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Author Topic: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)  (Read 3895 times)

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segura

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #75 on: August 05, 2019, 09:58:17 am »
0

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

Furthermore, in multiplayer games piles get drained more quickly and then we run into the issue that we know from BoM: the village pile is empty and Captain fails to be able to fulfill that critical function of a flexible engine piece (yeah, you can still use it as something like Lost City spread over two turns even if you merely player Pearl Diver twice).

I also doubt that the card will be as centralizing as Goon or Lost Arts.
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Donald X.

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #76 on: August 05, 2019, 11:52:13 am »
+5

I was trying not to say that in a thread DXV is frequenting but man you brought me there.
It's okay, I can take it.
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spineflu

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #77 on: August 06, 2019, 11:07:37 am »
0

any rough idea when these'll be available via bgg?
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Donald X.

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #78 on: August 06, 2019, 12:01:06 pm »
+2

any rough idea when these'll be available via bgg?
I think that's entirely up to BGG, who you could ask.
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Chappy7

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #79 on: August 06, 2019, 12:58:39 pm »
+2

I don't think that Captain is a $7.
Agreed
If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

Weaker than KC =/= shouldn't be a $7.  KC is OP AF.  I still agreed that it's fine at $6, that's just not a good argument
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spineflu

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #80 on: August 06, 2019, 01:56:19 pm »
0

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

I mean. Sure. But you can't make Captain hit Peddler the second time, and the first is capital-T tricky because you'd need to hit it with a bunch of cost reduction first. Also can you talk through those numbers? I'm not seeing how you're getting them.
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segura

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #81 on: August 06, 2019, 02:29:28 pm »
+1

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

I mean. Sure. But you can't make Captain hit Peddler the second time, and the first is capital-T tricky because you'd need to hit it with a bunch of cost reduction first. Also can you talk through those numbers? I'm not seeing how you're getting them.
Yeah, I meant Poacher, the modern Peddler.

Captainer-Poacher is +1 Coin this turn and next turn it is what Poacher says: +1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Coin
The gross effect of KC-Poacher is triple everything. But you played two cards so you net draw only 1, you had to play an Action to play KC so you only net 2 Actions and you get all the 3 Coins.

Viewing at the net effects of the vanilla stuff never gets the entire picture as it ignores all the important subtleties. But it is a good way to start (in case it is still not clear, when you play a card you gotta do -1 Card and -1 Action to get to the net effects; a cantrip is thus neutral).
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faust

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #82 on: August 06, 2019, 03:11:16 pm »
+6

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

I mean. Sure. But you can't make Captain hit Peddler the second time, and the first is capital-T tricky because you'd need to hit it with a bunch of cost reduction first. Also can you talk through those numbers? I'm not seeing how you're getting them.
Yeah, I meant Poacher, the modern Peddler.

Captainer-Poacher is +1 Coin this turn and next turn it is what Poacher says: +1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Coin
The gross effect of KC-Poacher is triple everything. But you played two cards so you net draw only 1, you had to play an Action to play KC so you only net 2 Actions and you get all the 3 Coins.

Viewing at the net effects of the vanilla stuff never gets the entire picture as it ignores all the important subtleties. But it is a good way to start (in case it is still not clear, when you play a card you gotta do -1 Card and -1 Action to get to the net effects; a cantrip is thus neutral).
This is not sound logic. In order to play KC-Poacher, you need to already have a Poacher, and connect the two. The cost of that is $11 and 2 buys and the cost of connecting.
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popsofctown

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #83 on: August 06, 2019, 03:34:39 pm »
+2

It's not always good to talk "balance" per se with Dominion cards due to the unique qualities of the game.  One reason I would have liked it more at seven is it would force you to pick up some essential kingdom must haves earlier instead of relying on a shapeshifter that provides the same service but does something different in a pinch.  Like you can probably skip lots of 3-4$ trashers and expect to hit six early, then feel terrible the times you don't, but I think it'd be correct.  And once the trashing is done with, this card switches to doing other things.  Can you imagine even looking at a Spice Merchant on a Captain board?  Seems like paying 4$ for a curse when you could also not pay 4$ for a curse.
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Erick648

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #84 on: August 06, 2019, 06:46:42 pm »
+1

Having just played my first game with Church, it really seems like more of a Tactician-esque utility card than a trasher.  I mean, yes, it can trash, but as a single-card trasher that's twice as likely to miss the reshuffle, it's fairly slow at it.  For example, in my game, the only trashers were Church and Amulet.  I bought one of each early on, and I'm definitely glad I had Amulet and not just Church (even with the two of them, it took me a while to trash all of my starting cards).

