiiiiiiii Yuma is back woooooo! You scum?

[mcmcsalot]

what I'm concerned with is the sincerity of your vote and unvote, which to me looks like faked activity

pssshaaaw; "that looks like faked activity" is lame.

Voting is good and wagons are pro-town.


Vote: Swowl

First good point, great!

Let’s treat that as deadline for all intents and purposes.

For all intensive purposes as well!


Vote: Swowl

Isn’t the idiom correctly “for all intents and purposes” and for all intensive purposes is nonsense babble?

Also why the Swowl vote?

[WestCoastDidds]

Yep, it’s all intents and purposes. Shraeye was being funny-ish.

[mail-mi]

Super busy today. Will get on if I can.

[WestCoastDidds]

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

[shraeye]

I call all hammers

#hammerstats

This is scummy

No, that's e

[shraeye]

Yep, it’s all intents and purposes. Shraeye was being funny-ish.

I resent that ish.  I'm funny all the way

[Robz888]

Oh I just realized who swowl is!

[scolapasta]

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

[yuma]

Also.... hello old friends.

Hiiiiiiii Yuma is back woooooo! You scum?

It has been a minute... No. Not the scum this time.

[yuma]

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

[MiX]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

[WestCoastDidds]

Oh I just realized who swowl is!

Ha!  Oh, yeah...we forgot to tell you.  DatSwan is now Swowl. Way more owly, way less datty

[MiX]

Oh I just realized who swowl is!

Ha!  Oh, yeah...we forgot to tell you.  DatSwan is now Swowl. Way more owly, way less datty

Same amount of going backwards and then forwards.

[WestCoastDidds]

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

The weekend is a fair point, and why I am not actually voting on my feelings yet. I'm just used to getting to say hey and see whats up by now.

[WestCoastDidds]

Oh I just realized who swowl is!

Ha!  Oh, yeah...we forgot to tell you.  DatSwan is now Swowl. Way more owly, way less datty

Same amount of going backwards and then forwards.

#Truth

[WestCoastDidds]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

She's not.  Yuma is overreacting, but yuma is the most low-key scum player I know so it means he's probably town.

[WestCoastDidds]

Yep, it’s all intents and purposes. Shraeye was being funny-ish.

I resent that ish.  I'm funny all the way

Uh huh

[A Drowned Kernel]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

Didds is scummy because it's early day one and she's actually scumhunting

vote: didds

[WestCoastDidds]

I was late! I was trying to catch up! I’m usually early so feel no compunction whatsoever about chatting everyone up.

Like, how are the animals? And how are you?

[shraeye]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

She's not.  Yuma is overreacting, but yuma is the most low-key scum player I know so it means he's probably town.

Overreacting to what??

[A Drowned Kernel]

I was late! I was trying to catch up! I’m usually early so feel no compunction whatsoever about chatting everyone up.

Like, how are the animals? And how are you?

Good and good

But I still think you're being unusually attentive to the particular if people's play for how early in the game it is so my vote stands

[yuma]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?
[/quotes]
She isn't. But I also dont think I am over reacting.

[yuma]

Blah

[Robz888]

Does no one els think mcmc's actions thus far are somewhat and surprisingly scummy?

[yuma]

Hmm. No?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Does no one els think mcmc's actions thus far are somewhat and surprisingly scummy?

I don't know if this is directed at me, but yes (though I'm not sure I'd say "surprisingly")

[Swowl]

Oh I just realized who swowl is!

Ha!  Oh, yeah...we forgot to tell you.  DatSwan is now Swowl. Way more owly, way less datty

Same amount of going backwards and then forwards.

Better than forwards then backwards?

[WestCoastDidds]

You do the hokey pokey and you turn yourself around! That’s what it’s all about!

[2.71828.....]

I feel like mcmc had the usual level of non-committal D1 posts they always have

[2.71828.....]

*has

Also, more people should vote for Galzria.

[2.71828.....]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

Didds is scummy because it's early day one and she's actually scumhunting

vote: didds

Also, I was just thinking that. More specifically how she called someone scummy for not being super chatty in the first 24 hours of the game

Vote: WCD

[2.71828.....]

*has

Also, more people should vote for Galzria.

Scratch that, vote for Didds.

Wagons!

[Swowl]

I feel like mcmc had the usual level of non-committal D1 posts they always have

I do not yet have an opinion on anyone per-say - but that is the exact opposite as I remember MCMC (as in, I disagree with this post).

[2.71828.....]

I feel like mcmc had the usual level of non-committal D1 posts they always have

I do not yet have an opinion on anyone per-say - but that is the exact opposite as I remember MCMC (as in, I disagree with this post).

Maybe I am conflating mcmc with someone else. Totally possible

[MiX]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

Didds is scummy because it's early day one and she's actually scumhunting

vote: didds

Also, I was just thinking that. More specifically how she called someone scummy for not being super chatty in the first 24 hours of the game

Vote: WCD

Is everyone scola's partner?

[WestCoastDidds]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

[mcmcsalot]

I feel like mcmc had the usual level of non-committal D1 posts they always have

I do not yet have an opinion on anyone per-say - but that is the exact opposite as I remember MCMC (as in, I disagree with this post).

Interesting that I do not think I have had a bunch of non commit all posts, but I also think i do not usually have non commit all posts day one as either alignment. I am usually pretty tunnely as both alignments.

On the subject of tunneling I still think ADK is scummy. Vote: ADK

I don’t understand the Didds wagon at all but I never find didds scummy.

[mcmcsalot]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

Why are the votes on you terrible?

[shraeye]

I feel like mcmc had the usual level of non-committal D1 posts they always have

I do not yet have an opinion on anyone per-say - but that is the exact opposite as I remember MCMC (as in, I disagree with this post).

I'm not sure which part you are disagreeing with, but I disagree with everything e wrote.

I dont think mcmc has, in general, noncommittal D1 posts, and I don't think he has them in this game specifically either.

[shraeye]

Vote: e

[jotheonah]

Does no one els think mcmc's actions thus far are somewhat and surprisingly scummy?

I do, hence the vote

[scolapasta]

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

Didds is scummy because it's early day one and she's actually scumhunting

vote: didds

Also, I was just thinking that. More specifically how she called someone scummy for not being super chatty in the first 24 hours of the game

Vote: WCD

Is everyone scola's partner?

Everyone who's town is my partner.

[scolapasta]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

While I am a lot of things, I disagree that I am everything (nor that it would be obvious).

[LaLight]

Vote Count 1.2

mcmcsalot (2): jotheonah, Robz888
Robz888 (2): scolapasta, Swowl
scolapasta (1): MiX
WestCoastDidds (3): yuma, A Drowned Kernel, 2.71828.....
A Drowned Kernel (1): mcmcsalot
2.71828..... (1): shraeye

Not Voting (3): Galzria, WestCoastDidds, mail-mi

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

[Robz888]

What did Didds do?

[Robz888]

I feel like mcmc had the usual level of non-committal D1 posts they always have

I do not yet have an opinion on anyone per-say - but that is the exact opposite as I remember MCMC (as in, I disagree with this post).

Maybe I am conflating mcmc with someone else. Totally possible

I don't think this describes mcmc very well.

[MiX]

What did Didds do?

Voted scum. The horror!

Wait, no, I think she just scumread scola really early into the game for real reasons and people think town!Didds can't do that. They're wrong by the way.

[Robz888]

Why did 2.7 call on us all to vote for Galz—a weird demand anyway, Galz hasn't done anything scum—and then immediately vote for someone else? This isn't logical behavior.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Why did 2.7 call on us all to vote for Galz—a weird demand anyway, Galz hasn't done anything scum—and then immediately vote for someone else? This isn't logical behavior.

Do you expect town!e to be more logical than scum!e?

[MiX]

Why did 2.7 call on us all to vote for Galz—a weird demand anyway, Galz hasn't done anything scum—and then immediately vote for someone else? This isn't logical behavior.

Do you expect town!e to be more logical than scum!e?

Where did Robz say this!e was scum!e?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Why did 2.7 call on us all to vote for Galz—a weird demand anyway, Galz hasn't done anything scum—and then immediately vote for someone else? This isn't logical behavior.

Do you expect town!e to be more logical than scum!e?

Where did Robz say this!e was scum!e?

I'm assuming here's not just asking the question for curiosity's sake

[A Drowned Kernel]

He's*

[MiX]

He's*

Right, but it doesn't assume e's scum because of it. He's just asking e a question.

It feels like you want to lead him into scumreading e so you can say his read is misplaced.

[shraeye]

He's*

Right, but it doesn't assume e's scum because of it. He's just asking e a question.

It feels like you want to lead him into scumreading e so you can say his read is misplaced.

He's not asking E a question.  He asked the question to the room.  Robz's question is 75% more leading than ADK's

[WestCoastDidds]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

Why are the votes on you terrible?

All of them are based on the fact that I must be scum because I have a legitimate reason for my vote instead of just banter

[A Drowned Kernel]

He's*

Right, but it doesn't assume e's scum because of it. He's just asking e a question.

It feels like you want to lead him into scumreading e so you can say his read is misplaced.

We're playing a game of mafia, commenting on something odd a player is doing carries an implication of "this thing might be scummy". I would rather he gave an opinion on the matter than polling the crowd

[WestCoastDidds]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

While I am a lot of things, I disagree that I am everything (nor that it would be obvious).

Ah, sorry...left out a pronoun. The term Before Time is everything. Because it is. Obviously.

[yuma]

Vote: e

No!

[yuma]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

Why are the votes on you terrible?

All of them are based on the fact that I must be scum because I have a legitimate reason for my vote instead of just banter

All of them?

[jotheonah]

I want to just acknowledge that I'm a lot less active than normal this day 1. That's down to unexpected RL business as well as the general "hard time getting into day 1" stuff. But I am following along.

[MiX]

I want to just acknowledge that I'm a lot less active than normal this day 1. That's down to unexpected RL business as well as the general "hard time getting into day 1" stuff. But I am following along.

Oh you're not trying to be town, that means you're town.

[mcmcsalot]

He's*

Right, but it doesn't assume e's scum because of it. He's just asking e a question.

It feels like you want to lead him into scumreading e so you can say his read is misplaced.

I completely agree with this. MiX you should join me in voting ADK hes been scummy.

[MiX]

He's*

Right, but it doesn't assume e's scum because of it. He's just asking e a question.

It feels like you want to lead him into scumreading e so you can say his read is misplaced.

I completely agree with this. MiX you should join me in voting ADK hes been scummy.

But I don't wanna exile ADK...

[2.71828.....]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

[2.71828.....]

But actually.

vote: Didds

[scolapasta]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

While I am a lot of things, I disagree that I am everything (nor that it would be obvious).

Ah, sorry...left out a pronoun. The term Before Time is everything. Because it is. Obviously.

Yes, obviously. I miss the Before Times. Sort of related, one of my favorite restaurants is closing down - getting one last takeput meal tonight, though 1/2 the menu is also out of stock.

I'm still happy with my Robz vote, though may consider didds. or MiX (always)

[Robz888]

Why did 2.7 call on us all to vote for Galz—a weird demand anyway, Galz hasn't done anything scum—and then immediately vote for someone else? This isn't logical behavior.

Do you expect town!e to be more logical than scum!e?

I suppose that's a valid question. Dunno.

[A Drowned Kernel]

or MiX (always)

See, this is scummy

vote: scola

[WestCoastDidds]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

And scola should be talking more. He totally introduced Before Time into my lexicon and is obviously everything.

Why are the votes on you terrible?

All of them are based on the fact that I must be scum because I have a legitimate reason for my vote instead of just banter

All of them?

Well, you tell me... I don't see how any of these are different in substance from one another.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

Didds is scummy because it's early day one and she's actually scumhunting

vote: didds

I do have to admit, this is town!scola, although that says nothing about whether he's town or not.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

Ha! I'm pretty sure I'm rarely engaged D1 (especially when intersecting with weekends)

That is what I thought too, vote: West

Why is Didds scummy?

Didds is scummy because it's early day one and she's actually scumhunting

vote: didds

Also, I was just thinking that. More specifically how she called someone scummy for not being super chatty in the first 24 hours of the game

Vote: WCD

[yuma]

Hm. My vote was because I felt your justification was fabricrated. Not just voting you for scum hunting. That isn't a reason to vote for someone.

[yuma]

Asks is kinda that. Mine and 2.7 less so.

[WestCoastDidds]

Hm. My vote was because I felt your justification was fabricrated. Not just voting you for scum hunting. That isn't a reason to vote for someone.

I fabricated that I found him less engaging than I normally do? Uhm...okay. That seems like far more of a fabrication than anything I said.

[yuma]

Fabricated is the wrong word. I thought it was a false reason and see a chance that it was fabricated if you are scum.

[Galzria]

Just got home from the trip. Going to read the entire thread tonight, but content won’t come until tomorrow, sorry.

[Swowl]

Just got home from the trip. Going to read the entire thread tonight, but content won’t come until tomorrow, sorry.

ditto. miight get to some of it tonight, but just got back.

[shraeye]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

I feel like this is always your defense. Why should I believe this iteration?

[WestCoastDidds]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

I feel like this is always your defense. Why should I believe this iteration?

I dunno. I don’t know that you ever don’t think I’m scum, so it’s always hard to overcome your suspicion even though it’s almost always incorrectly placed.

This has been a particularly aggravating start, though, because my impression of Scola was genuine and getting blasted for it is somewhat less than awesome.

[mail-mi]

Vote Count 1.1

mcmcsalot (3): jothenonah, A Drowned Kernel, Robz888
Robz888 (3): scolapasta, 2.71828....., mcmcsalot
scolapasta (1): MiX
Not Voting (6): Galzria, Swowl, shraeye, WestCoastDidds, yuma, mail-mi

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

  My no-exile vote isn't appearing in any vote counts.

Here, gonna reread the thread and see what's up.

[mail-mi]

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It's not pro-town, AND not necessarily something a town would do more than scum.  Or vice versa.  It's the way every game starts, with an overwrought, not helpful in any way discussion about setup.  No thanks.

It was pro-town, otherwise I would not have said it. It's at least a way to start the game rather than RVS, which admittedly still happened but was much less than usual.

[mail-mi]

I could see myself joining the Didds wagon. After people called her out for it, she started playing her meta more. Scumhunting early in D1 is a good thing, but playing up your meta after people call you out for it is scummy.

[mail-mi]

He's*

Right, but it doesn't assume e's scum because of it. He's just asking e a question.

It feels like you want to lead him into scumreading e so you can say his read is misplaced.

We're playing a game of mafia, commenting on something odd a player is doing carries an implication of "this thing might be scummy". I would rather he gave an opinion on the matter than polling the crowd

I agree with this first sentence. I disagree with the second sentence, though. I've had plenty of times where I want to know what the crowd thinks before saying what I think; or I haven't figured out what to think and I want some other opinions on it first.

[mail-mi]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

why are you extending RVS when we are way past that?

vote: 2.7 on principle.

[MiX]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

why are you extending RVS when we are way past that?

vote: 2.7 on principle.

Terrible vote. Guess you're town then.

Scola is still scum btw. He just might be town.

The Didds wagon is decent, but I think it's anti-town. I don't think this will exile scum!Didds.

[scolapasta]

or MiX (always)

See, this is scummy

vote: scola

Based on all past games I've had with MiX, this is definitely not scummy.

[scolapasta]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

I feel like this is always your defense. Why should I believe this iteration?

I dunno. I don’t know that you ever don’t think I’m scum, so it’s always hard to overcome your suspicion even though it’s almost always incorrectly placed.

This has been a particularly aggravating start, though, because my impression of Scola was genuine and getting blasted for it is somewhat less than awesome.

It feels like you're trying to hard to convice us that it was genuine, when I think you're the one who has previously even pointed out that I some weekends I can be nearly absent. i.e. if it were true, sure it could be genuine, but I don't necessarily follow were you would think it were true - I think that's why others have called it a possible fabrication.

[MiX]

or MiX (always)

See, this is scummy

vote: scola

Based on all past games I've had with MiX, this is definitely not scummy.

I'm always on the table, right?

Debatepro come back I miss you

PPE: hey why did you vote Robz?

[2.71828.....]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

why are you extending RVS when we are way past that?

vote: 2.7 on principle.

Vote: mail-mi

My next post literally negated my silly vote + voting on principle is scummy

[mail-mi]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

why are you extending RVS when we are way past that?

vote: 2.7 on principle.

Vote: mail-mi

My next post literally negated my silly vote + voting on principle is scummy

I am aware of your next post. however, you still dipped into RVS which is scummy.

[WestCoastDidds]

Ugh, y’all, quit it. Those are terrible votes and you know it.

I feel like this is always your defense. Why should I believe this iteration?

I dunno. I don’t know that you ever don’t think I’m scum, so it’s always hard to overcome your suspicion even though it’s almost always incorrectly placed.

This has been a particularly aggravating start, though, because my impression of Scola was genuine and getting blasted for it is somewhat less than awesome.

It feels like you're trying to hard to convice us that it was genuine, when I think you're the one who has previously even pointed out that I some weekends I can be nearly absent. i.e. if it were true, sure it could be genuine, but I don't necessarily follow were you would think it were true - I think that's why others have called it a possible fabrication.

I am not trying to convince anyone of my authenticity. Believe me or don’t, there is zero that I can do about that. I can answer arguments or assertions, but that’s not about if what I say about what I feel is real.

It is. I am.

So here is what I said:

Right now, scola is at the top of my exile list. Feels like it might be a scummy start for him.

What about scola’s start feels scummy to you?

He’s usually more chatty and engaged. This has been way more slow roll, low-key than I’m used to from town Scola

I don’t vote for you, or encourage other people to vote for you. I said this was how it seemed to me. Up until this point you had two rather terse one or two line posts.

I’m getting a bit tilted by this discussion so I’m going to stop now. If sharing my impressions is scummy, exile me. I’m over it.

[WestCoastDidds]

or MiX (always)

See, this is scummy

vote: scola

Based on all past games I've had with MiX, this is definitely not scummy.

I'm always on the table, right?

Debatepro come back I miss you

PPE: hey why did you vote Robz?

Hahahahahah....there’s a reason he doesn’t play with us! It’s no fun being the D1 missile. But I’ll convey your well wishes.

[yuma]

vote: robz

[Dylan32]

Sorry, there should be one vote for no exile. For some reason I thought the vote had been moved prior to the vote count. It will be fixed shortly.

[Dylan32]

Sorry, there should be one vote for no exile. For some reason I thought the vote had been moved prior to the vote count. It will be fixed shortly.

should have been*

[Dylan32]

Vote Count 1.3

mcmcsalot (2): jotheonah, Robz888
Robz888 (3): scolapasta, Swowl, yuma
scolapasta (2): MiX, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (1): mcmcsalot
2.71828..... (2): shraeye, mail-mi
mail-mi (1): 2.71828.....

Not Voting (2): Galzria, WestCoastDidds

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

[Swowl]

OK almost caught up.
Just gonna remove my RVS vote for now. Will finish up this afternoon and get some thoughts out.

Unvote

[jotheonah]

Vote Count 1.3

mcmcsalot (2): jotheonah, Robz888
Robz888 (3): scolapasta, Swowl, yuma
scolapasta (2): MiX, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (1): mcmcsalot
2.71828..... (2): shraeye, mail-mi
mail-mi (1): 2.71828.....

Not Voting (2): Galzria, WestCoastDidds

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

Wait, no one is voting for Didds? All this hullaballoo and no votes?

[mail-mi]

Joth has a point. vote: wcd

[MiX]

You guys moved away from Didds on your own, how is it a reason to vote her?

[mail-mi]

You guys moved away from Didds on your own, how is it a reason to vote her?

I still think didds is scummy. Also my e vote was a policy vote.

[MiX]

You guys moved away from Didds on your own, how is it a reason to vote her?

I still think didds is scummy. Also my e vote was a policy vote.

Oh you were on her already I see.

[jotheonah]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

[MiX]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

Yep.

[mail-mi]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

[WestCoastDidds]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

[MiX]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Well, uh, you guys forced her. Early pushes on Didds are anti-town as it makes her defend herself.

Instead, what people should've done is take the opportunity and push scola to see if he cracks. Turns out he's just away so that won't work, but pushing Didds doesn't tell us anything either.

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

Who's scum?

[2.71828.....]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

Yeah, only un-friendly, cynical, calculating people are townie

[mail-mi]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

I was late! I was trying to catch up! I’m usually early so feel no compunction whatsoever about chatting everyone up.

Like, how are the animals? And how are you?

Specifically, this quote. "Oh no, they're reading me scummy, I better do something Didds! How are the animals?" is how I read that.

[mail-mi]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Well, uh, you guys forced her.

Not me!

[WestCoastDidds]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Well, uh, you guys forced her. Early pushes on Didds are anti-town as it makes her defend herself.

Instead, what people should've done is take the opportunity and push scola to see if he cracks. Turns out he's just away so that won't work, but pushing Didds doesn't tell us anything either.

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

Who's scum?

Scola, Yuma, and yams

[MiX]

Wow.

And you're the fourth one? I can accept that.

Which ones aren't your partners?

[mail-mi]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Well, uh, you guys forced her. Early pushes on Didds are anti-town as it makes her defend herself.

Instead, what people should've done is take the opportunity and push scola to see if he cracks. Turns out he's just away so that won't work, but pushing Didds doesn't tell us anything either.

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

Who's scum?

Scola, Yuma, and yams

Ah, so those who scumread you are scum?

[2.71828.....]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Well, uh, you guys forced her.

Not me!

No, you are the very picture of town

I feel another mail-mi mislynch driven by me coming on...

[mail-mi]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Well, uh, you guys forced her.

Not me!

No, you are the very picture of town

I feel another mail-mi mislynch driven by me coming on...

I'm saying I didn't force didds back into her chatty self, I only started scumreading her after she was "forced" back into her meta.

Wouldn't be a game of mafia without it. 

[MiX]

I feel another mail-mi mislynch driven by me coming on...

No don't, I will fight those until the bitter end. I saw the train wreck from a mile away...

[WestCoastDidds]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

I was late! I was trying to catch up! I’m usually early so feel no compunction whatsoever about chatting everyone up.

Like, how are the animals? And how are you?

Specifically, this quote. "Oh no, they're reading me scummy, I better do something Didds! How are the animals?" is how I read that.

Oh, yeah...that is so dramatically different than any of my other posts.

Like this hard edged entry

Hi hi hi hi!

I’m sorry I’m so late to the party! Especially since I have missed you all so much!

Mcmc.....hi, friend! Congratulations on the new arrival. I’m so happy for you! And I’m glad you’re back!!

Mix and Swowl, I specifically joined this game because being in NO games together is just wrong. Same with Joth. Bereft! I was bereft!

Yams, scola, ADK, galzy, Yuma....hi! I hope that you are all doing well! (Yams is a nickname for mail-mi. I use it often)

Shraeye! It’s been a minute. I hope the semester ended well. Is there time in the summer for math?

Robs, I hardly know you, buy as one of the OGs you just be made of awesome. So, hi!

Or this foot to the fire burner

Good morning!

I’m super envious of the Swozria Tahoe trip. The lack of ability to go to fun places has been tough. We’re playing board games today with debatepro’s bestie, who is our only regular guest. I think it’s gonna be Scythe, but maybe Carnival of Monsters.

Right now, scola is at the top of my exile list. Feels like it might be a scummy start for him.

For my askersky ability, I’ll claim shameless appeal to emotion. Oh, wait....

Perhaps my message to ADK about the animals is because I care about the freaking animals and about ADK, and I want to be friends with y’all and this is how I do it.

I have no idea why this game is so duderific, but I’m definitely having a hard time navigating it.

[mail-mi]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

I was late! I was trying to catch up! I’m usually early so feel no compunction whatsoever about chatting everyone up.

Like, how are the animals? And how are you?

Specifically, this quote. "Oh no, they're reading me scummy, I better do something Didds! How are the animals?" is how I read that.

Oh, yeah...that is so dramatically different than any of my other posts.

Like this hard edged entry

Hi hi hi hi!

I’m sorry I’m so late to the party! Especially since I have missed you all so much!

Mcmc.....hi, friend! Congratulations on the new arrival. I’m so happy for you! And I’m glad you’re back!!

Mix and Swowl, I specifically joined this game because being in NO games together is just wrong. Same with Joth. Bereft! I was bereft!

Yams, scola, ADK, galzy, Yuma....hi! I hope that you are all doing well! (Yams is a nickname for mail-mi. I use it often)

Shraeye! It’s been a minute. I hope the semester ended well. Is there time in the summer for math?

Robs, I hardly know you, buy as one of the OGs you just be made of awesome. So, hi!

Or this foot to the fire burner

Good morning!

I’m super envious of the Swozria Tahoe trip. The lack of ability to go to fun places has been tough. We’re playing board games today with debatepro’s bestie, who is our only regular guest. I think it’s gonna be Scythe, but maybe Carnival of Monsters.

Right now, scola is at the top of my exile list. Feels like it might be a scummy start for him.

For my askersky ability, I’ll claim shameless appeal to emotion. Oh, wait....

Perhaps my message to ADK about the animals is because I care about the freaking animals and about ADK, and I want to be friends with y’all and this is how I do it.

I have no idea why this game is so duderific, but I’m definitely having a hard time navigating it.

Both of those posts came before people started calling you out and voting for you.

[Robz888]

Vote Count 1.3

mcmcsalot (2): jotheonah, Robz888
Robz888 (3): scolapasta, Swowl, yuma
scolapasta (2): MiX, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (1): mcmcsalot
2.71828..... (2): shraeye, mail-mi
mail-mi (1): 2.71828.....

Not Voting (2): Galzria, WestCoastDidds

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

Wait, no one is voting for Didds? All this hullaballoo and no votes?

This also sticks out to me. Vote: Scolapasta for being a prime offender on this front.

[Robz888]

vote: robz

Why?

[MiX]

Both of those posts came before people started calling you out and voting for you.

Exactly, so Didds didn't "go back" to posting like this. She just...posts like this.

[mail-mi]

(P.S. Didds, I love how friendly you are and I don't want the chatty fun to stop, btw.    Just think this particular instance is scummy in the context of this game)

[mail-mi]

Both of those posts came before people started calling you out and voting for you.

Exactly, so Didds didn't "go back" to posting like this. She just...posts like this.

What's getting me is the "Like," part of the post, which immediately follows the "I'm sorry I was scumhunting!" part of the post.

[mail-mi]

Both of those posts came before people started calling you out and voting for you.

Exactly, so Didds didn't "go back" to posting like this. She just...posts like this.

What's getting me is the "Like," part of the post, which immediately follows the "I'm sorry I was scumhunting!" part of the post.

Like she's saying "See! I'm still myself, look at this question I'm asking ADK!"

[MiX]

Both of those posts came before people started calling you out and voting for you.

Exactly, so Didds didn't "go back" to posting like this. She just...posts like this.

What's getting me is the "Like," part of the post, which immediately follows the "I'm sorry I was scumhunting!" part of the post.

Like she's saying "See! I'm still myself, look at this question I'm asking ADK!"

She is saying that. There's no...deceit. She went back to it because she was thinking about things she would do if she had time to, and thus that gave her time to think of that question, so she asked it.

I can't really see how this has to be scummy thinking.

[scolapasta]

Wait, no one is voting for Didds? All this hullaballoo and no votes?

This also sticks out to me. Vote: Scolapasta for being a prime offender on this front.

All I did was not understand were didd's vote on me came from (as I didn't agree with the reasoning). I think it leads me to suspect her, but not so much that I'm ready to vote for her.

I do feel like her reaction is more defensive than I've seen in the past. But that might just be because she feels more pushed. Or Covid times are just making everyone a little stir crazy.

Still happy with my Robz vote.

[MiX]

I was late! I was trying to catch up! I’m usually early so feel no compunction whatsoever about chatting everyone up.

Like, how are the animals? And how are you?

"I was more urgent than normal! I usually have time to think of stuff to chat about, like, how are the animals ADK?"

That's how I interpret that sentence.

[WestCoastDidds]

Ah, so those who scumread you are scum?

No, neither ADK nor e are on that list.

Scola is scum because I feel like he’s off. Yuma is scum based on the reasons for his votes, and you (and Scola) are scummy for beating a dead horse and trying to paint my interactions as forced, inauthentic, or deliberate...it’s taking up way too much space and distracting from anything important.

[A Drowned Kernel]

mail-mi is town

[MiX]

I would like to point out that 90% of the games Didds says I'm "off", I'm scum. That should be enough to vote scola, right?

mail-mi is town

Yes, but who's scum?

[mail-mi]

Ah, so those who scumread you are scum?

No, neither ADK nor e are on that list.

Scola is scum because I feel like he’s off. Yuma is scum based on the reasons for his votes, and you (and Scola) are scummy for beating a dead horse and trying to paint my interactions as forced, inauthentic, or deliberate...it’s taking up way too much space and distracting from anything important.

The horse isn't dead because you're not exiled yet.

But you do have a point, I should look at what other people are doing as well.

[WestCoastDidds]

(P.S. Didds, I love how friendly you are and I don't want the chatty fun to stop, btw.    Just think this particular instance is scummy in the context of this game)

Thanks, yams. And thanks, MiX. I appreciate y’all.

I wear my feelings on the outside (thus the defensiveness). I know it’s just a game and no one is trying to be mean.

[WestCoastDidds]

I would like to point out that 90% of the games Didds says I'm "off", I'm scum. That should be enough to vote scola, right?

This is a source of great pride for me.

Also, vote: Scola

[shraeye]

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It's not pro-town, AND not necessarily something a town would do more than scum.  Or vice versa.  It's the way every game starts, with an overwrought, not helpful in any way discussion about setup.  No thanks.

It was pro-town, otherwise I would not have said it. It's at least a way to start the game rather than RVS, which admittedly still happened but was much less than usual.

"It's pro-town because *I* said it" is so empty I can hear the air whooshing into the vacuum from here.

"At least it's something" is categorically not a defense to "it is not helpful"

[scolapasta]

Ah, so those who scumread you are scum?

No, neither ADK nor e are on that list.

Scola is scum because I feel like he’s off. Yuma is scum based on the reasons for his votes, and you (and Scola) are scummy for beating a dead horse and trying to paint my interactions as forced, inauthentic, or deliberate...it’s taking up way too much space and distracting from anything important.

Well this will end up being self fulfilling (since I'm responding) - but I just want back to confirm my posts. Go do it yourselves: how could those be read as "beating a dead horse". I mean sure, maybe you were more referring to mail-mi there, but you deliberately chose to add "and scola". It does feel like you're trying hard to push a scumapasta narrative one where none really exists.

Now does that paint you as scum? I don't know, just that it makes me want to keep on eye on you.

And claiming this is taking time from anything important? I don't get that either. These back and forth discussions seem to usually be at least somewhat useful is trying to read people.

That said, I am completely willing to move on from this specific interaction right now. Who else should we be looking at?

Didds, do you think Robz is scum?

ppe 4

[scolapasta]

Also, I now think MiX is likely town.

[mcmcsalot]

I think bringing up the potential of should the doctor claim or not is certainly pro town, it’s not necessarily towny because scum could do it as well. Sure it could be nefariously brought up to draw out reactions to find the doctor while looking towny but it doesn’t make the discussion itself anything other than pro-town.

It's not pro-town, AND not necessarily something a town would do more than scum.  Or vice versa.  It's the way every game starts, with an overwrought, not helpful in any way discussion about setup.  No thanks.

It was pro-town, otherwise I would not have said it. It's at least a way to start the game rather than RVS, which admittedly still happened but was much less than usual.

"It's pro-town because *I* said it" is so empty I can hear the air whooshing into the vacuum from here.

"At least it's something" is categorically not a defense to "it is not helpful"

While I disagree that it was not helpful I agree that mail-mi’s defense here of why it is helpful is pretty lame.

Also mail-mi has had a wild tunnel of wcd for what appears to be a pretty small and as E pointed out not very correct reason.

