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[Swowl]

Hey everyone! Good to have another game on here

Summary of thoughts:

1) Promoter Claim - Since we don't know if there is a Promoter, combined with the chance that there is a Mafia Promoter instead of a Town Promoter who could claim and then even "prove it" if we were to force the target options on them... I am not seeing a super upside for a Promoter Claim. Additionally, the Town Promoter is potentially a very strong role if I understand it correctly... but its value only grows as the game goes on. They get to enhance reads, isolate based on claims, etc... and all of that increases the chances of finding good targets. So yeah... I think I am against the Promoter Claim because I think Skum would probably want to get rid of them.

2) Joth is def the Jester.

[Joseph2302]

Vote: arishipshape
Because I will not allow for him to lay low again. Prove your townieness!

Bring it on, MiX! I entirely deserve this vote, after my performance last game. However, I got my wish this game. I'm the good guy.  For the record I totally did NOT lay low last game, at least day 1. Anyways, finger of suspicion on Joseph for claiming SK. Yes, yes, it was obviously sarcastic, blah blah blah. In my experience, at least with ten minute mafia, when you claim a scum role, it improves the chances that you are scum. Besides, townies shouldn't pull that crap. It's lost so many games in the past. Just don't lie as town. Period. There's already two bandwagons out, so I'm not gonna start a new one. Vote: MiX, because last time I did that, I won. And Faust rocks, so I'm gonna follow his lead. For now.

The first two posts I do every game is to claim SK and then vote for someone from Real Life Mafia 1

[MiX]

Question for ADK and the pro-claim crew:

If a promoter claims, is our next move to try to direct their power use? I sort of like that since then the fake-claiming scum promoter is locked into using their power in a town-powered way or else giving themselves away.

After mcmc's post I'm not 100% I'm on the pro-claim crew anymore.

That is another benefit to the promoter claiming, though.

Right now I'm simply thinking: if the worst part of a promoter claim is a conflict, why delay it? So, ADK, why are you against claiming?

Directing the promoter will happen naturally after they claim, it's essencially inevitable, there's almost no reason to have an opinion on it, and if there is why say it?

Hey everyone! Good to have another game on here

Summary of thoughts:

1) Promoter Claim - Since we don't know if there is a Promoter, combined with the chance that there is a Mafia Promoter instead of a Town Promoter who could claim and then even "prove it" if we were to force the target options on them... I am not seeing a super upside for a Promoter Claim. Additionally, the Town Promoter is potentially a very strong role if I understand it correctly... but its value only grows as the game goes on. They get to enhance reads, isolate based on claims, etc... and all of that increases the chances of finding good targets. So yeah... I think I am against the Promoter Claim because I think Skum would probably want to get rid of them.

Vote: DatSwan for not reading the setup: there's always a Promoter. Not reading the setup seems like something scum!Swan would loooove to do since he performed that in RMM52, where he was town.

[jotheonah]

Directing the promoter will happen naturally after they claim, it's essencially inevitable, there's almost no reason to have an opinion on it, and if there is why say it?

Sure, but there's directing in the sense of "everybody has an opinion" and directing in the sense of "we're all going to vote on who you should use your power on, and if you use it on anybody else we'll lynch you on day 3".

[jotheonah]

Has all of the pre-game discussion been lost to the thread move?

[Joseph2302]

As far as players go I wish I knew arishape better because I feel like if I did I would know their alignment already. They seem to be playing relatively straightforward and not a lot of pre-thought to their posts.

I have one game to my name.
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=19407.0
In this game, I was scum. Feel free to read it over. Anyways, you are absolutely correct in my straightforwardness. I try not to mask, deceive, or be unclear in any way, shape, or form, so as to leave no room for any misinterpretation, which is a scum's friend.

You were obviously scum that game too. No idea how you got away with it.....

[jotheonah]

Nevermind, I found it. I wanted to point to the fact that I tried to claim Jester before the game started as evidence that it was, in fact, a joke.

Well, we're close to starting. I'm going to go ahead and claim Jester.

But you know, now that I've introduced the WIFOM I definitely can't put it back in the bag, so we'll leave that as a problem for another day.

[Joseph2302]

In an actual game usefulness, I support claiming. Worst case is we get 2+ claims and get some scum/jesters, best case we get an IC

PPE: 5?

[Glooble]

I'm confused about why we think scum won't just kill the town promoter right away if they claim.

Or are we okay with that?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Hey everyone! Good to have another game on here

Summary of thoughts:

1) Promoter Claim - Since we don't know if there is a Promoter, combined with the chance that there is a Mafia Promoter instead of a Town Promoter who could claim and then even "prove it" if we were to force the target options on them... I am not seeing a super upside for a Promoter Claim. Additionally, the Town Promoter is potentially a very strong role if I understand it correctly... but its value only grows as the game goes on. They get to enhance reads, isolate based on claims, etc... and all of that increases the chances of finding good targets. So yeah... I think I am against the Promoter Claim because I think Skum would probably want to get rid of them.

