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Author Topic: very short strategy article  (Read 10805 times)

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ehunt

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very short strategy article
« on: February 21, 2018, 09:42:11 pm »
+5

All the boons are pretty good. It's annoying how you can't predict them, but still, you should probably be finding ways to take them.
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Commodore Chuckles

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2018, 10:00:33 pm »
+3

All the hexes are pretty good. It's annoying how you can't predict them, but still, you should probably be finding ways to give them.
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Robz888

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2018, 10:01:37 pm »
+1

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
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crj

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2018, 10:57:23 pm »
+1

I'd tend to agree, though I think the average Hex is only a little stronger than the average Boon.

However, predictability is helpful in Dominion and randomness is a problem. That means a random Hex benefits you less, but a random Boon hurts your opponent more.
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Witherweaver

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2018, 10:59:00 pm »
+3

Shorter strategy article: try to win.
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jonts26

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2018, 11:01:51 pm »
+1

Even shorter: Win.
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Eran of Arcadia

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2018, 08:30:56 am »
+4

W
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faust

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2018, 08:33:55 am »
+1

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.
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Since the number of points is within a constant factor of the number of city quarters, in the long run we can get (4 - ε) ↑↑ n points in n turns for any ε > 0.

Marcory

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2018, 09:10:08 am »
+9

Shorter strategy article: try to win.
Shorter strategy article: try to win
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LastFootnote

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2018, 12:25:45 pm »
+5

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.
Whoa, Werewolf sucks? Since when?
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faust

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2018, 12:30:22 pm »
+3

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.
Whoa, Werewolf sucks? Since when?
It's not that the card itself sucks, but usually you want to use it for the draw and the attack is just compensation for drawing it dead.
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Since the number of points is within a constant factor of the number of city quarters, in the long run we can get (4 - ε) ↑↑ n points in n turns for any ε > 0.

Robz888

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2018, 12:35:22 pm »
+1

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.

Skulk seems good enough.
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Awaclus

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2018, 12:37:56 pm »
0

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.

Skulk seems good enough.

Skulk also sucks.
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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2018, 12:38:08 pm »
+2

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.

Skulk seems good enough.

Strictly better than the #1 Ruin, guys.
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Awaclus

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2018, 12:39:44 pm »
0

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.

Skulk seems good enough.

Strictly better than the #1 Ruin, guys.

I can actually imagine a situation where I'd rather buy Ruined Market than Skulk.
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Accatitippi

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2018, 12:51:43 pm »
+3

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.

Skulk seems good enough.

Strictly better than the #1 Ruin, guys.

I can actually imagine a situation where I'd rather buy Ruined Market than Skulk.

Fair enough.

Once it's in your deck, it's strictly better than the #1 Ruin, guys*.

*except in some last-hex cases, in which your War might actually help your opponents trash their only which happens to be Cursed Gold, and Greed gives them their 10th copper for Fountain, and Poverty triggers their Tunnels, Diplomats, and Horse Traders (is that even possible), and Plague gives them their 15th unique card, and Bad Omens discard a deck full of Green, and I think you've made your point.
« Last Edit: March 09, 2018, 06:16:47 pm by Accatitippi »
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weesh

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #16 on: February 22, 2018, 01:28:38 pm »
0

Quote
Strictly better than the #1 Ruin, guys.

I can actually imagine a situation where I'd rather buy Ruined Market than Skulk.

Both of you are a bit off the mark.
Strictly better means it has the same base functionality, but at least 1 thing is better, and 0 things are worse....and it doesn't account for corner cases where you don't want the extra functionality.

Skulk isn't strictly better thank ruined market because it costs more.
But if the skulk was free, it would be strictly better than ruined market, even if you can imagine times that you don't want a free gold.

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Awaclus

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #17 on: February 22, 2018, 01:47:45 pm »
+1

Quote
Strictly better than the #1 Ruin, guys.

I can actually imagine a situation where I'd rather buy Ruined Market than Skulk.

Both of you are a bit off the mark.
Strictly better means it has the same base functionality, but at least 1 thing is better, and 0 things are worse....and it doesn't account for corner cases where you don't want the extra functionality.

Skulk isn't strictly better thank ruined market because it costs more.
But if the skulk was free, it would be strictly better than ruined market, even if you can imagine times that you don't want a free gold.

