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Author Topic: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Game Over, Perfect Mafia Victory!)  (Read 291072 times)

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jotheonah

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2000 on: February 20, 2019, 12:22:08 pm »

Vote Count 3.4
"One sticks one’s finger into the soil to tell by the smell in what land one is: I stick my finger in existence — it smells of nothing. Where am I? Who am I? How came I here? What is this thing called the world? What does this world mean? Who is it that has lured me into the world? Why was I not consulted, why not made acquainted with its manners and customs instead of throwing me into the ranks, as if I had been bought by a kidnapper, a dealer in souls? How did I obtain an interest in this big enterprise they call reality? Why should I have an interest in it? Is it not a voluntary concern? And if I am to be compelled to take part in it, where is the director? I should like to make a remark to him. Is there no director? Whither shall I turn with my complaint?" — Søren Kierkegaard


faust (3): Debatepro, shraeye, silverspawn (L-2)
silverspawn (2): faust, EFHW
EFHW (1): raerae
Debatepro (1): Joseph2302
Joseph2302 (1): Uncleeurope

Not Voting (1): arishipshape

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to lynch.
Day 3 ends February 21, 2019, 04:00:00 pm. That's in ~28 hours.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2019, 03:15:15 pm by UmbrageOfSnow »
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EFHW

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2001 on: February 20, 2019, 12:23:50 pm »

Mr. The Faust

Seems like a poor choice. Why not EFHW?

Claim sounded towny, claim was risky as scum, I think the timing isn't as strange as faust paints it.

In what way was it townie?? Also, screw what faust says (no offense, friend) this was my argument first and I'm not sheeping him. Believe it or not, I am capable of independent thought. Uncle was getting limited pressure when she claimed. She wasn't getting any pressure to claim and very easily could have just said, "He feels townie to me," like EVERY OTHER PERSON in this game has and I would have been the only one upset about it. As scum it was perfect timing because it gets her and her partner a pass for, now, going on two days. They force another mislynch here, she claims a movement result tomorrow on whoever we think is scummiest today (probably Ari), we lunch then and scum wins the game. Done and dusted, dude, done and dusted.
That's not what actually happened. I said Eddie was townie. Someone asked why and I didn't want to answer and Shraeye said ok. Then Shraeye asked again, so I answered. So really, he determined the timing of my claim. I feel like your scumread on me is completely speculation. And while the narrative could be true, there isn't really much to support it. You've also been ignoring other people's points about how scum would not have done what I did.
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2002 on: February 20, 2019, 01:25:18 pm »

Mr. The Faust

Seems like a poor choice. Why not EFHW?

Claim sounded towny, claim was risky as scum, I think the timing isn't as strange as faust paints it.

In what way was it townie?? Also, screw what faust says (no offense, friend) this was my argument first and I'm not sheeping him. Believe it or not, I am capable of independent thought. Uncle was getting limited pressure when she claimed. She wasn't getting any pressure to claim and very easily could have just said, "He feels townie to me," like EVERY OTHER PERSON in this game has and I would have been the only one upset about it. As scum it was perfect timing because it gets her and her partner a pass for, now, going on two days. They force another mislynch here, she claims a movement result tomorrow on whoever we think is scummiest today (probably Ari), we lunch then and scum wins the game. Done and dusted, dude, done and dusted.
That's not what actually happened. I said Eddie was townie. Someone asked why and I didn't want to answer and Shraeye said ok. Then Shraeye asked again, so I answered. So really, he determined the timing of my claim. I feel like your scumread on me is completely speculation. And while the narrative could be true, there isn't really much to support it. You've also been ignoring other people's points about how scum would not have done what I did.

Disagreeing and ignoring are two different things. Also, you and I have a different idea of "pressure" if somebody asking twice equates to a forced claim.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2003 on: February 20, 2019, 01:34:20 pm »

Which is why I find it unlikely a scum would claim there, it looks weird.

And scum would want to wait till the last possible second to claim, IMO. Why make a claim early before knowing how many PRs there are around especially when other forms of protecting me (if I am her partner) exist.

I only had two votes on me, that’s the most insane scum play. It is much more reasonable for a town to claim early.

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arishipshape

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2004 on: February 20, 2019, 01:37:13 pm »

I'm good with a faust vote, and I'll probably vote faust. However, i shall withold my vote to avoid L-1. Closer to the deadline i'll probably put my vote on him
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2005 on: February 20, 2019, 01:46:16 pm »

Which is why I find it unlikely a scum would claim there, it looks weird.

And scum would want to wait till the last possible second to claim, IMO. Why make a claim early before knowing how many PRs there are around especially when other forms of protecting me (if I am her partner) exist.

I only had two votes on me, that’s the most insane scum play. It is much more reasonable for a town to claim early.

