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Author Topic: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (Game Over!)  (Read 6716 times)

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DatSwan

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1100 on: October 11, 2018, 02:44:15 am »

Note that WCD is painted in green for all VC's below:

Day 1:

Vote count 1.1

silverspawn (2): Awaclus, EFHW
ashersky (2): 2.71828....., Morgrim7
Morgrim7 (1): chairs
2.71828..... (1) silverspawn
Not voting (8): Galzria, SpaceAnemone, gkrieg13, DatSwan, iguanaiguana, Hydrad, WestCoastDidds, ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am

Vote count 1.2

silverspawn (2): Awaclus, EFHW
ashersky (1): Morgrim7
Morgrim7 (2): chairs, SpaceAnemone
2.71828..... (1) silverspawn
WestCoastDidds (1): gkrieg13
DatSwan (1): Hydrad
iguanaiguana (1): 2.71828.....
Not voting (5): Galzria, DatSwan, iguanaiguana, WestCoastDidds, ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am

Vote count 1.3

silverspawn (2): Awaclus, EFHW
ashersky (1): Morgrim7
Morgrim7 (2): chairs, SpaceAnemone
2.71828..... (1) silverspawn
iguanaiguana (2): 2.71828....., Hydrad
EFHW (1): gkrieg13
Not voting (5): Galzria, DatSwan, iguanaiguana, WestCoastDidds, ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am

Vote count 1.4

Morgrim7 (2): chairs, SpaceAnemone
iguanaiguana (2): 2.71828....., Hydrad
EFHW (2): gkrieg13, Awaclus
Awaclus (1): silverspawn
silverspawn (1) EFHW
Not voting (6): Galzria, DatSwan, iguanaiguana, WestCoastDidds, ashersky, Morgrim7

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am

Vote count 1.5

Morgrim7 (1):, SpaceAnemone
iguanaiguana (1): Hydrad
EFHW (1): gkrieg13
WestCoastDidds (2): iguanaiguana, chairs
silverspawn (4): Awaclus, Morgrim7, 2.71828....., EFHW
Galzria (1): DatSwan
ashersky (1): silverspawn
2.71828..... (1): WestCoastDidds
Not voting (2): Galzria, ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am

Vote count 1.6

Morgrim7 (1):, SpaceAnemone
WestCoastDidds (1): Hydrad
silverspawn (5): Awaclus, 2.71828....., EFHW, chairs, gkrieg13
Galzria (1): DatSwan
ashersky (1): silverspawn
2.71828..... (1): WestCoastDidds
SpaceAnemone (1): iguanaiguana
chairs (1): Morgrim7
Not voting (2): Galzria, ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am. This is in 26 hours

Vote count 1.7

Morgrim7 (1):, SpaceAnemone
WestCoastDidds (1): Hydrad
silverspawn (5): Awaclus, 2.71828....., EFHW, chairs, gkrieg13
Galzria (1): DatSwan
chairs (4): Morgrim7, silverspawn, WestCoastDidds, iguanaiguana
Not voting (2): Galzria, ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am. This is in 23 hours

Vote count 1.8

Morgrim7 (1):, SpaceAnemone
WestCoastDidds (1): Hydrad
silverspawn (3): Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg13
Galzria (1): DatSwan
chairs (4): Morgrim7, silverspawn, WestCoastDidds, iguanaiguana
Hydrad (3): Galzria, chairs, 2.71828.....
Not voting (1): ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am. This is in 17 hours

Vote count 1.9

Morgrim7 (1): SpaceAnemone
silverspawn (3): Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg13
Galzria (1): DatSwan
chairs (1): Hydrad
Awaclus (7): iguanaiguana, Galzria, silverspawn, chairs, Morgrim7, WestCoastDidds, 2.71828.....
Not voting (1): ashersky

With 14 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day 1 ends, Tuesday, 18th of September, at 7am. This is in 5 hours

Vote count 1.final

Morgrim7 (1): SpaceAnemone
silverspawn (3): Awaclus, EFHW, gkrieg13
Galzria (1): DatSwan
Awaclus (8): iguanaiguana, Galzria, silverspawn, chairs, Morgrim7, WestCoastDidds, 2.71828....., Hydrad
Not voting (1): ashersky

With 14 alive, it took 8 to lynch.

------------------------------

Thoughts from D1:

- End of Day (1.Final & 1.9): Either the entire wagon on Awaclus was town (I'm discounting Chairs vote here in the hunt for Mafia, as Mafia would've assumed Chairs to be town - thus their choice to be involved with the Awaclus wagon or not would not have been impacted by Chairs being on wagon or not), or Morgrim/Hydrad are scum. From everybody else's perspective, I could be scum on the Awaclus wagon as well, which would honestly be a decent argument against me (especially from the claimed Mason's). The "all town wagon" is rare, but not impossible - it's more common in a rush to get a lynch through at deadline, and it's especially possible given that we are talking about Awaclus as the lynch.
- In vote counts 1.2 & 1.3, either all scum are voting, or Datswan is scum (or again, possibly me from your perspective). This isn't hard to believe if you think Morgrim/Hydrad are scum, but it's worth noting.
- Similar, with the Silver wagon in 1.6 & 1.7, either it's an all town wagon (again, Chair's vote excluded for the purposes of this exercise), or EFHW is scum.
- With the two points above, either all non-voters were town (1.2/1.3), in which case the scum team is either [Hydrad/Morgrim] or [Space/EFHW], or Swan is scum | And either all Silver voters were town (1.6/1.7), in which case the scum team is either [Hydrad/Morgrim] or [Space/Swan], or EFHW is scum.

******************************
Note that MORGRIM is painted PURPLE for all VOTES in the VC's below, due to being controlled by Chairs.

