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[MiX]

Vote: MiX

Why? I'll give Joseph, faust, and UncleEurope each 1 guess.

For pressure I assume. And to ask this question. Which in turn makes me want to ask. why us?

I couldn't agree more with everything you say here.

Given that the pool size is definitely not three new players, the odds are even lower.

What does this mean?

At the moment, the "new players" were me, ari and debatepro: him saying the scum team isn't three new players is the same as saying he's not scum.

It’s Saturday, I’ve been drinking, and I’m literally the only FNG in the game. 

Re: 6 or 7 people with shade... it seems to me like flailing with back to back posts include putting the spotlight on roughly half the other players in the game.

Re: why tunneling mix and ari... this is my first game, mix and ari makeup the bulk of the early posts and questions being asked and sequencing of votes and conversations with the two of you seem suspect.

Plus I like playing against a gambit and it seems like constant posting from an experienced player early could be scummy.

Hah, you consider me "an experienced player"? Still, there's one more question left unanswered:

Oh "the most scummiest thing I have ever read in all of the mafia games I've ever played" is just this one...funny. Was that intentional?

Still waiting for dylan's grand return...

[UmbrageOfSnow]

Vote Count 1.4
I am sitting with a philosopher in the garden; he says again and again "I know that that’s a tree," pointing to a tree that is near us. Someone else arrives and hears this, and I tell him: "This fellow isn’t insane. We are only doing philosophy." ― Ludwig Wittgenstein


Dylan32 (2): DatSwan, MiX
MiX (2): Debatepro, shraeye
silverspawn (2): Joseph2302, LaLight
raerae (2): faust, silverspawn
shraeye (1): raerae
EFHW (1): Uncleeurope

Not Voting (3): Dylan32, arishipshape, EFHW

With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.
Day 1 ends February 01, 2019, 05:00:00 pm

[UmbrageOfSnow]

mail-mi replaces Dylan32

[MiX]

vote: mail-mi

I was going to vote for you for /outing, how DARE you prefer that other game that doesn't exist here...

and now you're here! Hi I can't wait to see your insights on this game.

FYI: the vote's superfluous, I was already on your wagon.

Happy reading!

[mail-mi]

Hello

[shraeye]

@shraeye: So you picked out three people and not others to signal your reason for voting MiX?

@MiX: what did you think you had realized by looking closer?

Oh, and there ARE meaningful cases on me: Debatepro's, ari's and even shraeye's if you look closer, so it's not "for no reason".

No, picking those people didn't signal my reasons.

Others also want to know why I picked those people.  I wanted to get UncleEurope a chance to clarify his read on MiX, which was confusing me.  I wanted to pick faust to draw him into the game, and I wanted to pick one other person who needed to show some interaction and because 3 is a great number for a list.

I didn't want to pick only active people, have my question answered immediately and move on within an instant.  I wanted to draw it out to stir up real conversation better.

[Uncleeurope]

I recommend just asking me to explain myself, I prefer those kind of interactions (Where I understand the goal of the interaction) and I won't just respond with: "I have no idea why you voted for him." Which is less helpful. I will still gladly answer you if you are still confused as to my reasoning, but you might have figured it out now, I don't know.

Also, I dislike player swaps, now I feel like I have to wipe all opinions of Dylan and replace it with a new mail-mi box which is now sadly empty.

Sundays are slow, man. I guess it makes sense, people have lives.

[shraeye]

You had opinions about Dylan?  Huh?

[Uncleeurope]

Sure, I assume everyone did, his absence could be interpreted as lurking which can often mean someone is trying to go unnoticed, that information is much less valuable now.

[MiX]

I've been reading, and something caught my eye...

@Debatepro, you've never played before, right? How much have you researched? Did you read any games, maybe some theory in mafiascumwiki...what is your knowledge about Mafia as a whole and where did you get it from?

Uncle, lurking enough to get a prod is NAI, not scummy; unless you had a reason to assume scum!dylan likes to lurk, this changes nothing! Besides, lurking does draw attention: look at his wagon!

[MiX]

I have a lot to say to Debatepro compared to everyone else, odd.

Re: why tunneling mix and ari... this is my first game, mix and ari makeup the bulk of the early posts and questions being asked and sequencing of votes and conversations with the two of you seem suspect.

Now that the game has progressed, what do you think of literally anyone else? Anything about any other player besides us 3 is welcome.