All that being said I’m not sure scum!mail-mi decides to do any of this. I think he crafts a better reason the opening post was helpful and I think he drops the weird wcd pressure when the votes dissapear. Also were in multi ball so scum is not looking to force exiles on players they no are town, they are trying to legitimately scumhunt so in this case I think this is mistaken town!mail-mi

[WestCoastDidds]

@scola- I’m not a very good person to ask about Robz. I’ve played in one game with him, and he exiled and then turned out to be an IC.

Mcmc is a better source! Or galzy.

[mcmcsalot]

I just reread scola and his posts read pretty scummy.

He only had 12 posts and has taken a lot of time to respond with a laugh or to non game specific content, he appears mostly to be trying to look towny and low key.

His robz vote came super early and he’s consistently re-affirmed it despite robz varying quite a bit in play and attitude and votes so far (meaning I find it hard to believe someone has had a singularly consistent read on him).

I have not played with scola before, he is coming across to me like newbie scum concerned mostly about looking towny.

Vote: scola

[Robz888]

Scolapasta is a good lunch.

[mail-mi]

Question for those who are scumreading Scola: how is this different than the scola we've seen in games past? He's been town in every game, and I'm not sure I see the difference.

[MiX]

Question for those who are scumreading Scola: how is this different than the scola we've seen in games past? He's been town in every game, and I'm not sure I see the difference.

Is scumhunting D1.

[Robz888]

Question for those who are scumreading Scola: how is this different than the scola we've seen in games past? He's been town in every game, and I'm not sure I see the difference.

Well I've never played with him before!

[Swowl]

Question for those who are scumreading Scola: how is this different than the scola we've seen in games past? He's been town in every game, and I'm not sure I see the difference.

Is scumhunting D1.

He is absolutely not playing as they always do. Still not sold on skum, but to say the same as always is a stretch.

[scolapasta]

Question for those who are scumreading Scola: how is this different than the scola we've seen in games past? He's been town in every game, and I'm not sure I see the difference.

Is scumhunting D1.

He is absolutely not playing as they always do. Still not sold on skum, but to say the same as always is a stretch.

I do legitimately find this surprising. I don't love D1s. I don't usually participate in RVS, so usually skip, but try to find some reason to favor voting someone over someone else. In this case it was Robz and how he was discussing the doctor claim, which I don't see much reason as that being prow town.

As always, I don't feel completely that strong, but I also don't see reason yet to switch votes. (if I find a better cause, or the vote goes dangerously up, I will, as always, reconsider)

[scolapasta]

That said, if you and Didds both seem to think I'm playing differently? Then maybe you're right, and I am (though not as scumapasta). which would lessen my reactions to Didds. I'm willing to consider that for sure.

[mail-mi]

scumapasta.

Love it.

[jotheonah]

I was  just thinking about how strongly I'm townreading Robz right now.

Then I realized it's been so long since I've been in a game with Robz, I forgot that I'm basically 100% to misread him.

So he's probably scum.

But I can't quite bring myself to vote for someone based on my strong townread of them.

[A Drowned Kernel]

I would like to point out that 90% of the games Didds says I'm "off", I'm scum. That should be enough to vote scola, right?

mail-mi is town

Yes, but who's scum?

Still working on that but scola doesn't seem like a bad bet

[Robz888]

I was  just thinking about how strongly I'm townreading Robz right now.

Then I realized it's been so long since I've been in a game with Robz, I forgot that I'm basically 100% to misread him.

So he's probably scum.

But I can't quite bring myself to vote for someone based on my strong townread of them.

If it makes you feel any better—any differently? anything at all?—that's basically how I feel about you too.

Notably, though, I am NOT particularly townreading my brother mcmc, which is also something I usually find myself doing on Day 1.

[mcmcsalot]

Question for those who are scumreading Scola: how is this different than the scola we've seen in games past? He's been town in every game, and I'm not sure I see the difference.

Is scumhunting D1.

He is absolutely not playing as they always do. Still not sold on skum, but to say the same as always is a stretch.

I do legitimately find this surprising. I don't love D1s. I don't usually participate in RVS, so usually skip, but try to find some reason to favor voting someone over someone else. In this case it was Robz and how he was discussing the doctor claim, which I don't see much reason as that being prow town.

As always, I don't feel completely that strong, but I also don't see reason yet to switch votes. (if I find a better cause, or the vote goes dangerously up, I will, as always, reconsider)

See this doesn’t check out to me. Robz didnt bring up the doctor claim, mail-mi did. ADK, myself, joth, and robz all weighed in with varying takes. ADK was against it (can always l-1 claim), I made some points for it (counterclaims and time limit), joth was neutral (setup isn’t the worst for it but scum might find a way to nk), robz was for it but smart to say if he was the doctor he wouldn’t claim now which doesn’t rule him out of potentially being the doctor which strong in favor of claiming followed by not claiming would otherwise do.

So I don’t see how you pick robz out of all that for the vote.

[scolapasta]

I'll have to go back and reread and see why specifically I preferred Robz back then. I know there was something. But again, it was vague, just enough to convince me enough for the initial vote.

I'll try to do that sometime tonight.

[yuma]

vote: robz

Why?

Not sure yet. Will let you know if it comes to that.

[Swowl]

mail-mi is town

IDK if you are town... but I agree with this statement.

[Swowl]

Scola how many games have you played with us now (ballpark)?

[Swowl]

MiX - what is your current take on WCD?

[MiX]

MiX - what is your current take on WCD?

Null, which is somewhat scummy I guess.

I don't think this push is giving anything alignment indicative.

[Swowl]

MiX - what is your current take on WCD?

Null, which is somewhat scummy I guess.

I don't think this push is giving anything alignment indicative.

weird. not the response I was expecting.
We agree on something.

Null is whatever. Fine. Do you think Skum rides that line on WCD early D1 to push a lynch?

[MiX]

MiX - what is your current take on WCD?

Null, which is somewhat scummy I guess.

I don't think this push is giving anything alignment indicative.

weird. not the response I was expecting.
We agree on something.

Null is whatever. Fine. Do you think Skum rides that line on WCD early D1 to push a lynch?

Scum does what they want, some people would push Didds, some wouldn't.

This entire thing told me one thing: mail-mi is town. That's about it. And Didds is slightly scummy, I guess.

I never wanna scumread Didds lol.

[Swowl]

MiX - what is your current take on WCD?

Null, which is somewhat scummy I guess.

I don't think this push is giving anything alignment indicative.

weird. not the response I was expecting.
We agree on something.

Null is whatever. Fine. Do you think Skum rides that line on WCD early D1 to push a lynch?

Scum does what they want, some people would push Didds, some wouldn't.

This entire thing told me one thing: mail-mi is town. That's about it. And Didds is slightly scummy, I guess.

I never wanna scumread Didds lol.

what about ADK?

[MiX]

Why ADK in particular?

Scummy, but I don't want to exile him. That's what I thought before at least.

[Swowl]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

why are you extending RVS when we are way past that?

vote: 2.7 on principle.

Vote: mail-mi

My next post literally negated my silly vote + voting on principle is scummy

I am aware of your next post. however, you still dipped into RVS which is scummy.

homie - you opened the game voting for "no exile" and then immediately backed out saying it was just to see if it would show up that way. That is about as "RVS-y" as it gets. I dunno if you get the privledge of having this opinion this game.

[Swowl]

Why ADK in particular?

early game stuff tied into some opinions you have on other players he is connected too.
nothing to be had from it really, I am just trying to get a grip on your scola point of view.

[mail-mi]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

why are you extending RVS when we are way past that?

vote: 2.7 on principle.

Vote: mail-mi

My next post literally negated my silly vote + voting on principle is scummy

I am aware of your next post. however, you still dipped into RVS which is scummy.

homie - you opened the game voting for "no exile" and then immediately backed out saying it was just to see if it would show up that way. That is about as "RVS-y" as it gets. I dunno if you get the privledge of having this opinion this game.

That was like the third post of the game, versus when we're about 8 pages in. Those two situations are only remotely similar.

[yuma]

If anyone is getting misrepresented here it is Scola. No vote from me there.

[yuma]

Strong townreads of mail-mi right now are suspect

[Swowl]

back to vote: Robz for playing Dominion better than me....

why are you extending RVS when we are way past that?

vote: 2.7 on principle.

Vote: mail-mi

My next post literally negated my silly vote + voting on principle is scummy

I am aware of your next post. however, you still dipped into RVS which is scummy.

homie - you opened the game voting for "no exile" and then immediately backed out saying it was just to see if it would show up that way. That is about as "RVS-y" as it gets. I dunno if you get the privledge of having this opinion this game.

That was like the third post of the game, versus when we're about 8 pages in. Those two situations are only remotely similar.

Every existing case in this game right now is 100% based on individual player styles... which is a stretch and half at a minimum as far as cases go. So, remotely similar isn’t something to scoff at.

[jotheonah]

I was  just thinking about how strongly I'm townreading Robz right now.

Then I realized it's been so long since I've been in a game with Robz, I forgot that I'm basically 100% to misread him.

So he's probably scum.

But I can't quite bring myself to vote for someone based on my strong townread of them.

If it makes you feel any better—any differently? anything at all?—that's basically how I feel about you too.

Notably, though, I am NOT particularly townreading my brother mcmc, which is also something I usually find myself doing on Day 1.

I weight that quite highly, perhaps because I also have a brother who plays here. Can you articulate why it is you’re not townreading mcmc?

[scolapasta]

I'll have to go back and reread and see why specifically I preferred Robz back then. I know there was something. But again, it was vague, just enough to convince me enough for the initial vote.

I'll try to do that sometime tonight.

Went back and reread - I also didn't like his post about wagons being protown - I'm really not sure why exactly, but that made me suspect him.

Rereading now, I do see that this is not really a good reason to stay on thus.

So I'll go ahead and

unvote

While I'm guessing this will garner more votes for me, you're looking in the wrong place. I just overcommitted early to Robz and that was a mistake (likely).

[WestCoastDidds]

MiX - what is your current take on WCD?

Null, which is somewhat scummy I guess.

I don't think this push is giving anything alignment indicative.

weird. not the response I was expecting.
We agree on something.

Null is whatever. Fine. Do you think Skum rides that line on WCD early D1 to push a lynch?

Scum does what they want, some people would push Didds, some wouldn't.

This entire thing told me one thing: mail-mi is town. That's about it. And Didds is slightly scummy, I guess.

I never wanna scumread Didds lol.

But you did such a great job explaining how I think and talk! We’re making such good progress!!

[Robz888]

If anyone is getting misrepresented here it is Scola. No vote from me there.

Oh hai I am scola's partner.

(That's my impression of you!)

[WestCoastDidds]

If anyone is getting misrepresented here it is Scola. No vote from me there.

Oh hai I am scola's partner.

(That's my impression of you!)

Right?!!

[WestCoastDidds]

Where’s Galzy??

[Robz888]

So there's like eight conversations going on and we're all over the place and we are well past the deadline where I would have liked to E-1 someone. Not good! Again, for everyone who hasn't played as much recently, the major problem I had been noticing before my last hiatus was just constant last minute exiles.

Perhaps what's happening here is characteristic of multiball where there various scum agendas, but it worries me. We should be actively consolidating our votes on one or two people. These people should be scola and I guess someone else. But let's make it happen!

[mcmcsalot]

If anyone is getting misrepresented here it is Scola. No vote from me there.

Oh hai I am scola's partner.

(That's my impression of you!)

Right?!!

Me as well. The first immediate thought that came to mind was “how partnery of you”.

[mcmcsalot]

A very towny series of posts from swowl.

[A Drowned Kernel]

So there's like eight conversations going on and we're all over the place and we are well past the deadline where I would have liked to E-1 someone. Not good! Again, for everyone who hasn't played as much recently, the major problem I had been noticing before my last hiatus was just constant last minute exiles.

Perhaps what's happening here is characteristic of multiball where there various scum agendas, but it worries me. We should be actively consolidating our votes on one or two people. These people should be scola and I guess someone else. But let's make it happen!

The lack of consolidation might be because none of the people getting attention right now are scum, which would mean that scum have no motivation to push anything in particular and can just let town bicker

So let's try a hard pivot and vote: shraeye

[Swowl]

pivoting

Vote: ADK

[yuma]

If anyone is getting misrepresented here it is Scola. No vote from me there.

Oh hai I am scola's partner.

(That's my impression of you!)

That is a lousy impression of me.

[yuma]

So there's like eight conversations going on and we're all over the place and we are well past the deadline where I would have liked to E-1 someone. Not good! Again, for everyone who hasn't played as much recently, the major problem I had been noticing before my last hiatus was just constant last minute exiles.

Perhaps what's happening here is characteristic of multiball where there various scum agendas, but it worries me. We should be actively consolidating our votes on one or two people. These people should be scola and I guess someone else. But let's make it happen!

Stop playing town leader!

Although I do agree with you!!!

Except for deadlines and requirements to have E-1. And some of us have been consolidating. And that there hasn't been consolidation. And that one of them should be scola.

So basically I agree with the principle, but everything else not as much.

Actually there is a pretty decent consolidation on Robz. Let's do that.

[yuma]

If anyone is getting misrepresented here it is Scola. No vote from me there.

Oh hai I am scola's partner.

(That's my impression of you!)

Right?!!

Me as well. The first immediate thought that came to mind was “how partnery of you”.

So just for clarity... pointing out what appears to be inconsistent representations of another member of town moving toward being exiled is something town shouldn't be doing?

Are we discouraging town from trying to avoid misexiles, especially based off evidence that is either bad or misrepresented? Cause that sounds like a chilling effect recipe of disaster.

[yuma]

pivoting

Vote: ADK

ADK over sharaeye.

I like pivots, just not pivots for pivots sake.

PIVOT!

[yuma]

I am very embarrassed.

[Swowl]

pivoting

Vote: ADK

ADK over sharaeye.

I like pivots, just not pivots for pivots sake.

PIVOT!

PIVOT!
but not for pivot's sake.
ADK just had 2 random people not voting for them say they thought he was skummy and an option and then tries to start a rando wagon on Shraeye.
I pivot towards skummy behavior on this one.

[yuma]

vote: ADK

[MiX]

I'm down.

Vote: ADK

But now I probably need to have a better reason to scumread ADK other than "feels like that last game they were scum".

[A Drowned Kernel]

pivoting

Vote: ADK

ADK over sharaeye.

I like pivots, just not pivots for pivots sake.

PIVOT!

PIVOT!
but not for pivot's sake.
ADK just had 2 random people not voting for them say they thought he was skummy and an option and then tries to start a rando wagon on Shraeye.
I pivot towards skummy behavior on this one.

Why would I do that as scum? If I was actually that worried about being lynched wouldn't I try to push an existing wagon?

[MiX]

Well no one's getting lynched this game, so you're not worried about that.

Besides, when are you exiled D1? Never, right?

[jotheonah]

Robz, you gonna answer my question?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Well no one's getting lynched this game, so you're not worried about that.

Besides, when are you exiled D1? Never, right?

First slip up, dang

I think the only time that I've been exiled day one is as scum, so it's not happening here

[WestCoastDidds]

I am very embarrassed.

Why’s that?

[scolapasta]

Yuma, I can actually see the case, however mistaken, against me.

Why are you so sure I'm town?

[Robz888]

I was  just thinking about how strongly I'm townreading Robz right now.

Then I realized it's been so long since I've been in a game with Robz, I forgot that I'm basically 100% to misread him.

So he's probably scum.

But I can't quite bring myself to vote for someone based on my strong townread of them.

If it makes you feel any better—any differently? anything at all?—that's basically how I feel about you too.

Notably, though, I am NOT particularly townreading my brother mcmc, which is also something I usually find myself doing on Day 1.

I weight that quite highly, perhaps because I also have a brother who plays here. Can you articulate why it is you’re not townreading mcmc?

Sorry, missed this.

Oh everyone calm down I’m not being seriously.

Which mcmc should know, really.

Vote: mcmcsalot for false concern

[Robz888]

Vote: ADK

[yuma]

I am very embarrassed.

Why’s that?

Quoting from friends

[yuma]

Yuma, I can actually see the case, however mistaken, against me.

Why are you so sure I'm town?

I am not. But I will speak up against cases that originate from deceit or falsehood.

[LaLight]

Vote Count 1.4

mcmcsalot (1): jotheonah
scolapasta (2): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot
A Drowned Kernel (4): Swowl, yuma, MiX, Robz888
2.71828..... (1): shraeye
mail-mi (1): 2.71828.....
WestCoastDidds (1): mail-mi
shraeye (1): A Drowned Kernel

Not Voting (2): Galzria, scolapasta

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

[Swowl]

pivoting

Vote: ADK

ADK over sharaeye.

I like pivots, just not pivots for pivots sake.

PIVOT!

PIVOT!
but not for pivot's sake.
ADK just had 2 random people not voting for them say they thought he was skummy and an option and then tries to start a rando wagon on Shraeye.
I pivot towards skummy behavior on this one.

Why would I do that as scum? If I was actually that worried about being lynched wouldn't I try to push an existing wagon?

idk... you don't like the other option/there really was only one other wagon and it was dying. and I think you were on it already?

[Swowl]

also why did you pick shraeye? what did they do?

[Swowl]

E! - you still hung up on MM? Is it just the doc claim bit?

[A Drowned Kernel]

also why did you pick shraeye? what did they do?

I couldn't remember anything he had said this game, which seemed telling

[jotheonah]

vote: scolapasta

Time to get on a wagon and the ADK one is growing too fast for my tastes.

[yuma]

vote: scolapasta

Time to get on a wagon and the ADK one is growing too fast for my tastes.

Wut?

Scummy scummy post

[jotheonah]

vote: scolapasta

Time to get on a wagon and the ADK one is growing too fast for my tastes.

Wut?

Scummy scummy post

How so?

[yuma]

vote: scolapasta

Time to get on a wagon and the ADK one is growing too fast for my tastes.

Wut?

Scummy scummy post

How so?

Picking between two wagons but providing a preference based on flimsy rationale. Why is quick growing bad here?

[jotheonah]

vote: scolapasta

Time to get on a wagon and the ADK one is growing too fast for my tastes.

Wut?

Scummy scummy post

How so?

Picking between two wagons but providing a preference based on flimsy rationale. Why is quick growing bad here?

Because nearly a third of the town is scum, and scum consists of two uncoordinated sets of two.

Normally, scum is careful not to pile on, but here they can pile on without knowing they're doing it.

[jotheonah]

Generally if a wagon just seems to come together quickly and easily, and it's not because it's based on a compelling case, it means the wagon's on town. When a wagon seems to stall out and can't seem to gain traction, that's on scum. Although the latter effect is weakened by the fact that each partner only has one partner who knows who they are, the former is strengthened by the fact that scum can pile on without knowing it.

[jotheonah]

Incidentally, I don't think scum are bussing their one partner today unless they're backed into it. 1, because they're vote is actually a useful weapon to knock out the rival team and a bus wastes it in that regard, and 2, because their team is too small to risk it.

[MiX]

Generally if a wagon just seems to come together quickly and easily, and it's not because it's based on a compelling case, it means the wagon's on town. When a wagon seems to stall out and can't seem to gain traction, that's on scum. Although the latter effect is weakened by the fact that each partner only has one partner who knows who they are, the former is strengthened by the fact that scum can pile on without knowing it.

How do you know ADK's wagon won't be stalled? If I move to scola right now, which is tempting, suddenly the roles are swapped. Does ADK become scummy then?

[jotheonah]

Generally if a wagon just seems to come together quickly and easily, and it's not because it's based on a compelling case, it means the wagon's on town. When a wagon seems to stall out and can't seem to gain traction, that's on scum. Although the latter effect is weakened by the fact that each partner only has one partner who knows who they are, the former is strengthened by the fact that scum can pile on without knowing it.

How do you know ADK's wagon won't be stalled? If I move to scola right now, which is tempting, suddenly the roles are swapped. Does ADK become scummy then?

I tend to weight things that are actually happening quite a bit higher than hypotheticals that MiX made up.

[MiX]

Generally if a wagon just seems to come together quickly and easily, and it's not because it's based on a compelling case, it means the wagon's on town. When a wagon seems to stall out and can't seem to gain traction, that's on scum. Although the latter effect is weakened by the fact that each partner only has one partner who knows who they are, the former is strengthened by the fact that scum can pile on without knowing it.

How do you know ADK's wagon won't be stalled? If I move to scola right now, which is tempting, suddenly the roles are swapped. Does ADK become scummy then?

I tend to weight things that are actually happening quite a bit higher than hypotheticals that MiX made up.

This response is pretty shitty, you know. I can't answer without going into AtE because you specifically call me out.

What I was trying to say is it hasn't been enough time to see if the ADK wagon picks up, so why assume they're town and that the other wagon's on scum?

[Robz888]

I'm also fine with scola. Vote: Scola

[jotheonah]

Generally if a wagon just seems to come together quickly and easily, and it's not because it's based on a compelling case, it means the wagon's on town. When a wagon seems to stall out and can't seem to gain traction, that's on scum. Although the latter effect is weakened by the fact that each partner only has one partner who knows who they are, the former is strengthened by the fact that scum can pile on without knowing it.

How do you know ADK's wagon won't be stalled? If I move to scola right now, which is tempting, suddenly the roles are swapped. Does ADK become scummy then?

I tend to weight things that are actually happening quite a bit higher than hypotheticals that MiX made up.

This response is pretty shitty, you know. I can't answer without going into AtE because you specifically call me out.

What I was trying to say is it hasn't been enough time to see if the ADK wagon picks up, so why assume they're town and that the other wagon's on scum?

Sorry -- not trying to be shitty. I'm not assuming ADK is town or that scola's scum. I am hesitant to pile onto the wagon that feels like it's building too fast. I do want to get on a wagon because we're getting pretty far into the game.

On the merits of the evidence, ADK and scola are both perfectly cromulent exiles, but neither one strikes me as especially more scummy than the other. So instead I looked to the dynamics of the wagon to make my decision. Those dynamics, because they're an emergent factor of everyone's activity, can be more telling sometimes than the behavior of individuals who are (if scum) being careful to regulate that very behavior.

[yuma]

I completely disagree with joth. But maybe that is more difference of opinion and not scummy now that I understand it. The post from him in isolation was though.

[mail-mi]

unvote WCD ain't happening.

I'll have to reread to see if I feel ADK or scola more, but I think I'm leaning toward ADK.

[jotheonah]

One problem with my approach is it's a variation on the "If X were scum, X's partner would be defending them. No one's defending X, therefore they must be town" argument.

And whenever one tries to make that argument, the inevitable response is "well, you're defending them by making that argument". So whoever points it out makes it cease to be true.

[MiX]

One problem with my approach is it's a variation on the "If X were scum, X's partner would be defending them. No one's defending X, therefore they must be town" argument.

And whenever one tries to make that argument, the inevitable response is "well, you're defending them by making that argument". So whoever points it out makes it cease to be true.

It's really not been enough time to see who defends ADK.

Besides that argument's pretty bad with small scumteams, as you're entirely depending on one person's reaction to a wagon.

[jotheonah]

So doctor should claim, yes? Creates an IC and some WIFOM cause if both scumteams kill them they don't actually die.

No, because we don't need an IC. We should definitely wait for claims at L-1, however.

I will also abstain from further setup talk.

MiX, what did you mean by "we don't need an IC"? We always need an IC.

[MiX]

(ongoing game)

Don't make me talk about setup.

[jotheonah]

Hi all.

vote: Robz888

I don't see nearly enough positive of Doctor revealing so early.

I actually do see scola's opening post as a bit scummy. I think this has all been covered but there's two things happening here.

1) Voting for someone because you disagree with their analysis of the setup is already kinda scummy just because it's easy and lazy.
2) It's weird that he picked Robz out of all the people who had come out in  favor of the claim plan, including mail-mi who suggested it in the first place.

But I'm not sure why 2 is scummy. If anything, it suggests scola was not reading the thread particularly closely, which is a town tell.

[jotheonah]

I had an interesting theory-crafting thought about this setup that it's not actually pro-town to discuss, but someone remind me when the game's over.

[jotheonah]

I don’t vote for you, or encourage other people to vote for you. I said this was how it seemed to me. Up until this point you had two rather terse one or two line posts.

I’m getting a bit tilted by this discussion so I’m going to stop now. If sharing my impressions is scummy, exile me. I’m over it.

Not to resurrect dead wagons, but this Didds post jumped out to me on re-read. I am just much much more likely to be tilted by a day 1 wagon as scum than as town. Is that just me? It really does feel like Didds reacted disproportionately to a small amount of early-game heat, and I think that's a scumtell for a particular kind of person -- a person who plays emotionally and wears her heart on her sleeve, like WCD.

If this were another player I might be accusing them of doing a fake AtE to get their wagon off them, but I don't really think that's Didds's style. Scum or town, I tend to assume her emotions are genuine.

[jotheonah]

Perhaps my message to ADK about the animals is because I care about the freaking animals and about ADK, and I want to be friends with y’all and this is how I do it.

I have no idea why this game is so duderific, but I’m definitely having a hard time navigating it.

This post, though, reads more like towny frustration.  Like Didds was frustrated not by the votes but by having her authenticity as a friendly person challenged. Which is just really on-brand. (And also I'm sorry Didds! Feel a little bad drudging this up and scrutinizing you this much. I love your friendly ways. Never change.)

[scolapasta]

I don’t vote for you, or encourage other people to vote for you. I said this was how it seemed to me. Up until this point you had two rather terse one or two line posts.

I’m getting a bit tilted by this discussion so I’m going to stop now. If sharing my impressions is scummy, exile me. I’m over it.

Not to resurrect dead wagons, but this Didds post jumped out to me on re-read. I am just much much more likely to be tilted by a day 1 wagon as scum than as town. Is that just me? It really does feel like Didds reacted disproportionately to a small amount of early-game heat, and I think that's a scumtell for a particular kind of person -- a person who plays emotionally and wears her heart on her sleeve, like WCD.

If this were another player I might be accusing them of doing a fake AtE to get their wagon off them, but I don't really think that's Didds's style. Scum or town, I tend to assume her emotions are genuine.

When I first read I was more focused on the first part and disagreeing with it. Not that I've reread my earlier, and can see where that's coming from, yeah, even so, the response seems disproportional.

Enough to start a didds wagon? Not sure. I can't i imagine I won't stay a wagon, starting a 3rd one seems antitown to me.

[jotheonah]

Starting a 3rd wagon is never anti-town if you find the existing ones dissatisfying.

[MiX]

I don’t vote for you, or encourage other people to vote for you. I said this was how it seemed to me. Up until this point you had two rather terse one or two line posts.

I’m getting a bit tilted by this discussion so I’m going to stop now. If sharing my impressions is scummy, exile me. I’m over it.

Not to resurrect dead wagons, but this Didds post jumped out to me on re-read. I am just much much more likely to be tilted by a day 1 wagon as scum than as town. Is that just me? It really does feel like Didds reacted disproportionately to a small amount of early-game heat, and I think that's a scumtell for a particular kind of person -- a person who plays emotionally and wears her heart on her sleeve, like WCD.

If this were another player I might be accusing them of doing a fake AtE to get their wagon off them, but I don't really think that's Didds's style. Scum or town, I tend to assume her emotions are genuine.

Didds doesn't like wagons on them as either alignment.

You tilt more as an early wagon as town than scum, that's why you're good at being scum in the first place.

[jotheonah]

I'll have to go back and reread and see why specifically I preferred Robz back then. I know there was something. But again, it was vague, just enough to convince me enough for the initial vote.

I'll try to do that sometime tonight.

Went back and reread - I also didn't like his post about wagons being protown - I'm really not sure why exactly, but that made me suspect him.

Rereading now, I do see that this is not really a good reason to stay on thus.

So I'll go ahead and

unvote

While I'm guessing this will garner more votes for me, you're looking in the wrong place. I just overcommitted early to Robz and that was a mistake (likely).

So about scola. There's some appeasement happening in his playstyle -- when he gets challenged on a vote he does this sort of sheepish backpedal thing. That feels scummy because it seems like he's just trying to get people to like him and trying to avoid doing anything that will make people scumread him.

The thing about picking Robz instead of someone else is NAA to me, just because in this game fake scumhunting is not a tell-- we should be expecting earnest scumhunting from scum as they look for the other team.

[jotheonah]

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

[mcmcsalot]

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

I don’t think scum!joth fails to put me anywhere on this list. He even has a spot for people he forgot and fails to put me there which of scum is formulating this list they almost certainly check the op to see if they got everyone and throw “missed” reads there. This was made sloppily but with though which heavily suggests town.

[MiX]

Well, I know I've been wrong before...but joth's town.

He's not scared of anything. That readlist is pure parroting what has been said publicly.

PPE: And I also forgot you were in the game! Are you scum mcmc?

[mcmcsalot]

I’m also very comfortable with both the ADK and scola lynches. I feel adk’s early posts felt like scum trying to misrepresent and push players in a scummy way, scola felt like newbie scum with as joth said pretty sheepish behavior.

Since then ADK has leveled off in scummy behavior and some the reactions both positively and negatively toward the scola wagon have enhanced my scum read (other townreads of mine feel similarly+Yuma’s strange partnery defense)

[mcmcsalot]

Well, I know I've been wrong before...but joth's town.

He's not scared of anything. That readlist is pure parroting what has been said publicly.

PPE: And I also forgot you were in the game! Are you scum mcmc?

I think joths readlist is more summary than parroting but agree with the townread and no I am not scum.

[jotheonah]

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

I don’t think scum!joth fails to put me anywhere on this list. He even has a spot for people he forgot and fails to put me there which of scum is formulating this list they almost certainly check the op to see if they got everyone and throw “missed” reads there. This was made sloppily but with though which heavily suggests town.

Oops! I'm scumreading you, so it's an especially galling omission. I knew I had more scumreads!

[jotheonah]

In a normal game I would be like "oh no mcmc is a scumread but I also agree with his reads" but this is multiball so I feel fine about it.

[mcmcsalot]

In a normal game I would be like "oh no mcmc is a scumread but I also agree with his reads" but this is multiball so I feel fine about it.

What are you scumreading me for?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

I don’t think scum!joth fails to put me anywhere on this list. He even has a spot for people he forgot and fails to put me there which of scum is formulating this list they almost certainly check the op to see if they got everyone and throw “missed” reads there. This was made sloppily but with though which heavily suggests town.

Man if I'm scum and I'm making a list like this I definitely deliberately leave someone off

[MiX]

Oh, did joth steal your play?

[mail-mi]

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

I don’t think scum!joth fails to put me anywhere on this list. He even has a spot for people he forgot and fails to put me there which of scum is formulating this list they almost certainly check the op to see if they got everyone and throw “missed” reads there. This was made sloppily but with though which heavily suggests town.

Man if I'm scum and I'm making a list like this I definitely deliberately leave someone off

Nah. As scum, I'd scan over my posts much more and make sure not to miss anyone.

[yuma]

vote: mcmc

[yuma]

Also vote: joth

10 points to Gryfindor if anyone can tell me why for both. I'll share eventually when I can quote like a person that can use their phone.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

I don’t think scum!joth fails to put me anywhere on this list. He even has a spot for people he forgot and fails to put me there which of scum is formulating this list they almost certainly check the op to see if they got everyone and throw “missed” reads there. This was made sloppily but with though which heavily suggests town.

Man if I'm scum and I'm making a list like this I definitely deliberately leave someone off

Nah. As scum, I'd scan over my posts much more and make sure not to miss anyone.

Yes, and then I would deliberately leave someone off so I looked like forgetful town

[mail-mi]

Also vote: joth

10 points to Gryfindor if anyone can tell me why for both. I'll share eventually when I can quote like a person that can use their phone.

what if I'm in ravenclaw?

I could see myself voting for mcmc, but I'm reading townie on joth.

[scolapasta]

\So about scola. There's some appeasement happening in his playstyle -- when he gets challenged on a vote he does this sort of sheepish backpedal thing. That feels scummy because it seems like he's just trying to get people to like him and trying to avoid doing anything that will make people scumread him.