Day 2:

Vote count 2.1

silverspawn (1): gkrieg13
WestCoastDidds (1): silverspawn
Not voting (9): Galzria, SpaceAnemone, EFHW, DatSwan, Hydrad, Morgrim7, chairs, 2.71828....., WestCoastDidds

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am

Vote count 2.2

silverspawn (2): gkrieg13, Galzria
WestCoastDidds (1): silverspawn
Morgrim7 (2): chairs, SpaceAnemone
2.71828..... (1): EFHW
Not voting (5): DatSwan, Hydrad, Morgrim7, 2.71828....., WestCoastDidds

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am

Vote count 2.3

silverspawn (2): gkrieg13, Galzria
WestCoastDidds (1): silverspawn
Morgrim7 (3): chairs, SpaceAnemone, Morgrim7
2.71828..... (1): EFHW
Not voting (4): DatSwan, Hydrad, 2.71828....., WestCoastDidds

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am

Vote count 2.3

silverspawn (2): gkrieg13, Galzria
WestCoastDidds (1): silverspawn
Morgrim7 (2): chairs, SpaceAnemone
2.71828..... (1): EFHW
Not voting (5): DatSwan, Hydrad, 2.71828....., WestCoastDidds, Morgrim7

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am

Vote count 2.4

silverspawn (2): gkrieg13, Galzria
WestCoastDidds (2): silverspawn, Hydrad
Morgrim7 (1): chairs
Galzria (2): SpaceAnemone, DatSwan
SpaceAnemone (1): EFHW
DatSwan (1): WestCoastDidds
Hydrad (1): Morgrim7
Not voting (1): 2.71828.....

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am

Vote count 2.5

silverspawn (3): gkrieg13, Galzria, Morgrim7
WestCoastDidds (2): silverspawn, Hydrad
Galzria (2): SpaceAnemone, DatSwan
DatSwan (1): WestCoastDidds
Not voting (3): 2.71828....., chairs, EFHW

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am

Vote count 2.6

silverspawn (2): gkrieg13, Galzria
WestCoastDidds (3): silverspawn, Hydrad, Morgrim7
Galzria (1): SpaceAnemone
Hydrad (2): 2.71828....., chairs
Not voting (3): EFHW, WestCoastDidds, DatSwan

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am

Vote count 2.7

silverspawn (2): gkrieg13, Galzria
WestCoastDidds (2): silverspawn, Hydrad
Galzria (2): SpaceAnemone, Morgrim7
Hydrad (3): 2.71828....., chairs, WestCoastDidds
Not voting (2): EFHW, DatSwan

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch. Day 2 ends Thursday, 27th of September, at 4am. This is in 10 hours.

Vote count 2.final

WestCoastDidds (6): Hydrad, 2.71828....., gkrieg13, Galzria, silverspawn, SpaceAnemone
Galzria (1): Morgrim7
Hydrad (4): chairs, WestCoastDidds, EFHW, DatSwan

With 11 alive, it took 6 to lynch.

------------------------------

Thoughts from D2:

- I'm really just not picking up on anything D2. Everything seems so scattered, no matter what I look for in teams. Two small things that catch my eye: The first place that Chairs moves Morgrim's vote is onto Morgrim himself, where Chairs is already voting. The second place Chairs moves Morgrim's vote is onto Hydrad, where Chairs spends most of his day voting (including at deadline). This again, seems like a strong coincidence to just be random chance on Chairs part... but my follow up thought to that is... why in the world would Traitor!Chairs steal his own teammates vote? Like, that's just awful from a strategic standpoint. Note that from VC 2.5 to 2.6 Chairs moves Morgrim's vote but does NOT move his own - and he chooses NOT place Morgrim onto Hydrad's wagon with him (in what would've made Hydrad the leading wagon by 2 votes, and placed him to L-2), instead choosing to place Morgrim's vote onto me, where it stayed until the end of the day.

******************************
Note that on Day 3, I don't know who, if anybody, had their vote controlled by Chairs, so everybody here is colored normally.

Day 3:

Vote count 3.1

EFHW (1): chairs
chairs (1): EFHW
DatSwan (1): SpaceAnemone
gkrieg13 (1): DatSwan
Not voting (3): Galzria, Hydrad, Morgrim7

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 3 ends Saturday, 6th of October, at 5am

Vote count 3.2

DatSwan (1): SpaceAnemone
Galzria (1): Hydrad
gkrieg13 (1): Galzria
Not voting (4): Morgrim7, chairs, DatSwan, EFHW

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 3 ends Saturday, 6th of October, at 5am

Vote count 3.3

DatSwan (1): SpaceAnemone
gkrieg13 (1): EFHW
EFHW (3): Hydrad, Galzria, DatSwan
Not voting (2): Morgrim7, chairs

With 8 alive, it takes 5 to lynch. Day 3 ends Saturday, 6th of October, at 5am. That's in 2 hours.

Vote count 3.final

DatSwan (1): SpaceAnemone
EFHW (3): Hydrad, Galzria, DatSwan
chairs (1): EFHW
Not voting (2): Morgrim7, chairs

With 8 alive, it should've taken 5 to lynch.

------------------------------

Thoughts from D3:
- Morgrim never voted: Is this correct?
- One could argue that if EFHW is scum, Space is their likeliest partner, as that time of day is generally when Space is up and around, and we shouldn't have gone to no-lynch there. But it's not entirely impossible that, given the deadline, Datswan could be partnered with EFHW here. He could've been banking on a likely no lynch, with a worst case scenario of bussing his partner (when there wasn't much need to do so). Scum were easily ahead in the game at that point, and this would be the perfect setup to bus with a high-probability of not actually lynching.
- On the flip side, if EFHW is town, then scum is almost certainly messed up the chance to win the game, as either a [Swan/Space] pairing should've both been on the EFHW wagon to attempt to secure the lynch, or the same can be said of a [Hydrad/Morgrim] pairing.
-I'm really curious on the Morgrim not voting D3 thing though. That's just really, really bad if he's town.