On the other hand, Church is great for spiking higher price points.  In the game I played, I got an early Gold followed by an early Platinum just by saving most or all of my money for next turn (and then quickly got a couple more Platinums).  It can also be used for smoothing, for improving your Engine's reliability by saving spare components, or for making green cards miss the reshuffle.  Definitely a fun card---just don't use it as a reason to skip another trasher.
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segura

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #85 on: August 07, 2019, 10:46:39 am »
0

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

I mean. Sure. But you can't make Captain hit Peddler the second time, and the first is capital-T tricky because you'd need to hit it with a bunch of cost reduction first. Also can you talk through those numbers? I'm not seeing how you're getting them.
Yeah, I meant Poacher, the modern Peddler.

Captainer-Poacher is +1 Coin this turn and next turn it is what Poacher says: +1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Coin
The gross effect of KC-Poacher is triple everything. But you played two cards so you net draw only 1, you had to play an Action to play KC so you only net 2 Actions and you get all the 3 Coins.

Viewing at the net effects of the vanilla stuff never gets the entire picture as it ignores all the important subtleties. But it is a good way to start (in case it is still not clear, when you play a card you gotta do -1 Card and -1 Action to get to the net effects; a cantrip is thus neutral).
This is not sound logic. In order to play KC-Poacher, you need to already have a Poacher, and connect the two. The cost of that is $11 and 2 buys and the cost of connecting.
I don't think you would skip Poacher in either situation, with Captain or KC in the Kingdom. So it is a sunk cost, a decision you made early in the game to improve your economy no matter what.
Anyway, I am totally aware that this vanilla thing is imprecise but it nonetheless illustrates that Captain is likely weaker than KC (impossible to compare Captain with Forge or Expand) and thus priced correctly.
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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #86 on: August 07, 2019, 10:59:18 am »
+2

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

I mean. Sure. But you can't make Captain hit Peddler the second time, and the first is capital-T tricky because you'd need to hit it with a bunch of cost reduction first. Also can you talk through those numbers? I'm not seeing how you're getting them.
Yeah, I meant Poacher, the modern Peddler.

Captainer-Poacher is +1 Coin this turn and next turn it is what Poacher says: +1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Coin
The gross effect of KC-Poacher is triple everything. But you played two cards so you net draw only 1, you had to play an Action to play KC so you only net 2 Actions and you get all the 3 Coins.

Viewing at the net effects of the vanilla stuff never gets the entire picture as it ignores all the important subtleties. But it is a good way to start (in case it is still not clear, when you play a card you gotta do -1 Card and -1 Action to get to the net effects; a cantrip is thus neutral).
This is not sound logic. In order to play KC-Poacher, you need to already have a Poacher, and connect the two. The cost of that is $11 and 2 buys and the cost of connecting.
I don't think you would skip Poacher in either situation, with Captain or KC in the Kingdom. So it is a sunk cost, a decision you made early in the game to improve your economy no matter what.
Anyway, I am totally aware that this vanilla thing is imprecise but it nonetheless illustrates that Captain is likely weaker than KC (impossible to compare Captain with Forge or Expand) and thus priced correctly.
Being weaker than KC doesn't mean that it needs to cost less than it...
Also, you keep ignoring captain's biggest strength over kc, that it doesn't need to collide with anything.
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GendoIkari

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #87 on: August 07, 2019, 01:44:15 pm »
0

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

I mean. Sure. But you can't make Captain hit Peddler the second time, and the first is capital-T tricky because you'd need to hit it with a bunch of cost reduction first. Also can you talk through those numbers? I'm not seeing how you're getting them.
Yeah, I meant Poacher, the modern Peddler.

Captainer-Poacher is +1 Coin this turn and next turn it is what Poacher says: +1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Coin
The gross effect of KC-Poacher is triple everything. But you played two cards so you net draw only 1, you had to play an Action to play KC so you only net 2 Actions and you get all the 3 Coins.

Viewing at the net effects of the vanilla stuff never gets the entire picture as it ignores all the important subtleties. But it is a good way to start (in case it is still not clear, when you play a card you gotta do -1 Card and -1 Action to get to the net effects; a cantrip is thus neutral).
This is not sound logic. In order to play KC-Poacher, you need to already have a Poacher, and connect the two. The cost of that is $11 and 2 buys and the cost of connecting.
I don't think you would skip Poacher in either situation, with Captain or KC in the Kingdom. So it is a sunk cost, a decision you made early in the game to improve your economy no matter what.
Anyway, I am totally aware that this vanilla thing is imprecise but it nonetheless illustrates that Captain is likely weaker than KC (impossible to compare Captain with Forge or Expand) and thus priced correctly.
Being weaker than KC doesn't mean that it needs to cost less than it...
Also, you keep ignoring captain's biggest strength over kc, that it doesn't need to collide with anything.

