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Mean Mr Mustard

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IsoDom 3 Round 3
« on: February 16, 2012, 03:05:03 pm »
0

Congratulations to everyone who progressed!  Please have your round 3 matches completed by noon on Friday, February 24. Report the results to this thread.  As a reminder, all rounds are best of seven, with a preselected Kingdom to be played in the first game.  This week's Kingdom, submitted by Jorbles (nice job!) and approved by the community (thanks for that!) will be:

Tournament, Harem, Venture, Fishing Village, Golem, Bishop, Thief, Remake, Tunnel, Fool's Gold, Colony

Again, if anyone has any issues please let me know as soon as possible.

Round 3 Match-Ups

<b>1. Fabian</b>
vs.
3. Lespeutere

<b>1. RisingJaguar</b>
vs.
2. Olneyce

1. Geronimoo
vs.
<b>7. rspeer</b>

<b>1. Rabid</b>
vs.
7. Dubdubdubdub
« Last Edit: February 23, 2012, 01:13:13 pm by Mean Mr Mustard »
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Jake <a href=http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201203/17/game-20120317-030206-6456f97c.html>opening: opening: Silver / Jack of All Trades</a>
<b>IsoDom1 Winner:  shark_bait
IsoDom2 Winner: Rabid
Isodom3 Winner: Fabian</b>
Utúlie'n aurë! Aiya Eldalie ar Atanatári, Utúlie'n auré!

rrenaud

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #1 on: February 16, 2012, 03:28:42 pm »
+1

Oh man, another simulator rematch!
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Fabian

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #2 on: February 19, 2012, 07:36:05 am »
+2

Fabian beats lespeutere 4-1

Game 1 Fabian 61 - 53 lespeutere
I did a few quick solitaire games a few days ago when the kingdom was released, and quickly figured out that basically everything on the board was trap cards. Then I realized the theme of the week and was like "oh I see". It seemed clear to me that Remake/Fool's Gold into as few Copper as possible and more Fool's Gold and Venture and Platinum was the overall strategy I'd be going for. We opened 2/5 but both went Remake/Fool's Gold anyway, like I'd do on 3/4. The big question mark of the kingdom for me was Thief, which is kinda tough to get a feel for just by looking at the board and solitairing a bit. I kinda hoped he'd ignore it so I could ignore it unless the situation came up (which in practice means Remaking a Silver, which also happened in the game). Whether it was worth it or not, I don't know, it happened kinda lateish anyway. What happens in the game is I draw a very fortunate turn 5 hand which allows me to buy Platinum, which allows me to buy more Platinum and stuff. In the endgame when both our decks are very good and we buy Province or Colony every turn, lespeutere buys the penultimate Province on the one turn I don't have $8+, making me think I'll lose. Luckily for me, he also doesn't get to $8+ on his next turn, so I get the win anyway.

Game 2 Fabian 44 - 33 lespeutere
Sea Hag and IGG are the important cards on this board. Oh, and Philosopher's Stone. Lespeutere gets to $5 a lot in the early game, buying 3 IGG's and eventually winning the curse war 6-4. I get to $4 and buy Silvers and a Potion instead, looking for the sweet Stone. Lespeutere follows suit a bit later on, but I manage to pick up more Stones than him, and that's pretty much what decides this. $10 treasures are nice, yo. It doesn't even matter that I draw 2 in the same turn at some point in the endgame, as #3 shows up on the next turn anyway.

Game 3 Fabian 37 - 47 lespeutere
We both ignore Chapel and go Envoy/BM. I pick up a second Envoy on turn #3, while lespeutere declines to do so. This works out well for him, as he gets to $6 to buy Hoards while I get to $5 and buy Silver. I realize I'm too far behind to have time to Hoard it up, and buy Gold the one time I get to $6, then start going for Provinces. It turns out I'm able to buy 4 Provinces pretty quickly, and after the Duchies are divided (6 for him, 2 for me), he needs to buy both Provinces to win. I get to $1 and $4 on the following turns, while his 10 gold deck delivers and he takes it. Oh well, still got pretty close.

Game 4 Fabian 37 - 34 lespeutere
Border Village/Governor/Mountebank/Tactician stuff. Also Moneylenders, Moats, Horse Traders. He again gets to $5 quickly for the Mountebank while I buy a Horse Traders and a Silver with my two $4 hands, but the Mountebanks end up not being as super important as usual in this game. We both buy some Border Villages and Governors while picking up a Tactician and stuff. His deck is a lot better than mine in the mid/endgame, but meanwhile I've bought 4 Province to his 0. When his deck kicks into gear for his supermegaturns, he's too far behind to catch up, even though his Province + 4 Duchy + Estate turn makes it kinda close on the scoreboard.

