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Author Topic: M119: Towny Mafia (Game Over!)  (Read 140694 times)

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Joseph2302

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1175 on: December 03, 2018, 11:20:19 am »

Thanks, EFHW, for doing the work on the vote count. That is helpful.

I feel like my town homies are Joseph, DatSwan, and Dylan. I think Mcmc is scummy and Awaclus is null with a touch of scum.

I am pretty much ready to vote for mcmc, but would like to hear what he has to say now that EFHW is IC and that is the only place he has spent his time this game. I find the distinct lack of interaction between him and the scum telling. I don't see that Fang or Hyper were doing any bussing and it would have been (or, in fact, was) easy for Mcmc to just avoid any interaction with them entirely. But now that they've been caught, it looks super shady. 

I am waiting to vote because I understand why EFHW was a target. I was on her initially, but by Day 4 there was far more to suggest that she was town than to suggest that she was scum. Mcmc says as much at  #1098 and doesn't vote at all. (I didn't vote either. The day ended before I was on in the morning, but I'd have voted Mcmc or Awaclus if I had made it before the hammer.)

So, in short....I'm thinking Mcmc has some 'splaining to do
Agreed.
Although if it's one of mcmc and Awaclus, we can always guillotine one today and the other tomorrow if need be
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Mafia Stats: (correct as of 2017)
Town: 22 games, 8 wins
Scum: 5 games, 3 wins

mcmcsalot

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1176 on: December 03, 2018, 12:55:40 pm »

Sorry guys been busier than expected I’ll try and find time soon (a couple hours) to participate. First thoughts, I’m less surprised that I wish I was that efhw is town.

From what little I’ve gleamed I see that people are finding me scummy for not having much voting interactions with scum. I have almost no voting interactions with anyone. That’s common for me, I make cases but only move my vote when needed unless it’s my current case.

While things like vote analysis and post counts (I’m the only one to do that and will update it) are great metrics they can be screwed and misrepresented easily. The actual content contributions are more objective and I stand by my early efhw case which I thought it was good and it lessened as the days went on and fang became increasingly scummy. The day ended while I was not around and perhaps that is my fault for not being as present as I should. I will have more in regards to others later but that hopefully clarified some of my play for now.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

mcmcsalot

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1177 on: December 03, 2018, 09:32:03 pm »

Post Count (includes pregame):

wcd: 121
joseph: 83
mcmc: 80
dylan: 58
swan: 56
awacus: 42

Logged
Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

mcmcsalot

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1178 on: December 03, 2018, 10:00:47 pm »

Okay thoughts on yesterday.

Content wise it begins with people questioning the 2.7 kill over pps and then discussing the probability that if fang flips scum efhw is scum. Both of these are non starters. The kill discussion boils quickly down to wifom and the continued discussion of how we should read efhw based off fang's alignment is useless because we did not have fang's alignment. So instead of viewing results of the previous day and potentially reacting to them and changing reads accordingly (as should be done every day) we were distracted by these other conversations.

These two conversations were largely pushed by datswan, and at the time he received town cred for them. But if you look at the effect it keeps us at the status quo (an assumed efhw lynch).

The wagon for efhw is slow to start, specifically because I have not swarmed out of the gate calling for her lynch (as I believe scum thought I would). PPS had a known scum read on EFHW and swan had joined but other than that Dylan and WCD are engaging and asking questions, awaclus was as always absent but following. Then I post that I am concerned by the efhw wagon, that it was the least scummy day for her and that the wagon is finally getting traction despite me no longer pushing it. It began very much to feel like my tunnel wa going to be used by scum and that as time had gone on efhw had gotten less and less scummy. WCD seconds this point and I believe there is more rereading to be done and a representing of the efhw case that needs to be made. Before that can be done in a period of 6 hour EFHW recieves 3 votes, Awaclus, Dylan, Joseph.

Vote: EFHW

I did some re-reading and stuff but not very much came out of it.

