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Author Topic: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Game Over! Town wins flawlessly)  (Read 21412 times)

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LaLight

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Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia

This game will use New Newbie Setup v2, a semi-open setup for 9 players first used in NM11

Mod: LaLight

Tags:

Players
1. faust
2. Simon Jester
3. silverspawn
4. alinatolm
5. hypercube
6. Uncleeurope
7. UmbrageOfSnow
8. muenstercheese
9. WestCoastDidds

The Rules:

The Golden Rule:
This is a game. Everyone who signs up to play must be considerate of each other, never get personal, and focus on having fun. Once the game starts, having signed up is a commitment: inactivity is just as inconsiderate as rude comments.

The Standard Rules:
1. No communication between players outside of the game thread or shared QTs at any time. This includes passing references, jokes, or cases in other games or threads, whether in context or not.
2. If the game thread is locked, do not post. If you are unsure if something is locked, ask the mod by PM.
3. Direct or verbatim quoting of mod-provided information is strictly forbidden. Paraphrasing is okay.
4. Actions with instructions that do not specify a game state will be resolved in the order they are received.
5. All night actions must be submitted within 24 hours of day ending.
6. Players must post once every 24 hours.
7. Do not edit or delete posts, ever. If you need to clarify or correct something, post again.
8. Invisible text, font size less than 10, and spoiler tags are not allowed.
9. Cryptography is not allowed.
10. The time between a lynch being reached and a flip being provided is called twilight. All players may continue posting during this time, including the lynched player.
11. Dead players may not post in thread or QT, except their Role QT. A lynched player is not "dead" until a flip has been provided.
12. Personal multimedia, such as video or audio recordings, are not allowed in the game thread.


The Voting Rules:
1. Votes should be in this format: Vote: Playername. Unambigiuous nicknames are acceptable, or any string that uniquely identifies a user. Note that the point of voting is, in fact, unambiguity, and attempting to make it unclear to other players (or, of course, mods) which user you are voting for is very ill-advised.
2. Unvotes should be in this format:
unvote or Unvote: Playername.
3. Unvotes are not required if changing your vote from one player to another.
4. You may
vote: no lynch.
5. Lynches occur when a simple majority (rounded up) of living players is reached. Once reached, a lynch cannot be undone.
6. If a majority lynch is not reached by the Day's deadline, no lynch occurs.

The Rest:
1. Bold, aquamarine text is reserved for the mod. Players may not use it.
2. If you have an issue or problem with the game, please PM the Mod. Do not post complaints in the game thread.
3. Mods make mistakes - please point them out gently. If they can be corrected, they will. If irreversible, they will stand as final to be commiserated over after the game.
4. If a mod error disadvantages one faction greatly, the game may be called off.
5. Ask all questions and make all requests directly to the Mod via PM. Questions deemed as "universal" (defined as questions for which the answers should be available to all players) will be requested to be re-posted in the Game Thread and answered there.
6. One prod will be issued after 48 hours without posting in the game thread. Players are subject to replacement or modkill after one prod.
7. All rule violations will be dealt with according to their severity, as determined by the mod.
8. Each player will receive their own QT, regardless of role. Don't quote from it.
9. If the game goes on for 3 days and 3 nights without a lynch or nightkill, town wins.

Deadlines:
7-day Days, 2-day Nights
« Last Edit: August 27, 2018, 07:46:53 am by LaLight »
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Wins: 14, 10
Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
Mod/Co-mod: 18

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LaLight

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2018, 05:34:43 am »

Setup



I choose between A, B, and C and between 1, 2 and 3. ABC chooses which power role mafia has (between roleblocker, rolecop, and just a goon) and 123 chooses which power role(s) town has (depends on ABC). and then add 1 mafia goon and 5 vanilla townies.

Mafia may communicate at any time, and cannot kill and use a secondary action while both are alive.

Below are the role PMs: these are what i will tell each role at the beginning of the game. these are useful if you want to learn what any of the roles do.

Vanilla Townie (VT)
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Vanilla Townie! This means you are aligned with the town, but don't have any special powers. You can vote and talk during the day.

You win when all mafia members are eliminated.
Town Cop
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Town Cop! You are aligned with the town, and each night you can target one player to have me tell you whether they are a member of town or mafia, unless you are roleblocked, in which case i say "no result". Nothing can cause me to tell you a mafia member is town or vice versa. You can also vote and talk during the day.

You win when all mafia members are eliminated.
Town Doctor
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Town Doctor! You are aligned with the town, and each night you can target one player other than yourself; if the mafia target that person to kill them, the kill will fail and no one will die! You can also vote and talk during the day.

You win when all mafia members are eliminated.
Town Jailkeeper
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Town Jailkeeper! You are aligned with the town, and your role is a combination of the "doctor" and "roleblocker" roles: each night, you may target someone other than yourself; if the mafia target that person to kill them, the kill will fail and no one will die. Additionally, if they attempt to use a night action (including a kill if they are a mafia member) that action will fail. You can also vote and talk during the day.

You win when all mafia members are eliminated.
Town Tracker
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Town Tracker! You are aligned with the town, and each night, you can target one player to learn who they successfully targeted with some night action (though i don't tell you exactly what night action they used). if they didn't use a night action, i will say "[player] didn't target anyone." if you were roleblocked, i will say "no result." You can also vote and talk during the day.

You win when all mafia members are eliminated.
Town Neapolitan
Quote
welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a town neapolitan! You are aligned with the town, and each night you can target one player to have me tell you whether or not they are a vanilla townie, unless you are roleblocked, in which case i say "no result". Nothing can cause me to tell you a mafia member is town or vice versa. You can also vote and talk during the day.

You win when all mafia members are eliminated.
Mafia Goon
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Mafia Goon! You are aligned with the mafia, along with [player name], a [role name]. The two of you may talk at any time, in [qt link]. Additionally, each night, one of you may kill a member of the town. You can also vote and talk in the game thread during the day.

You win when mafia makes up at least half of the people alive during a day phase, or when town cannot prevent that from happening.
Mafia Rolecop
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Mafia Rolecop! You are aligned with the mafia, along with [player name], a [role name]. The two of you may talk at any time, in [qt link]. Additionally, each night:
-You may choose one player to have me tell you what role PM they received.
-Either of the two of you may kill a member of the town. You may not use this and the rolecop ability while [partner] is alive.

You can also vote and talk in the game thread during the day.

You win when mafia makes up at least half of the people alive during a day phase, or when town cannot prevent that from happening.
Mafia Roleblocker
Quote
Welcome to NM12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia! You are a Mafia Roleblocker! You are aligned with the mafia, along with [player name], a [role name]. The two of you may talk at any time, in [qt link]. Additionally, each night:
-You may choose one player; any night action that player uses will fail.
-Either of the two of you may kill a member of the town. You may not use this and the roleblock ability while [partner] is alive.

You can also vote and talk in the game thread during the day.

You win when mafia makes up at least half of the people alive during a day phase, or when town cannot prevent that from happening.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2018, 05:45:30 am by LaLight »
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Wins: 14, 10
Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
Mod/Co-mod: 18

I always have a limited access to forum on weekends.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2018, 05:34:49 am »

The game is aimed for newbies. If you have less than 2-3 games played on site, you are welcome to join! If you want to play and this is the first time, don't forget to /pledge in This Thread. Other than newbies, I would very much like to see 1-2 veterans who will play and help along the game. Let's try to engage as many new players as possible. If you have any questions about the game beforehand, feel free to ask them in thread!
« Last Edit: August 13, 2018, 05:48:46 am by LaLight »
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Wins: 14, 10
Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
Mod/Co-mod: 18

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faust

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2018, 05:56:08 am »

I would be available as a vet.
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Simon Jester

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2018, 06:37:15 am »

/in - 2 (1) games on this site, excluding BM.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2018, 06:49:32 am »

I would be available as a vet.

mafia has become fun again!
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2018, 06:50:27 am »

(in case it's unlcear, that means I'd also play.)
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LaLight

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2018, 06:52:14 am »

cool! Let's stop on 2 vets for now
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Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
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alinatolm

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #8 on: August 13, 2018, 07:28:18 am »

/in
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LaLight

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2018, 07:33:28 am »

this is my promised newbie :)
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Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
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hypercube

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2018, 07:34:47 am »

in
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faust

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #11 on: August 13, 2018, 07:52:42 am »

this is my promised newbie :)
The Newb That Was Promised
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #12 on: August 13, 2018, 09:52:45 am »

/in if you need another vet
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Scum: 5 games, 3 wins

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2018, 11:13:19 am »

I don't want to steal a newb spot but I'd really like to play if my friend (Uncleeurope) plays.

Anyway, I'll let him know about this but if there is still a slot open when it's time to launch I would really like to be /in.
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LaLight

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2018, 11:15:12 am »

I don't want to steal a newb spot but I'd really like to play if my friend (Uncleeurope) plays.

Anyway, I'll let him know about this but if there is still a slot open when it's time to launch I would really like to be /in.

let me try to advertise Mafia in Dominion Discord and see how many people will be willing to join, then we'll see.
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Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #15 on: August 13, 2018, 11:16:14 am »

At the very least I'll heckle from the spectator thread.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #16 on: August 13, 2018, 05:53:23 pm »

I am the newbie attached to UmbrageOfSnow

And I believe I am /in

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #17 on: August 13, 2018, 05:57:41 pm »

Umbrage is on the list. Let's find 2 more newbies, shall we? :)
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Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #18 on: August 13, 2018, 07:31:18 pm »

/tag
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #19 on: August 13, 2018, 08:02:50 pm »

/in

0 games played, so there's that
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #20 on: August 13, 2018, 10:02:03 pm »

/tag
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Open for signups!)
« Reply #21 on: August 13, 2018, 10:23:49 pm »

Looks like you already have enough veterans but I'll /in anyway in case the game doesn't fill up from newbies.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (1 spot left!)
« Reply #22 on: August 14, 2018, 08:40:49 am »

I will play, but am not quite sure how... the newbiest newb

LaLight

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (1 spot left!)
« Reply #23 on: August 14, 2018, 08:50:10 am »

I will play, but am not quite sure how... the newbiest newb

Awesome! You'll get it, its's quite simple :)
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Draws: 1
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Night 0, pms are out!)
« Reply #24 on: August 14, 2018, 08:57:45 am »

All of you have got the private messages on this forum with links to Quicktopic site. Click them, there will be your role and win condition. If you have any questions, ask me in there!

This THREAD is LOCKED. The game will start when everyone confirms they got the role in there.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2018, 09:24:41 am by LaLight »
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Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
Mod/Co-mod: 18

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Night 0, pms are out!)
« Reply #25 on: August 14, 2018, 04:39:48 pm »

/tag for speccy
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #26 on: August 15, 2018, 04:55:41 am »

Day 1 starts now!

Vote Count 1.0

Not Voting (9): faust, Simon Jester, silverspawn, alinatolm, hypercube, Uncleeurope, UmbrageOfSnow, muenstercheese, WestCoastDidds

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 starts now and ends Wednesday, August 22 at 5am forum time.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2018, 04:19:25 pm by LaLight »
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Wins: 14, 10
Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
Mod/Co-mod: 18

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #27 on: August 15, 2018, 05:05:24 am »

Good morning y'all!

Many new people naturally, exciting!

Let's start out with a vote: Umbrage and see where that leads us.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #28 on: August 15, 2018, 06:06:20 am »

vote: poorly written Harry Potter Villain

nice playing with you again!

I'm town. What about you?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #29 on: August 15, 2018, 08:09:42 am »

Hi everyone!

I'm town. What about you?

I'm also town.

vote: silver for starting a wagon in a somewhat opaque manner.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #30 on: August 15, 2018, 08:20:57 am »

Hi everyone!

I'm town. What about you?

I'm also town.

vote: silver for starting a wagon in a somewhat opaque manner.

Wha.. Wagons, where? How?

And wagons are good, bad reason for voting silver, really. One scumpoint to you.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #31 on: August 15, 2018, 08:33:00 am »

Vote Count 1.1

UmbrageOfSnow (1): Simon Jester
silverspawn (1): hypercube
Not Voting (7): faust, silverspawn, alinatolm, Uncleeurope, UmbrageOfSnow, muenstercheese, WestCoastDidds

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, August 22 at 5am forum time.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2018, 04:19:32 pm by LaLight »
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Wins: 14, 10
Losses: 10, 5, 1
Draws: 1
MVPs: 4
Mod/Co-mod: 18

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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #32 on: August 15, 2018, 09:04:41 am »

Hi everyone!

I'm town. What about you?

I'm also town.

vote: silver for starting a wagon in a somewhat opaque manner.

I'd have been fairly surprised if that vote counted. As you can see, it didn't.

but this one may. opaque vote: hypercube
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #33 on: August 15, 2018, 09:07:31 am »

Hi everyone!

I'm town. What about you?

I'm also town.

vote: silver for starting a wagon in a somewhat opaque manner.

I'd have been fairly surprised if that vote counted. As you can see, it didn't.

but this one may. opaque vote: hypercube

ooooh, Omgus! Fight, Fight, Fight!!
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #34 on: August 15, 2018, 09:29:44 am »

ooooh, Omgus! Fight, Fight, Fight!!

translucent vote: Simon for formenting conflict.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #35 on: August 15, 2018, 10:36:39 am »

Since we have at least one total total newb, I want to make a "brief" post on strategy.

  • Right now we have nothing to go on so we start by just voting for semi-arbitrary reasons. People will see things that give them a small read, argue about them, find each other scummy for their garbage reads, generate better reads off the whole mess, and so the cycle begins. Don't just throw up your hands and say "but there's nothing to get reads off of," it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
     
  • "L-1" means someone is 1 vote away from being lynched. We don't want anyone accidentally or "accidentally" hammering (casting the last vote) so announce when you put someone at L-1.

  • Also declare intent to hammer before doing so. This gives a chance for the lynchee to claim and everyone a last chance to reconsider in light of that claim. If you hammer someone without warning and they flip town, I will do everything in my power to lynch you the next day.

  • The goal isn't to survive until the end of the game, the goal is to identify and lynch the Mafia. If you are worried youíre on track to get mislynched, try to take a deep breath and figure out who is most likely to be scum. Make a case on why they are scum instead of flailing around just trying not to die, itís more helpful to town, and more likely to actually save you if itís a good case.

  • Don't claim false power roles or false results, this only benefits the scumteam. If you claim a power role, the correct play is for another town player with that power role to claim. If scum fake claims, this gets scum lynched at a 1-for-1 tradeoff with that town power role. If you do it as town, you and the town power role both die at no benefit to anyone other than the Mafia.

  • If you have a power role, be very cautious about claiming it. If you're about to be lynched (and I mean intent to hammer, not a couple votes and feeling generally depressed and fatalistic), if you have a guilty result on someone as cop or tracker, if scum just claimed your role or your role makes their claim impossible, if someone you have an innocent result on is about to be lynched, or when it's the last day and it's Lynch or Lose (LyLo), then claim. Not before.