The thing about picking Robz instead of someone else is NAA to me, just because in this game fake scumhunting is not a tell-- we should be expecting earnest scumhunting from scum as they look for the other team.

I've voted once and unvoted. Not sure if 1 qualifies as a pattern.

Tell me the next number in the sequence: 6, ...

Your next statement about avoiding doing things to scumread me is true. I know that people are already considering me, so If I do something scummy, I am more likely get exiled. I would read not wanting to be exiled as scummy, just self preserving (which at least, on D1, is NAI)

[A Drowned Kernel]

Also vote: joth

10 points to Gryfindor if anyone can tell me why for both. I'll share eventually when I can quote like a person that can use their phone.

what if I'm in ravenclaw?

I could see myself voting for mcmc, but I'm reading townie on joth.

mcmc had a good opportunity to jump on my mislynch and didn't, so I'm starting to lean town on him

[MiX]

My guesses are, in order of confidence: 6, 12, 8, 0, 1, 60, 600, 3.

What pattern do you expect people to catch on D1?

PPE: So it's best to not upset him?

[shraeye]

Generally if a wagon just seems to come together quickly and easily, and it's not because it's based on a compelling case, it means the wagon's on town. When a wagon seems to stall out and can't seem to gain traction, that's on scum. Although the latter effect is weakened by the fact that each partner only has one partner who knows who they are, the former is strengthened by the fact that scum can pile on without knowing it.

How do you know ADK's wagon won't be stalled? If I move to scola right now, which is tempting, suddenly the roles are swapped. Does ADK become scummy then?

I tend to weight things that are actually happening quite a bit higher than hypotheticals that MiX made up.

This response is pretty shitty, you know. I can't answer without going into AtE because you specifically call me out.

What I was trying to say is it hasn't been enough time to see if the ADK wagon picks up, so why assume they're town and that the other wagon's on scum?

It doesn't seem like a bad response to me at all

[shraeye]

Generally if a wagon just seems to come together quickly and easily, and it's not because it's based on a compelling case, it means the wagon's on town. When a wagon seems to stall out and can't seem to gain traction, that's on scum. Although the latter effect is weakened by the fact that each partner only has one partner who knows who they are, the former is strengthened by the fact that scum can pile on without knowing it.

How do you know ADK's wagon won't be stalled? If I move to scola right now, which is tempting, suddenly the roles are swapped. Does ADK become scummy then?

I tend to weight things that are actually happening quite a bit higher than hypotheticals that MiX made up.

This response is pretty shitty, you know. I can't answer without going into AtE because you specifically call me out.

What I was trying to say is it hasn't been enough time to see if the ADK wagon picks up, so why assume they're town and that the other wagon's on scum?

Sorry -- not trying to be shitty. I'm not assuming ADK is town or that scola's scum. I am hesitant to pile onto the wagon that feels like it's building too fast. I do want to get on a wagon because we're getting pretty far into the game.

On the merits of the evidence, ADK and scola are both perfectly cromulent exiles, but neither one strikes me as especially more scummy than the other. So instead I looked to the dynamics of the wagon to make my decision. Those dynamics, because they're an emergent factor of everyone's activity, can be more telling sometimes than the behavior of individuals who are (if scum) being careful to regulate that very behavior.

After looking up cromukent, I agree with this.  But looking at scolas exile crew and ADKs, I find people on ADK townier

[shraeye]

This game is strange, because there are the two small teams, I feel like the patterns we are looking for are different.  I'm really not interested in the standard "A said something weird so they're scum".  ADK and scola both seem to be on the line for fake scumhunting, well nobody's incentivized to do that, so it's hardly a scumtepl here.  Neither exile feels wrong or awesome though.

I feel like our best bet is to pivot (PIVOT!!) to a totally different exile.  Rather than looking for who's defending who (which is gonna be so much more fruitful in standard 3-scum setup), we should look for who's playing it safest. 

Off the top of my head that's Galz, e, mail-mi.

Vote: Galz

I know some of that is not-aroundedness. But playing it safe isn't just a synonym for low post count.  Once I'm at a compy imma check my instincts

[Robz888]

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

I don’t think scum!joth fails to put me anywhere on this list. He even has a spot for people he forgot and fails to put me there which of scum is formulating this list they almost certainly check the op to see if they got everyone and throw “missed” reads there. This was made sloppily but with though which heavily suggests town.

Oops! I'm scumreading you, so it's an especially galling omission. I knew I had more scumreads!

I basically agree with all these reads, I agree with mcmc that joth is townie for forgetting to include mcmc, and I agree with joth's additional comment that mcmc is scummy!

[Robz888]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

[mcmcsalot]

This game is strange, because there are the two small teams, I feel like the patterns we are looking for are different.  I'm really not interested in the standard "A said something weird so they're scum".  ADK and scola both seem to be on the line for fake scumhunting, well nobody's incentivized to do that, so it's hardly a scumtepl here.  Neither exile feels wrong or awesome though.

I feel like our best bet is to pivot (PIVOT!!) to a totally different exile.  Rather than looking for who's defending who (which is gonna be so much more fruitful in standard 3-scum setup), we should look for who's playing it safest. 

Off the top of my head that's Galz, e, mail-mi.

Vote: Galz

I know some of that is not-aroundedness. But playing it safe isn't just a synonym for low post count.  Once I'm at a compy imma check my instincts

Scola isn’t on the line for fake scum hunting it’s more specifically voting with out a strong reason, explaining the vote later when pressed with an explaination that doesn’t hold up logically with what happened at the time. (Check my prior post about the setup discussion and mail-mi, ADK, myself, joth and robz reactions with scola picking robz our of that). He’s is also being accused of acting like newbie overly sheepish, overly qualifying scum, many of his posts have had unnecessary jokey tone or greetings and he has bent quietly to the votes and cases against him.

I get that scum has more insentive to truly scumhunt and so “poor reasoning” and fake scum hunting” are less than ideal cases in this setup but they are much better than a total lurker exile which is essentially what a galz vote is for.

[Robz888]

This game is strange, because there are the two small teams, I feel like the patterns we are looking for are different.  I'm really not interested in the standard "A said something weird so they're scum".  ADK and scola both seem to be on the line for fake scumhunting, well nobody's incentivized to do that, so it's hardly a scumtepl here.  Neither exile feels wrong or awesome though.

I feel like our best bet is to pivot (PIVOT!!) to a totally different exile.  Rather than looking for who's defending who (which is gonna be so much more fruitful in standard 3-scum setup), we should look for who's playing it safest. 

Off the top of my head that's Galz, e, mail-mi.

Vote: Galz

I know some of that is not-aroundedness. But playing it safe isn't just a synonym for low post count.  Once I'm at a compy imma check my instincts

Scola isn’t on the line for fake scum hunting it’s more specifically voting with out a strong reason, explaining the vote later when pressed with an explaination that doesn’t hold up logically with what happened at the time. (Check my prior post about the setup discussion and mail-mi, ADK, myself, joth and robz reactions with scola picking robz our of that). He’s is also being accused of acting like newbie overly sheepish, overly qualifying scum, many of his posts have had unnecessary jokey tone or greetings and he has bent quietly to the votes and cases against him.

I get that scum has more insentive to truly scumhunt and so “poor reasoning” and fake scum hunting” are less than ideal cases in this setup but they are much better than a total lurker exile which is essentially what a galz vote is for.

Shraeye's pivot to Galz is weid because, Galz hasn't done ANYTHING, and while that's frustrating, I can't imagine we end up lynching lurker Galz on Day 1.

[Robz888]

weird*

[mcmcsalot]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Which one of those do you think is my partner?

[Robz888]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Which one of those do you think is my partner?

Not sure yet. Give me a break, I found all four scum already...

[mcmcsalot]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Which one of those do you think is my partner?

Not sure yet. Give me a break, I found all four scum already...

Two of those people I built cases on and are at the top of my want to lunch list, the other one had multiple people including you and me call out a potential partner reaction so while I’m super glad we agree on who is scum I’m curious where you think I fit in.

[Robz888]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Which one of those do you think is my partner?

Not sure yet. Give me a break, I found all four scum already...

Two of those people I built cases on and are at the top of my want to lunch list, the other one had multiple people including you and me call out a potential partner reaction so while I’m super glad we agree on who is scum I’m curious where you think I fit in.

Yes, I'm sure as mafia you would never even think to put a partner at the top of your "want to lunch" list.

[MiX]

I would never put my partner at a top of my "want to lunch" list in this setup.

[Robz888]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

[MiX]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

This is a fundamentally different setup than normal mafia.

Note to self: don't talk about setup.

[Robz888]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

This is a fundamentally different setup than normal mafia.

Note to self: don't talk about setup.

I realize it's different setup, but I don't see how this general principle is different here.

[scolapasta]

This game is strange, because there are the two small teams, I feel like the patterns we are looking for are different.  I'm really not interested in the standard "A said something weird so they're scum".  ADK and scola both seem to be on the line for fake scumhunting, well nobody's incentivized to do that, so it's hardly a scumtepl here.  Neither exile feels wrong or awesome though.

I feel like our best bet is to pivot (PIVOT!!) to a totally different exile.  Rather than looking for who's defending who (which is gonna be so much more fruitful in standard 3-scum setup), we should look for who's playing it safest. 

Off the top of my head that's Galz, e, mail-mi.

Vote: Galz

I know some of that is not-aroundedness. But playing it safe isn't just a synonym for low post count.  Once I'm at a compy imma check my instincts

Scola isn’t on the line for fake scum hunting it’s more specifically voting with out a strong reason, explaining the vote later when pressed with an explaination that doesn’t hold up logically with what happened at the time. (Check my prior post about the setup discussion and mail-mi, ADK, myself, joth and robz reactions with scola picking robz our of that). He’s is also being accused of acting like newbie overly sheepish, overly qualifying scum, many of his posts have had unnecessary jokey tone or greetings and he has bent quietly to the votes and cases against him.

I get that scum has more insentive to truly scumhunt and so “poor reasoning” and fake scum hunting” are less than ideal cases in this setup but they are much better than a total lurker exile which is essentially what a galz vote is for.

And yet this is your first game with me. That jokey tome or greeting is very normal for me D1. Look at any of my past, ended games.

my vote did have a reason. Not strong, because, well, D1. I don't agree with my explanation not holding up with any logic, though I think people wondering why I picked Robz over the other doctor reveal early suggesters is sensible. But I also din't think it was illogical.

I'm not sure what you mean by overly sheepish and overly qualifying scum. I also think it's interesting that I could in theory be all these scum newbie things, but there's no allowance there for just general town newbie. (I have only played a handful of games on here, two of which I was gone by D2).

I don't agree with the ADK wagon (though of course pondered voting that way for self preservation). And I am worried about starting a new wagon, because I agree we don't want to wait until last minute to consolidate. So I haven't put a vote in.

But I've been told new wagons are not antitown (do you agree), so if that's the case, Ill throw a vote in, after all:

vote: mcmcsalot

I do agree with you that voting a lurker isn't very practical right now.

[scolapasta]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

This is a fundamentally different setup than normal mafia.

Note to self: don't talk about setup.

Why not talk about setup?

[MiX]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

This is a fundamentally different setup than normal mafia.

Note to self: don't talk about setup.

Why not talk about setup?

(ongoing game)

[yuma]

Fifty first rule of mafia don't talk about not talking about ongoing games

[yuma]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Can I do an impression of you?

[MiX]

Fifty first rule of mafia don't talk about not talking about ongoing games

Are you drunk again?

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Can I do an impression of you?

Yes.

[Robz888]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Can I do an impression of you?

Be my guest!

[mcmcsalot]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

This is a fundamentally different setup than normal mafia.

Note to self: don't talk about setup.

I realize it's different setup, but I don't see how this general principle is different here.

The idea is it's even riskier to lose a teammate because there are only 2 of you and you can die at night making it extremely important for partners not to bus eachother. Scum is much more likely to throw townreads their partner's way so as to increase the overall town view of them.

[yuma]

Zero points for Gryffindor. The house cup was always a joke anyways. Sorry.

Anyways, reason.

Ok. I'm done rereading. It wasn't super-enlightening. But I guess I'll make a scum to chum list for the sake of having a useful deliverable.

People I'm townreading:
Robz
mail-mi
MiX
Swowl

People I'm scumreading:
scola
ADK

People I'm conflicted about:
Didds
yuma

People I'm neutral on:
e

People I forgot were playing this game:
Galzria
shraeye

Scum to chum lists are anti-town.

But more importantly:

I’m also very comfortable with both the ADK and scola lynches. I feel adk’s early posts felt like scum trying to misrepresent and push players in a scummy way, scola felt like newbie scum with as joth said pretty sheepish behavior.

Since then ADK has leveled off in scummy behavior and some the reactions both positively and negatively toward the scola wagon have enhanced my scum read (other townreads of mine feel similarly+Yuma’s strange partnery defense)

the points about ADK and scola. Like take a stand. Or just float along and go with it without actually landing somewhere.

OK. Break it down for me. What is "strange" "partnery" and "defense" about what I have said about scola?

vote: mcmc

[MiX]

There's also another reason which is anti-town to say, but overall...

Okay why are we helping scum. Hey mcmc why did you tell scum a reason to not bus each other?

Just everyone stop talking about...dammit no I was the one that mentioned setup in the first place. I'm sorry.

PPE: Uh remember that post that Robz said you looked like scola's partner? Yeah, that.

[MiX]

Also, readlists are pro-town. We want to help scum scumhunt, they're vigs.

Although I think that scumreading them is townie.

[yuma]

Fifty first rule of mafia don't talk about not talking about ongoing games

Are you drunk again?

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Can I do an impression of you?

Yes.

I am rarely drunk. But not entirely sober, either.

My impression

Hi! I am town!Robz! Scum are whomever has the most votes and the guy being contrary! What a quick, easy game!

But mostly I am mildly annoyed by the weird partner thing going on and probably just shouldn't respond to it. But it is gallingly poor scum hunting. Or maybe you all aren't being serious? Sometimes it is hard to tell.

[yuma]

Also, readlists are pro-town. We want to help scum scumhunt, they're vigs.

Although I think that scumreading them is townie.

I don't think scum will use those to scumhunt. I mean as scum I would rather trust my reads and my partners about that. But readlists are direct insights into what town is or isn't willing to do about EVERYONE. It gives a scum team with any initiative at all the opportunity to direct the exile in the direction they want.

Although to be completely clear I have no data backing this up and is my perception. At one point in my life I would have gone back and looked up games that used readlists. But my impression of that time was a lot of mafia wins.

[yuma]

PPE: Uh remember that post that Robz said you looked like scola's partner? Yeah, that.

I don't follow.

[Robz888]

Also, readlists are pro-town. We want to help scum scumhunt, they're vigs.

This is a good point. Yeah, scum-to-chum lists are better in this setup, actually. That I will concede.

[Robz888]

This is a very different yuma from the hyper logical scum finder I remember, though admittedly it's been several years. Feels like he's trying out a new personae, which might be different than being scum.

I think I most want to exile scolapasta.

[yuma]

This is a very different yuma from the hyper logical scum finder I remember, though admittedly it's been several years. Feels like he's trying out a new personae, which might be different than being scum.

I think I most want to exile scolapasta.

I am coming into this game with the goal of just having fun. I stopped having fun and got too... I don't know caught up in the concept of the game. So yeah. I am quite a bit different.

My first game back I was pretty horrible at scum hunting though. I... in this order.

Argued against a scum exile Day2 (Day1 was a no-exile)
Argued against a scum exile Day3 while pushing for an exile of someone who was town
Argued against a scum exile Day4
Was misexiled Day5 for my terrible reads

It was bad. But we won! And I had fun!

[mcmcsalot]

But more importantly:

I’m also very comfortable with both the ADK and scola lynches. I feel adk’s early posts felt like scum trying to misrepresent and push players in a scummy way, scola felt like newbie scum with as joth said pretty sheepish behavior.

Since then ADK has leveled off in scummy behavior and some the reactions both positively and negatively toward the scola wagon have enhanced my scum read (other townreads of mine feel similarly+Yuma’s strange partnery defense)

the points about ADK and scola. Like take a stand. Or just float along and go with it without actually landing somewhere.

OK. Break it down for me. What is "strange" "partnery" and "defense" about what I have said about scola?

vote: mcmc

Its this post

If anyone is getting misrepresented here it is Scola. No vote from me there.

and

Yuma, I can actually see the case, however mistaken, against me.

Why are you so sure I'm town?

I am not. But I will speak up against cases that originate from deceit or falsehood.

You defended scola saying he was being misrepresented and that you would't vote for him. It was strange because it's not like anyone was specifically asking you about scola and you werent directly responding to someone's point, it came as a bit of a suprise. It was partnery because you didn't explaining why he was being misrepresented and when asked by scola himself you were clear you aren't sure hes town just that you had to speak up. It came across less like "hey lets be careful I think scola is town for X and Y" and more "I must stop this, back off and don't call scola scummy".

[scolapasta]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

This is a fundamentally different setup than normal mafia.

Note to self: don't talk about setup.

Why not talk about setup?

(ongoing game)

Just because I'm slow, you mean because there's a different ongoing game with two scum teams? I mean, its setup is different, but I guess generally the same, so if that's it I understand your point.

But I guess it feels weird to me, because talking about setup can be useful, maybe? So in that way, that game is affecting this game.

But maybe I'm just misunderstanding it all.

[mcmcsalot]

Putting a partner at the top of a "want to lunch" list is probably an important component of a scum strategy. Honestly, I think the best reason not to do it would be it's sort of expected from scum anyway.

This is a fundamentally different setup than normal mafia.

Note to self: don't talk about setup.

Why not talk about setup?

(ongoing game)

Just because I'm slow, you mean because there's a different ongoing game with two scum teams? I mean, its setup is different, but I guess generally the same, so if that's it I understand your point.

But I guess it feels weird to me, because talking about setup can be useful, maybe? So in that way, that game is affecting this game.

But maybe I'm just misunderstanding it all.

I don't know the specifics of whats going on so its safe to say typically if people say ongoing game it has to do with the fact that a player could be modding or dead or a scum partner or a power role, or a different alignment in another game that is currently ongoing and so they may have some thoughts or knowledge that they learned in that game that they cannot share in this game as it indirectly would be talking about things going on in an ongoing game.


On the other hand the general reason talking about the setup is dangerous is the innate fact that town has less information than scum and town is more likely to tip off scum when discussing the setup. In this game taking hard stances on being pro claim or anti claim could tip scum off to which players are and are not likely the doctor.

[mcmcsalot]

This game is strange, because there are the two small teams, I feel like the patterns we are looking for are different.  I'm really not interested in the standard "A said something weird so they're scum".  ADK and scola both seem to be on the line for fake scumhunting, well nobody's incentivized to do that, so it's hardly a scumtepl here.  Neither exile feels wrong or awesome though.

I feel like our best bet is to pivot (PIVOT!!) to a totally different exile.  Rather than looking for who's defending who (which is gonna be so much more fruitful in standard 3-scum setup), we should look for who's playing it safest. 

Off the top of my head that's Galz, e, mail-mi.

Vote: Galz

I know some of that is not-aroundedness. But playing it safe isn't just a synonym for low post count.  Once I'm at a compy imma check my instincts

Scola isn’t on the line for fake scum hunting it’s more specifically voting with out a strong reason, explaining the vote later when pressed with an explaination that doesn’t hold up logically with what happened at the time. (Check my prior post about the setup discussion and mail-mi, ADK, myself, joth and robz reactions with scola picking robz our of that). He’s is also being accused of acting like newbie overly sheepish, overly qualifying scum, many of his posts have had unnecessary jokey tone or greetings and he has bent quietly to the votes and cases against him.

I get that scum has more insentive to truly scumhunt and so “poor reasoning” and fake scum hunting” are less than ideal cases in this setup but they are much better than a total lurker exile which is essentially what a galz vote is for.

And yet this is your first game with me. That jokey tome or greeting is very normal for me D1. Look at any of my past, ended games.

my vote did have a reason. Not strong, because, well, D1. I don't agree with my explanation not holding up with any logic, though I think people wondering why I picked Robz over the other doctor reveal early suggesters is sensible. But I also din't think it was illogical.

I'm not sure what you mean by overly sheepish and overly qualifying scum. I also think it's interesting that I could in theory be all these scum newbie things, but there's no allowance there for just general town newbie. (I have only played a handful of games on here, two of which I was gone by D2).

I don't agree with the ADK wagon (though of course pondered voting that way for self preservation). And I am worried about starting a new wagon, because I agree we don't want to wait until last minute to consolidate. So I haven't put a vote in.

But I've been told new wagons are not antitown (do you agree), so if that's the case, Ill throw a vote in, after all:

vote: mcmcsalot

I do agree with you that voting a lurker isn't very practical right now.

So it looks like we agree the vote was weak and your explanation was lacking the really solid logic of why specifically robz over others.

I do think it could be general newness as well but the fact that it is tied to you making a vote on someone leans new scum. New town is likely to hold on to their thought if its not strong or clear, new scum feels more compelled to contribute and thus might make a weaker less logically explainable vote.



Overly sheepish and qualifying behavior below. This could very well be how you talk, I have not played with you before but it think scum more often adds words that are unneeded because they sound better when reread:

Whew(qualifier), and my vote wasn't strictly rvs(sheepish, is it or isn't it and if its both maybe elaborate as more info comes about)

Ha, pretty sure(not strong opinion)

This is outside of game discussion and then tagged with the fact that you still like your robz vote but might consider didds or mix.(might consider indicates not a strong read on any of the players you have decided to talk about which is weird for town to do because if you only might consider why even mention it.)

Here you get voted for being one of the players who was saying you would vote for didds without actually voting for her and you give your reason then triple down on liking your robz vote which you have gone on to say is weak and was slightly rvs to start.

You then go back and reread at my pressure for a reason for your vote and it prompts you to unvote. So why during the three times were you still so confident that you needed to reitorate you still like the robz vote to then just go ah yea it's not a great vote. Obviously if you are town and just made a bad vote it sucks to then get more scumread for backing off but its that the pattern is not one of oh yea that vote was bad its an inbetween world where you think the vote was okay, its just day one, you reitorate a bunchm then you decide nevermind its bad. It seems like scum bending to pressure after having made a vote and read that didn't hold up.

[mcmcsalot]

I don't agree with the ADK wagon (though of course pondered voting that way for self preservation). And I am worried about starting a new wagon, because I agree we don't want to wait until last minute to consolidate. So I haven't put a vote in.

But I've been told new wagons are not antitown (do you agree), so if that's the case, Ill throw a vote in, after all:

vote: mcmcsalot

I do agree with you that voting a lurker isn't very practical right now.

Go back and reread the ADK wagon and bring why specifically you don't like it. Is it a weak reasoned wagon? Are the players pushing the wagon scummy? Does it look coordinated? Are there players ignoring the wagon entirely? If you feel a way about the wagon hit it from every angle to figure out why you feel that way and then see where that leads you.

New wagons are not anti town. Wagons that are extremely unlikely to go anywhere and serve only to distract from town discussing the main wagons are anti town. If you want to start a new wagon because you find something that you think is scummy and you think noone else has said anything about it that is pro town all the way.

[mcmcsalot]

Post Count 1.0, mid day 1


53 (55-2): MiX
42 (44-2): yuma

36 (37-1): mcmcsalot
36 (39-3): Robz888
32 (37-5): WestCoastDidds
30 (32-2): jotheonah
29 (31-3): mail-mi
29 (30-1): A Drowned Kernel

21 (22-1): scolapasta
19 (20-2): Swowl
18 (20-2): 2.71828.....
13 (14-1): shraeye

4 (7-3): Galzria

[mcmcsalot]

Main take aways from the post count is that oh my galz is literally nonexsistant. He did say he was going to reread and content would follow but that should have been yesterday. Shraeye voting Galz is even scummier that it originally seemed because shraeye is also the next least posting player by a significant margin.

I will not vote for Mix or Yuma today.

other than that nothing huge, () are total count minus pre game start posts. Future vote counts can take total posts less the same number.

Also if everyone could put a shuffle it username it helps ctrl+f your post total, otherwise I have to use the number of posts you have made which I think can change if you go and make a thread.

[yuma]

Post Count 1.0, mid day 1

What work!

[Swowl]

holy crap - Robz has 36 posts on day 1?
... is what I take away from that

[Swowl]

Also, readlists are pro-town. We want to help scum scumhunt, they're vigs.

This is a good point. Yeah, scum-to-chum lists are better in this setup, actually. That I will concede.

gonna chalk this one up into the "probably shouldn't talk about it" category.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Main take aways from the post count is that oh my galz is literally nonexsistant. He did say he was going to reread and content would follow but that should have been yesterday. Shraeye voting Galz is even scummier that it originally seemed because shraeye is also the next least posting player by a significant margin.

Come join me on shraeye!

[shraeye]

Main take aways from the post count is that oh my galz is literally nonexsistant. He did say he was going to reread and content would follow but that should have been yesterday. Shraeye voting Galz is even scummier that it originally seemed because shraeye is also the next least posting player by a significant margin.

I will not vote for Mix or Yuma today.

other than that nothing huge, () are total count minus pre game start posts. Future vote counts can take total posts less the same number.

Also if everyone could put a shuffle it username it helps ctrl+f your post total, otherwise I have to use the number of posts you have made which I think can change if you go and make a thread.

So you're saying that if I post more, then I'll get off your radar?  How bout I just keep being me and you do more than this tedious yet lazy scumhunting

[shraeye]

Scum are yuma, ADK, scola, and mcmc. What a quick, easy game!

Which one of those do you think is my partner?

Not sure yet. Give me a break, I found all four scum already...

Two of those people I built cases on and are at the top of my want to lunch list, the other one had multiple people including you and me call out a potential partner reaction so while I’m super glad we agree on who is scum I’m curious where you think I fit in.

Yes, I'm sure as mafia you would never even think to put a partner at the top of your "want to lunch" list.

I would do this anytime.  Have done this anytime.  We won't find scum by seeing who's defending who.  Assuming it will play out that way (and publically doing it) will definitely backfire

[jotheonah]

Didds was not wrong when she said this game had a weird, duderiffic energy.

I think it’s because Yuma and Robz and mcmc are all back and they’re playing the game as we played it when they left but our meta as a community has evolved since then and so there’s a slight mismatch. That mismatch is making everyone see everyone else as plying the game wrong. Plus it’s an “everything you know is wrong” sort of a setup on top of that.

Anyway, y’all are silly about reads lists. They’re pro-town and here’s why: town have actual genuine reads. Scum have fake reads (less true than normal here, but still true). It’s pro-town to make scum commit to their fake reads and put them down on paper because it limits their options later or gives us the opportunity to catch them in a contradiction.

The number one way that scum gets exiled is they get caught in A lie. Promoting an atmosphere of “everybody play it close to the vest” just gives the scum team cover to avoid lying and therefore getting caught.

Thank you for coming to my TED talk.

Between mcmc and Scola I’d rather exile Scola today because mcmc is being pretty helpful and I’d rather keep him around, even if he’s scum.

[2.71828.....]

Just have to say, that was a fun read catching up. You all are so funny

[MiX]

So is mcmc scumreading scola or what?

I feel like Robz has to be scum this game. Would he try this hard D1 as town? But I also feel like scum doesn't want to try hard in this setup anyway.

[2.71828.....]

So is mcmc scumreading scola or what?

I feel like Robz has to be scum this game. Would he try this hard D1 as town? But I also feel like scum doesn't want to try hard in this setup anyway.

"Try hard" arguments are bad arguments

[2.71828.....]

So is mcmc scumreading scola or what?

I feel like Robz has to be scum this game. Would he try this hard D1 as town? But I also feel like scum doesn't want to try hard in this setup anyway.

Also, scum wants to scum hunt and find the other team. So if anything scum will try harder

[2.71828.....]

Didds was not wrong when she said this game had a weird, duderiffic energy.

I think it’s because Yuma and Robz and mcmc are all back and they’re playing the game as we played it when they left but our meta as a community has evolved since then and so there’s a slight mismatch. That mismatch is making everyone see everyone else as plying the game wrong. Plus it’s an “everything you know is wrong” sort of a setup on top of that.

Anyway, y’all are silly about reads lists. They’re pro-town and here’s why: town have actual genuine reads. Scum have fake reads (less true than normal here, but still true). It’s pro-town to make scum commit to their fake reads and put them down on paper because it limits their options later or gives us the opportunity to catch them in a contradiction.

The number one way that scum gets exiled is they get caught in A lie. Promoting an atmosphere of “everybody play it close to the vest” just gives the scum team cover to avoid lying and therefore getting caught.

Thank you for coming to my TED talk.

Between mcmc and Scola I’d rather exile Scola today because mcmc is being pretty helpful and I’d rather keep him around, even if he’s scum.

Joth being townie here

[mcmcsalot]

So is mcmc scumreading scola or what?

I feel like Robz has to be scum this game. Would he try this hard D1 as town? But I also feel like scum doesn't want to try hard in this setup anyway.

I am scum reading scola but I have recognized what I think to be newbie scum. He brought up that he’s new here and I haven’t played with him much so he could be newbie town and if that is the case I want to help him “show his work” so to speak so I can better understand if he is scummy or towny.

I would expect robz to be trying hard as either alignment this game, he has to have been excited for it he let me know he was playing and we haven’t gotten to do much together In the last few months. His higher post count actually makes me lean pretty towny on him for the day as scum robz would be “helping” in less words. Tone robz helps by getting his thoughts out in the open.

[mcmcsalot]

Just have to say, that was a fun read catching up. You all are so funny

Anything more specific to say?

[2.71828.....]

Just have to say, that was a fun read catching up. You all are so funny

Anything more specific to say?

Scola is a fine target, just want to watch it from the shadows.

Joth is town as others have realized.

Uh, what else?

Mail-mi is scummy, maybe I will get lucky and he will actually be scum

Yuma is probably scum, but I won't realize it until I am exiled off in the speccy

MiX is town

Other stuff is sure to come to mind eventually

[WestCoastDidds]

Happy July! Holy smokes the summer is going slow/fast.

I ❤️ you, Joth. I will always come to your Ted Talk.

What’s up with Galzy? Swowl, is he alive? I’m not sure scum Galz is so absent. Especially on a 2-dude team. We’ve been exiling him early for lurking but he hasn’t been quite this absent in those games, so he’s staying on my town list with MiX, Joth, and Swowl. I think Shraeye is on that list too, and probably Rob.

Debatepro’s daughter turned 18 yesterday. Good gravy, people, that’s a full grown adult. She voted and bought lottery tickets. I was old before, but I’m really old now. In that arrested development, completely ageless college professor kind of way, obvi.

[jotheonah]

Everyone please stop townreading me so hard I really don’t want to be the N1 kill.

[yuma]

Everyone please stop townreading me so hard I really don’t want to be the N1 kill.

I am not. Your TED Talk was nice. But I will never post a full scum to chum. Parts and pieces sure, but I have no mind to tell scum everything I am thinking so they can manipulate me from that.

And you are right about new fds meta. It is quite different.

[WestCoastDidds]

And you are right about new fds meta. It is quite different.

Better, or just different?

[yuma]

And you are right about new fds meta. It is quite different.

Better, or just different?

Probably better.

[scolapasta]

This game is strange, because there are the two small teams, I feel like the patterns we are looking for are different.  I'm really not interested in the standard "A said something weird so they're scum".  ADK and scola both seem to be on the line for fake scumhunting, well nobody's incentivized to do that, so it's hardly a scumtepl here.  Neither exile feels wrong or awesome though.

I feel like our best bet is to pivot (PIVOT!!) to a totally different exile.  Rather than looking for who's defending who (which is gonna be so much more fruitful in standard 3-scum setup), we should look for who's playing it safest. 

Off the top of my head that's Galz, e, mail-mi.

