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Author Topic: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Town and Survivor win!)  (Read 154809 times)

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MiX

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #200 on: June 04, 2019, 04:25:35 pm »

I'm realizing that DatSwan is getting a meta for imprecision. Anyone else I would have voted for misreading ash (plans vs. planning) and mischaracterizing a post. I don't think that's a great meta for us to accept complacently, so vote: DatSwan anyway.

PPE: Glooble

We did that last time, and that's how we lynched scum. I seriously doubt he would do this on purpose this game.
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Glooble

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #201 on: June 04, 2019, 04:40:04 pm »

I'm realizing that DatSwan is getting a meta for imprecision. Anyone else I would have voted for misreading ash (plans vs. planning) and mischaracterizing a post. I don't think that's a great meta for us to accept complacently, so vote: DatSwan anyway.

PPE: Glooble

We did that last time, and that's how we lynched scum. I seriously doubt he would do this on purpose this game.

He's not doing the same thing though. In that game DatSwan spent a lot of day 1 just straight up pretending to have misread crucial portions of the setup (I assume to make people think he couldn't possibly be scum, since scum think harder about that stuff and have a QT to discuss it before the game starts.)  That's very different than presenting a misleading case on another player.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

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MiX

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #202 on: June 04, 2019, 04:41:46 pm »

I'm realizing that DatSwan is getting a meta for imprecision. Anyone else I would have voted for misreading ash (plans vs. planning) and mischaracterizing a post. I don't think that's a great meta for us to accept complacently, so vote: DatSwan anyway.

PPE: Glooble

We did that last time, and that's how we lynched scum. I seriously doubt he would do this on purpose this game.

He's not doing the same thing though. In that game DatSwan spent a lot of day 1 just straight up pretending to have misread crucial portions of the setup (I assume to make people think he couldn't possibly be scum, since scum think harder about that stuff and have a QT to discuss it before the game starts.)  That's very different than presenting a misleading case on another player.

And when has Swan presented a case on ash? He merely pointed out an inconsistency, which was something I was also thinking about knowing how ash talked about plans in the recent past.
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Glooble

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #203 on: June 04, 2019, 04:50:42 pm »

I'm realizing that DatSwan is getting a meta for imprecision. Anyone else I would have voted for misreading ash (plans vs. planning) and mischaracterizing a post. I don't think that's a great meta for us to accept complacently, so vote: DatSwan anyway.

PPE: Glooble

We did that last time, and that's how we lynched scum. I seriously doubt he would do this on purpose this game.

He's not doing the same thing though. In that game DatSwan spent a lot of day 1 just straight up pretending to have misread crucial portions of the setup (I assume to make people think he couldn't possibly be scum, since scum think harder about that stuff and have a QT to discuss it before the game starts.)  That's very different than presenting a misleading case on another player.

And when has Swan presented a case on ash? He merely pointed out an inconsistency, which was something I was also thinking about knowing how ash talked about plans in the recent past.

I suppose you're right that DatSwan didn't exactly make a case on Ash. Or rather, the case was implied by his question, but not stated outright.  Either way, the point is he mischaracterized ash's statement. And that's scummy.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

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MiX

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #204 on: June 04, 2019, 04:54:41 pm »

I'm realizing that DatSwan is getting a meta for imprecision. Anyone else I would have voted for misreading ash (plans vs. planning) and mischaracterizing a post. I don't think that's a great meta for us to accept complacently, so vote: DatSwan anyway.

PPE: Glooble

We did that last time, and that's how we lynched scum. I seriously doubt he would do this on purpose this game.

He's not doing the same thing though. In that game DatSwan spent a lot of day 1 just straight up pretending to have misread crucial portions of the setup (I assume to make people think he couldn't possibly be scum, since scum think harder about that stuff and have a QT to discuss it before the game starts.)  That's very different than presenting a misleading case on another player.

And when has Swan presented a case on ash? He merely pointed out an inconsistency, which was something I was also thinking about knowing how ash talked about plans in the recent past.

I suppose you're right that DatSwan didn't exactly make a case on Ash. Or rather, the case was implied by his question, but not stated outright.  Either way, the point is he mischaracterized ash's statement. And that's scummy.