  • No Lynching is very bad for Town most of the time. We should compromise and get someone lynched. Scum have complete control over the night kill, but have to vote like everyone else on the lynch, which gives us more information, which is better. If we get to 3v1 or 4v2 that's when we No Lynch.

  • There is no reason to wait until the last 5 minutes of every day to settle on a compromise lynch. No one ever gets their top scumread lynched every day and we can get better compromises that are more likely to hit scum if we try to settle things a bit early instead of waiting until the last minute and having who is online (or strategically lurking) decide which compromises are even possible.

And with that, Iíll shut up about theory.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #36 on: August 15, 2018, 10:37:13 am »

Vote:Faust for not doing that yet.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #37 on: August 15, 2018, 10:45:47 am »

vote: poorly written Harry Potter Villain

nice playing with you again!

I'm town. What about you?

Nice playing with you again too! Like I've realized I've been missing forum mafia and I'm actually a bit emotional about coming back. Not just excitement or shame at having left before but like nostalgia and that sort of happy sadness. I'm seriously glad to be back.

None of that is alignment-indicative though. And neither is this: I'm town.

P.S. The poorly written Harry Potter villain was
a) all of them
b) spelled Umbridge
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #38 on: August 15, 2018, 10:49:17 am »

ooooh, Omgus! Fight, Fight, Fight!!

translucent vote: Simon for formenting conflict.

Asch, conflict is good, irregardless if it's fabricated, silly or whatever. What is fishy is to try to dial down a potential subject of conversation. Town wants to have many interactions D1 a so we can go back later days and study them when we have more revealed information.

PPE

So c'mone, be a pro-town player and go hunt down scum!silver, attaboy!
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #39 on: August 15, 2018, 10:55:02 am »

@Hypercube: what's your previous Mafia experience?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #40 on: August 15, 2018, 11:03:37 am »

a) all of them
b) spelled Umbridge

I know. I once called you Umbridge and you said you didn't want to be confused with a poorly written harry potter villain. It was a failed attempt at an insider. Iactuallythinkumbridgeiswellwrittenbutnjeh

Your case on faust is solid. I think you probably caught him. vote: faust
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #41 on: August 15, 2018, 11:10:19 am »

Wooo, wagon!

I remember that now, but I have trouble remembering who said what sometimes. I thought it was EFHW for some reason.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #42 on: August 15, 2018, 11:18:22 am »

@Hypercube: what's your previous Mafia experience?

I've played IRL some, never by text before. I've been lurking this forum for a while; I've probably read ~20 games here.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #43 on: August 15, 2018, 02:03:25 pm »

Even though no one asked me, I have a bit of IRL experience and a bit of forum experience, although my forum experience was a lot more... casual? I guess? With very different structure and terms. So I may get lost, but I will try my best to keep myself aware and open to listening to advice from you people.

That being said, any advice that disagrees with me will allow me to assume its coming from the depths of scumminess, and will have to be dealt with.

(Note: This is a post which is meant to show I am reading all of this without actually accomplishing anything.)
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #44 on: August 15, 2018, 03:00:08 pm »

Hi! So much terms in here! I've played Mafia at school before, but never on the internet. So scared to do something wrong. I hope I'll figure out things here quickly. What does it mean 'declare intent to hammer'? How exactly should I warn someone before the action?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #45 on: August 15, 2018, 03:06:20 pm »

Hi! So much terms in here! I've played Mafia at school before, but never on the internet. So scared to do something wrong. I hope I'll figure out things here quickly. What does it mean 'declare intent to hammer'? How exactly should I warn someone before the action?

Don't let the terms intimidate you, but they do get thrown around a lot (and do help people talk about stuff without re-explaining everything) so worth getting used to, but if you don't know what something means just ask.

Don't worry too much about doing something wrong, just put your thoughts out there. If you are scum or town with a power role, this probably doesn't help much, but try to play as if you are town with no powers.

Just saying it is all anyone ever means. Often we put it in bold.

Like this
Intent to hammer: Uncleeurope

Bold doesn't automatically make it a vote or something, you have to actually say Vote:
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #46 on: August 15, 2018, 03:24:06 pm »

OK thank you! In real life I'm used to the fact that Mafia is often too active. So
vote: UmbrageOfSnow
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #47 on: August 15, 2018, 04:17:44 pm »

@Lalight, your date in the vote count is likely wrong, unless the first game-day is ending today!?

Interesting vote from alinatolm, altough activeness can't be a general scumtell in forum mafia, it's much more a question of each players meta in that case. It's easy to lurk as mafia and it tends to be a playstyle that pays off unfortunately so I would rather look among the silent players in the first place. Of course irrelevant this early in the game, but we'll see.

Umbrages ambition to be the tutor for the newbies is most likely a null-tell, but it would be so fun it was a deliberate way to gain easy town-cred that I'm happy to have my vote staying where it is. Slightly less RVS now, with other words.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #48 on: August 15, 2018, 04:20:04 pm »

@Lalight, your date in the vote count is likely wrong, unless the first game-day is ending today!?


Sorry for that, I fixed it.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #49 on: August 15, 2018, 04:29:08 pm »

Thank you for the explanation. Can I clarify some words? What do 'null-tell' and 'RVS' mean?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #50 on: August 15, 2018, 04:35:09 pm »

Thank you for the explanation. Can I clarify some words? What do 'null-tell' and 'RVS' mean?

"null-tell" means basically that a statement is neither townie nor scummy. RVS is Random Vote Stage and that's where we are right now and Umbrage mentioned it above. We throw careless accusations that generates discussion and via the discussion we et more substantial reads and then the game has begun for real.

For further reference this link might be useful: http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16266.0
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #51 on: August 15, 2018, 06:05:42 pm »

Vote: alinatolm

Either he is killing a talker, or he is killing someone he thinks is intelligent enough to be a threat, you decide. Ima just vote for the guy to see what happens.
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faust

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #52 on: August 16, 2018, 04:03:08 am »

Hi!

My internet was broken yesterday, but hopefully it will be better from now on.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #53 on: August 16, 2018, 04:23:12 am »

Hi everyone!

I'm town. What about you?

I'm also town.

vote: silver for starting a wagon in a somewhat opaque manner.
This is the scummiest thing to happen so far. As in, why in the world is that even scummy? It seems just like not wanting to place a vote without a reason.

Vote: hypercube
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #54 on: August 16, 2018, 04:24:32 am »

Umbrages ambition to be the tutor for the newbies is most likely a null-tell, but it would be so fun it was a deliberate way to gain easy town-cred that I'm happy to have my vote staying where it is. Slightly less RVS now, with other words.
I have trouble parsing what you are saying here.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #55 on: August 16, 2018, 04:30:40 am »

Vote Count 1.2

UmbrageOfSnow (2): Simon Jester, alinatolm
Simon Jester (1): hypercube
faust (1): silverspawn
alinatolm (1): Uncleeurope
hypercube (1): faust
Not Voting (3): UmbrageOfSnow, muenstercheese, WestCoastDidds

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, August 22 at 5am forum time.

Please note, that this vote:

Vote:Faust for not doing that yet.

Doesn't count, because it is poorly written.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #56 on: August 16, 2018, 04:37:40 am »

OK thank you! In real life I'm used to the fact that Mafia is often too active. So
vote: UmbrageOfSnow
This post is interesting in several ways.

- it is the third vote on UoS from what I can tell, making it the first major wagon.
- the reasoning is the kind of flawed one that you often see from casual players. Mafia is not more active then town. Different players have different levels of activity. Some people are more as scum then they are as town, and for others it is the other way around. I can testify to the fact that UoS's activity level so far is about what I would expect from him as either alignment.

So if alina is scum, they are trying a very in-your-face approach to get UoS lynched. So not a subtle scum player. Which makes me confident that it won't take us long to figure out their alignment.

By the way, what pronouns does everyone use? You can use he or they for me.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #57 on: August 16, 2018, 06:20:50 am »

goot points. vote: muenstercheese for lurking
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #58 on: August 16, 2018, 06:23:16 am »

Umbrages ambition to be the tutor for the newbies is most likely a null-tell, but it would be so fun it was a deliberate way to gain easy town-cred that I'm happy to have my vote staying where it is. Slightly less RVS now, with other words.
I have trouble parsing what you are saying here.

I think there is a chance that scum!Umbrage could make an effort to be active in the early stage of the game with teaching advice and such to get a townie feel on himself, that well, since I don't have anything else at the moment I'm happy to have my vote there as of now.

quote author=faust link=topic=18893.msg764947#msg764947 date=1534408660]

- it is the third vote on UoS from what I can tell, making it the first major wagon.
- the reasoning is the kind of flawed one that you often see from casual players. Mafia is not more active then town. Different players have different levels of activity. Some people are more as scum then they are as town, and for others it is the other way around. I can testify to the fact that UoS's activity level so far is about what I would expect from him as either alignment.

So if alina is scum, they are trying a very in-your-face approach to get UoS lynched. So not a subtle scum player. Which makes me confident that it won't take us long to figure out their alignment.
[/quote]

It's not. Silvers vote was never counted and it was quite obvious it wouldn't be (silver voted somewhere else soon there after too) which makes the rest of your reasoning quite.. meh. Giving someone a second vote is not bold at all and to use their familiar IRL- meta as reasoning for voting as a new forum player is not strange either when casting the first vote.
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Simon Jester

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #59 on: August 16, 2018, 06:24:00 am »

Quote fail, aagh.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #60 on: August 16, 2018, 06:25:22 am »

I think there is a chance that scum!Umbrage could make an effort to be active in the early stage of the game with teaching advice and such to get a townie feel on himself, that well, since I don't have anything else at the moment I'm happy to have my vote there as of now.

Umbrage is totally the person to do this as town, so I don't think that's any tell.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #61 on: August 16, 2018, 06:25:51 am »

But you're right of course that the second vote wasn't anything notable.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #62 on: August 16, 2018, 06:39:17 am »

I think there is a chance that scum!Umbrage could make an effort to be active in the early stage of the game with teaching advice and such to get a townie feel on himself, that well, since I don't have anything else at the moment I'm happy to have my vote there as of now.

Umbrage is totally the person to do this as town, so I don't think that's any tell.

Ah, well, alrite, I guess not.

Let's hunt lurkers: vote: Westcoastdidds
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #63 on: August 16, 2018, 06:52:31 am »

I prodded WestCoastDidds and muenstercheese
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #64 on: August 16, 2018, 07:50:29 am »

Thanks for the prod! I know what my favorite animal is, but not that the game had started.

Alas, voting for lurkers is no bueno. Especially when they are the newbs. Look at my delightful headgehog outfit. Itís totally town wear.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #65 on: August 16, 2018, 08:06:43 am »

Thanks for the prod! I know what my favorite animal is, but not that the game had started.

Alas, voting for lurkers is no bueno. Especially when they are the newbs. Look at my delightful headgehog outfit. Itís totally town wear.

Voting lurkers is always bueno, newb or not. There can be better cases but chances to catch scum among low posters is always rather high so Lynch All Lurkers Literally is a saying here that is good to listen to.

Scummy vibe from you. Hm.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #66 on: August 16, 2018, 08:13:07 am »

Scummy vibe is just a lack of coffee.

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #67 on: August 16, 2018, 08:16:23 am »

you need a whitespace after the colon, otherwise LaLight won't count it.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #68 on: August 16, 2018, 08:21:27 am »

This is the scummiest thing to happen so far. As in, why in the world is that even scummy? It seems just like not wanting to place a vote without a reason.

Vote: hypercube

I was mostly annoyed that it took me several minutes to figure out who they were (pretending to) vote for.

muenstercheese is basically notorious for running away from things so it's not terribly surprising he's not here.

He or they pronouns for me.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #69 on: August 16, 2018, 08:23:08 am »

Interesting... why is that?

Vote: Muenstercheese

Iím she/they

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #70 on: August 16, 2018, 10:41:07 am »


Please note , that this vote: [/color]
Vote:Faust for not doing that yet.

Doesn't count , because it is poorly written.

This vote count doesn't count because it is poorly written.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #71 on: August 16, 2018, 10:45:03 am »

Interesting... why is that?

Vote: Muenstercheese

Iím she/they

So that you new players can have fun experiencing a fake hammer I guess. Where someone deliberately looks like they are hammering someone but didn't really.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #72 on: August 16, 2018, 10:46:39 am »

Scummy vibe is just a lack of coffee.

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

Lurker lynching is all well and good but what do you think of the game so far? Does any player seem more likely to be town or scum to you?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #73 on: August 16, 2018, 11:06:59 am »

Sorry for the post spam here, I'll try to keep it down.

Anyway, I do actually get a slight townread off that vote on me. No, I don't think it put me in danger of being lynched or anything, but I feel like new scum would have been more nervous about that whole interaction.

I'm a bit weirded out by UE and faust both coming to my defense in their own ways.

I go by he or they but I'm tempted (because I'm feeling trollish since it's right after coffee #2) to insist everyone should call me they purely to bother anyone who has this thing about singular they being wrong, it predates Shakespeare and pushing for "he" as a generic/genderless first person pronoun didn't start until the mid 1700s and was never agreed upon by everyone. Grrrrrrr
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #74 on: August 16, 2018, 11:17:06 am »

muenstercheese is basically notorious for running away from things so it's not terribly surprising he's not here.

How do you to know each other? Do you think you are likely to be better at reading each other than average?

I'm friends with Uncleeurope and we played one game somewhat like forum mafia before, but a lot less serious with some element of roleplaying and outside-the-thread communication. I ended up mis-scumreading him because of a Skype call we had where basically he was trying to get me to scumread him to generate a read on me.

We also play Dominion, another board game called Summoner Wars, and the roleplaying game Trail of Cthulhu (and recently a game of Fiasco) together. I feel like I can point out when something is about what's expected from him, but he's also probably able to fool me as scum, and therefore I'm prone to oversuspecting him. But I'm aware of that, so who knows where my actual bias is. Anyway, don't blindly sheep my reads on him.

(Sheep means to follow or agree with someone with basically no other thought or comment of your own.)
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #75 on: August 16, 2018, 11:20:42 am »

"How do you TWO"

gah.

Okay, I will post nothing else until some people come in here and respond to things. Feel like I'm falling back into old habits and will end up having half the posts in the game, which is bad for anyone's ability to actually read or reread the game to get reads.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #76 on: August 16, 2018, 11:28:34 am »

Sorry for the post spam here, I'll try to keep it down.
Something is wrong when people start apologizing for posting.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #77 on: August 16, 2018, 11:30:38 am »

Sorry for the post spam here, I'll try to keep it down.
Something is wrong when people start apologizing for posting.

Just seems like I'm going way beyond the pace of the rest of the game. Do you remember my first game ever?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #78 on: August 16, 2018, 11:32:20 am »

Sorry for the post spam here, I'll try to keep it down.
Something is wrong when people start apologizing for posting.

Just seems like I'm going way beyond the pace of the rest of the game. Do you remember my first game ever?
Doesn't your first game predate mine?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #79 on: August 16, 2018, 11:35:24 am »

Doesn't your first game predate mine?