And

So I have a meeting for the few hours leading right up to the deadline, and I hate mornings in general, so I can't promise I'll be up in time to spend time on here before it, so I guess I have to Vote: EFHW now.  Since I do think fang is going to flip scum, I'm fine still going with EFHW for today because I think she would actually make a really good IC tomorrow if she's town.  She's been obviously polarizing this game, and it's likely affected how open some people (self included) are to her theories, so being able to confidently listen tomorrow in the event I'm wrong about that partnership is worth doing this today rather than waiting. Besides, noone else really stuck out as super scummy after rereading, so I don't have anyone else that I'd rather put on guillotine today anyway.
I agree with most of this.
I think EFHW is scum and if I'm wrong then hopefully she can be a good IC for us tomorrow.
Vote: EFHW

The towniest of these votes is clearly Dylans, Awaclus and joseph both give us nothing and there is lots of scum motivation behind those votes. Scum!awaclus needs to finally put his vote down to secure efhw as the lynch because there is a chance wcd and I do not. Scum!joseph could be lazily hammering there but I actually think its fine for scum to sit efhw at L-1 so I guess the scummiest vote is by far awaclus.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

mcmcsalot

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1179 on: December 03, 2018, 10:02:25 pm »

So I am torn, overall day datswan was the scummiest player, rambling through scenarios and conversation that I think derailed the rest of town from posting discussing last end of day. But his vote is much more consistent in a read that he held were awaclus's vote has come out of nowhere.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

mcmcsalot

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1180 on: December 03, 2018, 10:03:47 pm »

The other thing that is worrying is swan's 58 posts, awaclus is at a standard level of participation for his play as either alignment, Swan I am always suprised by how high he is on post counts because he tends to wall post as either alignment but this game his count is unusually low.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

Joseph2302

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1181 on: December 04, 2018, 02:21:08 am »

Post Count (includes pregame):

wcd: 121
joseph: 83
mcmc: 80
dylan: 58
swan: 56
awacus: 42
I'm the second biggest poster? Guys you really need to post more
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Mafia Stats: (correct as of 2017)
Town: 22 games, 8 wins
Scum: 5 games, 3 wins

LaLight

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D2!)
« Reply #1182 on: December 04, 2018, 05:25:34 am »

Vote count 5.1

Not voting (7): Dylan32, DatSwan, Joseph2302, Awaclus, WestCoastDidds, EFHW, mcmcsalot

EFHW is on the guillotine.
With 7 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 5 ends Saturday, 8th of December, at 7am
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Wins: 15, 10
Losses: 11, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
Mod/Co-mod: 18

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Swowl

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1183 on: December 04, 2018, 05:47:56 am »

work got me today. I will catch up tomorrow.
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Town:  14 wins, 14 losses (1 MVP)
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3-Party: 4 wins, 1 loss

WestCoastDidds

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1184 on: December 04, 2018, 10:53:22 am »

Interesting, Mcmc.

The thing about DatSwan for me is that he was the critical mass vote for hyper. There were other viable wagons then (mine!) so he didn’t need to vote there to protect himself or some such. And the hyper lynch, it seems to me, was huge in terms of the game. Finding scum that early from a wagon that was almost entirely based on gut reads from me and Robz felt surprising to me (perhaps my inexperience showing).

Awaclus has been off and on Fang all game, but hasn’t said much about anything. Would he have bussed his partner?

EFHW, what do you think about mcmc’s response?
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EFHW

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1185 on: December 04, 2018, 12:00:08 pm »

I'll save my comments for later.

I think it's Awaclus's turn to explain to us why he is town!
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Dylan32

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1186 on: December 04, 2018, 04:17:59 pm »

In reply to mcmc's long post where he discussed the EFHW wagon: Joseph didn't hammer and was actually L-1. Scum!fang hammered.
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Forum Mafia Record - Wins: 14 - NM9, M97, RMM41, M99, M102, M104, M119, M126, RMM56, M133, M134, RMM58, RMM59, RMM61, RMM60; Losses 15 - RMM37, M89, M94, M95, M96, M100, RMM47 M109, M110, M120, M127, M129, M131, M132, M136; MVPs: 1 - NM9

Dylan32

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1187 on: December 04, 2018, 04:18:56 pm »

In reply to mcmc's long post where he discussed the EFHW wagon: Joseph didn't hammer and was actually L-1. Scum!fang hammered.

So if it is true that scum was cool letting EFHW hang at L-1 like you said, Joseph should be getting those scum points instead of Awaclus.
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Forum Mafia Record - Wins: 14 - NM9, M97, RMM41, M99, M102, M104, M119, M126, RMM56, M133, M134, RMM58, RMM59, RMM61, RMM60; Losses 15 - RMM37, M89, M94, M95, M96, M100, RMM47 M109, M110, M120, M127, M129, M131, M132, M136; MVPs: 1 - NM9

mcmcsalot

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1188 on: December 04, 2018, 05:04:33 pm »

In reply to mcmc's long post where he discussed the EFHW wagon: Joseph didn't hammer and was actually L-1. Scum!fang hammered.

You are correct I was reading the vote count after josephs vote as the final vote count. Joseph L-1 ing efhw there is actually quite scummy.