Game 5 Fabian 21 - 18 lespeutere
More cursing! I open Sea Hag/Fishing Village to his Sea Hag/Silver. My idea is to pick up a second Sea Hag, which I kinda like doing when the risk of the colliding is smallish. I win the curse war 6-4, meanwhile we buy more Fishing Villages and Tournaments and Nobles and stuff. Also some Governors on lespeutere's side. I see a chance for a 3-pile ending, and when my Tournament connects I can get Princess to buy the last two Nobles. He's behind by 9 points and can only buy a Province next turn, and all I need is $3 for the last Fishing Village to end the game up 3 points.

Overall I think it was a well played match, but a few key decisions really paid off for me, especially going after the Philosopher's Stones early. I drew pretty well in game 1 (turn 5 Platinum is nice) and perhaps not as well in game 3. Maybe I won't get another Envoy so quickly in the future.

Thanks for the match lespeutere!
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Geronimoo

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #3 on: February 19, 2012, 07:14:01 pm »
+3

Sadly, she... ah no, that's from another game

rspeer beats Geronimoo 4-3

Bishop, Colony, Fishing Village, Fool's Gold, Golem, Harem, Platinum, Potion, Remake, Thief, Tournament, Tunnel, and Venture
Geronimoo
The fixed set and boy oh boy, it was a doozy! I played a game or 2 against n00bs with this set and simulated a few things. Fool's Gold is extremely strong here, but sims pointed out that a Thief can be really good here when both decks get trimmed down with Remakes. The small decks also favored Tournament quite a bit. Golem/Tunnel was a few turns too slow, so that was out the window. I didn't test other stuff (Bishop-Golden deck was probably too slow as well). Eventually I decided I was going to go Remake/FG with Tournaments before the game started. The game felt really weird playing it because I got a few +$11 hands early on and I needed to not buy Colonies/Platinums to keep with the plan. His Thief hurt me a bit, but I guess my Followers hurt him more (to be honest, the Estates I got from them were really clogging me up as well and the game dragged on quite a bit).

Apothecary, Baron, Border Village, Cache, Crossroads, Embassy, Forge, Fortune Teller, Governor, Outpost, and Potion
rspeer
A Governor game where we both open Baron/Silver. I suck at Puerto Rico... (he gets a very nice turn 12, so maybe a bit of luck there?)

Chapel, Duchess, Forge, Fortune Teller, Mountebank, Oasis, Oracle, Potion, Scheme, Torturer, and Transmute
Geronimoo
We both go Chapel/Silver into Mountebank. I get a gazillion Golds in the early game making me able to green quite comfortably. Oasis is better than Silver after a while here. rspeer buys a Scheme very early which felt like a mistake to me.

Apprentice, Bazaar, Border Village, Cache, Hoard, Inn, Militia, Sea Hag, Spy, and Stash
rspeer
Sea Hag into Apprentice for both of us, but my opponent Apprentices a lot more agressively, while I just go for Hoard. He smartly manages to three pile me before my economy starts to deliver. He clearly outplayed me here

Envoy, Expand, Fortune Teller, Haggler, Horse Traders, Potion, Scrying Pool, Throne Room, Torturer, Transmute, and Tunnel
Geronimoo
We both go Horse Traders/Tunnel, but I get 5 of each while rspeer only 3 of each. I broke PPR, because it all felt a little random, which might actually be a good reason NOT to break it...??

Embassy, Envoy, Fishing Village, Golem, Horse Traders, Jester, Pearl Diver, Potion, Talisman, Venture, and Watchtower
rspeer
My simulator buddy outplayed me again here. Well, I'll admit it, I didn't know what the hell I was doing. I thought this was going to be a fight about the Fishing Villages, so I made sure I got most of them, then all of a sudden he was buying Provinces and I was stuck with 3 Watchtowers in hand and not a Fishing Village in sight at which point I resigned the game.

Caravan, Expand, Farmland, Fishing Village, Harem, Haven, Hoard, Mandarin, Mountebank, and Royal Seal
rspeer
Ah, a game right up my ally: Mountebank and no engine in sight! I'm quite sure I need to open Silver/Silver here to assure me of a Mountebank and I pump the fist when rspeer opens Caravan (which is often not such a great opener). Unfortunately I didn't do my homework that well and Caravan IS a good opener here according to the simulator. Oh well, live and learn I guess!

