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JimJammer

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Rats
« on: August 09, 2018, 02:46:30 pm »
+1

As everyone loves rats, here some more 'rats'.

Ok, they're probably not the best thought out cards, but maybe we can turn this into a rats thread. Add your own, refine and mock.

All cars have 20 copies.

Locust:
Cost: 3$
+1 Card +1 Action
Gain a Locust. Trash a card from you hand other than a locust. Each other player either gains a locust or draws 3 cards, trashes 2 and discards the other. When you trash this return it to the supply and every player gains a locust.

Baby Snakes
6$
+1 Card +1 Action +2$
Gain 2 baby snakes. Each other player reveals the top cards of their deck. If eithr are a Baby Snakes they reveal their hand and trash all cards other than victory cards, otherwise discard.

Mole
2$
 +1 Action
Gain 2 moles. Reveal your hand, if you have no victory cards in it and this is the first action card you've played this turn then +4$

Maggots
0$
If this is the first time this game a Maggots has been played, each other player gains a maggots. When you trash this, gain 4 maggots.

Piranha
3$
+1 card +1 Action +3$
Gain a Piranha. Each other player draws 2 cards and reveals their hand. Any player with two or more piranhas trashes all cards in their hand other than piranhas.


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Holunder9

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Re: Rats
« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2018, 04:52:11 pm »
0

Locust seems far too good for the opponent. It is as brilliant as an early Sentry that trashes 2 cards (with a higher likelihood of hitting some junk).
I'd make Baby Snakes an Attack and make the self-gaining harder. Like, cantrip, get 2 Coins or a Baby Snake.
As it stands whoever hit 6 one shuffle earlier might be able to massively win the split such that not even the Attack will compensate for it.
Same with Mole, the self-gaining is too crazy.
Maggots seem pointless except for Swindler games.
About Piranha, this is probably more interesting than Baby Snakes. Tripe Peddler seems weaker than a double Lab so I'd change this a bit.

Overall some cool ideas but I think that self-gaining, interactive cards are a mess to balance.
One way to getmake balancing easier would be a split pile: put the self-gaining cards on top and the more expansive, interactive card that punishes whomever got a lot of the self-gaining cards underneath.
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kru5h

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Re: Rats
« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2018, 09:16:20 pm »
0

Quote
Spiders Action - Attack, (Supply # = Same as Curses)
Each other player gains 2 Spiders.
Trash this.
---
When you buy this, take 2 Action tokens.

Ever see that video where somebody squashes a spider and thousands of baby spiders come out? Yeah.

Edit: Since I don't like tokens:

Quote
Spiders Action - Attack, (Supply # = Same as Curses)
Each other player gains 2 Spiders.
Trash this.
---
When you buy this, you may trash a card and/or an Action card from your hand.

I have to admit, though, that the Action tokens are a bit more clever.

Edit 2: Changed cost and wording.

Edit 3:

Quote
Spiders Action, (Supply = Same as Curse supply)
Trash this.
---
When you trash this, each other player gains 2 Spiders.
---
When you buy this, you may trash a card from your hand.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2018, 05:23:47 pm by kru5h »
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JimJammer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2018, 06:56:05 am »
0

You're right, maggots is pretty pointless. Here is a modification.

Cost: 0
+2$
Each player gains a maggots or skips a turn
When you buy this, +1 buy
When this is trashed, gain 4 maggots

I'll give some more thought to the other cards.
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JimJammer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #4 on: August 10, 2018, 07:11:25 am »
0

For the mole, i think taking away the +1Action might solve it, then can take away the condition about being the first action card. Possibly still too strong with some form of Village, but only if you have a way of keeping victory cards out of your hand.

Mole
Cost: 2$
Gain 2 Moles
Reveal your hand, if you have no victory cards then +4$


I actually think the gain 2 moles makes it weaker than gain 1 mole. Gaining 3 moles would make it even worse. With 2 we get

for example,

Buy a mole turn 1  - 1 mole in deck of 11, 3 estates
Play a mole turn 4 - 3 moles in deck of ~16 3 estates
Play a mole turn 6 and buy a province - 5 moles in deck of ~22 4 victory cards.
At that point I'd probably want to stop playing them until we hit the last 1-2 draws unless i've figured out a way of discarding the victory cards and getting enough actions.


EDIT: Also, I  like to think of this as an inverse Baron, plus self gaining.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2018, 07:12:36 am by JimJammer »
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JimJammer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #5 on: August 10, 2018, 07:16:13 am »
0

Quote
Spiders Action - Attack, (Supply # = Same as Curses)
Each other player gains 2 Spiders.
Trash this.
---
When you buy this, take 2 Action tokens.

Ever see that video where somebody squashes a spider and thousands of baby spiders come out? Yeah.

