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[Dylan32]

Vote: Space also seems good to me.


Can someone summarize for me what happened at the end of the previous day, how I became the choice?

Sure. Actually, this might be more of a play-by-play than a true summary, because that seems more useful.

At vote count 1.6, Joseph's wagon had 5 people and yours had 3, so let's start there.

#412 fang says he's very happy on Joseph, would vote for Robz if needed.
#414 EFHW goes from Joseph to Robz because they didn't actually vote for Joseph because they thought he was scummy.
#417 Space leaves Joseph to Robz, but at the end of them same post votes for Awaclus.
VC 1.7: Joseph 3, Robz 4
#432 WCD moves from EFHW (who was at 3 herself) to Robz
#437 EFHW moves back to Joseph because of #432
#442 faust moves off Joseph onto Space
#446 Space votes Robz
VC1.8: Joseph 3, Robz 5, EFHW 2, Dylan Awaclus mcmc and Space 1
next post hypercube moves off Joseph onto Space, putting both wagons at 2.
#467 mcmc moves from EFHW to Space
#471 mcmc moves back and tries to get Awaclus to join
#474 fang votes Robz, prefers it to Space
#477 faust votes Joseph from Space
#489 hypercube follows faust's advice and goes back to Joseph
#491 thread locked.

[Dylan32]

Vote: infangthief

[EFHW]

Vote: infangthief

How did you get to this from your previous post?

[Dylan32]

Post 198 from fang reminds me of something I did in (I think) NM9, when as scum I pointed out some flawed reasoning a guy was using to townread me, and basically told him not to give me town points for that. You don't see many people (especially town) actively turn away town points unless doing so has even more pro-town benefits than having someone reading you as town correctly, even though the reasons are wrong. So this seems like a very new scum post.  Combined with his voting pattern at EoD and the recent stuff, I'm very happy leaving my vote on infangthief for a while, preferably until he's on guillotine.

[Awaclus]

Awaclus and myself are both town.

Huh? How do you know that?

[infangthief]

I think it is reasonable to scrutinize the Robz wagon (and to be clear I'm not entirely comfortable with my position on it!) so don't let me stop those who are doing that, or follow DatSwan's suggestion.

I do feel, however, that the plurality lynch mechanic meant we got less info out of that end of day than we would with a normal majority lynch situation.
Joseph, faust and hypercube alerted us to dangers in #350, #356 and #380, but we still ended up without anything near a majority vote, and a real possibility at the end of a Joseph lynch with no chance for him to claim.

I think personally I'm going to focus effort on rereading a few key people. WCD, e, maybe Awaclus.

Bolded part just doesn't seem like something town would add it there.

I'll admit that I got confused by the plurality lynch thing. I was trying to follow faust's advice to make a clear majority and avoid lynching without opportunity to claim and all that. But yeh, when I looked at the end of day wagon I thought why ever am I on Robz? Joseph any day.

But e's advice is much more simple:

But in plurality you should be voting who you want to vote.

No one mentioned that yesteday. Maybe it's too obvious to have needed stating.

[Dylan32]

I think it is reasonable to scrutinize the Robz wagon (and to be clear I'm not entirely comfortable with my position on it!) so don't let me stop those who are doing that, or follow DatSwan's suggestion.

I do feel, however, that the plurality lynch mechanic meant we got less info out of that end of day than we would with a normal majority lynch situation.
Joseph, faust and hypercube alerted us to dangers in #350, #356 and #380, but we still ended up without anything near a majority vote, and a real possibility at the end of a Joseph lynch with no chance for him to claim.

I think personally I'm going to focus effort on rereading a few key people. WCD, e, maybe Awaclus.

Bolded part just doesn't seem like something town would add it there.

I'll admit that I got confused by the plurality lynch thing. I was trying to follow faust's advice to make a clear majority and avoid lynching without opportunity to claim and all that. But yeh, when I looked at the end of day wagon I thought why ever am I on Robz? Joseph any day.

But e's advice is much more simple:

But in plurality you should be voting who you want to vote.

No one mentioned that yesteday. Maybe it's too obvious to have needed stating.

Robz was almost entirely absent, and so Robz didn't seem to have much of a chance to claim either, yet Joseph (I think) was actually around, so if avoiding the lynch without a claim was your biggest concern and Joseph was your biggest scumread, seems like you should have been on him.

[Joseph2302]

I think it is reasonable to scrutinize the Robz wagon (and to be clear I'm not entirely comfortable with my position on it!) so don't let me stop those who are doing that, or follow DatSwan's suggestion.

I do feel, however, that the plurality lynch mechanic meant we got less info out of that end of day than we would with a normal majority lynch situation.
Joseph, faust and hypercube alerted us to dangers in #350, #356 and #380, but we still ended up without anything near a majority vote, and a real possibility at the end of a Joseph lynch with no chance for him to claim.

I think personally I'm going to focus effort on rereading a few key people. WCD, e, maybe Awaclus.

Bolded part just doesn't seem like something town would add it there.

I'll admit that I got confused by the plurality lynch thing. I was trying to follow faust's advice to make a clear majority and avoid lynching without opportunity to claim and all that. But yeh, when I looked at the end of day wagon I thought why ever am I on Robz? Joseph any day.

