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Author Topic: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter  (Read 7984 times)

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markus

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2018, 07:41:31 am »
0

Is it a bug that you can't use village tokens while you have no action cards in hand? Or that's the rule?
That does matter when playing diadem.
Did you try clicking on the icon? It may be a bug, or at least, a feature not implemented yet. The idea is to give you a way to use villagers even with no Action cards in hand, for both Diadem and Possession.

This feature is not yet implemented. See
Spending Villagers - edgecases


And believe me, you really don't want to get asked in every game to end your Action phase when you have Villagers, so that is the much better version for preview week.

You can click the icon while still having Action cards in hand to spend them.
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ossiangrr

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2018, 08:07:34 am »
0

How do the tokens do double duty? Two mats? One mat with two sides? Double-sided coins?
Donald made it sound like it was one mat divided in half, with a side for coffers and a side for villagers.
Correct, it's the size of the Seaside mats but divided into a top and bottom. The idea here is, you only want so much of your table space taken up with mats.

All the more reason to use meeples (or VP tokens, or Embargo tokens, or the Guilds 2E Coffers-mat, if you want to use things already in the box), to avoid an issue if you accidentally knock the mat and can't remember whether you had 3 Coffers and 2 Villagers or the other way around in those few setups where it will matter.
It's not exactly a problem on the level of Terraforming Mars.. or a problem at all.. but there are still plenty of solutions to this non-problem :)

Maybe if Donald ever stops making expansions, someone could create a definitive single playmat with divided sections for all the possible special areas.  ;D
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faust

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2018, 08:12:37 am »
0

Recruiter / Fortress. Awesome Engine or just Village Idiot on steroids?
Just played that, I ended the game with 25 Villagers. There was also Priest...
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Asper

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2018, 08:21:36 am »
+3

just gonna leave that here too


I have made it a habit not to click on links announcing that an element at a particular index of a list was soandso or would make me do thisandthat.

popsofctown

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2018, 08:40:11 am »
+1

This seems like it's gonna be one of my favorite expansions much more than the last few.

Sculptor is such a cool card, I love seeing cards I am about to buy/not buy and then play incorrectly, more room to grow.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #30 on: September 25, 2018, 08:57:46 am »
0

When specifically can you spend a Villager?
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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #31 on: September 25, 2018, 09:02:59 am »
0

When specifically can you spend a Villager?

At any time during your Action phase. Any time. A-N-Y time!
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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #32 on: September 25, 2018, 09:06:24 am »
0

When specifically can you spend a Villager?

At any time during your Action phase. Any time. A-N-Y time!

That's good, I was kind of worried it was going to be like Coffers and you could only spend them at the beginning of the phase.

Asper

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #33 on: September 25, 2018, 09:10:10 am »
+2

When specifically can you spend a Villager?

At any time during your Action phase. Any time. A-N-Y time!

That's good, I was kind of worried it was going to be like Coffers and you could only spend them at the beginning of the phase.

Producing Actions you can only use from next turn on DOES sound interesting for one card or so! Thinking about it, I wonder whether there will be a Treasure that gives you Villagers.

GendoIkari

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #34 on: September 25, 2018, 09:13:19 am »
+1

When specifically can you spend a Villager?

At any time during your Action phase. Any time. A-N-Y time!

Sounds like more emphasis on clarity over technicality. A game like MTG would shudder at such a thing, but I'm ok with this direction.

So you can play Smithy, draw 2 cards, spend a Villager, then draw a third.
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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #35 on: September 25, 2018, 09:21:17 am »
+6

When specifically can you spend a Villager?

At any time during your Action phase. Any time. A-N-Y time!

Sounds like more emphasis on clarity over technicality. A game like MTG would shudder at such a thing, but I'm ok with this direction.

So you can play Smithy, draw 2 cards, spend a Villager, then draw a third.

You can go to the bathroom in the middle of resolving a Smithy. I'm sure people will manage.

Erick648

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #36 on: September 25, 2018, 09:34:51 am »
0

I love how flavor-friendly Recruiter's synergies are (despite being the standard trash-for-benefit synergies):  The best place to recruit from is the Fortress.  The Border Village is also a useful target (someone has to guard that border).  Also, you can Recruit from your starting Estates but not your starting Coppers (at least not effectively).