******************************

Blaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah. I *ALMOST* hit the
  • button on the browser window when switching back to this tab for the LAST Day 3 VC. I would've rage thrown my computer across the room.

Soooo...

Day 1 Lynch: Hydrad!Morgrim and Galz are on the wagon. Swan and Space are off. Ashes is being controlled, and not voting.

Day 2 Lynch: Hydrad, Galz, and Space are on the wagon. Swan AND EFHW are off. Morgrim is being controlled, and the only vote on Galz.

Day 3 *no*Lynch: Hydrad, Galz, Swan are trying to lynch EFHW. Space is on Swan. EFHW is on Chairs. Morgrim and Chairs are not voting. IDK what to make of this one.
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DatSwan

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1101 on: October 11, 2018, 02:44:39 am »

forgot to snip that last one sorry.
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EFHW

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1102 on: October 11, 2018, 07:24:14 am »

I come away from Galzria's chairs analysis thinking chairs did not know who his partners were.  I also don't this assuming that he did know. "What if" is useful, but it feels like Galz forgets he is doing a what if. Same with assuming that wagons can't be all town.
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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1103 on: October 11, 2018, 07:25:37 am »

* "I also don't like this assuming ..."
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EFHW

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1104 on: October 11, 2018, 07:29:04 am »

Day 3 chairs did say he had vote-targeted e!, who had just died. It would have been safest for him to claim his real target.
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Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1105 on: October 11, 2018, 12:57:11 pm »

Forgot to charge up my computer last night, so I'm starting this with only 53%. Will do the team pairs I can until it dies on me.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1106 on: October 11, 2018, 01:31:55 pm »

Hi all! I'm busy tonight hosting a games night (yay, Haddock's coming!), then tomorrow night I have a leaving do for a colleague, and then Sat-Sun I'm properly VLA because my a cappella group has a gig in Bruges, so we're doing an overnight trip to the continent, which is somewhat nuts, and means I'll be computerless. That means time is limited :-(

@Galz, you asked for a VC highlighting places where I disagree with the main VC, I think. I can't do that because my script doesn't parse out anything to do with the main VC. I can do a post that is every voting state through the game as it would have been counted if there were no behind-the-scenes shenanigans, though -- does that suit your needs at all?
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Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1107 on: October 11, 2018, 03:44:12 pm »

Player: Space
Possible Pairs: {EFHW, Datswan}

D1:

Through post #403 (22/98 for Space, including pregame), Space has not interacted with either EFHW or Datswan in any meaningful way (One comment agreeing with EFHW that Silver seemed odd for focusing so much on Bart, and one comment to EFHW about the show itself). I made this my first cut point because Space did a reread on two players immediately prior to this, and stated a desire to do a reread on two others in this post - while it's all of mild value, those four players were: Chairs, Morgrim, Hydrad, Silver. This is also Space's last post for D1 (didn't realize this above when I stopped to write. :P ). The only vote that Space ever cast, for the entirety of D1, was their first post in #85 where they voted for Morgrim. The post at #403 was on September 17th, at 7:30pm FT, approximately 11 1/2 hours to deadline D1. At this point in time theirs was the only vote on Morgrim and in no way was it helping us towards a lynch. The actual hammer on Awaclus was cast on September 18th at 3:00am, 4 hours prior to deadline, and 7 1/2 hours after Space's previous post. According to Space's post at #403, deadline would've been around noon for them, so the lynch occured around 8:00am. My biggest problem with Space from D1 is simply that they did... nothing - like, at all. I'll grant that the majority of what ended up being Awaclus's lynch occured during the time that Space was most likely asleep - but even in their last post before going to bed the night before the deadline... there was no attempt at really finding scum. The only vote they cast being on Morgrim from their first post D1 just really doesn't help matters. As far as pairings go - at least from a Space-to-X view, there's nothing to match them with either Swan or EFHW.

D2:

Space was the first person to post out of the gates on D2, at #426:
Urgh, busy night. Seems reasonably likely that ash was the NK and Iguana died by targeting the wrong person while in human form. I need to read back to work out who Iguana would have been scumreading, and work out whether he'd have played to die as a way of catching scum at all anyway, especially with a randomly switching role like that.

If that leaves Ash as the NK, then it kind of points to older players who're more aware of his big meta. I don't see Ash as that big and scary a target, and I suspect others who think a bit more like me (silver, for isntance) would leave him be as scum just because he has a high chance of lying to town and self-destructing even as town.

Then there's the good old "why didn't Galz/gkrieg die?" thing. There's bound to be wifom in here somewhere along the line, though. More reading and thinking when I'm not at work...

I actually responded to this post at the time (see: #432), and what struck me as off about the entire post then still does now: At the time, there was really no reason to assume that Ash was a scum kill and Igu was a WV death. I mean, it was a possibility, sure - but so were a lot of other things. SK, Vig, PGO, etc - It simply feels off to me to instantly jump to the conclusion that Space did simply because there's evidence of the possibility that the suggested outcome occurred - without considering the potential for unknown possibilities, especially in an RMM. It felt then as it does now - that Space already knew that Ash was the NK, so quickly jumped to why they felt Igu must've died.

It also feels as if both Space's second and third statement in that quote are designed to create WIFOM - certainly there's no real measure of support to either opinion - the second of which has simply been false recently, and the first of which could be stated exactly opposite (ie. "I think the newer players are more likely to have killed Ash at night because they're afraid of the legend - whereas older players know how to deal with him"). I just felt like neither statement had any actual value in the process of helping find scum, but more than that, were designed to cast shade without any real support.