Congrats to rspeer! He played a lot better and more focused than last time we met. I hope he keeps it up in the next rounds and does us simulators proud!
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Mean Mr Mustard

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #4 on: February 19, 2012, 10:50:05 pm »
0

Awesome.
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Jake <a href=http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201203/17/game-20120317-030206-6456f97c.html>opening: opening: Silver / Jack of All Trades</a>
<b>IsoDom1 Winner:  shark_bait
IsoDom2 Winner: Rabid
Isodom3 Winner: Fabian</b>
Utúlie'n aurë! Aiya Eldalie ar Atanatári, Utúlie'n auré!

rspeer

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #5 on: February 20, 2012, 02:22:05 am »
+1

Good summary by Geronimoo. I'll add my perspective on the games:

Bishop, Colony, Fishing Village, Fool's Gold, Golem, Harem, Platinum, Potion, Remake, Thief, Tournament, Tunnel, and Venture
Geronimoo
The fixed set and boy oh boy, it was a doozy! I played a game or 2 against n00bs with this set and simulated a few things. Fool's Gold is extremely strong here, but sims pointed out that a Thief can be really good here when both decks get trimmed down with Remakes. The small decks also favored Tournament quite a bit. Golem/Tunnel was a few turns too slow, so that was out the window. I didn't test other stuff (Bishop-Golden deck was probably too slow as well). Eventually I decided I was going to go Remake/FG with Tournaments before the game started. The game felt really weird playing it because I got a few +$11 hands early on and I needed to not buy Colonies/Platinums to keep with the plan. His Thief hurt me a bit, but I guess my Followers hurt him more (to be honest, the Estates I got from them were really clogging me up as well and the game dragged on quite a bit).

We both agreed after the game that Remake+Thief beats Remake+Fool's Gold in simulations, so it seemed I had an obvious plan when he opened with Fool's Gold. But I hadn't thought to simulate Remake+Fool's Gold+Tournament.

My Thief hurt him... but his Followers hurt me much more.

Quote
Apothecary, Baron, Border Village, Cache, Crossroads, Embassy, Forge, Fortune Teller, Governor, Outpost, and Potion
rspeer
A Governor game where we both open Baron/Silver. I suck at Puerto Rico... (he gets a very nice turn 12, so maybe a bit of luck there?)

Turn 12 was nice, given that I got two Provinces out of Governor-remodeling and Geronimoo got nothing. But one of those two Governors was one I drew because Geronimoo took +3 cards from his Governor, which I won't do before the endgame except in a dire situation.

Quote
Chapel, Duchess, Forge, Fortune Teller, Mountebank, Oasis, Oracle, Potion, Scheme, Torturer, and Transmute
Geronimoo
We both go Chapel/Silver into Mountebank. I get a gazillion Golds in the early game making me able to green quite comfortably. Oasis is better than Silver after a while here. rspeer buys a Scheme very early which felt like a mistake to me.
It was neat that we both switched to Oases at the same time. The Scheme was indeed a mistake.

Quote
Apprentice, Bazaar, Border Village, Cache, Hoard, Inn, Militia, Sea Hag, Spy, and Stash
rspeer
Sea Hag into Apprentice for both of us, but my opponent Apprentices a lot more agressively, while I just go for Hoard. He smartly manages to three pile me before my economy starts to deliver. He clearly outplayed me here
I was really glad that my fixation on Apprentices made it possible for me to three-pile by buying the rest of them. I was ahead but I had trashed nearly all of my money, so I needed the game to end fast.

Quote
Envoy, Expand, Fortune Teller, Haggler, Horse Traders, Potion, Scrying Pool, Throne Room, Torturer, Transmute, and Tunnel
Geronimoo
We both go Horse Traders/Tunnel, but I get 5 of each while rspeer only 3 of each. I broke PPR, because it all felt a little random, which might actually be a good reason NOT to break it...??
When Geronimoo broke the PPR and then both our decks stalled for three turns, he was making some increasingly anguished noises in chat, but it all worked out for him.

Quote
Embassy, Envoy, Fishing Village, Golem, Horse Traders, Jester, Pearl Diver, Potion, Talisman, Venture, and Watchtower
rspeer
My simulator buddy outplayed me again here. Well, I'll admit it, I didn't know what the hell I was doing. I thought this was going to be a fight about the Fishing Villages, so I made sure I got most of them, then all of a sudden he was buying Provinces and I was stuck with 3 Watchtowers in hand and not a Fishing Village in sight at which point I resigned the game.
If I'd had bad shuffle luck, I might not have gotten to say this, but: who has time to buy more Fishing Villages when there are Embassies to be had?

