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-Stef-

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future plans
« on: November 12, 2017, 10:00:52 am »
+32

Quote from: Stef
I know there has been a lack of communication here, Nocturne has been pretty overwhelming.
I still don't have much time, but a bit of reflection never hurts.

We squeezed in some features with Nocturne that will help the general client.
- duration attacks are now visible, and enchantress has the pig
- your starting cards are shown at the start of the game
- revised kingdom layout in the client

Thursdays release will have Nocturne fully implemented, but also:
- autoplay (finally)
- improved undo vs bots

After Nocturne goes live, we will continue with...
- rewriting the client. The goal here is
  - clear domain model & readable/maintainable code
  - full control over zones displayed; always find a spot for all zones with cards in them on the screen
  - full control over animations; enable users to animate all cardmoves and do something special for moves that change ownership
  - visualize the ordering of abilities
  - if all of the above succeeded, we can by default turn the log off.

- refactor the gameserver. Currently my gameserver has a problem. It's about states & asynchronous programming.
I use constructs like these:
Code: [Select]
    public void onPlay(Context context, Player player, PlayCardAbility playCardAbility, Handler<Void> handler) {
        player.addBuys(1);
        List<Card> estates = player.getHand().getCards(c -> c.getName() == CardObjectName.ESTATE);
        context.ask(new WhatCardToDiscardOptional(getCardObjectAssociation(), storyOf(QuestionId.BARON), estates), discardMe -> {
            if (discardMe.isPresent()) {
                player.discardFromHand (context, discardMe.get(), getCardObjectAssociation(), discarded -> {
                    player.addCoins(context, 4);
                    handler.handle(null);
                });
            } else {
                player.gain(context, getCardObjectAssociation(), CardObjectName.ESTATE, gained -> handler.handle(null));
            }
        });
    }
This works fine, but I'm not in love with using handlers this way, and it's no longer sufficient. Suppose you have played the baron, and there aren't any Estates left in the supply. Now you could decide not to discard an Estate. After you decided that, the gamestate changed, even though there wasn't a single card that moved or counter that got updated.

Also you see a difference in how I add buys and coins. Adding coins could have some side-effect which needs logging (the -1 coin token) and buys can not. I don't like that it makes that distinction; in the new situation I want to have a more general idea of moving from one state to the next, even after something as insignificant as adding a buy.

The big problem here is that I can't fully reflect on the state I'm in. This baron is only moving forward.

In the new situation, I want to add the concept of a "stage" I'm in while executing the Baron, and let every stage create some kind of Mutation I apply to the gamestate to move to the next stage. This Mutation will also have a function to undo itself, and needs to hold enough information to perform that undo.

Off course baron is one of the easiest cards here. It gets significantly trickier with cards that target other cards (throne room), could lose track of things or interact with your opponents. It will be quite an undertaking to apply these changes to all cards.

But the reward should be significant: then I can move forth and back through a game. This will allow the gameserver to support a much more powerful "delayed decisions" like we have on mining village now. But most importantly it will allow me to start working on a real AI.

I want to be able to synchronize both those gamestates and the Mutations. This should allow for a much more powerful logging system, allow you to save/load games, and most importantly: create a script that has direct instructions for the gameserver.

I want that to develop into a scripting language that allows the creation of campaigns and tutorials.

I would like to give more attention to compatibility with Android and iPad devices.

Oh and I want to hammer down the known card bugs; at least all the ones that aren't interface related.

just wanted to post it here too because it's more likely to get response here.
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-Stef-

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Re: future plans
« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2017, 10:21:51 am »
+22

ok ok I'll admit it. I just cross-posted in an obvious attempt to harvest some respect on f.ds

I remember thinking about respect/effort ratio and how posting memes was the best and organizing the league the worst thing I could do.
I was so wrong, writing your own dominion implementation is far worse.
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Donald X.

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Re: future plans
« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2017, 10:29:33 am »
+10

ok ok I'll admit it. I just cross-posted in an obvious attempt to harvest some respect on f.ds

I remember thinking about respect/effort ratio and how posting memes was the best and organizing the league the worst thing I could do.
I was so wrong, writing your own dominion implementation is far worse.
Dude, 29 upvotes so far just for saying that I asked you to ban Possession. They'll upvote online Dominion, you just have to spin it right.
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-Stef-

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Re: future plans
« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2017, 10:39:38 am »
+13

ok ok I'll admit it. I just cross-posted in an obvious attempt to harvest some respect on f.ds

I remember thinking about respect/effort ratio and how posting memes was the best and organizing the league the worst thing I could do.
I was so wrong, writing your own dominion implementation is far worse.
Dude, 29 upvotes so far just for saying that I asked you to ban Possession. They'll upvote online Dominion, you just have to spin it right.

Yes yes, we're spinning it right here.
Let's make some more posts for people to upvote.
Or do you think people have standards and the posts actually need to contain information?
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Re: future plans
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2017, 10:47:41 am »
+10

I'm not giving you any pity upvotes.
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Donald X.

