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Author Topic: Weekly Design Contest Thread  (Read 228966 times)

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scolapasta

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4800 on: February 17, 2020, 11:39:33 pm »
+4

[Replaced by Gondolier v.0.3 below; which took the central reserve buy aspect of Shopper and put it on a Night card instead]


Entry for the week, Shopper, a terminal copper that lets you save a buy for when you need it.



This idea for this card started with me thinking about +Buy tokens. It occurred to me that a) they might be too powerful to have them on a card as just +1 Buy token (I called them Shoppers), and b) clearly you can't have then be on buy, because then you could just buy the whole pile (with Bridges in play). So why not reserve buys?

I'm very curious what people think of this card. As a terminal copper*, you really don't want it, but that reserve buy can be very powerful. And once you play it and goes onto the tavern mat, it's out of your deck (until you need that buy, of course).

* there's a reason that there are only a handful of official terminal coppers

I also liked the idea of my +1 Buy card costing just $1, since you might often have an extra $1 to buy a 2nd card - so the non reserve part needs to be weak. And it makes it interesting to Upgrade your coppers to this...

So what do you think?

Some (not mutually exclusive) possible tweaks:
forget the $1 cost and make it $2
add +1 Action, or alternatively make it a treasure
make it +$2 (though this would then
 have to cost $4 to compare with woodcutter)
give an additional +$1 when you call it

Lastly, official (all $2) cards to compare this to:
Coin of the realm - it's a treasure that reserves +2 Actions
Peasant - $1, and +1 Buy (though not reserve) - of course it's real strength is that it travels
Herbalist - $1, and +1 Buy (though not reserve) - it's extra is saving a treasure
Squire - one of the options is +2 Buys
« Last Edit: February 23, 2020, 03:48:44 pm by scolapasta »
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forkofnature

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4801 on: February 17, 2020, 11:50:24 pm »
0

It's a gold with a +buy. The Catch? You must use the buy. This means using this to spike high points doesn't work as well (you can do it, it will just come with a copper).

It took a long time to get the wording right but here's what I got. I wanted only the buys from this and your orginal buy to be mandatory (or else worker's villages/ Market Sqaures would really mess with this). If anyone has a better way of saying it please feel free to say so.

This doesn't really work as-is, mostly thanks to the fact that Villa can provide an uncertain future to your turn, which can prevent you from saying for sure whether it's possible for you to use all the necessary Buys if, say, the Coppers and Curses are gone.

I came up with the following: "At the end of your Buy phase, if this is in play, gain a Copper unless you've gained more cards this turn than you have Bulk Orders in play."

Since people were just going to take Coppers with their spare Buys anyway, this is mostly the same but uses less text and is easier to parse.
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kru5h

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4802 on: February 17, 2020, 11:57:06 pm »
+6

My submission for the +1 Buy contest.

forkofnature

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4803 on: February 18, 2020, 12:34:47 am »
+1

Entry for the week, Shopper, a terminal copper that lets you save a buy for when you need it.



This idea for this card started with me thinking about +Buy tokens. It occurred to me that a) they might be too powerful to have them on a card as just +1 Buy token (I called them Shoppers), and b) clearly you can't have then be on buy, because then you could just buy the whole pile (with Bridges in play). So why not reserve buys?

I'm very curious what people think of this card. As a terminal copper*, you really don't want it, but that reserve buy can be very powerful. And once you play it and goes onto the tavern mat, it's out of your deck (until you need that buy, of course).

* there's a reason that there are only a handful of official terminal coppers

I also liked the idea of my +1 Buy card costing just $1, since you might often have an extra $1 to buy a 2nd card - so the non reserve part needs to be weak. And it makes it interesting to Upgrade your coppers to this...

So what do you think?

Some (not mutually exclusive) possible tweaks:
forget the $1 cost and make it $2
add +1 Action, or alternatively make it a treasure
make it +$2 (though this would have to cost $4 to copper to woodcutter)
give an additional +$1 when you call it

Lastly, official (all $2) cards to compare this to:
Coin of the realm - it's a treasure that reserves +2 Actions
Peasant - $1, and +1 Buy (though not reserve) - of course it's real strength is that it travels
Herbalist - $1, and +1 Buy (though not reserve) - it's extra is saving a treasure
Squire - one of the options is +2 Buys

This is a cool idea but needs some work. Costing $1 is a little awkward because if you want this there probably isn't regular +Buy on the board, so you have to waste a bunch of coins on it even if you're responsible and pick it up early.

