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Author Topic: 5-6 player number of cards.  (Read 340 times)

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Karpeth

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5-6 player number of cards.
« on: September 21, 2018, 05:40:42 am »
+1

It seems we have different rules on This in different editions.

Intrigue, base cards and dominion second edition wants you to use 120 Copper, 80 silver, 60 gold, 30 estates, 12 duchies, 18 province and 50 curses and ruins.

Big box Two includes 100 extra cards, which are suppoused to bring the Numbers to 80 Copper, 70 silver, 48 gold, 30 estates, 12 duchies, 18 province and 50 curses and ruins.

Am I misinformed on the contests of big box II, or is There a discrepancy between the rules?
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infangthief

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2018, 08:02:50 am »
+1

I do not know about big box 2, but my understanding is that the number of basic treasure cards is somewhat arbitrary, and shouldn't affect the game play very much.
I believe that the advice for 5-6 players is pretty much 'use as many as you have'.

The number of victory and curse cards is much more important, but your numbers show no discrepancy there.
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TheOthin

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2018, 09:29:10 am »
+1

Your numbers of victory cards, Curses, and Ruins are right for 6 players, but for 5 players it's just 27 total Estates (15 in starting decks, 12 in the supply) and 40 Curses/Ruins (10 for each player beyond the first).

And yeah, don't worry about treasures.
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Oyvind

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2018, 09:46:04 am »
+1

I asked a similar question earlier, and DXV himself replied that he had not proposed this 80/70/48 split of the basic treasure cards as official for higher player counts. I remembered that I had read it, but my recollection assumed things not to be assumed. In 1st edition, the original Intrigue rulebook came with the following text: "To set up for 5 or 6 players, combine the Treasure cards from Dominion and Dominion: Intrigue". I.e. 120C/80S/60G. In 2nd edition, it says the same, but with other words: "Add all of the extra Coppers, Silvers, and Golds from Base Cards (or the other copy of Dominion) to those piles".

If I remember correctly: When producing the 2nd edition Big Box, they had room for some extra treasures, and DXV decided to put in the arbitrary amounts of 80C/70S/48G. This was no attempt by him to define the number of treasure cards needed for 5- og 6-player games. It was simply what he decided to put into the Big Box, and this was limited by the available space in the tray (and the fact that cards are shrink-wrapped in amounts of 100). The box says: "...plus extra base cards for 5-6 players". Unless I've missed something, there is no mention of actually using 80C/70S/48G anywhere, but I accidentally read the above-mentioned box text to mean "these are the amounts of treasure cards to use with 5 or 6 players". It simply states that they included some extra base cards, in case you want to play with 5 or 6 players.

When it comes to victory cards, curses and ruins, the numbers are clearly defined (and I'm not including the Estates normally included in the players' starting decks, as these are omitted when playing with shelters).

Provinces
2p: 8.
3p, 4p: 12.
5p: 15.
6p: 18.

ALL other victory cards:
2p: 8.
3p, 4p, 5p, 6p: 12.


Curses and ruins
2p: 10.
3p: 20.
4p: 30.
5p: 40.
6p: 50.

The number of potions and platinum cards aren't mentioned, so I imagine they should always be used in amounts of 16 and 12, respectively, even if you happen to have the Base Cards product.
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Doom_Shark

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2018, 11:40:39 am »
0

Actually, Oyvind, the number of colonies should always be equal to the number of provinces
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Karpeth

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2018, 02:33:00 pm »
+1

Actually, Oyvind, the number of colonies should always be equal to the number of provinces

Actually no.

I hope DXV would confirm oyvind.
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GendoIkari

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2018, 02:56:12 pm »
+1

Actually, Oyvind, the number of colonies should always be equal to the number of provinces

Actually no.

I hope DXV would confirm oyvind.

You are correct. From the Prosperity Rulebook, second edition:

Quote
Use 8 copies of Colony for games with 2 players, 12 for games with 3 or more
players.

*Edit* First Edition rules say the same. And the rulebook is definitely aware of 5-6 player rule changes, because it describes the game ending on 4 empty piles in a 5-6 player game.
« Last Edit: September 21, 2018, 02:58:58 pm by GendoIkari »
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Karpeth

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2018, 04:28:28 pm »
0

Actually, Oyvind, the number of colonies should always be equal to the number of provinces

Actually no.

I hope DXV would confirm oyvind.

You are correct. From the Prosperity Rulebook, second edition:

Quote
Use 8 copies of Colony for games with 2 players, 12 for games with 3 or more
players.

*Edit* First Edition rules say the same. And the rulebook is definitely aware of 5-6 player rule changes, because it describes the game ending on 4 empty piles in a 5-6 player game.

It clearly states 3 or more players. That was not what I was refering to, but rather the number  of treasures.
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Donald X.

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2018, 05:12:11 pm »
+4

It seems we have different rules on This in different editions.

Intrigue, base cards and dominion second edition wants you to use 120 Copper, 80 silver, 60 gold, 30 estates, 12 duchies, 18 province and 50 curses and ruins.

Big box Two includes 100 extra cards, which are suppoused to bring the Numbers to 80 Copper, 70 silver, 48 gold, 30 estates, 12 duchies, 18 province and 50 curses and ruins.

Am I misinformed on the contests of big box II, or is There a discrepancy between the rules?
When Intrigue was a standalone, it had the same treasures as the main set. To go to 5-6 players, you combined them. This isn't because you needed twice as many treasures; it's just because that's how many additional treasures you had. If you instead got Base Cards, well, add those; again the exact amount you end up with is not something I ever felt was important.

Big Box #2 had so much space, it fit what it could fit. It does a fine job of having enough extra treasures for 5-6 players. If you want more, add more, I won't stop you. Just establish the size of the piles before playing and then don't change them.

It matters if a Treasure pile runs out, it has an effect on various cards and contributes to ending the game. But the intention is to mostly have them not run out. If it had been a computer game from day one, they would have been infinite. So, just have enough Treasures for 5-6, and don't worry about having a particular number.
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Cave-o-sapien

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #9 on: September 22, 2018, 04:45:02 pm »
0

It matters if a Treasure pile runs out, it has an effect on various cards and contributes to ending the game. But the intention is to mostly have them not run out. If it had been a computer game from day one, they would have been infinite. So, just have enough Treasures for 5-6, and don't worry about having a particular number.

I would miss Beggar/Tower.
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J Reggie

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #10 on: September 22, 2018, 09:32:42 pm »
+1

Then there could be a card that said "gain ∞ Coppers".

infangthief

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Re: 5-6 player number of cards.
« Reply #11 on: September 24, 2018, 04:57:36 am »
+1

Then there could be a card that said "gain ∞ Coppers".
And would playing such a card pile out the Coppers or not?
If so then it would seem a reasonable opening for a Duke game.
Either way, it combos nicely with Gardens.
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