Vote: Galz

I know some of that is not-aroundedness. But playing it safe isn't just a synonym for low post count.  Once I'm at a compy imma check my instincts

Scola isn’t on the line for fake scum hunting it’s more specifically voting with out a strong reason, explaining the vote later when pressed with an explaination that doesn’t hold up logically with what happened at the time. (Check my prior post about the setup discussion and mail-mi, ADK, myself, joth and robz reactions with scola picking robz our of that). He’s is also being accused of acting like newbie overly sheepish, overly qualifying scum, many of his posts have had unnecessary jokey tone or greetings and he has bent quietly to the votes and cases against him.

I get that scum has more insentive to truly scumhunt and so “poor reasoning” and fake scum hunting” are less than ideal cases in this setup but they are much better than a total lurker exile which is essentially what a galz vote is for.

And yet this is your first game with me. That jokey tome or greeting is very normal for me D1. Look at any of my past, ended games.

my vote did have a reason. Not strong, because, well, D1. I don't agree with my explanation not holding up with any logic, though I think people wondering why I picked Robz over the other doctor reveal early suggesters is sensible. But I also din't think it was illogical.

I'm not sure what you mean by overly sheepish and overly qualifying scum. I also think it's interesting that I could in theory be all these scum newbie things, but there's no allowance there for just general town newbie. (I have only played a handful of games on here, two of which I was gone by D2).

I don't agree with the ADK wagon (though of course pondered voting that way for self preservation). And I am worried about starting a new wagon, because I agree we don't want to wait until last minute to consolidate. So I haven't put a vote in.

But I've been told new wagons are not antitown (do you agree), so if that's the case, Ill throw a vote in, after all:

vote: mcmcsalot

I do agree with you that voting a lurker isn't very practical right now.

So it looks like we agree the vote was weak and your explanation was lacking the really solid logic of why specifically robz over others.

I do think it could be general newness as well but the fact that it is tied to you making a vote on someone leans new scum. New town is likely to hold on to their thought if its not strong or clear, new scum feels more compelled to contribute and thus might make a weaker less logically explainable vote.



Overly sheepish and qualifying behavior below. This could very well be how you talk, I have not played with you before but it think scum more often adds words that are unneeded because they sound better when reread:

Whew(qualifier), and my vote wasn't strictly rvs(sheepish, is it or isn't it and if its both maybe elaborate as more info comes about)

Ha, pretty sure(not strong opinion)

This is outside of game discussion and then tagged with the fact that you still like your robz vote but might consider didds or mix.(might consider indicates not a strong read on any of the players you have decided to talk about which is weird for town to do because if you only might consider why even mention it.)

Here you get voted for being one of the players who was saying you would vote for didds without actually voting for her and you give your reason then triple down on liking your robz vote which you have gone on to say is weak and was slightly rvs to start.

You then go back and reread at my pressure for a reason for your vote and it prompts you to unvote. So why during the three times were you still so confident that you needed to reitorate you still like the robz vote to then just go ah yea it's not a great vote. Obviously if you are town and just made a bad vote it sucks to then get more scumread for backing off but its that the pattern is not one of oh yea that vote was bad its an inbetween world where you think the vote was okay, its just day one, you reitorate a bunchm then you decide nevermind its bad. It seems like scum bending to pressure after having made a vote and read that didn't hold up.

A lot of this evidence is definitely not having played with me. Extra words like whew and all are definitely how I talk / type. And I I'm not really the kind of player to put out long posts and reasons. Maybe that's not ideal, so another reason I'm an OK D1 exile, but I do tend to post / be more useful on later D1s. i.e. D1 scola is never going to be particularly useful.

I do think your posts trying to "help" me read as town.

So, while I don't love hopping around, I'll need a new vote. I actually think voting for people defending me is not a bad idea.

vote: shraeye

[mail-mi]

Looks like the people I need to reread are scola, ADK, and shraeye? Can do.

[MiX]

Who's on the shraeye wagon?

[WestCoastDidds]

LaLi, when you get a chance can we have a vote count, please? And maybe prod Galz? Thank you!!

[Robz888]

So is mcmc scumreading scola or what?

I feel like Robz has to be scum this game. Would he try this hard D1 as town? But I also feel like scum doesn't want to try hard in this setup anyway.

Basically I was town the last game I played, and my performance was pathetic, and I want to try harder. I've also realized it's easier for me to b invested, to form reads, etc, if I'm active from the get-go. If I get behind, it spirals and I don't catch up. So I'm specifically trying hard on purpose. (Which, yes, I would also be doing that as mafia, true.)

[Robz888]

Absent Galz is a bummer but it does not make me think he's scum.

[LaLight]

Vote Count 1.5

scolapasta (3): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah
A Drowned Kernel (3): Swowl, MiX, Robz888
mail-mi (1): 2.71828.....
shraeye (2): A Drowned Kernel, scolapasta
Galzria(1): shraeye
mcmcsalot (1): yuma

Not Voting (2): Galzria, mail-mi

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

Galzria has been prodded.

[2.71828.....]

Pasta only has 3? I like more pressure there

Vote: scolapasta

[yuma]

ADK only has 3? I like more pressure there

vote: ADK

[yuma]

Also worth noting that soc and ADK aren't voting for each other.

[scolapasta]

obviously, that's because we're partners. </sarcasm>

[2.71828.....]

obviously, that's because we're partners. </sarcasm>

No, just scum from both factions

[A Drowned Kernel]

Also worth noting that soc and ADK aren't voting for each other.

Why is that worth noting?

[jotheonah]

Also worth noting that soc and ADK aren't voting for each other.

Why is that worth noting?

Because it means we can combine these wagons into a lethal wagon without anyone having to self-vote.

[Robz888]

Vote: Scola

[mail-mi]

scola reread:

Nothing has stood out to me so far (currently on reply 270) other than that scola does feel slightly different than he has before. He's never been scum, so that does give him scumpoints.

Someone else pointed out his casual backing off. I notice here (in reply 271) that he agrees with his detractors. When I was newer scum, I found myself agreeing with people arguing against me, and then saying "but I'm not scum." So also some scumpoints there. Here's the quote, for reference:

That said, if you and Didds both seem to think I'm playing differently? Then maybe you're right, and I am (though not as scumapasta). which would lessen my reactions to Didds. I'm willing to consider that for sure.

Here's another post with the same vibe (#317):

Yuma, I can actually see the case, however mistaken, against me.

Why are you so sure I'm town?

which, why would you ask that last question? I don't get town or scum vibes off of it, just weird vibes. I feel like as town or scum you don't look a gift townread in the mouth. Maybe that's just me.



So overall scola comes off scummy to me. I'll need to reread others before I put a vote down, but I am happy with scola lynch if it happens.

[mail-mi]

And Robz just voted for him.

intent to hammer, and all that.

[mail-mi]

And Robz just voted for him.

intent to hammer, and all that.

Want to wait for scola to see if he's the doctor (or if he claims doctor and gets counterclaimed.)

[jotheonah]

We should probably decide right now how to respond to a doctor claim at L1. Scum will inevitably try it in order to out the real doctor. As a town, we have to decide if we want to allow that to happen or not.

To all of you who say 'the doctor will do what the doctor will do', that's exactly the problem. If we leave it up to them then we'll never know whether lack of counterclaim means the doctor is on the chopping block or lack of a counterclaim  means the doctor is keeping quiet.

If we decide, as policy, we're going to ignore L-1 doctor claims then we're trading a small risk of exiling our doctor for extended doctor anonymity.
If we decide, as policy, we're going to believe L-1 doctor claims in the absence of a counterclaim, we're doing the opposite.
I can kind of see the argument either way, but I do think it benefits  us to put forth, agree to, and honor a policy.

[A Drowned Kernel]

And Robz just voted for him.

intent to hammer, and all that.

Not to be a killjoy, but he's at 5, so that's not E-1 (X-1?)

[A Drowned Kernel]

We should probably decide right now how to respond to a doctor claim at L1. Scum will inevitably try it in order to out the real doctor. As a town, we have to decide if we want to allow that to happen or not.

To all of you who say 'the doctor will do what the doctor will do', that's exactly the problem. If we leave it up to them then we'll never know whether lack of counterclaim means the doctor is on the chopping block or lack of a counterclaim  means the doctor is keeping quiet.

If we decide, as policy, we're going to ignore L-1 doctor claims then we're trading a small risk of exiling our doctor for extended doctor anonymity.
If we decide, as policy, we're going to believe L-1 doctor claims in the absence of a counterclaim, we're doing the opposite.
I can kind of see the argument either way, but I do think it benefits  us to put forth, agree to, and honor a policy.

No

[shraeye]

Just have to say, that was a fun read catching up. You all are so funny

Anything more specific to say?

vote: e

[shraeye]

And you are right about new fds meta. It is quite different.

Better, or just different?

Probably better.

I agree.

[shraeye]

No, useless vote is useless (It's a good vote; I wanted e before, got distracted by Galz; but want e most)

vote: ADK

[mail-mi]

And Robz just voted for him.

intent to hammer, and all that.

Not to be a killjoy, but he's at 5, so that's not E-1 (X-1?)

Ah, shoot.

vote: scola X-1.

[scolapasta]

scola reread:

Nothing has stood out to me so far (currently on reply 270) other than that scola does feel slightly different than he has before. He's never been scum, so that does give him scumpoints.

Someone else pointed out his casual backing off. I notice here (in reply 271) that he agrees with his detractors. When I was newer scum, I found myself agreeing with people arguing against me, and then saying "but I'm not scum." So also some scumpoints there. Here's the quote, for reference:

That said, if you and Didds both seem to think I'm playing differently? Then maybe you're right, and I am (though not as scumapasta). which would lessen my reactions to Didds. I'm willing to consider that for sure.

Here's another post with the same vibe (#317):

Yuma, I can actually see the case, however mistaken, against me.

Why are you so sure I'm town?

which, why would you ask that last question? I don't get town or scum vibes off of it, just weird vibes. I feel like as town or scum you don't look a gift townread in the mouth. Maybe that's just me.



So overall scola comes off scummy to me. I'll need to reread others before I put a vote down, but I am happy with scola lynch if it happens.

slightly differently, because I'm being targeted as scum. Except for my first game with y'all that hasn't happened before. So yeah, you're seeing different behavior. Which I agree, you might also see if I were scum, OR if I were scum I would actually try to play exactly like I have other games, because I would not want to be suspected.

So the different behavior can be evidence for either, no?

My vote on Robz over the others. One part I neglected to explain is that part of it over others is that I don't know If I think scum would propose a (what I think is a) bad idea first, but once proposed by someone else, would try to go with it. Yes Robz was not the only one, but I can only pick one person to vote, so it's the one I chose. Once I had what I though was a (slightly) better reason for someone else, I switched.

Anyway, I do think I'm likely to be exiled (which btw X-2 and X-1 is perfect for it), because I know that anything I do to defend myself with be seen as scummy - because it's D1 and there are imho not very good reasons to suspect anyone over anyone else.

But I will throw this out, now at X-2, to make y'alls lives easier. I am not a doctor, just a VT. So if you do exile me, you save yourself the need for the doctor to counter claim AND you only get rid of a VT, which is better than a PR.

[scolapasta]

ppe 1 on that last one, I guess I'm X-1 now. Still not a doctor.

self preservation vote (as promised):

vote: ADK

[Swowl]

Vote: Scola

where did this come from all of a sudden?

[yuma]

I won't agree to any policy.

[yuma]

Also worth noting that soc and ADK aren't voting for each other.

Why is that worth noting?

That you two would/could vote for each other for self preservation  as others already said

[MiX]

So ADK can hammer, right?

[Swowl]

I was gonna say he claims doc here every time as skum, but I guess that is not true.
I still think Pasta is town. They are being accused of hedgy behavior and backing off cases when challenged? that is the only pasta I know, meta wise.

As I don't think there is a rush on DL and we have a prod out... we should at the minimum wait for Galz to get some opinions out publicaly before anyone hammers. Regardless of anyone's alignment, having all the players in the game say their 2 cents on a day 1 decision is unarguably a pro town play.

[A Drowned Kernel]

So ADK can hammer, right?

I might. Let me get home and reread scola, I wasn't opposed to his exile earlier

[Dylan32]

Vote Count 1.6

scolapasta (6): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
shraeye (1): A Drowned Kernel

Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Day 1 lasts until 11:00am FT on July 3, 2020.

[yuma]

ALL THE PEOPLE ON SCOLA ARE SCUMMY

I shouted to no one in particular. But really. Look at my votes and they are them, plus ADK...

[MiX]

ALL THE PEOPLE ON SCOLA ARE SCUMMY

I shouted to no one in particular. But really. Look at my votes and they are them, plus ADK...

"I AM SCOLA'S PARTNER AND I MUST SCREAM"

- yuma

[yuma]

Town partner I am guessing at this point.

[MiX]

Town partner I am guessing at this point.

I don't know, but I think so, yes.

[Galzria]

Sorry! Sorry!

We got back Sunday and Monday I just... like... didn't move for 24 hours. I needed the day to recover. Tuesday, I honestly meant to get involved and then just... didn't. Completely my bad.

I'm finishing catching up right now.

I genuinely read ADK as the scummier of the two wagons, but I have far more town reads on Scola (mcmc, Joth, Robz, e!)...

[scolapasta]

I'd suggest someone unvote me and vote ADK to X-1. See if they want to scum claim doctor. If they do, we've caught scum. And if they don't you can always come back to me.

And if someone hammers ADK first and they're town, well then you get two good possibles exiles for tomorrow, me and the hammer.

[A Drowned Kernel]

I'd suggest someone unvote me and vote ADK to X-1. See if they want to scum claim doctor. If they do, we've caught scum. And if they don't you can always come back to me.

And if someone hammers ADK first and they're town, well then you get two good possibles exiles for tomorrow, me and the hammer.

vote: scola

Thanks for making this easy

[MiX]

You're not a good possible exile if you're town.

Willing to hammer, but not intent to hammer, Galzria needs to say more.

I'd suggest someone unvote me and vote ADK to X-1. See if they want to scum claim doctor. If they do, we've caught scum. And if they don't you can always come back to me.

And if someone hammers ADK first and they're town, well then you get two good possibles exiles for tomorrow, me and the hammer.

vote: scola

Thanks for making this easy

Yeah I don't scumread this in the slighest. Although you should wait for Galzria...

[yuma]

Welp.

[scolapasta]

Well, as I said, am town, VT.

Why doesn't ADK at least wait for galz to finish catching up? even if they get to X-1, no one was going to hammer that immediately, could have vote for me, having us both at X-1 and seen.

I disagree with MiX, I do think this is scummy, trying to hide as self preservation.

[Galzria]

Alright, let's do it this way - I'm not going to vote immediately. If I vote for Scola (hammer), day is over. If I vote for ADK, ADK will definitely vote for Scola (hammer), day is over.

So instead, since I've been absent, does anybody want to fire away questions at me?

Let's do something fun - call scum teams:

{ADK, Didds}
{MiX, [Swowl/Yuma]}

This isn't completely arbitrary - it's based loosely on my scumdar upon re-reading, and the pairings based around votes. The people I'm town reading are, in some sort of order: Mcmc, e!, joth, Robz, Mail-Mi. The people that fall kinda null for me are Swowl, Shraeye and Scola (all the S-names!), although Swowl is on the scummier side of neutral. Can't decide if I think he or Yuma is scummier.

[MiX]

Welp.

So, who do you think the other scumteam is?

Well, as I said, am town, VT.

Why doesn't ADK at least wait for galz to finish catching up? even if they get to X-1, no one was going to hammer that immediately, could have vote for me, having us both at X-1 and seen.

I disagree with MiX, I do think this is scummy, trying to hide as self preservation.

They voted for you because it was you vs them. So they might as well hammer potential scum than always town.

PPE: Funny. Wait why am I scum? And why is Didds ADK's partner?

[scolapasta]

Welp.

So, who do you think the other scumteam is?

Well, as I said, am town, VT.

Why doesn't ADK at least wait for galz to finish catching up? even if they get to X-1, no one was going to hammer that immediately, could have vote for me, having us both at X-1 and seen.

I disagree with MiX, I do think this is scummy, trying to hide as self preservation.

They voted for you because it was you vs them. So they might as well hammer potential scum than always town.

PPE: Funny. Wait why am I scum? And why is Didds ADK's partner?

It was already me vs them, before then. And no one was going to hammer ADK immediately at X-1.

[Galzria]

Well, as I said, am town, VT.

Why doesn't ADK at least wait for galz to finish catching up? even if they get to X-1, no one was going to hammer that immediately, could have vote for me, having us both at X-1 and seen.

I disagree with MiX, I do think this is scummy, trying to hide as self preservation.

Well, I had hoped this. Didn't seem to be a rush.. didn't expect ADK to hammer you. Blah.

My apologies for not being around earlier everyone. Can't be completely upset at ADK here for "not giving me time", even though he could've - my absence Monday/Yesterday was on me.

[scolapasta]

Maybe now people will realize my meta is I'm not very good at this and my "scummy" moves are just that.

(and that I do post some fluff, because well, why not - I'm not a machine. Well, maybe in Westworld mafia, I will be )

[Galzria]

Welp.

So, who do you think the other scumteam is?

Well, as I said, am town, VT.

Why doesn't ADK at least wait for galz to finish catching up? even if they get to X-1, no one was going to hammer that immediately, could have vote for me, having us both at X-1 and seen.

I disagree with MiX, I do think this is scummy, trying to hide as self preservation.

They voted for you because it was you vs them. So they might as well hammer potential scum than always town.

PPE: Funny. Wait why am I scum? And why is Didds ADK's partner?

Didds is ADK's partner because I think she's scummy, and I think ADK is scummy, and I don't think ADK's partner was voting for ADK here.

You're scummy because I was running out of town reads and you always read scummy to me until I have something to really latch on to in believing you to be town. I don't know. I feel like I always scum read you early, and then I either continue to scum read you later when you're actually scum, or switch to town reading you when you're town. Like, the longer the game goes on, the better my read of you gets - but the default is always scummy.

[MiX]

Welp.

So, who do you think the other scumteam is?

Well, as I said, am town, VT.

Why doesn't ADK at least wait for galz to finish catching up? even if they get to X-1, no one was going to hammer that immediately, could have vote for me, having us both at X-1 and seen.

I disagree with MiX, I do think this is scummy, trying to hide as self preservation.

They voted for you because it was you vs them. So they might as well hammer potential scum than always town.

PPE: Funny. Wait why am I scum? And why is Didds ADK's partner?

It was already me vs them, before then. And no one was going to hammer ADK immediately at X-1.

Yeah well when you make it a 1v1 you self-pres as early as possible to minimize the chances of being...exiled.

The problem was whoever put you at X-1 without ADK being on the wagon.

Maybe now people will realize my meta is I'm not very good at this and my "scummy" moves are just that.

(and that I do post some fluff, because well, why not - I'm not a machine. Well, maybe in Westworld mafia, I will be )

Talk about future games!

I don't know what you could've done differently. What I do know is that if you're scum you should be sharing your scumreads

PPE: Oh yeah you're one of those "MiX is scum until proven otherwise" people.

[Swowl]

pasta - skum calls.

[yuma]

Welp.

So, who do you think the other scumteam is?

I dont see any use in giving reads during twilight. They could be the same or they could be different. But a lot changes once an exile happens.

[yuma]

Ugh. Also did you know that you can stop using emojis by selecting an option below? :)

Cool

[scolapasta]

pasta - skum calls.

huh?

[scolapasta]

pasta - skum calls.

huh?

oh, who I think is scum

[scolapasta]

pasta - skum calls.

huh?

oh, who I think is scum

well, it's still who i've voted for at some point, plus Didds, maybe. But as I've said none of these are so strong that I had / have much confidence in.

[WestCoastDidds]

Sheesh... now Galz thinks I’m scummy, too?

Especially if Scola is a mis-X, y’all Ned yo get your town pants on straight and figure out what’s what.

Sorry, Scola...if I had been around tonight I’d have unvoted. Leaving the competing wagon to hammer, two days before deadline, is no bueno.

[scolapasta]

Yeah, mail-mi might be worth a look for the X-1.

[mail-mi]

Yeah, mail-mi might be worth a look for the X-1.

Someone has to be exiled. I reread you and found you scummy, ergo I had the desire to exile you.

[LaLight]

Thread Locked.

[LaLight]

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

[LaLight]

After hearing the captain's orders to find and deal with the Dragonborn infiltrators, the town erupted into chaos.

mcmcsalot has been gone for so long, maybe he came back to destroy our town!

No no, Robz is the real culprit! How else is he able to build campfires that burn so hot?!

You idiot, that's Swowl and Galz that build campfires, and they just soak the wood in oil before lighting it, anyway.

oh, right...

Captain, we've found one of them for sure!

Scolapasta has been exiled. They were a Vanilla Townie.

Night 1 starts now and ends in 48 hours, July, the 4th, at 2 am or a bit later, because it's Saturday morning for me. But not much later.

[LaLight]

The dawn of a new day arised upon the village. Villagers started to wake up, emerged from their houses to their fields, shops, and other village business. Nothing was out of an ordinary, until...

LaLight was a shy and romantic fellow. He was a bard: every morning he aimed to wake up as early as possible to go to the highest hill of the village. He was seeking inspiration there, as there was a person in the village, whom LaLight was planning to propose. And for that, perfectionists as he was, he needed a flawless song. Something that would melt even the iciest heart.

Ironically, this very morning, at the top of the hill, there was a frozen figure not even the best LaLight's song could do anything for.
 
mail-mi was frozen. He was a Vanilla Townie.

But, as sad as it was, this was not the only tragedy to happen tonight.

Robz was a highwayman. Well, former highwayman. He was arrested in the big city and exiled to the nearby village. But can the robbers ever be former?

This night Robz was walking at night, looking for the adrenaline that many times made his heart burned. He didn't want to rob anyone per se, he was just reliving those vivid moments: dark night, a full moon, almost inaudible rustling of the leaves, the figure of a stranger on a crossroads...
Wait. There was a stranger on a crossroads! Robz, unknown even to himself, started approaching the figure. He didn't really plan what to do next, it was the excitement of not-yet-committed crime. But then, the consiousness returned to him. "What am I even doing? I am no more like that!" thought Robz.

He called the stranger. "Hey! It's pretty dark, please be careful out there! There're some sorts of people that can attack you this time of night!"

The stranger turned to Robz, and his heart felt sinking. The eyes of a person were not even red, just the word "red" can't describe the fieriness, the rage, the...

"Dragon" exhaled Robz just before his very soul burned in the eyes of a Red Dragonborn.

Robz888 was burned. He was a Vanilla Townie.

Day 2 starts now!

Vote count 2.0

Not voting (10): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., A Drowned Kernel, Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, Galzria

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to exile. Day 2 ends Saturday, 11th of July, at 5am FT.

Thread unlocked! And happy independence day to my fellow Americans! :)

[2.71828.....]

Harumph.

Interesting.

[2.71828.....]

Both scum teams chose to kill on-wagon.

I don't know what it means, but it must mean something

[MiX]

Probably means they were both on wagon.

Vote: ADK

[2.71828.....]

Alright, let's do it this way - I'm not going to vote immediately. If I vote for Scola (hammer), day is over. If I vote for ADK, ADK will definitely vote for Scola (hammer), day is over.

So instead, since I've been absent, does anybody want to fire away questions at me?

Let's do something fun - call scum teams:

{ADK, Didds}
{MiX, [Swowl/Yuma]}

This isn't completely arbitrary - it's based loosely on my scumdar upon re-reading, and the pairings based around votes. The people I'm town reading are, in some sort of order: Mcmc, e!, joth, Robz, Mail-Mi. The people that fall kinda null for me are Swowl, Shraeye and Scola (all the S-names!), although Swowl is on the scummier side of neutral. Can't decide if I think he or Yuma is scummier.

I like this post from Galzria post-hammer looking back with the flips we have.

Lean town on Galzria

[2.71828.....]

Probably means they were both on wagon.

Vote: ADK

Also, yeah.

Vote: ADK

[2.71828.....]

Alright, let's do it this way - I'm not going to vote immediately. If I vote for Scola (hammer), day is over. If I vote for ADK, ADK will definitely vote for Scola (hammer), day is over.

So instead, since I've been absent, does anybody want to fire away questions at me?

Let's do something fun - call scum teams:

{ADK, Didds}
{MiX, [Swowl/Yuma]}

This isn't completely arbitrary - it's based loosely on my scumdar upon re-reading, and the pairings based around votes. The people I'm town reading are, in some sort of order: Mcmc, e!, joth, Robz, Mail-Mi. The people that fall kinda null for me are Swowl, Shraeye and Scola (all the S-names!), although Swowl is on the scummier side of neutral. Can't decide if I think he or Yuma is scummier.

I like this post from Galzria post-hammer looking back with the flips we have.

Lean town on Galzria

To explain, I don't see a scum team with Galzria killing robz or mail-mi last night after posting this. I mean, possible. He did list a bunch of us as towny. So have to kill someone from somewhere.

But there are better people to go after today

[A Drowned Kernel]

Probably means they were both on wagon.

Vote: ADK

Bad, and lazy

My money is still on vote: shraeye

[WestCoastDidds]

Good morning!

It’s a holiday weekend so I’m likely to be scarce. But then again, I live in a small tourist town where people are freaking crazy so we may be bored and locked inside because the folks on the Outside cannot be trusted. We’ll see....  I hope you all have something fun going on!

The ADK votes don’t seem bad or lazy, although that response is.

[jotheonah]

vote: mcmc  is where I'm at.

[jotheonah]

ALthough I wish he'd elaborated more on his reasons, I'm quite inclined to trust town!Robz's instinct about his brother.

[yuma]

Well I was going to vote mail-mi opening day. But that isn't an option anymore

[yuma]

And I would argue against ADK behavior in the way I argued against Raptor two games ago and most of us saw how that turned out...

[MiX]

Is that all of your vote? Because Robz said so?

Not bad.

Well I was going to vote mail-mi opening day. But that isn't an option anymore

Townie!town? Ew.

So, scola's partner, how'd you get him a deathmiller?

Just kidding you're town too.

PPE: Raptor =/= ADK, to be fair.

[yuma]

That is fair. But still weird behavior from ADK and I usually think weird isn't scummy.

[yuma]

vote: west

West gave basically no reads the entire Day1.

The one read I found was on me, mail-mi and scola and that was when directly asked and was immediately after the mini-wagon that formed there.

I see scum!west as moving very cautiously through the game, especially after that day1 scare...

[yuma]

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Well, uh, you guys forced her. Early pushes on Didds are anti-town as it makes her defend herself.

Instead, what people should've done is take the opportunity and push scola to see if he cracks. Turns out he's just away so that won't work, but pushing Didds doesn't tell us anything either.

I can't decide if Didds is scummy. Is she always this defensive when a couple of people vote for her?

It's not the defensiveness that is getting on me. It's that she forced a return to her chatty friendly meta after people found her scummy for scumhunting (which, again, is not scummy)

Oh, good gravy! Being myself is scummy? And I forced it?

Who's scum?

Scola, Yuma, and yams

This one

[MiX]

"Who's scum?" "town, town and town"

I'm down for Didds, I just want to solve ADK first.

[jotheonah]

Is that all of your vote? Because Robz said so?

Well that plus a persistent gut read. But I’m hoping a re-read will yield a more articulate case.

[A Drowned Kernel]

"Who's scum?" "town, town and town"

I'm down for Didds, I just want to solve ADK first.

Here's a hint: I'm town

[WestCoastDidds]

I’m still town. So, it would be better if we lunched one of the baddies.

MiX’s ease with the idea of scum me is not characteristic. But scum Yuma, I remember. Plus, at least one of my three guesses was probably correct.

Vote: Yuma

[Galzria]

Good morning!

It’s a holiday weekend so I’m likely to be scarce. But then again, I live in a small tourist town where people are freaking crazy so we may be bored and locked inside because the folks on the Outside cannot be trusted. We’ll see....  I hope you all have something fun going on!

The ADK votes don’t seem bad or lazy, although that response is.

I’m still town. So, it would be better if we lunched one of the baddies.

MiX’s ease with the idea of scum me is not characteristic. But scum Yuma, I remember. Plus, at least one of my three guesses was probably correct.

Vote: Yuma

Your fluff has been normal fluff from you - but what’s off is that your game-related opinions and thoughts are a little more cutting than usual.

[Galzria]

vote: Didds for now.

[yuma]

I’m still town. So, it would be better if we lunched one of the baddies.

MiX’s ease with the idea of scum me is not characteristic. But scum Yuma, I remember. Plus, at least one of my three guesses was probably correct.

Vote: Yuma

Cool.

What is the term for what west is doing here in voting me back. Cant remember it... it isn't always scummy as town certainly can do it. But voting w/o any response to what I said about my vote and providing a really poor justification for voting me certainly is...

continue to vote: west

[MiX]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

[Galzria]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

#sarcasm

[yuma]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

I FORGOT! Thanks. I knew it was some sort of obscure abbreviation.

[Galzria]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

I FORGOT! Thanks. I knew it was some sort of obscure abbreviation.

Damn! Really?? I absolutely read it as sarcasm. And it was glorious.

[yuma]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

I FORGOT! Thanks. I knew it was some sort of obscure abbreviation.

Damn! Really?? I absolutely read it as sarcasm. And it was glorious.

My memory is horrible lately⁴

[Swowl]

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Happy 4th everyone!

I’ll get into this tomorrow.

But two separate scum teams made two separate choices and both chose on wagon players.
I’ll do the work tomorrow, but [Swowl, MiX, Yuma, Shraeye, Galz] will probably be a good jumping off point.

[2.71828.....]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

I FORGOT! Thanks. I knew it was some sort of obscure abbreviation.

Damn! Really?? I absolutely read it as sarcasm. And it was glorious.

My memory is horrible lately⁴

I looked for the footnote and didn't find it.

[yuma]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

I FORGOT! Thanks. I knew it was some sort of obscure abbreviation.

Damn! Really?? I absolutely read it as sarcasm. And it was glorious.

My memory is horrible lately⁴

I looked for the footnote and didn't find it.

I forgot to add it.

[jotheonah]

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Happy 4th everyone!

I’ll get into this tomorrow.

But two separate scum teams made two separate choices and both chose on wagon players.
I’ll do the work tomorrow, but [Swowl, MiX, Yuma, Shraeye, Galz] will probably be a good jumping off point.

I think scum probably was focusing on two things:

- not targeting the same team as each other
- trying to hit the doctor

Neither of those considerations is particularly related to wagon position.

[yuma]

Day2 joth is suddenly saying much of what I am 5hinking. Wagon analysis for that purpose is rarely useful and certainly misses how I think about NKs as scum, but especially in this game.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

I FORGOT! Thanks. I knew it was some sort of obscure abbreviation.

Damn! Really?? I absolutely read it as sarcasm. And it was glorious.

My memory is horrible lately⁴

Day2 joth is suddenly saying much of what I am 5hinking. Wagon analysis for that purpose is rarely useful and certainly misses how I think about NKs as scum, but especially in this game.

What exactly are you going for here?

[yuma]

Can't tell if you're joking or you forgot about OMGUS.

I FORGOT! Thanks. I knew it was some sort of obscure abbreviation.

Damn! Really?? I absolutely read it as sarcasm. And it was glorious.

My memory is horrible lately⁴

Day2 joth is suddenly saying much of what I am 5hinking. Wagon analysis for that purpose is rarely useful and certainly misses how I think about NKs as scum, but especially in this game.

What exactly are you going for here?

Who knows...

I am basically saying I have opinions, but they are based on metas and ideas of yesteryear and my memory of them are questionable...

But! I do know that when I am mafia the choice of killing on or off wagon is basically never a main reason for a NK. Here in this game there are multiple higher priorities for the NK: Doctor hunting, other team hunting, making sure NK isn't doctored or duplicated, making sure not take out likely misexiles.

So basically saying I agree with joth a disagree with Swowl that using wagon analysis for a vote justification seems insufficient. I think that is something Swowl relies on but doesn't work as much here.

[A Drowned Kernel]

I meant why are you putting random numbers in your posts

[yuma]

I meant why are you putting random numbers in your posts

Typos

[WestCoastDidds]

Good morning!

