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Author Topic: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (GAME OVER, Maquis win!)  (Read 377522 times)

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ashersky

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #375 on: February 26, 2019, 10:31:19 pm »

I'm happy to walk you through my though process. For the first post- the Ferengi only know what alignment one of the Ferengi are. That could be the alignment not in the game, if that's the only one that fits the bill. But all a town Ferengi would know is one alignment that no one in the QT has. I saw that Ash had realized this, but I also wanted to point out that if Ash's original assumption was true, i.e. that the Ferengi knew which alignment wasn't in the gaqme, it would still be bad for them to say because that knowledge helps scum more than it helps town.


After I made that post, it occurred to me that if at least one Ferengi was scum, they would already know which alignment wasn't in the game, since they have an additional piece of information- their own alignment. Which would be an argument in favor of sharing that information with town. But its all moot since a town Ferengi wouldn't have that info in the first place.

I think Glooble ended up thinking he was wrong somewhere, but he’s kind of right. If scum is in the neighborhood and is told there is no town in the hood, they know the exact setup alignment wise.
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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #376 on: February 26, 2019, 10:32:44 pm »

Your logic makes perfect sense in regards to the here and now, but go and look at any town victory ever that goes through Day 4 - Day 6+.... it all comes back to how people interact with one and other. To remove the first of those interactions, the most purest of those interactions... is just I mean a bad idea.
This is a gross misrepresentation. shraeye explicitly said that he does not want us to stop interaction, or push through a no lynch right away.

Phrasing confusion? I am not suggesting otherwise - just my opinion on the topic and why. "interaction" in this context was to mean "a flip + pages from Day 1".
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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #377 on: February 26, 2019, 10:43:16 pm »

Vote: chickenwarlord
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #378 on: February 27, 2019, 12:44:44 am »

See, that one I don't buy. If Eddie was scum and I his partner, and we decided to claim Gul Dukat, why on earth would I want to steal his thunder by proposing the plan before he ever had a chance to post?

What thunder would you be stealing exactly? There's no universe in which anyone fakeclaims Dukat, the only question is alignment, not role.
The thunder that comes from him claiming out of his own volition and would possibly give him towncred.

Also, I had somehow missed that the serial killer, if we have one, would be full BP rather than 1-shot, which does indeed change things although I'm not entirely sure how. Surviving an NK is a sort of soft Changeling cop for scum. Either way it doesn't change how I would use Bus Driver, successfully targeting one of the 2 scum making an NK turns Bus Driver into a vig shot, and there are two chances to guess right, with the other top guess being vigged.
It doesn't really though. If the NK originally targeted one of your scum reads, then it already was like a vig shot.
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #379 on: February 27, 2019, 12:50:25 am »

Okay, since we're done playing my little game here, I may as well give my reasoning:

Faust is one of the players who gets the utility of Day 1. And his Dukat claiming talk is fine, but the desire to lynch UE didn't read like a reaction test to me, for a minute before he realized it was insanely anti-town for the UB to inherit Dukat's power if the UB is town, he wanted Dukat dead for strategy reasons.

And yeah, Dukat isn't likely to be the NK but he's sortable by reads later on. If we are possibly going into LYLO in the next day later in the game and don't decide we collectively trust him, it makes sense to lynch Unceeurope then, but doing it in the first couple real life days of Day 1 eliminates a lot of the utility Faust knows there can be in Day 1. And I think Town!faust realizes that.
I wanted Dukat dead for strategy reasons. Lynching Dukat means not lynching a useful PR. It also means removing a liability. Of course the UB changes the first part, and makes it so that it largely does not matter whom we lynch from a PR perspective.

Much as I like D1s, I also like utilizing setup info to my advantage, and in an open setup if there is a good plan it outweighs reads for me. Especially in multiball where scum can legitimately scumhunt and thus is even harder to catch.
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #380 on: February 27, 2019, 12:54:54 am »

Like if a player’s general style makes them hard to read, that player is a liability as town and especially dangerous as scum. Sounds like a great day 1 lynch to me.

I'd generally agree but that got MiX killed D1 last game. I'm interested in letting MiX live one more day if only to see what he's like D2.
It didn't really. MiX provided a lot of info and was active. There was a lot that could have been analyzed later on. That's really not the sort of player I consider hard to read. And noone to my knowledge made that argument in the other game. He was lynched because people perceived him as scummy.
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #381 on: February 27, 2019, 12:55:55 am »

Wondering - what do people think their Chickenwarlord votes will achieve?
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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #382 on: February 27, 2019, 01:43:20 am »

Wondering - what do people think their Chickenwarlord votes will achieve?

Why is voting for them different than voting for any other player?
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Chickenwarlord

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #383 on: February 27, 2019, 01:44:16 am »

Make sure you make a post in the forums somewhere outside the forum games section, this will prevent having to do a captcha each time you post.
Would be nice for finding your posts if you added you ShuffleIT Username or a distinguishable signature to your profile.
Can you tell us about your prior experience and what your preferred pronouns are?
Hopefully my signature is now somewhat searchable for clarity.

Prior mafia experience is basically all in person stuff. This is my first time in a play by post mafia engine. I can already see that there's a lot more theorydiving and conjecture than IRL setups.

Preferred pronoun is he.