Right, as a basic illustration, this sentence: "Captainer-Poacher is +1 Coin this turn".. actually no. Captain+Poacher, as compared to King's Court+Poacher, is + this turn; because if we're comparing it to King's Court, we're talking about having both Captain and Poacher in hand. Captain gives + if used to play a Poacher from the supply, and the Poacher in your hand gives another +.
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markusin

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #88 on: August 08, 2019, 04:53:10 pm »
+6

I don't think that Captain is a $7. A simple heuristic is vanilla stuff (sure, there is other stuff like Captain being bad because it is a Duration and misses shuffles and being good because doing stuff at the start of your turn increases concistency). If you play around with it you can easily see that it is weaker than KC. For example Captain-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +1 Action, +2 Coins whereas KC-Peddler has net effects of +1 Card, +2 Actions, +3 Coins.

I mean. Sure. But you can't make Captain hit Peddler the second time, and the first is capital-T tricky because you'd need to hit it with a bunch of cost reduction first. Also can you talk through those numbers? I'm not seeing how you're getting them.
Yeah, I meant Poacher, the modern Peddler.

Captainer-Poacher is +1 Coin this turn and next turn it is what Poacher says: +1 Card, +1 Action, +1 Coin
The gross effect of KC-Poacher is triple everything. But you played two cards so you net draw only 1, you had to play an Action to play KC so you only net 2 Actions and you get all the 3 Coins.

Viewing at the net effects of the vanilla stuff never gets the entire picture as it ignores all the important subtleties. But it is a good way to start (in case it is still not clear, when you play a card you gotta do -1 Card and -1 Action to get to the net effects; a cantrip is thus neutral).
This is not sound logic. In order to play KC-Poacher, you need to already have a Poacher, and connect the two. The cost of that is $11 and 2 buys and the cost of connecting.
I don't think you would skip Poacher in either situation, with Captain or KC in the Kingdom. So it is a sunk cost, a decision you made early in the game to improve your economy no matter what.
Anyway, I am totally aware that this vanilla thing is imprecise but it nonetheless illustrates that Captain is likely weaker than KC (impossible to compare Captain with Forge or Expand) and thus priced correctly.
Being weaker than KC doesn't mean that it needs to cost less than it...
Also, you keep ignoring captain's biggest strength over kc, that it doesn't need to collide with anything.

And we can't ignore KC's biggest strength: it's bonkers when it collides with itself and pretty much anything. The value of additional Captains to your deck is additive.

It's at least "good" in most circumstances, but it's still a duration and hence the effect of spiking it early can be mitigated by it missing the shuffle more often than non-durations.
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jomini

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #89 on: August 10, 2019, 10:13:12 am »
0

I think a better comparison for Captain is Prince. We side step the whole issue about how much is it worth to interact with $5s and up (which is obviously the biggest value with Kc compared to Cap), they both give you benefit of playing the card at the turn start (e.g. can draw before Silos), and they both allow you to gain "unique" abilities on boards (e.g. generating >5 card hands with no net draw).

Prince requires you to buy and collide the $4. Prince is turn delayed from when you play it; and worse is a always a dead terminal when you play it. Prince cannot use durations as durations (e.g. Prince of Churches or Gears can work, but has to give up a lot of their utility). Prince is locked into what you put on the mat (e.g. once a village, always a village). Prince costs $8.

What can, and usually does, make Prince better? Prince never gets destroyed by piles emptying. Prince gets the amped version of the card twice as often. Prince never bottom decks once in play. Prince can play multiple terminal on its own.

Cap can introduce a huge weakness into your deck. If using him with cantrips is your only +action, the other guy may be able to tank your deck just by piling the cantrips, which are often cards you want to build up to $6. It is worse if you are using him for your draw. A functional engine vs a tanked one is something like 8V per turn; avoiding that will often be worth double.

Okay, but say you have a board where there are plenty of good Cap/Prince targets, how much is Prince better here? Well for $12 with Cap I get one "normal" version of the card and one free +1 action/+1 card effect. With a $12 Prince setup I get one $4 and one free +1 a/+ 1 card effect. Double Cap is then basically gaining the advantage of having one more $4 in deck. Of course this also means you need to draw your "$4". Of course getting two Caps will often completely offset Princes of penalty of coming online a turn later. Advantage to Cap, but not by all that much. Going to $7, though would likely make me prefer Prince on most boards; after all on most engine boards the majority of my non-VP gains are going to come on >=$8 coin hands or <$6 hands; not to mention that it is vastly easier to sneak in some sort of "gain a $4" than "gain a $6". $14 vs $12 (or $11) is starting to delay my engine by a turn and that is costly.