Space DOES spend a LOT of time defending Silver right out of the gates Day 2, which does suggest that Silver had in fact visited them Night 1. The problem is, I would expect Space to do this as either alignment because it would look weird to Silver if they didn't. Still, this does at least support Space's claim regarding Silver.

The majority of the middle of the day is spent talking about vote scripts and what amounted to Chairs controlling Morgrim's vote. Post #620 is Space's first (and thusfar only) interaction with or mention of Datswan... but it's a nothing post. Post #633 continue's this little "feud" between them - it could definitely be forced interaction from teammates that have realized they have no interactions thusfar:

Swan unvote was not registered.

I already posted about this, and we have confirmation from LaLight back at post #530 that the unvote was not supposed to have been missed out.

I also posted about the Ash one at #146, but if there was another one with Hydrad then I missed it.
Galz and gkrieg seem entrenched in their silver case.

I've left my "test vote" on Galz because I think he's being lazy about giving a good justification. Gkrieg is trying harder, at least, but I still don't think it's enough to go on.

I'm not saying I think silver is conf!town, but I'm saying I'm not interested in the cases on him today.

yes I know, I wasn't trying to dissolve your previous comments. I was just reading through from start to finish and posting all of it as I went.

Yeah, but it's nicer for other people if you flag your intentions up-front. To me it totally looked like you were ignoring stuff I'd said ~90 posts ago, filling the thread with a load of stuff that's purely mechanical and offers no insight or conversation to the other people in the thread, and boils down to one little post where you say "hey, here are three points where things don't make sense".

One little post saying "I found these three voting mismatches, and I wonder why Space missed the Hydrad one? Maybe they're scum together!" would have been a much better way of getting some engagement going. Flooding the thread with stuff that the conversational people aren't interested in re-reading, verifying or engaging with, in a game that's already stalling pretty badly, doesn't actually seem all that pro-town.

In #688 Space moves their vote from me to Hydrad, while noting that they preferred to lynch Morgrim, me, or Gkrieg. In #786 Space moved from Hydrad to WCD to help get the lynch through.

D2 is where I first really started to feel like Space was scum, and was definitely where I was going to pull much of my case on them from when I was talking about it D3 prior to claims. Space and I simply read the game state completely differently day 2. I thought that it was naive of Space not to consider other options regarding the N1 deaths, Space thought it was presumptuous of me to believe that there might be without any evidence. I felt that, given Morgrim's posts, there was enough evidence there to support a case on Silver being scum - Space felt that, given their knowledge that Silver visited them Night 1, my evidence was circumstantial at best, and unsupported directly by Morgrim himself. Space wanted to lynch me, and the people I read as town, while they defended the person that I wanted to lynch, and the people I thought were scum. We were about as polar opposite as you can get on Day 2. As far as interactions go, Space continues to have next to nothing in regards to interactions with EFHW, and the interactions that they have with Datswan D2 are extremely limited - although the nitpick points of contention between the two definitely feel like they could be a forced interaction.

D3:

Space opens in #808 by claiming that Silver had visited them N1, which explains their read on Silver for all of D2. It still bothers me that there's no breadcrumb from Silver to support this - especially after Silver made such a big deal about Iguana NOT leaving a breadcrumb on D1. But if you re-read D2 from Space it does SEEM like Space's assertion that Silver visited them is accurate.

In #809, Space continues to attack my case on Silver by misrepresenting what I had said - I never claimed it was based on Morgrim having Tracker evidence, I had said that I suspected Morgrim of having *some form of cop like results*, which could be, but wasn't limited to: Tracker, Watcher, Cop, etc. Space claims that my speculation was "totally unfounded", and yet I would still argue that anybody reading Morgrim from D2, knowing that they had claimed SOME form of "Detective" would read his posts to STRONGLY suggest they had a result on Silver.

By this point I had been feeling like Space was going out of their way to discredit me, and had been since the very beginning of day 2 when they opened with what was essentially the WIFOM suggesting it was weird that I wasn't yet dead. It felt like they had decided on an agenda to get me lynched, and they were going to push it regardless of the cases/evidence of what I was saying. I'll fully admit that I was wrong about Morgrim having a result on Silver Day 2 - but I do not feel that I was at all wrong in reading Morgrim as telegraphing that he did, and moreover, given the limited amount of information that we had to work with up to that point, I don't think it was at all wrong of me to find this sort of evidence compelling enough to push a case. In #822, Space continues to frame the pushing of the cases on Silver as scummy, saying that Gkrieg and I had been on a "Witch Hunt" to get Silver lynched.

D3 continues with EFHW finding the "breadcrumb" from Silver on Datswan, and in #847 Space jumps on it:
I think the breadcrumb that EFHW posted is very plausible, so my test vote can be Vote: Datswan :-)

Between #847 & #901, Space makes 6 different posts talking about the breadcrumb that Silver left that implicate Swan as scum. While I agree very much with the strength of the breadcrumb (as far as breadcrumbs go), I find it very off-putting that Space wants to put so much weight in this crumb, but cannot show where Silver made a similar crumb about Space on D1 - I mean, in a vacuum, sure, this is great. But I find it difficult to find the argument that "Silver said he would leave great breadcrumbs, and here's a great breadcrumb, so Swan must be Swan. Also, he targeted me Night 1, and you all will just have to believe me because Silver didn't breadcrumb it" to be credible. I'm just left feeling like Space will call things out when they're convenient for them, and ignore things when they aren't - something that strikes me as a particularly scummy trait. WITH that said, I do feel like this makes a Space/Swan pairing a little LESS likely, unless Space felt really compelled to push this argument against their partner - which would only be the case if they felt the evidence was completely damning. Maybe they did? I dunno. But to me it takes away from this potential pairing.