Quote
Caravan, Expand, Farmland, Fishing Village, Harem, Haven, Hoard, Mandarin, Mountebank, and Royal Seal
rspeer
Ah, a game right up my ally: Mountebank and no engine in sight! I'm quite sure I need to open Silver/Silver here to assure me of a Mountebank and I pump the fist when rspeer opens Caravan (which is often not such a great opener). Unfortunately I didn't do my homework that well and Caravan IS a good opener here according to the simulator. Oh well, live and learn I guess!
The funny thing is, even if Geronimoo's simulations vindicate my choice of opening, it's probably unrelated to the fact that I won. I assume Caravan/Silver is good here because you still have a reasonable shot at getting $5 before the second shuffle and then you already have a caravan. But I hit the failure mode, not getting a mountebank until after the second shuffle.

The caravans were nice, but surprisingly, I think some credit goes to the Mandarin I bought on turn 10! It got me probably 10 VP that I wouldn't have gotten if it had been some respectable card like a Royal Seal, and I think that made the difference. (I won by 13 points in the end, but only because Geronimoo of course wouldn't buy the last province to lose.)

Thanks to Geronimoo for the games and the great post-game analysis.
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Geronimoo

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #6 on: February 20, 2012, 04:23:45 am »
0

In my defense for the Governor game where I drew 3: I had 3 Gold, 4 Governors, an Embassy and 2 Border Villages in my deck at that point, so I expected to double Province that turn in which case I don't mind giving my opponent a few cards in the process. Unfortunately I drew no more Govs or Embassy so I ended up spending $13 on my first Province and enabled his double Province turn in the meantime... ouch!
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Rabid

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #7 on: February 21, 2012, 03:33:47 pm »
+1

Rabid 4 Dubdubdubdub 2 (1 draw) 

(or maybe 4-1-1 when I counted the score I had duplicated a game log I think)

Thanks for the match was a lot closer than the result.
Got some fun boards as well which always helps.

Game 1
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-111246-df60e20f.html
Dubdubdubdub 62, remake, venture, tunnel.
Rabid 65, remake, venture, 2 fools gold, mess.
Bishop, Colony, Fishing Village, Fool's Gold, Golem, Harem, Platinum, Potion, Remake, Thief, Tournament, Tunnel, and Venture

The trap board: I manage to play this game absolutely terribly, with no clear plan.
Turn 20 misclick from Dubdubdubdub failing to reveal prov to tournament cost them the game.

Game 2
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-112339-eef5e5dc.html
Dubdubdubdub 27, Chapel Silver, thief, jester
Rabid 30, Chapel mining village, Chancellor, Island .
Chancellor, Chapel, Duchess, Island, Jester, Market, Mining Village, Philosopher's Stone, Potion, Shanty Town, and Thief

I use chancellor & MV to avoid buying money, possibly over reacting to the thief.
Dubdubdubdub is forced to chapel away the useless thief, then I start on the gold.
I green much later, then control the end game with Islands / the option to double prov off my MV.
Close game but I think the Thief was a mistake.

Game 3
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-113038-067849cb.html
Chancellor, Feast, Fool's Gold, Harvest, Monument, Pirate Ship, Potion, Spice Merchant, Swindler, Talisman, and Vineyard

Dubdubdubdub 30, FG, Spice Merchant, Monument
Rabid 30, Swindler, Spice merchant

My plan was to swindle FG into Estates, but it never happened all game.
My hits with swindlers are:
Copper > Curse, Spice Merchant > Talisman, Curse> Curse, Talisman > Talisman, Estate> FG.
Starting my turn 13 I was losing by 12 with 2 prov remaining so I go for it and buy the 7th prov.
Dubdubdubdub gets unlucky only having $3 and buys the estate.
So I am now down 7 points, Swindler saves the day hitting the Estate > FG for $8 and the draw.

Game 4
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-114226-d70450ca.html
Bishop, Fairgrounds, Golem, Haggler, Library, Militia, Mint, Potion, Secret Chamber, Spy, and Warehouse
Rabid 56 , Silver,Silver into, militia, haggler BM
Dubdubdubdub 45, Mint Secret chamber into bishop

I opened 4/3 so didn't buy the militia as it is countered by library.
Not sure I should have bought it but was kind of scared of a delayed "Golden Deck".
Was a nice race to the end with the free gold from Haggler just about getting to 7 prov in 20 turns.