But e's advice is much more simple:

But in plurality you should be voting who you want to vote.

No one mentioned that yesteday. Maybe it's too obvious to have needed stating.

Robz was almost entirely absent, and so Robz didn't seem to have much of a chance to claim either, yet Joseph (I think) was actually around, so if avoiding the lynch without a claim was your biggest concern and Joseph was your biggest scumread, seems like you should have been on him.

I would have to agree with this.
I can claim now, if people would like?

[pingpongsam]

I voted Robz because of his quick lynch suggestion. 1stly that is actually scummy. 2ndly, it's the expected result when you make such suggestions. Robz knows that is scummy and I figured he was generating a wagon for some purpose. When the IC flip occurred I figured that was actually his intent which seems a bit behind the better objective of find and kill scum which he was never present enough to actually do. It would be super good if he actually made use of the fact he is an IC for a day.

[Robz888]

I voted Robz because of his quick lynch suggestion. 1stly that is actually scummy. 2ndly, it's the expected result when you make such suggestions. Robz knows that is scummy and I figured he was generating a wagon for some purpose. When the IC flip occurred I figured that was actually his intent which seems a bit behind the better objective of find and kill scum which he was never present enough to actually do. It would be super good if he actually made use of the fact he is an IC for a day.

I dispute that proposing a quicklynch is scummy in general or scummy for me specifically.

[infangthief]

Robz was almost entirely absent, and so Robz didn't seem to have much of a chance to claim either, yet Joseph (I think) was actually around, so if avoiding the lynch without a claim was your biggest concern and Joseph was your biggest scumread, seems like you should have been on him.

To avoid lynching a PR, it seemed that we needed:
1. clarity on who was the likely lynch candidate.
2. an assumption that if someone had a PR to claim they would be around (assuming they were aware they had a wagon on them).

For (1), me being on Joseph at the end would have made it very unclear whether Joseph should be claiming or not.
For (2), I was unaware of Robz's VLA, so it seemed reasonable to assume from Robz's absence that he had nothing to claim.

I know that all seems complicated, which is why I now prefer e's suggestion of just being on who you think is scummiest. Let PR claiming take its chance.

[WestCoastDidds]

Post 198 from fang reminds me of something I did in (I think) NM9, when as scum I pointed out some flawed reasoning a guy was using to townread me, and basically told him not to give me town points for that. You don't see many people (especially town) actively turn away town points unless doing so has even more pro-town benefits than having someone reading you as town correctly, even though the reasons are wrong. So this seems like a very new scum post.  Combined with his voting pattern at EoD and the recent stuff, I'm very happy leaving my vote on infangthief for a while, preferably until he's on guillotine.

Whelp, I just disappeared down the rabbit hole that was NM9...what an interesting and weird game. Also, duderific. Also, I like Space's flavor writing (adulting IS hard!) Also, Dylan did what he sees Fang doing, and he was, in fact, scum.

I have found much of Fang's posts today a little off, and so I was trying to think through why I found him towny before.  I came up with:
1. I found him somewhat charming with the "little bit arrogant, little bit lynched comment"
2. the last time I played with him, he was super active and helpful and because he was super active again (except for a lull midweek) I assumed he was also super helpful
3. scum pushed his lynch D1 in that previous game, which was his first ever of f.ds and I felt guilty (and still do) about lynching the newest kid on the first day of a Newbie game

So, between guilt, previous play, and charm, I think maybe I am being snowed. None of those are reasons that he has been town this game, and I think that when I read through the conversations today and look back through D1, he isn't so towny after all. The not comfortable with the wagon comments, the "hey don't town-read me" comment, the narrowing it down to 8 isn't helpful comments, and then his desire to look more closely at me, e, and Awaclus today. In his first game, he and the rest of the speccy had lynched me over and over again, and I was town through and through. I'd have guessed that he would have a better sense of me, and as a result, I now see his questioning of three folks I mostly see as town (although I am not as sure about Awa), as off. So, I'm thinking vote: Fang

[SpaceAnemone]

I can claim now, if people would like?

Is this seriously meant as a pro-town suggestion? If you're town, it's not pro-town to help scum narrow down where our PRs might be. If faust's right about it being more beneficial than usual in this set-up for scum to establish early fake-claims, then I think there's good motivation for scum!you to consider it, though. Particularly since we're only in very early D2 right now and you don't currently have any votes.

[SpaceAnemone]

New observation: WCD isn't expressing any opinions about Joseph at all, barring putting him in the middle of her long list of people "on the fringes".

The only direct interaction has been her question to him in response to his assertion of there being at least on scum in a group of six. That was a factual "what am I missing?" sort of question, rather than any kind of a scum-hunting motive-questioning post like she's aimed at other people. It's the kind of thing that could be a newbie partner-tell.

[SpaceAnemone]

Also, I like Space's flavor writing (adulting IS hard!)