It might, I don't know. Anyway, newb!me spammed the crap out of a game and I was town but I think I did more to help the scumteam in terms of creating town apathy than I did anything else. If I think I had a correct scumread on Robz that no one listened to, partly because I drowned myself out in walls of vote count and post count nonsense.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #80 on: August 16, 2018, 01:29:23 pm »

Scummy vibe is just a lack of coffee.

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

Lurker lynching is all well and good but what do you think of the game so far? Does any player seem more likely to be town or scum to you?

Hell if I know! It seems like with the number of brand spanking new folks and our general lack of know-how, two of us are not likely to be scum. We wouldnít know what to do! Youíd want a vet in at least one of the spots, right? So, I am less supicious of the lesser known. 

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #81 on: August 16, 2018, 01:32:20 pm »

Faust, Silver, and Umbrage are the vets?

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #82 on: August 16, 2018, 01:45:15 pm »

Quote from: UmbrageOfSnow
I'm a bit weirded out by UE and faust both coming to my defense in their own ways.

*Shrugs* Fair enough, I wasn't expecting to have much support with that post being an oddity, I just wanted to latch on to something similar to a lead. I can vote for you now if it makes you feel more comfortable.

Quote from: UmbrageOfSnow
I'm friends with Uncleeurope and we played one game somewhat like forum mafia before, but a lot less serious with some element of roleplaying and outside-the-thread communication. I ended up mis-scumreading him because of a Skype call we had where basically he was trying to get me to scumread him to generate a read on me.

We also play Dominion, another board game called Summoner Wars, and the roleplaying game Trail of Cthulhu (and recently a game of Fiasco) together. I feel like I can point out when something is about what's expected from him, but he's also probably able to fool me as scum, and therefore I'm prone to oversuspecting him. But I'm aware of that, so who knows where my actual bias is. Anyway, don't blindly sheep my reads on him.

Awwwwww, that's the nicest thing you've ever said to me. <3
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #83 on: August 16, 2018, 01:52:38 pm »

@uncle, you still have zero posts, does that mean you have to fill out something every time you want to post?

If so that'll disappear if you make a post somwewhere where it counts. The random stuff thread, for example. http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=18043.msg764966#new
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #84 on: August 16, 2018, 01:55:51 pm »

Faust, silver, and Umbrage are the vets?

Yes. I'll take care of all your hurt animals.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #85 on: August 16, 2018, 01:59:53 pm »

Faust, silver, and Umbrage are the vets?

Yes. I'll take care of all your hurt animals.
Nice flavor tie-in!
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #86 on: August 16, 2018, 02:01:31 pm »

Indeed!

Plus my cats, Scott and Brad, would appreciate the care.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #87 on: August 16, 2018, 02:01:43 pm »

Scummy vibe is just a lack of coffee.

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

Lurker lynching is all well and good but what do you think of the game so far? Does any player seem more likely to be town or scum to you?

Hell if I know! It seems like with the number of brand spanking new folks and our general lack of know-how, two of us are not likely to be scum. We wouldnít know what to do! Youíd want a vet in at least one of the spots, right? So, I am less supicious of the lesser known.
We can be very, very sure that roles were distributed completely randomly and everyone had an equal that of being scum.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #88 on: August 16, 2018, 02:03:49 pm »

Scummy vibe is just a lack of coffee.

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

Lurker lynching is all well and good but what do you think of the game so far? Does any player seem more likely to be town or scum to you?

Hell if I know! It seems like with the number of brand spanking new folks and our general lack of know-how, two of us are not likely to be scum. We wouldnít know what to do! Youíd want a vet in at least one of the spots, right? So, I am less supicious of the lesser known.
We can be very, very sure that roles were distributed completely randomly and everyone had an equal that chance of being scum.
EBWOP

(That stands for Edit By Way Of Post, i.e. I posted something that I want to correct and since we're are not allowed to modify posts, I quote the wrong post and point out what I actually meant to say)
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #89 on: August 16, 2018, 02:06:07 pm »

Doesn't your first game predate mine?

It might, I don't know. Anyway, newb!me spammed the crap out of a game and I was town but I think I did more to help the scumteam in terms of creating town apathy than I did anything else. If I think I had a correct scumread on Robz that no one listened to, partly because I drowned myself out in walls of vote count and post count nonsense.
Well let me tell you that I can think of no game where I would say that town was crippled by a townie posting too much, but on the other hand there were a plethora of instances where town lost because people weren't active enough. So I would ask you to not restrain yourself.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #90 on: August 16, 2018, 02:06:24 pm »

Whcih goes for everybody obviously.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #91 on: August 16, 2018, 02:27:20 pm »

@uncle, you still have zero posts, does that mean you have to fill out something every time you want to post?

If so that'll disappear if you make a post somwewhere where it counts. The random stuff thread, for example. http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=18043.msg764966#new

There, I think I did it, thanks.

I was seriously starting to get the feeling I would be in some insane asylum blubbering about captchas in the near future.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #92 on: August 16, 2018, 03:20:09 pm »

How do you to know each other? Do you think you are likely to be better at reading each other than average?

Just from the Dominion Discord (the running away thing is regarding crew battle challenges on there). I doubt I have any special insight; maybe the lurking makes them slightly more likely to be scum. I'm ok with where my vote is at the moment though.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #93 on: August 16, 2018, 06:18:11 pm »

vote: father-brother-continent
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #94 on: August 17, 2018, 03:13:30 am »

vote: father-brother-continent
Do you have anything else to contribute?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #95 on: August 17, 2018, 05:41:43 am »

Oh, I've lost the whole conversation about identity! I'm definitely 'she'
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #96 on: August 17, 2018, 06:33:15 am »

Very slow start here. How about this: everyone vote for someone in their next post

vote: muenstercheese
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #97 on: August 17, 2018, 07:05:01 am »

vote: father-brother-continent

This is just too odd.

vote: muenstercheese
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #98 on: August 17, 2018, 08:10:03 am »

Very slow start here. How about this: everyone vote for someone in their next post

vote: muenstercheese
Can you explain how your voting will help us get the game started?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #99 on: August 17, 2018, 10:06:09 am »

I'll post some thoughts on things, hopefully that will help.

None of that is alignment-indicative though. And neither is this: I'm town.

If you're town, isn't saying "I'm town" literally indicating your alignment?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #100 on: August 17, 2018, 10:09:02 am »

ooooh, Omgus! Fight, Fight, Fight!!

translucent vote: Simon for formenting conflict.

Asch, conflict is good, irregardless if it's fabricated, silly or whatever. What is fishy is to try to dial down a potential subject of conversation. Town wants to have many interactions D1 a so we can go back later days and study them when we have more revealed information.

PPE

So c'mone, be a pro-town player and go hunt down scum!silver, attaboy!

Scum probably wants to encourage things like OMGUS though, especially if it's between two town, since it leads to emotional reactions and lets them hide.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #101 on: August 17, 2018, 10:14:53 am »

Vote: alinatolm

Either he is killing a talker, or he is killing someone he thinks is intelligent enough to be a threat, you decide. Ima just vote for the guy to see what happens.

I agree that trying to leave the more experienced players alive for the early going is probably a good idea.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #102 on: August 17, 2018, 10:17:04 am »

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

This is a very fast turn around from "voting for lurkers is no bueno."
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #103 on: August 17, 2018, 10:20:34 am »

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

This is a very fast turn around from "voting for lurkers is no bueno."
Good point.

Vote: WCD
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #104 on: August 17, 2018, 10:27:02 am »

vote: father-brother-continent

This is possibly too apathetic to be scum, or at least if they're scum we can count on them to be apathetic scum.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #105 on: August 17, 2018, 10:29:12 am »

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

This is a very fast turn around from "voting for lurkers is no bueno."

Iím learning, so taking advice when itís offered. You said lurkers are suspicious, and I was one of the only two people who hadnít voted, so I voted for the other. Your reason that lurkers are suspicious was more substantive than any other vote thus far.

Iím quite literally figuring this out as we go along...

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #106 on: August 17, 2018, 10:31:02 am »

And the only single thing we have heard from muenstercheese at all is the weird father-brother-continent vote. Weird, right?

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #107 on: August 17, 2018, 10:32:27 am »

Very slow start here. How about this: everyone vote for someone in their next post

vote: muenstercheese
Can you explain how your voting will help us get the game started?

Agreed that "let's move things along by voting. [policy vote]" isn't actually helpful.

vote: silverspawn
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #108 on: August 17, 2018, 10:47:10 am »

Vote: alinatolm

Either he is killing a talker, or he is killing someone he thinks is intelligent enough to be a threat, you decide. Ima just vote for the guy to see what happens.

I agree that trying to leave the more experienced players alive for the early going is probably a good idea.

To be honest, I'm not sure it is a good strategy. If you play for a long time, it means you can hide your true nature professionally.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #109 on: August 17, 2018, 10:57:55 am »

And the only single thing we have heard from muenstercheese at all is the weird father-brother-continent vote. Weird, right?

To be fair I believe it was a vote directed at me.

About the "voting in next post" thing, I am very content with my current vote, am I supposed to change it? Or was that just calling out all the non-voters? Either way I think I will keep everything as is for the time being.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #110 on: August 17, 2018, 11:26:34 am »

Very slow start here. How about this: everyone vote for someone in their next post

vote: muenstercheese
Can you explain how your voting will help us get the game started?

No.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #111 on: August 17, 2018, 11:27:36 am »

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

This is a very fast turn around from "voting for lurkers is no bueno."
Good point.

Vote: WCD

sure, vote: WCD
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #112 on: August 17, 2018, 11:43:03 am »

Vote Count 1.3

UmbrageOfSnow (1): alinatolm
alinatolm (1): Uncleeurope
muenstercheese (2): WestCoastDidds, Simon Jester
WestCoastDidds (2): faust, silverspawn
silverspawn (1): hypercube
Not Voting (2): UmbrageOfSnow, muenstercheese

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, August 22 at 5am forum time.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #113 on: August 17, 2018, 12:13:25 pm »

Scum probably wants to encourage things like OMGUS though, especially if it's between two town, since it leads to emotional reactions and lets them hide.
I feel like emotions make it easier to sort people rather than easier for scum to hide. Scum can manipulate town using emotions for sure, but I think it helps with reads.

This is possibly too apathetic to be scum, or at least if they're scum we can count on them to be apathetic scum.
No such thing as too apathetic to be scum, and apathetic scum can be very hard to catch. They can sit back as town tears itself apart and no one really wonders why they are still alive or has any way to sort them from town. Letting apathetic scum off the hook lets apathetic scum win games.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #114 on: August 17, 2018, 12:16:30 pm »

You said lurkers are suspicious, and I was one of the only two people who hadnít voted, so I voted for the other. Your reason that lurkers are suspicious was more substantive than any other vote thus far.

So you were worried you looked suspicious?
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #115 on: August 17, 2018, 12:21:07 pm »

What is OMGUS?

Iím not worried that Iíd look suscious, rather I was trying to find some reason to vote one way of another since it seems so rando.

But two of the veterans targeting the new kid....that seems all kinds of scummy.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #116 on: August 17, 2018, 12:27:41 pm »

What is OMGUS?
It stands for "Oh My God You Suck," when someone votes the person voting for them, it's a good way for scum to discredit votes on themselves and so can be sort of a tell that way, but it's also just common with new players in general. Town tends to get emotional and mistakenly scumread people voting for them because "if you're voting for me then you can't see how obviously town I am, you must be scum!" which is often untrue.

Basically it's something that can be a good reason to find someone scummy that gets abused and is often meaningless.

By the way, confirmation bias is sometimes called confbias.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #117 on: August 17, 2018, 12:28:59 pm »

Iím not worried that Iíd look suscious, rather I was trying to find some reason to vote one way of another since it seems so rando.

But two of the veterans targeting the new kid....that seems all kinds of scummy.
Why is that scummy?

Is 3 a less scummy number than 2?

Vote: WestCoastDidds
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #118 on: August 17, 2018, 12:38:04 pm »


Why is that scummy?

Is 3 a less scummy number than 2?

Vote: WestCoastDidds

I thought the point was ask questions and learn, but that just leads to votes. So, if I want to keep playing, better to just watch? The only thing Iíve learned so far, other than the acronyms (thank you) is engagement is bad.

WestCoastDidds

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #119 on: August 17, 2018, 12:39:20 pm »

Sorry....I didnít mean to make my text part of your quote.

I thought the point was ask questions and learn, but that just leads to votes. So, if I want to keep playing, better to just watch? The only thing Iíve learned so far, other than the acronyms (thank you) is engagement is bad.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #120 on: August 17, 2018, 12:42:35 pm »

I thought the point was ask questions and learn, but that just leads to votes. So, if I want to keep playing, better to just watch? The only thing Iíve learned so far, other than the acronyms (thank you) is engagement is bad.

So this is an interesting post. I suspect that you probably suspect that we think engagement is actually good. Therefore, you put pressure on us to stop voting for you in order to prove that it's actually good.

Would you agree or deny that this was your intention?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #121 on: August 17, 2018, 12:44:49 pm »

I thought the point was ask questions and learn, but that just leads to votes. So, if I want to keep playing, better to just watch? The only thing Iíve learned so far, other than the acronyms (thank you) is engagement is bad.

That's really the wrong lesson to take away from this. I'm not voting you because you asked questions, I'm voting for you because of your reaction to pressure. It would still take 2 more votes to lynch you and there is plenty of time left in the day for people to change their minds. Don't just throw up your hands and give up hope, I know it can be frustrating.

For the record, the other person I most want to be voting for right now is muenstercheese, so that's how lurking works out.

Take a deep breath, think about it, and answer some questions:
1. Is it scummy that Faust voted for you? Why or why not?
2. Why is it scummy that Silverspawn voted for you?
3. Is it scummy that I voted for you? Why or why not?
4. Other than the three of us, you, and muenster, who do you think is most likely to be TOWN in this game?
5. Why?

None of these have objective answers, but they are all questions worth thinking about and answering, both for yourself and to help people read you.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #122 on: August 17, 2018, 12:49:15 pm »

Sorry....I didnít mean to make my text part of your quote.

I thought the point was ask questions and learn, but that just leads to votes. So, if I want to keep playing, better to just watch? The only thing Iíve learned so far, other than the acronyms (thank you) is engagement is bad.

I donít think your engagement is the problem, I would think itís just how squirrelly your engagement has been his far. You look a touch guilty.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #123 on: August 17, 2018, 12:55:29 pm »

Iím not worried that Iíd look suscious, rather I was trying to find some reason to vote one way of another since it seems so rando.

But two of the veterans targeting the new kid....that seems all kinds of scummy.
Why is that scummy?

Is 3 a less scummy number than 2?

Vote: WestCoastDidds
Meh.

Vote: UoS
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #124 on: August 17, 2018, 01:06:25 pm »

Am I coming across like I have multiple personality disorder here?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #125 on: August 17, 2018, 01:15:52 pm »

I thought the point was ask questions and learn, but that just leads to votes. So, if I want to keep playing, better to just watch? The only thing Iíve learned so far, other than the acronyms (thank you) is engagement is bad.