It’s a holiday weekend so I’m likely to be scarce. But then again, I live in a small tourist town where people are freaking crazy so we may be bored and locked inside because the folks on the Outside cannot be trusted. We’ll see....  I hope you all have something fun going on!

The ADK votes don’t seem bad or lazy, although that response is.

I’m still town. So, it would be better if we lunched one of the baddies.

MiX’s ease with the idea of scum me is not characteristic. But scum Yuma, I remember. Plus, at least one of my three guesses was probably correct.

Vote: Yuma

Your fluff has been normal fluff from you - but what’s off is that your game-related opinions and thoughts are a little more cutting than usual.

I did not appreciate being accused of being inauthentic. I know it is the game and it’s not personal, but my feelings were hurt. That was the reference in my comment about being on tilt. Tilt is my word for feeling wounded. So I’m having trouble developing a sense of fun and mutual appreciation in this game. I’m not still hurt,  but I got sort of depleted in the process.

I won’t be sad if I get exiled because I’m not sure this dynamic is my jam. But if I don’t defend myself, and get mis-xed we have a way harder time winning. So, I’m trying to suck it up.

So, if I’m reading as terse of cutting, yeah, I guess. It’s not my preferred way of being in the world.

[yuma]

The things west has consistently responded to are things that deal with how others are perceiving and are more on the personal side. As a result the defense, naturally and appropriately, on those points are more appeals to emotion.

But, west hasn't responded to the points about actual game play. And those are the points I most want a response on, but haven't received. Al though to be fair I haven't specifically asked. Am I the only one that seems those points as significant?

[MiX]

The things west has consistently responded to are things that deal with how others are perceiving and are more on the personal side. As a result the defense, naturally and appropriately, on those points are more appeals to emotion.

But, west hasn't responded to the points about actual game play. And those are the points I most want a response on, but haven't received. Al though to be fair I haven't specifically asked. Am I the only one that seems those points as significant?

No.

There, that's my post for today.

Pushing Didds is anti-town. We can exile her, but pushing is terrible, which only makes me want to get rid of her as fast as possible.

yuma broke the ice, you can all come out of hiding now.

[A Drowned Kernel]

The things west has consistently responded to are things that deal with how others are perceiving and are more on the personal side. As a result the defense, naturally and appropriately, on those points are more appeals to emotion.

But, west hasn't responded to the points about actual game play. And those are the points I most want a response on, but haven't received. Al though to be fair I haven't specifically asked. Am I the only one that seems those points as significant?

If I understand your position correctly, you're saying that didds had a lack of strong reads and a passive playstyle D1, which I feel like describes a lot of players' D1 playstyle, and certainly describes how didds usually plays

[Swowl]

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Happy 4th everyone!

I’ll get into this tomorrow.

But two separate scum teams made two separate choices and both chose on wagon players.
I’ll do the work tomorrow, but [Swowl, MiX, Yuma, Shraeye, Galz] will probably be a good jumping off point.

I think scum probably was focusing on two things:

- not targeting the same team as each other
- trying to hit the doctor

Neither of those considerations is particularly related to wagon position.

right, yeah that is fair enough in theory. However, we have to remember that Skum Team A does not know who Skum team B is. So, in reality what i would assume to be actually true is simply; shoot other skum >  shoot the doctor > shoot VT.

Now all that being said I actually do not think that they would even care all that much about the doctor at this point in the set up. Doctor shots are based on reads, reads could be wrong. I mean yeah they will put their kill above VT in  terms of value, but it would just be happenstance, I don't think they plan for it.

Pretty much - I think that the only thing in terms of what Skum was thinking about at night that actually played into their kill selection is trying to shoot other skum.

(So yeah - all of the above is me kind of agreeing with you I guess). But wait there's more!

PPE 3

[yuma]

The things west has consistently responded to are things that deal with how others are perceiving and are more on the personal side. As a result the defense, naturally and appropriately, on those points are more appeals to emotion.

But, west hasn't responded to the points about actual game play. And those are the points I most want a response on, but haven't received. Al though to be fair I haven't specifically asked. Am I the only one that seems those points as significant?

No.

There, that's my post for today.

Pushing Didds is anti-town. We can exile her, but pushing is terrible, which only makes me want to get rid of her as fast as possible.

yuma broke the ice, you can all come out of hiding now.

vote: mix

Least useful post ever

[MiX]

What's the vote for?

[yuma]

Someone else can take a turn.

And FYI my work recently became hellish again. Two employees are out on quarantine protocol for at least a week.... maybe 2. So my availability is maybe a few minutes during breaks and late evenings.

[yuma]

What's the vote for?

For not being helpful

[MiX]

What's the vote for?

For not being helpful

Here's help: don't make Didds freeze the thread by pushing her based on nothing.

What do you want me to do? I could've stayed silent, is that what you wanted?

[Swowl]

...more....

We had several large-ish wagons yesterday. However, the main ones (bc RVS, size, timing) would be; Pasta and ADK.

It is kind of hard to do this without a skum flip, but let's start here...

If ADK is skum, then...
1) I agree that it is very unlikely that their partner would not be on Pasta.
2) I also do not think they would be one of the players that ended on Pasta, but were on ADK.

Now we have no way of knowing if ADK is skum or not, so that really doesn't help us right? Except then I look at who was voting for ADK, or not voting for Pasta rather; [Swowl, MiX, Yuma, Shraeye, Galz].

So here is the Swowl "I am forcing VCA down your throat, I will find a way to at least make it make some sense" theory.... Here are the scenarios for the wagons for us to look at:

a) Town!Scola, Town!ADK - Skum A knows other Skum A, and Skum B knows other Skum B. All skum however, would be 100% ok with either of these wagons.

b) Town!Scola, SkumA!ADK - Skum Team A other is 100% on Pasta there. Unfortunately, no real way of pounding that one out. They could of either been sitting up in the front half and not moving because partner was only other option, or they could be an off wagoner that moved to Pasta in the later end.... both possible. OK - buttttt... skum Team B would be treating this scenario the same as Situation A above here. It might as well be town v town to them (bc in this case it is just 2 wagons that are NOT Skum B).
So they would be split - firmly believe that. I also firmly believe that talking about why I think that is def not the best right now, but like tomorrow probably, or after we flip a skum... if people need it I can give my reasons. But I think it is right.

c) Town!Scola, SkumB!ADK - Exact same thing as "b)", just reversed.


So that may be a little ramble-y, so here is the TLDR:

Either ADK is town or ADK is skum.
 - If ADK is town then there were two teams of 2 who would of been completely fine with being on EITHER wagon, as it is would be town v town.
 - If ADK is skum, then the skum team that does not consist of ADK would probably have one player on ADK and one player on Pasta. Additionally, ADK's partner would be on Pasta.

So really, there is a pretty decent chance that there are between 2-3 skum on Pasta there (3 if ADK is skum).

So yeah that is kind of the exact opposite logic as what I mini posted yesterday - but as I mentioned, after reconsidering, Joth and Yuma are correct, the VCA is way different and WAYYY less valuable this game in this set up.
So I guess it is just more of a jumping off point.... I guess I still am going with ADK for now because outside of VCA that is still who I find the most skummy.

Vote: ADK

PPE 5

[yuma]

What's the vote for?

For not being helpful

Here's help: don't make Didds freeze the thread by pushing her based on nothing.

What do you want me to do? I could've stayed silent, is that what you wanted?

I dont think I pushed her on nothing.... Your first post didnt say that nor did it say why it was about nothing, but I guess I didnt specifically ask for that.... Thanks for clarifying but I am keeping my vote.

[WestCoastDidds]

It feels like Yuma wants me to have some kind of big insight about the folks or the game. But his insight seems to comprised entirely of finding me scummy for assorted reasons that are all basically tied to me intrinsically.

What do I think? I didn’t like that ADK ended the day early, especially since Galz had just shown up. Galz not showing up until then was not helpful, and would be scummy if it wasn’t Galz. MiX is irritated right now (sorry, didn’t mean to freeze the thread) so he’s not fully engaged. But Yuma is trying to make his efforts to create some sort of case on me seem far more laudable than they are.

PPE : Deux

[MiX]

I dont think I pushed her on nothing.... Your first post didnt say that nor did it say why it was about nothing, but I guess I didnt specifically ask for that.... Thanks for clarifying but I am keeping my vote.

I'm not talking about you alone, you know.


As for Swowl's wall post...is the conclusion that you can't take away conclusions? If so, why are you voting ADK?

PPE 1

[yuma]

When you respond to my post I am always going to assume you are talking to me.

I won't be posting for a bit. I feel like I am detracting from content being generated and want to hear what others have to say before I get more set on anything.

[MiX]

When you respond to my post I am always going to assume you are talking to me.

I won't be posting for a bit. I feel like I am detracting from content being generated and want to hear what others have to say before I get more set on anything.

Sorry, the part about your post ended after the "No", I guess that wasn't clear.

[Swowl]

I dont think I pushed her on nothing.... Your first post didnt say that nor did it say why it was about nothing, but I guess I didnt specifically ask for that.... Thanks for clarifying but I am keeping my vote.

I'm not talking about you alone, you know.


As for Swowl's wall post...is the conclusion that you can't take away conclusions? If so, why are you voting ADK?

PPE 1

pretty much. at least for now. ADK because I skum read them yesterday and that hasn't changed today.

[mcmcsalot]

Holiday weekend is over, will catch up during lunch break tomorrow.

[WestCoastDidds]

Good morning, friends! I hope the weekend treated you well. We played Dominion online with the kid last night. It seems better for him than more fortnite. Here’s what I know....the Margrave is NOT FUN in a three person game.

Thanks, Swowl for the extensive reread. The two tiny scum teams makes my head hurt Because it changes everything. The only thing we know for sure is that wagons on town will grow and prosper, but a scum wagon is going to have some sort of resistance from someone other than the person themselves. Bussing is scary because it could go sideways so quickly and then the team is down to one.

[jotheonah]

MiX  are there  things you'd  like to say about Stormlight now that it's no longer [ongoing game]?

[MiX]

MiX  are there  things you'd  like to say about Stormlight now that it's no longer [ongoing game]?

I'm glad I'm town, and I lost practice. I haven't even setup all of my reads, let alone start thinking about the VCA.

Part of that is exam season, but I was so relaxed that game, it was really relieving. I don't feel like putting effort...

[MiX]

Prod: shraeye

[LaLight]

Vote count 2.1

A Drowned Kernel (3): 2.71828....., Swowl, MiX
shraeye (1): A Drowned Kernel
mcmcsalot (1): jotheonah
WestCoastDidds (1): Galzria
yuma (1): WestCoastDidds
MiX (1): yuma
Not voting (2): mcmcsalot, shraeye

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to exile. Day 2 ends Saturday, 11th of July, at 5am FT.

shraeye has been prodded

[WestCoastDidds]

Good luck on your exams, MiX!!

[2.71828.....]

Hey, game is real slow right now. I will go back through again tonight or tomorrow, specifically looking at ADK again as well as what our exiled friends had to say

[Swowl]

So here is a weird idea. ...

4 skum and 5 Town... the skum are split up so it is really 2v2v5 I suppose.

If we mis lynch + 1 town death + 1 skum death... which seems oddly specific, but I think it is a good balance "average" of what happens in terms of night actions.. but like.... that is 1v2v3. Let alone 2 Town night deaths which would be 2v2v2 lol.

There are other factors, like doc shot and obviously if we do not mis lynch today then yay.

That is a lot of whatever - should we be considering a no lynch here and just let skum shoot at each other?
no, right?

[MiX]

There's 10 players alive, so I presume that if you are correct about what you're saying then we should exile.

Also, there's 3 factions, and all of them have a faction kill. We shouldn't waste ours.

The day phase should be for everyone to scumhunt. This helps scum find scum and helps us do their job for them.

..unfortunately I don't really have the drive to do that. I have exams all the way to deadline, so don't expect much of me this day.

[Swowl]

There's 10 players alive, so I presume that if you are correct about what you're saying then we should exile.

Also, there's 3 factions, and all of them have a faction kill. We shouldn't waste ours.

The day phase should be for everyone to scumhunt. This helps scum find scum and helps us do their job for them.

..unfortunately I don't really have the drive to do that. I have exams all the way to deadline, so don't expect much of me this day.

oh yeah I must of removed myself in the math... so for sure we lynch then mb. nevermiiiinnnddd

[Swowl]

There's 10 players alive, so I presume that if you are correct about what you're saying then we should exile.

Also, there's 3 factions, and all of them have a faction kill. We shouldn't waste ours.

The day phase should be for everyone to scumhunt. This helps scum find scum and helps us do their job for them.

..unfortunately I don't really have the drive to do that. I have exams all the way to deadline, so don't expect much of me this day.

oh yeah I must of removed myself in the math... so for sure we lynch then mb. nevermiiiinnnddd

*exile* - sorry

[shraeye]

Both scum teams chose to kill on-wagon.

I don't know what it means, but it must mean something

I think that we're gonna find scum easiest off-wagon then.

[shraeye]

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Happy 4th everyone!

I’ll get into this tomorrow.

But two separate scum teams made two separate choices and both chose on wagon players.
I’ll do the work tomorrow, but [Swowl, MiX, Yuma, Shraeye, Galz] will probably be a good jumping off point.

I think scum probably was focusing on two things:

- not targeting the same team as each other
- trying to hit the doctor

Neither of those considerations is particularly related to wagon position.

How does a scumteam focus on avoiding the other kill?

[shraeye]

The things west has consistently responded to are things that deal with how others are perceiving and are more on the personal side. As a result the defense, naturally and appropriately, on those points are more appeals to emotion.

But, west hasn't responded to the points about actual game play. And those are the points I most want a response on, but haven't received. Al though to be fair I haven't specifically asked. Am I the only one that seems those points as significant?

No.

There, that's my post for today.

Pushing Didds is anti-town. We can exile her, but pushing is terrible, which only makes me want to get rid of her as fast as possible.

yuma broke the ice, you can all come out of hiding now.

i dont understand, you're saying that pushing her is terrible (a stance that I feel like you've consistently fought against in the past, saying "gut reactions are the best, that's why I push"), so we should just exile her first without thinking about it too much?

[shraeye]

*Swowl does VCA*

This really looks like you first thought ADK was scum, THEN did an analysis.

You say "if ADK is town, then scum were ok with either wagon" but then conclude there are 2-3 scum on scola's wagon...is that true even if ADK is town?? why would that make scum want to be on scola's wagon more than ADKs?

Why are you ignoring where the kills were?

[shraeye]

ADK because I skum read them yesterday and that hasn't changed today.

That's exactly what it looked like to me.  Good job on consistency.  Bad job on honestly scumhunting.

[shraeye]

the Margrave is NOT FUN in a three person game.

Fixed it. 

Also, did you agree with Swow's conclusions on his analysis?  What did you take away from his post?

[shraeye]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

[MiX]

i dont understand, you're saying that pushing her is terrible (a stance that I feel like you've consistently fought against in the past, saying "gut reactions are the best, that's why I push"), so we should just exile her first without thinking about it too much?

I'm saying that in this game it's not being useful. Could be because she's scum, but I don't think it's conclusive since it just makes Didds hyper defensive.

ADK because I skum read them yesterday and that hasn't changed today.

That's exactly what it looked like to me.  Good job on consistency.  Bad job on honestly scumhunting.

Do you think he's town, scum, or "no answer"?

[shraeye]

ADK because I skum read them yesterday and that hasn't changed today.

That's exactly what it looked like to me.  Good job on consistency.  Bad job on honestly scumhunting.

Do you think he's town, scum, or "no answer"?

Who is the "he"?

I am mighty suspicious of Swowl. 

[MiX]

Swowl.

Okay, well I'm townreading him for the approach to the VCA but I can see why you wouldn't.

[WestCoastDidds]

the Margrave is NOT FUN in a three person game.

Fixed it. 

Also, did you agree with Swow's conclusions on his analysis?  What did you take away from his post?

Fair enough. But it’s especially bad when you margraved twice!

It had reread qualities, although it’s more VCA than anything. The length was rereadish. Here is what I know about DatSwoel...VCA is his thing, but when he’s using it up steer a game, it’s when he’s scum. Best evidence was in the customer service game we just finished. Scum!Swowl and scum!yuma exhibition there.

[WestCoastDidds]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Ah, sorry...answered that one above. But I didn’t say what I thought of his conclusions.

The steering feels scummy and it seemed like he started with the end in mind (which he concedes) but then again ADK was ringing my scumbells, too. So I don’t disagree....mostly I think they aren’t on the same team.

[yuma]

I will vote for west or mix today. You guys can pick.

[A Drowned Kernel]

I will vote for west or mix today. You guys can pick.

I'd vote for mix over didds but neither is as good as shraeye

the Margrave is NOT FUN in a three person game.

Fixed it. 

Also, did you agree with Swow's conclusions on his analysis?  What did you take away from his post?

Fair enough. But it’s especially bad when you margraved twice!

Totally game-unrelated dominion posts: every margrave you get hit with past the first helps you

[yuma]

Actually... yeah. I can see that.

vote: shraeye

[Swowl]

*Swowl does VCA*

This really looks like you first thought ADK was scum, THEN did an analysis.

You say "if ADK is town, then scum were ok with either wagon" but then conclude there are 2-3 scum on scola's wagon...is that true even if ADK is town?? why would that make scum want to be on scola's wagon more than ADKs?

Why are you ignoring where the kills were?

I pushed for ADK all of Day 1 - so yes, I did my VCA under two scenarios, and one is where my lead skum pick "could be skum". Not quite sure what is weird about that.

I also went into fairly decent detail on why I was "ignoring" where the kills were - but in a nutshell, again... I think that boiled down, the importance of Skum Team A shooting Skum Team B, or vice versa, would of been so overly important to them in comparison to stuff like "wagon placement and how to use it for choosing the NK". Which I think is pretty solid point actually. You really think skum from Skum Team A is gonna be like "oh yeah I reallllllllyyyyy think Player X is other skum team... but man... it would limit the on/off wagon pool so let's just kill someone that is probably town"? - yeah that is never happening.

Also, more simplistically - Skum team A does not know who is on the other skum team, and vice versa... so even if all the skums went into night with like zero reads... it still really wouldn't mean all that much... except for like how they could be split... which I think I also pointed out.

I feel like I said all of this already? Am I crazy?

[Swowl]

the Margrave is NOT FUN in a three person game.

Fixed it. 

Also, did you agree with Swow's conclusions on his analysis?  What did you take away from his post?

Fair enough. But it’s especially bad when you margraved twice!

It had reread qualities, although it’s more VCA than anything. The length was rereadish. Here is what I know about DatSwoel...VCA is his thing, but when he’s using it up steer a game, it’s when he’s scum. Best evidence was in the customer service game we just finished. Scum!Swowl and scum!yuma exhibition there.

In VCA's defense.... I have also ridden that beezy into some cool wins, and some goulish losses... both as town not skum. I once used it so much as town it somehow drove Town!Awaclus to self hammer. I shit you not.

[2.71828.....]

Reading shraeye's what appears to be stream of conscious posting and swowl's reply....

I don't want to exile either of them today

[MiX]

the Margrave is NOT FUN in a three person game.

Fixed it. 

Also, did you agree with Swow's conclusions on his analysis?  What did you take away from his post?

Fair enough. But it’s especially bad when you margraved twice!

It had reread qualities, although it’s more VCA than anything. The length was rereadish. Here is what I know about DatSwoel...VCA is his thing, but when he’s using it up steer a game, it’s when he’s scum. Best evidence was in the customer service game we just finished. Scum!Swowl and scum!yuma exhibition there.

In VCA's defense.... I have also ridden that beezy into some cool wins, and some goulish losses... both as town not skum. I once used it so much as town it somehow drove Town!Awaclus to self hammer. I shit you not.

Now that's a moment for history.

Reading shraeye's what appears to be stream of conscious posting and swowl's reply....

I don't want to exile either of them today

That's where I'm at too.

Still see no reason to move my vote from ADK.

[WestCoastDidds]

MiX, what do you think about Yuma?

[mcmcsalot]

I’m caught up. Having a hard time parsing much together because we got 3 town flips that are likely townies who were being scumread by both town and scum.

[mcmcsalot]

Hey, game is real slow right now. I will go back through again tonight or tomorrow, specifically looking at ADK again as well as what our exiled friends had to say

Did you get anything from this?

[jotheonah]

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

Happy 4th everyone!

I’ll get into this tomorrow.

But two separate scum teams made two separate choices and both chose on wagon players.
I’ll do the work tomorrow, but [Swowl, MiX, Yuma, Shraeye, Galz] will probably be a good jumping off point.

I think scum probably was focusing on two things:

- not targeting the same team as each other
- trying to hit the doctor

Neither of those considerations is particularly related to wagon position.

How does a scumteam focus on avoiding the other kill?

By avoiding obvious choices.

[jotheonah]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Shraeye, is the implication here that Swowl and Didds are partners, Swowl said something in the  night QT about planning to do a reread, and then Didds scumslipped by using that term even though Swowl hadn't?

[jotheonah]

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

[jotheonah]

I’m caught up. Having a hard time parsing much together because we got 3 town flips that are likely townies who were being scumread by both town and scum.

This. Also, I miss Robzy. Was so excited to play with him again and then he was gone.

[MiX]

I’m caught up. Having a hard time parsing much together because we got 3 town flips that are likely townies who were being scumread by both town and scum.

Were they being scumread by town? I was townreading mail-mi and I feel like people were seeing town!Robz, although that's kinda hard due to how he plays scum.

MiX, what do you think about Yuma?

I think he's townie.

By avoiding obvious choices.

How do you do that? What's an "obvious" choice?

[jotheonah]

How do you do that? What's an "obvious" choice?

People who have breadcrumbed a PR, people who are  universally or nearly-universally townread, people who get N1 NKd as a matter of course like faust...

[mcmcsalot]

I’m caught up. Having a hard time parsing much together because we got 3 town flips that are likely townies who were being scumread by both town and scum.

Were they being scumread by town? I was townreading mail-mi and I feel like people were seeing town!Robz, although that's kinda hard due to how he plays scum.

Interesting looking back other than my initial vote for mail-mi 2.7 is the only other person who voted mail-mi all day. Robz had a few votes but all were pretty much surrounding his self vote and he was getting townreads towards the end of the day. Maybe scum was doctor hunting then? They were both pro doctor claim which feel like if anything it would point to not being the doctor but wifom for sure.

[shraeye]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Shraeye, is the implication here that Swowl and Didds are partners, Swowl said something in the  night QT about planning to do a reread, and then Didds scumslipped by using that term even though Swowl hadn't?

That was the angle I wanted to hear Didds elaborate on.

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

Can you explain the "BUT" again?

[jotheonah]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Shraeye, is the implication here that Swowl and Didds are partners, Swowl said something in the  night QT about planning to do a reread, and then Didds scumslipped by using that term even though Swowl hadn't?

That was the angle I wanted to hear Didds elaborate on.

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

Can you explain the "BUT" again?

It's pretty straightforward. I feel like you just  now showed up to play, and while that makes me happy, it does you no credit that you did so around the time a number of people started voting for you.

[MiX]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Shraeye, is the implication here that Swowl and Didds are partners, Swowl said something in the  night QT about planning to do a reread, and then Didds scumslipped by using that term even though Swowl hadn't?

That was the angle I wanted to hear Didds elaborate on.

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

Can you explain the "BUT" again?

It's pretty straightforward. I feel like you just  now showed up to play, and while that makes me happy, it does you no credit that you did so around the time a number of people started voting for you.

He showed up when I prodded him.

At least that's the timing ITT maybe he was lurking.

[Swowl]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Shraeye, is the implication here that Swowl and Didds are partners, Swowl said something in the  night QT about planning to do a reread, and then Didds scumslipped by using that term even though Swowl hadn't?

That was the angle I wanted to hear Didds elaborate on.

so all of this inaccurate - but more funny is how the two of you are acting wayyyy more partnery/leady in the accusation of calling someone else partnery.

[jotheonah]

vote: swowl

[mcmcsalot]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Shraeye, is the implication here that Swowl and Didds are partners, Swowl said something in the  night QT about planning to do a reread, and then Didds scumslipped by using that term even though Swowl hadn't?

That was the angle I wanted to hear Didds elaborate on.

so all of this inaccurate - but more funny is how the two of you are acting wayyyy more partnery/leady in the accusation of calling someone else partnery.

Yea I don’t see the didds/swowl connection here, but I also don’t think it is scummy of shraeye and joth to be discussing it.

[MiX]

vote: swowl

Did scum find each other? Cute.

I think you guys are wrong about ADK though.

[shraeye]

What has been said about ADK?

which "you guys"?

[MiX]

What has been said about ADK?

which "you guys"?

You/joth and Swowl/Didds obviously

Not much, actually.

[shraeye]

How am i wrong about ADK then?

[Swowl]

Follow-up.  Why did you call Swowl's analysis a "reread"?

Shraeye, is the implication here that Swowl and Didds are partners, Swowl said something in the  night QT about planning to do a reread, and then Didds scumslipped by using that term even though Swowl hadn't?

That was the angle I wanted to hear Didds elaborate on.

so all of this inaccurate - but more funny is how the two of you are acting wayyyy more partnery/leady in the accusation of calling someone else partnery.

Yea I don’t see the didds/swowl connection here, but I also don’t think it is scummy of shraeye and joth to be discussing it.

to be clear - this was a half joke. While I do think it is "funny" I also doubt a skum duo of Shraeye!Joth partner up on me in this way.

The fact that Shraeye is throwing shade randomly my way is weird, but the game is slow, so that could just be town trying to find something to push I guess.

[Swowl]

How am i wrong about ADK then?

have you given any original thought on ADK today?
All I can find is you questioning why I had them dog eared as skum in my VCA post.

[shraeye]

How am i wrong about ADK then?

I haven't, which made mixs statement pop out.

have you given any original thought on ADK today?
All I can find is you questioning why I had them dog eared as skum in my VCA post.

[shraeye]

How am i wrong about ADK then?

have you given any original thought on ADK today?
All I can find is you questioning why I had them dog eared as skum in my VCA post.

I haven't, which is what made mixs statement pop out

[MiX]

Didds is town.

Let's just exile ADK and go back to sleep I'm tired of scum being alive.

[MiX]

I have a billion new thoughts on the setup which should be brought out in bits and pieces as most of them are anti-town.

AMA because if I start talking out of nowhere I'll spill something that shouldn't be said.

Scum's on wagon because scum shot where they thought the other scumteam was, and the easiest way to think about that is shooting where you are located. This means there's 2-4 scum on wagon. This is much more likely if ADK's scum than town.

[MiX]

How am i wrong about ADK then?

have you given any original thought on ADK today?
All I can find is you questioning why I had them dog eared as skum in my VCA post.

I haven't, which is what made mixs statement pop out

What I meant was a joke on you/joth looking like partners, Swowl/Didds as well, and joth voted Swowl. Thus each scum pair was scumreading the other (you don't need both players of the pair to publicly scumread for the pair to scumread as scum act independently). However, since ADK is scummy, I was suggesting that all 4 of you were wrong, as you missed ADK being scum, and are instead scumreading each other.

Now, this doesn't make any sense, but it sounds incredibly funny to me, which is why I said it.

[yuma]

Someone tell me why scola and I were partners, but Mix and Didds aren't?

[MiX]

Someone tell me why scola and I were partners, but Mix and Didds aren't?

Because I know how to read people, and you don't.

Empirically anyway. In theory it's the reverse.

Also you're town partners, as you said.

[yuma]

ouch

[yuma]

I am devastated.... Devastated!

[yuma]

intent to hammer Mix

[MiX]

ouch

I mean what kind of question is that.

You are partners with scola. Right?

I am devastated.... Devastated!

I mean, no, but also, yes.

intent to hammer Mix

Oh...

[MiX]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

[Swowl]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.

you 100% on that or 99.99% sure on that?

[MiX]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.

you 100% on that or 99.99% sure on that?

99% only, sorry.

[yuma]

I am not implying you cant defend didds. And I'll hold grudges as long as I want. It is what makes the meta game.... and jokey...

The rest I have no idea what you are referring to...

[A Drowned Kernel]

I have a billion new thoughts on the setup which should be brought out in bits and pieces as most of them are anti-town.

AMA because if I start talking out of nowhere I'll spill something that shouldn't be said.

Scum's on wagon because scum shot where they thought the other scumteam was, and the easiest way to think about that is shooting where you are located. This means there's 2-4 scum on wagon. This is much more likely if ADK's scum than town.

Why does my alignment affect this argument?

[yuma]

Raise your hand if you have been scum in multiball before.

[Swowl]

I have a billion new thoughts on the setup which should be brought out in bits and pieces as most of them are anti-town.

AMA because if I start talking out of nowhere I'll spill something that shouldn't be said.

Scum's on wagon because scum shot where they thought the other scumteam was, and the easiest way to think about that is shooting where you are located. This means there's 2-4 scum on wagon. This is much more likely if ADK's scum than town.

Why does my alignment affect this argument?

because you would be 1 of the potential 2-4.

[WestCoastDidds]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

Wow, MiX! That is lit! I like the fiery version of you.

[yuma]

Raise your hand if you have been scum in multiball before.

I am having long conversations with myself about this, so typing it out.

Basically I am taking the approach this day so far that analyzing the wagons in terms of who scum night killed and way is somewhat fruitless.

I think this because when I have played multiball in the past that wasn't something that I considered. Without delving too into what I already said into the past, I had other priorities. Now that is assuming that 1. that is good play and 2. that scum are playing that way here.

Both are bad assumptions right? I think I won a handful of multiball games as scum before. But that doesn't mean I won because of that play or that it is a good play. There are lots of ways to win as scum...

So what I am trying to say is that I am going to take a more open mind about the ideas presented above and the implications that is has for scum hunting in general. Because there really isn't anything else that has generated content or actual conversation. (Not throwing shade, it is just the state of the game and I am that way as well). So yeah, I'll read those posts and reasses.

[WestCoastDidds]

Raise your hand if you have been scum in multiball before.

The game (Random word) where Mail-mi/WCD and MiX/chairs were the two scum teams just ended.

It was the first time (I think) that I’ve been regular scum (I was a traitor-ish person in the first falling skies) on f.ds. But I forget things so I could be wrong.

[WestCoastDidds]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

The more I read this, the more awesome I think it is. It rather perfectly captures the ethos of this game which should now be known as: Come At Me, Bro mafia.

[mcmcsalot]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

The more I read this, the more awesome I think it is. It rather perfectly captures the ethos of this game which should now be known as: Come At Me, Bro mafia.

I don’t feel like that is the ethos of this game at all.

Vote: didds

[yuma]

vote: Didds!!!

[MiX]

vote: Didds!!!

There's a really good scum!Didds game that proves you wrong.

Maybe, I don't know, I'd need to reread it honestly.

[WestCoastDidds]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

The more I read this, the more awesome I think it is. It rather perfectly captures the ethos of this game which should now be known as: Come At Me, Bro mafia.

I don’t feel like that is the ethos of this game at all.

Vote: didds

Then you have been playing in a way different game than I have

[mcmcsalot]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

The more I read this, the more awesome I think it is. It rather perfectly captures the ethos of this game which should now be known as: Come At Me, Bro mafia.

I don’t feel like that is the ethos of this game at all.

Vote: didds

Then you have been playing in a way different game than I have

Exactly my thought

[WestCoastDidds]

LaLi, can you please prod Galz? He has been around since 7/4. Thank you!

[LaLight]

LaLi, can you please prod Galz? He has been around since 7/4. Thank you!

Oh I sure can. Galzria has been prodded.

[LaLight]

Vote count 2.2

A Drowned Kernel (3): 2.71828....., Swowl, MiX
shraeye (1): A Drowned Kernel
WestCoastDidds (3): Galzria, mcmcsalot, yuma
yuma (1): WestCoastDidds
Swowl (1): jotheonah
Not voting (1): shraeye

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to exile. Day 2 ends Saturday, 11th of July, at 5am FT.