And to be more specific, what do you think of dylan's - now mail-mi's - wagon?

[Uncleeurope]

Well my statement to lurking was regarding to before his prod, basically a “wouldn’t it be nice if...” kind of statement. I was mainly expressing the unfortunate circumstance we have with a new player when Day 1 is halfway done.

What I was trying to say was we had more on Dylan than we now have on Mail-Me even though that will obviously change and the previous knowledge was limited.

It was petty and unimportant, I just wanted to complain about nothing, as is often the case. Feel free to ignore me.

Also, what do you mean by Dylan/mail-me wagon? It’s just 2 people right?

[MiX]

Time for a pointless reply:

We didn't have more on dylan, we could ASSUME we had more, since he could be lying about why he was lurking...I guess that's more than what we known about mail-me so far, so fair.

The wagon's only 2 people now, but surely dylan's lurking didn't make him go unnoticed, which is what you were saying.

[Debatepro]

I have a lot to say to Debatepro compared to everyone else, odd.

Re: why tunneling mix and ari... this is my first game, mix and ari makeup the bulk of the early posts and questions being asked and sequencing of votes and conversations with the two of you seem suspect.

Now that the game has progressed, what do you think of literally anyone else? Anything about any other player besides us 3 is welcome.

• EFHW: first post was hilarious. In #266 she reads you as scummy. Could be i am searching for confirmation of my bias/opinion.
• Faust: first posts quoting Nietzsche was funny and it blew my newb mind when datswan hypothesized that it could be a role based restriction, which i had no idea could exist in the known universe.
• I don't understand the any of the justifications for voting for or by raerae or shraeye.
• Shraeye: I took comment about giving Joseph, faust, and eddie one guess as some kind of shared history/joke that I am not part of.
• Lalight: i didn't understand the SS scumslip! assertion but i had a slightly scummy vibe from SS which could also be confirmation bias.
• Joseph's post count summary was helpful, which i appreciated.
• Eddie's posts about you and ari reaffirmed my initial admittedly novice read.
• Datswans summary analysis post was awesome, thought i should borrow that technique sometime. Also hints at somewhat scummy read on you.
• Faust in #252 seems to suggest SS town read is scummy, which is how i took it.
• Mail-mi/Dylan - No opinion

And to be more specific, what do you think of dylan's - now mail-mi's - wagon?

Seemed like people where voting for Dylan to get them to play, which i didn't find a compelling reason for an RSV. I could always roll some die if i want to play that way.

If you are town, your wasting dialog time with me, because there are clearly better players you need to convince you are not scum. If you are scum and you are wasting your time with me, then I find it a brilliant strategy to project yourself as a newb player. Sticking with my reads for now.

[EFHW]

I'm slow. Who is Eddie?

[Debatepro]

@Debatepro, you've never played before, right? How much have you researched? Did you read any games, maybe some theory in mafiascumwiki...what is your knowledge about Mafia as a whole and where did you get it from?

As i stated earlier, my partner plays in this forum (not this game) and has played for several months. We've talked about their previous games during and after. I would have preferred my first game be open and with more newbs.

I didn't have a lot of time to read past games, brushed up on some basic rules. Constantly looking up phrases like tunneling, sheeping, etc. on mafiascumwiki.

Who is eddie?

In Uncleeurope's signature = Eddie. Faust also refers to them as Eddie in #258. I assumed it was a known nickname.

[raerae]

re: dylan's departure - This is directed to everybody as a whole, nobody in particular. 

It is a disservice to this community to even insinuate that somebody would lie about an unexpected IRL event.  We owe it to each other to trust that we all have enough respect for the game, the mods, and our fellow players that we wouldn't make stuff up just to lurk.  When we start questioning people's real lives it gets real hard for them to care about this fake one.


dylan, if you happen to catch up with the thread, I hope your car gets better and you join another game soon.
mail-mi, welcome!

[mail-mi]

So I'm super busy right now so don't expect too much from me, especially while I catch up. It also seems like everyone likes making gigantic wall posts in this game--don't expect that from me either 

[EFHW]

Who is eddie?

In Uncleeurope's signature = Eddie. Faust also refers to them as Eddie in #258. I assumed it was a known nickname.

Makes sense. I turned off signatures so I didn't see it.

