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Author Topic: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?  (Read 16887 times)

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LastFootnote

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #50 on: October 17, 2017, 01:54:06 pm »
+3

We might also need something that encompasses Cards, Events and Landmarks. Basically, these are the things that you pay the most attention to because they change every game. Of course, Colonies and Shelters also change, so... I dunno. Thoughts?

Kingdom pieces?
« Last Edit: October 17, 2017, 02:08:48 pm by LastFootnote »
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Awaclus

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #51 on: October 17, 2017, 02:05:56 pm »
+2

Looking at that Nocturne thread made me realize one potential good thing that could come from this thread: We need a better term than "card-shaped things."

I'm thinking we at least need a nice, elegant term that encompasses things you can buy (so Cards and Events, but not Landmarks.) "Buyables?" I'm open to suggestions.

We might also need something that encompasses Cards, Events and Landmarks. Basically, these are the things that you pay the most attention to because they change every game. Of course, Colonies and Shelters also change, so... I dunno. Thoughts?

In most contexts, the distinction between a card and a non-card card-shaped thing doesn't matter so you can just call them cards.
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #52 on: October 17, 2017, 02:13:17 pm »
+2

Looking at that Nocturne thread made me realize one potential good thing that could come from this thread: We need a better term than "card-shaped things."

I'm thinking we at least need a nice, elegant term that encompasses things you can buy (so Cards and Events, but not Landmarks.) "Buyables?" I'm open to suggestions.

We might also need something that encompasses Cards, Events and Landmarks. Basically, these are the things that you pay the most attention to because they change every game. Of course, Colonies and Shelters also change, so... I dunno. Thoughts?

In most contexts, the distinction between a card and a non-card card-shaped thing doesn't matter so you can just call them cards.

Is there a context in which it's not simpler and clearer to refer to them as "cards and events?"

If there were ever a third type of thing to buy, then I would be more easily persuaded that we need a new term.
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Awaclus

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #53 on: October 17, 2017, 02:27:48 pm »
+1

Is there a context in which it's not simpler and clearer to refer to them as "cards and events?"

"Donate is the most OP card in Dominion" is simpler and as clear as "Donate is the most OP card or event in Dominion".
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markusin

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #54 on: October 17, 2017, 05:11:04 pm »
+2

Looking at that Nocturne thread made me realize one potential good thing that could come from this thread: We need a better term than "card-shaped things."

I'm thinking we at least need a nice, elegant term that encompasses things you can buy (so Cards and Events, but not Landmarks.) "Buyables?" I'm open to suggestions.

We might also need something that encompasses Cards, Events and Landmarks. Basically, these are the things that you pay the most attention to because they change every game. Of course, Colonies and Shelters also change, so... I dunno. Thoughts?

Kards.
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chipperMDW

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #55 on: October 17, 2017, 05:57:57 pm »
+6

Looking at that Nocturne thread made me realize one potential good thing that could come from this thread: We need a better term than "card-shaped things."

I'm thinking we at least need a nice, elegant term that encompasses things you can buy (so Cards and Events, but not Landmarks.) "Buyables?" I'm open to suggestions.

We might also need something that encompasses Cards, Events and Landmarks. Basically, these are the things that you pay the most attention to because they change every game. Of course, Colonies and Shelters also change, so... I dunno. Thoughts?

I always call them cardoids. Nobody else does, though.
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crj

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #56 on: October 17, 2017, 10:05:25 pm »
0

It's difficult. Best I can think of is to borrow from the world of finance and refer to Cards and Events as "Asks", i.e. offers of things at specific prices. That would more rightly refer to the price than the thing, but it does at least have the merit of being a concise and commonplace word that can't easily be confused with any other Dominion terminology.
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #57 on: October 17, 2017, 10:34:02 pm »
+1

What's wrong with card-shaped-thing? Donald uses it...

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #58 on: October 17, 2017, 10:57:28 pm »
+2

What's wrong with card-shaped-thing? Donald uses it...