2) Joth is def the Jester.

I don't think the town promoter is a strong role, since it narrows the lynch pool by a lot, which diminishes the information that we get on days where it's in effect. And yeah, go read the setup, there's always either a mafia promoter or a town promoter.

I'm confused about why we think scum won't just kill the town promoter right away if they claim.

Or are we okay with that?

Given that it's negative utility, it's not the worst thing in the world.

[MiX]

Directing the promoter will happen naturally after they claim, it's essencially inevitable, there's almost no reason to have an opinion on it, and if there is why say it?

Sure, but there's directing in the sense of "everybody has an opinion" and directing in the sense of "we're all going to vote on who you should use your power on, and if you use it on anybody else we'll lynch you on day 3".

Hmm. If the latter happens, I suggest we lynch them D2 instead. Otherwise I believe voting's better, but it will most likely drag the game down. So it'll depend on how early promoter claims, the earlier the better. So, scum, claim now for town points! They're free!

I'm confused about why we think scum won't just kill the town promoter right away if they claim.

Or are we okay with that?

I am perfectly fine with killing Promoter if it means PRs have extra protection. There's also Bodyguards ready to die which makes a pseudo-IC stronger.

Nevermind, I found it. I wanted to point to the fact that I tried to claim Jester before the game started as evidence that it was, in fact, a joke.

Well, we're close to starting. I'm going to go ahead and claim Jester.

But you know, now that I've introduced the WIFOM I definitely can't put it back in the bag, so we'll leave that as a problem for another day.

Actually bringing this up is clearly some sort of setup to evade being the D1 lynch. I support it.

PPE: 1

[Glooble]

Why are we all saying the Promoter is negative utility? If they guess right and target scum, they increase our chance of lynching scum to 50%. How is that bad?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Why are we all saying the Promoter is negative utility? If they guess right and target scum, they increase our chance of lynching scum to 50%. How is that bad?

I don't think anyone's chance of guessing right is that good. It's like a vigilante; awesome if they guess right, terrible if they guess wrong, and their odds aren't good.

[A Drowned Kernel]

So, ADK, why are you against claiming?

I think the points are stacking up in favor of claiming at this point.

[Glooble]

Why are we all saying the Promoter is negative utility? If they guess right and target scum, they increase our chance of lynching scum to 50%. How is that bad?

I don't think anyone's chance of guessing right is that good. It's like a vigilante; awesome if they guess right, terrible if they guess wrong, and their odds aren't good.

Would you consider a compulsive vig-granter to be negative utility?

[A Drowned Kernel]

Why are we all saying the Promoter is negative utility? If they guess right and target scum, they increase our chance of lynching scum to 50%. How is that bad?

I don't think anyone's chance of guessing right is that good. It's like a vigilante; awesome if they guess right, terrible if they guess wrong, and their odds aren't good.

Would you consider a compulsive vig-granter to be negative utility?

Yes.

[Joseph2302]

Question for ADK and the pro-claim crew:

If a promoter claims, is our next move to try to direct their power use? I sort of like that since then the fake-claiming scum promoter is locked into using their power in a town-powered way or else giving themselves away.

After mcmc's post I'm not 100% I'm on the pro-claim crew anymore.

That is another benefit to the promoter claiming, though.

Right now I'm simply thinking: if the worst part of a promoter claim is a conflict, why delay it? So, ADK, why are you against claiming?

Directing the promoter will happen naturally after they claim, it's essencially inevitable, there's almost no reason to have an opinion on it, and if there is why say it?

Hey everyone! Good to have another game on here

Summary of thoughts:

1) Promoter Claim - Since we don't know if there is a Promoter, combined with the chance that there is a Mafia Promoter instead of a Town Promoter who could claim and then even "prove it" if we were to force the target options on them... I am not seeing a super upside for a Promoter Claim. Additionally, the Town Promoter is potentially a very strong role if I understand it correctly... but its value only grows as the game goes on. They get to enhance reads, isolate based on claims, etc... and all of that increases the chances of finding good targets. So yeah... I think I am against the Promoter Claim because I think Skum would probably want to get rid of them.

Vote: DatSwan for not reading the setup: there's always a Promoter. Not reading the setup seems like something scum!Swan would loooove to do since he performed that in RMM52, where he was town.

How is there always a promoter? Am I reading the setup wrong? There's 4 quadrants and we get the 4 things in that quadrant, right?
And only 2 of these have a promoter. ......

