Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1] 2 3 4  All

Author Topic: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile  (Read 17572 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5868
  • Respect: +23636
    • View Profile
Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« on: March 04, 2020, 03:01:02 am »
+28

Menagerie includes Exile mats, one per player. They're a place to put cards where they're still yours but not in your deck. The Exile mat has a built-in rule to let you get the cards off of it; check it out:



What that all means will vary a lot, depending on the card doing the exiling. Eight kingdom cards use Exiling, and six landscapes; here are some of those kingdom cards.



Bounty Hunter mainly stores cards that you probably don't want to draw anymore. If you didn't have one of whatever it is in Exile already, you get +$3, so early on it helps you spike $ amounts, and then it's either a way to at least get rid of more cards, or you can consider collecting a bounty on something you weren't exactly planning on parting with. And after that it can keep Provinces out of your deck, so I mean, what's not to like.

Stockpile has a different trick: it Exiles itself. You can just buy another one to get back the first one, and Exile them again, and buy another to get back those two, and so on. Until the pile runs out anyway.

Coven has yet another trick. It hands out Curses, but they don't just poison your deck immediately; they accumulate in Exile and then one day you dump them all into your deck at once. I will just tell you now, you better not be relying on Bounty Hunter to get rid of the Curses; you can keep collecting the bounty, but Coven will keep dumping them back into your deck.
Logged

mxdata

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 595
  • Respect: +622
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #1 on: March 04, 2020, 03:23:34 am »
0

Interesting!  So, it's kinda similar to the Tavern mat, except with a different way of retrieving cards?  I'm wondering if any of the other cards have another way of retrieving cards from Exile, for example, an Action card that's something like "If there are any cards on your Exile mat, discard one"?
Logged
They/them

scolapasta

  • Witch
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 476
  • Respect: +516
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #2 on: March 04, 2020, 03:32:59 am »
+6

Hypothesis: cards with horses in their art will combo well with Horses.

Bounty Hunter: exile a horse*, get +$3; gain another horse and discard the exiled one; repeat.

* missing out on playing the horse here isn't terrible, since it's a one shot anyway.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2020, 03:42:00 am by scolapasta »
Logged
Feel free to join us at scolapasta's cards for discussion on any of my custom cards.

mxdata

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 595
  • Respect: +622
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #3 on: March 04, 2020, 03:35:16 am »
0

Coven's attack is rather interesting, especially since one player could get all the curses on their mat dumped on them before the others.  For example, if there are only two curses left in a 4-player game, and you play Coven, the first two players to your left will exile a curse, but then the third player will get all of the curses dumped on them right away.  But, I suspect in most cases, the others would get them soon enough so that it wouldn't usually make a particularly significant impact
Logged
They/them

mxdata

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 595
  • Respect: +622
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2020, 03:41:02 am »
0

Any particular reason there's not a special type for these cards, like how cards that use the Tavern mat in Adventures have the Reserve type?
Logged
They/them

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5868
  • Respect: +23636
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2020, 03:44:14 am »
+2

Any particular reason there's not a special type for these cards, like how cards that use the Tavern mat in Adventures have the Reserve type?
You mean for Stockpile? Miser isn't a Reserve card.

There are reasons to use types: to tie rules to the type; to refer to the type on a card; to give the cards a color so they draw your attention. These reasons didn't exist here so they don't have a special type.
Logged

mxdata

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 595
  • Respect: +622
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #6 on: March 04, 2020, 03:47:31 am »
+1

Bounty Hunter would be great for getting victory cards out of your deck!  Similar to Island, but without the VP that Island has.
Logged
They/them

Ingix

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 223
  • Shuffle iT Username: Ingix
  • Respect: +309
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2020, 04:03:50 am »
+1

Yes, that's the way to use them once you are greening (and with the initial Estates/Shelters as well).
Logged

mxdata

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 595
  • Respect: +622
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2020, 04:15:15 am »
+4

Yes, that's the way to use them once you are greening (and with the initial Estates/Shelters as well).

I just realized that would mean that Bounty Hunter would work really well with Shelters - you'd be able to get the bounty for each shelter, while in an Estates game, you'd only get the bounty for the first Estate you Exile.  Castles would work well too for the same reason
Logged
They/them

faust

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2901
  • Shuffle iT Username: faust
  • Respect: +4058
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2020, 04:55:13 am »
+3

Seems like Changeling could be a very useful card with Exiling.

