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[EFHW]

We're coming up on deadline now. I think mcmc is our best bet for finding scum. I'm not sure what it means that he has stayed at L-1 so long. It's plurality lynch, in any case, so maybe that's why. There is no other 3 person wagon.

@Dylan: It would great if you placed a vote somewhere.

Part of why I haven't is cuz I'm leaning towards mcmc, but also didn't want to hammer before you got answers to some of your questions.

Makes sense (quotefail)

[Dylan32]

Intent to hammer

[Swowl]

since it is plurality (just as a back up), and MCMC said they would be back, I think it might be prudent to wait at least a little before hammering in case he returns.

[WestCoastDidds]

Hey y’all- it looks like things haven’t moved much. I still feel like Mcmc is the best choice, although if I’m wrong I’ll have a morning like Joseph and Dylan did at the begiinning of the Day where they were confused about why we’re still playing...

I won’t be around in the morning before deadline, but should be able to check back in again tonight in the event there is some new information.

[mcmcsalot]

since it is plurality (just as a back up), and MCMC said they would be back, I think it might be prudent to wait at least a little before hammering in case he returns.

Thank you, I am back catching up as quickly as I can.

[mcmcsalot]

Btw did a 12 mike hike up a mountain and along the Pacific Ocean and saw a wild wild today. Pretty awesome day.

[mcmcsalot]

Btw did a 12 mike hike up a mountain and along the Pacific Ocean and saw a wild wild today. Pretty awesome day.

Wild wolf, like really up close, we ware hiking just a small ways behind some people on horseback so our scent was covered it was awesome.

[Awaclus]

Btw did a 12 mike hike up a mountain and along the Pacific Ocean and saw a wild wild today. Pretty awesome day.

That's a lot of mikes.

[mcmcsalot]

Which means either it's the right kill, or scum is too scared to expose themselves

Or the third option which you conveniently forgot to mention, which is that scum is already on the wagon.

Vote: Awaclus

Why Joseph?

Because he's scum.

... so is it Joseph or me?

It could be either, i doubt its me or awaclus and I think he feels that way too.

[WestCoastDidds]

Btw did a 12 mike hike up a mountain and along the Pacific Ocean and saw a wild wild today. Pretty awesome day.

Wild wolf, like really up close, we ware hiking just a small ways behind some people on horseback so our scent was covered it was awesome.

That’s super cool!

[mcmcsalot]

While I understand we need to look at more than VCA, I do have some thing to point out about Joseph regarding my dislike of their wagon:

Day 1) At the end of D1, both Fang and Hyper got on Joseph's wagon bringing him to (5). That is 2/5 skum on the wagon, when they could of made the (5) wagon either Robz or EFHW instead. They stayed there all the way down to Joseph(3), and then after the wagon dissipates, they move elsewhere. That is the exact opposite of a Skum Narrative of D1 voting actions, and matches up pretty clearly with a Narrative of 2 skum trying to push any good mis-lynch wagon.

actually an early wagon in scum is a very smart tactic because then the go without scrutiny the rest of the game. Also with 2 scum on a wagon of 5 it’s extremely easy to jump off wagon before it actually goes through especially on day one. I agree it fits a town!joseph narrative but I don’t think it excludes a scum!joseph one.

Day 2) Since we know it is Skum!Fang and Skum!Hyper... think about the following from a Skum!Joseph POV. Towards the end of Day 2, Joseph switches their vote onto Hypercube to put them at L-1 when they just of easily could of voted for the WCD counter wagon. If Joseph is skum, then WCD is town... and we know Hyper was skum... so yeah that doesn't really make any damn sense.

could be bussing as which would make sense why hyper just kinda flailed at the end and gave up that he was scum when he didn’t need to and could have disrupted the next day.

Day 3) Joseph is on EFHW for the majority of the day until the end. He doesn't switch to Fang... which I actually read as towny because I assume skum would make sure to be on that bus.

How are you so sure scum doesn’t bus early day one when it’s save but would definitely bus on day 3 when it pins scum in a really tough spot. I feel like you are veiwing this as how you would play not how a scum!joseph/town!joseph would play. Personally I think bussing your teammate and making yourself the last scum needing to make it to endgame is not worth the towncred but I believe you feel differently.

Day 4) Joseph got on EFHW as #3, when they could of been on Awaclus as #2. Aside from that... with the suggested narrative from others on Day 4 regarding "EFHW being skum if Fang flips skum".... why in all the hell would he push an EFHW lynch? Like, literally, skum would want to push ANY other lynch at that point so they could set up EFHW the next day because they would know that Fang is gonna flip skum.

This is where I think it is important to see that I who was the primary pusher of the efhw wagon had voiced concern that efhw was not scum. That’s not setting up efhw for a futur lynch that’s creating a town player who withstood a game long tunnel and was going to be very difficult to lynch if she survived. I think scum!joseph needed to inch efhw yesterday so I would look bad for ever pushing efhw at all and he could move toward an late game awaclus push for “he’s being awaclus” reasons.

So yeah, I don't like our chances with Joseph.

@ EFHW - The above is why "not Joseph". As for why "not MCMC"... If I am picking between Joseph and MCMC I am going for MCMC. But my "reason" would be that skum at this point would want to create the most likely scenario for tomorrow to promote a mislynch. Right now that would be done by having two close competing wagons (both town) run out the end of the day so that the living player can be set up tomorrow. I also think that Skum!MCMC would pick both either Awaclus or myself as a counter wagon as opposed to Joseph at this point.

Sorry for poor formatting I was in a rush on mobile and wanted to get my thoughts out. Underlined text is my responses. This is my why Joseph.

