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Author Topic: Speculation on Ways  (Read 1207 times)

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scolapasta

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Speculation on Ways
« on: March 10, 2020, 02:47:17 pm »
+2

So, we've seen 5 Ways so far: Ox, Mole, Turtle, Chameleon, and Rat, with 15 more on the way.

Over in the interview thread, Donald X seemed OK with our speculating based on the leaked names:

Would you be willing to share what the remaining Way animals are? It'd be fun to speculate what they might do, based on the names alone.

This info is already on the Wiki; it's linked to in one of the previews threads.

Sure, I saw that. But it felt like an unofficial leak*; I preferred not to speculate publicly in the forums until it was something more official.

* though I will admit, it's what inspired this question :)
I'm happy to leave it as, you know there was that leak, you can go look at it and speculate.

 So here's a thread for just that. My suggestion is limit yourself to just one or two Ways per post, so as to not overwhelm the speculations.

Here's mine:

It'd be cool of Way of the Butterfly somehow had to do with the Butterfly effect, i.e. do something small now, that could eventually lead to something much larger later. But honestly, I'm not sure in practice what that would work. I mean, with tokens, you could do something like Sinister Plot, but as we know, no tokens this expansion.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2020, 02:54:41 pm »
+2

I've been wondering about Way of the Horse, since we know what Horse does already. It assume it would have something to do with card draw, but it obviously can't just be the same as Horse's text. +2 cards seems like a possibility.
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scolapasta

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2020, 03:23:51 pm »
+2

I've been wondering about Way of the Horse, since we know what Horse does already. It assume it would have something to do with card draw, but it obviously can't just be the same as Horse's text. +2 cards seems like a possibility.

I think the design challenge with Ways is how well they work with any Action card. Turtle, Rat, and Chameleon all scale to the card that is playing them. Ox and Mole don't, but are situationally useful: if you have three non terminals in your hand, you're going to activate Ox, and similarly if your hand is a $5, 2 coppers, and 2 estates, Mole looks attractive.

I'm hardpressed to find frequent enough examples of wanting +2 Cards in lieu of the card's regular instructions.

How about: "Discard this. If you do, gain a Horse per $1 it costs."

So now a $2 card is a deferred Moat (one at a time, of course), while a $5 card gets you +5 deferred cards.

(if this is too strong, you could possibly replace "Discard this" with "Return this to its pile".
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mxdata

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2020, 03:35:57 pm »
+1

Way of the Goat seems likely to be a trashing card, probably "Trash a card from your hand"

Way of the Monkey might be some kind of emulator, like "Play a card from the Supply costing up to $4"
« Last Edit: March 10, 2020, 03:46:24 pm by mxdata »
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mxdata

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2020, 03:42:41 pm »
+1

Also, since there's a Way of the Squirrel, I really hope there's a card called Moose
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mxdata

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2020, 04:03:28 pm »
0

Way of the Squirrel: Exile a card from your hand or discard one card from your Exile mat (thematically: a squirrel stashing away acorns)
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Awaclus

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2020, 04:41:32 pm »
+3

I feel like most of this speculation is going to be way off.
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scolapasta

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2020, 04:50:43 pm »
+2

I feel like most of this speculation is going to be way off.

Of course it will, that what makes it fun! :)
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J Reggie

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2020, 05:04:12 pm »
+3

As I said earlier, I think Way of the Pig will be a cantrip. If anything has to do with horses, it'll probably be the mule.

popsofctown

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2020, 05:18:57 pm »
+2

I can only dispute other people since as far as I can tell these were removed from the wiki.  So like hey I'm not going out of my way to be adversarial ok.

I think Way of the Butterfly will reference metamorphosis, and will be "trash this: gain an action card costing exactly 1$ more".
I think it could possibly say "and then play it" with the logic of everything is ok if everybody gets to do the busted thing, Donate style, but without "and then play it" it still seems like it could get some activations, Moneylender if nothing else.
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Donald X.