I just hate it, personally. It's way too clunky. I feel like there has to be a better term for a concept that's referred to so often. It also includes Landmarks by definition, but we might need a term for only things you can buy.
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markusin

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #59 on: October 17, 2017, 11:07:22 pm »
0

What's wrong with card-shaped-thing? Donald uses it...

I just hate it, personally. It's way too clunky. I feel like there has to be a better term for a concept that's referred to so often. It also includes Landmarks by definition, but we might need a term for only things you can buy.

And then non-supply stuff like Spoils and Madman.

Possibly some term with the word "kingdom" can work.
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #60 on: October 17, 2017, 11:26:03 pm »
+1

Rectangles.
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #61 on: October 18, 2017, 02:07:35 am »
+6

What's wrong with card-shaped-thing? Donald uses it...

I believe the term is actually "uh card-shaped thing".
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Polk5440

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #62 on: October 18, 2017, 07:45:43 am »
+3

village -- card that gives at least +2 actions
psuedo-village -- card that can be used to play at least 2 additional actions

However, I prefer descriptive phrases as opposed to treating "village" as a card type (which it's not). "Extra actions" and "acts like a village" are good. As in, "I am using Throne Room to play extra actions" when playing TR-TR-terminal. Or, "Here, Summon acts like a village". Or, "Procession-Pearl Diver gives me extra actions". Or "Crossroads is a village only the first time you play it."

Big Money Ultimate (capitalized)-- the optimized strategy of buying only basic Treasures and buying only basic Victory cards. Comes from simulation subforum.
Big Money + X (capitalized) -- the optimized strategy for card X which allows for only buying/gaining X, basic Treasures, and basic Victory cards. " Comes from simulation subforum.
Y + X -- the optimized strategy of buying mostly Y with limited numbers of X, basic Treasure, and victory cards. As in "Hunting Party + X" or "Rebuild + X".
Big Money (capitalized) -- The loose deck type laid out in WW's 5 deck type article which people seem to reference, but not have read. Thus, it's becoming an undefined term in casual usage and I try not to use it in favor of describing decks directly.

It seems better to simply describe the deck you are trying to build rather than say "I am going engine here." Great. Thanks for telling me nothing. Try instead, "I want to build a deck that gains as many Minions as possible and thins out coppers and shelters." Or "I will gain a lot Mystics, cantips, and other cards that do not draw dead because I expect a fat and bloated deck." Or "I want to build a deck that consistently draws itself and generates a lot of buys to give control over the end of the game. I will accomplish this by buying Ironworks to gain villages and draw cards, trash with Junk Dealer, and use Squire for buys and a way to get Familiar to slow down my opponent".

I do not like splitter or good stuff. These terms mean nothing to me. And proposed definitions seem sloppier than simply describing what you mean directly.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2017, 07:52:06 am by Polk5440 »
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #63 on: October 18, 2017, 11:31:34 am »
+2

Is there a context in which it's not simpler and clearer to refer to them as "cards and events?"

"Donate is the most OP card in Dominion" is simpler and as clear as "Donate is the most OP card or event in Dominion".

This creates a lot of potential confusion, and is just lazy. How hard would “oh, this card isn’t a card, so ignore things that refer to cards when thinking about this card” be to understand? Quite hard.

“Kingdom piece”, “Kingdom component”, “card or event”, whatever, these won’t literally create rules confusion out of pure laziness...
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #64 on: October 18, 2017, 11:41:50 am »
+2

I think the current lingo is fine. Is it really that confusing? No matter what terms we use, it's always going to be confusing to newbies that an Event is somehow not a "card", so why bother switching the lingo if we're still going to have to explain that?
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LastFootnote

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #65 on: October 18, 2017, 12:17:35 pm »
+4

If only events had been printed on those weighted balls that always rest with the same side facing up.
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #66 on: October 18, 2017, 02:12:46 pm »
0

This creates a lot of potential confusion, and is just lazy. How hard would “oh, this card isn’t a card, so ignore things that refer to cards when thinking about this card” be to understand? Quite hard.