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Re: future plans
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2017, 11:15:23 am »
+11

Yes yes, we're spinning it right here.
Let's make some more posts for people to upvote.
Or do you think people have standards and the posts actually need to contain information?
The biggest thing is to only make one point per post. If you make two points, someone may agree with one but not the other, and so deny you the upvote.
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Re: future plans
« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2017, 11:35:45 am »
+5

Please prioritize adding a see all Kingcard cards /events/landmarks feature. This is particularly important for newer players because they may not know many of the cards in the kingdom and currently need to repeatedly right-click on individual cards.
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Re: future plans
« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2017, 12:05:00 pm »
+1

Please prioritize adding a see all Kingcard cards /events/landmarks feature.

I agree with this.

Quote
This is particularly important for newer players because they may not know many of the cards in the kingdom and currently need to repeatedly right-click on individual cards.

But your PC-centric language here offends me. Therefore, no upvote.  ;)
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Re: future plans
« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2017, 12:12:25 pm »
+6

Is my language PC centric? Or just grammatically correct? Time for a new super fun thread!
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Re: future plans
« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2017, 04:25:35 pm »
+3

ok ok I'll admit it. I just cross-posted in an obvious attempt to harvest some respect on f.ds

I remember thinking about respect/effort ratio and how posting memes was the best and organizing the league the worst thing I could do.
I was so wrong, writing your own dominion implementation is far worse.
Dude, 29 upvotes so far just for saying that I asked you to ban Possession. They'll upvote online Dominion, you just have to spin it right.

Yes yes, we're spinning it right here.
Let's make some more posts for people to upvote.
Or do you think people have standards and the posts actually need to contain information?

Definitely not
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Re: future plans
« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2017, 05:08:01 pm »
+10

Any chance that the best thing about Isotropic, logs available outside the system, will be implemented?  These were always key to examining games in the forum and the blog, and the lack of them is painful.  I know it's been near the top of the to-do list for a while...
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Re: future plans
« Reply #11 on: November 12, 2017, 05:38:50 pm »
+9

I'm disappointed because there was nothing about future Plans in the post. Clickbait title.
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Re: future plans
« Reply #12 on: November 12, 2017, 05:48:28 pm »
+4

I'm disappointed because there was nothing about future Plans in the post. Clickbait title.

"For every card you gain from that pile, you may trash a card from your hand during the next game."
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Re: future plans
« Reply #13 on: November 12, 2017, 09:21:58 pm »
+1

Thursdays release will have Nocturne fully implemented

Does this mean what I think it means?
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Re: future plans
« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2017, 03:59:45 am »
+3

Thursdays release will have Nocturne fully implemented

Does this mean what I think it means?

Well we don't know what you think it means, but it leaves little room for interpretation
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Re: future plans
« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2017, 04:39:49 am »
0

Thursdays release will have Nocturne fully implemented

Does this mean what I think it means?

Well we don't know what you think it means, but it leaves little room for interpretation

Was it announced somewhere else and I missed it?
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Re: future plans
« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2017, 04:41:04 am »
+2

Thursdays release will have Nocturne fully implemented

Does this mean what I think it means?

Is Thursday's release ambiguous?
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Re: future plans
« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2017, 04:54:28 am »
+1

Thursdays release will have Nocturne fully implemented

Does this mean what I think it means?

Is Thursday's release ambiguous?

There are lots of Thursdays. I guess I was just surprised to see something more concrete for the release (physical or online) than "probably some time in November".
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Re: future plans
« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2017, 07:52:41 am »
+1

So why do all the online retailers say they'll ship on November 30th?
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Re: future plans
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2017, 08:26:10 am »
+2

I don't understand the confusion?

RGG now expects stores to get copies Thursday or Friday (Nov 16-17), depending on where they are in the country. There won't be a "street date," they will just be allowed to sell them when they get them in.
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Re: future plans
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2017, 09:25:17 am »
+5

So why do all the online retailers say they'll ship on November 30th?
I mean, that's a Thursday as well!
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Re: future plans
« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2017, 01:18:54 pm »
+6



Let's get those upvote farms going!
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Re: future plans
« Reply #22 on: November 13, 2017, 02:28:35 pm »
+7



Let's get those upvote farms going!

Time to release "Upvote Clicker"
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Re: future plans
« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2017, 11:42:59 pm »
0

Yes yes, we're spinning it right here.
Let's make some more posts for people to upvote.
Or do you think people have standards and the posts actually need to contain information?
The biggest thing is to only make one point per post. If you make two points, someone may agree with one but not the other, and so deny you the upvote.
If the overall points come out positive, I upvote.  If it's a tie between upvote or not, I round up!
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Re: future plans
« Reply #24 on: November 14, 2017, 12:06:25 am »
0

I don't understand the confusion?