In what do you base your suspicion that scum is more likely to misinterpret and mischaracterize ash's statement?
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Glooble

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #205 on: June 04, 2019, 05:04:40 pm »


In what do you base your suspicion that scum is more likely to misinterpret and mischaracterize ash's statement?

Not sure I understand your question. Misinterpret and Mischaracterize are very different things.

Scum is more likely to mischaracterize ash's statement because that helps them win. Intentionally mischaracterizing another player's statement as town is very bad play.

Scum isn't any more likely to misinterpret ash's statement, but I don't think that's what happened here.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

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Check out my podcast: www.stppodcast.com

MiX

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #206 on: June 04, 2019, 05:13:09 pm »


In what do you base your suspicion that scum is more likely to misinterpret and mischaracterize ash's statement?

Not sure I understand your question. Misinterpret and Mischaracterize are very different things.

Scum is more likely to mischaracterize ash's statement because that helps them win. Intentionally mischaracterizing another player's statement as town is very bad play.

Scum isn't any more likely to misinterpret ash's statement, but I don't think that's what happened here.


Intentionally misinterpretting exists, but I suppose that's just mischaracterizing?

How does mischaracterizing ash's statement help scum win?
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Debatepro

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #207 on: June 04, 2019, 05:14:24 pm »


In what do you base your suspicion that scum is more likely to misinterpret and mischaracterize ash's statement?

Not sure I understand your question. Misinterpret and Mischaracterize are very different things.

Scum is more likely to mischaracterize ash's statement because that helps them win. Intentionally mischaracterizing another player's statement as town is very bad play.

Scum isn't any more likely to misinterpret ash's statement, but I don't think that's what happened here.

Is the end result of the dialog around mischaractorizion plan vs. planning that DS gets scum points. Am I interpreting the intent correctly?
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Glooble

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #208 on: June 04, 2019, 05:22:02 pm »


How does mischaracterizing ash's statement help scum win?

This is kinda mafia 101 isn’t it? Scum wants town players to be more suspicious of other town players. Scum also wants to look like they’re scum hunting. In the scenario where DatSwan is scum and ash is town, DatSwan’s statement accomplishes both those things.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

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silverspawn

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #209 on: June 04, 2019, 05:22:18 pm »

Scum isn't any more likely to misinterpret ash's statement, but I don't think that's what happened here.

This is another piece of very well established common wisdom that I suspect might be completely untrue. I very rarely intentionally mischaracterize people as scum.

silverspawn

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #210 on: June 04, 2019, 05:24:06 pm »

I notice that most of my posts are very non-commital general comments. That's because I don't have any strong feelings towards anyone yet that i could share. I also notice that I'm very self aware. Don't vote for me because of that, it's not a scum tell.

MiX

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #211 on: June 04, 2019, 05:24:44 pm »


How does mischaracterizing ash's statement help scum win?

This is kinda mafia 101 isn’t it? Scum wants town players to be more suspicious of other town players. Scum also wants to look like they’re scum hunting. In the scenario where DatSwan is scum and ash is town, DatSwan’s statement accomplishes both those things.

You're still acting like Swan thinks this is at all alignment indicative, which might be false. I also fail to see in what world Swan would think that tidbit would make people scumread ash.

Scum isn't any more likely to misinterpret ash's statement, but I don't think that's what happened here.

This is another piece of very well established common wisdom that I suspect might be completely untrue. I very rarely intentionally mischaracterize people as scum.

That's another very true statement, said by scum themselves!

I notice that most of my posts are very non-commital general comments. That's because I don't have any strong feelings towards anyone yet that i could share. I also notice that I'm very self aware. Don't vote for me because of that, it's not a scum tell.

This defensiveness is, however.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #212 on: June 04, 2019, 05:31:45 pm »

Vote: MiX
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MiX

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #213 on: June 04, 2019, 05:32:32 pm »

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Glooble

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #214 on: June 04, 2019, 05:35:33 pm »

I also fail to see in what world Swan would think that tidbit would make people scumread ash.

Really? Ash basically said (sorry can’t quote I’m on mobile) “I’m more likely to make a plan as scum” and several months ago said “my plans aren’t alignment indicative”. The implicit argument in Swan’s Question is “he contradicted himself so one of the statements must be a lie”. And since the older statement was in a game where ash was town, the further implication is that it is the quote from this game that is, in fact, the lie.