Bounty Hunter seems a bit overpowered to me honestly. Compared to Moneylender, it's nonterminal, can get rid of Estates (while keeping the VP) and while you don't get the cash for subsequent Coppers, that is more than made up for by the fact that you can remove Provinces from your deck later on. And don't even get me started on Shelters/Heirlooms. The card would still be very strong without the +action, so I don't really get why that's there.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2020, 04:56:34 am by faust »
Logged
Since the number of points is within a constant factor of the number of city quarters, in the long run we can get (4 - ε) ↑↑ n points in n turns for any ε > 0.

faust

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2901
  • Shuffle iT Username: faust
  • Respect: +4058
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2020, 05:02:31 am »
+2

I assume Exiling a Curse due to Coven doesn't count as gaining, so you couldn't trigger the Curses going into your deck earlier if you wanted to?
Logged
Since the number of points is within a constant factor of the number of city quarters, in the long run we can get (4 - ε) ↑↑ n points in n turns for any ε > 0.

silverspawn

  • Governor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4942
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +2597
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2020, 05:06:30 am »
+1

I was just writing something about how you can now obtain cards without gaining them when you PPE'd this ^

It was previously possible with masquerade, but somehow masquerade never shows up when I play *shrugs*. I don't think there's another way.
Logged

Donald X.

  • Dominion Designer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5868
  • Respect: +23636
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2020, 05:16:13 am »
+3

I assume Exiling a Curse due to Coven doesn't count as gaining, so you couldn't trigger the Curses going into your deck earlier if you wanted to?
Exiling isn't gaining, and discarding from Exile isn't gaining (though it's discarding, triggering e.g. Tunnel).

You can get the Curses into your deck earlier by e.g. buying a Curse though.
Logged

faust

  • Margrave
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2901
  • Shuffle iT Username: faust
  • Respect: +4058
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2020, 06:05:15 am »
+6

I was just writing something about how you can now obtain cards without gaining them when you PPE'd this ^

It was previously possible with masquerade, but somehow masquerade never shows up when I play *shrugs*. I don't think there's another way.
Well, there was Inheritance - the card you set aside with it is yours.
Logged
Since the number of points is within a constant factor of the number of city quarters, in the long run we can get (4 - ε) ↑↑ n points in n turns for any ε > 0.

Hockey Mask

  • Moneylender
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 162
  • Respect: +178
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2020, 06:53:37 am »
0

Very clever mechanic. 
Logged
-The Compulsive Completist

pubby

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 508
  • Respect: +912
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2020, 07:36:52 am »
+26

Best preview yet!

BTW what do you call an island that is no longer an island?

An ex-isle.
Logged

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3841
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2418
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #16 on: March 04, 2020, 08:07:11 am »
0

Seems like Changeling could be a very useful card with Exiling.

Bounty Hunter seems a bit overpowered to me honestly. Compared to Moneylender, it's nonterminal, can get rid of Estates (while keeping the VP) and while you don't get the cash for subsequent Coppers, that is more than made up for by the fact that you can remove Provinces from your deck later on. And don't even get me started on Shelters/Heirlooms. The card would still be very strong without the +action, so I don't really get why that's there.

More than made up for? On what turn do you expect to gain province and collide it with Bount Hunter? Sure this means you can gain provinces earlier, but then the provinces are back into your deck as soon as you gain another one. Even if you keep gaining back the cards you exile with this to kick them off the mat, this still stacks poorly with itself, meaning you can't go nuts with these for a large part of the game. And the coppers and estates you set aside will come flooding back in case you ever have to gain estate or copper, even if your opponent is responsible for that. Spiking price points early is a key feature of the card, but not completely unseen for $4 or less with Skulk and now Stockpile.

It's a mighty fine card with the +1 action. It would be woefully underpowered without the +1 action. It's priced fine for what it does.
Logged

navical

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 193
  • Respect: +257
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #17 on: March 04, 2020, 08:09:53 am »
+7

The Exile mat says "may" - the Coppers, Estates and Provinces don't have to come back to your deck if you don't want them to (which usually you don't).
Logged

silverspawn

  • Governor
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4942
  • Shuffle iT Username: sty.silver
  • Respect: +2597
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #18 on: March 04, 2020, 08:14:00 am »
+2

That, and not only can you exile provinces, you actually get +3$ for the first province you exile. You can even buy an early duchy for the extra 3$ next turn, if you expect to draw your deck.