So this is an interesting post. I suspect that you probably suspect that we think engagement is actually good. Therefore, you put pressure on us to stop voting for you in order to prove that it's actually good.

Would you agree or deny that this was your intention?

No real intention of any sort. Just pointing out that this is what is happening. Mostly, Iím just confused. Earlier someone said we need to engage, we need to vote!  So I tried that out. Result= people vote for me. The people who are just chilling (Alina, Muenster) are far safer. So there must be some lower level of engagement that is preferable.

I also donít have a sense of why folks are voting. When someone gave me a good reason, I followed it and that made me look guilty, or squirrely or whatever. So, perhaps I need to be less forthcoming and more observant. (Which is probably true IRL, too.)

Thanks for the help, UoS. Itís helpful to know how yaíll are thinking about things and the kinds of questions that I should consider.

So, what happens next? How do we get more/better information? What happens when day one ends?

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #126 on: August 17, 2018, 01:30:38 pm »

Mostly, Iím just confused. Earlier someone said we need to engage, we need to vote!  So I tried that out. Result= people vote for me. The people who are just chilling (Alina, Muenster) are far safer. So there must be some lower level of engagement that is preferable.
I have felt this way so many times. As you may have noticed, I tend to be more talkative than average. I feel like most games that gets me initially townread and then a certain amount of scumreads no matter what I do. But it's not because I talk, it's because I say a bunch of stuff and sooner or later some of it makes people think I'm scummy. Lurkers have less shots at this and so it can feel bad, but you can also often talk your way out of being lynched just like you talk your way into it.

Quote
I also donít have a sense of why folks are voting.
Admittedly the reasons are all still a bit weaker right now, but it's no longer random. Sometimes people are cagey about their reasons. In my case it was partly to see how you reacted to increased pressure and partly because of how you had reacted to pressure so far.

Quote
When someone gave me a good reason, I followed it and that made me look guilty, or squirrely or whatever. So, perhaps I need to be less forthcoming and more observant. (Which is probably true IRL, too.)
You should try to think for yourself. You should definitely look at being more observant, but there's nothing wrong with being forthcoming.

Incidentally, this kind of thing is part of what is making you look suspicious, it looks like you're appealing to everyone's emotions rather than logic, like we should pity you and therefore not vote for you, which can be a good scum tactic. (I do know it can also come out of genuine frustration, but that's some of what I'm seeing at least.)

Quote
So, what happens next? How do we get more/better information? What happens when day one ends?
Well one thing you could do is literally answer the questions I gave you. Think about them, (also, I don't really think Silverspawn was scummy for that, I phrased it that way because you had commented that it was and I want to know why you said that.)

Day 1 ends when we lynch someone. That person dies and gets access to a spectator thread where a few other people have probably already posted some of their observations of the game. We go to Night where only the scumteam can talk, they pick a townie to die and the next Day, that person goes to the spectator thread and can't post here anymore either, Power Roles have their results and everyone has 2 players who we absolutely know the alignment of. If I'm still alive I then look back at Day 1 in light of those two new things I know and see if it changes my opinion on anything.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #127 on: August 17, 2018, 01:48:22 pm »

Thanks for the insight. I appreciate the help.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #128 on: August 17, 2018, 02:00:30 pm »

For the record, my vote was entirely for pressure. Now is the first time that I think I have some kind of read, and it's a town read on WCD. Don't particularly want to explain why.

back to vote: uncle
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #129 on: August 18, 2018, 01:36:17 pm »

Seriously guys? I waited a day hoping someone would ask me what I thought of Faustís vote on me so I could respond with ďmehĒ and now it wonít be funny at all.

MuensterCheese is a couple hours away from the 2nd prod

@Alinatolm: Aside from whether or not you should focus on experienced or inexperienced players, what other thoughts do you have? Did my push on WestCoastDidds seem more towny or more scummy to you? Why?

Vote: Uncleeurope
You being this quiet I know is unusual. Trying not to draw attention while subtly defending me out of the gate?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #130 on: August 18, 2018, 01:37:32 pm »

Hm. This game is hard to get a good feeling of, but I can't help to get a new!scum- vibe from Westcoast. Let's see what some real pressure might do: vote: Westcoast
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #131 on: August 18, 2018, 01:39:17 pm »

Hm. This game is hard to get a good feeling of, but I can't help to get a new!scum- vibe from Westcoast. Let's see what some real pressure might do: vote: Westcoast

Interesting timing
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #132 on: August 18, 2018, 01:48:58 pm »

Hm. This game is hard to get a good feeling of, but I can't help to get a new!scum- vibe from Westcoast. Let's see what some real pressure might do: vote: Westcoast

Interesting timing

You think?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #133 on: August 18, 2018, 01:56:18 pm »

There is no recipe for getting a game started. We just joke around until reads form and then it goes from there. Sometimes that happens more quickly than other times. This is one of the slowest games in memory. A bit unfortunate as an introduction.

I was hoping to cause some kind of drama with my bossy "everyone vote" post, even just someone saying I was scummy for it or discussing it or anything

As it looks right now we're headed towards lynching someone with fairly little information. I think it can't be a vet. There are only three. If we lynch one and one dies in the night there's only one. If that one is scum, that's super bad news.

So probably a lynch ona new player is incoming. I don't want it to be WCD, but I'm still fairly undecided between the others.

uncle is my defualt pick. If you are town, then prove it.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #134 on: August 18, 2018, 03:40:17 pm »

The arg for saving the vets is solid.

Muenstercheese was my vote a while back, and still is because if we are going to vote out a new person, they are the one we know the least about. Literally one post that was just a vote. Alina has shared marginally more, but very little as well. Uncleeurope too, yeah?

I have shared all my wide-eyed innocence. If itís scummy, Iím not sure how and also unsure how else Iíd learn to play.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #135 on: August 18, 2018, 04:05:17 pm »

Simon Jester targeting me, tho? Seems weird since he was for rooting out lurkers and I am dr ideally not.

Interesting timing, indeed.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #136 on: August 18, 2018, 04:41:14 pm »

I'm sorry. I just figured out that last time I played Mafia several years ago. And in real life it's so different, you know. You can see emotional reaction from people, who you often already know. It makes process easy because you can guess based on it. Now it's too complicated, and I just read the conversation and try to catch something. But for the moment I haven't any ideas. But! The theory of probability says that every time you need to make an opinion about who is a scum, you should pick different person from previous time. So I'll make a try

vote: faust
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #137 on: August 18, 2018, 04:45:50 pm »

Muenstercheese was my vote a while back, and still is because if we are going to vote out a new person, they are the one we know the least about. Literally one post that was just a vote.
Yes, but I am hoping that we will get a replacement here.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #138 on: August 18, 2018, 04:47:26 pm »

The theory of probability says that every time you need to make an opinion about who is a scum, you should pick different person from previous time.
Does it though?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #139 on: August 18, 2018, 04:48:13 pm »

Hm. This game is hard to get a good feeling of, but I can't help to get a new!scum- vibe from Westcoast. Let's see what some real pressure might do: vote: Westcoast
Do you think the previous pressure on WCD was fake pressure, and if so, why?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #140 on: August 18, 2018, 04:51:02 pm »

I think WCD, alina and silver are town.

Scummy people are UoS and Simon. I could maybe be convinced against lynching the vet, though Simon doesn't really count as a newbie in my book.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #141 on: August 18, 2018, 05:38:07 pm »

UoS is scummy? Why?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #142 on: August 18, 2018, 06:12:34 pm »

I think WCD, alina and silver are town.

Scummy people are UoS and Simon. I could maybe be convinced against lynching the vet, though Simon doesn't really count as a newbie in my book.
Odd people to have a scumvibe on, especially together. UoS feel very townie so far and it's not by their activity as such, it just feel too jittery to be from scum. Your read on me I have no clue on what you are basing it on. I feel I haven't really been engaged in the game yet to be anything than null for most players..

When it comes to WCD my hunch is coming from this post:

No real intention of any sort. Just pointing out that this is what is happening. Mostly, Iím just confused. Earlier someone said we need to engage, we need to vote!  So I tried that out. Result= people vote for me. The people who are just chilling (Alina, Muenster) are far safer. So there must be some lower level of engagement that is preferable.

I also donít have a sense of why folks are voting. When someone gave me a good reason, I followed it and that made me look guilty, or squirrely or whatever. So, perhaps I need to be less forthcoming and more observant. (Which is probably true IRL, too.)

Thanks for the help, UoS. Itís helpful to know how yaíll are thinking about things and the kinds of questions that I should consider.

So, what happens next? How do we get more/better information? What happens when day one ends?
 
It reads to me as new!scum trying something in the game, gets heat for it and gets confused and a bit scared but manages to hide it behind being new and flustered generally. It's not much, but it strikes out to me every time I reread.

I might have missed if WCD was on 3 votes before, but that I put them there was what I was referring to anyway.

Faust feels unusually townie and the same goes for silvers.. that is almost scary, but I see the point that we should avoid vets for D1.

Is there any case for Uncleeurope by the way, why are people voting there?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #143 on: August 18, 2018, 07:45:54 pm »

Thanks for the prod! I know what my favorite animal is, but not that the game had started.

Alas, voting for lurkers is no bueno. Especially when they are the new newbs. Look at my delightful headgehog outfit. Itís totally town wear.

Voting lurkers is always bueno, newb or not. There can be better cases but chances to catch scum among low posters is always rather high so Lynch All Lurkers Literally is a saying here that is good to listen to.

Scummy vibe from you. Hm.

Simon has been anti-WCD for the start, and then followed it up with ďreal pressureĒ comment. Seems like a lot of effort to sway folks against me without any real reason other than noting I have lots of basic questions.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #144 on: August 19, 2018, 03:46:24 am »

UoS is scummy? Why?
I don't like the way he jumped on the WCD wagon,, did not seem genuine. Also we have seen a lot of posts and none of them made me feel any particular town vibe. A lot of them were very explainy, and it's certainly also good for town to do that, but I would expect town to also do other things that are notable and move the game and UoS has been a bit too distant from the game for my taste.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #145 on: August 19, 2018, 03:49:04 am »

Request replacement for muentercheese

It has been 48 hours since that last post, rules states people are subject to replacement at the second prod.

hypercube is also up for prodding soon.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #146 on: August 19, 2018, 03:57:56 am »

Thanks for the prod! I know what my favorite animal is, but not that the game had started.

Alas, voting for lurkers is no bueno. Especially when they are the new newbs. Look at my delightful headgehog outfit. Itís totally town wear.

Voting lurkers is always bueno, newb or not. There can be better cases but chances to catch scum among low posters is always rather high so Lynch All Lurkers Literally is a saying here that is good to listen to.

Scummy vibe from you. Hm.

Simon has been anti-WCD for the start, and then followed it up with ďreal pressureĒ comment. Seems like a lot of effort to sway folks against me without any real reason other than noting I have lots of basic questions.

Yes, you have yet to give me a reason to see you as town. It's not your questions as is, it's more of a tone where you seem.. a tad too worried and self-aware. And you are already accusing me of tunneling you when I'm basically trying out my first real scumread this game. Doesn't really help your case.

Second scum is probably among muenstercheese/hypercube, a bit sad if both of them is gone.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #147 on: August 19, 2018, 04:09:20 am »

Yes, you have yet to give me a reason to see you as town. It's not your questions as is, it's more of a tone where you seem.. a tad too worried and self-aware. And you are already accusing me of tunneling you when I'm basically trying out my first real scumread this game. Doesn't really help your case.
I don't want to open a whole can of worms... but I think this is more a character-thing than an alignment one.

Second scum is probably among muenstercheese/hypercube, a bit sad if both of them is gone.
Why should this be the case?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #148 on: August 19, 2018, 04:16:36 am »

Second scum is probably among muenstercheese/hypercube, a bit sad if both of them is gone.
Why should this be the case?
[/quote]

I have no other scumread than WCD, all others seems fairly townie which makes me assume last scum could be among the players not actually playing. 
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #149 on: August 19, 2018, 04:32:47 am »

So can you explain why you think the other are all townie?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #150 on: August 19, 2018, 04:58:40 am »

I think I already have done that to some extent to be honest, but sure:

UoS activity I read as town. You have a point that his post is not too game- oriented, but I would almost feel that a happy scum!UoS would focus more on being pro-town in that way in his first posts. Could be swayed here I guess, but right now I lean townie on him.

You are your usual pro-town you and it's easy to townread you by default. I have seen nothing that defer to that this game.

Silver is the same, a useful and good vet. Has done nothing to make the game weird or crazy, even though he said he tried to do that with the votething I think his suggestion was good and moved the game forward somewhat.
 
I liked Alinas posts, there is a confidence there that comes off as townie to me. Would need some more activity to have a more confident read though. Why do you read them as town? 

Uncleeurope is perfectly and utterly null, if anyone can weigh in on them I would appreciate it.

hypercube and muenstercheese left and yeah, wouldn't blow my mind if there is one scum there.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #151 on: August 19, 2018, 07:56:55 am »

Uncleeurope is perfectly and utterly null, if anyone can weigh in on them I would appreciate it.
So you think that Unlce is null, but at the same time:

all others seems fairly townie

Which one is it?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #152 on: August 19, 2018, 08:01:20 am »

I liked Alinas posts, there is a confidence there that comes off as townie to me. Would need some more activity to have a more confident read though. Why do you read them as town? 
Mostly just gut reads. The votes she placed seemed to come from a newbie!town perspective.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #153 on: August 19, 2018, 08:15:29 am »

/tag
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #154 on: August 19, 2018, 08:24:02 am »

Uncleeurope is perfectly and utterly null, if anyone can weigh in on them I would appreciate it.
So you think that Unlce is null, but at the same time:

all others seems fairly townie
Which one is it?

Fairly. That was including null to townreads. Waiting for the case on uncle to be better explained, until then I'm fine with "fairly townie" on them for sure.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #155 on: August 19, 2018, 08:35:43 am »

Vote Count 1.4

UmbrageOfSnow (1): faust
alinatolm (1): Uncleeurope
muenstercheese (2): WestCoastDidds, Simon Jester
silverspawn (1): hypercube
Uncleeurope (2): silverspawn, UmbrageOfSnow
faust (1): alinatolm
Not Voting (1): muenstercheese

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, August 22 at 5am forum time.

hypercube prodded, replacemewnt for muenstercheese is on the way.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #156 on: August 19, 2018, 08:46:16 am »

Huh, I thought WCD would be at 3 votes and now there is none there..

Both ss and faust moved away yeah, but mine wasn't counted.

vote: Westcoastdidds to have my stance on record.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #157 on: August 19, 2018, 08:53:59 am »

Real life got amped up right as I was voted for, and I knew my next post would me a bit more mentally taxing than he average one, so I put it off.

That being said, my case it that since a decent chunk of people are saying cheese has a good shot at being evil. (At least from what I can tell, a lot of people appear to be saying opinions halfwayishly.) Well, cheese voted for me. That's the best defense I got right now.

If a replacement for cheese is inevitable, I would like to wait a bit to see how his replacement responds before settling a vote in that direction.