Game 5
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-120011-ab205cd9.html
Courtyard, Festival, Jester, Menagerie, Merchant Ship, Mountebank, Tactician, Tunnel, Upgrade, and Worker's Village
Dubdubdubdub 49, 2 Mountbacks
Rabid 22, Failed double Tac.

Dubdubdubdub played this one really well. I thought I could race mountback with upgrades, I failed.

Game 6
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-121647-210e7c79.html
Caravan, Crossroads, Farmland, Grand Market, Horse Traders, Merchant Ship, Mountebank, Spy, Talisman, and Trading Post
Rabid 49, late trading post into, caravan, GM, crossroads
Dubdubdubdub 46, Mountback, big money.

Tricky game but I get my mega turn just in time to buy the last prov + 5 estates for the win.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2012, 04:13:20 pm by Rabid »
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RisingJaguar

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #8 on: February 21, 2012, 09:02:23 pm »
0

Just a heads up, Olneyce and I will be playing wednesday night. 
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Dubdubdubdub

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2012, 04:44:20 am »
0

Rabid 4 Dubdubdubdub 2 (1 draw) 

(or maybe 4-1-1 when I counted the score I had duplicated a game log I think)

Thanks for the match was a lot closer than the result.
Got some fun boards as well which always helps.

Game 1
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-111246-df60e20f.html
Dubdubdubdub 62, remake, venture, tunnel.
Rabid 65, remake, venture, 2 fools gold, mess.
Bishop, Colony, Fishing Village, Fool's Gold, Golem, Harem, Platinum, Potion, Remake, Thief, Tournament, Tunnel, and Venture

The trap board: I manage to play this game absolutely terribly, with no clear plan.
Turn 20 misclick from Dubdubdubdub failing to reveal prov to tournament cost them the game.

Game 2
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-112339-eef5e5dc.html
Dubdubdubdub 27, Chapel Silver, thief, jester
Rabid 30, Chapel mining village, Chancellor, Island .
Chancellor, Chapel, Duchess, Island, Jester, Market, Mining Village, Philosopher's Stone, Potion, Shanty Town, and Thief

I use chancellor & MV to avoid buying money, possibly over reacting to the thief.
Dubdubdubdub is forced to chapel away the useless thief, then I start on the gold.
I green much later, then control the end game with Islands / the option to double prov off my MV.
Close game but I think the Thief was a mistake.

Game 3
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-113038-067849cb.html
Chancellor, Feast, Fool's Gold, Harvest, Monument, Pirate Ship, Potion, Spice Merchant, Swindler, Talisman, and Vineyard

Dubdubdubdub 30, FG, Spice Merchant, Monument
Rabid 30, Swindler, Spice merchant

My plan was to swindle FG into Estates, but it never happened all game.
My hits with swindlers are:
Copper > Curse, Spice Merchant > Talisman, Curse> Curse, Talisman > Talisman, Estate> FG.
Starting my turn 13 I was losing by 12 with 2 prov remaining so I go for it and buy the 7th prov.
Dubdubdubdub gets unlucky only having $3 and buys the estate.
So I am now down 7 points, Swindler saves the day hitting the Estate > FG for $8 and the draw.

Game 4
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-114226-d70450ca.html
Bishop, Fairgrounds, Golem, Haggler, Library, Militia, Mint, Potion, Secret Chamber, Spy, and Warehouse
Rabid 56 , Silver,Silver into, militia, haggler BM
Dubdubdubdub 45, Mint Secret chamber into bishop

I opened 4/3 so didn't buy the militia as it is countered by library.
Not sure I should have bought it but was kind of scared of a delayed "Golden Deck".
Was a nice race to the end with the free gold from Haggler just about getting to 7 prov in 20 turns.

Game 5
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-120011-ab205cd9.html
Courtyard, Festival, Jester, Menagerie, Merchant Ship, Mountebank, Tactician, Tunnel, Upgrade, and Worker's Village
Dubdubdubdub 49, 2 Mountbacks
Rabid 22, Failed double Tac.

Dubdubdubdub played this one really well. I thought I could race mountback with upgrades, I failed.

Game 6
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/21/game-20120221-121647-210e7c79.html
Caravan, Crossroads, Farmland, Grand Market, Horse Traders, Merchant Ship, Mountebank, Spy, Talisman, and Trading Post
Rabid 49, late trading post into, caravan, GM, crossroads
Dubdubdubdub 46, Mountback, big money.