By that definition, Oasis is strictly better than Peddler because it has the same base functionality, but it also has an extra functionality that you don't always want.
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Robz888

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #18 on: February 22, 2018, 02:03:37 pm »
+1

I like that Skulk comes with a Gold. Having a Gold in your deck makes up for the lack of +coin provided by Skulk.
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Cuzz

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #19 on: February 22, 2018, 02:12:36 pm »
+10

I like that Skulk comes with a Gold. Having a Gold in your deck makes up for the lack of +coin provided by Skulk.

Where have you been, man? Golds are basically curses, with occasional utility as tfb fuel.
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GendoIkari

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #20 on: February 22, 2018, 02:18:00 pm »
+8

The Hexes are more hurtful than the Boons are beneficial, though. Or at least it seems that way to me.
Yes, but the Hex-dealers suck (apart from Vampire), and the Boon-givers are all kinda good.

Pretty sure Vampires suck as well; at least that's how they're portrayed in all the movies...
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GendoIkari

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #21 on: February 22, 2018, 02:32:14 pm »
+3

Quote
Strictly better than the #1 Ruin, guys.

I can actually imagine a situation where I'd rather buy Ruined Market than Skulk.

Both of you are a bit off the mark.
Strictly better means it has the same base functionality, but at least 1 thing is better, and 0 things are worse....and it doesn't account for corner cases where you don't want the extra functionality.

Skulk isn't strictly better thank ruined market because it costs more.
But if the skulk was free, it would be strictly better than ruined market, even if you can imagine times that you don't want a free gold.

This has been discussed at great length before; and we've generally decided that cost should not be factored in, because if it were, then nothing is ever strictly better than anything else in Dominion; Donald designs it that way. When you don't factor in cost, you still get very few strictly better things... Mining Village and Worker's Village are both strictly better than Village, for example.

Giving your opponents a hex makes it no longer strictly better because of edge cases where the hex will help them (and you might even know the hex will help them before you play the card).

Gaining a gold also makes it no longer strictly better, because sometimes you don't want the gold. But it is fair to talk about "strictly better once it's in your deck".

Pretty sure the only way to make something strictly better at this point is to have a "you may", a choice, or a +buy added on. (Extra actions, coins, and cards are not strictly better due to weird stuff with Storyteller and Diadem and such).
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Commodore Chuckles

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #22 on: February 22, 2018, 05:18:53 pm »
+13

Edgecase Village
Action - $3
+1 Card
+2 Actions
When you gain this, gain a card strictly worse than it.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2018, 05:21:18 pm by Commodore Chuckles »
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weesh

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #23 on: February 22, 2018, 07:10:05 pm »
0

Bravo Chuckles.

Quote
Strictly better means it has the same base functionality, but at least 1 thing is better, and 0 things are worse
Quote
By that definition, Oasis is strictly better than Peddler because it has the same base functionality, but it also has an extra functionality that you don't always want.
You seem to have read "at least 1 thing better, and 0 things are worse" as "at least 1 thing is better in an edgecase"?

These three phrases are true:
* Peddler is better because discarding cards is generally undesirable
* Peddler is better because it will often be cheaper
* Peddler is worse because it will often be more expensive.

A strictly better comparison is inappropriate because it isn't a situation where 100% of the positive differences are stacked on one card.

Not just my definition, but this one too:
https://mtg.gamepedia.com/Strictly_better

If all cards in the game were free, it would be fair to say "peddler is strictly better than oasis", but the inverse is wrong.   

---

This has been discussed at great length before; and we've generally decided that cost should not be factored in, because if it were, then nothing is ever strictly better than anything else in Dominion...

Really?

You guys?

Forum.dominionstrategy.com, come together, and a strong majority decided to redefine a gaming term to fit dominion better...and there wasn't a substantial, loud and prominent dissenting block of respected members of the community? 

I mean, if so: *mind blown*
« Last Edit: February 22, 2018, 07:14:32 pm by weesh »
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Gazbag

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Re: very short strategy article
« Reply #24 on: February 22, 2018, 07:27:41 pm »
+2

Pretty sure the only reason people say "strictly better" instead of "better" is so they can have this argument again.
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