Dominion Strategy Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Pages: [1]

Author Topic: Delusion  (Read 569 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Screwyioux

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 182
  • Shuffle iT Username: Screwyioux
  • Respect: +200
    • View Profile
Delusion
« on: June 25, 2018, 11:34:43 pm »
0

My goal is for at least one person to get the reference :)

Logged

Holunder9

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 717
  • Respect: +302
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2018, 06:20:14 am »
0

You might want to work on the picture and make it smaller to increase readability.

About the Landmark, if you won the Province split 5-3 this will not enable the other player to catch up, the difference of 16VPs only shrinks to 12VPs.
It punishes non-mirror Alt-VP play though; working hard to push those Silk Road up to 3 or 4 VPs does suddenly not look very attractive anymore.
Engines vs money in a non-mirror is more interesting. Normally I'd say that the engine players have more copies of one card but the money players can end up with quote some Silvers/Gold as well. Unlike with other Landmarks you don't have to track though and can just count the respective piles at the end of the game.
Logged

ClouduHieh

  • Apprentice
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 255
  • Shuffle iT Username: ClouduHieh
  • Respect: +53
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2018, 11:04:23 pm »
0

I donít really like the landmark version.

However if you made it an action similar to embargo. But instead of embargo tokens what if it was just one token. That you can move to any supply pile you want as you play the game. When you play the action of course. And then the player who gets to play it last when the game end gets the advantage. Because with a - 2 V moving to pile to pile many would be hesitant to buy too many of one type of cards. Except maybe provinces. Because with the randomness of the game you donít know who going to end up playing it last.

If it was done this way it could give the underdog a chance or could give the one whoís in the lead. To beat everyone by overlapping them so to speak. And of course you would really have to keep track of what everyone is buying to put it to good use. Which is harder to keep up with in 4 player game.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2018, 11:06:51 pm by ClouduHieh »
Logged

Screwyioux

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 182
  • Shuffle iT Username: Screwyioux
  • Respect: +200
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2018, 08:34:03 am »
0

That's what I thought when I first came up with the card, but the more I mull it over, the more balanced I think it is.

Remember, the scoring modifier applies to everyone, so to gain a significant points advantage from it, your deck needs to be significantly different. And the knowledge that this is going to occur is in front of players from the beginning of the game, so it challenges certain dynamics of deck building.

Normally, winning the Governor split 7-3 is GG. With this, it still might be, but you have to win by more than a Province for it to count.

And if the strategies are similarly competitive to the point that the Delusion points are the deciding factor, ending the game on your turn is still probably part of your win condition, but you're trying to engineer a 1-pt loss instead of a win.

I'm actually super interested to try this out.
Logged

ClouduHieh

  • Apprentice
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 255
  • Shuffle iT Username: ClouduHieh
  • Respect: +53
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2018, 08:20:01 pm »
0

Or why donít you just include the randomizers like this.

For each card that each player has copies of (under this) - 2V
Setup: randomly choose a kingdom card from the randomizers that your playing with and put it face down under this landmark. And make sure on one sees it not even you.
Logged

GendoIkari

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 7298
  • Respect: +8123
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2018, 10:45:26 pm »
+2

The card shows up just fine. Doesn't everyone regularly use 25% zoom when viewing web pages?
Logged
Check out my F.DS extension for Chrome! Card links; Dominion icons, and maybe more! http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=13363.0

Thread for Firefox version:
http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16305.0

ClouduHieh

  • Apprentice
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 255
  • Shuffle iT Username: ClouduHieh
  • Respect: +53
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #6 on: June 28, 2018, 12:19:51 am »
0

im Sure most have some sort of smart device, like an iPad or something. That they use to view these forums.
« Last Edit: June 28, 2018, 12:21:40 am by ClouduHieh »
Logged

Holunder9

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 717
  • Respect: +302
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2018, 05:46:52 am »
0

Or why donít you just include the randomizers like this.

For each card that each player has copies of (under this) - 2V
Setup: randomly choose a kingdom card from the randomizers that your playing with and put it face down under this landmark. And make sure on one sees it not even you.
That's just the inverse of Obelisk with the downside that it is hidden such that you have no control at all. All it does is slightly disincentivize engine play.
Logged

popsofctown

  • Adventurer
  • ******
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5248
  • Respect: +2699
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2018, 02:00:06 am »
0

im Sure most have some sort of smart device, like an iPad or something. That they use to view these forums.
Poe's law.
Logged
Also you probably are an expert if you buy two bureaucrats early.