Tricky game but I get my mega turn just in time to buy the last prov + 5 estates for the win.

Overall: it was a really fun match, with interesting boards and a tough opponent.

Game 1 was sour. I feel like I played pretty well; Venture/Tunnel and Tournament were going well for me. But misclicks happen; oh well.
Game 2: Thief was a grave mistake. I went for it in a haze; like: "it's a chapel game! Thief must be good here!". Idiotic. The Jester later on helped me a lot more. I tried to come back after trashing the thief, but wasn't able to catch up.
Game 3: I felt like I was on top the whole time; the tie was a bummer. I don't really understand why Rabid swindled me a Talisman and not a Potion (vineyards was the only potion card and I was clearly going BM). Nice game.
Game 4: I tried Mint/Secret Chamber. I don't think I ever played that opening before; it was risky. It took me just a little too long to build up by economy.
Game 5: Finally won a game, thanks to the power of Mountebank. Rabid loaded up on Worker's Villages and took quite a few Menageries. I'm not sure why. Menageries gave 3 cards only thrice.
Game 6: I like Grand Market and wanted to go for them (with Mountebank), but Rabid hit them earlier and was able to gain lots. BM gave me a nice lead, but Rabid's excellent endplay with Farmland got him a tight but deserved victory.


I really liked playing in this tournament! Playing structurally against strong opponents with the added sensation of possibly dropping out was really cool. So, thanks MMM, and Rabid: good luck against your next opponent!
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olneyce

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2012, 10:27:23 pm »
0

Rising Jaguar wins in an incredibly exciting series: 4-3.  I'll post comments tomorrow, but basically every game had something to offer, and FOUR of the seven games were decided by two points or less, including the final which he won 54-53 in a big Goons/Tunnel war.
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RisingJaguar

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2012, 10:42:37 pm »
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Rising Jaguar wins in an incredibly exciting series: 4-3.  I'll post comments tomorrow, but basically every game had something to offer, and FOUR of the seven games were decided by two points or less, including the final which he won 54-53 in a big Goons/Tunnel war.
I must say, this was the best set of games I've played.  With how close it was, intricacy of the sets, and how good my opponent is, wonderful set.  I hope to post my comments tonight, but I may give up half way. 
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RisingJaguar

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2012, 11:09:14 pm »
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Phew... what a set, the kingdoms we drew were really intricate and intense aside from the two with minions... Having no point counter did not help calm me down, suspense through the roof. 

Game 1: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/22/game-20120222-175437-f3f901fd.html
The set game.  I'll explain my plan, then move towards the game.

My plan was to go into the trap essentially.  Grab to remakes asap, and trash everything (coppers first).  Move towards a thief, and a bishop and two FV, the rest would be tournaments.  It's really slow, it takes till turn 11ish? But I presume it could have world effects against a remake/BM especially FG.  I knew there were two problems with this plan, any decent plan with provinces, as my tournaments are not cantrips, and tunnels as thief has essentially a nil effect on it. 

5/2 start happens, he gets venture, i go remake/nothing.  I should realize my plan sucks now, but I'm stubborn and try anyways.  His plan was just too fast and I lose pretty convincingly.  I read everyone else's plans of Remake/FG being the best and determined to beat it, instead i get beat by something else altogether... *sigh*

Game 2: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/22/game-20120222-181435-4e9743b4.html
Black market at its best! (or its worst if you're one of those haters)
It's the only terminal here in a field full of villages... no way to avoid it here.  Let me emphasize how much stronger each BM's card is with no curser, no +card, no attack, no trasher (bishop doesn't really count) out there... So I grab tournament/ghost ship on first 2... he grabs nothing (rightfully).  He then gets remake and sea hag... and my deck really starts to crumble.  Game continues onwards as I try to stay a float and olneyce waits for the last few curses to be gone before delving into the double embargoed provinces i presume. 

On my last turn (without point counter so olnyece wasn't too aware of the score, neither was i of course), I finally get my first prize, princess, and attempt to empty piles of the embargoed caravan, FV, and curse.  I personally thought this was one of my better played turns ever with the princess, nomad's camp and knowing that its now or never. 