Of course, this breaks down if you start recruiting Rats (maybe he's friends with the Pied Piper or something).
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matste

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #37 on: September 25, 2018, 09:43:23 am »
+1

When specifically can you spend a Villager?

At any time during your Action phase. Any time. A-N-Y time!

Herald + Diadem sometimes make it beneficial to spend them in the middle of an action play. I wonder if this gets implemented.
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markus

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #38 on: September 25, 2018, 09:55:42 am »
0

When specifically can you spend a Villager?

At any time during your Action phase. Any time. A-N-Y time!

Herald + Diadem sometimes make it beneficial to spend them in the middle of an action play. I wonder if this gets implemented.

The idea is to be able to spend them when playing Diadem in the action phase. And before ending the action phase when you might want to play Diadem in the buy phase or are worried about opponent's Possession.
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Cuzz

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #39 on: September 25, 2018, 09:58:59 am »
0

My first game today had Fortress, Priest, Recruiter, and Storyteller and was ridiculous.
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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #40 on: September 25, 2018, 10:27:30 am »
+4



I have made it a habit not to click on links announcing that an element at a particular index of a list was soandso or would make me do thisandthat.

thats fine you can find the video in my youtube channel. no need to click on the link. ;)
the clickbaity title is supposed to be funny since they are uncommon for dominion content. Bu ti guess by explaining it now the joke is gone.
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Aquila

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #41 on: September 25, 2018, 10:33:13 am »
0

So, I like how these cards make Villagers different enough from Villages and open up different strategies, so if both come up in the same game they're each worth considering, but I'm surprised you can get so many of them:
Recruiter / Fortress. Awesome Engine or just Village Idiot on steroids?
Just played that, I ended the game with 25 Villagers.
In the IRL set that's 25 Coffers or Villagers other players can't get, right? Only 10 left. Especially in 4+ player games this might be an issue? I get that these 3 cards don't give that much in the way of draw or payload so you shouldn't get lots of them, but some newer players might anyway. Like those who try to get so many they can ignore Villages altogether (though at great early game cost).
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Asper

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #42 on: September 25, 2018, 10:41:54 am »
+1



I have made it a habit not to click on links announcing that an element at a particular index of a list was soandso or would make me do thisandthat.

thats fine you can find the video in my youtube channel. no need to click on the link. ;)
the clickbaity title is supposed to be funny since they are uncommon for dominion content. Bu ti guess by explaining it now the joke is gone.

You will find that on fds, explaining jokes makes them funnier.
Yes,that itself is an in-joke here. And I just explained it.

Asper

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #43 on: September 25, 2018, 10:45:00 am »
+5

So, I like how these cards make Villagers different enough from Villages and open up different strategies, so if both come up in the same game they're each worth considering, but I'm surprised you can get so many of them:
Recruiter / Fortress. Awesome Engine or just Village Idiot on steroids?
Just played that, I ended the game with 25 Villagers.
In the IRL set that's 25 Coffers or Villagers other players can't get, right? Only 10 left. Especially in 4+ player games this might be an issue? I get that these 3 cards don't give that much in the way of draw or payload so you shouldn't get lots of them, but some newer players might anyway. Like those who try to get so many they can ignore Villages altogether (though at great early game cost).

I am certain Villagers are not limited just because the physical tokens shipped with Renaissance are.

trivialknot

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #44 on: September 25, 2018, 10:54:29 am »
+2

I'm not sure I appreciate the two-sided mat thing.  In practice, we just never use most of the mats.  Sometimes when the play-space gets crowded, we take out tavern mats, and use them for everything--reserve cards, duration cards, set-aside cards, all the tokens.  Using the same tokens to represent two things requires us to use particular mats, and also requires us to keep the mat organized.