Honestly I think you could just make this give +$2 and have it cost $3. As far as I'm concerned Woodcutter lost its right to complain about being strictly worse than anything when it got excommunicated from the game.

But let's say you're an empathetic stickler. In that case, I'd make this cost $3 and either be a treasure or else give +2 Buys.
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naitchman

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4804 on: February 18, 2020, 12:44:04 am »
+1

It's a gold with a +buy. The Catch? You must use the buy. This means using this to spike high points doesn't work as well (you can do it, it will just come with a copper).

It took a long time to get the wording right but here's what I got. I wanted only the buys from this and your orginal buy to be mandatory (or else worker's villages/ Market Sqaures would really mess with this). If anyone has a better way of saying it please feel free to say so.

This doesn't really work as-is, mostly thanks to the fact that Villa can provide an uncertain future to your turn, which can prevent you from saying for sure whether it's possible for you to use all the necessary Buys if, say, the Coppers and Curses are gone.

I came up with the following: "At the end of your Buy phase, if this is in play, gain a Copper unless you've gained more cards this turn than you have Bulk Orders in play."

Since people were just going to take Coppers with their spare Buys anyway, this is mostly the same but uses less text and is easier to parse.

1) Not sure how villa makes a difference. Could you explain in more detail.
2) if coppers and curses are gone (which almost never happens) and you have no coins you can end your buy phase because of the part at the end "or you cannot buy any cards in the supply".
3) i thought of using something like that, however, first i feel it's a little clunky. Second this would have differences when stacking multiples. If you play 5 bulk orders and buy 5 cards, my version forces you to buy one copper, your version gains you 5 coppers.
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NoMoreFun

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4805 on: February 18, 2020, 12:49:46 am »
0



This is a great card, but why limit the below the line to Action phases? I don't think it would be too strong as a buy-cantrip (like Forum)
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forkofnature

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4806 on: February 18, 2020, 01:09:17 am »
0


1) Not sure how villa makes a difference. Could you explain in more detail.
2) if coppers and curses are gone (which almost never happens) and you have no coins you can end your buy phase because of the part at the end "or you cannot buy any cards in the supply".
3) i thought of using something like that, however, first i feel it's a little clunky. Second this would have differences when stacking multiples. If you play 5 bulk orders and buy 5 cards, my version forces you to buy one copper, your version gains you 5 coppers.

1 & 2) Ah, there was a miscommunication here. As written, the clause, "or you cannot buy any cards in the supply," presents an alternative to "you can't end your buy phase," rather than "you've gained x cards." That is, it says: "if you can't use all the necessary buys, you can't buy anything at all," rather than: "if you can't buy anything, the game is allowed to continue." You seem to be intending the latter, which makes a lot more sense  ;). Technically, you can fix this by removing the comma before "or you cannot buy any cards"; however, this would leave the sense ambiguous rather than clarifying your intended meaning, so I would still try something else.

3) As I understand it, once you've gained one copper, the rider, "unless you've gained more cards this turn than you have Bulk Orders in play" should block the other four triggers in your scenario. Is this not the case?
« Last Edit: February 18, 2020, 01:26:00 am by forkofnature »
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Doom_Shark

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4807 on: February 18, 2020, 02:59:58 am »
+3

I'm back again! Here's something probably not balanced that I slapped together at almost 2 am



Market Square's top with a minor trasher/spy thing below the line triggered by purchasing cards. Could probably use a cost adjustment. Original idea had just the spy bit and costed less, I decided it was lackluster and added the trashing option. Might go back to the original still, not sure yet, but it's 2 am where I live and I'm going to bed.
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NoMoreFun

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4808 on: February 18, 2020, 05:24:58 am »
+3

Entry for the week, Shopper, a terminal copper that lets you save a buy for when you need it.



How about making it a cantrip - not strictly better than Market Square as it doesn't have the reaction so you could cost it at $2 or $3 (at $4 you can get Fair which is like playing this every turn)

I think it's more interesting to have a card that invites you to play it multiple times than a card you would almost always want out of your deck until the endgame. Being "harmless" to your deck aids with that.