DatSwan
EFHW
Space
gkrieg
chairs
Galz

I find the ordering quite funny, because my leading hypothesis at the moment is that Swan and Galz are scumbuddies... it's so uncharacteristic of Swan not to be super-suspicious of Galz, and we have a breadcrumb from a dead WV on Swan. And then there's Galz's awful silver case, which he built on top of allegedly reading incorrectly into Morgrim's posts.. If Galz is that great at reading the finer details, why was he missing all my "it's not silver" subtext at the same time? I think he was looking to build a mislynch case, rather than trying to read into the game that subtly. And why is Galz not engaging with the breadcrumb conversation?

At least Morgrim and I agree that Swan is looking scummy. If I were dictating the order, I'd suggest something more along the lines of:

Swan
Galz
chairs
gkrieg
EFHW
Space
Morgrim
Hydrad

As it is, masons, do you have daychat? If so, I think you should be debating this in your own QT, then presenting town with a finished list, rather than musing openly in here.

Responding to the bold above (which I never did at the time, but was planning on it when making the case against Space): Because there was no evidence, circumstantial or not, to support your read on Silver! Day 2 was essentially (Me): "Here's all these posts from a claimed Detective suspecting Silver - so I'm going to go out on a limb and say he probably has result implicating Silver but doesn't want to fully out himself so he's not full claiming at this time". (You): "No, you're wrong, Silver is town". It was your word/read against a claimed detective that was beating the same drum the entire day! I had far more reason to trust Morgrim than to trust you!

In #938 & #941 Space tries slightly to distance themselves from harping about the breadcrumb implicating Swan as scum - making sure it's noted that EFHW is the one that found the crumb, not them. But as I noted above, while that may be true, Space definitely jumped on and pushed the breadcrumb. These two things combined though (Space pushing it first, and then trying to distance themselves after) definitely leave me feeling like the [Space/Swan] team is less likely. If they were partners, then either Space wouldn't have pushed the crumb at all, trying to avoid a Swan lynch, or they would've wanted to make sure they got credit for it later if Swan DID get lynched. This makes any potential scum team here most likely to be [Space/EFHW].

In #955 Space claims Dirk, which is when/where I decided NOT to push a case against them yesterday (despite the massive AtE that they open the post with). When I was Samurai Jack in the game of the same name, I felt that claiming the titular character D1 would make it extremely unlikely that I was fake-claiming (and I wasn't - I was SJ, and was town). While this isn't a D1 claim, it's the first claim based off Morgrim's ordering - and either Space was given Dirk as a fakeclaim, and they know Dirk isn't in the game (possible), or they are town and telling the truth. Given that we hadn't had/seen any scum death's at this point, it seemed reasonable to remove Space from the lynch pool yesterday based simply on their flavor claim.

Most of the rest of Space's day consists of talking about the claims and asking questions about how exactly powers work - something I would expect from both town and scum. Space concludes that their biggest two scum reads after the claims are Chairs and Datswan (#995).

Space's last post was on October 5th at 7:21pm FT, which is consistent with when they usually go to sleep. Deadline was on October 6th at 5:00am FT - which was 9 1/2 hours after Space posted. That would've been around 10:00am FT for Space. EFHW was by far the likeliest candidate to get lynched at that point (sitting at 3 votes) - while I cannot hold Space solely responsible for the fact that we went to no lynch (especially as EFHW still needed TWO votes to lynch), it is odd that Space didn't even check in knowing we were this close to deadline.

******************************

And that's about all I have for now. I'm down to 13% so won't get to Datswan/EFHW until later today. To conclude on the reread though, I do definitely see things that point towards Space potentially being scum. If they ARE scum, I feel like the their partner is much more likely to be EFHW and not Datswan. There are almost no interactions with EFHW on D1 or D2, and while there are a few mentions of / interactions with EFHW on D3, they're mostly to agree with things EFHW has said - they aren't really engaging with EFHW. Combined with Space's absence at deadline yesterday when EFHW was the most likely lynch, I could definitely see this pair being possible. I feel like if the pair were [Space/Swan] then Space definitely would've found the time to log in and vote for EFHW before deadline yesterday.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9

SpaceAnemone

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1108 on: October 11, 2018, 07:56:44 pm »

Maybe I've been too careless, but I thought that given I'm the titular character, which I left a breadcrumb for early on, then I was going to be able to IC myself without too much difficulty. My power itself is pretty useless, so I kind of took the pseudo-IC-ness to be a useful part of my role. I don't think I'd have had the confidence to do stuff like attempt to dictate the order that claims should go in if I wasn't feeling that I've been pretty darn townie :-P

In response to a few things Galz has said:
Deadlines: have been painful for me this game, because I'm entirely a night owl. I wake around 9am typically (on a weekday; later on a weekend given the chance), but I'm not functional till later in the day, so thinking to check in is rare unless I'm so invested that it actually negatively impacts my sleep so that I wake early and have to suffer the rest of the day tired, which I hate, so I try to avoid needing to do that. Usually I'm here around 10pm-midnight, though at times like now it gets later than that.

D1: I was legitimately busy and not really engaging with a lot, and I struggle with D1s more than later play anyway. You may well be right that I didn't engage with Swan or EFHW, but did I really engage with all of other players that much more?

I don't recall exactly when my suspicions of Galz happened, but my notes from D2 say "Swan hasn't been complaining about/being suspicious of Galz. I think that means both he and Galz are scum." Coming from that standpoint, his claim to have "found" a way by reading Morgrim that meant that he thought he had a strong silver case, while not reading the same amount into anything I was saying really did feel off. I mean, I'm using the past tense here only because I can't see Farah not being in the game, and I do think the claimed protective role makes a lot of sense with the number of possible deaths. Otherwise, I think it's a terrible idea to base pretty much an entire case off someone else's careless posts, and then not at least pause to reconsider when that person failed to show up. To me it just looked too much like Morgrim (my scum read from D1) and Galz were colluding to mislynch silver. Sorry if you see it differently, but that was my honest read of the situation.