[raerae]

3) raerae (no shuffle ID, so IDK, but they have decent content): All in all just too damn paranoid for me to consider as a lynch rn. I am a pretty strong town read on them as of current.. they check all the correct boxes. 1) Frustrated with their wagon (not skummy, no matter what people have said), 2) faust pissing them off (townX1000), 3) They continue to attempt to open new venues of conversation, which is the easiest form of skum hunting in early days to avoid... so skum tends to you know... avoid it.
- Start of game has mostly to do with twin claim wars. To be expected. As I somewhat recently joined FDS from a twinclaim referral I can go ahead and say that gunning for your friend is essentially NAI... so if you are married it is probably just outright expected to happen (that was a joke, it is nice to play with both of you!)
- That being said... #138 is just downright incorrect. This is a form of RMM - if we bring every player to L-1 on Day 1, then on Day 1 every player will essentially have to claim. That is an exaggerated example (I am not promoting a mass claim by any means).. I am just saying that to wagon up players, under the correct circumstances, during early phases of this set up... def does NOT just "tell us nothing". If anything it is a stronger argument for the RVS stage of the game.

Dude, are you sure you were rereading me?  I guess I appreciate that you've found me town but your reasoning is flawed so I'm concerned your "townread" on me is more of a buddy than an actual read.

1)I'm not frustrated with the "wagon" on me (one vote, hardly more than RVS I think?), I was frustrated the MiX wagon spun up so quick and stuck so long but that's been my only frustration so far. 
2)Faust is most certainly not pissing me off, he voted for me and I asked why, I promise you I have much more colorful words reserved for when I'm pissed.
3)I'll give you this one.
-Start of the game didn't "mostly" have to do with a twinclaim, I had a PS on a post informing people, that's about it.  Then I started raising a fuss about the MiX wagon and trying to get additional conversation going.
-Post #138 wasn't even mine.  Regardless, I disagree with you.  This isn't RMM in the slightest, it's normal as stated in the set-up, we're guaranteed at least 5 VTs and minimum 1 Goon so with 13 playing we're only looking at a maximum of 7 roles.  Beyond that, claiming early game only benefits scum, just because you're on L-1 DOES NOT mean you should claim so you saying we'd all have to mass claim if we all RVS'd each other to L-1 is just wackadoo.  Beyond that, I've never been a huge fan of RVS but I get it, conversation has to start somewhere but there is no reason, that I can see, to let it get within lynching range so damn early because it just allows scum opportunity for a quickhammer.

[Swowl]

3) raerae (no shuffle ID, so IDK, but they have decent content): All in all just too damn paranoid for me to consider as a lynch rn. I am a pretty strong town read on them as of current.. they check all the correct boxes. 1) Frustrated with their wagon (not skummy, no matter what people have said), 2) faust pissing them off (townX1000), 3) They continue to attempt to open new venues of conversation, which is the easiest form of skum hunting in early days to avoid... so skum tends to you know... avoid it.
- Start of game has mostly to do with twin claim wars. To be expected. As I somewhat recently joined FDS from a twinclaim referral I can go ahead and say that gunning for your friend is essentially NAI... so if you are married it is probably just outright expected to happen (that was a joke, it is nice to play with both of you!)
- That being said... #138 is just downright incorrect. This is a form of RMM - if we bring every player to L-1 on Day 1, then on Day 1 every player will essentially have to claim. That is an exaggerated example (I am not promoting a mass claim by any means).. I am just saying that to wagon up players, under the correct circumstances, during early phases of this set up... def does NOT just "tell us nothing". If anything it is a stronger argument for the RVS stage of the game.

Dude, are you sure you were rereading me?  I guess I appreciate that you've found me town but your reasoning is flawed so I'm concerned your "townread" on me is more of a buddy than an actual read.

1)I'm not frustrated with the "wagon" on me (one vote, hardly more than RVS I think?), I was frustrated the MiX wagon spun up so quick and stuck so long but that's been my only frustration so far. 
2)Faust is most certainly not pissing me off, he voted for me and I asked why, I promise you I have much more colorful words reserved for when I'm pissed.
3)I'll give you this one.
-Start of the game didn't "mostly" have to do with a twinclaim, I had a PS on a post informing people, that's about it.  Then I started raising a fuss about the MiX wagon and trying to get additional conversation going.
-Post #138 wasn't even mine.  Regardless, I disagree with you.  This isn't RMM in the slightest, it's normal as stated in the set-up, we're guaranteed at least 5 VTs and minimum 1 Goon so with 13 playing we're only looking at a maximum of 7 roles.  Beyond that, claiming early game only benefits scum, just because you're on L-1 DOES NOT mean you should claim so you saying we'd all have to mass claim if we all RVS'd each other to L-1 is just wackadoo.  Beyond that, I've never been a huge fan of RVS but I get it, conversation has to start somewhere but there is no reason, that I can see, to let it get within lynching range so damn early because it just allows scum opportunity for a quickhammer.