But that's how people already do it and it has never caused any confusion.
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trivialknot

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #67 on: October 19, 2017, 02:20:12 pm »
+7

You could think of an event as a thing that is printed on a card, but which is distinct from the card itself.  You cannot buy the card that the event is printed on.  You can, however, buy the event which is described by the card.  The names of the specific events are the same as the names of the card.   For example, I might say that Donate (the card) is a really strong card; then later I might buy Donate (the event) and claim that I had nonetheless not bought a card.  Sometimes we refer to the card as an "event card" or simply an "event".

When explaining to newbies, it's fun to point to the cards and say, "This is not a card," and then we all have a little laugh as if I had just pointed to a card and claimed it was a blue dog.  But beyond the humor, we all know that events are cards in the literal sense, and not merely card-shaped.

I will also mention that this proposed use of language is fully consistent with the Adventures rulebook:

Quote
Adventures has Event cards. These are not Kingdom cards. In your Buy phase, when you can buy a card, you can buy an Event instead. Buying an Event means paying the cost indicated on the Event and then doing the effect of the Event. The Event just stays on the table, the player does not take it; there is no way for a player to gain one or end up with one in their deck. Buying an Event uses up a Buy; normally a player can either buy a card, or buy an Event.
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Polk5440

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #68 on: October 19, 2017, 02:43:38 pm »
0

You could think of an event as a thing that is printed on a card, but which is distinct from the card itself.  You cannot buy the card that the event is printed on.  You can, however, buy the event which is described by the card.  The names of the specific events are the same as the names of the card.   For example, I might say that Donate (the card) is a really strong card; then later I might buy Donate (the event) and claim that I had nonetheless not bought a card.  Sometimes we refer to the card as an "event card" or simply an "event".

Exactly.  Very nicely said. 
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #69 on: October 19, 2017, 03:05:23 pm »
0

Has "village-like" ever been proposed, reminiscent of "rogue-like"? Or is this just treading the same water as "pseudo-village".
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #70 on: October 19, 2017, 07:50:49 pm »
+2

Rogue-like = Knights, Graverobber, Lurker, Giant
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #71 on: October 19, 2017, 07:53:51 pm »
+3

+1 for calling them "villages". I just don't see a scenario when this is confusing.

"Page can effectively turn everything into a village."
"Summon-Peddler can be used as a village."
"Throne Rooms can be stacked to play multiple terminals per turn -- kind of like a village."
etc.

None of these are confusing (assuming you have a basic understanding of Dominion mechanics).
« Last Edit: October 19, 2017, 07:56:26 pm by Dingan »
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Dylan32

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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #72 on: October 19, 2017, 08:33:27 pm »
0

Rogue-like = Knights, Graverobber, Lurker, Giant

Rogue-like = Nethack, Slash'em, Ancient Domains of Mystery, Crypt of the Necrodancer, etc.

EDIT: Yeah, posted this and then realized this was pretty much exactly what markusin was referring to already, not actually "rogue-like" cards like AJD said. Also, 100th post. I meant for it to be my introduction, but oh well.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2017, 08:37:10 pm by Dylan32 »
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #73 on: October 20, 2017, 09:52:35 am »
+1

+1 for calling them "villages". I just don't see a scenario when this is confusing.

"Page can effectively turn everything into a village."
"Summon-Peddler can be used as a village."
"Throne Rooms can be stacked to play multiple terminals per turn -- kind of like a village."
etc.

None of these are confusing (assuming you have a basic understanding of Dominion mechanics).

This is confusing for Dominion players who have never seen cards from the Base set, like my girlfriend. Hence I introduced "villages" to her as "splitters" because I like that term. She now uses it. Take that, community!
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Re: Dominion Terms: What Should We Call Things?
« Reply #74 on: October 20, 2017, 01:18:08 pm »
0

Really, I'm fine with people calling Events "cards," as long as we all agree that's proper terminology and stop pedantically correcting ourselves and each other with "card-shaped thing." Cuz seriously guys, that needs to stop.

Personally, I like the "cardoid" suggestion. I think I'll use that from now on.
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