[mcmcsalot]

Hey y’all- it looks like things haven’t moved much. I still feel like Mcmc is the best choice, although if I’m wrong I’ll have a morning like Joseph and Dylan did at the begiinning of the Day where they were confused about why we’re still playing...

I won’t be around in the morning before deadline, but should be able to check back in again tonight in the event there is some new information.

Wcd can you explain why you find me scummy, it feels like you are just going with the flow. I agree I have been the expected lynch much because my low interactions with anyone but efhw. You may not know this but you can look at another game I believe okervill (efhw mentioned it earlier) I frequently have a strong scum read on town!efhw. It’s a problem one that I wanted to remedy and had to look towards how others were acting. As the wagon began turning towards her you agreed with me that it was a troublingly accepted thing that efhw would be the lynch. We both voiced concerns and hours later she received 3 votes lynching her. That’s troubling

[mcmcsalot]

Swan I understand a lot of what you are saying from your perspective and simply disagree with it. Opposite to efhw I do tend to push your lynch when I am scum often because I can genuinely disagree with you. I am finally realizing I think we have different play styles and you use your own to establish reads (not a bad thing to do just one that’s polarizing). This is not a scum!mcmc game.

[Dylan32]

frick, I have the same feeling about mcmc now that he had about EFHW having their least scummy day and then getting lynched. I didn't really think mcmc was scummy earlier, but I've thought his contributions today have actually been towny.  I retract my intent to hammer for the moment...

[Dylan32]

To be clear, I thought he was likely to be scum today from VCA, but to say that not a single scum bused this game is kind of a stretch when you think about it, and his points on the early day double bus could make sense, especially if Joseph coached the two new scum to do that early during N0.

[WestCoastDidds]

Hey y’all- it looks like things haven’t moved much. I still feel like Mcmc is the best choice, although if I’m wrong I’ll have a morning like Joseph and Dylan did at the begiinning of the Day where they were confused about why we’re still playing...

I won’t be around in the morning before deadline, but should be able to check back in again tonight in the event there is some new information.

Wcd can you explain why you find me scummy, it feels like you are just going with the flow. I agree I have been the expected lynch much because my low interactions with anyone but efhw. You may not know this but you can look at another game I believe okervill (efhw mentioned it earlier) I frequently have a strong scum read on town!efhw. It’s a problem one that I wanted to remedy and had to look towards how others were acting. As the wagon began turning towards her you agreed with me that it was a troublingly accepted thing that efhw would be the lynch. We both voiced concerns and hours later she received 3 votes lynching her. That’s troubling

I can’t say that I find you scummy, more that the VCA kept clearing everyone else. But I can also say that I’ve never played this late into a game so I don’t really know moves scum make to clear themselves later by bussing early. I didn’t find your defenses yesterday terribly compelling, but the stuff in the last couple of hours is more interesting.

I also stopped reading EFHW as scum yesterday but hadn’t thought much about folks on her as scum. I can see that as more possible now.

[WestCoastDidds]

Mcmc- I appreciate you pushing me. I feel like I learn a lot when I’m talking with you, so thanks! I also realize, that similar to Fang, I find you charming so it’s easy for me to agree with you when I’m in your head space. When I walk away (or in this case, go for ice cream)  I remember that Joseph didn’t have to be on the hyper wagon and I can’t see why he’d want one of his buddies putted so early when I was a likely and viable lynch. I can also see some strategic reason why scum!mc would move away from EFHW when her wagon gained speed without proposing and alternative.

I’m with my extended fam this weekend so time is at a premium. If you get lynched, and then IC, I’ll be the first to apologize.

[mcmcsalot]

Wcd o think you should take into account the fact that in a game this large it’s very beneficial for scum to vote for their partner early. The most common tool for lynching players late game is vote wagon analysis and vca. Town only cares about voting for their reads. If you look at my play I have pushed and voted for me reads. Joseph has conveniently voted for scum when it benefitted and town when it benefitted him.

[Swowl]

Wcd o think you should take into account the fact that in a game this large it’s very beneficial for scum to vote for their partner early. The most common tool for lynching players late game is vote wagon analysis and vca. Town only cares about voting for their reads. If you look at my play I have pushed and voted for me reads. Joseph has conveniently voted for scum when it benefitted and town when it benefitted him.

It’s not about just when Joseph voted for others. It’s also the known skum others and when they voted for Joseph. Bussing early could be beneficial for skum - but You are saying because of the size of the game it makes it more likely for skum to pick skum wagons over town wagons early on? I think it is the opposite bc or plausible deniability.

[EFHW]

I think I got lynched because there was no movement towards anyone else and because if I was town I would be an active IC for a day. Voting me was less scummy than it would usually be.

[EFHW]

Fang and hyper were both new scum. They might not have realized the value in "suspecting" their partners early on. They didn't bus each other at all, so it seems quite plausible that they didn't bus the 3rd scum, either.

[Swowl]

Fang and hyper were both new scum. They might not have realized the value in "suspecting" their partners early on. They didn't bus each other at all, so it seems quite plausible that they didn't bus the 3rd scum, either.

Agreed.

[WestCoastDidds]

Hmmm....it’s morning and I’m still feeling pretty good about Mcmc. And EFHW often seems to be on point and hasn’t wavered, and has significantly less to gain by persuading me, so I’m gonna stay where I’m at.

[EFHW]

The deadline passed, so it's a done deal. The time after deadline is called twilight.

[EFHW]

If mcmc is scum, do I get released unharmed from the guillotine? Wishful thinking. They'd have to kill me to make room for mcmc. I don't want to go. Townpoints to anyone who gets the reference.