Thank you :-) I think I was feeling inspired by the fact that a lot of players at that point were approximately 14 and I was feeling old :-P

[SpaceAnemone]

I voted Robz because of his quick lynch suggestion. 1stly that is actually scummy. 2ndly, it's the expected result when you make such suggestions. Robz knows that is scummy and I figured he was generating a wagon for some purpose. When the IC flip occurred I figured that was actually his intent which seems a bit behind the better objective of find and kill scum which he was never present enough to actually do. It would be super good if he actually made use of the fact he is an IC for a day.

I dispute that proposing a quicklynch is scummy in general or scummy for me specifically.

Meh.. is "Let’s quick lynch somebody" obviously pro-town? It definitely suffers from making a bunch of people unsure of how to react, and how to read you, especially since there are impressionable newbies around.

I definitely don't see how your suggestion is not likely to court votes from at least some of the current player base, and it's reasonable to assume that at the time you made the post, you could have predicted exactly that... so to me PPS's reasoning isn't a million likes out.

Anyway, presumably PPS's post's purpose was to goad you into being a more active IC.. so maybe it'll work? :-)

[WestCoastDidds]

New observation: WCD isn't expressing any opinions about Joseph at all...

The only direct interaction has been her question to him in response to his assertion of there being at least on scum in a group of six. That was a factual "what am I missing?" sort of question, rather than any kind of a scum-hunting motive-questioning post like she's aimed at other people. It's the kind of thing that could be a newbie partner-tell.

You’re right. I didn’t see a very good reason for his wagon on D1 because it was either based in set up related content or people who played with him before...both of which I’m not terribly facile at yet. And then today I went down that old game rabbit hole and haven’t had much bandwidth to think about or reread anyone other than Fang. I’ll get to Joseph soon, I hope, and until then I’m following other folks reads.

Tomorrow is Election Day and I’m in a close race state so I’m gonna be a mess. Likely scattered and erratic and nervous, so fair warning. And if my guy wins, DAMA!

[WestCoastDidds]

Also, I like Space's flavor writing (adulting IS hard!)

Thank you :-) I think I was feeling inspired by the fact that a lot of players at that point were approximately 14 and I was feeling old :-P

Yeah, that would be somewhat short of awesome. 14 year old boys...that explains the dude vibe. So much dude. My step-daughter is 16. The early teen years were rough. She’s pretty awesome now.

[Robz888]

Also, I like Space's flavor writing (adulting IS hard!)

Thank you :-) I think I was feeling inspired by the fact that a lot of players at that point were approximately 14 and I was feeling old :-P

The last thing I want to do is re-familiarize myself with everyone's ages. I was in my early 20s when I joined these Forums. Now I'm, well, old.

[EFHW]

Also, I like Space's flavor writing (adulting IS hard!)

Thank you :-) I think I was feeling inspired by the fact that a lot of players at that point were approximately 14 and I was feeling old :-P

The last thing I want to do is re-familiarize myself with everyone's ages. I was in my early 20s when I joined these Forums. Now I'm, well, old.

You do have the consolation that the rest of us got older too.

[EFHW]

Sorry I've been quiet.  I was doing a WCD reread. I'll write it up tomorrow.  I'm still thinking about where I stand, but I'm glad to see her making an actual case in her recent post.

[infangthief]

I find it interesting how my "I'm going to reread WCD, e, maybe Awaclus" comment has been taken.
They're people who I'd like to be clearer what I think about them; e and Awaclus I haven't considered much at all yet, WCD I've been up and down on.
But e and WCD both seem to not want to be re-read. If you're town surely you don't mind me rereading you?

[LaLight]

Vote count 2.1

WestCoastDidds (1): EFHW
EFHW (1): hypercube
SpaceAnemone (3): 2.71828....., Joseph2302, Robz888
infangthief (2): Dylan32, WestCoastDidds
Not voting (6): pingpongsam, DatSwan, infangthief, SpaceAnemone, Awaclus, mcmcsalot

Robz888 is on the guillotine.
With 13 alive, it takes 7 to lynch. Day 2 ends Sunday, 11th of November, at 10am

[Swowl]

Also, I like Space's flavor writing (adulting IS hard!)

Thank you :-) I think I was feeling inspired by the fact that a lot of players at that point were approximately 14 and I was feeling old :-P

The last thing I want to do is re-familiarize myself with everyone's ages. I was in my early 20s when I joined these Forums. Now I'm, well, old.

old people don't have the dexterity to ride scooters to work

[Swowl]

I think it is reasonable to scrutinize the Robz wagon (and to be clear I'm not entirely comfortable with my position on it!) so don't let me stop those who are doing that, or follow DatSwan's suggestion.

I do feel, however, that the plurality lynch mechanic meant we got less info out of that end of day than we would with a normal majority lynch situation.
Joseph, faust and hypercube alerted us to dangers in #350, #356 and #380, but we still ended up without anything near a majority vote, and a real possibility at the end of a Joseph lynch with no chance for him to claim.

I think personally I'm going to focus effort on rereading a few key people. WCD, e, maybe Awaclus.

Bolded part just doesn't seem like something town would add it there.

DatSwan's recent post feels maybe a little partnery towards Joseph.

ppe 1

Why do I seem partnery towards Joseph?

So this is pretty much you saying that you skum read the people that switched wagons a ton plus me yeah?