[jotheonah]

Ok, well, I still prefer Swowl but vote: WCD for the sake of consolidating. That's L-2.

[shraeye]

Ok, well, I still prefer Swowl but vote: WCD for the sake of consolidating. That's L-2.

No, let's go back to Swowl.  I strongly prefer there over Didds

vote: Swowl

[shraeye]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

The more I read this, the more awesome I think it is. It rather perfectly captures the ethos of this game which should now be known as: Come At Me, Bro mafia.

I don’t feel like that is the ethos of this game at all.

Vote: didds

No, it kinda is how Didds say it be.  But this is a super weird difference-of-opinion to turn into a vote.  You think Didds is scummy because she doesn't characterize the game the way you do....?

[jotheonah]

Ok, well, I still prefer Swowl but vote: WCD for the sake of consolidating. That's L-2.

No, let's go back to Swowl.  I strongly prefer there over Didds

vote: Swowl

okeley dokeley
vote: Swowl

[Galzria]

I’m caught up. Having a hard time parsing much together because we got 3 town flips that are likely townies who were being scumread by both town and scum.

This is pretty much where I'm at... and there's just not much going on - which I guess my not posting is contributing to. I'm just better at making reads when I'm more focused on reading than I am interacting. That's a bad way of putting it. I think a better way is that when I talk to people, I tend to be swayed by their words, whereas when I just listen to people I get a more emotionally independent read on them. Take BM31 that just concluded. While I was actively involved with getting scum!MiX lynched D1, I then just kinda read along D2 - and correctly identified not only two of the three remaining scum, (Chairs, Didds, Mail-Mi), but even which teams they belonged to.

That said - I'll try to do better.

Thusfar today, I'm quite content with my read on Didds. Shraeye has moved into my town pile for his responses to MiX & Swowl. Nothing else has really moved for me.

[mcmcsalot]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

The more I read this, the more awesome I think it is. It rather perfectly captures the ethos of this game which should now be known as: Come At Me, Bro mafia.

I don’t feel like that is the ethos of this game at all.

Vote: didds

No, it kinda is how Didds say it be.  But this is a super weird difference-of-opinion to turn into a vote.  You think Didds is scummy because she doesn't characterize the game the way you do....?

I have not felt like this game is a guns out bring it on come at me bro discourse around all. In fact I have found it to be more mellow with lots of cooperation, people are consolidating so that we don’t end the day with a quick exhume, I have seen people change their minds. I think didds perception of the game is much more likely to come from scum. Also Yuma has been increasingly townie and he has consistently pushed didds. Remember even scum!yuma doesn’t know scola was town so regardless of his alignment his read on the game has been right so far. So I’m going with that plus my read that didds reactions to the game are colored by being scum.

[shraeye]

I think didds perception of the game is much more likely to come from scum.

y tho?

[mcmcsalot]

I think didds perception of the game is much more likely to come from scum.

y tho?

Scum tends to read more accusations in posts then town because they are primarily concerned with not getting exhiled. It is true didds has been under a decent amount of scrutiny but to categorize the whole game that way feels like she isn’t seeing past the interactions she specifically is having with people which suggest scum.

[yuma]

I think didds perception of the game is much more likely to come from scum.

y tho?

Scum tends to read more accusations in posts then town because they are primarily concerned with not getting exhiled. It is true didds has been under a decent amount of scrutiny but to categorize the whole game that way feels like she isn’t seeing past the interactions she specifically is having with people which suggest scum.

Yep

[Galzria]

You know what I can give you the actual answer.

We are.

Come and get us.


But also it's a bad question as it brings up D1 things when people compared you to a dead townie and you're still taking that grudge. Forget about it. It makes you town.

Also implying I can't defend Didds is awful.


I have a billion answers to that question I really hate the implication in it.

The more I read this, the more awesome I think it is. It rather perfectly captures the ethos of this game which should now be known as: Come At Me, Bro mafia.

I don’t feel like that is the ethos of this game at all.

Vote: didds

No, it kinda is how Didds say it be.  But this is a super weird difference-of-opinion to turn into a vote.  You think Didds is scummy because she doesn't characterize the game the way you do....?

I have not felt like this game is a guns out bring it on come at me bro discourse around all. In fact I have found it to be more mellow with lots of cooperation, people are consolidating so that we don’t end the day with a quick exhume, I have seen people change their minds. I think didds perception of the game is much more likely to come from scum. Also Yuma has been increasingly townie and he has consistently pushed didds. Remember even scum!yuma doesn’t know scola was town so regardless of his alignment his read on the game has been right so far. So I’m going with that plus my read that didds reactions to the game are colored by being scum.

This sums up why I feel like Didds is scum.

I’ve played so many games with her now, and plenty that have been far more edgy than this one has even come close to.

I think didds perception of the game is much more likely to come from scum.

y tho?

Because in my experience, when Didds is Town, she’s very carefree and bubbly. It could very well be that she’s Town and is feeling more attacked this game than normal and thus is more on edge ... and if that’s the case, obviously, Didds, I’m sorry you’re feeling that way! But I also know that Didds doesn’t like being scum and that rolling that alignment stresses her out. So given how I’ve personally viewed this game, combined with how I’ve seen Town!Didds act in plenty of other more hostile atmosphere games, I just think that while she’s genuinely feeling attacked and pressured, her response is more indicative of scum!Didds than town!Didds.

[jotheonah]

Color me convinced, back to vote: Didds

[A Drowned Kernel]

vote: didds X-1

It isn't the worst exile (that would be me)

[WestCoastDidds]

Based on my recent scum experience, I can 100% say that having a partner makes me feel way more secure and relaxed because I know someone had my back. Even if I got exiled, they’d still be able to win for us. And y’all know I love a qt....if I had someone talking me down I’m sure I’d be a lot more twisted.

But here’s the deal...if we exile me, then it’s 5 town and 4 scum. If there’s two more town NKs, I don’t see how town can win. So, four of you could care less, but 5 of you should care a lot.

I’ve been accused of being emotionally manipulative, inauthentic, falsely leaning into my meta, terse and cutting, and now scum for finding the game hostile. That’s not a usual game for me. Especially when I’m town. So, yeah..duderrific. Come at me, bro. Fuck it. Whatever.

[WestCoastDidds]

I’m ready to hammer myself.

Y’all deserve to lose if this is how we’re going to play.

I’m going to eat lunch first, see if I think differently, then do it.

[MiX]

Didds is town.

vote: didds X-1

It isn't the worst exile (that would be me)

You're scum and you need to stop being scum.

[Galzria]

Based on my recent scum experience, I can 100% say that having a partner makes me feel way more secure and relaxed because I know someone had my back. Even if I got exiled, they’d still be able to win for us. And y’all know I love a qt....if I had someone talking me down I’m sure I’d be a lot more twisted.

But here’s the deal...if we exile me, then it’s 5 town and 4 scum. If there’s two more town NKs, I don’t see how town can win. So, four of you could care less, but 5 of you should care a lot.

I’ve been accused of being emotionally manipulative, inauthentic, falsely leaning into my meta, terse and cutting, and now scum for finding the game hostile. That’s not a usual game for me. Especially when I’m town. So, yeah..duderrific. Come at me, bro. Fuck it. Whatever.

fwiw - I don’t think any of the bolded are true of you this game! I think you’re genuinely frustrated by the suggestion of these narratives, and I get that you would be frustrated as town or as scum. Certainly I would be too. What I’ve personally found scummy is your response to those accusations. Or, more that I haven’t felt that your responses are in-line with how I think Town!Didds would respond. That doesn’t make your responses inauthentic though. I truly believe you’re frustrated. I just think you’re frustrated scum, not frustrated Town.

I AM sorry you’re feeling this way though, regardless of your alignment.

[yuma]

I am not voting didds for any of the reasons listed

[WestCoastDidds]

I am not voting didds for any of the reasons listed

Yeah? Because you are responsible for a good portion of the insulting characterizations.

[WestCoastDidds]

I’m not frustrated Galz. I feel bullied and gaslighted. There is a distinct lack of kindness or generosity of spirit.

I’m over it.

Vote: WCD

[Galzria]

I’m not frustrated Galz. I feel bullied and gaslighted. There is a distinct lack of kindness or generosity of spirit.

I’m over it.

Vote: WCD

🙁🙁🙁

[jotheonah]

I wish that, if you really felt that way, you had requested replacement rather than self-voting.

We always walk a fine line in these games between animosity in the context of the game and animosity that generates real bed feeling beyond the context of the game. It's been a while since we've had to deal with that, but for whatever reason it's back this game. All I can say is Didds, I'm sorry that this game has been a bad experience for you, I'm especially sorry if I've contributed to that, and I'm happy to engage in a real dialogue about it after the game concludes.

[yuma]

Insulting?

[yuma]

Jesus fuck... this is why I left fds a while ago

[yuma]

This is a social deception game. There is no bullying or gas lighting. We are all in the dark. Play the game or dont. But dont accuse others of insults when clearly none are intended.

[mcmcsalot]

Didds reread yourself this game...you have roughly 5 posts that are talking about an actual read or commentary on the game state that doesn’t have to do with yourself.

I don’t want you to feel attached or feel like we are piling on but you just got exhiled, we think you are scum if you are not convince us otherwise by putting in the effort to making cases, keep defending yourself, look for anything to do to help town. I know you thought scola was scum and you think yuma is scum. Other than that I have no clue what your reads are and haven’t seen you scumhunting, just defending yourself and commenting on how this game feels more duderific and hostile.

[MiX]

Told you the push was anti-town.

Bullies.

Learn how to Didds.

Good night.

Scum, kill ADK.

[MiX]

I wish that, if you really felt that way, you had requested replacement rather than self-voting.

We always walk a fine line in these games between animosity in the context of the game and animosity that generates real bed feeling beyond the context of the game. It's been a while since we've had to deal with that, but for whatever reason it's back this game. All I can say is Didds, I'm sorry that this game has been a bad experience for you, I'm especially sorry if I've contributed to that, and I'm happy to engage in a real dialogue about it after the game concludes.

Everyone needs to take this game and learn how to push Didds. You don't push her like any other player. It's something that comes from how she plays, if you make her play the game like anyone else she won't. She can't. That's not the game she's playing.

This is a social deception game. There is no bullying or gas lighting. We are all in the dark. Play the game or dont. But dont accuse others of insults when clearly none are intended.

It doesn't matter what we're doing, it matters what Didds feels. I can go on morality and stuff, but it's incredibly obvious after this self-hammer that it's anti-town, and for that reason alone we shouldn't do this. Doesn't matter who's right.

Didds reread yourself this game...you have roughly 5 posts that are talking about an actual read or commentary on the game state that doesn’t have to do with yourself.

I don’t want you to feel attached or feel like we are piling on but you just got exhiled, we think you are scum if you are not convince us otherwise by putting in the effort to making cases, keep defending yourself, look for anything to do to help town. I know you thought scola was scum and you think yuma is scum. Other than that I have no clue what your reads are and haven’t seen you scumhunting, just defending yourself and commenting on how this game feels more duderific and hostile.

Yes that's common when she's playing on the defense.

She's saying the truth. That's more than scum!Didds. Scum!Didds has cases to push, town!Didds doesn't.


Can't believe I was only 99% sure she was town. Part of me really wanted her to be scum so I could have revenge for BM31. But now I just wish I was her mason this game.

[yuma]

To me bullying and gaslighting are extremely charged words.

I am not comfortable continuing to play in a game where I am being accused of that.

Either I am doing that, which is bad. Or others are falsely accusing. Which is also bad. I am not interested in discussing.

But I have requested to be out of this game. There is a mother fucking Corona virus and there is enough bullahit going on.

I only play for fun now. This isn't fun. If I made the game unfunny I am sorry. That was never intent but part of this game is the possibility that you might get exiled...

/out

[yuma]

And mix. You arent helping. Just stop

[MiX]

There's one thing game-wise that can be learned from this game: stop voting for no reason.

This is the second day that ended prematurely because we let ADK decide when the day ended.

Wake up town! Wake up to what the dynamic of this game is!

We need time, not exiles. Exiles are just one of the 3 ways scum can die. We need to scumhunt, so that all players know who's scum better and can aim their vig shots correctly.

PPE 3: The accusation is meaningless in this context. She doesn't mean it by the literal words, she's just upset.

Also you can't /out publicly.

And mix. You arent helping. Just stop

I'm still playing to win, and right now winning is making sure town doesn't quit.

[yuma]

I already messaged lalight

[2.71828.....]

People. Come on now.

Also, exile has happened I guess. ADK had like zero pressure outside of the few of us who started the day on them, which is interesting.

Anyway, goodnight!

And also. MiX has an inflammatory playstyle, usually will end up showing himself as scum eventually if he is, which is why I don't like lynching him early. But still. Let's all take a breath, breathe in some nice refreshing (interestingly cool) July weather, and wait for a flip

[Dylan32]

Thread locked

[Dylan32]

Vote count 2.2

A Drowned Kernel (3): 2.71828....., Swowl, MiX
WestCoastDidds (6): Galzria, mcmcsalot, yuma, jotheonah, A Drowned Kernel, WestCoastDidds
Swowl (1): shraeye

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to exile.

[Dylan32]

By this time, the town was getting restless.

We will soon be overrun by the dragonborn, and there's not much time left to stop it!

WestCoastDidds has been acting strangely since this all started. Let's exile her!

You know what, if this is the way this town is going to be, I don't want to stay here anyway. Goodbye.

WestCoastDidds has been exiled. They were a Vanilla Townie.

Night 2 starts now and ends in roughly 48 hours, July, the 10th, at whatever time is good for LL to unlock the thread.

[Dylan32]

Remember, keep things civil and non-personal. This is a game that is meant to be fun.

[LaLight]

EFHW replaces yuma

[LaLight]

The dawn of a new day arised upon the village. The fire met Ice and the Ice won.

mcmcsalot was frozen. He was a Red Dragonborn.

But unfortunately, he was not the only Red Dragonborn as 2.7's burned remains suggested.

2.71828..... was burned. He was a Vanilla Townie.

Day 3 starts now!

Vote count 3.0

Not voting (7): jotheonah, A Drowned Kernel, Swowl, MiX, EFHW, shraeye, Galzria

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to exile. Day 3 ends Friday, 17th of July, at 6:30 pm FT.

Thread unlocked!

[MiX]

Vote: ADK

We don't need to worry about if ADK's red or white dragon this game, although if you are red, you should probably claim.

My other scumreads are dead so this game is probably not this easy, but I'm pretty sure ADK hammered 2 people now for no reason, so let's just exile them.

Welcome EFHW! Are you town?

[jotheonah]

Did I call it or did I call it? You all should have listened to me and Robz.

[jotheonah]

Ok, is this the point where our doctor is more valuable as an IC?

We're at

1 Red
2 Blue
1 Doc
3 VT

If doc claims and is counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum. If doc claims and isn't counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum with an IC.

On the other hand, our doc has stayed hidden and alive so far and tonight they'll be 1/5 to prevent a kill, which is good. Although if they do there's either a 2/5 or 3/5 chance that the kill they prevent is on scum.

[jotheonah]

I'm going to start reading through to look for mcmc's likely partner.

[MiX]

Did I call it or did I call it? You all should have listened to me and Robz.

Yeah, good job. If it weren't for your NK, I don't think we would've caught him.

Seriously, regardless of you being scum, scumreading scum helps town, so that was pro-town and I'm townreading you a bunch for it. Although I'm townreading too many people now.

Ok, is this the point where our doctor is more valuable as an IC?

We're at

1 Red
2 Blue
1 Doc
3 VT

If doc claims and is counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum. If doc claims and isn't counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum with an IC.

On the other hand, our doc has stayed hidden and alive so far and tonight they'll be 1/5 to prevent a kill, which is good. Although if they do there's either a 2/5 or 3/5 chance that the kill they prevent is on scum.

That seems about right. That basically means we need 1 scum dead by the start of tomorrow, which is pretty nice.

I'm going to start reading through to look for mcmc's likely partner.

You do that, I'm going to be busy until late tomorrow so I'm just going with my gut.

[jotheonah]

Does no one els think mcmc's actions thus far are somewhat and surprisingly scummy?

Hmm. No?

Does no one els think mcmc's actions thus far are somewhat and surprisingly scummy?

I don't know if this is directed at me, but yes (though I'm not sure I'd say "surprisingly")

[jotheonah]

I feel like mcmc had the usual level of non-committal D1 posts they always have

[jotheonah]

Sorry didn't mean to post those. But they are interesting -- responses to RObz asking if anyone else found mcmc scummy. None are slam dunk partnery, all could be partnery.

[MiX]

E died by the way so you don't need to look at his posts.

Joth's town, he slipped twice so he can't be either team.

[jotheonah]

MiX is so towny it hurts. But I could see any of the rest of you as scum.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Ok, is this the point where our doctor is more valuable as an IC?

We're at

1 Red
2 Blue
1 Doc
3 VT

If doc claims and is counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum. If doc claims and isn't counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum with an IC.

On the other hand, our doc has stayed hidden and alive so far and tonight they'll be 1/5 to prevent a kill, which is good. Although if they do there's either a 2/5 or 3/5 chance that the kill they prevent is on scum.

Yeah it's time. I'm the doctor

[A Drowned Kernel]

shraeye, galz, and let's say swowl is where I'm at

[A Drowned Kernel]

And didds hammered didds, but I don't think arguing about that at this point would be fruitful

[MiX]

Unvote

[jotheonah]

Well ain’t that nice. Now everyone check in so we can make sure there’s no counterclaim.

[jotheonah]

shraeye, galz, and let's say swowl is where I'm at

I don’t hate it, but I’ve been feeling Yuma. (Who is now someone else)

[MiX]

shraeye, galz, and let's say swowl is where I'm at

I don’t hate it, but I’ve been feeling Yuma. (Who is now someone else)

Now that yuma is EFHW, the chances of him being scum went up by 200%, so that makes sense.

But I'm at where ADK's at if no counterclaim, although it's just PoE since I'm townreading you and yuma.

[Galzria]

Def not Doctor.

Generally free this weekend so will be around.

[Galzria]

Ok, is this the point where our doctor is more valuable as an IC?

We're at

1 Red
2 Blue
1 Doc
3 VT

If doc claims and is counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum. If doc claims and isn't counterclaimed, we're 50/50 to hit scum with an IC.

On the other hand, our doc has stayed hidden and alive so far and tonight they'll be 1/5 to prevent a kill, which is good. Although if they do there's either a 2/5 or 3/5 chance that the kill they prevent is on scum.

Yeah it's time. I'm the doctor

I wish you had waited for everyone to check in at least. Would’ve been informative to get initial reads from people.

[Galzria]

shraeye, galz, and let's say swowl is where I'm at

I don’t hate it, but I’ve been feeling Yuma. (Who is now someone else)

This is a stupid meta-game point and I hate it - and yet it’s where I’m at: I have a really hard time seeing Yuma sub out like that if he was on a team with someone else. Yes, Town is still a “team”, but that’s not what I mean here. I just don’t think scum!Yuma does that to a partner.

[A Drowned Kernel]

shraeye, galz, and let's say swowl is where I'm at

I don’t hate it, but I’ve been feeling Yuma. (Who is now someone else)

This is a stupid meta-game point and I hate it - and yet it’s where I’m at: I have a really hard time seeing Yuma sub out like that if he was on a team with someone else. Yes, Town is still a “team”, but that’s not what I mean here. I just don’t think scum!Yuma does that to a partner.

I wouldn't discount it, actually

[Swowl]

Checking in.
No counter claim. I’ll be intermittent until Monday.

[jotheonah]

shraeye, galz, and let's say swowl is where I'm at

I don’t hate it, but I’ve been feeling Yuma. (Who is now someone else)

This is a stupid meta-game point and I hate it - and yet it’s where I’m at: I have a really hard time seeing Yuma sub out like that if he was on a team with someone else. Yes, Town is still a “team”, but that’s not what I mean here. I just don’t think scum!Yuma does that to a partner.

I wouldn't discount it, actually

Tend to agree with ADK there. I think that scum or town has that reaction.

[EFHW]

I'm here. No cc. Town. ADK was my top scum read. mcmc was one, too, so that's good. My notes are inaccessible at the moment, so I'll say more later.

[EFHW]

Now that yuma is EFHW, the chances of him being scum went up by 200%, so that makes sense.

I doubt random.org knew I'd be subbing in for yuma, so I'd say this game is independent of the scum curse that has been chasing me.

[EFHW]

Vote count 2.2

A Drowned Kernel (3): 2.71828....., Swowl, MiX
WestCoastDidds (6): Galzria, mcmcsalot, yuma, jotheonah, A Drowned Kernel, WestCoastDidds
Swowl (1): shraeye

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to exile.

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

vote: joth, as the likely representative of scum team B on the two town wagons.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Vote count 2.2

A Drowned Kernel (3): 2.71828....., Swowl, MiX
WestCoastDidds (6): Galzria, mcmcsalot, yuma, jotheonah, A Drowned Kernel, WestCoastDidds
Swowl (1): shraeye

With 10 alive, it takes 6 to exile.

Vote Count 1.final

scolapasta (7): WestCoastDidds, mcmcsalot, jotheonah, 2.71828....., Robz888, mail-mi, A Drowned Kernel
A Drowned Kernel (5): Swowl, MiX, yuma, shraeye, scolapasta
Not Voting (1): Galzria

With 13 alive it takes 7 to exile.

vote: joth, as the likely representative of scum team B on the two town wagons.

That's iffy logic. I was the only other major wagon both days, and since I'm on neither scum team, scum would not have had any particular incentive to push the not-me wagon; if anything, they would have wanted to stay off of the final wagon

[EFHW]

You are assuming they knew they were on a town wagon, but they would have hoped they were on the opposite scum's wagon.

[EFHW]

They also wouldn't have known you were town.

[EFHW]

prod: Shraeye

[jotheonah]

Are you voting for me purely for my wagon positions or have you actually found my play scummy?

[A Drowned Kernel]

You are assuming they knew they were on a town wagon, but they would have hoped they were on the opposite scum's wagon.

My point is that if neither of the major wagons include a member of a scum team, then that team isn't to going to particularly care where they are

[EFHW]

You are assuming they knew they were on a town wagon, but they would have hoped they were on the opposite scum's wagon.

My point is that if neither of the major wagons include a member of a scum team, then that team isn't to going to particularly care where they are

Unless they actually think the wagon is on scum.

[EFHW]

Are you voting for me purely for my wagon positions or have you actually found my play scummy?

Right now it's just the VCA. I will reread you.

[EFHW]

Are you voting for me purely for my wagon positions or have you actually found my play scummy?

Right now it's just the VCA. I will reread you.

What I see is that you are more active than usual and much more active than you are as scum. That is in your favor, except WIFOM.

[EFHW]

If joth is town, then (from my perspective) our 3 scum are in {Shraeye, Swowl, MiX, Galzria}. Swowl, MiX and Shraeye were not on either exile wagon. None of them were on the Day 1 wagon. This would be an unusual pattern, though not impossible.

[LaLight]

prod: Shraeye

Done.

[shraeye]

Here, sorry.

Man, this feels like Less Pressure now; we have an IC, I'm looking for two town instead of 3 scum.

Shots from the hip
Swowl's "analysis" against ADK still looks bad, worse because of the doctor claim
Galz said he'd be here all weekend, great!....except no content.  Waiting game = scum game
MIX = still town

[shraeye]

But, if we're searching for mcmc's partner, the best bet is yuma/EFHW.


I'm scanning back to day1, where yuma insta-defended mcmcs when Robz brought up possible weirdness. 
Then around this area where he tried to tie joth/mcmc together.
This was shortly after he agreed with Robz that consolidation was needed, but nobody was on either mcmc or joth.
Flash forward to the next vote count, after which yuma immediately jumps off mcmc.
No real effort behind that vote at all.

Then, recall that Robz was killed first night, after Robz spent a lot of D1 harping on yuma.

Day2 had NO interaction with mcmc (I lied, there is this post).

[shraeye]

In a similar vein, I really can't see joth being mcmc's partner.  If I'm making that reads list, I agonize over where to put my partner, I definitely don't leave them out.

[shraeye]

Actually, I went through some possibilities; unfortunately, I think our best bet is to try to find the hidden team.  It's not ideal, but better than landing in a 2v3 tomorrow.  Used to be LyLo; I played around with words,  "X or L" sounds nice. Classic X or L scenario and we have to win it TWICE.

There is a possibility (2.4% if all is done randomly) that the remaining scum shoot eachother and we instantly win.  But that's obviously a long shot.
A healthy chance ~22% that we still have 4 town tomorrow. (6% with one scum down, 16% no kills)
Equally healthy chance that we end up in MexLo with 1 scum  (replacement for Mylo, don't hate it)
slightly less healthy chance (~18%) that we end up in a 1-1-3 scenario which was too confusing for me to analyze but has got to be better than a 2v3.

Here's the downside though:
Bigger chance (33%) that we end up in a scenario with 1v1v2; must NoEx tomorrow and hope scum hit eachother.  This sounds dismal, but realize this: a team cannot win without hitting the other, so they're really trying for it.  If they both hit the same town, then it just makes it more likely that they'll hit eachother the next night.

[jotheonah]

Ok, well it seems pretty unlikely to me after that post that shraeye is on Team Ice. No reason to do that analysis. On the other hand, if shraeye is mcmc's partner that post makes a lot of sense. I think EFHW is scum, but I'm not particularly sure which team.

[EFHW]

But, if we're searching for mcmc's partner, the best bet is yuma/EFHW.


I'm scanning back to day1, where yuma insta-defended mcmcs when Robz brought up possible weirdness. 
Then around this area where he tried to tie joth/mcmc together.
This was shortly after he agreed with Robz that consolidation was needed, but nobody was on either mcmc or joth.
Flash forward to the next vote count, after which yuma immediately jumps off mcmc.
No real effort behind that vote at all.

Then, recall that Robz was killed first night, after Robz spent a lot of D1 harping on yuma.

Day2 had NO interaction with mcmc (I lied, there is this post).

This is a nice story, but I don't see the resemblance to what actually happened. I see yuma over the course of an hour agreeing about Robz in principle about consolidating but objecting to Robz telling town what to do, defending scola, and finally supporting Swowl's ADK case with a vote (at 311). Before that he was on Robz (at 219). He does do a quick mcmc => joth switch later (365 and 366), promising an explanation. When he comes back, he gives those explanations and switches back to mcmc (at 396). Stays there until voting ADK at 440. Defends scola at 446. Day 2 is mostly about Didds, with some MiX and Shraeye thrown in for awhile.

What I see here is a town player scumhunting. He takes positions with both scum- and town-reads, shifts his votes between a small group of scumreads, and then flames out at feeling misjudged.

vote: Shraeye

[EFHW]

*defends scola at 466.

[shraeye]

But, if we're searching for mcmc's partner, the best bet is yuma/EFHW.


I'm scanning back to day1, where yuma insta-defended mcmcs when Robz brought up possible weirdness. 
Then around this area where he tried to tie joth/mcmc together.
This was shortly after he agreed with Robz that consolidation was needed, but nobody was on either mcmc or joth.
Flash forward to the next vote count, after which yuma immediately jumps off mcmc.
No real effort behind that vote at all.

Then, recall that Robz was killed first night, after Robz spent a lot of D1 harping on yuma.

Day2 had NO interaction with mcmc (I lied, there is this post).

This is a nice story, but I don't see the resemblance to what actually happened. I see yuma over the course of an hour agreeing about Robz in principle about consolidating but objecting to Robz telling town what to do, defending scola, and finally supporting Swowl's ADK case with a vote (at 311). Before that he was on Robz (at 219). He does do a quick mcmc => joth switch later (365 and 366), promising an explanation. When he comes back, he gives those explanations and switches back to mcmc (at 396). Stays there until voting ADK at 440. Defends scola at 446. Day 2 is mostly about Didds, with some MiX and Shraeye thrown in for awhile.

What I see here is a town player scumhunting. He takes positions with both scum- and town-reads, shifts his votes between a small group of scumreads, and then flames out at feeling misjudged.

vote: Shraeye

Even in your story, you're not defending the fact that he made a throwaway vote on mcmc (and if I remember that was AFTER people had been voting mcmc but then left), made NO attempts to bring other people back to mcmc, and then hopped off as soon as a votecount was posted.

That's scummy.

[shraeye]

yuma made it sound like a breakthrough revelation.  Didn't bother too much over teh fact that nobody really guessed at all, gave two standard/lazy explanations (reads lists are scummy, mcmc hedged) without trying AT ALL to convince people these were voteable reasons and that people should agree/follow yuma.

[EFHW]

It's not a throwaway vote since he 1. explained it and 2. returned to it after explaining the joth vote. I'll check the vote count detail at a computer, but I don't remember anything like that. Since when is campaigning against a player required for a vote to not be throwaway?

[EFHW]

The vote count was around 60 posts later, and why shouldn't he consolidate? You voted for ADK shortly thereafter as well, after a brief visit on an e wagon. You didn't make an e case. Was that a throwaway vote?

[shraeye]

e was town. 

We're not sitting here debating who was E's partner.   That is a scumtastic deflection.



Also, while we're stacking up scumtells, nice OMGUS

[EFHW]

Not OMGUS. You posted a distorted case. That's always going to get my vote.

[Galzria]

Weekend, as it usually does, got away from me. I’m iso’ing by player right now. Will post thoughts on each today.

[MiX]

Okay let's put in some effort I don't think shraeye vs EFHW is working.


I think shraeye is trying extra duper hard, which is a red
scum trait at this point.

EFHW has a really good point about joth. It's very likely he's white scum with that...but would white call their team "blue"? That's kinda why I was clearing him.

I think there's white scum between swowl and galz. Maybe EFHW if joth isn't. I don't think the big scumteam busses here.

I guess I need to reread them then.

Also I'm on vacation so I have less time to reread, although the same to post.

[jotheonah]

Oh, oops. I was just thinking "fire and ice = red and blue". You all know what I meant.

[jotheonah]

Okay let's put in some effort I don't think shraeye vs EFHW is working.

Really? It is so clear to me that at least one of them is scum.

[MiX]

Okay let's put in some effort I don't think shraeye vs EFHW is working.

Really? It is so clear to me that at least one of them is scum.

Right. One of them is red scum. But that's not what we want. At least, uh...not anymore? I did some math and the obvious thing is if we exile red scum, then tomorrow is 3v2 XLo, which kinda sucks? We can do much better if we get white instead.

Although you're right in that letting them talk was helpful.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Okay let's put in some effort I don't think shraeye vs EFHW is working.

Really? It is so clear to me that at least one of them is scum.

Right. One of them is red scum. But that's not what we want. At least, uh...not anymore? I did some math and the obvious thing is if we exile red scum, then tomorrow is 3v2 XLo, which kinda sucks? We can do much better if we get white instead.

Although you're right in that letting them talk was helpful.

If we get red scum we eliminate a nightkill. I'd have to crunch some numbers but that might improve our chances

[jotheonah]

jotheonah - Me, a townie
A Drowned Kernel - Our doctor, a townie
MiX - obvtown
shraeye - red scum or town

White scum, then, is among: Galzria, Swowl, EFHW
my strongest townread in that group is Galz.

so... vote: Swowl

[shraeye]

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

Joth, are you still scumreading me because of this?  I thoguht I'd question you to draw it out at the time, didn't work.  You need to look back more closely. 
A) ADK was the only person who had voted for me and (B) I showed up after prodded.   
You might be thinking about yuma, who voted me AFTER I showed up.

[shraeye]

Also, ADK/MiX.  I already crunched those numbers and showed my results.

It's clear that we need to find the hidden team.

This is why despite finding mcmcs partner, im not voting there
This is why the OMGUS vote EFHW threw out was doubly scummy.  She says bad case means I'm scum, but didn't think for a moment if I was mcmcs partner or not, which absolutely matters.

[jotheonah]

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

Joth, are you still scumreading me because of this?  I thoguht I'd question you to draw it out at the time, didn't work.  You need to look back more closely. 
A) ADK was the only person who had voted for me and (B) I showed up after prodded.   
You might be thinking about yuma, who voted me AFTER I showed up.