Edit: Since I don't like tokens:

Quote
Spiders Action - Attack, (Supply # = Same as Curses)
Each other player gains 2 Spiders.
Trash this.
---
When you buy this, you may trash a card and/or an Action card from your hand.

I have to admit, though, that the Action tokens are a bit more clever.

Edit 2: Changed cost and wording.

What's an action token?
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LostPhoenix

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Re: Rats
« Reply #6 on: August 10, 2018, 08:59:10 am »
0

Quote
Spiders Action - Attack, (Supply # = Same as Curses)
Each other player gains 2 Spiders.
Trash this.
---
When you buy this, take 2 Action tokens.

Ever see that video where somebody squashes a spider and thousands of baby spiders come out? Yeah.

Edit: Since I don't like tokens:

Quote
Spiders Action - Attack, (Supply # = Same as Curses)
Each other player gains 2 Spiders.
Trash this.
---
When you buy this, you may trash a card and/or an Action card from your hand.

I have to admit, though, that the Action tokens are a bit more clever.

Edit 2: Changed cost and wording.

What's an action token?

It's the old version of +1 Actioffers.

In all seriousness, the newly announced Dominion: Renaissance includes "tokens that let you save coins and actions for later."
Presumably, this means that when you have an action token, you may spend it at any time to get +1 Action.
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Jack Rudd

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Re: Rats
« Reply #7 on: August 10, 2018, 11:00:28 am »
0

As a point of card design, all these cards have to have types. I'm assuming all of them have the Action type, and some of them the Attack type.
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Evidence of thriving towns, Pottery, roads, and a centralized government amaze the startled scientists.

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King Leon

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Re: Rats
« Reply #8 on: August 10, 2018, 06:09:18 pm »
+2

Tribble
Cost: $3
Types: Action/Reaction

+2 Cards
You may play a Tribble from your hand.
--
When another player plays an Attack card, you may first reveal this. If you do: Look at the top card of your deck. If it is not a Tribble, you may discard it. If you do, gain a Tribble on top of your deck.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2018, 06:47:15 pm by King Leon »
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JimJammer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #9 on: August 12, 2018, 08:27:01 am »
0

Tribble
Cost: $3
Types: Action/Reaction

+2 Cards
You may play a Tribble from your hand.
--
When another player plays an Attack card, you may first reveal this. If you do: Look at the top card of your deck. Discard it or put it back on top. If you discarded another card than a Tribble, gain a Tribble on top of your deck.

I like this but it needs to cost more than 3. It looks to me
to be  a no-brainer to open with two of these where you can.

I still think its cheap at 4. Though maybe 5 is too much. Guess youd have to play test it.
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Holunder9

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Re: Rats
« Reply #10 on: August 12, 2018, 08:47:21 am »
0

Tribble
Cost: $3
Types: Action/Reaction

+2 Cards
You may play a Tribble from your hand.
--
When another player plays an Attack card, you may first reveal this. If you do: Look at the top card of your deck. Discard it or put it back on top. If you discarded another card than a Tribble, gain a Tribble on top of your deck.

I like this but it needs to cost more than 3. It looks to me
to be  a no-brainer to open with two of these where you can.

I still think its cheap at 4. Though maybe 5 is too much. Guess youd have to play test it.
I have my doubts. Cultist is overpowered because it junks so quickly. But the draw-and-connect thing in itself is not necessarily good enough to justify a price of $4 as the net effects of 2 Tribbles that connect (-1 Action, +2 Cards) are identical to that of 1 Smithy.
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Jack Rudd

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Re: Rats
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2018, 11:01:25 am »
0

Tribble
...
When another player plays an Attack card, you may first reveal this. If you do: Look at the top card of your deck. Discard it or put it back on top. If you discarded another card than a Tribble, gain a Tribble on top of your deck.
This needs to be reveal and set aside, unless you want someone to gain the entire Tribble pile when an Attack is played.
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Centuries later, archaeologists discover the remains of your ancient civilization.

Evidence of thriving towns, Pottery, roads, and a centralized government amaze the startled scientists.

Finally, they come upon a stone tablet, which contains but one mysterious phrase!

'ISOTROPIC WILL RETURN!'

King Leon

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Re: Rats
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2018, 06:48:04 pm »
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Tribble
...

When another player plays an Attack card, you may first reveal this. If you do: Look at the top card of your deck. Discard it or put it back on top. If you discarded another card than a Tribble, gain a Tribble on top of your deck.
This needs to be reveal and set aside, unless you want someone to gain the entire Tribble pile when an Attack is played.

Thank you, I reworded the card, because I had a small oversight. It now says:

Tribble
...
Look at the top card of your deck. If it is not a Tribble, you may discard it. If you do, gain a Tribble on top of your deck.