Galz's re-read of my does rather miss the point that I didn't collaborate lynch the actual townie I thought wasn't super-scummy, and did correctly lynch the third-party person who even the mafia (and whatever traitors etc we have) couldn't have known wasn't town, so my actions were pro-town.

As for the no-lynch, I took my eye off the ball there. Nobody was posting about how close the deadline was.. I'd posted early in the day from work, and then there had only been about 20 posts from the rest of you the whole day before I came back in here late at night. I still had a lot of questions about how the various roles could work (like whether EFHW could target gkreig to find out if he was secretly female and therefore our Bart candidate), and I just hadn't noticed when I went to bed that I wasn't going to get a chance to digest the answers to those questions and move my vote. It was 11am my time, but it was a weekend, and I was sorely in need of some sleep and relaxation after a very heavy week, so I didn't even set an alarm. I was quite miffed when I realised it was a no-lynch given that I was sitting on a perfectly good lynch target all the way through, but I got over it by the time we started D4.

Last thing before sleep: the silver breadcrumb. I don't know why he didn't breadcrumb me D1, but it's not the most un-silver-like thing to realise he'd not played optimally, to regret that, and then to broadcast the correct way to play back into the game, like him schooling us all on what he should have done! That was my internal explanation for it during D2, especially after his obvious crumb was exposed. That breadcrumb is just so much exactly what he said he'd do, and so obviously deliberate in retrospect. So even if you think I might be scummy, why are you ignoring what conf!town!silver did? I mean, yes, there might be redirects in play -- and there needs to be something like that to explain the masons' weird results -- but if you're letting Swan off the hook for that, then also consider that silver may have breadcrumbed someone else D1 and been redirected onto me, but nobody else is claiming to have been targeted, and he's still alive, meaning that it should still make you consider that he targeted me, since scum trying to make up that they'd received a WV when there was only a low chance of it having happened seems far-fetched, especially so early in the game, and especially if that scum is me, who you know is a don't-take-risks sort of scum player at best.
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Congratulations! Your SpaceAnemone evolved into UniverseAnemone!
Town games: M84(L), M85(W), M86(L), M87(W), M88(L), M90(L), M92(W), M94(L), M97(L), M99(W), M100(L), M104(W), M107(W), M110(L), M112(L), RMM37(L), RMM40(D), RMM41(L), RMM43(L), RMM47(W), ZM23(W).
Scum games: M89(D), M108(L), NM8(W&MVP), NM10(L)   Mod: NM9, RMM38, RMM42.   Pronouns: they/them

Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1109 on: October 11, 2018, 09:22:11 pm »

Space, still from phone so not doing more than just responding -

Please donít take my post on you to mean that I think you are the best candidate to lynch today to find scum. I hope to do a equal  evaluation of everybody, and for this exercise I am intentionally being unfair towards my rereads, as Iím looking for the most likely scum narrative and the most likely scum teams. This does not mean that I think you must be scum, simply that I see a narrative where you and EFHW could be partners. You just happened to be first on my reread, but please be assured you wonít be alone, and Iím not out to criminalize you specifically.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9

LaLight

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (N1)
« Reply #1110 on: October 12, 2018, 08:39:32 am »

Vote count 4.2

Morgrim7 (1): DatSwan
Galzria (1): Galzria
Not voting (4): SpaceAnemone, EFHW, Hydrad, Morgrim7

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 4 ends Monday, 15th of October, at 11am.
Logged
Wow where is all this LaLight love coming from all of the sudden?

Wins: 11, 6
Losses: 9, 4, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 3
Mod/Co-mod: 16

I always have a limited access to forum on weekends.

Hydrad

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (N1)
« Reply #1111 on: October 12, 2018, 08:42:12 am »

Vote count 4.2

Morgrim7 (1): DatSwan
Galzria (1): Galzria
Not voting (4): SpaceAnemone, EFHW, Hydrad, Morgrim7

With 6 alive, it takes 4 to lynch. Day 4 ends Monday, 15th of October, at 11am.

So being more aware this time. We might have to lynch on the weekend or early Monday so we can't leave it supernlast minute   
Logged
For anyone else, such a statement would be a scum tell.  For Hydrad, it's simply a tell that you're reading something from Hydrad.

DatSwan

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1112 on: October 12, 2018, 04:41:31 pm »

Galz and i will also be a little VLA at a company conference starting tomorrow evening.

We could ask for a day extension?
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Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1113 on: October 12, 2018, 11:27:26 pm »

Galz and i will also be a little VLA at a company conference starting tomorrow evening.

We could ask for a day extension?

This is true, and I wouldnít be opposed to an extension. That said, I plan on trying to finish my rereads and posts while on the plane tomorrow, and should be feeling confident enough to place my vote by Sunday morning.
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9

DatSwan

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1114 on: October 13, 2018, 04:08:11 am »

OK - Pretty much the last case I can make here:

1) Galz/Space - I do not think either of you are skum. However, I am as certain as I can be based on game mechanics, that both of you are not. So this should speak to at least one of you. From either of your "Town POVs" the possible teams have to be either [Swan!EFHW, Swan!Space, Swan!Galz, EFHW!Space, EFHW!Galz, Hydrad!Morgrim].
So it is either EFHW and me, the other of you and me, or the other of you and EFHW.

Points for Space/Galz to consider:
- If it is EFHW!Swan, why are both of you alive?
- Do you find it more likely it is either Swan or EFHW with the other of you, then the masons?