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2020, 05:36:46 pm »
0

(Way of the Butterfly was spoiled on the German forums - an image that appeared on a few foreign store sites.)
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crj

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #11 on: March 11, 2020, 06:58:47 pm »
+1

I've been wondering about Way of the Horse, since we know what Horse does already. It assume it would have something to do with card draw
Horse also returns itself to its pile; maybe the Way of the Horse is about that instead?
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mxdata

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2020, 07:10:06 pm »
0

I've been wondering about Way of the Horse, since we know what Horse does already. It assume it would have something to do with card draw
Horse also returns itself to its pile; maybe the Way of the Horse is about that instead?
Something like "Return this card to its pile after following its directions"?  Could be useful for cards that are only useful in the early game, or for games with landscapes such as Lone Wolf or Wall when you're getting near the end of the game
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crj

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #13 on: March 11, 2020, 07:33:28 pm »
+1

It could be something more swish, such as +1 Card, +1 Action, follow this card's instructions, return this to its pile. Or even play the card twice then return it?
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hhelibebcnofnena

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #14 on: March 11, 2020, 10:56:42 pm »
0

I don't think it would be a pure "return this to its pile after following its instructions." Way of the Turtle's self-exile is too similar.
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scolapasta

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #15 on: March 11, 2020, 11:37:36 pm »
+1

It could be something more swish, such as +1 Card, +1 Action, follow this card's instructions, return this to its pile. Or even play the card twice then return it?

Play card twice would allow you to play card infinitely. :) But that's pedantic, of course, it could say "follow this card's instructions twice".

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D782802859

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #16 on: March 12, 2020, 06:29:25 am »
0

Way of the Butterfly might have something to do with gain and play, because of Summon.
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crj

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #17 on: March 12, 2020, 08:26:04 am »
+1

Given that it appears ways are always on-play effects, not on-buy or on-gain, that would be tricky to engineer. An appealing idea, though. (-8
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scolapasta

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #18 on: March 12, 2020, 10:08:14 am »
+2

Possible way of the camel:

Exile a card from the supply costing $1 per $1 this costs.

Let's cards do what camels do, but scaled to their cost.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #19 on: March 13, 2020, 08:28:56 am »
+2

I've been wondering about Way of the Horse, since we know what Horse does already. It assume it would have something to do with card draw
Horse also returns itself to its pile; maybe the Way of the Horse is about that instead?

We were both right!
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GendoIkari

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #20 on: March 13, 2020, 08:39:42 am »
+1

Possible way of the camel:

Exile a card from the supply costing $1 per $1 this costs.

Let's cards do what camels do, but scaled to their cost.

Seems weak compared to Way of the Rat; except way overpowered if Peddler is in the Kingdom.
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grrgrrgrr

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #21 on: March 14, 2020, 04:58:39 am »
0

Well, it's pretty obvious now that most of the ways are simple, and that they don't scale at all.

So my speculation is:

Way of the Dog: +2 Cards (no, this is not too weak)

Way of the Owl: +1 Action, Look at the top 3 cards of your deck. Discard any number of them and put back the rest in any order.

Way of the Peacock: +2 Buys

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #22 on: March 14, 2020, 11:28:05 am »
0


Way of the Peacock: +2 Buys

This is too weak to be an official card, maybe +$1, +1 Buy?
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popsofctown

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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #23 on: March 14, 2020, 11:29:55 am »
+1

I think +1$, +1 Buy is more likely but it's pretty hard for anything with +1 Buy to be totally too weak to be an official card since it always has the potential to be the only +1 Buy on an engine board.
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Re: Speculation on Ways
« Reply #24 on: March 14, 2020, 01:46:29 pm »
+5


Way of the Peacock: +2 Buys

This is too weak to be an official card, maybe +$1, +1 Buy?

Hard disagree. Thing with ways is that their positioning doesn't matter. They can't gum you starting hand, and they are always there when you need them. In many turns you manage to draw your engine, there are cards that ended up being not necessary for the turn itself, but rather are added to prevent your starting hand from sucking ass. In those cases, you can trade 1 action for 2 buys, which is a steal.

I think the version you proposed is worse, as a way. As a $2 cost, it would've been better.
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