ClouduHieh

  • Apprentice
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 255
  • Shuffle iT Username: ClouduHieh
  • Respect: +53
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2018, 02:07:25 am »
0

Yeah true but it could always be a lower score. And if you still have the randomizers from the bace game (for some reason there was randomizers for copper, silver, gold, estate, duchy, and province. Iím not sure why they did that since those are in every game.) you could add those to the equation. And then even if it was - 2V it could be quite destructive. What if it turned out to be gold. And the player who bought the most provinces also bought the most golds. Or what if one player bought the most silvers and another player bought the most golds and another player wasnít able to get rid of their coppers and it turned out to be copper. Ouch! And it would give those cards something to do. Rather than sitting under the insert of the box.

Or imagine it was the curses that had the extra minus score. And the game didnít have a way to trash them. Every player would be trying to make sure they didnít end up with the most of those. Buy buying as many giants as possible. And of course if royal carriage was in the game too or port and ranger or something. But anyhow it be chaos especially if you didnít know. In fact they may hate it even more than possession or stash.

So regardless of what way you you decide to go with for delusion. Youíll either end up with it not affecting the score at the end of the game. (Unless you donít mind losing by 2 rather than 10.) or youíll end up with most players adding it to the hate list. Especially if the player who would of won by 12,  but lost by 12. And vice a versa. In any case it would be like giving the newbie a handicap like in a video game. And who here is a newbie anyway. Do you really need a handicap to win? At least if you didnít know what the card was that was going to decrease your score, it would all come down to luck. Luck is better than a handicap. And most players wonít be as mad at you. They will be more mad at themselves for buying the cards that decreased their score. (I mean not being balanced with what they buy. (The village idiot) I just had to have the most villages didnít I.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2018, 02:30:24 am by ClouduHieh »
Logged

Holunder9

  • Minion
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 717
  • Respect: +302
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #10 on: July 02, 2018, 07:22:31 am »
0

Luck is better than a handicap.
No. Big no. Like never-ever-go-anywhere-near-that no.

Your version is like deciding the outcome of the game with a die whereas the Landmark is something that you can plan for, influence and if you are good at card counting even use to win a game. It enriches the game whereas your suggestion, adding random noise, totally destroys the game. You could be ahead, decide to end the game and still lose because of this random nonsense.

Quote
They will be more mad at themselves for buying the cards that decreased their score.
Sure, be mad at yourself for not anticipating that the die landed on the 5. ::)
Logged

Screwyioux

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 182
  • Shuffle iT Username: Screwyioux
  • Respect: +200
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #11 on: July 02, 2018, 09:28:49 am »
0

The core of my idea behind this card definitely relies on the premise that both players know it's going to happen and the player with the lower initial score decides which card it happens to. Implemented that way, I don't think it's a luck-based mechanic at all.

Logged

ClouduHieh

  • Apprentice
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 255
  • Shuffle iT Username: ClouduHieh
  • Respect: +53
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #12 on: July 02, 2018, 09:44:18 pm »
0

Well like I said his version doesnít really change anything anyway. And of course mine changes the whole game. Why donít you make your landmark delusion, like wall, or bandit fort, or wolf den. Cause those change the game too. But not to my extremes
Logged

Screwyioux

  • Golem
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 182
  • Shuffle iT Username: Screwyioux
  • Respect: +200
    • View Profile
Re: Delusion
« Reply #13 on: July 03, 2018, 09:15:47 am »
0

Well like I said his version doesnít really change anything anyway. And of course mine changes the whole game. Why donít you make your landmark delusion, like wall, or bandit fort, or wolf den. Cause those change the game too. But not to my extremes

Mine does change things. Quite a bit, actually. Think about if one player is playing big money and another is playing the Kingdom. If the scores are close, you'd need to try to end the game on a loss so you could name Silver or Market or whatever, but you also need to keep it from being such a steep loss that you lose in the end anyway.

Or, if you commit to one deck type over your opponent, you need it to be enough of a blowout to win despite it. Or let's say it's a rebuild mirror and you get 5 Duchies. That's usually GG, but now I can leverage your low point ceiling by scoring as much as possible in other ways, naming Rebuild Duchy or Province if you don't alter your play.

It completely changes the math.
Logged
Pages: [1]
 

Page created in 0.11 seconds with 21 queries.