Game 3: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/22/game-20120222-182752-02c7fd5e.html
To me this was rather boring.  I toss his oracle early on, I get 6-4 minions, I don't screw up.  Pretty much sums the game up.  (I'm sure there was something here with getting HoP in the mix, but probably not enough trashing)

Game 4: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/22/game-20120222-184013-667beebd.html
A colony game where the highest card bought was a stable.  I lie he buys a province later on but i digress.  We both realize early on that the other is heading towards the same thing, silkroads.  I make the better choice of two barons, especially considering its my only $ source.  I think Olneyce went away from it going for oasis/tunnels as another source.  But he realizes mid game, that gold wasn't useful mid game having to spend $7 on a silk road.  I almost lose midway on T11 not being able to buy the last silk road, but he gets $3 too, so we split silk roads.  His oasis/tunnels does allow him later to net 2 provinces which almost turned the tide.  In the end, it's very close and I'm not still not sure which way is better.

Game 5: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/22/game-20120222-185016-35e1cf29.html
Minions 2.0.  Here's the story, I get minions 6-4.  His consolation is that he gets more great halls.  I try to invest in libraries... half-heartedly.  I'm dominating as I get provinces 3-0 and 4-2.  But he gets the last provinces and wins on the backs of his two extra great halls.  I'm convinced if I buy more libraries I win, but I realized it too late.  Also minions/militia look the same... so many misclicks (like3? not that big a problem though. definitely not the reason i lost, i actually don't know why i lost)

Game 6: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/22/game-20120222-190923-fbf0291b.html
Familiar game where I get potion 2P... on T5... yup... I make a pretty good rebound here to the point where I think I can contend.  I get trashers out of black market.  I grab a lot of early peddlers for expand in the future. 

Then oracles hit me.  He throws action after action... if you think it's my personal bias.  Just ctrl+f envoy... story of the game... Olneyce was even shocked when he realize I never played one envoy the whole game up unto that final point.

Enough complaining, I debated my first familiar buy with golem as I felt I was already too late, but without any trasher, I'm guessing I made the right choice.  With all the complaining aside, I still thoroughly enjoyed this game.  I like when Black market gets his chance to shine properly. 

Game 7: http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201202/22/game-20120222-192152-42c14d27.html
I really have no insight here.  We both pondered alchemist, but knew it would've been destroyed against IGG.  I'm pretty sure olneyce played it uberly well.  Two lookout start, IGG midway.  I'm surprised his deck didn't flow better.  I wonder if I avoid goons, if he goes for alchemist after his two lookout start which I think would have been an amazing launching pad for himself. 

But yeah I grab a thousand oracles after realize they are the best $3 card, which actually doesn't work out so well oddly... I green quite early in the sense that i grab a bunch of duchies before touching a province.  I think that was the right move.  I was more nervous of a random 3 pile creeping up on me.  I get incredibly lucky on the last turn.  Passing up $3 and getting $4 from oracle ($6 is rather useless with 1 estate/1 duchy left). 

I hope that wasn't just jibberish for the non-minion games.  I'm quite confused on proper gameplay or whatever.  It was a pleasure facing olneyce and look forward to his comments. 
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Geronimoo

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #13 on: February 23, 2012, 04:55:03 am »
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So has any concensus been reached on the fixed board? I'm a bit surprised people are going for Venture/Tunnel. It's quite strong, but a little slow and random while Remake/Fool's Gold into Tournament/Province is really strong and slightly less random.
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Fabian

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #14 on: February 23, 2012, 05:29:15 am »
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Yeah, unlike last week's set, this one was kinda cool in that pretty much everyone seems to have gone for something different, and there appears to be no real consensus. There was no discussion of my match at all, but I felt like my strategy of Remake/Fool's Gold into Venture and going for (primarily) Colony was pretty good. Our game certainly was a lot quicker than the others. I dunno about Tournament, but I really feel like Tunnel should just be bad on this board (just like on last week's board).
« Last Edit: February 23, 2012, 05:32:41 am by Fabian »
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Geronimoo

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2012, 06:17:24 am »
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@Fabian: you did get very good draws and one game isn't really enough to prove a strategy is better. I think it's really close between Tournament and simply going for Venture/Colony and I'm guessing Tournament is slightly better on the play while Venture is better on the draw. Also, the Venture/Colony strat is much more vulnerable to Thief while Tournament isn't.
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olneyce

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2012, 01:36:30 pm »
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Game 1
I was planning on going for Venture/Tunnel regardless, but the 5/2 start seemed to really limit the options for alternatives.  In part it's just about being contrarian.  Everyone seemed confident that Remake/FG was the way to go and I wanted to be different.  I'm not entirely convinced it's a such a clear winner, though, either.