The card seems super strong, but "overpowered" doesn't really apply. Cards can be super strong and fun or super strong and not fun.
Logged

markusin

  • Cartographer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3841
  • Shuffle iT Username: markusin
  • I also switched from Starcraft
  • Respect: +2418
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2020, 08:27:14 am »
+3

Seems like Changeling could be a very useful card with Exiling.

Bounty Hunter seems a bit overpowered to me honestly. Compared to Moneylender, it's nonterminal, can get rid of Estates (while keeping the VP) and while you don't get the cash for subsequent Coppers, that is more than made up for by the fact that you can remove Provinces from your deck later on. And don't even get me started on Shelters/Heirlooms. The card would still be very strong without the +action, so I don't really get why that's there.

More than made up for? On what turn do you expect to gain province and collide it with Bount Hunter? Sure this means you can gain provinces earlier, but then the provinces are back into your deck as soon as you gain another one. Even if you keep gaining back the cards you exile with this to kick them off the mat, this still stacks poorly with itself, meaning you can't go nuts with these for a large part of the game. And the coppers and estates you set aside will come flooding back in case you ever have to gain estate or copper, even if your opponent is responsible for that. Spiking price points early is a key feature of the card, but not completely unseen for $4 or less with Skulk and now Stockpile.

It's a mighty fine card with the +1 action. It would be woefully underpowered without the +1 action. It's priced fine for what it does.

Dang, I missed the "may" on the exile mat. Okay now I am really feeling the Bounty Hunter hype.

The Exile mat says "may" - the Coppers, Estates and Provinces don't have to come back to your deck if you don't want them to (which usually you don't).
« Last Edit: March 04, 2020, 08:28:58 am by markusin »
Logged

Jack Rudd

  • Saboteur
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1230
  • Shuffle iT Username: Jack Rudd
  • Respect: +1212
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2020, 08:31:50 am »
+12

Ooh, I just thought of a nice one: Bounty Hunter/Inheritance. Exile your Estates until you've bought Inheritance, then bring them all back.
Logged
Centuries later, archaeologists discover the remains of your ancient civilization.

Evidence of thriving towns, Pottery, roads, and a centralized government amaze the startled scientists.

Finally, they come upon a stone tablet, which contains but one mysterious phrase!

'ISOTROPIC WILL RETURN!'

benedettosoxfan

  • Baron
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 56
  • Shuffle iT Username: benedettosoxfan
  • Respect: +129
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2020, 09:41:46 am »
+1

My immediate impression is that I'll be opening Bounty Hunter 99 times out of 100. When Renaissance came out I thought Priest was the ideal $4 cost opener, but Bounty Hunter seems even better than priest at least for the 1st and 2nd shuffles. I also really like the mini game that Coven seems to present. You can ignore it, but you're basically betting that your opponent can't play it 10 times before the game ends. I think this is one of the cooler mechanics to come out in recent Dominion expansions and I'm excited to see how else the Exile mat is used!
Logged

Willvon

  • Conspirator
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 203
  • Respect: +157
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2020, 09:54:48 am »
+2

I like that this expansion is adding new things, but still keeping it relatively straightforward, like Renaissance did.  You can jump on your horse and take a quick ride, and then just put it back in the stable.  Or you can exile those delinquents to the “ex-isle” (love that one, pubby), and after they have been sufficiently humbled and disciplined, you can invite them back to your dominion to add some winning value.

I am looking forward to using Bounty Hunter on a kingdom with Fairgrounds and lots of stuff, like Ruins, that are great for variety, but a pain to have in your deck during play.

Thanks again, Donald. This has been a great week so far.
Logged

FlyerBeast

  • Ambassador
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 33
  • Shuffle iT Username: FlyerBeast
  • Wide and Torturous
  • Respect: +48
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2020, 09:55:27 am »
+1

Bounty Hunter looks like the closest to Menagerie (the card) card we've seen so far from Menagerie, what with the caring about cards that aren't copies! Is the choice of the word 'bounty' a reference to Cornucopia or is that just a perfect coincidence?

Is there any significance in it saying 'if you don't have a copy' instead of 'if you have no cards with the same name as it', as I'd imagine it probably would have said if the card had been in Cornucopia?
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9006
  • Respect: +9815
    • View Profile
Re: Menagerie Previews 3: Exile
« Reply #24 on: March 04, 2020, 10:06:02 am »
+3

Exile from the supply... yet another new way to get a card without gaining it!
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0
Pages: [1] 2 3 4  All
 

Page created in 0.105 seconds with 21 queries.