[A Drowned Kernel]

Question for ADK and the pro-claim crew:

If a promoter claims, is our next move to try to direct their power use? I sort of like that since then the fake-claiming scum promoter is locked into using their power in a town-powered way or else giving themselves away.

After mcmc's post I'm not 100% I'm on the pro-claim crew anymore.

That is another benefit to the promoter claiming, though.

Right now I'm simply thinking: if the worst part of a promoter claim is a conflict, why delay it? So, ADK, why are you against claiming?

Directing the promoter will happen naturally after they claim, it's essencially inevitable, there's almost no reason to have an opinion on it, and if there is why say it?

Hey everyone! Good to have another game on here

Summary of thoughts:

1) Promoter Claim - Since we don't know if there is a Promoter, combined with the chance that there is a Mafia Promoter instead of a Town Promoter who could claim and then even "prove it" if we were to force the target options on them... I am not seeing a super upside for a Promoter Claim. Additionally, the Town Promoter is potentially a very strong role if I understand it correctly... but its value only grows as the game goes on. They get to enhance reads, isolate based on claims, etc... and all of that increases the chances of finding good targets. So yeah... I think I am against the Promoter Claim because I think Skum would probably want to get rid of them.

Vote: DatSwan for not reading the setup: there's always a Promoter. Not reading the setup seems like something scum!Swan would loooove to do since he performed that in RMM52, where he was town.

How is there always a promoter? Am I reading the setup wrong? There's 4 quadrants and we get the 4 things in that quadrant, right?
And only 2 of these have a promoter. ......

We have two quadrants, either the top two, the bottom two, the left two, or the right two.

[faust]

Why are we all saying the Promoter is negative utility? If they guess right and target scum, they increase our chance of lynching scum to 50%. How is that bad?

If town guesses right and lynches scum, it even increases our chance of lynching scum to 100%.

[faust]

Vote: ADK

Faust, is this a pressure vote, or do you have some sort of reason to believe A Drowned Kernel is scummy or something? Explain.

I have some sort of reason to vote for ADK.

...Would you care to explain this reason? Preferably in glorious detail?

Vote: ADK

Faust, is this a pressure vote, or do you have some sort of reason to believe A Drowned Kernel is scummy or something? Explain.

I have some sort of reason to vote for ADK.

And that is...?

It's cute how you think I post an unexplained vote and then explain it just because you ask nicely.

[A Drowned Kernel]

Vote: ADK

Faust, is this a pressure vote, or do you have some sort of reason to believe A Drowned Kernel is scummy or something? Explain.

I have some sort of reason to vote for ADK.

...Would you care to explain this reason? Preferably in glorious detail?

Vote: ADK

Faust, is this a pressure vote, or do you have some sort of reason to believe A Drowned Kernel is scummy or something? Explain.

I have some sort of reason to vote for ADK.

And that is...?

It's cute how you think I post an unexplained vote and then explain it just because you ask nicely.

It was worth a shot.

[faust]

Unrelated note: Well done gkrieg.

This reminds me: What's gkrieg's meta? With his, feel free to explain chairs joth and Galzria's metas as well, I just realized I haven't played with them yet.

Let's just say if gkrieg were the Traitor, we'd already know...

Seriously, gkrieg tends to have pretty good reads as town but for some reason people read him scummy and he gets mislynched frequently. As scum he's much easier to detect IRL. chairs is like always kind of excited when he starts playing, and then something terrible happens in his life and he can't participate. He's also very much a gut feeling kind of player. joth I feel I haven't really played with enough yet. Galzria's current meta is unfortunately that he lurks until he is replaced.

[faust]

How is there always a promoter? Am I reading the setup wrong? There's 4 quadrants and we get the 4 things in that quadrant, right?
And only 2 of these have a promoter. ......

I sure hope we're in one of the scenarios that have only 1 scum!

[faust]

How is there always a promoter? Am I reading the setup wrong? There's 4 quadrants and we get the 4 things in that quadrant, right?
And only 2 of these have a promoter. ......

I sure hope we're in one of the scenarios that have only 1 scum!

*technically 2

[jotheonah]

Directing the promoter will happen naturally after they claim, it's essencially inevitable, there's almost no reason to have an opinion on it, and if there is why say it?

Sure, but there's directing in the sense of "everybody has an opinion" and directing in the sense of "we're all going to vote on who you should use your power on, and if you use it on anybody else we'll lynch you on day 3".

Hmm. If the latter happens, I suggest we lynch them D2 instead. Otherwise I believe voting's better, but it will most likely drag the game down. So it'll depend on how early promoter claims, the earlier the better. So, scum, claim now for town points! They're free!

But can we lynch them day 2? I thought the whole promoter/gladiator thing meant we can't lynch anybody we want to day 2...