RGG now expects stores to get copies Thursday or Friday (Nov 16-17), depending on where they are in the country. There won't be a "street date," they will just be allowed to sell them when they get them in.

That would be the announcement I missed. Thanks! :)
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Re: future plans
« Reply #25 on: November 14, 2017, 03:03:01 am »
+1

I would like to give more attention to compatibility with Android and iPad devices.

Super, we will get reorder for Android :-)
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Re: future plans
« Reply #26 on: November 14, 2017, 09:43:45 am »
+1

Yes yes, we're spinning it right here.
Let's make some more posts for people to upvote.
Or do you think people have standards and the posts actually need to contain information?
The biggest thing is to only make one point per post. If you make two points, someone may agree with one but not the other, and so deny you the upvote.

Unless one of the points is going to be slightly controversial and the other is going to be humorous in nature. Then you can bank on people upvoting the humor even if they don't agree with the serious point. Down that road lies (theoretical, virtual) profit.
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-Stef-

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Re: future plans
« Reply #27 on: November 14, 2017, 08:01:51 pm »
+7

I upvoted everyone who said anything remotely related to the content of the opening post.
But I hope it does more if I make it explicit? Please if you considered actually responding to it, do so.

Oh and I upvoted Seprix. He made a picture that was funny. You have to upvote those, it's the law on f.ds
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Re: future plans
« Reply #28 on: November 15, 2017, 08:05:09 pm »
+1

I've got a game model question - are there any plans for storing which piles/zones started with any given cards, for pairing split piles, knights, black market, etc?

I currently don't (and thus also your UI currently doesn't) have a way to link split piles together once emptied, or hide the contents of certain piles (BM) without accidentally revealing deck contents.

Updating the card model to contain either a starting zone or something similar would solve this issue.
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-Stef-

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Re: future plans
« Reply #29 on: November 16, 2017, 06:14:58 am »
+1

I've got a game model question - are there any plans for storing which piles/zones started with any given cards, for pairing split piles, knights, black market, etc?

I currently don't (and thus also your UI currently doesn't) have a way to link split piles together once emptied, or hide the contents of certain piles (BM) without accidentally revealing deck contents.

Updating the card model to contain either a starting zone or something similar would solve this issue.

Yes for sure. We intend to completely rewrite the game model in the client.

In the gameserver I have a concept of "pile name" associated with cards, and we'll also add that to the client model.
For almost all cards the pile name is just the same as the card name, but there are a few exceptions (bottom half of split piles, ruins, knights, ...)
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Re: future plans
« Reply #30 on: November 16, 2017, 11:01:52 pm »
0

This is a talk I recently watched that discusses why OOP has a hard time keeping track of time. Stef's discussion reminded me of it. I don't know if anyone here is interested in such things, but it made me wonder if implementing Dominion would be easier in a functional programming language.
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Re: future plans
« Reply #31 on: November 17, 2017, 02:35:58 am »
+1

I upvoted everyone who said anything remotely related to the content of the opening post.
But I hope it does more if I make it explicit? Please if you considered actually responding to it, do so.

Oh and I upvoted Seprix. He made a picture that was funny. You have to upvote those, it's the law on f.ds

One thing that is not completely clear is, who is working at shuffle it? Of course you are not expected to publish the full payroll or anything, but it would be nice to know who is who, also for online interactions.
As I understand it, you are working on the servers, Ingix works on the client, and then there are a number of f:dsers that help with translations, community management and maybe also graphics?
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Re: future plans
« Reply #32 on: November 17, 2017, 09:13:30 am »
+2

I upvoted everyone who said anything remotely related to the content of the opening post.
But I hope it does more if I make it explicit? Please if you considered actually responding to it, do so.

Oh and I upvoted Seprix. He made a picture that was funny. You have to upvote those, it's the law on f.ds

One thing that is not completely clear is, who is working at shuffle it? Of course you are not expected to publish the full payroll or anything, but it would be nice to know who is who, also for online interactions.
As I understand it, you are working on the servers, Ingix works on the client, and then there are a number of f:dsers that help with translations, community management and maybe also graphics?

Ingix doesn't work for ShuffleiT, just a nice person who reads and responds to bug reports.
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Re: future plans
« Reply #33 on: November 17, 2017, 02:59:05 pm »
0

I upvoted everyone who said anything remotely related to the content of the opening post.
But I hope it does more if I make it explicit? Please if you considered actually responding to it, do so.

Oh and I upvoted Seprix. He made a picture that was funny. You have to upvote those, it's the law on f.ds

One thing that is not completely clear is, who is working at shuffle it? Of course you are not expected to publish the full payroll or anything, but it would be nice to know who is who, also for online interactions.
As I understand it, you are working on the servers, Ingix works on the client, and then there are a number of f:dsers that help with translations, community management and maybe also graphics?

Ingix doesn't work for ShuffleiT, just a nice person who reads and responds to bug reports.

QED. :)
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