As for my vote on Alin, I still can't shake the scum read I had there completely, but I feel weathered down by all the positive reactions you people are having to her. the next people on my list here are cheese, cube, and I have a weird feeling about faust. (Mainly because he seems really nit-picky about phrasing, he honestly could be fine)

Ehhh, don't wanna vote for cheese until a replacement is figured out... So I guess... Vote: Faust (Yes, I realize I skipped over cube in my list, so sue me, this vote is more interesting)

Also, side note, I find it hilarious that this is a newbie game, and the strat has become to save the vets. I get the logic, it just amuses me immensely.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #158 on: August 19, 2018, 09:14:05 am »

who or what is cheese?


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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #159 on: August 19, 2018, 09:24:04 am »

who or what is cheese?

Muenstercheese, I think

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #161 on: August 19, 2018, 10:39:28 am »

The theory of probability says that every time you need to make an opinion about who is a scum, you should pick different person from previous time. So I'll make a try

vote: faust

I'm curious as to what this theory of probability is.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #162 on: August 19, 2018, 10:42:58 am »

Happy Sunday! I just had cookies for breakfast so itís sure to be a good day. The predicted high is 104F, though, so maybe I am speaking too soon. Nothing like having to hide inside because the planet is roasting. Good times!

Anyway....so Muenstercheese is to be replaced? Does that mean new folks will slot into their roles and we kind of start from scratch on reading them, on our current time line?

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #163 on: August 19, 2018, 10:47:18 am »

alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #164 on: August 19, 2018, 10:50:44 am »

Apologies for not posting yesterday, although I disagree with Simon's characterization of me as "not playing."
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #165 on: August 19, 2018, 11:05:46 am »

Apologies for not posting yesterday, although I disagree with Simon's characterization of me as "not playing."

Sorry, was just refering to the prodding-business. Please feel free to make me notice you further.

Actually, a reread of you makes me fairly suspicious of you. Short posts, no strong stances really. I know it's hard to get into a game, but you give off a feeling that you don't really want anything to happen. You criticised me for jokingly trying to incite an omgus- argument and silver for his voting proposal. A stagnate game is good for scum, I think you just might be the scum I assumed would be found among you and muenstercheese.

So.. are you?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #166 on: August 19, 2018, 11:10:17 am »

alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?

I believe Europe is voting faust for his nitpicky attitude, mainly showing against me above. I think this is wrong, it's a bit annoying but probably a good scumhunt- method which I assume is what is going on. 

I agree though that alinas vote is a bit out of place. What more than the "probability argument" is there for the vote, alinas? Do you have any further scumreads? 
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #167 on: August 19, 2018, 11:25:32 am »

Happy Sunday! I just had cookies for breakfast so itís sure to be a good day. The predicted high is 104F, though, so maybe I am speaking too soon. Nothing like having to hide inside because the planet is roasting. Good times!

Anyway....so Muenstercheese is to be replaced? Does that mean new folks will slot into their roles and we kind of start from scratch on reading them, on our current time line?

Yup. (on both counts)
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #168 on: August 19, 2018, 11:26:29 am »

faust asking questions is a very faust thing to do. I also think it's a pro-town thing to so. it's definitely not a town tell, because he'd do it as scum, but it's not a scum tell, either.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #169 on: August 19, 2018, 11:30:12 am »

alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?

I mean, I felt I was fairly transparent, about my reasoning, you can disagree with the reasoning as Jester does, but the reasoning still exists. I am prodding a prodded.

The snarky side of myself wants to throw a vote at you now with no explaination given just for fun, but I have just given the explaination (ďfor funĒ) so I guess itís too late. Bummer.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #170 on: August 19, 2018, 11:31:33 am »

alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?

I mean, I felt I was fairly transparent, about my reasoning, you can disagree with the reasoning as Jester does, but the reasoning still exists. I am prodding a prodder.

The snarky side of myself wants to throw a vote at you now with no explaination given just for fun, but I have just given the explaination (ďfor funĒ) so I guess itís too late. Bummer.

Autocorrect telling me ďprodderĒ isnít a thing, pffft.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #171 on: August 19, 2018, 11:41:38 am »

phyphor replaces muenstercheese, effective immediately. I canít do a vote count until evening
« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 01:04:50 pm by LaLight »
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #172 on: August 19, 2018, 11:45:32 am »

phyphar replaces muenstercheese, effective immediately. I canít do a vote count until evening

Welcome Phyphar! Standard questions: Any previous mafia experience, preferred pronouns and most importantly.. are you scum?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #173 on: August 19, 2018, 11:57:39 am »

Does anyone find the name "Uncle Europe" curious? I mean Europa was mythologically a woman and hence would have a hard time being an uncle. So maybe it means "uncle of Europe" some research leads me to on of her uncles: Belos, King of Egypt (and son of Poseidon).

So I think Belos should totally be a valid nickname for Uncleeurope.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #174 on: August 19, 2018, 11:59:14 am »

Nothing like having to hide inside because the planet is roasting.
Don't think we couldn't roast you as well.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #175 on: August 19, 2018, 12:09:30 pm »

Does anyone find the name "Uncle Europe" curious? I mean Europa was mythologically a woman and hence would have a hard time being an uncle. So maybe it means "uncle of Europe" some research leads me to on of her uncles: Belos, King of Egypt (and son of Poseidon).

So I think Belos should totally be a valid nickname for Uncleeurope.

The first google-post suggests it has to do with Edward VII and the creation of Entente Cordiale.. the more you know.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #176 on: August 19, 2018, 12:22:59 pm »

Nothing like having to hide inside because the planet is roasting.
Don't think we couldn't roast you as well.

True enough. Thus, the importance of cookie breakfast. Because if your gonna get fried, at least you enjoyed some quality baked good satisfaction along the way.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #177 on: August 19, 2018, 12:28:42 pm »

Does anyone find the name "Uncle Europe" curious? I mean Europa was mythologically a woman and hence would have a hard time being an uncle. So maybe it means "uncle of Europe" some research leads me to on of her uncles: Belos, King of Egypt (and son of Poseidon).

So I think Belos should totally be a valid nickname for Uncleeurope.

I am going to pretend that a logical reasoning behind my name exists. Mainly because listening to over people attempt to decipher it is a lot more enjoyable than expected.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #178 on: August 19, 2018, 12:31:31 pm »

Does anyone find the name "Uncle Europe" curious? I mean Europa was mythologically a woman and hence would have a hard time being an uncle. So maybe it means "uncle of Europe" some research leads me to on of her uncles: Belos, King of Egypt (and son of Poseidon).

So I think Belos should totally be a valid nickname for Uncleeurope.

I am going to pretend that a logical reasoning behind my name exists. Mainly because listening to other people attempt to decipher it is a lot more enjoyable than expected.

Fixed

I need to stop doing this on my phone.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #179 on: August 19, 2018, 12:50:49 pm »

phyphar replaces muenstercheese, effective immediately. I canít do a vote count until evening

Welcome Phyphar! Standard questions: Any previous mafia experience, preferred pronouns and most importantly.. are you scum?

0) LaLight can't spell - my name is phyphor
1) Yes
2) it/its
3) no


Vote: Uncleeurope

Partially to save my own back, but also because setting up three of us to share the votes (by switching to Faust) means we are unlikely to lynch on Day 1.

In general we want to lynch every day, but whilst Day 1 is a day with little information which makes it hard to do a good lynching if we don't lynch anyone we run the risk of having the Mafia take out the good townies (be it because they're good at Mafia or have had to role-claim to save their skin).
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #180 on: August 19, 2018, 12:58:33 pm »

Partially to save my own back, but also because setting up three of us to share the votes (by switching to Faust) means we are unlikely to lynch on Day 1.

In general we want to lynch every day, but whilst Day 1 is a day with little information which makes it hard to do a good lynching if we don't lynch anyone we run the risk of having the Mafia take out the good townies (be it because they're good at Mafia or have had to role-claim to save their skin).

It's unclear if you mean that a no-lynch D1 is good or not. It's very much NOT good to no-lynch here. Sure, due to the little information we have it's likely we are hitting town, but the information the lynch is gathering is key to have a useful D2. Without a lynch we are doomed to repeat D1 only with fewer players left.

Maf will most likely kill out the best/towniest town players by their NK no matter what we do. Scum has not that much influence over our lynch though, which is why it's so important to use, also in D1.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #181 on: August 19, 2018, 01:19:51 pm »

Apologies for not posting yesterday, although I disagree with Simon's characterization of me as "not playing."

Sorry, was just refering to the prodding-business. Please feel free to make me notice you further.

Actually, a reread of you makes me fairly suspicious of you. Short posts, no strong stances really. I know it's hard to get into a game, but you give off a feeling that you don't really want anything to happen. You criticised me for jokingly trying to incite an omgus- argument and silver for his voting proposal. A stagnate game is good for scum, I think you just might be the scum I assumed would be found among you and muenstercheese.

So.. are you?

There hasn't been too much analysis to do thus far; there's been lots of posts without any content which I'm able to use to make reads. I would rather not contribute to that unless I have something actually helpful to say. My reads early on were focused on looking for people who seemed like they were trying to be helpful without actually being helpful, which caused me to scumread you and silver somewhat. My criticism of silver wasn't that he made the voting proposal, but rather that he made it while placing a vote that didn't inspire discussion.

I'm town, as I've already pointed out.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #182 on: August 19, 2018, 01:23:30 pm »

alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?

I mean, I felt I was fairly transparent, about my reasoning, you can disagree with the reasoning as Jester does, but the reasoning still exists. I am prodding a prodded.

The snarky side of myself wants to throw a vote at you now with no explaination given just for fun, but I have just given the explaination (ďfor funĒ) so I guess itís too late. Bummer.

Voting for someone because they're nitpicking seems pretty arbitrary. What makes the nitpicking scummy specifically?

I'm happy to vote for Uncleeurope but am holding off for now to not put him at L-1.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #183 on: August 19, 2018, 01:30:41 pm »

Apologies for not posting yesterday, although I disagree with Simon's characterization of me as "not playing."

Sorry, was just refering to the prodding-business. Please feel free to make me notice you further.

Actually, a reread of you makes me fairly suspicious of you. Short posts, no strong stances really. I know it's hard to get into a game, but you give off a feeling that you don't really want anything to happen. You criticised me for jokingly trying to incite an omgus- argument and silver for his voting proposal. A stagnate game is good for scum, I think you just might be the scum I assumed would be found among you and muenstercheese.

So.. are you?

There hasn't been too much analysis to do thus far; there's been lots of posts without any content which I'm able to use to make reads. I would rather not contribute to that unless I have something actually helpful to say. My reads early on were focused on looking for people who seemed like they were trying to be helpful without actually being helpful, which caused me to scumread you and silver somewhat. My criticism of silver wasn't that he made the voting proposal, but rather that he made it while placing a vote that didn't inspire discussion.

I'm town, as I've already pointed out.

Well, there is a little more to go on by now, I would say. Care to share any reads?

ppe

Again: Is there a case against Eddie I can look closer into?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #184 on: August 19, 2018, 01:32:45 pm »

2) it/its

Wait, really? I don't have a problem with that but it strikes me as so unusual that I want to make sure you aren't joking.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #185 on: August 19, 2018, 01:34:24 pm »

Eddie?

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #186 on: August 19, 2018, 02:00:46 pm »

alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?

I mean, I felt I was fairly transparent, about my reasoning, you can disagree with the reasoning as Jester does, but the reasoning still exists. I am prodding a prodded.

The snarky side of myself wants to throw a vote at you now with no explaination given just for fun, but I have just given the explaination (ďfor funĒ) so I guess itís too late. Bummer.

Voting for someone because they're nitpicking seems pretty arbitrary. What makes the nitpicking scummy specifically?

I'm happy to vote for Uncleeurope but am holding off for now to not put him at L-1.

Nothing makes nitpicking scummy specifically, it is, however, the reason that caused to to raise an eyebrow in his direction. Often times I have seen the baddies in these games jump on things that look like logical inconsistencies, but are actually just phrasing discrepancies and claim that there is a deeper meaning to be found. (Ima be honest, I do this when I am a baddie, write that one down) It is a good way to seem like you are contributing to sleuthing, while actually just saying nothing significant.

The whole "Aha! Gottem!" vibe he gave me when comparing two statements made by Jester was a bit odd. Honestly I know little about Faust's play style and it seems this is normal behavior for him. Fair enough, helpful information I didn't know prior and now know, thanks to me voting. Ima count it as a win.

Sadly the two people at the top of my list (The newly acquired Phyphor and our friend cube, here) both seem to have an interest in ending my life. Which is unfortunate, any vote to them will now look self-defensive. Does that mean I won't vote for them at all? No, as you are probably already aware due to the bold font that drew your eyes immediately: Ima Vote: hypercube

He doesn't have a vote yes, as far as I can see, and that makes him a safer pick than phyphor.
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #187 on: August 19, 2018, 02:12:56 pm »

Eddie?

Sorry, was referring to Uncleeurope, but the wiki-article about Edward VII was really intense. Cool dude, fascinating era.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #188 on: August 19, 2018, 02:22:34 pm »

Eddie is a great nickname.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #189 on: August 19, 2018, 02:38:22 pm »

Nothing makes nitpicking scummy specifically, it is, however, the reason that caused to to raise an eyebrow in his direction. Often times I have seen the baddies in these games jump on things that look like logical inconsistencies, but are actually just phrasing discrepancies and claim that there is a deeper meaning to be found. (Ima be honest, I do this when I am a baddie, write that one down) It is a good way to seem like you are contributing to sleuthing, while actually just saying nothing significant.
I still think it was a logical inconstency. Simon argued that two lurkers should have one scum among them because the others are all townie, and then it turned out he doesn't actually townread everyone else, so it doesn't make much sense to narrow it down to those two, it was arbitrary and he could have included you, but didn't. Which strikes me as manipulative because had he ended up with "1 of those 3 is probably scum", it would be harder to justify a vote on them.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #190 on: August 19, 2018, 02:45:25 pm »

Partially to save my own back, but also because setting up three of us to share the votes (by switching to Faust) means we are unlikely to lynch on Day 1.
We are not close to the deadline, so I don't think there is anything wrong - or scummy - in not consolidating wagons yet.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #191 on: August 19, 2018, 02:48:14 pm »

Nothing makes nitpicking scummy specifically, it is, however, the reason that caused to to raise an eyebrow in his direction. Often times I have seen the baddies in these games jump on things that look like logical inconsistencies, but are actually just phrasing discrepancies and claim that there is a deeper meaning to be found. (Ima be honest, I do this when I am a baddie, write that one down) It is a good way to seem like you are contributing to sleuthing, while actually just saying nothing significant.
I still think it was a logical inconstency. Simon argued that two lurkers should have one scum among them because the others are all townie, and then it turned out he doesn't actually townread everyone else, so it doesn't make much sense to narrow it down to those two, it was arbitrary and he could have included you, but didn't. Which strikes me as manipulative because had he ended up with "1 of those 3 is probably scum", it would be harder to justify a vote on them.

