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Author Topic: Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)  (Read 381 times)

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Aleimon Thimble

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Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)
« on: March 30, 2018, 08:30:46 am »
+1

Yesterday we discussed Tragic Hero, now let's go for something different!




It's Cemetery, one of the more exotic trashers. It's especially good with gainers and trash-for-benefit. Some questions to consider include:

- How many cards should you be able to trash before it's worth buying/gaining one?
- When do you get it early-game over an engine component?
- To what extent should it be considered as a source of Alt-VP when analyzing a board?
- What are some ways to increase your chances of activating your Heirloom, Haunted Mirror?
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Awaclus

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Re: Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)
« Reply #1 on: March 30, 2018, 09:22:35 am »
+2

>How many cards should you be able to trash before it's worth buying/gaining one?

A good basic rule of thumb is at least EE or ECC or CCCC where E=Estate or other junk card that doesn't do anything and C=Copper or other junk card whose value is roughly comparable to Copper. The more other trashing and/or draw you already have (including previous Cemetery purchases), the less inclined you are to trash your Coppers with Cemetery i.e. if you have 8 cards in your deck, you'd much rather buy a Smithy than replace four Coppers with a Cemetery, because the Smithy helps your tempo but the Cemetery hurts it. On the other hand, if you have extra stop cards in your deck that you wouldn't normally have, that makes you more inclined to trash Coppers. As long as you have two or more Estates, trashing them is basically always better than buying any engine component for $4 unless you have a better way of trashing them coming up really soon, but if your engine is already working smoothly, adding more payload or greening in order to pressure your opponent or to answer your opponent's pressure can situationally be better.

>When do you get it early-game over an engine component?

That's the same question again and I already answered it.

>To what extent should it be considered as a source of Alt-VP when analyzing a board?

To the extent that you think Duchies are going to run out.

>What are some ways to increase your chances of activating your Heirloom, Haunted Mirror?

In most games, you can trash Haunted Mirror as soon as you can regardless of whether you can activate it, because having access to only one copy of Ghost is super disappointing due to the "asymmetry". If you're playing an unreliable, more megaturn-y style engine, that's the main exception to that rule, and the other notable exception is when Exorcist is available, in which case the ways to increase your chances of activating Haunted Mirror are the same as the ways to increase your chances of doing most things in the game: draw and trashing.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2018, 09:24:12 am by Awaclus »
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Holunder9

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Re: Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)
« Reply #2 on: March 30, 2018, 09:42:41 am »
0

I'd say only buy Cemetery when you can trash 4 cards and if there are gainers it might be OK in a situation when you can only trash 3 cards. 2 seems nearly always pointless to me, as Cemetery is also junk you only net trash 1 card.
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Gazbag

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Re: Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2018, 10:47:32 am »
+3

Haunted Mirror is my 2nd favourite way to gain Ghosts.
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DG

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Re: Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2018, 12:00:04 pm »
+1

If you can gain a cemetery easily with alms or workshop then it's like having a chapel hand and there's little reason not to go for it and build the engine later. Buying a cemetery generally involves more deck construction as you need the 4 coins plus a bunch of cards left in hand to trash, so you are often forced to build first and trash a bit later.

Cemetery isn't a significant vp pile unless you can gain it easily as part of a 3 pile ending.
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trivialknot

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Re: Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2018, 12:34:26 pm »
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Agree with Awaclus that it's worth buying Cemetery even if you're trashing only two junk cards.  It's like buying a Lab for $4, or buying an Island that gets played immediately.

I often regret getting a Ghost through Haunted Mirror.  It's best when you weren't going to play that action card you discarded anyway.
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Screwyioux

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Re: Let's Discuss Nocturne Cards: Cemetery (and Haunted Mirror)
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2018, 11:51:36 pm »
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I'll second everything Awalcus said.
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