Bottom decking is utterly huge. Prince of Smithies is an 8 card hand for the rest of the game. Cap of Smithies needs 12.5% of your deck to be Caps. For larger decks, that starts becoming hard to ensure (e.g. needing 3 for 20 cards) and if you clump at deck bottom you may have a lot of really subpar hands in this shuffle and the next. Like Wharf or Fishing village, Cap is going to be more reliable when your deck starts to green than regular villages and draw but when it tanks it tanks hard. At high skill play, you should expect at least a few turns with busted shuffles so paying more for Cap than Prince becomes challenging.

Cap, at best, can manage two terminals without support. This is not enough for a Hop deck. It also means you have trouble managing combos. For instance Bish/Terminal gainer can allow you load up on Silvers and then build out to a very high VP/turn Golden deck (in theory 15 VP/turn but easily 7 VP/turn). On such a pure terminal board these are incredibly strong (e.g. Militia/Masq).

Cap at $6 makes double Cap pretty close to Prince of whatever at "$12". Yeah I will buy Cap often instead of Prince on a lot of boards. More often I will buy Cap and then drop a Prince of whatever might run out and cruise. But fundamentally they are around the same functionality and around the same price.

After all, what are the major effect of increasing price from $6 to $7? Yeah it can make early gain more swingy. But more often it delays the gain a shuffle. It also makes it far harder to build out in the standard $16 engine. Getting to $9 - where you can now buy a Cap and a silver, means drawing the Silvers and a buy. Getting to $10 is likely a full gain later (call it half a turn). Getting to $12 is two golds and three silvers. Getting to $14 means gaining another gold and at least half a turn later. In the late game going to $7 means that you will much more rarely have to choose between a duchy and another Cap. Going to $6 means there are a lot more turns where you are nearing the end of the shuffle and being able to increase your odds of a big turn are worth more than locking in 3 VP this turn.

I would need a very good argument to say that Cap should be $7 when Prince/$4 parallels so nicely with double Cap. I cannot say that double Cap or Prince is generally better, but I would be surprised if I didn't buy a lot fewer Caps/more Princes if Cap went to $7.
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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #90 on: August 11, 2019, 06:38:41 pm »
+1

Having played a few games with Church, it feels pretty powerful - more for the potential to line up strong combos than the trashing - e.g. I had an encampment game where I used it to put a gold/plunder in hand every turn, which pretty much ensured I could draw my deck without any risk of losing my encampments.
With something like a village/smithy engine, if you have drawn your deck (or drawn enough to hit the target spend) with a spare pair in hand, you can guarantee a good turn next turn - and you can hide at least one green out of the shuffle at the same time, which is pretty strong.

It also combos really well with Menagerie - being able to thin out duplicates mid turn without spending an action means that with a few Churches in a deck you can keep the Menageries firing even on large hand sizes.

The extra deck thinning felt more a bonus than anything else (making the trashing mandatory might have been interesting!).

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #91 on: August 12, 2019, 09:52:38 am »
0

Of course Haven and Gear do the same thing, being better/worse in different ways. I guess these can be called Haven variants.

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #92 on: August 12, 2019, 10:21:33 am »
0

Quote
I would need a very good argument to say that Cap should be $7 when Prince/$4 parallels so nicely with double Cap. I cannot say that double Cap or Prince is generally better, but I would be surprised if I didn't buy a lot fewer Caps/more Princes if Cap went to $7.

There's a Cap discussion in an ongoing thread started by Seprix. For those who like abbreviations, I would suggest Cpt.

The strength of Captain very much depends on the kingdom. Recently I had a board with Workers' Village, Throne Room, Conclave, and Spice Merchant. Captain was really versatile here. Prince needs only one card to shine, but is much less adaptive to the current board.
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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #93 on: August 15, 2019, 05:29:56 pm »
+4

I've been checking occasionally to see if Captain and Church are available on the BGG store, and I just noticed they are both currently available for purchase. You can see all the available promos here: https://boardgamegeekstore.com/collections/dominion-promos
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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #94 on: August 16, 2019, 02:46:42 am »
+3

I played a few games against Lord B with Captain, BoM, Ferry and then either Highway or Bridge.

I think the way to do it is play ferry on Captain as soon as possible, get the Captain and the Highway/Bridge and then try and connect them (using whatever else is there)

Bridge was MUCH better than Highway - for two reasons. (1) You can't use Captain to play Highway until you have played a Highway first - which means you can't play $5 cards at the start of your turn, and (2) When Captain plays Highway it doesn't activate the cost reduction.