Yeah, that's fair.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #192 on: August 19, 2018, 03:16:57 pm »

How many times, would you estimate, that we have to go back and read from the start? Does that happen over and over again. Anyway, it was a good exercise.

"Appearing to be helpful without actually being helpful" (proposed by both Uncle and Simon) seems a useful criteria, and by that one Hypercube is aces. Lots of one-line commentary that revealed little, and jumping on the Uncle wagon, but remarking on the kindness of being amenable but not wanting to but him on L-1, seems an attempt to bolster his town-cred without actually having to do anything. My current most scummy.

Uncle Eddie doesn't seem at all concerned to have a heap of votes, and says Phy and HyperC are at the top of his list. I am not exactly sure why, though. If one of them was his scum partner would he be elevating them like that? Or is it fairly low risk regardless since Phy is new to the game and there hasn't been much discussion of HyperC?  More scummy than town for me but just barely.

Simon seems to be trying to get things going and stirring things up. Other than his squeamishness about me, its been rather erratic, but when he draws down on Hypercube, the response was along the lines well, there hasn't been much to say and I don't want to chatter needlessly. Faust saying that Simon doesn't really count as a newb is interesting, too. Still, it doesn't really feel like he is working with anyone so townish. But I am more on the fence about him than other towns.

silver and Faust have a townie feel, and have shared their thinking about who is town, etc earlier on in a "the vets can show you how we do" way that I found helpful. The nitpicking actually serves to remind me that this particular fora is one where words matter because its all we've got to go on.

Alina seems about as freshly scrubbed as I am, and isn't really trying to move the game forward at all, so townish. I feel like that is where I am at as well.  I am not moving the game forward other than sharing information about myself and asking questions, so many questions.   

What has become of UofS???  He was all over and now crickets.  I don't have a scummy feeling about that necessarily because he didn't stir the pot significantly before fading, but it is different. Maybe that is just weekend real life?

So, I have five townish to some extent (Simon, silver, faust, alina, WCD)
Two scummyish (HyperC, Uncle)
Two need more info: Phy and Umbrage

My vote was on Muenster before so I think I am currently without a vote. Vote: Hypercube

Also, Eddie is a GREAT nickname for such a grand handle as UncleEurope.


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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #193 on: August 19, 2018, 03:25:05 pm »

How many times, would you estimate, that we have to go back and read from the start? Does that happen over and over again. Anyway, it was a good exercise.
Usually you would do it at most once after D1. There is also the option of targeted reread, where you only read through a specific player's posts, which will occur more frequently.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #194 on: August 19, 2018, 03:48:09 pm »


Great post, and I agree with much of your observations. Sorry about the "erratic" case against you, the vibe I observed in your earlier posts isn't here at all so I will leave it for now, I think. First hunches are what they are.

I wonder a bit about your view of Alina. Do you think it is townie to not move the game forward or are you just giving her sort of a newbie-pass in general? I'm eager to hear her responses to what have happened recently, right now she sinks a little bit into the scummier areas, more because of vagueness than anything else.

UoS disappearance is odd, yeah. If he wasn't experienced/vet I would almost assume he got scared of Faust and others scumreading him, but nah. Probably V/LA.

And finally, pleased to not be alone with my read on hypercube. That's where I want to go now. vote: Hypercube
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #195 on: August 19, 2018, 03:56:25 pm »

How many times, would you estimate, that we have to go back and read from the start? Does that happen over and over again. Anyway, it was a good exercise.
Usually you would do it at most once after D1. There is also the option of targeted reread, where you only read through a specific player's posts, which will occur more frequently.

Oh, on that note. May I ask new players to get a signature? Doesn't have to be anything fancy, just something that makes it possible to search especially for your posts when rereading.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #196 on: August 19, 2018, 04:03:38 pm »

By signature you mean the text at the bottom of the post? like your cor.ax?

Also, what is VLA? Thanks

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #197 on: August 19, 2018, 04:10:13 pm »

By signature you mean the text at the bottom of the post? like your cor.ax?

Also, what is VLA? Thanks

Yes, precisely. Profile>Modify profile>Forum profile.

Vacation/Low access. If you know that you probably won't be able to post in some time it's good to announce it beforehand. There is a special thread for it here somewhere.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #198 on: August 19, 2018, 05:58:15 pm »

"Appearing to be helpful without actually being helpful" (proposed by both Uncle and Simon) seems a useful criteria, and by that one Hypercube is aces. Lots of one-line commentary that revealed little, and jumping on the Uncle wagon, but remarking on the kindness of being amenable but not wanting to but him on L-1, seems an attempt to bolster his town-cred without actually having to do anything. My current most scummy.

Uncle Eddie doesn't seem at all concerned to have a heap of votes, and says Phy and HyperC are at the top of his list. I am not exactly sure why, though. If one of them was his scum partner would he be elevating them like that? Or is it fairly low risk regardless since Phy is new to the game and there hasn't been much discussion of HyperC?  More scummy than town for me but just barely.

The first bit kinda answers about my opinion on Hypercube, you and I both came to the same conclusion there. He is trying to sound helpful but isn't saying anything new. (He also offered to kill me if other people were up to it in a weird way, like he was hoping the blood wouldn't be on his hands, super sketchy...) As for Phy, him piggybacking off of cheese, who was uber-scummish, doesn't help his case. I know they have the same role.

Then phy comes in with the goal of not lynching anyone while putting me at vote #3. Super aggressive way to not kill someone. His initial post just struck me as odd, and I get the feeling that would be the case regardless of who he voted for, but I am willing to admit that defensive bias might play into this. I dunno, phy just doesn't sit right with me. And this confusion is ultimately why I went with cube first.

As for the possibility that one of my partners resides with Cube or Phy, the obvious counter would be I am voting for cube and phy is voting for me. And while such things are not proof (votin' for friends be a strat) it is something to consider and my only defense to the claim. *Shrugs*

And as for not being concerned about being voted on a bunch, I have always thought denial is the best medicine for panic.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #199 on: August 19, 2018, 06:01:26 pm »

By signature you mean the text at the bottom of the post? like your cor.ax?

Also, what is VLA? Thanks

Yes, precisely. Profile>Modify profile>Forum profile.

Vacation/Low access. If you know that you probably won't be able to post in some time it's good to announce it beforehand. There is a special thread for it here somewhere.

Done
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #200 on: August 19, 2018, 06:12:53 pm »

Eddie, your signature is EVERYTHING!

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #201 on: August 19, 2018, 06:21:22 pm »


As for Phy, him piggybacking off of cheese, who was uber-scummish, doesn't help his case. I know they have the same role.

Then phy comes in with the goal of not lynching anyone while putting me at vote #3. Super aggressive way to not kill someone. His initial post just struck me as odd, and I get the feeling that would be the case regardless of who he voted for, but I am willing to admit that defensive bias might play into this. I dunno, phy just doesn't sit right with me.

I wonder why Muenster flaked. Was he a vanilla townie and bored by the idea? It seems like if he had been scum he might have felt more compelled to be engaged. But that is 100% impossible to know. I just wonder.

I agree on it (its pronoun choice...sigh) being weird out of the gate and the ďitís gonna be a no lunchĒ and saying zippo about itís experience. Super strange to me, but not sure if itís scummy yet.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #202 on: August 19, 2018, 06:35:36 pm »


I wonder a bit about your view of Alina. Do you think it is townie to not move the game forward or are you just giving her sort of a newbie-pass in general? I'm eager to hear her responses to what have happened recently, right now she sinks a little bit into the scummier areas, more because of vagueness than anything else.

Right now, sort of a newbie pass but the expiration date on that is nearing because her engagement level is really low and she hasnít shared much by way of impression or thoughts in any substantive manner. The longer that takes the more lurkier and scummier it appears. Of course, I am only just now getting to the impression sharing point myself so some slack is okay. That being said, I am also looking forward to her take...

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #203 on: August 19, 2018, 06:54:53 pm »

"Appearing to be helpful without actually being helpful" (proposed by both Uncle and Simon) seems a useful criteria, and by that one Hypercube is aces. Lots of one-line commentary that revealed little, and jumping on the Uncle wagon, but remarking on the kindness of being amenable but not wanting to but him on L-1, seems an attempt to bolster his town-cred without actually having to do anything. My current most scummy.

I would say that I've contributed above average to this game. My observation of your flip-flop regarding lurkers led to a significant discussion of your thoughts there. By comparison I don't think you or Europe have done much other than defend yourselves until this point.

To those who don't like my one-line commentary, well, that's how I'm finding it easiest to read and respond to things so hopefully you'll learn to cope.

Simon seems to be trying to get things going and stirring things up. Other than his squeamishness about me, its been rather erratic, but when he draws down on Hypercube, the response was along the lines well, there hasn't been much to say and I don't want to chatter needlessly. Faust saying that Simon doesn't really count as a newb is interesting, too. Still, it doesn't really feel like he is working with anyone so townish. But I am more on the fence about him than other towns.

I agree with your characterization of Simon as erratic. I've been reading him the most carefully and haven't come up with anything particularly scummy, so right now I think he's just town who rubs me the wrong way a little bit.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #204 on: August 19, 2018, 06:56:38 pm »

Oh, on that note. May I ask new players to get a signature? Doesn't have to be anything fancy, just something that makes it possible to search especially for your posts when rereading.

You can use "xyrix" to find my posts.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #205 on: August 19, 2018, 07:07:36 pm »

Well, there is a little more to go on by now, I would say. Care to share any reads?

My strongest scumread at the moment is silver, who has seemed happy to fly under the radar for most of the game. Phypor/muenstercheese have done absolutely nothing towny in their two posts. Uncleeurope's explanation of his vote against faust was decent but he retains a slightly higher than average chance of being scum in my eyes.

You, WCD, and faust are my townreads so far. I agree with the general consensus that WCD did a towny job of talking themselves out of trouble, and faust's thinking has been tracking my own fairly well thus far. The others are null for lack of information mostly.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #206 on: August 20, 2018, 03:32:18 am »

Great post, and I agree with much of your observations. Sorry about the "erratic" case against you, the vibe I observed in your earlier posts isn't here at all so I will leave it for now, I think. First hunches are what they are.
I don't like this at all. Simon scumread WCD, and then she makes a single (admittedly decent) post and he drops the whole thing and even apologizes (!) for making a case. This is a buddying tactic and I would expect town who actually scumreads WCD to be a bit more persistent in their reads.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #207 on: August 20, 2018, 03:48:30 am »

Gotta check out the hyper-cool new wagon we have going.

So I'm doing a targeted reread, also to show that off.

So first notable post is here:

muenstercheese is basically notorious for running away from things so it's not terribly surprising he's not here.
If the cheese/now phyphor is town, then scum!cube has little reason to talk about this. It's a soft defense of one of the at the time most lynchable player.

But in the spirit of Lynch All Lurkers
Vote:muenstercheese for being all excited and now suspiciously absent

This is a very fast turn around from "voting for lurkers is no bueno."
So here is hyper pointing out something strange about WCD's behaviour... but not following up with a vote. Note WCD has only one vote on her at that time. You can of course say that this is scum being hedgy and reluctant to vote, but actually I think scum would be pretty happy to take the opportunity to place a vote that seems more solid.

vote: father-brother-continent

This is possibly too apathetic to be scum, or at least if they're scum we can count on them to be apathetic scum.
Continued defense of cheese.

alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?
And he comes to my aid! Gotta love that rectangular polyhedron!

I'm happy to vote for Uncleeurope but am holding off for now to not put him at L-1.
This on the other hand is not great. Why do you think Eddie is scum?

My strongest scumread at the moment is silver, who has seemed happy to fly under the radar for most of the game. Phypor/muenstercheese have done absolutely nothing towny in their two posts. Uncleeurope's explanation of his vote against faust was decent but he retains a slightly higher than average chance of being scum in my eyes.

You, WCD, and faust are my townreads so far. I agree with the general consensus that WCD did a towny job of talking themselves out of trouble, and faust's thinking has been tracking my own fairly well thus far. The others are null for lack of information mostly.
And finally some reads. silver is an interesting one, I am not really seeing that but it follows naturally from what hyper posted. Interesting that he defended cheese but now puts phyphor as scummy, though it does make some sense.

Question for you, hypercube: How does it make you feel that two of your scumreads, silver and phyphor, are voting for the third, Eddie?

And this is it. I am not seeing much scumminess. I am also not seeing a lack in content that others have claimed.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #208 on: August 20, 2018, 03:54:31 am »

Full disclosure: I had a gut-felt skepticism of the hyper wagon before starting this reread. I try to not let that influence my assessment, but it is good to be aware of your own biases because you can never fully shut them out.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #209 on: August 20, 2018, 05:11:08 am »

Well, itís nice to see you guys defending each other, at least thereís consistency.

(Also, if you just wanna do one of those nice long posts clearing my name/train too, thatíd be awesome.)
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #210 on: August 20, 2018, 05:18:02 am »

Well, itís nice to see you guys defending each other, at least thereís consistency.

(Also, if you just wanna do one of those nice long posts clearing my name/train too, thatíd be awesome.)
Well I'm burnt out now... but why don't you just do it yourself?
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #211 on: August 20, 2018, 06:13:12 am »

Great post, and I agree with much of your observations. Sorry about the "erratic" case against you, the vibe I observed in your earlier posts isn't here at all so I will leave it for now, I think. First hunches are what they are.
I don't like this at all. Simon scumread WCD, and then she makes a single (admittedly decent) post and he drops the whole thing and even apologizes (!) for making a case. This is a buddying tactic and I would expect town who actually scumreads WCD to be a bit more persistent in their reads.

Stop being grumpy. I actually felt a little ashamed or "erratic" scumreading a new player mostly for them being jokey and seemingly themselves. I was a bit afraid that could scare her off and I guess that is what showing here. For a certain personality type the first times you get false accusations D1 could be pretty tough, I am that one myself and I hated the first time people used my writing style and tone as argument for scumpainting me, and I just wanted to reassure a bit that it really was "first scumread"- kind of thing from my side. Maybe unnecessary, everybody should know it's only a game after all, but still. I want the new players to enjoy their experience rather than it being too scary and confusing.

By the way Faust, you seem to think that our reads should be firm and steady already. That is very much not the case for me, this early I change almost post to post and since it was basically one post from WCD plus her generally jokeyness that gave me the scumvibe this post makes her more null, not precisely towney. I think firm reads on D1 would be a mistake, since it is built on almost nothing but gut and I think your approach here is odd. I would suspect players that tunneling people this early a lot more, but neither is really alignment-indicative, it depends on the kingdom player.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #212 on: August 20, 2018, 07:08:56 am »

Question for you, hypercube: How does it make you feel that two of your scumreads, silver and phyphor, are voting for the third, Eddie?