1) my TR of you has primarily to do with your general form of communication thus far.
2) i have realized since reading this that ALL Of my post # quotes that they are all off by one for some reason. Sorry about about that.

[Uncleeurope]

3) raerae (no shuffle ID, so IDK, but they have decent content): All in all just too damn paranoid for me to consider as a lynch rn. I am a pretty strong town read on them as of current.. they check all the correct boxes. 1) Frustrated with their wagon (not skummy, no matter what people have said), 2) faust pissing them off (townX1000), 3) They continue to attempt to open new venues of conversation, which is the easiest form of skum hunting in early days to avoid... so skum tends to you know... avoid it.
- Start of game has mostly to do with twin claim wars. To be expected. As I somewhat recently joined FDS from a twinclaim referral I can go ahead and say that gunning for your friend is essentially NAI... so if you are married it is probably just outright expected to happen (that was a joke, it is nice to play with both of you!)
- That being said... #138 is just downright incorrect. This is a form of RMM - if we bring every player to L-1 on Day 1, then on Day 1 every player will essentially have to claim. That is an exaggerated example (I am not promoting a mass claim by any means).. I am just saying that to wagon up players, under the correct circumstances, during early phases of this set up... def does NOT just "tell us nothing". If anything it is a stronger argument for the RVS stage of the game.

Dude, are you sure you were rereading me?  I guess I appreciate that you've found me town but your reasoning is flawed so I'm concerned your "townread" on me is more of a buddy than an actual read.

1)I'm not frustrated with the "wagon" on me (one vote, hardly more than RVS I think?), I was frustrated the MiX wagon spun up so quick and stuck so long but that's been my only frustration so far. 
2)Faust is most certainly not pissing me off, he voted for me and I asked why, I promise you I have much more colorful words reserved for when I'm pissed.
3)I'll give you this one.
-Start of the game didn't "mostly" have to do with a twinclaim, I had a PS on a post informing people, that's about it.  Then I started raising a fuss about the MiX wagon and trying to get additional conversation going.
-Post #138 wasn't even mine.  Regardless, I disagree with you.  This isn't RMM in the slightest, it's normal as stated in the set-up, we're guaranteed at least 5 VTs and minimum 1 Goon so with 13 playing we're only looking at a maximum of 7 roles.  Beyond that, claiming early game only benefits scum, just because you're on L-1 DOES NOT mean you should claim so you saying we'd all have to mass claim if we all RVS'd each other to L-1 is just wackadoo.  Beyond that, I've never been a huge fan of RVS but I get it, conversation has to start somewhere but there is no reason, that I can see, to let it get within lynching range so damn early because it just allows scum opportunity for a quickhammer.

Scum quickhammering is a good thing. It’s basically a free scum lynch.

[raerae]

Scum quickhammering is a good thing. It’s basically a free scum lynch.

But with no conversation you can't KNOW the quickhammerer is scum! 

But votes don't mean anything if there isn't discussion behind them.  We can push four people to L-1 but if it's just a bunch of people sheeping crappy cases that doesn't tell us anything.

Are you really saying that a quickhammered sheeped mislynch is actually beneficial to town?  Because when you said I was "downright incorrect" above is the post you were referencing.

[Uncleeurope]

Scum quickhammering is a good thing. It’s basically a free scum lynch.

But with no conversation you can't KNOW the quickhammerer is scum! 

But votes don't mean anything if there isn't discussion behind them.  We can push four people to L-1 but if it's just a bunch of people sheeping crappy cases that doesn't tell us anything.

Are you really saying that a quickhammered sheeped mislynch is actually beneficial to town?  Because when you said I was "downright incorrect" above is the post you were referencing.

I mean, if someone hammered a townie into the ground without talking to anyone 4+ days before deadline I would think they would have to be scum in most scenarios. And there’s no way they would escape being lynched the next day regardless, and town would be aware of this.

[Swowl]

Rae - thoughts on anyone but yourself?