Another option is +2 Cards for $3 (which doesn't technically step on Woodcutter's toes even though it's probably a better card)
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naitchman

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4809 on: February 18, 2020, 08:06:58 am »
+1


1) Not sure how villa makes a difference. Could you explain in more detail.
2) if coppers and curses are gone (which almost never happens) and you have no coins you can end your buy phase because of the part at the end "or you cannot buy any cards in the supply".
3) i thought of using something like that, however, first i feel it's a little clunky. Second this would have differences when stacking multiples. If you play 5 bulk orders and buy 5 cards, my version forces you to buy one copper, your version gains you 5 coppers.

1 & 2) Ah, there was a miscommunication here. As written, the clause, "or you cannot buy any cards in the supply," presents an alternative to "you can't end your buy phase," rather than "you've gained x cards." That is, it says: "if you can't use all the necessary buys, you can't buy anything at all," rather than: "if you can't buy anything, the game is allowed to continue." You seem to be intending the latter, which makes a lot more sense  ;). Technically, you can fix this by removing the comma before "or you cannot buy any cards"; however, this would leave the sense ambiguous rather than clarifying your intended meaning, so I would still try something else.

3) As I understand it, once you've gained one copper, the rider, "unless you've gained more cards this turn than you have Bulk Orders in play" should block the other four triggers in your scenario. Is this not the case?

1 and 2) I woke up this morning with a sudden epiphany of our miscommunication and the technical ambiguity of my wording. Lemme see if I could phase it a little better.

3) You are correct. I'd assumed it would use buys and didn't notice you used gains instead. This creates it's own problems however, since you then aren't forced to use the buys if you gain cards during the turn with cards like magpie or workshop. The idea is to have a non optional buy.
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spineflu

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4810 on: February 18, 2020, 10:05:44 am »
+2



Royal Docks
Action/Duration - $5
+1 Buy
This turn, when you gain an Action card, you may set it aside under this.
While any cards remain under this, at the start of each of your turns, play one twice.

Note: Royal Docks remains in play until it doesn't have any cards under it and all the cards it plays are discarded from play, same as other Throne Room variants. If you play the same royal docks twice (with Throne Room), it's all set aside under the same docks, and you can play 2 cards from under it at the start of every turn. There is no way to set cards aside under a Royal Docks other than on the turn you play it.

This is a really cool card;
Also the computer programmer in me is very happy that you withdrew Queue because that's how a Collection-Iterator design pattern works, not a Queue.



Entry for the week, Shopper, a terminal copper that lets you save a buy for when you need it.



This idea for this card started with me thinking about +Buy tokens. It occurred to me that a) they might be too powerful to have them on a card as just +1 Buy token (I called them Shoppers), and b) clearly you can't have then be on buy, because then you could just buy the whole pile (with Bridges in play). So why not reserve buys?

I'm very curious what people think of this card. As a terminal copper*, you really don't want it, but that reserve buy can be very powerful. And once you play it and goes onto the tavern mat, it's out of your deck (until you need that buy, of course).

* there's a reason that there are only a handful of official terminal coppers

I also liked the idea of my +1 Buy card costing just $1, since you might often have an extra $1 to buy a 2nd card - so the non reserve part needs to be weak. And it makes it interesting to Upgrade your coppers to this...

So what do you think?

Some (not mutually exclusive) possible tweaks:
forget the $1 cost and make it $2
add +1 Action, or alternatively make it a treasure
make it +$2 (though this would then
 have to cost $4 to compare with woodcutter)
give an additional +$1 when you call it

Lastly, official (all $2) cards to compare this to:
Coin of the realm - it's a treasure that reserves +2 Actions
Peasant - $1, and +1 Buy (though not reserve) - of course it's real strength is that it travels
Herbalist - $1, and +1 Buy (though not reserve) - it's extra is saving a treasure
Squire - one of the options is +2 Buys


I think it's interesting the cards you picked to compare it to because when I read it, I immediately thought it was a reverse-Ducat - this gives $1 now and +1 Buy later, Ducat is +1 Buy now and a $1 later.

I think it's a hard sell as-is with it being terminal, especially on a board with no +Buys; Maybe do a reverse-Candlestick Maker and have it give +1 Action on play.