Game 2
A very interesting Black Market game, where we each got some very powerful cards out.  He got Tournament as his first card, and my immediate impulse was to Embargo the Provinces to try and prevent a cascade of painful Tournament victories.  Midway through the game he commented that he might as well just resign, but it seemed pretty clear to me that this one was going to be close.  I probably made a mistake in not anticipating just how big his final turn could be.  I think I could have blocked the 3-pile victory for him with smarter play - and then used my more powered (and less Curse-laden) deck to win.  But still, it was a pretty impressive last turn that was required to make it happen.  No shame in losing to that.

Game 3
Not very interesting.  I lost the Minion race thanks to early game shuffle luck.  Pretty much inevitable at that point.

Game 4
A Silk Road game with Tunnel and Great Hall on the board.  And there is Oasis and Navigator as enablers for Tunnel.  And Baron as an enabler for Silk Road.  And Stables to get the hands moving.  Very interesting board.  RJ is right that I made a probably deadly detour into the Oasis/Tunnel pool.  Although it did help me grab a couple Provinces, which is pretty much what I was hoping for - a reasonable split on the low-value green cards, and a couple high-value ones to tip the scales.  Probably required too many moving parts to beat the more straightforward approach, though.  Still, we were tied going into turn 17 and if I had $3 instead of $2 I would have won.

Game 5
So I'm down 3-1 and it's another Minion game where I lose the race 6/4 again.  Seems like it's just about the end for me.  I'm not really sure how.  I guess my Stables help me cycle my deck a bit more?  Or maybe I just got lucky.

Game 6
I get better draws early and am able to get ahead with Familiars.  That lets me win the Curse race 7/3.  However, he's able to trash pretty liberally with Lookout so I'm not ahead by too much in the way of curse.  Golem is huge for me in this game as it lets me chain a ton of actions.  Getting Laboratory out of the Black Market helps a lot, and the Oracles really tie it together.  There is no cheap Village in the game, but the combination of a Crossroads, an Inn out of the BM, and the double-cantrip play via the Golem is more that enough to sustain me.  And, as RisingJaguar notes, the repeated use of the Oracle does some serious business on his deck.  Many of his crucial cards get tossed aside repeatedly.  He bought an Envoy on turn 11 - which I forced him to discard on turns 12, 14, 17, 20, and 21.  Wow.

Game 7
I like the double-Lookout start here.  It anticipates the danger of Ill-Gotten Gains, it generates an economy with Tunnels, and it significantly increases the chances of a tight Goons-deck.  And Tunnels are a nice counter to Goons, of course, too.  I don't know if I made a mistake here buying some Ill-Gotten Gains.  I wanted to muck up his deck a bit, but of course any time I buy one of those I'm wasting $5 to buy a weak Silver.  It might have made more sense to fully devote myself to constructing a tighter deck and increasing the chance of some Goons turns before things finished.  As it was, it really hurt that I only got to play my Goons once in the final 9 turns.  Alternatively, I could have been buying Duchies which is two points better than an IGG, though it mucks up my deck of course.   This was certainly a very interesting board, one that I think would be fun to re-play.
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Jorbles

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Re: IsoDom 3 Round 3
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2012, 05:06:43 pm »
+1

On the topic of the trap board, I actually wasn't sure what the strongest strategy on the board would be when I made it, which is part of why I found it interesting. I really wanted to make a board where Thief was if not dominant (which I think is impossible), than at least it wasn't the usual trap, plus I wanted to populate it with a lot of strong cards, but in weak positions, not quite enough support for one to completely overpower the other (at least not obviously, once you throw in some simulation you can solve it eventually). I knew Golem/Tunnel would be too slow (and if you picked up a Remake too it could be deadly). I didn't think that a Remake was strong enough support to get a Golden Deck off the ground for Bishops. Fool's Gold didn't have any of their really strong support cards (+Buys, Remodels or draw cards). Fishing Villages I tossed in because they didn't really add much to the other cards, plus they're such a shiny card that I love to see them in a weak position. Harems I just tossed in there to strengthen Thief, without strengthening another strategy so much that it became obviously dominant). Finally Tournaments are weaker than usual with Colonies on the board making Tournament strategies in doubt. Venture/Tunnel with Remake support is obviously pretty strong, but has trouble getting past Provinces, into Colonies (I did not see that Tournaments could be used as support here, and kudos to Geronimoo for seeing that). I've really enjoyed watching different people attempt to interpret the board.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2012, 05:08:46 pm by Jorbles »
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