At this point I'm not exactly scumreading you so much for that.  Instead, the fact that you were the one to suggest hunting specifically for the other team suggests that you're either town or you're mcmc's partner. So my point in that last post was that, whether you're scum or not, for the purposes of finding white scum I'm counting you out  today.

Which brings me to... between Galz, EFHW, and Swowl,  which one do you think is town and why?

[jotheonah]

Which brings me to... between Galz, EFHW, and Swowl,  which one do you think is town and why?

MiX and ADK, same question.

[shraeye]

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

Joth, are you still scumreading me because of this?  I thoguht I'd question you to draw it out at the time, didn't work.  You need to look back more closely. 
A) ADK was the only person who had voted for me and (B) I showed up after prodded.   
You might be thinking about yuma, who voted me AFTER I showed up.

At this point I'm not exactly scumreading you so much for that.  Instead, the fact that you were the one to suggest hunting specifically for the other team suggests that you're either town or you're mcmc's partner. So my point in that last post was that, whether you're scum or not, for the purposes of finding white scum I'm counting you out  today.

Which brings me to... between Galz, EFHW, and Swowl,  which one do you think is town and why?

None of the above.   I'm feeling mostly sure MiX is town.  You're the most unknown variable.


I've got independent reasons for Galz and Swowl, but I haven't yet rescanned focusing on them as a pair to see if it that partnership checks out.

[MiX]

Which brings me to... between Galz, EFHW, and Swowl,  which one do you think is town and why?

MiX and ADK, same question.

EFHW, I guess. More like yuma.

[Swowl]

back from camping. Sorry it ran a half day longer then expected. It was rad though. I will read up now.

[Dylan32]

Vote count 3.1

shraeye (1): EFHW
Swowl (1): jotheonah

Not Voting (5): A Drowned Kernel, Swowl, MiX, shraeye, Galzria

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to exile. Day 3 ends Friday, 17th of July, at 6:30 FT.

[EFHW]

This is why the OMGUS vote EFHW threw out was doubly scummy.  She says bad case means I'm scum, but didn't think for a moment if I was mcmcs partner or not, which absolutely matters.

You're right, I didn't think about that. It seems like there have been comments on both sides of the issue of which scum team to try to target. My first instinct would be to get mcmc's partner so there is one less nk. What is the advantage of looking for the white team instead? Hoping red and white will kill each other?

[A Drowned Kernel]

I am finding this latest turn from shraeye to be very town!shraeye BUT I can't help but notice that town!shraeye came out right after people started voting for him. Isn't this very similar to what someone (I want to say mail-mi) was accusing Didds of? Steering hard into her town meta when she started to get votes?

Joth, are you still scumreading me because of this?  I thoguht I'd question you to draw it out at the time, didn't work.  You need to look back more closely. 
A) ADK was the only person who had voted for me and (B) I showed up after prodded.   
You might be thinking about yuma, who voted me AFTER I showed up.

At this point I'm not exactly scumreading you so much for that.  Instead, the fact that you were the one to suggest hunting specifically for the other team suggests that you're either town or you're mcmc's partner. So my point in that last post was that, whether you're scum or not, for the purposes of finding white scum I'm counting you out  today.

Which brings me to... between Galz, EFHW, and Swowl,  which one do you think is town and why?

I am leaning EFHW. But I do want to hear more from galz

[Swowl]

Joth - why is Galz a TR for you?

[Galzria]

Alright. First off. Permutations from where we're at (Since there seems to be some confusion surrounding this - and what is "best" for us right now):

7 Alive:
- 2 Red
- 1 White
- 3 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc

Scenario's 1-9: We exile VT today
Scenario 10: We exile White today
Scenario's 11-17: We exile Red today

Scenario 1:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots VT
-- White Shoots VT
-- Shots do not Cross-Fire, Doc does not proc
-- Day 4: 4 Alive
- 2 Red
- 1 White
- 1 IC Doc
--- Draw/Town Win
*** - This leads to No Exile, White Shoots Red, Red must shoot White (if they shoot ADK then final day is 1 Red, 1 White = Draw). ADK protects White to create a final day of 1:1:1. ADK forces no-exile and scum must shoot each other (If either shoots ADK they reset at best (both shoot ADK), or lose if the other scum shoots them). This means that Red must play WIFOM at night: Wanting to shoot ADK to remove this situation, but must also be worried about White playing defense by also shooting ADK. ***

Scenario 2:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots Town
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots do not Cross-Fire, Doc Procs
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
- 2 Red
- 1 White
- 2 Town (either both VT or {1 VT, 1 IC Doc} depending on Red/White target choices)
--- Exile Red: Draw/Town Win/Red Win/White Win. Exile White: Red Win. Exile Town: Draw/Town Win (ADK)/Red Win (No ADK)
*** This is a weird ExLo where town cannot Exile Town or White. Assuming a Red Exile, it's entirely down to night actions. If Red and White hit each other, Town wins. If Red hits White and White hits Town, Red wins (and vice versa). If Red and White hit separate Town Players, it's a 1v1 Draw. If Red and White hit the same Town Player, the next day is 2v1v1, goes to No-Exile, and essentially repeats. This ultimately ends in a Town Win, as Red must shoot White knowing White will never get exiled , and vice versa. This is true with or without ADK (With ADK, he either always Doctor's the last remaining Town if he knows who they are, and thus it's essentially a 1v1v1, or does nothing if he doesn't and is essentially VT) --- There's an edge case where in ExLo, if we exile the remaining VT and ADK is still alive he can Doctor White while White shoots Red. If Red shoots ADK then it's a 1v1 Draw. If Red Shoots White (Doctored) then it's 1v1v1 again. ***

Scenario 3:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots Town
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots Cross-Fire, Doc Proc doesn't matter
-- Day 4: 6 Alive
- 2 Red
- 1 White
- 2 Town VT
- 1 Doc
--- Undetermined
*** Lots of things can happen from here ***

Scenario 4:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc does not Proc
-- Day 4: 4 Alive
- 2 Red
- 2 Town
--- Red Wins

Scenario 5:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc Procs
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
-- Situation A:
- 2 Red
- 2 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc
--- Semi-Traditional Ex-Lo
-- Situation B:
- 2 Red
- 1 White
- 2 Town VT or {1 Town VT, 1 IC Doc}
--- See Second Scenario Above: Exile Red: Draw/Town Win/Red Win/White Win. Exile White: Red Win. Exile Town: Draw/Town Win (ADK)/Red Win (No ADK)

Scenario 6:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots Town
-- White Shoots Red
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc does not Proc
-- Day 4: 4 Alive
- 1 Red
- 1 White
- 2 Town
--- See results from Second Scenario Above assuming Red-Exile: No Exile: Draw/Town Win/Red Win/White Win.

Scenario 7:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots Town
-- White Shoots Red
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc Procs
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
Situation A:
- 1 Red
- 1 White
- 3 Town
--- Undetermined
*** Lots of things can happen from here ***
Situation B:
- 2 Red
- 1 White
- 2 Town (either both VT or {1 VT, 1 IC Doc} depending on Red/White target choices)
--- See Second Scenario Above: Exile Red: Draw/Town Win/Red Win/White Win. Exile White: Red Win. Exile Town: Draw/Town Win (ADK)/Red Win (No ADK)


Scenario 8:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Red
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc does not Proc
-- Day 4: 4 Alive
- 1 Red
- 2 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc
--- Traditional Me-Lo.

Scenario 9:
--- Exile VT
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Red
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc Procs
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
Situation A:
- 2 Red
- 2 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc
--- Semi-Traditional Ex-Lo
Situation B:
- 1 Red
- 1 White
- 2 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc
--- Undetermined
*** Lots of things can happen from here ***


Scenario 10:
--- Exile White:
-- Red Shoots ADK
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
- 2 Red
- 3 Town VT
--- Traditional Ex-Lo

Scenario 11:
--- Exile Red
-- Red Shoots Town
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots do not Cross-Fire, Doc does not Proc
-- Day 4: 4 Alive
- 1 Red
- 1 White
- 2 Town
--- See results from Second Scenario Above assuming Red-Exile: No Exile: Draw/Town Win/Red Win/White Win.

Scenario 12:
--- Exile Red
-- Red Shoots Town
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots do not Cross-Fire, Doc Procs
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
- 1 Red
- 1 White
- 3 Town
--- Undetermined
*** Lots of things can happen from here ***

Scenario 13:
--- Exile Red
-- Red Shoots Town
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots Cross-Fire, Doc Proc doesn't matter
-- Day 4: 6 Alive
- 1 Red
- 1 White
- 3 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc
--- Undetermined
*** Lots of things can happen from here ***

Scenario 14:
--- Exile Red
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc does not Proc
-- Day 4: 4 Alive
- 1 Red
- 3 Town
--- Traditional MeLo
**After Red Exile, Scenario can flip Red/White**

Scenario 15:
--- Exile Red
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Town
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc Procs
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
Situation A:
- 1 Red
- 1 White
- 3 Town
--- Undetermined
*** Lots of things can happen from here ***
Situation B:
- 1 Red
- 3 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc
--- Undetermined, but good spot for Town
**After Red Exile, Scenario can flip Red/White**

Scenario 16:
--- Exile Red
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Red
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc does not Proc
--- Town Wins

Scenario 17:
--- Exile Red
-- Red Shoots White
-- White Shoots Red
-- Shots can not Cross-Fire, Doc Procs
-- Day 4: 5 Alive
- 1 Red or White
- 3 Town VT
- 1 IC Doc
--- Undetermined, but good spot for Town

********************************************************

Conclusions:

I do not think it's entirely as clear as Shraeye makes it out to be that Exiling Red is strictly better than Exiling White here - but it's pretty damn close. With the exception of Scenario 11, most of the other scenario's are basically either on par (eh, it's weird still with a few multi-faction scenario's) with Scenario 10 or in many cases better than Scenario 10. So we almost certainly want to be hunting for the two Red's and not Mcmc's partner.

[Galzria]

As far as my re-read today went, I kinda focused on a few key things:

- There are two other town players (discounting ADK here) besides myself. That's 2 from {Swowl, MiX, Joth, EFHW, Shraeye}
- There is one partner with Mcmc
- There are two unknown partnered Scum

My most consistent town read is Shraeye. While he's been as quiet as I have for the most part, every time he's been prodded I've really felt like he was driving to find scum and challenging posts in a way that's consistent with town!Shraeye. At the very least anyway, I've found myself agreeing with his questions and points. He's also the only other person today to approach the day recognizing that there's two town (assuming he's town) that he needs to identify. That's an extremely town oriented approach to take because it carries with it the base assumption that he himself IS town - scum tend to focus more on/care more about "finding the remaining scum" and don't have that mindset.

Yuma/EFHW I've expressed why I struggle to see as scum. It's a bad line of reasoning, but it's what my gut tells me having played with Yuma for years and years. Discounting that, I see them on the same plane as Joth. I think one is town and one is scum, but I don't know which.

MiX/Swowl are the two that have the least "town" feel to me based on gut read. I want to look at some VCA with them, but I think it's safe to say that I would be comfortable exiling either.

Really will not lynch:
ADK
Galzria

Will not lynch:
Shraeye

Don't want to lynch, but one is almost definitely scum:
EFHW
Joth

Would lynch:
MiX
Swowl

[Galzria]

Sorry. My fingers so naturally type "lynch" and not "exile". I had to go back and make a million edits to try and fix that in my permutations post. If I'm not consciously aware of it and checking myself, it's just ingrained. Gonna take me awhile to break that habit.

[Swowl]

As far as my re-read today went, I kinda focused on a few key things:

- There are two other town players (discounting ADK here) besides myself. That's 2 from {Swowl, MiX, Joth, EFHW, Shraeye}
- There is one partner with Mcmc
- There are two unknown partnered Scum

My most consistent town read is Shraeye. While he's been as quiet as I have for the most part, every time he's been prodded I've really felt like he was driving to find scum and challenging posts in a way that's consistent with town!Shraeye. At the very least anyway, I've found myself agreeing with his questions and points. He's also the only other person today to approach the day recognizing that there's two town (assuming he's town) that he needs to identify. That's an extremely town oriented approach to take because it carries with it the base assumption that he himself IS town - scum tend to focus more on/care more about "finding the remaining scum" and don't have that mindset.

Yuma/EFHW I've expressed why I struggle to see as scum. It's a bad line of reasoning, but it's what my gut tells me having played with Yuma for years and years. Discounting that, I see them on the same plane as Joth. I think one is town and one is scum, but I don't know which.

MiX/Swowl are the two that have the least "town" feel to me based on gut read. I want to look at some VCA with them, but I think it's safe to say that I would be comfortable exiling either.

Really will not lynch:
ADK
Galzria

Will not lynch:
Shraeye

Don't want to lynch, but one is almost definitely scum:
EFHW
Joth

Would lynch:
MiX
Swowl

So there is all skum in [MiX, Swowl, EFHW, Joth] and 100% of MiX/Swowl is skum? That is how that reads right?

[MiX]

Galzria wall is really hard to read considering he mixed up red and white.

I'm not even sure if that counts as a townslip.

Who doesn't think Swowl is scum?

[jotheonah]

Galzria wall is really hard to read considering he mixed up red and white.

I'm not even sure if that counts as a townslip.

Who doesn't think Swowl is scum?

Thank you! I was like ... what?

It would count as a townslip if you hadn't pointed out me doing something similar. Now there's too great a chance scum!Galz does it on purpose.

[jotheonah]

Galz, how much experience do you have playing with MiX?

We're reading him opposite ways, but he's also  a bit of a weird player (no offense MiX) whom I have a lot of experience with.

[MiX]

Galz, how much experience do you have playing with MiX?

We're reading him opposite ways, but he's also  a bit of a weird player (no offense MiX) whom I have a lot of experience with.

Galz has a hard time seeing me as town.

Also, none taken, I'm proud of that 

[jotheonah]

Joth - why is Galz a TR for you?

I always have a hard time articulating these things.  I think disengaged/working hard to engage Galz is more often town Galz. The big post he just did was pretty towny. He seems to be seeing the game in a towny way.

As others have pointed out, the current situation is a bit like Less Pressure and I have a town tell that often works in LP that's working here. idk. Nothing rock-solid.

[Swowl]

Who doesn't think Swowl is scum?

<--- this guy

[Swowl]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

[MiX]

Oh no I saw that the doctor was doing an incredible amount of self-pres.

Also we don't really wanna kill red scum.

Vote: Swowl, I'm ready. It's less pressure odds, this is fine.

[Galzria]

Galzria wall is really hard to read considering he mixed up red and white.

I'm not even sure if that counts as a townslip.

Who doesn't think Swowl is scum?

Thank you! I was like ... what?

It would count as a townslip if you hadn't pointed out me doing something similar. Now there's too great a chance scum!Galz does it on purpose.

My bad on the colors. But as I was merely pointing out all possibilities the colors are actually irrelevant. Could be Yellow and Purple and it would all still be accurate. I do get that it can be mentally confusing though, so sorry about that!

[Galzria]

Galz, how much experience do you have playing with MiX?

We're reading him opposite ways, but he's also  a bit of a weird player (no offense MiX) whom I have a lot of experience with.

I have quite a bit of experience with him and contrary to...:

Galz, how much experience do you have playing with MiX?

We're reading him opposite ways, but he's also  a bit of a weird player (no offense MiX) whom I have a lot of experience with.

Galz has a hard time seeing me as town.

Also, none taken, I'm proud of that 

My general take with MiX is that I always find him scummy D1, but rarely vote for him over it. That’s largely because I’m generally decent at switching that read when he’s actually Town as the game goes on.

That said, there isn’t anything that strikes me as crazy scummy from MiX this game, it’s just PoE. There’s two town in {Swowl, MiX, Shraeye, EFHW, Joth}. I’m strong reading Shraeye as one. That only leaves one more amongst the remaining four... and MiX just isn’t topping that list for me.

[Galzria]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

🐞🐞🐞

[A Drowned Kernel]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

🐞🐞🐞

What?

[Galzria]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

🐞🐞🐞

What?

He said I was looking for ladybugs...

[A Drowned Kernel]

Oh is that what those are

[MiX]

Oh is that what those are

Did you not know what ladybugs were?

Obv!scum

[shraeye]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

The fact that Swowl is default looking for mcmcs partner...yup

I'm still not forgetting the VCA from earlier that "implicated" ADK but just skipped right past the if-ADK-is-town portion.

Vote: Swowl

[shraeye]

Oh no I saw that the doctor was doing an incredible amount of self-pres.

When did you notice the doctor doing self-pres?  What did you do because of that?

[Swowl]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

The fact that Swowl is default looking for mcmcs partner...yup

I'm still not forgetting the VCA from earlier that "implicated" ADK but just skipped right past the if-ADK-is-town portion.

Vote: Swowl

You are bringing up... again... the implication of ADK. To which I IMMEDIATELY responded to you saying all of day 1 I skum read them and wrote the VCA up from a "if they are skum" pov. Did not hide it. Openly stated it. Don't know why you are hung up on it.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Oh is that what those are

Did you not know what ladybugs were?

Obv!scum

They kind of looked like Majora's Mask to me

[Galzria]

Galz, how much experience do you have playing with MiX?

We're reading him opposite ways, but he's also  a bit of a weird player (no offense MiX) whom I have a lot of experience with.

I have quite a bit of experience with him and contrary to...:

Galz, how much experience do you have playing with MiX?

We're reading him opposite ways, but he's also  a bit of a weird player (no offense MiX) whom I have a lot of experience with.

Galz has a hard time seeing me as town.

Also, none taken, I'm proud of that 

My general take with MiX is that I always find him scummy D1, but rarely vote for him over it. That’s largely because I’m generally decent at switching that read when he’s actually Town as the game goes on.

That said, there isn’t anything that strikes me as crazy scummy from MiX this game, it’s just PoE. There’s two town in {Swowl, MiX, Shraeye, EFHW, Joth}. I’m strong reading Shraeye as one. That only leaves one more amongst the remaining four... and MiX just isn’t topping that list for me.

((If you’re looking for an exact reference: MiX joined the site 24 games ago (including current ongoing games) - he and I have played together in 13 of those, and we’ve also played a lot of Drunk Mafia on Jimmmmm’s site))

[EFHW]

I'm settling on Swowl and MiX as my townreads. But I don't have theories yet as to which of the others are red or white. I had thought of joth as white, but others seem to think he is red. I think I'll stick with my Shraeye vote and will continue ISO's tomorrow.

[A Drowned Kernel]

I'm settling on Swowl and MiX as my townreads. But I don't have theories yet as to which of the others are red or white. I had thought of joth as white, but others seem to think he is red. I think I'll stick with my Shraeye vote and will continue ISO's tomorrow.

Why is swowl a town read for you?

[Swowl]

Oh no I saw that the doctor was doing an incredible amount of self-pres.

Also we don't really wanna kill red scum.

Vote: Swowl, I'm ready. It's less pressure odds, this is fine.

1) I obviously did not know he was a doctor at the time.
2) The term you were looking for is "exile" or "lynch"... not "kill".
3) According to your own logic, it is not less pressure. In less pressure you don't care who skum is, as long as they are skum.

The concept of not wanting to lynch "red skum" is ridiculous. Yes, it would be fantastic if we find MCMC's partner... but the fact of the matter is that lynching any skum is better than a mis lynch. So unless ya'll got some freeking super powers that helps you hone in based on skum color, I would say that everyone that is suggesting it is ridiculous and boarderline skummy.

7 alive. 3 skum. 3 town. 1 IC.
Looking at that from my pov, or anyone that is actually town, that is choosing 3 skum out of 5 total choices. Or.. if you wanna make it super convoluted, you can try to find 1 skum out of 5 total.
The fact that people have tried to steer the conversation and general thought towards the latter is in its own - skummy.

There are

[EFHW]

I'm settling on Swowl and MiX as my townreads. But I don't have theories yet as to which of the others are red or white. I had thought of joth as white, but others seem to think he is red. I think I'll stick with my Shraeye vote and will continue ISO's tomorrow.

Why is swowl a town read for you?

I isoed him and his posts feel free of any agenda. He writes long posts that feel very much like town!him.

[EFHW]

@Swowl,  you've got it backwards. People are advocating looking for white scum rather than mcmc's red partner.

[MiX]

Oh no I saw that the doctor was doing an incredible amount of self-pres.

When did you notice the doctor doing self-pres?  What did you do because of that?

I voted for them because I thought they were scum.

I did that like all of D2 and SoD3.

@Swowl,  you've got it backwards. People are advocating looking for white scum rather than mcmc's red partner.

I blame Galzria's confusion 

[EFHW]

What's self-pres?

[MiX]

What's self-pres?

Self-preservation, which in this case is hammering twice (yes, twice) when you're the alternative.

[shraeye]

Oh no I saw that the doctor was doing an incredible amount of self-pres.

When did you notice the doctor doing self-pres?  What did you do because of that?

I voted for them because I thought they were scum.

I did that like all of D2 and SoD3.

Ah, ok.  It wasn't meant to be a veiled criticism, I just didn't understand exactly what you meant.  Carry on.

[MiX]

Put a comma between "them" and "because" and you'll get a less agressive answer, which should match with your questions after that clarification.

[Galzria]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

The fact that Swowl is default looking for mcmcs partner...yup

I'm still not forgetting the VCA from earlier that "implicated" ADK but just skipped right past the if-ADK-is-town portion.

Vote: Swowl

Was this X-1?

Joth (726), MiX (749), Shraeye (757)?

Can we get a VC?

Vote: MiX

[Galzria]

I keep trying to type out a VCA but everytime i get into it the conclusion is just the same as before.. which is not helpful.

Day 1 Joth and MiX were the campers on the TownvTown Wagons, whereas Shraeye and Yuma spent the crucial part of the day voting for 1-offs (galz and E! I think) and then both came on in the end to even out the wagons voting for ADK. Galz was looking for ladybugs or something all day, so idk what to make of that.

Then Day 2 Mix is with me on ADK. Galz, Yuma, Joth all on WCD. Shraeye not voting.


So yeah, to keep it short...

long list is
- MiX/Shraeye
- gap
- Galz
- gap
- Joth/Yuma.

i believe the two least likely players to be MCMC's team mate are Joth and Yuma, which is why they are down on the list. I believe the most likely players to be skum in general are MiX, Shraeye, Galz. There is a gap on Galz, because it is based off of VCA that doesn't effing work in this game. So for today - I am MiX or Shraeye.


I am gonna go do some iso's but for now - Vote: MiX

The fact that Swowl is default looking for mcmcs partner...yup

I'm still not forgetting the VCA from earlier that "implicated" ADK but just skipped right past the if-ADK-is-town portion.

Vote: Swowl

Was this X-1?

Joth (726), MiX (749), Shraeye (757)?

Can we get a VC?

Vote: MiX

((To be clear: I have no problem with the Swowl exile - I just don't want to accidently hammer it. Of the players on the wagon, MiX is the one that I think has the clearest chance of flipping scum based on PoE))

[Galzria]

Galz Vote Count 3.X

Swowl (3): Joth (726), MiX (749), Shraeye (757)
MiX (2): Swowl (748), Galz (772)

Not Voting: ADK, EFHW

With 7 Alive it takes 4 to Exile

[Galzria]

Galz Vote Count 3.X1

Shraeye (1): EFHW (712)
Swowl (3): Joth (726), MiX (749), Shraeye (757)
MiX (2): Swowl (748), Galz (772)

Not Voting: ADK

With 7 Alive it takes 4 to Exile

(Missed EFHW's vote))

[Dylan32]

Vote count 3.1

shraeye (1): EFHW
Swowl (3): jotheonah, MiX, shraeye
MiX (2): Swowl, Galzria

Not Voting (1): A Drowned Kernel

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to exile. Day 3 ends Friday, 17th of July, at 6:30 FT.

[Dylan32]

Vote Count 3.2*

Vote count 3.1

shraeye (1): EFHW
Swowl (3): jotheonah, MiX, shraeye
MiX (2): Swowl, Galzria

Not Voting (1): A Drowned Kernel

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to exile. Day 3 ends Friday, 17th of July, at 6:30 FT.

[EFHW]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

[Swowl]

@Swowl,  you've got it backwards. People are advocating looking for white scum rather than mcmc's red partner.

ok yes I def had that backwards then.
However point stands... 3 is still better than 2.

[Swowl]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

[EFHW]

What's self-pres?

Self-preservation, which in this case is hammering twice (yes, twice) when you're the alternative.

He didn't hammer Day 2.

[EFHW]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.

[Galzria]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.

Shraeye wouldn’t make an unannounced X-1 vote as scum. Absolutely no way he intentionally does it, and even less chance he does it accidentally.

[A Drowned Kernel]

What's self-pres?

Self-preservation, which in this case is hammering twice (yes, twice) when you're the alternative.

He didn't hammer Day 2.

I mentioned it before, and we should probably save this discussion until after the game

[MiX]

I mentioned it before, and we should probably save this discussion until after the game

Yes.

[Swowl]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.

it wasn't meant to be persuasive. you asked, i told. I stated previously that I would go for shraeye if needed as the only alternative to MiX - and I will if need be... but for now I will be sticking with MiX.

Why are you so hard set on Shraeye?

[MiX]

I'm thinking we should vote for EFHW instead now...

I don't wanna be exiled though...

Swowl why is EFHW town? And why can't I agree with you D1??

[Swowl]

I'm thinking we should vote for EFHW instead now...

I don't wanna be exiled though...

Swowl why is EFHW town? And why can't I agree with you D1??

I did not say EFHW is town, I said they are my second choice to you. Way far off of "town".
And it is not we cannot agree... we just normally you know.. don't.

[MiX]

I'm thinking we should vote for EFHW instead now...

I don't wanna be exiled though...

Swowl why is EFHW town? And why can't I agree with you D1??

I did not say EFHW is town, I said they are my second choice to you. Way far off of "town".
And it is not we cannot agree... we just normally you know.. don't.

Oh right.

I don't know who I should vote for. It feels like every non-townread can be scum...

[EFHW]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.

it wasn't meant to be persuasive. you asked, i told. I stated previously that I would go for shraeye if needed as the only alternative to MiX - and I will if need be... but for now I will be sticking with MiX.

Why are you so hard set on Shraeye?

Sorry. I said vote Shraeye bc you said he was a close second for you and I think he is scum.

[EFHW]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.

Shraeye wouldn’t make an unannounced X-1 vote as scum. Absolutely no way he intentionally does it, and even less chance he does it accidentally.

So you are saying you are both town. He wouldn't do announced X-1 and I should believe that your intervention here is to help me scumhunt better. So then I have to believe Swowl is scum, which I don't.  But it sounds like we both think joth is scum. Let's vote there.

[EFHW]

*unannounced

[EFHW]

I'm thinking we should vote for EFHW instead now...

I don't wanna be exiled though...

Swowl why is EFHW town? And why can't I agree with you D1??

I did not say EFHW is town, I said they are my second choice to you. Way far off of "town".
And it is not we cannot agree... we just normally you know.. don't.

Oh right.

I don't know who I should vote for. It feels like every non-townread can be scum...

This is uncharacteristic of you. And if you are town then it wouldn't just feel like every nontownread could be scum. For town players who aren't ADK, every nontownread is very likely to be scum since only 2/5 can be town.

[MiX]

I'm thinking we should vote for EFHW instead now...

I don't wanna be exiled though...

Swowl why is EFHW town? And why can't I agree with you D1??

I did not say EFHW is town, I said they are my second choice to you. Way far off of "town".
And it is not we cannot agree... we just normally you know.. don't.

Oh right.

I don't know who I should vote for. It feels like every non-townread can be scum...

This is uncharacteristic of you. And if you are town then it wouldn't just feel like every nontownread could be scum. For town players who aren't ADK, every nontownread is very likely to be scum since only 2/5 can be town.

Uh, yeah. That's what I meant. The literal "can" be scum. It's kinda hard to get a top scumread to vote for when everyone's a good pick...

Like, now I'm second guessing my read on Swowl...he's so likely scum I can't know for certain that he is. Too much PoE and not good enough scumreads. I was way too focused on ADK the previous days, so I basically just have townreads at this point.

[shraeye]

I'm thinking we should vote for EFHW instead now...

I don't wanna be exiled though...

Swowl why is EFHW town? And why can't I agree with you D1??

I did not say EFHW is town, I said they are my second choice to you. Way far off of "town".
And it is not we cannot agree... we just normally you know.. don't.

Oh right.

I don't know who I should vote for. It feels like every non-townread can be scum...

This is uncharacteristic of [MiX].

It's not though, especially later in games

[shraeye]

I'm thinking we should vote for EFHW instead now...

I don't wanna be exiled though...

Swowl why is EFHW town? And why can't I agree with you D1??

I did not say EFHW is town, I said they are my second choice to you. Way far off of "town".

No, you said that *I* was a second choice.  Getting hard to keep those "reads" straight?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Did some rereading, and I'm comfortable voting for swowl. Will probably do so later this evening, we're still a day out form deadline so there's still time for more discussion

[EFHW]

Did some rereading, and I'm comfortable voting for swowl. Will probably do so later this evening, we're still a day out form deadline so there's still time for more discussion

What did I miss?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Did some rereading, and I'm comfortable voting for swowl. Will probably do so later this evening, we're still a day out form deadline so there's still time for more discussion

What did I miss?

I've been following along, trying not to be too vocal about my reads. I'm scum reading swowl though

[EFHW]

Did some rereading, and I'm comfortable voting for swowl. Will probably do so later this evening, we're still a day out form deadline so there's still time for more discussion

What did I miss?

I've been following along, trying not to be too vocal about my reads. I'm scum reading swowl though

Now that you have stated your intention to vote for him, you have been vocal. Is it more vocal to say why so other people can think about your reasons? I don't want to townread him if there is something scummy I missed. Right now I'm using my townread for POE.

[Galzria]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.

Shraeye wouldn’t make an unannounced X-1 vote as scum. Absolutely no way he intentionally does it, and even less chance he does it accidentally.

So you are saying you are both town. He wouldn't do announced X-1 and I should believe that your intervention here is to help me scumhunt better. So then I have to believe Swowl is scum, which I don't.  But it sounds like we both think joth is scum. Let's vote there.

I've clearly stated that I believe he's town, yes. I know that I am - that's not a belief. My "intervention" as you put it isn't to make you "scumhunt better", it's to make an additional point as to why I'm confident in my read on him. I have no idea if you're town or not. My gut has said that Yuma wouldn't do what he did as scum - but I generally find Joth more townie than Yuma/You. PoE means that if I'm town and Shraeye is town, then there can only be exactly one town amongst {EFHW, Joth, MiX, Swowl}. Between my instinct on Yuma and how I generally read Joth, I believe that it's one town amongst {EFHW, Joth}, and that {MiX, Swowl} are both scum.

If you're scum, you're going to believe whatever you want. My point regarding Shraeye is that amongst other reasons, the dude is clearly town.

[Galzria]

Swowl,  what's your reason for voting for MiX?

1. We agreed Day 1 a lot, and I am town... sounds like a joke, but it is only kind of a joke.

2. Assuming that all of the skum were not on wagon, it is at a minimum either Shraeye or MiX, both of which I am fine with, but for other reasons I prefer mix at this point.

3. If they flip red skum, whatever still skum, and it is possible... but if they flip white, I am like idk... 83.5% sure I know who their mate is.


I do have one reservation about MiX, but it is not enough to have my mind changed at this point. Unless everyone wanted shraeye all of a sudden. That would be the only alt I think for me today.

This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.

it wasn't meant to be persuasive. you asked, i told. I stated previously that I would go for shraeye if needed as the only alternative to MiX - and I will if need be... but for now I will be sticking with MiX.

Why are you so hard set on Shraeye?

Sorry. I said vote Shraeye bc you said he was a close second for you and I think he is scum.