It's a gold with a +buy. The Catch? You must use the buy. This means using this to spike high points doesn't work as well (you can do it, it will just come with a copper).

It took a long time to get the wording right but here's what I got. I wanted only the buys from this and your orginal buy to be mandatory (or else worker's villages/ Market Sqaures would really mess with this). If anyone has a better way of saying it please feel free to say so.

Wording suggestion that changes the card a little but also streamlines it:
Quote
"If you have unused Buys at the start of Clean up, choose one: gain a Copper for each Bulk Order in play; gain a Copper for each unused Buy. (Do this once, rather than once per Bulk Order.)"
This changes its interaction with
other +buy cards
debt
Counting House - maybe you want more coppers - you can elect to do that with this.
removes ambiguity from "when is the end of your Buy phase?" with Villa.
buys used where you didn't buy cards - you bought events, etc. Less tracking for paper players.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2020, 11:53:14 am by spineflu »
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mail-mi

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4811 on: February 18, 2020, 10:24:20 am »
0



This is a great card, but why limit the below the line to Action phases? I don't think it would be too strong as a buy-cantrip (like Forum)

I was going for the self-synergy and uniqueness, you don't think it would be too strong?.
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GendoIkari

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4812 on: February 18, 2020, 11:10:09 am »
0



This is a great card, but why limit the below the line to Action phases? I don't think it would be too strong as a buy-cantrip (like Forum)

I was going for the self-synergy and uniqueness, you don't think it would be too strong?.

I dunno, playing 4 Highways might be too easy compared to playing 5 which is what's required to instant-drain Forum. Although on the other hand, instant-draining Forum is something you would want to do more often than you would want to instant-drain Atelier.
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naitchman

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4813 on: February 18, 2020, 12:10:09 pm »
+1

It's a gold with a +buy. The Catch? You must use the buy. This means using this to spike high points doesn't work as well (you can do it, it will just come with a copper).

It took a long time to get the wording right but here's what I got. I wanted only the buys from this and your orginal buy to be mandatory (or else worker's villages/ Market Sqaures would really mess with this). If anyone has a better way of saying it please feel free to say so.

Wording suggestion that changes the card a little but also streamlines it:
Quote
"If you have unused Buys at the start of Clean up, choose one: gain a Copper for each Bulk Order in play; gain a Copper for each unused Buy. (Do this once, rather than once per Bulk Order.)"
This changes its interaction with
other +buy cards
debt
Counting House - maybe you want more coppers - you can elect to do that with this.
removes ambiguity from "when is the end of your Buy phase?" with Villa.
buys used where you didn't buy cards - you bought events, etc. Less tracking for paper players.

I want to avoid this for 2 reasons.

1) The interaction with other buy cards. This card would become almost unusable if you had workers villages. The idea is to make it's own +buy mandatory, and leave your other + buys optional.
2) I want this to be used for its coin and buy not for a copper gaining ability. This could be used in conjunction with gardens to gain a lot of coppers (play 5 bulk orders, buy 5 cards, gain 5 coppers).
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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4814 on: February 18, 2020, 12:43:24 pm »
+7


Pretty self explanatory I hope. This can make you think about the order you buy things which is pretty cool (e.g. if you have $13 and are buying a Province and a $5 Action you should probably buy the Action first.)
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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4815 on: February 18, 2020, 12:53:26 pm »
+3


Pretty self explanatory I hope. This can make you think about the order you buy things which is pretty cool (e.g. if you have $13 and are buying a Province and a $5 Action you should probably buy the Action first.)

Actually, if not a lot of Provinces are gone from the Supply (by the time I get to have something like , I doubt that'd be true, but eh), I'd Buy the Province first just to force my opponents to reveal their hand, allowing me to more carefully select my second Buy in order to hurt them the most.  :P
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naitchman

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4816 on: February 18, 2020, 06:08:17 pm »
+1

Ok, so here is an updated version of my card which hopefully is a little more clear.


Technically if you can't buy curses or coppers (due to contraband or empty piles) and you have too few coins to buy something and you have coffers, you would be forced to use the coffers if it would allow you to buy cards. Not a likely case though.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4817 on: February 18, 2020, 06:21:33 pm »
+1


Pretty self explanatory I hope. This can make you think about the order you buy things which is pretty cool (e.g. if you have $13 and are buying a Province and a $5 Action you should probably buy the Action first.)