Silver's vote for Eddie was interesting:

For the record, my vote was entirely for pressure. Now is the first time that I think I have some kind of read, and it's a town read on WCD. Don't particularly want to explain why.

back to vote: uncle

He had never been voting there or expressing suspicion previously. Phypor/cheese's vote there was similarly unexplained. This makes the two of them look significantly worse, and moves Eddie back into nullish.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #213 on: August 20, 2018, 07:19:29 am »

Vote Count 1.6

UmbrageOfSnow (1): faust
silverspawn (1): hypercube
Uncleeurope (3): silverspawn, UmbrageOfSnow, phyphor
faust (1): alinatolm
hypercube (3): Uncleeurope, WestCoastDidds, Simon Jester

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, August 22 at 5am forum time.

replacement for alinatolm is on the way.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2018, 07:35:03 am by LaLight »
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #214 on: August 20, 2018, 07:45:35 am »

Too bad about all the replacements. It's probably good that LaLight follows through on those quickly as continued lurking can really slow things down. Unfortunately phyphor is also gone again it seems.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #215 on: August 20, 2018, 08:33:01 am »

mcmcsalot replaces alinatolm, effective immediately.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #216 on: August 20, 2018, 08:33:22 am »

Vote Count 1.7

UmbrageOfSnow (1): faust
silverspawn (1): hypercube
Uncleeurope (3): silverspawn, UmbrageOfSnow, phyphor
faust (1): mcmcsalot
hypercube (3): Uncleeurope, WestCoastDidds, Simon Jester

With 9 alive it takes 5 to lynch. Day 1 ends Wednesday, August 22 at 5am forum time.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #217 on: August 20, 2018, 08:35:01 am »

mcmcsalot replaces alinatolm, effective immediately.
Curious, I would have expected Awaclus based on how signups went.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #218 on: August 20, 2018, 08:35:56 am »


Too bad about all the replacements. It's probably good that LaLight follows through on those quickly as continued lurking can really slow things down. Unfortunately phyphor is also gone again it seems.

Too bad, indeed. We hadnít heard from her or UoS since Saturday, and it was becoming super suspicious to me. And then Phy is suspicious to everyone with the odd statements from out of the gate. With those three just absent from the conversation, I wonder if the rest of us are just looking for anything to get a read and back-biting one another due to the lack of engagement from the rest. The fact that weíre all trying to talk maybe makes us all more town than not, or no?

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #219 on: August 20, 2018, 08:36:55 am »

Also less than 48 hours to deadline. I am not super excited about either of the existing wagons. Would lynch phyphor over both. But preferably Simon or UoS.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #220 on: August 20, 2018, 08:39:48 am »


Too bad about all the replacements. It's probably good that LaLight follows through on those quickly as continued lurking can really slow things down. Unfortunately phyphor is also gone again it seems.

Too bad, indeed. We hadnít heard from her or UoS since Saturday, and it was becoming super suspicious to me. And then Phy is suspicious to everyone with the odd statements from out of the gate. With those three just absent from the conversation, I wonder if the rest of us are just looking for anything to get a read and back-biting one another due to the lack of engagement from the rest. The fact that weíre all trying to talk maybe makes us all more town than not, or no?
How active you are very rarely has anything to do with your alignment. Not posting for more than 24 hours is breaking the rules, I would hope that noone does so intentionally. The most likely explanation is that things got busy. But we should prod them as soon as we can.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #221 on: August 20, 2018, 08:53:20 am »

Now that mcmc is here, the vet thing becomes less relevant. But, hm, I don't really want to vote for any of them.

Also less than 48 hours to deadline. I am not super excited about either of the existing wagons. Would lynch phyphor over both. But preferably Simon or UoS.

let's make it happen! vote: Simon
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #222 on: August 20, 2018, 08:55:48 am »

vote: Simon
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #223 on: August 20, 2018, 09:13:26 am »

Iím completely caught up and was following along as the posts came so I havenít re-read the beginning pages yet. Faust what was your umbrage case I canít remember it at all and was really surprised when I hit a vote count with your vote on him.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #224 on: August 20, 2018, 09:17:25 am »

Oh and unvote
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #225 on: August 20, 2018, 09:17:56 am »

Just checking in to say I'm going to be a bit busy today and tomorrow and won't be able to post much.

Welcome mcmc! I posted some questions to Alina later back, would be happy if you could answer them as relevant as you can, knowing the fact that you, eh, aren't her..
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #226 on: August 20, 2018, 09:22:10 am »

Iím completely caught up and was following along as the posts came so I havenít re-read the beginning pages yet. Faust what was your umbrage case I canít remember it at all and was really surprised when I hit a vote count with your vote on him.

UoS is scummy? Why?
I don't like the way he jumped on the WCD wagon,, did not seem genuine. Also we have seen a lot of posts and none of them made me feel any particular town vibe. A lot of them were very explainy, and it's certainly also good for town to do that, but I would expect town to also do other things that are notable and move the game and UoS has been a bit too distant from the game for my taste.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #227 on: August 20, 2018, 09:26:29 am »

Iíll reread umbrage and see if I get that I actually have a case on someone else ready to go for similar reasons. Iíll post after my reread on unbradge.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #228 on: August 20, 2018, 09:49:18 am »

Woah yea umbrage has said absolutely nothing non newb aid related. I agree his vote on wcd was terrible she be town.

From following along my biggest scum read has been silverspawn. His contribution has been limited to his ďletís get everyone to voteĒ post which he claimed was to incite drama (hereís your drama). I think it was not helpful, forcing people to get reads out is best done by directly asking question and Faust does well getting everyoneís general vote/read out benefits scum because they can see where the lynch of least resistance is.

Silver also made what I think is the scummiest post of the whole game:
As it looks right now we're headed towards lynching someone with fairly little information. I think it can't be a vet. There are only three. If we lynch one and one dies in the night there's only one. If that one is scum, that's super bad news.

This is now the second time silver is inciting the idea that we need to be more directed in our reads and votes. This post comes on the 18th which is 3 days after start and 4 days before deadline way too early to be concerned about this I think. He then goes on to give a clear direction that we shouldnít be lynching a vet. This is absolutely crazy and wrong. Vets partake in newbie games to help out through tough day ones and provide tips about game theory/wording. They absolutely are no there to help lead the charge in finding scum nor should they be held to any safer standard than newbies.

With that vote: silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #229 on: August 20, 2018, 09:57:10 am »

Just checking in to say I'm going to be a bit busy today and tomorrow and won't be able to post much.

Welcome mcmc! I posted some questions to Alina later back, would be happy if you could answer them as relevant as you can, knowing the fact that you, eh, aren't her..

This is all I could find:
alina and Europe voting for faust without a stated reason is somewhat suspicious to me, explanation please?

I believe Europe is voting faust for his nitpicky attitude, mainly showing against me above. I think this is wrong, it's a bit annoying but probably a good scumhunt- method which I assume is what is going on. 

I agree though that alinas vote is a bit out of place. What more than the "probability argument" is there for the vote, alinas? Do you have any further scumreads?
And unfortunately other than her favorite animal I was left no notes as to her reads so I do not know why she was voting for Faust or what the probability argument is.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #230 on: August 20, 2018, 10:05:12 am »


Vote: Uncleeurope

Partially to save my own back, but also because setting up three of us to share the votes (by switching to Faust) means we are unlikely to lynch on Day 1.

In general we want to lynch every day, but whilst Day 1 is a day with little information which makes it hard to do a good lynching if we don't lynch anyone we run the risk of having the Mafia take out the good townies (be it because they're good at Mafia or have had to role-claim to save their skin).

This is a terrible vote. Phyphor tell me why you think uncleeurooe is scummy.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #231 on: August 20, 2018, 10:11:17 am »

From following along my biggest scum read has been silverspawn. His contribution has been limited to his ďletís get everyone to voteĒ post which he claimed was to incite drama (hereís your drama). I think it was not helpful, forcing people to get reads out is best done by directly asking question and Faust does well getting everyoneís general vote/read out benefits scum because they can see where the lynch of least resistance is.
Agreed that his way of trying to get people to vote was not particularly well thought out. I don't see why this speaks to silver's alignment.

Silver also made what I think is the scummiest post of the whole game:
As it looks right now we're headed towards lynching someone with fairly little information. I think it can't be a vet. There are only three. If we lynch one and one dies in the night there's only one. If that one is scum, that's super bad news.

This is now the second time silver is inciting the idea that we need to be more directed in our reads and votes. This post comes on the 18th which is 3 days after start and 4 days before deadline way too early to be concerned about this I think. He then goes on to give a clear direction that we shouldnít be lynching a vet. This is absolutely crazy and wrong. Vets partake in newbie games to help out through tough day ones and provide tips about game theory/wording. They absolutely are no there to help lead the charge in finding scum nor should they be held to any safer standard than newbies.

With that vote: silverspawn
I can see a point here in silver's argument. Newbies definitely can often use help scumhunting and it is bad news if vets die early. But of course the flip side is that vets are also expectedly better scums. But anyway this is a theory disagreement and again I fail to see why it would imply that silver is scum.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #232 on: August 20, 2018, 10:19:54 am »

The reason those things imply scum is town!silver is aware of the better way of generating reads from people and has not done that at all. Scum!silver is aware that getting quick votes down from everyone helps him find easy lynch targets. Town!silver is aware ruling people out for poor reasons is bad and scum!silver is aware putting fear into newbies for vets dying directly protects himself. We have had many ďnewbiesĒ over the years that did not need any help from vets and I think pushing that idea only limits individual though and hurts town.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #233 on: August 20, 2018, 10:23:45 am »

I could say the same to you faust about your (weaker in my opinion) umbrage case. Umbrage has almost solely given help to the newbies, which while it isnít high quality content it is actually helpful vs silverspawns unhelpful posts.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #234 on: August 20, 2018, 10:30:39 am »

I would have something to say to this, but I would prefer to see silver address this himself.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #235 on: August 20, 2018, 10:51:45 am »

vote: Simon

Faust, Why Simon over UoS?

Thanks, MC for the fresh commentary. Itís helping me think through things from a new perspective. I can see why having everyone talking is better than having five people talking...

Iím also compelled by Faustís reading and Hypercubeís explanation that is his one line responses arenít necessarily suspicious, just not particularly helpful but not for lack of trying. And he correctly notes that none of the newbs (me, Eddie, Hyper, simon(?)) are really doing much to move the game, largely, Iíd guess, because we donít quite know how.

MC says silver could be doing better at generating game play....this is why vetís are helpful! I wouldnít have known that. Iíll be interested in what he has to say to that remark. Same with UoS, who was super helpful in explaining the game to me but maybe that was all.

Anyway, unvote: Hyper because I think the newbs may just be taking turns whacking each other around, and Iím not ready to commit elsewhere until I see how the silver and UoS discussion goes. And Phy....whatís up Phy? Ugh.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #236 on: August 20, 2018, 10:58:53 am »

vote: Simon

Faust, Why Simon over UoS?
Well noone else seemed interested in voting for UoS. We are entering a phase in the game where it is good to not have votes spread out all over the place, but consolidate on a couple of wagons. Which isn't to say that you should only vote for people who already have votes necessarily, but I have tried the UoS wagon and there is no movement there and I have nothing new to add to that case because UoS has not been posting.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #237 on: August 20, 2018, 11:02:46 am »

vote: Simon

Faust, Why Simon over UoS?
Well noone else seemed interested in voting for UoS. We are entering a phase in the game where it is good to not have votes spread out all over the place, but consolidate on a couple of wagons. Which isn't to say that you should only vote for people who already have votes necessarily, but I have tried the UoS wagon and there is no movement there and I have nothing new to add to that case because UoS has not been posting.

And Simon is scummy why?

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #238 on: August 20, 2018, 11:03:27 am »

Another point against silver is his interactions with phyphor/muenstercheese, who I think we all agree have only been scummy in their brief time here.

Cheese follows silver in voting in a convoluted manner:

vote: poorly written Harry Potter Villain

vote: father-brother-continent

He then votes for cheese in this much-scrutinized post:

Very slow start here. How about this: everyone vote for someone in their next post

vote: muenstercheese

And then, after switching onto WCD, moves onto Eddie instead of actually going back to cheese.

For the record, my vote was entirely for pressure. Now is the first time that I think I have some kind of read, and it's a town read on WCD. Don't particularly want to explain why.

back to vote: uncle

At this point phyphor shows up, follows silver in voting for Eddie, and makes a very scummy post. Being concerned with self-preservation first and foremost is a pretty big red flag.

Partially to save my own back, but also because setting up three of us to share the votes (by switching to Faust) means we are unlikely to lynch on Day 1.

In general we want to lynch every day, but whilst Day 1 is a day with little information which makes it hard to do a good lynching if we don't lynch anyone we run the risk of having the Mafia take out the good townies (be it because they're good at Mafia or have had to role-claim to save their skin).

silver doesn't comment on the above other than to note that phyphor's choice of pronouns is unusual.

I think we should lynch one of these two and then strongly suspect the other if the first flips scum.

PPE 3
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #239 on: August 20, 2018, 11:08:55 am »

I don't think that repeating a joke is the gold standard for partner tells.
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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #240 on: August 20, 2018, 11:13:17 am »

vote: Simon

Faust, Why Simon over UoS?
Well noone else seemed interested in voting for UoS. We are entering a phase in the game where it is good to not have votes spread out all over the place, but consolidate on a couple of wagons. Which isn't to say that you should only vote for people who already have votes necessarily, but I have tried the UoS wagon and there is no movement there and I have nothing new to add to that case because UoS has not been posting.

And Simon is scummy why?
This is mostly a gut read for me. I don't like the wagons he has been pushing, and I don't like how he has been pushing them. I didn't like the "I have no scumreads but WCD" from a bit earlier, it is usually harder for scum to procure scumreads than it is for town, and then he pushed for a specific group of two less active players with no reason as to why he chose those two specifically.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #241 on: August 20, 2018, 11:22:10 am »

I don't think that repeating a joke is the gold standard for partner tells.

Oh faust, you and your only addressing a part of the post you find a flaw with is so you...anyway I think that point is weak but the rest of the post is strong.

I hadnít even realized his ďback to uncleĒ was infact not backed up by him voting for uncleeurope. He votes cheese for lurking, pressures cheese again with his vote call post, wcd and Simon both join in voting cheese to which he immediately swaps off to wcd for a ďpressure voteĒ and then as shown goes ďback to uncleĒ. 
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #242 on: August 20, 2018, 12:52:47 pm »

Woah yea umbrage has said absolutely nothing non newb aid related. I agree his vote on wcd was terrible she be town.

From following along my biggest scum read has been silverspawn. His contribution has been limited to his ďletís get everyone to voteĒ post which he claimed was to incite drama (hereís your drama). I think it was not helpful, forcing people to get reads out is best done by directly asking question and Faust does well getting everyoneís general vote/read out benefits scum because they can see where the lynch of least resistance is.

I disagree. I think it was helpful. Posting begets posting. The worst thing that can happen is that no-one cares and no-one has anything to say. And that kind of thing does happen, I've seen it happen before. And it's not good for town. On the other hand, I don't recall any game where there was a minimum quantity of discussion, but it was all so devoid of content that I didn't find any alignment indicative stuff in it. If there is a concerning lack of activity, which there was, then more stuff is a very safe bet for a good thing. And people did start to post a bit immediately afterwards, so it might have even worked.