2) EFHW - I also do not think you are skum. Whether you are or not, we both know to 100% certainty that we are not both skum. If you are town and are choosing between Swan!Space and Swan!Galz, I see how I would be the obvious choice for you. So I would press you to look at the game as it has been played.

Points to EFHW:
- Do you think it is more likely Swan!Space or Swan!Galz instead of the masons?
- If I am skum with either Galz or Space, why are all the masons alive?


3) Masons - You are skum. Playing well.. but still skum.
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EFHW

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1115 on: October 13, 2018, 11:14:25 am »

Definitely swan/galz is more likely, since you gave a result in Galz's favor.

The masons are most likely still alive for several reasons. 1. Scum were looking for the traitor. 2. Scum needed to eliminate the vig. 3. These masons aren't very active players or very aggressive scumhunters, so they are lower priority targets. 4. The masons could provide a mislynch for scum.
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MXXI: VT (L) MXX: Goon (W) BMX: PGO/Cult (L) ZM12: VT (L) MXXIII: VT (L) ZM14: VT (W) RMM6:Witch (L) MVP ZM15: VT (W) RMM8: Bomb (L) RMM10:Backup Hobbit (W) M31: SK (L) RMM11: Maleficent (L) RMM12: The Doctor (L) M34: VT (L) RMM14: commuting lover (W) RMM18: multi-buyer (W) RMM20: Tracker/watcher (L) RMM21: Strongman (W) MVP M42(sub): VT (L) M43: Mason (L) M61: Rainbow Dash (L) RMM26: Grimace (W) MVP M74: VT (W) MVP RMM30 Enabler (W) MVP

EFHW

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1116 on: October 13, 2018, 11:25:05 am »

I'm  not sure I interpreted your question correctly. If you meant why are masons less likely to be scum than you paired with Space or Galz, it's because I feel your case on them was scummy.
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MXXI: VT (L) MXX: Goon (W) BMX: PGO/Cult (L) ZM12: VT (L) MXXIII: VT (L) ZM14: VT (W) RMM6:Witch (L) MVP ZM15: VT (W) RMM8: Bomb (L) RMM10:Backup Hobbit (W) M31: SK (L) RMM11: Maleficent (L) RMM12: The Doctor (L) M34: VT (L) RMM14: commuting lover (W) RMM18: multi-buyer (W) RMM20: Tracker/watcher (L) RMM21: Strongman (W) MVP M42(sub): VT (L) M43: Mason (L) M61: Rainbow Dash (L) RMM26: Grimace (W) MVP M74: VT (W) MVP RMM30 Enabler (W) MVP

DatSwan

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1117 on: October 13, 2018, 02:55:39 pm »

Definitely swan/galz is more likely, since you gave a result in Galz's favor.

The masons are most likely still alive for several reasons. 1. Scum were looking for the traitor. 2. Scum needed to eliminate the vig. 3. These masons aren't very active players or very aggressive scumhunters, so they are lower priority targets. 4. The masons could provide a mislynch for scum.

Fair enough - i would like to point out the only potential skum team possible that REALLY would care about GKs shot would be the masons... everyone else would still have 1 alive if GK shot them
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Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1118 on: October 13, 2018, 02:57:33 pm »

Psychic vampire - Every night you may target a player. If the target is Universe-Aligned, you will be informed you have absorbed their energy. If the target is not Universe-Aligned, you will die. If you do not absorb another player's energy at night, you will die the following night.

What is the basis of your townread on Galzria?

DatSwan - Why are you alive?

I donít get it? I am alive bc i am alive and my Town read on Galz is because i visited n2 and i didnít die.

So did you visit anyone last night?

Yeah I did... I targeted chairs and I got the confirmation that I absorbed energy... so not really sure what to make of that. I was dead wrong on my read. I was fairly certain given the just my overall reads of the situation that it was gonna end up being EFHW and GK. Obviously I was wrong.

My line of reasoning for my choice actually leads me into a larger point so I am going to put it in a next post.


PPE: the next post is kind of what space just pointed out.

Umm... why is Swan alive?
Logged
Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1119 on: October 13, 2018, 04:04:36 pm »

Definitely swan/galz is more likely, since you gave a result in Galz's favor.

The masons are most likely still alive for several reasons. 1. Scum were looking for the traitor. 2. Scum needed to eliminate the vig. 3. These masons aren't very active players or very aggressive scumhunters, so they are lower priority targets. 4. The masons could provide a mislynch for scum.

Fair enough - i would like to point out the only potential skum team possible that REALLY would care about GKs shot would be the masons... everyone else would still have 1 alive if GK shot them

Not following you here. Or maybe I get it. You mean because if one is revealed the other is as well? At first I thought you were suggesting scum lovers!
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MXXI: VT (L) MXX: Goon (W) BMX: PGO/Cult (L) ZM12: VT (L) MXXIII: VT (L) ZM14: VT (W) RMM6:Witch (L) MVP ZM15: VT (W) RMM8: Bomb (L) RMM10:Backup Hobbit (W) M31: SK (L) RMM11: Maleficent (L) RMM12: The Doctor (L) M34: VT (L) RMM14: commuting lover (W) RMM18: multi-buyer (W) RMM20: Tracker/watcher (L) RMM21: Strongman (W) MVP M42(sub): VT (L) M43: Mason (L) M61: Rainbow Dash (L) RMM26: Grimace (W) MVP M74: VT (W) MVP RMM30 Enabler (W) MVP

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1120 on: October 13, 2018, 04:06:14 pm »

Psychic vampire - Every night you may target a player. If the target is Universe-Aligned, you will be informed you have absorbed their energy. If the target is not Universe-Aligned, you will die. If you do not absorb another player's energy at night, you will die the following night.

What is the basis of your townread on Galzria?