Of course, I'm sure this doesn't matter in many games, if a kingdom only contains coffers or only contains villagers.  And there might be some games where we'd just use debt or VP tokens to distinguish coffers from villagers.
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cascadestyler

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #45 on: September 25, 2018, 11:00:31 am »
+3

Recruiter seems ridiculous to me. I just played one game with it. I opened Recruitor/Nothing and quickly trashed out my estates while rolling up to 6 villagers and getting a second Recruiter. I then got Envoys for draw and Bandits to gain me gold plus more Recruiters. I was then able to fire a Magic Lamp pretty quickly with Recruiter/Envoy/Bandit/Copper/Gold/Lamp and around that point my opponent resigned. They had gone for a pretty nice-looking Talisman/Experiment strategy and at that point I was worried I'd done a "first time playing with Rats" kind of mistake and that my deck would die, so I played it out against the bot. I trashed through the rest of my coppers occasionally trashing a gold to add extra villagers. I had 6 provinces after T12. I'm sure if I did it again I could do it a few turns faster. I know ML will have helped me speed up, but I don't think it was key at all. I think I'd have slowed down by a turn or maybe two without, but I think I could make that time back up with practice. I've never played with a card that seemed so OP from the word go. I finished with more than 10 spare villagers, only ever purchased terminal actions (Druid was strictly a soft terminal as it had Field's Gift). It didn't feel like dominion at all. I'm psyched about this expansion in general but I'm a little worried that villagers make some really simplistic decks very powerful. They're crack for terminal draw, with which you normally have to be very careful, and the fact that Recruiter is terminal draw (and trashing) itself makes it ludicrously self-synergistic. Maybe this was a really odd game and actually you can barely ever do this. We'll see.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2018, 11:02:06 am by cascadestyler »
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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #46 on: September 25, 2018, 11:04:49 am »
+4

I am guessing there will be some cards that hand out coffers and villagers; hence, the villagers being shown before coffers tomorrow even though we already know about coffers.

Also, dual functionability of tokens would make even more sense because you only need one set of tokens when using those cards. Simplicity and efficiency seems to be a theme in this set, which is welcome after Nocturne (a great set, but it can be fiddly IRL).
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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #47 on: September 25, 2018, 11:08:51 am »
+1

Herald + Diadem sometimes make it beneficial to spend them in the middle of an action play. I wonder if this gets implemented.

Right when you play Diadem in your Action phase, before it gets executed, you get asked how many Villagers to spend. Stef figured that was the only case where you may need to spend Villagers for an immediate effect in the Action phase. In the paper game, you would play Herald, it would reveal/play a Black Market/Storyteller and you would then play a Silver, convert 2 Villagers to Actions and then play Diadem. Online, spending the Villagers becomes part of playing Diadem (if it happens during the Action phase).

All the other reasons to spend Villagers could wait until 'nothing important is going on'. Implementing "can happen any time" effects in games is a real nuisance, both from the mechanics view as well as the UI view. As markus pointed out, a good way to give you the option to spend Villagers when your Action phase is about to end is not yet implemented.
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trivialknot

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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #48 on: September 25, 2018, 11:18:03 am »
0

I really like these cards.  Acting Troupe seems like it might suffice as a village in at least some engines--how many times do you play each village anyways?  Hey wait, we have statistics for this, and the average is between 3 and 4.  So Acting Troupe is right at that edge.  But also, it gives me dreams of playing a counter strategy that simply waits out my opponent until they run out of villager steam.

Sculptor... I once had a fan card that would gain cards to hand, but would be non-terminal only if it gained a treasure.  It was terrible, but I loved it.  Sculptor lives out that dream, while also being non-terrible.  Sculptor looks pretty good next to Explorer, but then what doesn't.  It does not look as good next to Cobbler.

Recruiter looks bonkers, like a Sentry that trashes from hand instead of from deck.  Curious that the +2 cards is before the trashing, since an obvious nerf would be to swap those two instructions.  It makes me wonder if it's not quite as strong as it first looks.
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Re: Renaissance Previews #2: Acting Troupe, Sculptor, Recruiter
« Reply #49 on: September 25, 2018, 11:23:01 am »
0

I have made it a habit not to click on links announcing that an element at a particular index of a list was soandso or would make me do thisandthat.

Even if it's obvious ironic humor?
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