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Chickenwarlord

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #384 on: February 27, 2019, 02:14:04 am »

@Chicken, at this point I feel like voting for you to see if you wake up, I know that in my first game, I wanted to make a big impression, I believe you should try to do the same: it's pro town, it sets you up for future days, and it helps for future games if those ever exist. So overall it's a pretty good deal!
I mean Day 1 is really difficult to get a good read out of people, but if we want post super unsubstantiated suspicions I'd be willing to wager that Ashersky and Faust are town.
I definitely want to wait for more info before throwing any fingers.
Vote: No Lynch
At least until there are some more actual claims out in the open or some compelling arguments.
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #385 on: February 27, 2019, 02:18:37 am »

Wondering - what do people think their Chickenwarlord votes will achieve?

Why is voting for them different than voting for any other player?
Other people have posted.
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2.71828.....

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #386 on: February 27, 2019, 02:19:32 am »

I haven't posted for a while, sorry. I will try to put some thoughts down later today
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Chickenwarlord

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #387 on: February 27, 2019, 02:26:20 am »

It also stands to reason that the 'listening intently for verbal tripups so you can point out inconsistencies' style of play doesn't really translate so well to play by post, since it just seems like one isn't there. Having the ability to carefully craft a reply rather than wordsplurge also kind of puts a damper on it too.
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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #388 on: February 27, 2019, 03:09:01 am »

I understand your willingness to No Lynch, chicken, as that tends to be optimal in primitive setups, where the cop's super important. This is less true here, where, since every single post is saved, you want everyone to interact early, to generate information useful in later days. The easiest way to do this is to (at least try to) lynch someone, so people have to put down reads and stand by their words and actions.

@UoS: if scum fails to NK, it could also be scum!Kira (apart from doc/bus driver).
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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (PMs sent. Night 0)
« Reply #389 on: February 27, 2019, 03:50:17 am »

Vote: LaLight

This will be 3 scum games in a row, right?

M120, RMM51, and this game. They are on a streak! You can beat WW's streak, I know it!

there was also the Newbie game, so I had 4 in a row. But this ended in the Philosophers finally, I am really happy to get town then and now
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Chickenwarlord

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #390 on: February 27, 2019, 04:01:54 am »

I understand your willingness to No Lynch, chicken, as that tends to be optimal in primitive setups, where the cop's super important. This is less true here, where, since every single post is saved, you want everyone to interact early, to generate information useful in later days. The easiest way to do this is to (at least try to) lynch someone, so people have to put down reads and stand by their words and actions.

@UoS: if scum fails to NK, it could also be scum!Kira (apart from doc/bus driver).
It's true that the prospect of all 3 role cops gleaning information from the first night was at least partially on my mind. However, I'm now realizing that they're not all necessarily town-aligned and the fact that we might not even get anybody to step forward with that info is pretty likely.
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LaLight

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #391 on: February 27, 2019, 04:04:41 am »

vote: 2.7 he doesn’t feel as genuine as he normally does to me. Hasn’t come across as towny and he normally does pretty early.

This is my thought as well as I am rereading

vote: 2.71828.....
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LaLight

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #392 on: February 27, 2019, 04:06:37 am »

yeah, I don't want to lynch MiX, not yet. Robz lately is paying his meta in the thread trying to seem town but usually ends up as scum. hmmm

So why are you scumreading Robz, Lalight?

I don't know, Robz' meta changed during last couple of years we are playing with him and he is really struggling with activity when he's scum. Up to this point I can't remember a single post from him other than "let's end D1 quicklynching someone"
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LaLight

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #393 on: February 27, 2019, 04:15:20 am »

ok, I'm pretty much finished with the reread. There's a lot of people and I struggle to wrap it all up, but I have some townreads and couple of scumreads, top one of each is 2.7
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LaLight

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #394 on: February 27, 2019, 04:15:32 am »

ok, I'm pretty much finished with the reread. There's a lot of people and I struggle to wrap it all up, but I have some townreads and couple of scumreads, top one of each is 2.7

of which.
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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #395 on: February 27, 2019, 04:16:35 am »

Unfortunately I am not expecting being superactive on D1, sorry. I will get to it eventually unless I'm killed or lynched
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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #396 on: February 27, 2019, 06:09:25 am »

Wondering - what do people think their Chickenwarlord votes will achieve?

Why is voting for them different than voting for any other player?
Other people have posted.

He'd made 2 in-game posts by then! Isn't that equivalent to 200 000 posts for determining his alignment? :-)
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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #397 on: February 27, 2019, 06:13:48 am »

Wondering - what do people think their Chickenwarlord votes will achieve?

Why is voting for them different than voting for any other player?
Other people have posted.

He'd made 2 in-game posts by then! Isn't that equivalent to 200 000 posts for determining his alignment? :-)
1. Please stop misrepresenting what I say.
2. If they got an alignment read from Chickenwarlord's posts, then that is totally fine and they can say so, it's a valid answer.
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MiX

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #398 on: February 27, 2019, 08:18:19 am »

vote: 2.7 he doesn’t feel as genuine as he normally does to me. Hasn’t come across as towny and he normally does pretty early.

This is my thought as well as I am rereading

vote: 2.71828.....

Why? I don't think I've seen cases against e and he seems pretty town to me. Also, sheeping a meh, if not bad, vote is just...lazy, as (I think) Didds put it. Scumpoints!

I also have to say that I've been reading the QTs of M121, and I saw this in the mason one...

LaLight: "...By the way MiX when you read this, sorry!"

That is so adorable. FoS: LaLight, because having 2 votes is double the power!

@faust, what makes you think Swan didn't get a scumread from chicken?

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faust

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Re: RMM52: Deep Space Nine Mafia Redux (Day 1)
« Reply #399 on: February 27, 2019, 08:29:45 am »

@faust, what makes you think Swan didn't get a scumread from chicken?
The fact that he didn't say that he did.
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