Another thing I would 100% do as scum. mail-mi was practically taking out billboards about how role and I don't believe for a second she missed that. Nobody thinks Ari is town so it's basically her against him when she claims. It's a great place to as scum.
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2006 on: February 20, 2019, 01:46:45 pm »

I'm good with a faust vote, and I'll probably vote faust. However, i shall withold my vote to avoid L-1. Closer to the deadline i'll probably put my vote on him

Poor choice. Try again.
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jotheonah

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2007 on: February 20, 2019, 01:53:30 pm »

Also, in reference to earlier events, it is up to UmbrageOfSnow whether to take any action against DebatePro, but I would ask everyone to refrain from quoting any outside information in their posts, even personal notes, per f.ds mafia policy.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2008 on: February 20, 2019, 01:59:16 pm »

Disagreeing and ignoring are two different things. Also, you and I have a different idea of "pressure" if somebody asking twice equates to a forced claim.
To be fair, it wasn't just anyone asking, but the IC.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2009 on: February 20, 2019, 02:02:22 pm »

Which is why I find it unlikely a scum would claim there, it looks weird.

And scum would want to wait till the last possible second to claim, IMO. Why make a claim early before knowing how many PRs there are around especially when other forms of protecting me (if I am her partner) exist.

I only had two votes on me, that’s the most insane scum play. It is much more reasonable for a town to claim early.

Another thing I would 100% do as scum. mail-mi was practically taking out billboards about how role and I don't believe for a second she missed that. Nobody thinks Ari is town so it's basically her against him when she claims. It's a great place to as scum.

Ari hadn’t claimed yet when she did, so the claim could have come from you or someone who was much more towny in people’s eyes at the time, she would have no way of knowing.

Now for a series of questions so I can get a better idea of your thoughts regarding all of this.

If you weren’t allowed to be vote for EFHW, then who would you vote for? You mentioned Joseph, does faust’s case mean anything to you in regards to that read? Do you still want me to die?

If the scum team is me and EFHW then who is our partner? Why would I try to get her lynched day one near the deadline?

Have you looked at our interactions in the past? Do they confirm or deny this partnership? Does me blatantly defending her mean you are going to be more paranoid? Probably. Do you find me scummy apart from my connection to EFHW?

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Debatepro

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2010 on: February 20, 2019, 02:04:21 pm »

Also, in reference to earlier events, it is up to UmbrageOfSnow whether to take any action against DebatePro, but I would ask everyone to refrain from quoting any outside information in their posts, even personal notes, per f.ds mafia policy.

I self reported in my secret channel with UoS, no reply.
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2011 on: February 20, 2019, 02:15:18 pm »

Which is why I find it unlikely a scum would claim there, it looks weird.

And scum would want to wait till the last possible second to claim, IMO. Why make a claim early before knowing how many PRs there are around especially when other forms of protecting me (if I am her partner) exist.

I only had two votes on me, that’s the most insane scum play. It is much more reasonable for a town to claim early.

Another thing I would 100% do as scum. mail-mi was practically taking out billboards about how role and I don't believe for a second she missed that. Nobody thinks Ari is town so it's basically her against him when she claims. It's a great place to as scum.

Ari hadn’t claimed yet when she did, so the claim could have come from you or someone who was much more towny in people’s eyes at the time, she would have no way of knowing.

Now for a series of questions so I can get a better idea of your thoughts regarding all of this.

If you weren’t allowed to be vote for EFHW, then who would you vote for? You mentioned Joseph, does faust’s case mean anything to you in regards to that read? Do you still want me to die?

If the scum team is me and EFHW then who is our partner? Why would I try to get her lynched day one near the deadline?

Have you looked at our interactions in the past? Do they confirm or deny this partnership? Does me blatantly defending her mean you are going to be more paranoid? Probably. Do you find me scummy apart from my connection to EFHW?

I'll have to be on a computer to verify the timing of Ari's claim, sorry, just not going to trust you on that one. You're my second choice and I suppose Joseph would be my third. Faust's case isn't impacting me one way or the other.

EFHW's D1 lunch was never going to happen, it's a safe place to be and something to point to in later days as to why you couldn't possibly be partners. And yes, I will take every opportunity to become more paranoid, apparently, it isn't intentional but it's happening so whatcha gonna do?

I'm sure I've missed questions but I'm on my phone and it's the best I can do. Frankly, EFHW's lunch probably isn't happening today which makes mean more sure I'm right. With (probably) three scum still around they can afford to spread out but NOBODY is biting on her lunch so it seems like there's town on the table and they're lining up there instead.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2012 on: February 20, 2019, 02:29:58 pm »

I'm sure I've missed questions but I'm on my phone and it's the best I can do. Frankly, EFHW's lunch probably isn't happening today which makes mean more sure I'm right. With (probably) three scum still around they can afford to spread out but NOBODY is biting on her lunch so it seems like there's town on the table and they're lining up there instead.
Yes they are. But look where your scumreads are voting. Eddie voting for Joseph. Joseph is the only one voting for Debatepro. The town scum are lining up to lynch is me, but your scumreads aren't there.