Actually, if not a lot of Provinces are gone from the Supply (by the time I get to have something like , I doubt that'd be true, but eh), I'd Buy the Province first just to force my opponents to reveal their hand, allowing me to more carefully select my second Buy in order to hurt them the most.  :P
I would buy the Province first with 3 Crooks in play, revealing a hand of 5 Patrons and giving them 15 coffers, but that's just me.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4818 on: February 18, 2020, 06:29:54 pm »
+1

I would buy the Province first with 3 Crooks in play, revealing a hand of 5 Patrons and giving them 15 coffers, but that's just me.

If there is a game with both Crook and Patron in it, then I'd definitely buy a card first with one or more Crook in play to ensure that no Patron from any player can ever be revealed.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4819 on: February 18, 2020, 06:43:32 pm »
+1

Ok, so here is an updated version of my card which hopefully is a little more clear.


Technically if you can't buy curses or coppers (due to contraband or empty piles) and you have too few coins to buy something and you have coffers, you would be forced to use the coffers if it would allow you to buy cards. Not a likely case though.

How does this work with having debt?
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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4820 on: February 18, 2020, 10:14:42 pm »
+1

Ok, so here is an updated version of my card which hopefully is a little more clear.


Technically if you can't buy curses or coppers (due to contraband or empty piles) and you have too few coins to buy something and you have coffers, you would be forced to use the coffers if it would allow you to buy cards. Not a likely case though.

How does this work with having debt?

I'm not 100% certain of your question. Can you give a specific case?
You would have to pay off debt and buy a card if possible. If not, you wouldn't have to pay off debt (but then again why would you not pay off debt?

Technically you could do cute tricks with debt to avoid the mandatory buy. If you have $6, you could buy one overlord and then end your buy phase (because you can't buy any cards). It's uncommon enough that I'm okay with it (like capital's loophole with Mandarin or herbalist).

Random aside:
I think I'm going to update the wording to count buys used rather than cards bought to include events and projects.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2020, 10:17:08 pm by naitchman »
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mail-mi

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4821 on: February 18, 2020, 11:32:45 pm »
0

Ok, so here is an updated version of my card which hopefully is a little more clear.


Technically if you can't buy curses or coppers (due to contraband or empty piles) and you have too few coins to buy something and you have coffers, you would be forced to use the coffers if it would allow you to buy cards. Not a likely case though.

How does this work with having debt?

I'm not 100% certain of your question. Can you give a specific case?
You would have to pay off debt and buy a card if possible. If not, you wouldn't have to pay off debt (but then again why would you not pay off debt?

Technically you could do cute tricks with debt to avoid the mandatory buy. If you have $6, you could buy one overlord and then end your buy phase (because you can't buy any cards). It's uncommon enough that I'm okay with it (like capital's loophole with Mandarin or herbalist).

Random aside:
I think I'm going to update the wording to count buys used rather than cards bought to include events and projects.

I was just wondering how it works with debt and your explanation makes sense.
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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4822 on: February 19, 2020, 08:54:33 am »
+1

New Idea.
The buy on this card is a little less crucial than I'd like, but having it there enables you to grab one of these in order to dump a province in the trash and then buy that province that turn. Or similar. Just in case the trash is empty of cards you want.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2020, 08:56:38 am by somekindoftony »
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Saul Goodman

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4823 on: February 19, 2020, 09:16:47 am »
0


Pretty self explanatory I hope. This can make you think about the order you buy things which is pretty cool (e.g. if you have $13 and are buying a Province and a $5 Action you should probably buy the Action first.)

I like this.  Wonder if it is too powerful the way it is written.  Maybe limit to the first buy?  Or the first two?  On a heavy buy turn, this could gut the opponent's hand.
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grep

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Re: Weekly Design Contest Thread
« Reply #4824 on: February 19, 2020, 11:17:11 am »
+2

New Idea.
The buy on this card is a little less crucial than I'd like, but having it there enables you to grab one of these in order to dump a province in the trash and then buy that province that turn. Or similar. Just in case the trash is empty of cards you want.

It's "+3 Coffers, you cannot buy cards this turn" most of the time. This might be great for megaturns, comparable to Tactician, but only having another source of +Buys. This card itself could be an enabler if it had "+2 Buys" on buy.
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