DatSwan - Why are you alive?

I donít get it? I am alive bc i am alive and my Town read on Galz is because i visited n2 and i didnít die.

So did you visit anyone last night?

Yeah I did... I targeted chairs and I got the confirmation that I absorbed energy... so not really sure what to make of that. I was dead wrong on my read. I was fairly certain given the just my overall reads of the situation that it was gonna end up being EFHW and GK. Obviously I was wrong.

My line of reasoning for my choice actually leads me into a larger point so I am going to put it in a next post.


PPE: the next post is kind of what space just pointed out.

Umm... why is Swan alive?
That is a really good question!
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MXXI: VT (L) MXX: Goon (W) BMX: PGO/Cult (L) ZM12: VT (L) MXXIII: VT (L) ZM14: VT (W) RMM6:Witch (L) MVP ZM15: VT (W) RMM8: Bomb (L) RMM10:Backup Hobbit (W) M31: SK (L) RMM11: Maleficent (L) RMM12: The Doctor (L) M34: VT (L) RMM14: commuting lover (W) RMM18: multi-buyer (W) RMM20: Tracker/watcher (L) RMM21: Strongman (W) MVP M42(sub): VT (L) M43: Mason (L) M61: Rainbow Dash (L) RMM26: Grimace (W) MVP M74: VT (W) MVP RMM30 Enabler (W) MVP

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1121 on: October 13, 2018, 08:13:27 pm »

Psychic vampire - Every night you may target a player. If the target is Universe-Aligned, you will be informed you have absorbed their energy. If the target is not Universe-Aligned, you will die. If you do not absorb another player's energy at night, you will die the following night.

What is the basis of your townread on Galzria?

DatSwan - Why are you alive?

I donít get it? I am alive bc i am alive and my Town read on Galz is because i visited n2 and i didnít die.

So did you visit anyone last night?

Yeah I did... I targeted chairs and I got the confirmation that I absorbed energy... so not really sure what to make of that. I was dead wrong on my read. I was fairly certain given the just my overall reads of the situation that it was gonna end up being EFHW and GK. Obviously I was wrong.

My line of reasoning for my choice actually leads me into a larger point so I am going to put it in a next post.


PPE: the next post is kind of what space just pointed out.

Umm... why is Swan alive?

I addressed this at the begining of the day - i donít know. Posted the weirdness of it at the beginning of the day.
Are you just now reading to that point of the game?
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Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1122 on: October 13, 2018, 10:10:45 pm »

Psychic vampire - Every night you may target a player. If the target is Universe-Aligned, you will be informed you have absorbed their energy. If the target is not Universe-Aligned, you will die. If you do not absorb another player's energy at night, you will die the following night.

What is the basis of your townread on Galzria?

DatSwan - Why are you alive?

I donít get it? I am alive bc i am alive and my Town read on Galz is because i visited n2 and i didnít die.

So did you visit anyone last night?

Yeah I did... I targeted chairs and I got the confirmation that I absorbed energy... so not really sure what to make of that. I was dead wrong on my read. I was fairly certain given the just my overall reads of the situation that it was gonna end up being EFHW and GK. Obviously I was wrong.

My line of reasoning for my choice actually leads me into a larger point so I am going to put it in a next post.


PPE: the next post is kind of what space just pointed out.

Umm... why is Swan alive?

I addressed this at the begining of the day - i donít know. Posted the weirdness of it at the beginning of the day.
Are you just now reading to that point of the game?

I fail to see where you covered that...
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9

Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1123 on: October 14, 2018, 12:10:13 am »

So... what Iím seeing is...:

Silver breadcrumbs Swan, and Silver dies... and Swan canít explain why.
Swan claims to have targeted Chairs, but is alive, even though he should be dead... and Swan canít explain why.

Itís possible that scum have a redirect, sure. But they wouldíve needed to play both nights perfectly to explain this situation: N2 redirecting Silver from Swan onto themselves, and N3 redirecting Swan from Chairs onto town - and thatís assuming they wouldnít just redirect Swan onto themselves to activate his weak visitor modifier.

It seems to me the more likely scenario here is that Swan is lying scum, who couldnít die by targeting Chairs last night because that isnít actually his role, and he inadvertently killed Silver N2 when Silver choose to target him.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9

Galzria

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Re: RMM50: Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency (D4)
« Reply #1124 on: October 14, 2018, 12:14:51 am »

This would most likely make EFHW his partner (as I find it more or less unlikely that a claimed Dirk is scum, and I donít think Spaceís interactions suggest that theyíre partnered with Swan). This would make Swanís vote on EFHW yesterday a gambit in which Swan was banking on the low activity to result in a no lynch - and would explain why he kept trying to redirect to Chairs (whose alignment I believe was unknown to him) and Gkrieg.
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Quote from: Voltgloss
Derphammering is when quickhammers go derp.


Blitz:
TOWN Wins: ZM11, ZM13
TOWN Losses: ZM3, ZM5, ZM6, ZM8, ZM9, ZM10
SCUM Wins: ZM1
SCUM Losses: ZM4

Total Wins: 3
Total Losses: 7

Normal Games:
TOWN Wins: M3, M5, M6, M11, M17, M28, M32, M105, M108
TOWN Losses: M4, M7, M8, M9, M13, M14, M18, M31
SCUM Wins: M2, M19, M23, M100
SCUM Losses: M15 (SK), M102 (Traitor)

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 10

Other:
TOWN Wins: DM1, BM4, BM4, BM5, BM8, BM13, DoM1, OZ2, RM45
TOWN Losses: BM1, BM2, BM3, BM6, BM11, RM3, RM4
SCUM Wins: DM3, BM7, RM1, RM2
SCUM Losses: BM9, OZ1

Total Wins: 13
Total Losses: 9
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