The impact of that is I was generally connecting Highway-Captain around turn 8 or 9. Whereas Captain-Bridge was connecting on turns 4-5.

In all cases after the connection is made the game ended (massively) the next turn. There always seemed to be some set of <$5 cards that when you played an unlimited number of them I was able to empty the provinces (and usually all the duchies and the estates and once all the silvers when that got me VP).

(I did not test Bridge Troll, but Canal came up randomly one time, and I managed to use it.)

I guess none of this is too surprising, but it was interesting (if a little tedious) to see it play out in practice. One "technique" I discovered that was helpful - especially for the Highway version - was switching the Ferry to a different card after you connect the Highway-Captain. It lets you start the next turn playing an unlimited number of the $5-$6 card you choose.

Obviously the chances of this combo ever coming up in a real game is close to zero (I'm sure someone ran the odds), but if it ever does,  boy am I ready!

Ed
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Jeebus

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #95 on: August 16, 2019, 09:56:43 am »
0

The impact of that is I was generally connecting Highway-Captain around turn 8 or 9. Whereas Captain-Bridge was connecting on turns 4-5.

I might be missing something here, but don't you need a village to play Captain and Bridge in the same turn? The idea is to play BoM with the Captain, right? How can this happen on turn 4? Even without the Village, how can you draw both Bridge and Captain on turn 4? Assuming you spent the three first turns buying Ferry, Captain and Bridge, either the Bridge or the Captain is not shuffled in yet, right?

GendoIkari

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #96 on: August 16, 2019, 10:00:02 am »
0

The impact of that is I was generally connecting Highway-Captain around turn 8 or 9. Whereas Captain-Bridge was connecting on turns 4-5.

I might be missing something here, but don't you need a village to play Captain and Bridge in the same turn? The idea is to play BoM with the Captain, right? How can this happen on turn 4? Even without the Village, how can you draw both Bridge and Captain on turn 4? Assuming you spent the three first turns buying Ferry, Captain and Bridge, either the Bridge or the Captain is not shuffled in yet, right?

I don't see why you would actually buy Bridge... you play Captain to play Bridge. At the start of next turn, Bridge is played again, for free, so on that turn you can just play Captain to play BoM, back and forth. You do need 2 Captains though.
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Jeebus

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #97 on: August 16, 2019, 11:13:26 am »
0

The impact of that is I was generally connecting Highway-Captain around turn 8 or 9. Whereas Captain-Bridge was connecting on turns 4-5.

I might be missing something here, but don't you need a village to play Captain and Bridge in the same turn? The idea is to play BoM with the Captain, right? How can this happen on turn 4? Even without the Village, how can you draw both Bridge and Captain on turn 4? Assuming you spent the three first turns buying Ferry, Captain and Bridge, either the Bridge or the Captain is not shuffled in yet, right?

I don't see why you would actually buy Bridge... you play Captain to play Bridge. At the start of next turn, Bridge is played again, for free, so on that turn you can just play Captain to play BoM, back and forth. You do need 2 Captains though.

Right. I was thinking that "connecting" means connecting Captain and Bridge. So, with Ferry + Captain, you can play Captain on turn 3 and buy another Captain. You need to play the Captain as something that gets you through your deck (Smithy, Warehouse) I guess, in order to play the second Captain on turn 4. You then start turn 4 playing Bridge.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 10:39:52 am by Jeebus »
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hsiale

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #98 on: August 19, 2019, 12:35:06 pm »
+3

After Church and Captain release we have exactly 10 promos. What do you think about the kingdom made out of them?

( 3 ) Black Market, Church
( 4 ) Dismantle, Envoy, Walled Village
( 4|5 ) Sauna/Avanto
( 5 ) Stash, Governor
( 6 ) Captain
( 8 ) Prince
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Jeebus

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Re: New Promos: Church, Captain (Gen Con 2019)
« Reply #99 on: August 19, 2019, 01:15:17 pm »
+1

After Church and Captain release we have exactly 10 promos. What do you think about the kingdom made out of them?

( 3 ) Black Market, Church
( 4 ) Dismantle, Envoy, Walled Village
( 4|5 ) Sauna/Avanto
( 5 ) Stash, Governor
( 6 ) Captain
( 8 ) Prince

You open Black Market (for the attack) and Church. You try to get Captain as soon as possible. Every card could possibly have a place (some of them maybe only through Captain), except I don't know if there will be time for Prince. And of course you skip Stash. Governor might dominate.
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