You didn't answer his question. You're on Shraeye. Your quote to him was "This is unpersuasive. Vote Shraeye instead.". What's your case? You've got to have something better than PoE to call Swowl's case on MiX "unpersuasive", right?

[Galzria]

MiX, scum-to-chum list, go!:

[Galzria]

I'm settling on Swowl and MiX as my townreads. But I don't have theories yet as to which of the others are red or white. I had thought of joth as white, but others seem to think he is red. I think I'll stick with my Shraeye vote and will continue ISO's tomorrow.

Why is swowl a town read for you?

I isoed him and his posts feel free of any agenda. He writes long posts that feel very much like town!him.

He writes long posts regardless of alignment. And what you're calling "free of any agenda" can better be described as IIoA - something he's especially good at as scum to produce "content" (although he DOES still do a fair amount of this as town, so it's not a lock as a scum tell either).

[Galzria]

I know Joth is semi-V/LA - but would be nice to get some content with deadline in about a day.

[MiX]

MiX, scum-to-chum list, go!:

Shraeye
Swowl
Galzria
EFHW
Joth

But that's useless. I think shraeye's red scum so he might as well be town today

[Galzria]

MiX, scum-to-chum list, go!:

Shraeye
Swowl
Galzria
EFHW
Joth

But that's useless. I think shraeye's red scum so he might as well be town today

What votes/posts/interactions do you think point to Shraeye being Mcmc's partner?

[MiX]

MiX, scum-to-chum list, go!:

Shraeye
Swowl
Galzria
EFHW
Joth

But that's useless. I think shraeye's red scum so he might as well be town today

What votes/posts/interactions do you think point to Shraeye being Mcmc's partner?

I haven't reread yet, I'm on vacation.

He seems to be trying really really hard, which red scum really needs to do to win.

[Galzria]

MiX, scum-to-chum list, go!:

Shraeye
Swowl
Galzria
EFHW
Joth

But that's useless. I think shraeye's red scum so he might as well be town today

So to you, the current wagons are:

Red (1): Green
White (3): Green, Green, Red
Green (2): White, White

Not Voting (1): Green
 
?

(Reference):

Vote count 3.2*

shraeye (1): EFHW
Swowl (3): jotheonah, MiX, shraeye
MiX (2): Swowl, Galzria

Not Voting (1): A Drowned Kernel

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to exile. Day 3 ends Friday, 17th of July, at 6:30 FT.

[MiX]

Yes? Yes, that's actually perfect. A variation of that is what I'd expect.

These questions are confusing.

[Galzria]

Yes? Yes, that's actually perfect. A variation of that is what I'd expect.

These questions are confusing.

I feel like you're the only player that hasn't expressed clear reads, so I'm just trying to fill in the gaps in my notes.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Did some rereading, and I'm comfortable voting for swowl. Will probably do so later this evening, we're still a day out form deadline so there's still time for more discussion

What did I miss?

I've been following along, trying not to be too vocal about my reads. I'm scum reading swowl though

Now that you have stated your intention to vote for him, you have been vocal. Is it more vocal to say why so other people can think about your reasons? I don't want to townread him if there is something scummy I missed. Right now I'm using my townread for POE.

Part of it is PoE. I'm townreading people who aren't swowl, so swowl is a good exile

[EFHW]

I stated my case on Shraeye awhile back, which is that he distorted yuma's play in making a case on me.  His aggressive tone also reminds me of scum!Shraeye.
 

[EFHW]

What's IIoA? Has anyone stated anything scummy about Swowl?

My townread on MiX was teetering,  but now it turns out he is on vacation, which could explain his not scumhunting as actively as usual.

[Galzria]

What's IIoA? Has anyone stated anything scummy about Swowl?

My townread on MiX was teetering,  but now it turns out he is on vacation, which could explain his not scumhunting as actively as usual.

Information Instead of Analysis

[shraeye]

He seems to be trying really really hard, which red scum really needs to do to win.

I thoguth you said you did an analysis of which scumteam to hunt for...did that analysis really lead you to believe that town shouldn't be trying hard?

[Swowl]

Did some rereading, and I'm comfortable voting for swowl. Will probably do so later this evening, we're still a day out form deadline so there's still time for more discussion

What did I miss?

I've been following along, trying not to be too vocal about my reads. I'm scum reading swowl though

Now that you have stated your intention to vote for him, you have been vocal. Is it more vocal to say why so other people can think about your reasons? I don't want to townread him if there is something scummy I missed. Right now I'm using my townread for POE.

Part of it is PoE. I'm townreading people who aren't swowl, so swowl is a good exile

I don't know how to defend myself on this one ya'll. Content has been hard this game because I normally use VCA quite a bit and I just am having trouble generating information from it in this set up. I am in the unique situation where I know I am town, so the PoE for me based on groupings of where skum has to be, is pretty neat.

@ ADK - So, that being said... Let me run through the iso's please and post my thoughts because I am pretty sure even with a mis lynch on me town has some scenarios where we can win. It will take me a until tomorrow some time to get them all out.

[jotheonah]

I know Joth is semi-V/LA - but would be nice to get some content with deadline in about a day.

I’m on vacay, I’m reading along, and I’m happy with where my vote is parked.

Best guess right now is EFHW and Swowl are white team and shraeye is mcmc’s partner, but it could be you or even MiX. That feels like a tomorrow problem.

[EFHW]

I'm impressed. Our 3 scum are doing good town impersonations.  I am now officially in a muddle.

[Galzria]

6 hours to deadline?

[MiX]

6 hours to deadline?

Huh. Seems like it.

Is ADK around?

[A Drowned Kernel]

6 hours to deadline?

Huh. Seems like it.

Is ADK around?

Yeah, I'm still curious if swowl is going to post his thing

[Galzria]

I leave to go camping in an hour and a half (2:30 pm Forum Time).

[Swowl]

6 hours to deadline?

Huh. Seems like it.

Is ADK around?

Yeah, I'm still curious if swowl is going to post his thing

I am sorry i didn’t realize how close to DL
Gimme like an hour to finish

[Swowl]

MCMC Interactions:
#58 – Asks ADK why they are voting for Joth
#63 – defends Joth to ADK; votes ADK
#129 – inquires Shraeye why the Swowl vote
#190/191 – posts and response with MiX. Telling him to join onto ADK, MiX says no go. Potential signaling I suppose.
#262 – responds to shraeye in a null tone.
#265 – comes up with some weakfish reasons to vote for pasta. Pasta previously had Mix, ADK on the wagon… both of whom left for others (MiX for ADK), now Didds had got on Pasta. So this puts Pasta at 2 with Didds, MCMC.
#277 – responding to pasta in a fairly articulate way about why he thinks the doc claim stuff doesn’t check out. He says  “Robz didnt bring up the doctor claim, mail-mi did. ADK, myself, joth, and robz all weighed in with varying takes”… that list is missing a player who did in fact also weigh in, stating there is no point in claiming, just let it happen at L-1… and then said it again later… that player was MiX. Weird to me that he went through the time to go and list exactly which players weighed in and what they said, but completely skipped over mix.
#301 – calls out Yuma/EFHW for partner actions on scola
#302 – Calls Swowl Towny for a series of posts.
#355 – So not only does MCMC come in and defend Joth here… but they are the first and most immediate response – they are the one to point out that Joth did not include MCMC in the skum to chum list. What that means is IDK – I think that regardless of alignment we all look for our names on lists first. The only points against at all I suppose are it could be MCMC trying to like “get ahead of it”.
#357 – comes in and says they are ok with either Pasta or ADK… but ADK coming on as more town now… There were three wagon potentials. The third one at the time was Shraeye.
#361 – Joth comes back to the point out that MCMC is not on the list and says “oh yeah I am skum reading you”… which to be fair is either true, or partnery.
#377 – gets on Shraeye about trying to go for Galz last minute. In a way that does not come off as partnery.
#395/#405 – a bunch of back and forths with Yuma/EFHW. Like pushing on each other pretty hard, and Yuma actually votes for MCMC and tries to build that case out when there were at least 2 Town wagons running at that time. So if Yuma/EFHW is skum… don’t think it is with MCMC.
#408 – responds to scola ignoring shraeye in big break down post.
#410/#411 – fun. This is the post count and response post. The top three posters are MiX, Yuma/EFHW, followed by MCMC. The bottom is Galz. MCMC LITERALLY SAYS “I will not vote for MiX or Yuma”… and then throws defense in at Galz, at Shraeye’s expense. So OK… That leaves the middle that MCMC will vote for… ahem… those are classified as the following:

Dead Town = [Robz, WCD, MM, ADK, Pasta, E!]
Alive Town = [Swan]
Alive Unknown = [Joth, Shraeye]
…. I know this is “a little paranoid”… but 100% his partner, just based off of this, is either MiX, Yuma, or Galz. Hard leaning on MiX (more reasons to follow). MCMC got to CHOOSE when to post this…. And they only posted it once. I promise you that the timing was not a damn accident.

#500 – back and forths with E!.
#596 – Defends Swowl and WCD. I am telling you again right here guys… you have to at the very least remove me from the list of MCMC’s fucking partner. He has been knighting all the fucking town flips, and this is like the 5th time he has done it again for me. I am TOWN!!!
#632/#633 – this is VC 2.2 and right after. When WCD starts up. Galz is on, followed by MCMC, Yuma, and Joth. OK fine whatever that could mean anything. However… immediately hafter in #634 Shraeye comes in and tries to get the Swowl wagon going off some half cocked reason they never respond to my responses on. Could of gone for ADK or WCD… instead went for me. Again, that could be just trying to make more wagons hoping that you find other skum on one of them.


I guess this is the first one that I got. I am not gonna have time before DL to do everyone. But I have one connection piece I wanna get out too. So gimme another small bit here I will do it now.


My take away from this is MCMC seemed to openly defend a ton of people that have flipped town since then. They have also been building quite a few cases on people and playing leader on pushing them.
There partner is going to be in the crossover of
a) Players that cases were not made on
b) Players that were more ignored than knighted
c) Players that did not join MCMC's cases (last one is based on the fact that every wagon we have had has NOT flipped as MCMC's partner, so there was never any rush to try and get a lynch off, so they would spread out).

MiX, Shraeye, EFHW (in that order is the likelihood I have for MCMC partner.) MiX and Shraeye are pretty damn close though after this read through.

[Swowl]

I got 5 hours left.
I am still doing my other reads, but is there anyone here that is willing to work with me?
I am town I super pinky promise! So if you are skum and you are one me (which at least one of you has to be!) you do NOT want to lynch me. and if you are town and on me... you also don't wanna lynch me.

[A Drowned Kernel]

I got 5 hours left.
I am still doing my other reads, but is there anyone here that is willing to work with me?
I am town I super pinky promise! So if you are skum and you are one me (which at least one of you has to be!) you do NOT want to lynch me. and if you are town and on me... you also don't wanna lynch me.

That post was a lot about mcmc and his partner; what about the other scum team?

[MiX]

Swowl's white scum.

Now that's one hell of a statement out of context.

He's voting his real scumread (it's wrong though, not that I feel like rereading mcmc to prove it), which has to be the red scum he's hunting. That's definitely not what town would do.

[Swowl]

I got 5 hours left.
I am still doing my other reads, but is there anyone here that is willing to work with me?
I am town I super pinky promise! So if you are skum and you are one me (which at least one of you has to be!) you do NOT want to lynch me. and if you are town and on me... you also don't wanna lynch me.

That post was a lot about mcmc and his partner; what about the other scum team?

2 seperate posts. I did red first. White is coming hold plz.

[Swowl]

Swowl's white scum.

Now that's one hell of a statement out of context.

He's voting his real scumread (it's wrong though, not that I feel like rereading mcmc to prove it), which has to be the red scum he's hunting. That's definitely not what town would do.

1. No he not.
2. It is exactly what town would do. And then follow it up with a white team post. Which I am.
3. It also exactly what anyone would do, including myself as Town... which I am, in order to allow for the highest liklihood of not a mis lynch. At this point - I legit do not care which skum is lynched, bc any of them are better than me.

White team coming up uno momento.

[Galzria]

Have some service on the road. Deadline in 1 hour 40 min

[Galzria]

Have some service on the road. Deadline in 1 hour 40 min

Sorry, 2h10m

[MiX]

Swowl's white scum.

Now that's one hell of a statement out of context.

He's voting his real scumread (it's wrong though, not that I feel like rereading mcmc to prove it), which has to be the red scum he's hunting. That's definitely not what town would do.

1. No he not.
2. It is exactly what town would do. And then follow it up with a white team post. Which I am.
3. It also exactly what anyone would do, including myself as Town... which I am, in order to allow for the highest liklihood of not a mis lynch. At this point - I legit do not care which skum is lynched, bc any of them are better than me.

White team coming up uno momento.

Ok so why are you voting me? Not now as we're the only wagons, but when you voted for me. It seems like you think I'm red scum with that post.

[Swowl]

2 White Skum in [Joth, EFHW, Shraeye, Galz, and MiX]

Joth:

- Up to #62: Opens day 1 with a lot of set up talk and discussion of the Doctor claim. I personally do not assign skum points for that type of behavior, especially in a game full of vets where no one is gonna like "miss something" in the set up anyways.

#67 -Votes for MCMC

#188/189 - Joth stating not active. MiX comments on "oh you're not trying so you must be town".

#274 - hedges on Robz (leading wagon at the time). I think they town, which means they are prob skum. Always skummy thing to say. gives you an opening without a reason.

#294/315 - gets on Robz for reasons behind why not town reading MCMC.

#328-339 - leaves MCMC... to follow MCMC onto Scola. Gets into a pretty believable back and forth with MiX regarding why and dynamics of wagons and etc. Does throw in there that they are ok with BOTH the leading wagons just doesn't find one more skummy than the other. My primary take away though is following the person you have been voting ALL day onto 1 of 2 wagon choices, that you think are equally likely to be skum... how do you choose the wagon choice with your actual skum read on it? That is weird. Could be skum MCMC partner.. though not likely... more likely white skum move not paying attention. Very unlikely town forgot there only skum read of the whole damn game and followed them on an even choice.

... ok gonna try to speed things up...

- Next he has a few posts in which he hits the fence on whether or not WCD is skummy or not. Followed by talking, yet not talking, about set up shit.
- Then there is the reads list that missed MCMC. That is supppperrr weird. Could be a slip IDK. Further than that -
he is TRing 3 town and MiX,
skum reading ADK and Pasta,
Fenced about Yuma and WCD and E!,
and then "forgot Galz and Shraeye were in the game".
For a list that requires you to be neutral or TRing as skum to your partner, that is a lot of non flipped people in a lot of spots Joth DOES NOT need to vote for. Additionally, I have somehow gone from a top town read to their only vote of the day. Not sure what to make of that. 


#418 - makes a posts about the defense of reads lists. We don't have enough time to get into this, and I did not want to bring it up at the time, I was hoping for it to get pushed again - I 100% disagree with the general assumption that lists are better in this set up. Yes, skum can use them and town lists are genuine great. But at some point, kill selection becomes an issue, and skum will be able to hone in on other skum (like kinda like now probably), but also on players that are potentially the doc or players that hit a mid range of unlynchable/could be skum. List goes on. Short is - I don't agree. So I think it is skummy.


THIS POST IS IMMIDEATELY AFTER THE DEFENSE OF USING LISTS TO HELP SKUM SHOOT SKUM! why why why would this be a post? why would he believe that he would be a likely kill target for being a TR??? Makes no sense. Skummy af fluff post.

Everyone please stop townreading me so hard I really don’t want to be the N1 kill.

- Day 2 starts off on MCMC again. And then AGAIN.... follows MCMC to WCD. Again, even more now.... I think that is something that skum that is not partnered with MCMC does without thinking about it too much.

#585 - is the incredibly leading thing he brings up in response to Shraeye's response to MY analysis read. The conclusion they make of which is somehow that WCD and Swowl are partners that had a night discussion about using specific verbiage between the words "re read" vs "VCA... I think? Either way it is the weakest case ever and saying out loud is boarderline more skummy than bringing it up - I have brought that up before.... suprise... guess who disagreed with me? Hint: it wasMCMC.

#589 is a lazy response about how skum hones in kills. One of the reasons is "people that auto die night 1 anyways... like faust". That has not been a thing for a long as time.

#633 - Votes for Swowl, then says no instead goes to WCD to put them at L2. Cool fun thing is the next post from Shraeye:

Ok, well, I still prefer Swowl but vote: WCD for the sake of consolidating. That's L-2.

No, let's go back to Swowl.  I strongly prefer there over Didds

vote: Swowl

--- "Let's" go back to swowl??? Shraeye was never on swowl. That could legit be a slip.




OK running out of time and I need to try to do something so summary of everything else in like 2 sentences:

Joth says and does a ton of things that come off as potentially leaving the door open, and/or could be very masking. Like a lot. And all that is skummy. But there overall gameplay and effort just seems to be towny.
I do not know what to make of the fact that they just like do not quote in this game for some reason? I don't think that means anything.

So imo, yes... Joth could be White Skum with either Shraeye, EFHW/Yuma, or Galz. But not MiX. I think.

From that list [Joth, Shraeye, Yuma/EFHW, Galz] - I think that both Joth and Galz fall into a "We should worry about it tomorrow" category. So the last on my lists outside of mix would be EFHW or Shraeye.

[Swowl]

Swowl's white scum.

Now that's one hell of a statement out of context.

He's voting his real scumread (it's wrong though, not that I feel like rereading mcmc to prove it), which has to be the red scum he's hunting. That's definitely not what town would do.

1. No he not.
2. It is exactly what town would do. And then follow it up with a white team post. Which I am.
3. It also exactly what anyone would do, including myself as Town... which I am, in order to allow for the highest liklihood of not a mis lynch. At this point - I legit do not care which skum is lynched, bc any of them are better than me.

White team coming up uno momento.

Ok so why are you voting me? Not now as we're the only wagons, but when you voted for me. It seems like you think I'm red scum with that post.

Tell you what man, at this point even if you are skum, my second choice is better than me.

I don't see it working, but at this point I don't see people lynching you either.

I guess I will try a Shraeye move. Any chance I can convince people to join in on that?

Vote: Shraeye

[Swowl]

Also, FWIW, this is the scenario(s) I see most likely right now:

Vote count 3.1
shraeye (1): EFHW
Swowl (3): jotheonah, MiX, shraeye
MiX (2): Swowl, Galzria

Not Voting (1): A Drowned Kernel


#1: Red = [MCMC, MiX]; White = [Shraeye, Joth] - explains the switch in Joth from me being a top TR over Shraeye being null to now choosing the off wagon field of myself over Shraeye, and then ofc being joined by Shraeye.

#2: Red = [MCMC, MiX]; White = [Shraeye, Galz] - Just based on the wagons of the day when galz stated their intentions for the day. it is a huge gap between #1 and #2. Galz would also have no problem going for MiX if they did in fact think MiX was skummy (other skum obv).

#3: Paranoia, and I have reasons for it but I don't have time to get it out. But just note this.
If MiX is skum, but is not RED skum... then my top choice is Red = [MCMC, Galz]; White = [MiX, ??]

#4: If I am wrong about MiX,  then Red = [MCMC, EFHW/Galz]; White = [Joth, Shraeye].

So yeah, I guess actually I have no problem going with my Shraeye vote.

[Swowl]

sigh... that is all I have time to actually go back and do.

if someone wants something ask it of me I guess. we have like 90 minutes I think.

[Swowl]

cmon! somebody work with me here... we are for sure 33% between Joth, MiX, Shraeye... and we are "probably" 66% between those three... and there is a chance that is not hilariously low that we are 100% to find skum there.

If there is 1/3 on me it is MiX as Red, then EFHW/Galz as White.
If there are 2/3 on me it is Joth/Shraeye as white and fuck if I know between EFHW/Galz.
If there are 3/3 on me it is MiX as Red, then Joth/Shraeye as white. <-- this is most likely imo.

[Dylan32]

Vote count 3.3

shraeye (2): EFHW, Swowl
Swowl (3): jotheonah, MiX, shraeye
MiX (1): Galzria

Not Voting (1): A Drowned Kernel

With 7 alive, it takes 4 to exile. Day 3 ends Friday, 17th of July, at 6:30 FT (that's in 65 minutes).

[Swowl]

cmon! somebody work with me here... we are for sure 33% between Joth, MiX, Shraeye... and we are "probably" 66% between those three... and there is a chance that is not hilariously low that we are 100% to find skum there.

If there is 1/3 on me it is MiX as Red, then EFHW/Galz as White.
If there are 2/3 on me it is Joth/Shraeye as white and fuck if I know between EFHW/Galz.
If there are 3/3 on me it is MiX as Red, then Joth/Shraeye as white. <-- this is most likely imo.

second likely is 1/3, least likely is 2/3... just for reference.

[A Drowned Kernel]

MiX, would you consider switching to shraeye?

[MiX]

MiX, would you consider switching to shraeye?

Maybe?? We can win regardless of exile, and I think he's red scum.

But Swowl is just so scum I don't really want to move...

[Galzria]

Leaving service area in 5 min.

ADK, exile preference? I can leave my vote wherever.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Blergh

vote: swowl

[Galzria]

Fuck it.

Vote: Shraeye

ADK, you can still hammer Swowl or convince MiX to move.

I’m only not hammering Swowl here because you can still. I prefer Swowl to Shraeye.

[Galzria]

Blergh

vote: swowl

That works too.

[Swowl]

ah man. wrong choice adk :/

[MiX]

Ok, well. Good night everyone! Good luck scum!

And uh, you should try to hit each other. Trust me on that one.

Swowl, are you red?

[Swowl]

I am green unfortunately.

[Swowl]

Ok, well. Good night everyone! Good luck scum!

And uh, you should try to hit each other. Trust me on that one.

Swowl, are you red?

Also, I thought you thought shraeye was red? We both cannot be red.

[Swowl]

adk you want anything before this locks?

[MiX]

Ok, well. Good night everyone! Good luck scum!

And uh, you should try to hit each other. Trust me on that one.

Swowl, are you red?

Also, I thought you thought shraeye was red? We both cannot be red.

It's the only thing you can admit to being now...

I really want to believe you're scum.

How could I be voting for town in this PoE...

[A Drowned Kernel]

adk you want anything before this locks?

A do-over on this game

[MiX]

adk you want anything before this locks?

A do-over on this game

We can still win, okay?

Multiball is a mess.

[Swowl]

Ok, well. Good night everyone! Good luck scum!

And uh, you should try to hit each other. Trust me on that one.

Swowl, are you red?

Also, I thought you thought shraeye was red? We both cannot be red.

It's the only thing you can admit to being now...

I really want to believe you're scum.

How could I be voting for town in this PoE...

well either it is because you are red and then it is a combo of white between [joth, shraeye, galz]
or
because you are town and it is red Galz and white Joth, shraeye
or
it could be you are town and shraeye is red, and white is galz shraeye.

but I don't think shraeye is red here - on the off chance you are town, you should re read that one.

[Swowl]

or off shot - but it could be mix/galz. I like think that alone is possible, but when I have to select a red player I can't with the remaining options... so probably not likely.

[MiX]

What's that third option??

I need to reread tomorrow don't I.

[Swowl]

What's that third option??

I need to reread tomorrow don't I.

galz joth. typo

[Swowl]

ADK I am sure you have thought about this - but if you have a Red/Town read - that should be your target. If you die and white gets red, its game.

[MiX]

Red won't kill ADK (please trust me) so the odds of us losing on the spot are low. But it's possible, so I agree with Swowl.

As long as you doc someone we always have a chance to win, but 3v1v1's easier than 3v2.

[jotheonah]

Just remember scum is reading all this too.

[LaLight]

Thread Locked.

[LaLight]

Vote count 3.final

shraeye (2): EFHW, Swowl
Swowl (4): jotheonah, MiX, shraeye, A Drowned Kernel
MiX (1): Galzria

Not Voting (0):

With 7 alive, it took 4 to exile.

[LaLight]

Swowl sat in their bedroom staring at a wall of pictures of everyone in town, connected by bits of red and white string.

"There must be a pattern, *something* that will give away mcmcsalot's partner and reveal who the other draconic scum are!"

Swowl pondered everything. Suddenly, he remembered overhearing a conversation the other day.

"Of course! It must be them!"

Just then the door burst open.

"Seize him!"

Swowl has been exiled. He was a Vanilla Townie.

Night 3 starts now and ends in 48 hours or so, July 19 at 7pm

[LaLight]

A few remaining villagers tried to stay at home. Closer to their loved once, closer to the fire. But sometimes Ice is much, much stronger than any man-made fire.

jotheonah was frozen. He was a Vanilla Townie.

But the fire that is not man made can melt even the hardest Dragon Ice.

Galzria was burned. He was an Ice Dragonborn.

Day 4 starts now!

Vote count 4.0

Not voting (4): A Drowned Kernel, MiX, EFHW, shraeye

With 4 alive, it takes 3 to exile. Day 4 ends Sunday, 26th of July, at 7 pm FT.

Thread unlocked!

[A Drowned Kernel]

So it's 2v1v1?

I think that means vote: no exile

[MiX]

So it's 2v1v1?

I think that means vote: no exile

It does, if you want.

The game is dependent on your doc target. If you want time to think, we can talk it out this day.

If you're settled, we can end it.

[A Drowned Kernel]

It would help if I knew who scum was, so if they want to claim, that would be nice

[EFHW]

vote: no exile

[MiX]

Vote: No exile

Okay, well, good night everyone, good luck ADK.

[LaLight]

Thread Locked.

[LaLight]

Vote count 4.final

No Exile (3): A Drowned Kernel, EFHW, MiX

Not Voting (1): shraeye

With 4 alive, it took 3 to no exile.

[LaLight]

Night 4 starts now and end in 48 hours, July 27, 7 am FT. If you want a shorter night, please state in your qt. If everyone will confirm, the night will be shortened.

[LaLight]

And then it was over. The one who was doctored 4 times sat with the one who doctored him.

[LaLight]

shraeye was frozen. He was a Red Dragonborn.

EFHW was Burned. She was a Vanilla Townie.

The team of White Dragonborns, MiX and Galzria, won!

Thread unlocked.

[LaLight]

White Dragonborn QT
Red Dragonborn QT
speccy
mod qt

[LaLight]

Thanks a lot to Dylan for comodding, I felt sick at one point and couldn't do the vote counts. and also thanks for the flavor!

[A Drowned Kernel]

Good game, all

[MiX]

Good game indeed.

Galzria is a very fun partner to have.

Being scum in multiball twice is weird. Glad it paid off this time

[MiX]

Speccy's interesting. Galzria came up with a situation that I had never thought of, which is in that last day town could've exiled a VT, thus ensuring 1v1v1 which is essentially a town win. I thought it was just 2v1v1 with doc, which means whoever the doc picks wins (since in LyLo doc can just choose to trust them again, no real reason to swap). That means the 2v1v1 scenario, which is normally 33% for each team, would be...a 33%, actually, since ADK would have to choose who to exile, which essentially resorts it into weird XiLo, as they would have to place the second vote on town, and then hope for one scum to hammer, thinking they were hammering other scum.

The 3v2v1 going into the night scenario is so rich in possibilities and plays, I really loved theorizing about it. This setup is even better than I thought!

[Galzria]

Good game indeed.

Galzria is a very fun partner to have.

Being scum in multiball twice is weird. Glad it paid off this time

Sorry for changing the previous NK to Joth. The VCA I mentioned was that he opened D1 & D2 voting for Mcmc - something he would def do regardless, but he left the votes there for soooo long. I just felt if he was Town he would’ve moved his vote sooner.

It all worked out though, and my going for you instead of Swowl paid off it seems! Good job getting to the finish! So many ways that could’ve played out!

[MiX]

Good game indeed.

Galzria is a very fun partner to have.

Being scum in multiball twice is weird. Glad it paid off this time

Sorry for changing the previous NK to Joth. The VCA I mentioned was that he opened D1 & D2 voting for Mcmc - something he would def do regardless, but he left the votes there for soooo long. I just felt if he was Town he would’ve moved his vote sooner.

It all worked out though, and my going for you instead of Swowl paid off it seems! Good job getting to the finish! So many ways that could’ve played out!

The fact that he was pushing for mcmc, and the weird "forgot to put your name on my read list" put joth as town for me. But it's actually interesting how XiLo doesn't need to be the best way to win the game. Going into a joth/EFHW/MiX situation seems hard.


And apparently I had ADK townreading me? Ooooh I'd love to know how your read progression was!

[jotheonah]

Other than mcmc my reads were extremely terrible!

[EFHW]

Other than mcmc my reads were extremely terrible!

Mine were good but everyone thought I was scum ☹

[Swowl]

Ah! damn! GG White team!

[Robz888]

GG!

My "gut" reads were actually better than usual. I intuitively suspected mcmc, and actually had a feeling about Galz I couldn't explain. Not that I was able to parlay this isn't anything...

[EFHW]

This game is a great example of how well scum can do when they are all (mostly) active.

[Galzria]

This game is a great example of how well scum can do when they are all (mostly) active.

I mean, Scum should generally do well when active. I have notes in my QT where I talked about intentionally being less active to lean into an older established meta of mine - dictated by the group we were playing with. If the game were largely the “newer” (to me, since returning for M100) crowd, I think I would’ve played more forward and “in control”. I certainly find it WAY easier to be active scum than inactive scum - I hate feeling a loss of game control.

[2.71828.....]

Whole I enjoy winning, I am kind of glad that town didn't win a game where we didn't exile a single scum.

GG everyone!

[2.71828.....]

While*

[jotheonah]

Well, this is what happens when I townread MiX, even for a moment. Back to never trusting him again!

[MiX]

Well, this is what happens when I townread MiX, even for a moment. Back to never trusting him again!

Yay! That's the best reaction.

This game is a great example of how well scum can do when they are all (mostly) active.

Well, I guess, yeah. It is tricky to dodge NKs and be townie at the same time though. I know I wanted to kill mail-mi because of how townie he was, regardless of the setup wanting scum to aim at scum.

Whole I enjoy winning, I am kind of glad that town didn't win a game where we didn't exile a single scum.

GG everyone!

Same as the previous multiball, interestingly. You don't really need to, exiles are much less important than reading people correctly.

[shraeye]

Other than mcmc my reads were extremely terrible!

Mine were good but everyone thought I was scum ☹

That was very much your predecessor I was reading

[EFHW]

Other than mcmc my reads were extremely terrible!

Mine were good but everyone thought I was scum ☹

That was very much your predecessor I was reading

I thought yuma's play was very towny. Scumhunting plus some jokes. Even the flaming out was towny - scum would have rolled with the accusations.

[shraeye]

I went downstairs to my office just now to get a todo list, and I saw a reads list that I wrote out earlier with a line connecting Galz and MiX....shoot, should have looked at that when submitting night actions.

[mcmcsalot]

Other than mcmc my reads were extremely terrible!

Mine were good but everyone thought I was scum ☹

That was very much your predecessor I was reading

I thought yuma's play was very towny. Scumhunting plus some jokes. Even the flaming out was towny - scum would have rolled with the accusations.

I think multi-ball was the downfall there. I kept thinking he’s doing scumhunting but that’s exactly what scum would do. I also felt similar to him during the flame out but kept quiet because I didn’t want to hurt my game but it did feel like frustrated scum being told he shouldn’t be misexileing someone.

[mcmcsalot]

also I had a solid town read on Mix, I feel like I always townread mix, he’s good at buddying me
Without me noticing

[mcmcsalot]

GG!

My "gut" reads were actually better than usual. I intuitively suspected mcmc, and actually had a feeling about Galz I couldn't explain. Not that I was able to parlay this isn't anything...

You played day one too well. It hurt to nk you so quickly but such a smart doctor opinion plus a correct read on me that joth and galz and Yuma were likely to listen to. I had to just eliminate people who suspected me, too bad I didn’t pick the ones that could ice me

[MiX]

also I had a solid town read on Mix, I feel like I always townread mix, he’s good at buddying me
Without me noticing

I also townread you unconditionally, so maybe it's mutual. My PoE was getting to you, but Galzria's the one that had the idea to ice you first.