That was my interpretation anyway. But maybe I’m reading too much into Swan’s post.

Anyway, this has been a fun Socratic discussion but my phone is about to die so I will be back in a few hours probably.
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I think town!Glooble pointing to something as a scum tell and then shortly thereafter doing that thing is a lot more likely than scum!Glooble doing that.

He/ Him

Check out my podcast: www.stppodcast.com

silverspawn

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #215 on: June 04, 2019, 05:52:24 pm »

This defensiveness is, however.

No.

MiX

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #216 on: June 04, 2019, 05:52:52 pm »

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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #217 on: June 04, 2019, 05:57:44 pm »

Vote Count 1.3

MiX (4): pingpongsam, Debatepro, jotheonah, Uncleeurope
ashersky (1): gkrieg13
pingpongsam (3): silverspawn, pubby, A Drowned Kernel
DatSwan (3): 2.71828....., Glooble, EFHW


Not Voting (4): DatSwan, ashersky, mcmcsalot, MiX

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends on June 10, 2019, 10:00:00 am.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2019, 03:41:47 pm by faust »
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gkrieg13

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #218 on: June 04, 2019, 06:03:24 pm »

Of those, I don't really like the PPS wagon, I like the Datswan wagon, and don't think the MiX wagon is for very good reasons, although I think the people on the MiX wagon are probably town.

vote: Datswan
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gkrieg13

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #219 on: June 04, 2019, 06:05:12 pm »


In what do you base your suspicion that scum is more likely to misinterpret and mischaracterize ash's statement?

Not sure I understand your question. Misinterpret and Mischaracterize are very different things.

Scum is more likely to mischaracterize ash's statement because that helps them win. Intentionally mischaracterizing another player's statement as town is very bad play.

Scum isn't any more likely to misinterpret ash's statement, but I don't think that's what happened here.


Intentionally misinterpretting exists, but I suppose that's just mischaracterizing?

How does mischaracterizing ash's statement help scum win?

If ash is town, ash is easy to mislynch, so getting a wagon going on him is a pretty good idea.
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gkrieg13

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #220 on: June 04, 2019, 06:06:36 pm »

I notice that most of my posts are very non-commital general comments. That's because I don't have any strong feelings towards anyone yet that i could share. I also notice that I'm very self aware. Don't vote for me because of that, it's not a scum tell.

Ugh I want to vote for you so badly, but every game I have done that you end up being town. Although people not voting for you yet D1 is a scum tell for you.
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Debatepro

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #221 on: June 04, 2019, 06:19:57 pm »

If ash is town, ash is easy to mislynch, so getting a wagon going on him is a pretty good idea.

For scum? Aren't you voting for him?
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silverspawn

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #222 on: June 04, 2019, 06:50:34 pm »

I notice that most of my posts are very non-commital general comments. That's because I don't have any strong feelings towards anyone yet that i could share. I also notice that I'm very self aware. Don't vote for me because of that, it's not a scum tell.

Ugh I want to vote for you so badly, but every game I have done that you end up being town. Although people not voting for you yet D1 is a scum tell for you.

That... is probably empirically true, unfortunately.

A Drowned Kernel

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #223 on: June 04, 2019, 07:09:43 pm »

I'm realizing that DatSwan is getting a meta for imprecision. Anyone else I would have voted for misreading ash (plans vs. planning) and mischaracterizing a post. I don't think that's a great meta for us to accept complacently, so vote: DatSwan anyway.

PPE: Glooble

We did that last time, and that's how we lynched scum. I seriously doubt he would do this on purpose this game.

He's not doing the same thing though. In that game DatSwan spent a lot of day 1 just straight up pretending to have misread crucial portions of the setup (I assume to make people think he couldn't possibly be scum, since scum think harder about that stuff and have a QT to discuss it before the game starts.)  That's very different than presenting a misleading case on another player.

I have to more to say later but for the record, that was scum!swan sincerely misunderstanding the setup
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pubby

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Re: M123: Doomsday Mafia (Day 1)
« Reply #224 on: June 04, 2019, 07:21:58 pm »

I cannot get into this game guys. Try as I might.

That's OK. It means I won't feel guilty about...

vote: jotheonah

Not expecting to change my vote from this.
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