It may be still exploitable with Diplomat, but very limited.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2018, 06:58:25 pm by King Leon »
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Jack Rudd

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Re: Rats
« Reply #13 on: August 13, 2018, 05:28:19 am »
0

Quote
Tribble
...
Look at the top card of your deck. If it is not a Tribble, you may discard it. If you do, gain a Tribble on top of your deck.


It may be still exploitable with Diplomat, but very limited.
I might be more worried about the interaction with Caravan Guard, or Secret Chamber.
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Centuries later, archaeologists discover the remains of your ancient civilization.

Evidence of thriving towns, Pottery, roads, and a centralized government amaze the startled scientists.

Finally, they come upon a stone tablet, which contains but one mysterious phrase!

'ISOTROPIC WILL RETURN!'

Kudasai

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Re: Rats
« Reply #14 on: August 13, 2018, 10:40:34 pm »
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I'm not quite sure what cards like Rats are supposed to be. Animal themed and a 20-pile Supply? Well, if that's the case, I think I've got one for you.



Made this card of my girlfriend's cat to try and get her into playing Dominion. Well it didn't quite work and now I'm stuck with this. It's fun, but probably a bit too strong in too many situations.
« Last Edit: August 13, 2018, 10:42:41 pm by Kudasai »
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Holunder9

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Re: Rats
« Reply #15 on: August 14, 2018, 02:34:28 am »
0

I'm not quite sure what cards like Rats are supposed to be. Animal themed and a 20-pile Supply? Well, if that's the case, I think I've got one for you.



Made this card of my girlfriend's cat to try and get her into playing Dominion. Well it didn't quite work and now I'm stuck with this. It's fun, but probably a bit too strong in too many situations.
Hard to tell but in Kingdoms in which you can trash Estates it seems like a decent idea to pay $5 and get 3 House Cats respectively in Kingdoms with extra Buys buy them directly.
I think that the card is far too good, in the opening you will definitely get one. In general I don't think that cheap cards that suck in quantity are a good design direction. Of course it is a good idea to stop monostrategies but if you try to do it like this players will at least get one or two copies and that's it.
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JimJammer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2018, 11:17:21 am »
0


I'm not quite sure what cards like Rats are supposed to be. Animal themed and a 20-pile Supply? Well, if that's the case, I think I've got one for you.

By my definition anything self gaining that can f** you up is a rats. Your cat might be to tame to qualify.
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JimJammer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #17 on: August 14, 2018, 11:19:20 am »
0


I'm not quite sure what cards like Rats are supposed to be. Animal themed and a 20-pile Supply? Well, if that's the case, I think I've got one for you.

By my definition anything self gaining that can f** you up is a rats. Your cat might be to tame to qualify.

In fact, reading the card again, it isn't actually self gaining.
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kru5h

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Re: Rats
« Reply #18 on: August 14, 2018, 10:01:00 pm »
0

I decided to turn "Spiders" into "Wasp".



The supply of these is equal to the supply of Curses, so 10 in a 2-player game, 20 in a 3-player, etc.

This will turn the game into a temporary slog until all Wasps are trashed. Don't do this unless you have better Action density, sifting, trashing, or buying than your opponent (Buying lets you trash one from your hand to attack more.)

Commodore Chuckles

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Re: Rats
« Reply #19 on: August 14, 2018, 11:26:37 pm »
0


I'm not quite sure what cards like Rats are supposed to be. Animal themed and a 20-pile Supply? Well, if that's the case, I think I've got one for you.

By my definition anything self gaining that can f** you up is a rats. Your cat might be to tame to qualify.

I was assuming that anything with mandatory self-gaining was a Rats, so Magpie is also a Rats.
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JimJammer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #20 on: August 15, 2018, 05:21:59 am »
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I'm not quite sure what cards like Rats are supposed to be. Animal themed and a 20-pile Supply? Well, if that's the case, I think I've got one for you.

By my definition anything self gaining that can f** you up is a rats. Your cat might be to tame to qualify.

I was assuming that anything with mandatory self-gaining was a Rats, so Magpie is also a Rats.

 Then we will never see eye to eye.  I suggest a duel to the death.
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LibraryAdventurer

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Re: Rats
« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2018, 01:22:11 am »
+1


I'm not quite sure what cards like Rats are supposed to be. Animal themed and a 20-pile Supply? Well, if that's the case, I think I've got one for you.

By my definition anything self gaining that can f** you up is a rats. Your cat might be to tame to qualify.

I was assuming that anything with mandatory self-gaining was a Rats, so Magpie is also a Rats.

 Then we will never see eye to eye.  I suggest a duel to the death.

duel to the Death of rats?

silvern

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Re: Rats
« Reply #22 on: August 17, 2018, 05:49:48 pm »
+1

my attempt

Ant Farm
$whatever     Action
+1 Action
+$1
Gain an ant farm. You may discard any number of actions. +1 card per action discarded.
--------
When you buy this, you may trash any number of ant farms you have in play. If you trashed any, gain an action card.
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