The on guillotine mechanic is actually extremely interesting because the remaining scum was 100% aware fang was scum and that fang would hammer a town player with no worry at all because he then is instantly killed. So yes josephs lackluster vote after the quick votes by awaclus and dylan is extremely scummy. I need to reread joseph.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

Awaclus

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1189 on: December 04, 2018, 06:00:53 pm »

I think it's Awaclus's turn to explain to us why he is town!

Well, I didn't do a whole lot this game, but I think that the evidence that exists supports a town narrative better than a scum one:

1) I voted for chairs/hypercube on my own accord and encouraged others to do the same early on. I probably would not do this to the scum PR if I was scum.
2) I helped faust and e out by jumping on the wagons they were pushing on WCD and Dylan, respectively. (I told WCD I had a "more compelling reason" to lynch her, but I didn't really; I just wanted to give more weight to the wagon that a towny player was pushing)

Apparently some other people also found me towny earlier, for reasons I don't understand.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1190 on: December 04, 2018, 09:48:11 pm »

(I told WCD I had a "more compelling reason" to lynch her, but I didn't really; I just wanted to give more weight to the wagon that a towny player was pushing)

I read this to my kid and his assessment was “he’s a meanie!” Which, while irrelevant, made me laugh.
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EFHW

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1191 on: December 04, 2018, 10:35:16 pm »

Will post my thoughts tomorrow.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1192 on: December 05, 2018, 07:02:41 am »

(I told WCD I had a "more compelling reason" to lynch her, but I didn't really; I just wanted to give more weight to the wagon that a towny player was pushing)

I read this to my kid and his assessment was “he’s a meanie!” Which, while irrelevant, made me laugh.

This morning small one revised his opinion. “Not a meanie, just a stinker”. I think I probably agree with that.

Awa, in D2, I voted for Hyper. Then he voted for me. Then Robz voted for Hoer, then you voted for me, and kept your vote there until EOD. What had me as scum from that interaction? And why not Hyper?

On D3, you voted for Fang early on. Why?
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Awaclus

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1193 on: December 05, 2018, 07:18:54 am »

Awa, in D2, I voted for Hyper. Then he voted for me. Then Robz voted for Hoer, then you voted for me, and kept your vote there until EOD. What had me as scum from that interaction? And why not Hyper?

On D3, you voted for Fang early on. Why?

1) Nothing, I was just a little disappointed at how little came of your wagon from D1, so I wanted to push it more since there was an opportunity. I could have also pushed for hypercube but as stated, I was VLA at the time so I wasn't thinking too hard about what to do.

2) I don't remember.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1194 on: December 05, 2018, 08:23:32 am »

Who do you think you’ll vote for today?
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Awaclus

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1195 on: December 05, 2018, 08:25:29 am »

I'd just vote already if I knew.
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EFHW

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1196 on: December 05, 2018, 09:25:46 am »

What do people make of fang voting Awaclus Days 3 and 4?
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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1197 on: December 05, 2018, 05:52:15 pm »

What do people make of fang voting Awaclus Days 3 and 4?
mcmc, what do you think about it?
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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1198 on: December 05, 2018, 06:13:12 pm »

What do people make of fang voting Awaclus Days 3 and 4?
mcmc, what do you think about it?

Day three awaclus is in no danger. But is also an easy vote. I think it’s a smart move from fang because it doesn’t tell much. He was clearly trying to show buddying with you so he wouldn’t vote there and was still hoping to avoid his lynch so didn’t want to try cases on more active players who might put up a fight. I think day four it’s interesting, he leads off with the awaclus vote almost as a carry over but drops it quickly for a pressure vote on wcd. I think not sticking to the awaclus vote once he was lynched looks partnery as opposed to weak town case. Once fang is lynched he should be pushing any non efhw town lynch he can and is read of really going in at awaclus he goes all over the place and let’s efhw take center stage and get lynched. If awaclus isn’t gangs partner an in dang I am going all out crusading that I am still town as is efhw and we need to be lynching awaclus, that way my partner gets a datswan and efhw lynch before needing to do any heavy lifting. Fang seemed to just fizzle and wait for he inevitable efhw lynch.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

WestCoastDidds

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Re: M119: Towny Mafia (D5!)
« Reply #1199 on: December 05, 2018, 06:28:30 pm »

Awaclus seems any easy target for Fang. Awa doesn’t fight back much and is null enough for everyone that no one feels like it’s super scummy, even if it doesn’t gather momentum. In my (limited) experience it seems like Awaclus gets lynched sometimes for being hard to play with.  I don’t feel like the Fang votes have cleared him, or deemed partnery. Meh.
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