If you were right about your scumreads, it would have been super easy for them to lynch me by now.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2013 on: February 20, 2019, 02:34:48 pm »

Quote from: faust link=topic=19407.msg789240#msg789240
[/quote
No not really. I am using M118 as a reference game. He is very reactionary there, most of his posts are direct comments of waht others say. That is very much not the case here. For an illustration of this, Joseph uses the word "agreed" 6 times in M118 (that is 20.6% of all uses of the word in the game - including quoted stuff). He has not used it a single time here.

Can you explain your math? Last 20 posts are ~600 words of his own text and one instance of agreed. That was about 1 out of 20 posts.
The word "agreed" appears 29 times. 6 of those are Joseph. That's 20.6%.
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2014 on: February 20, 2019, 02:40:30 pm »

I'm sure I've missed questions but I'm on my phone and it's the best I can do. Frankly, EFHW's lunch probably isn't happening today which makes mean more sure I'm right. With (probably) three scum still around they can afford to spread out but NOBODY is biting on her lunch so it seems like there's town on the table and they're lining up there instead.
Yes they are. But look where your scumreads are voting. Eddie voting for Joseph. Joseph is the only one voting for Debatepro. The town scum are lining up to lynch is me, but your scumreads aren't there.

If you were right about your scumreads, it would have been super easy for them to lynch me by now.

Neither one of us exactly has an impeccable record this game. I'm not sure if be so confident that everybody voting for you is scum.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2015 on: February 20, 2019, 02:58:39 pm »

I'm sure I've missed questions but I'm on my phone and it's the best I can do. Frankly, EFHW's lunch probably isn't happening today which makes mean more sure I'm right. With (probably) three scum still around they can afford to spread out but NOBODY is biting on her lunch so it seems like there's town on the table and they're lining up there instead.
Yes they are. But look where your scumreads are voting. Eddie voting for Joseph. Joseph is the only one voting for Debatepro. The town scum are lining up to lynch is me, but your scumreads aren't there.

If you were right about your scumreads, it would have been super easy for them to lynch me by now.

Neither one of us exactly has an impeccable record this game. I'm not sure if be so confident that everybody voting for you is scum.
No, I don't think that (and obviously shraeye is voting for me). But I think that if all town are on me, then two scum would have jumped by now to seal the deal. Voting a mislynch with the IC is pretty attractive for scum. I am very sure that at least one of silver/Debate is scum.
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faust

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2016 on: February 20, 2019, 02:59:05 pm »

And actually, I wanted to ask: silver, Debate, could you summarize why you are voting for me?
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Debatepro

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2017 on: February 20, 2019, 03:10:40 pm »

And actually, I wanted to ask: silver, Debate, could you summarize why you are voting for me?
Off the top of my head:
1. Non-town-aligned-dialog-preferencing
2. Reflecting responses
3. Reversal responses
4. Gödel's second incompleteness theorem
5. Information sharing and analysis
6. Your still alive
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2018 on: February 20, 2019, 03:15:34 pm »

And actually, I wanted to ask: silver, Debate, could you summarize why you are voting for me?
Off the top of my head:
1. Non-town-aligned-dialog-preferencing
2. Reflecting responses
3. Reversal responses
4. Gödel's second incompleteness theorem
5. Information sharing and analysis
6. Your still alive

Please explain how this is a scum tactic?
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Debatepro

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2019 on: February 20, 2019, 03:22:09 pm »

And actually, I wanted to ask: silver, Debate, could you summarize why you are voting for me?
Off the top of my head:
1. Non-town-aligned-dialog-preferencing
2. Reflecting responses
3. Reversal responses
4. Gödel's second incompleteness theorem
5. Information sharing and analysis
6. Your still alive

Please explain how this is a scum tactic?

Apologies this is not clear, I'm doing analysis of his information sharing and analysis, and I find it not helpful.
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Debatepro

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2020 on: February 20, 2019, 03:29:06 pm »

@raerae - You believe this?

When did you pick up on MM breadcrumb?
Whenever the first person pointed it out today {day 3}.
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2021 on: February 20, 2019, 03:34:29 pm »

@raerae - You believe this?

When did you pick up on MM breadcrumb?
Whenever the first person pointed it out today {day 3}.

Yeah, I think he was too far into his own "mail-mi is scum" narrative to see what was right in front of him.
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EFHW

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2022 on: February 20, 2019, 03:56:04 pm »

Disagreeing and ignoring are two different things. Also, you and I have a different idea of "pressure" if somebody asking twice equates to a forced claim.
To be fair, it wasn't just anyone asking, but the IC.
I was just going to post that his being IC was a big part of why I answered.
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EFHW

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2023 on: February 20, 2019, 03:57:40 pm »

I'm good with a faust vote, and I'll probably vote faust. However, i shall withold my vote to avoid L-1. Closer to the deadline i'll probably put my vote on him
Why?
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raerae

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Re: M121: Philosophers Mafia Mafia (Day 3)
« Reply #2024 on: February 20, 2019, 04:02:02 pm »

EFHW, why'd you investigate (or whatever the appropriate verb is) silver last night?
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