Quote
Silver also made what I think is the scummiest post of the whole game:

This is now the second time silver is inciting the idea that we need to be more directed in our reads and votes. This post comes on the 18th which is 3 days after start and 4 days before deadline way too early to be concerned about this I think. He then goes on to give a clear direction that we shouldnít be lynching a vet. This is absolutely crazy and wrong. Vets partake in newbie games to help out through tough day ones and provide tips about game theory/wording. They absolutely are no there to help lead the charge in finding scum nor should they be held to any safer standard than newbies. [/quote]
I think it wasn't wrong at the time. If you have a game with three vets and one+ of them is scum, then if you lynch a vet day 1, what will happen is that a second vet dies n1 which leaves a bunch of people who're playing for the first time and one vet who is scum. That is really bad.

And you don't have any argument why it's not bad, you're just making the policy/moral case. It's always bad to answer a factual argument with a moral argument.

And you also conveniently left out this post:

Now that mcmc is here, the vet thing becomes less relevant.

I took the vet thing back as soon as you were here, because with 4 the same argument no longer applies. Where is the scum motivation for that?
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #243 on: August 20, 2018, 12:54:24 pm »

The reason those things imply scum is town!silver is aware of the better way of generating reads from people and has not done that at all.

The whole problem I was trying to solve was that there was no material to work with.
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Uncleeurope

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #244 on: August 20, 2018, 12:56:46 pm »

Well, I am not opposed to jumping off the cube wagon either, and as previously stated, my runner-up was to Vote: Phyphor

I will just let that rest there while I reread Silver/Simon/Snow
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Uncleeurope Eddie

silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #245 on: August 20, 2018, 12:59:42 pm »

s/s/s for short
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Uncleeurope

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #246 on: August 20, 2018, 01:01:42 pm »

The reason those things imply scum is town!silver is aware of the better way of generating reads from people and has not done that at all.

The whole problem I was trying to solve was that there was no material to work with.

Well, there is more info now, do you have more reads?
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Uncleeurope Eddie

mcmcsalot

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #247 on: August 20, 2018, 01:08:12 pm »

The reason those things imply scum is town!silver is aware of the better way of generating reads from people and has not done that at all.

The whole problem I was trying to solve was that there was no material to work with.

I totally understood that. But the way to went generating more material was done in a scummy way. You got people to make quick general votes which benefits scum to see where they can get a lynch instead of making specific singular interactions that let town figure out individual alignments.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #248 on: August 20, 2018, 01:17:51 pm »

Some, all mostly feeling based.

Town on WCD, weak town on faust. Scum somewhat on you just because if I read any of the other new players I get this urge to believe they're town and I don't get that from you.

That's all, sorry. I don't share the scumread on UoS and while mcmc has said some stuff, I can easily see that coming from either alignment.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #249 on: August 20, 2018, 01:19:20 pm »

The reason those things imply scum is town!silver is aware of the better way of generating reads from people and has not done that at all.

The whole problem I was trying to solve was that there was no material to work with.

I totally understood that. But the way to went generating more material was done in a scummy way. You got people to make quick general votes which benefits scum to see where they can get a lynch instead of making specific singular interactions that let town figure out individual alignments.

I didn't think particularly far, it was the only thing I could come up with, and I reasoned that it was better done than not done.

I don't agree that quick general votes early benefits scum in any way.
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #250 on: August 20, 2018, 01:25:02 pm »

The quoting is hard to parse from silver so Iíll adress the point that he made separately.

I think it wasn't wrong at the time. If you have a game with three vets and one+ of them is scum, then if you lynch a vet day 1, what will happen is that a second vet dies n1 which leaves a bunch of people who're playing for the first time and one vet who is scum. That is really bad.

And you don't have any argument why it's not bad, you're just making the policy/moral case. It's always bad to answer a factual argument with a moral argument.

And you also conveniently left out this post:

Now that mcmc is here, the vet thing becomes less relevant.

I took the vet thing back as soon as you were here, because with 4 the same argument no longer applies. Where is the scum motivation for that?

In reference to the ďwe shouldnít lynch vets argumentĒ. It was bad and Iíll explain, you claimed it would be bad if we lynched a vet, then a vet died, and the remaining one was scum left with all newbies and therefor we shouldnít lynch a vet. The issue there is that your bad scenario assumes one vet is scum and the we are lynching and having killed the other vets. Just on the surface your saying letís not lynch from this pool in case one is scum which is absolutely bad. On top of that I think you are severely underrating new players ability to make logical reads as the game progresses that they would be swayed be a singular scum vet who could run away with he game.

Itís just a poor reasoning  all around for ruling out lynching a group of people that includes yourself hence it being scummy on top of logically flawed.

Yes I saw that you dropped it once I joined and that to be expected from either alignment because  the one lynch/one kill = one vet left part is no longer true. The scum reasoning for it is there is one more town player(me) that is now in the vet category that scum you might need to try to get lynched.
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Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
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UmbrageOfSnow

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #251 on: August 20, 2018, 01:29:04 pm »

Sorry, busy Sunday, spent most of the day driving and then impromptu dogsitting a hyperactive dog with emotional issues in the time when I expected to be catching up on mafia, super busy today, will catch up later tonight (probably around 11 PM forum time), no worries about deadline from me. Glad to see the pace picked up while I was busy.

Hi Mcmcsalot!
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faust

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #252 on: August 20, 2018, 01:45:17 pm »

I don't think that repeating a joke is the gold standard for partner tells.

Oh faust, you and your only addressing a part of the post you find a flaw with is so you...anyway I think that point is weak but the rest of the post is strong.

I hadnít even realized his ďback to uncleĒ was infact not backed up by him voting for uncleeurope. He votes cheese for lurking, pressures cheese again with his vote call post, wcd and Simon both join in voting cheese to which he immediately swaps off to wcd for a ďpressure voteĒ and then as shown goes ďback to uncleĒ.
It was the only thing in there I found that held a barest hint of partner interaction. The fact that silver voted for someone and then left is... well I don't know how that constitutes a partner interaction, and that he says "back to" when he did not go back doesn't improve that, it is just an expression that shows he thought about voting for Eddie before. You'd think that if scum!silver put a pressure vote on his partner, he'd remember.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #253 on: August 20, 2018, 01:46:18 pm »

In reference to the ďwe shouldnít lynch vets argumentĒ. It was bad and Iíll explain, you claimed it would be bad if we lynched a vet, then a vet died, and the remaining one was scum left with all newbies and therefor we shouldnít lynch a vet. The issue there is that your bad scenario assumes one vet is scum and the we are lynching and having killed the other vets. Just on the surface your saying letís not lynch from this pool in case one is scum which is absolutely bad. On top of that I think you are severely underrating new players ability to make logical reads as the game progresses that they would be swayed be a singular scum vet who could run away with he game.

There is no argument here. You're just saying "bad" but still not giving actual reasons. I already said that it is based on having one vet be scum, and that is not particularly unlikely. And that's all you need, after that scum NKs a vet (why wouldn't they?) and there you have it. It's not far fetched, it's not super unlikely, it's a thing that could reasonably happen. Explain me why this scenario is not plausible or admit that you're wrong.

The only actual argument here is that I underestimate the ability for new players to make logical reads. I think you almost certainly overestimate that ability. Reads in general are terrible. The game is so hard that you only need a few percentage points above random to have a decent win %. I don't see any reason to be confident that scum!faust or scum!UoS couldn't trick a bunch of new players.
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faust

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #254 on: August 20, 2018, 01:47:17 pm »

Meh, I find mcmc's case very weak, but silver's defense isn't as decisive as I would have hoped either.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #255 on: August 20, 2018, 01:47:42 pm »

btw the opposite could also happen. Maybe one vet dies the other gets NKd and town gets paranoid about the third and lynches them. Both cases aren't good.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #256 on: August 20, 2018, 01:48:19 pm »

Meh, I find mcmc's case very weak, but silver's defense isn't as decisive as I would have hoped either.

:'(
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mcmcsalot

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #257 on: August 20, 2018, 01:54:53 pm »

Meh, I find mcmc's case very weak, but silver's defense isn't as decisive as I would have hoped either.

Itís day one, like I said I think your umbrag case was valid yet weaker. I maintain that silver trying to give himself and other vets a d1 pass based on the conspiracy that a scum vet will run away with the game is less likely to be true then scum!silver thinking that argument will fly and actually create a sense that vets are important to keep around.

Again the argument is so silly because it assumes one vet is scum(totally possible) but then makes a straw argument for his benefit. You could easily lynch s newbie, have scum!silver kill one of the other vets and hen use the well you canít lynch me because then if the other vet is scum they will run away with the game. Itís a bad argument and silver saying I need to explain why when I have repeatedly only makes me more confident Iím right.
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Wins: M19, M21, M23, M24, M26, M39, M91, M94, M102, M104, M107, M114, M115
Losses: M20, M22, M25, M27, M30, M31, M35, M38, M40, M42, M46, M60, M90, M93, M96, M98, M100, M101, M106, M111, M113
Winrate: 38.2%(13/34) 29.6%(8/27), 71.4%(5/7)

silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #258 on: August 20, 2018, 02:16:22 pm »

can someone reasonable tell mcmc that it's not a bad argument? Maybe he'll listen to them.

Also Ė I realize that I'm incentivized to say this, but nonetheless Ė finding a policy or meta reason for why others shouldn't vote for you strikes me as an excellent bet for something town does far more often than scum.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #259 on: August 20, 2018, 03:45:47 pm »


No position on the strength of the arg itself, but when silver made the arg we had 6 newbies (2 or 3 super brand new) and 3 vets. Since then, two of the newbs left and have been replaced by vets so vets are now in the majority. Iím assuming that his arg is now null.

More interesting now is what his arguments look like moving forward.

faust

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #260 on: August 20, 2018, 03:57:40 pm »


No position on the strength of the arg itself, but when silver made the arg we had 6 newbies (2 or 3 super brand new) and 3 vets. Since then, two of the newbs left and have been replaced by vets so vets are now in the majority. Iím assuming that his arg is now null.

More interesting now is what his arguments look like moving forward.
Actually phyphor is also a newbie.
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silverspawn

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #261 on: August 20, 2018, 04:06:07 pm »

Iím assuming that his arg is now null.

Even though there are only four as faust as pointed out; yes I've immediately said that it's no longer valid and already reminded mcmc of that.

It's relevant to look back at the argument of mcmc thinks it makes me scummy.
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WestCoastDidds

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #262 on: August 20, 2018, 05:47:51 pm »

phyphar replaces muenstercheese, effective immediately. I canít do a vote count until evening

Welcome Phyphar! Standard questions: Any previous mafia experience, preferred pronouns and most importantly.. are you scum?

0) LaLight can't spell - my name is phyphor
1) Yes
2) it/its
3) no


Ah, Iíd assumed he was a vet because heíd played before and started spouting  ďwe have to do this or else no lynchĒ kind of stuff like he knew what was up. My bad.

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #263 on: August 20, 2018, 07:10:50 pm »

In general we want to lynch every day, but whilst Day 1 is a day with little information which makes it hard to do a good lynching if we don't lynch anyone we run the risk of having the Mafia take out the good townies (be it because they're good at Mafia or have had to role-claim to save their skin).

It's unclear if you mean that a no-lynch D1 is good or not. It's very much NOT good to no-lynch here. Sure, due to the little information we have it's likely we are hitting town, but the information the lynch is gathering is key to have a useful D2. Without a lynch we are doomed to repeat D1 only with fewer players left.

Maf will most likely kill out the best/towniest town players by their NK no matter what we do. Scum has not that much influence over our lynch though, which is why it's so important to use, also in D1.

What you've done here is throw doubt on what I said, where I was very clear in that in general we want to lynch every day, and then re-stated what I said they'd do as if it were new information.


2) it/its

Wait, really? I don't have a problem with that but it strikes me as so unusual that I want to make sure you aren't joking.

I don't joke about pronouns. They aren't a joking matter. And, yes, the correct pronoun for me, someone who doesn't have a gender, is "its". The pronoun "it" has been used to dehumanise people because of the implicit assumption that all people have a gender, but I assume most people here are enlightened enough to recognise that this isn't necessarily the case.





Then phy comes in with the goal of not lynching anyone while putting me at vote #3. Super aggressive way to not kill someone. His initial post just struck me as odd, and I get the feeling that would be the case regardless of who he voted for, but I am willing to admit that defensive bias might play into this. I dunno, phy just doesn't sit right with me. And this confusion is ultimately why I went with cube first.

No, phy comes in stating that I want to kill someone that isn't me. Although you and Simon appear to want to collaborate on making it seem like I said something else. Not only that you choose to misgender me so, yeah, I'm keeping my vote on you and, assuming I make it through the night, Simon tomorrow at this rate.


I agree on it (its pronoun choice...sigh) being weird out of the gate and the ďitís gonna be a no lunchĒ and saying zippo about itís experience. Super strange to me, but not sure if itís scummy yet.

I didn't say "no lynch", I merely outlined why some people argue against a D1 lynch, but that I think it's a good idea.

I was asked if I had experience, I said yes. If you want to know more then ask me. I don't believe lying as a townie (which I am, but we'd all say this) helps the town.

Also, can we stop with the passive-aggressive sighing at my pronouns, thanks?

Phypor/muenstercheese have done absolutely nothing towny in their two posts.

What, precisely, would you like me to do on D1?





Vote: Uncleeurope

Partially to save my own back, but also because setting up three of us to share the votes (by switching to Faust) means we are unlikely to lynch on Day 1.

In general we want to lynch every day, but whilst Day 1 is a day with little information which makes it hard to do a good lynching if we don't lynch anyone we run the risk of having the Mafia take out the good townies (be it because they're good at Mafia or have had to role-claim to save their skin).

This is a terrible vote. Phyphor tell me why you think uncleeurooe is scummy.

I don't know how to make it clearer. Someone switching votes to keep us at 3 seemingly to avoid lynching someone is a bad tactic If they switched for a reason then that's fine, but this didn't appear to be the case.




Another point against silver is his interactions with phyphor/muenstercheese, who I think we all agree have only been scummy in their brief time here.

I'm scummy because?

Oh, wait, you said "Being concerned with self-preservation first and foremost is a pretty big red flag."

EVen though I said that was partially the reason and provided a better reason. But nice of you, and others, to skip past what I said, right?




Actually phyphor is also a newbie.

Here, yes, but not in general (as I said before).

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phyphor

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #264 on: August 20, 2018, 07:14:38 pm »

Ah, Iíd assumed [it] was a vet because [they]íd played before and started spouting  ďwe have to do this or else no lynchĒ kind of stuff like he knew what was up. My bad.

So how comes you can understand my "we should do this because not lynching is bad" but others seemed to think I was saying not to  lynch / changing my vote to avoid a lynch?
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Uncleeurope

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Re: Newbie Mafia 12: Your Favorite Animal Mafia (Day 1!)
« Reply #265 on: August 20, 2018, 08:12:51 pm »

Do you think I am scum, or are you just trying to save yourself with this triangle voting business?
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Uncleeurope Eddie

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