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Author Topic: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?  (Read 24339 times)

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sitnaltax

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What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« on: February 15, 2012, 09:04:36 pm »
+1

What occurrence makes you yell "Dammit!" and startle your housemates/roommates/pets the most fiercely?

Feel free add your own peeves, and to share your stories of frustration (or stories of disturbing those around you!) I will add any interesting grievances I have missed.
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michaeljb

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2012, 09:15:00 pm »
+1

My "other" is drawing 5/2 on a board where the 5s might be good, might even be great, but there are 3 and 4 costers that are too good as openers to easily pass up--probably Sea Hag, Masquerade, and Ambassador. Possibly some others, but none as important as those 3 off the top of my head.
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dondon151

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #2 on: February 15, 2012, 09:35:43 pm »
+3

How about drawing both of your opening buys on turn 5? It's like opening 3/4 twice...
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WrathOfGlod

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #3 on: February 15, 2012, 09:44:42 pm »
0

Mine is opening Terminal/Silver, then having my terminal miss the shuffle and collide with a second terminal on turn 5
(The cause of a good 20% of my cursing, Starcraft uses up all the rest [TvP is brutal]).
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Axxle

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2012, 09:48:26 pm »
0

How about drawing both of your opening buys on turn 5? It's like opening 3/4 twice...
I voted for missing the familiar buy, but this comes a close second.
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sitnaltax

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2012, 09:59:20 pm »
0

How about drawing both of your opening buys on turn 5? It's like opening 3/4 twice...

I slightly edited one of the poll options to allow for this. Although it's infrequent enough (~1.4%) that it doesn't bug me as much as, say 5/2 on an Ambassador board.
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Robz888

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2012, 10:04:24 pm »
0

Also... opponent breaking PPR when they don't have to, and winning!
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dondon151

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2012, 10:09:35 pm »
0

I slightly edited one of the poll options to allow for this. Although it's infrequent enough (~1.4%) that it doesn't bug me as much as, say 5/2 on an Ambassador board.

Just the fact that it only happens 1.4% of the time is enough to bug me because I know it's really not supposed to happen.

Opening 5/2 on an Ambassador board sucks, but you can presumably fight back as long as the $5s are not really weak.
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papaHav

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2012, 10:23:49 pm »
0

Swinder hits my tactician
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hgfalling

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2012, 10:39:11 pm »
+2

Open Silver/Silver on a board with strong 5s and nothing else, then fail to hit $5 until turn 7
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Captain_Frisk

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #10 on: February 15, 2012, 10:47:24 pm »
+3

I've never had Mint / Mine confusion, but I have had Fairground / Farmland confusion frequently.  More rarely I've had Nomad Camp / Noble Brigand.
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rotundo

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2012, 10:48:46 pm »
0

Gotta go Other here and vote for my personal weakness, confusing Fairgrounds and Farmlands. Stupid Green $6 F-Words. Many whoopsies.
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ratxt1

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #12 on: February 15, 2012, 11:42:04 pm »
+1

I went mine/mint which was more of a vote for confusing cards in general (I have not actually mistaken mine for mint yet) one of my favorite (least favorite) misreads of the kingdom which I do a ton is not realizing it is a colony game until turn 6 or 7. This is usually not as bad as most of the others on this list, but I do it so often (like every other colony game it seems) that I have to hate it the most.
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sitnaltax

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2012, 12:10:03 am »
0

Gotta go Other here and vote for my personal weakness, confusing Fairgrounds and Farmlands. Stupid Green $6 F-Words. Many whoopsies.

I've done this, yup.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2012, 01:02:44 am »
0

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #15 on: February 16, 2012, 01:05:51 am »
0

I've also mistaken fairgrounds and farmland on a few occasions  :(

Oh, and I also hate minions as well.
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Kirian

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #16 on: February 16, 2012, 01:39:36 am »
+1

(The cause of a good 20% of my cursing, Starcraft uses up all the rest [TvP is brutal]).

Perhaps you should consider constructing additional pylons.
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chwhite

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #17 on: February 16, 2012, 01:48:36 am »
+1

Getting timed out because of crappy internet.  Again.
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Wingnut

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #18 on: February 16, 2012, 02:12:06 am »
0

Possessing someone who has nothing in hand only to watch him Possess me and buy a Province on the next turn.
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olneyce

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #19 on: February 16, 2012, 02:23:44 am »
0

$2P when going for Familiar is clearly the winner.  Everything else is annoying but situational.  That one is a reasonably likely occurrence every single time Familiar is on the board. 
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jimjam

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #20 on: February 16, 2012, 03:09:51 am »
0

Turn 5 unassisted treasure maps going off is the worst. You see them open it and simultaneously scoff and know that it's going to happen, and then you've lost.
Jester hitting your first Gold is also pretty annoying.
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Davio

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #21 on: February 16, 2012, 03:55:09 am »
0

Losing the first Tournament to an inferior deck.

That one really pisses me off.
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blueblimp

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #22 on: February 16, 2012, 04:28:10 am »
0

Losing the first Tournament to an inferior deck.

That one really pisses me off.

It's even worse when, to add insult to injury, your tournament is parried (so you don't even get the +1 card +$1), and then your opponent's winning tournament is played when you have no province in hand, so they can play the prize on the same turn they get it. So annoying.
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brokoli

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #23 on: February 16, 2012, 06:21:49 am »
0

Being possessed when I have both my tournament and my province in hand (all prices are available).
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Kuildeous

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #24 on: February 16, 2012, 08:44:48 am »
0

I wish I could dump all six votes into drawing both buys on Turn 5. It aggravates me so, and the dread build sup. In Turn 3, I'm thinking, "Well, it's rare that I won't get one of those cards next turn but that's not likely to happen. Or is it? Crap, what if it does?" And then when Turn 4 comes around, that fear is realized, and I know that those two cards are my buys.

I'd also vote for anything that loses those buys in turns 3 and 4. Basically, it's a combination of the Turn 5 blues and the Sea Hag blues. I *could* have had a critical card in turn 4, but my opponent's Sea Hag/Jester/whatever just took it out of commission until my next shuffle.

I didn't vote for the Familiar only because I don't play with it often enough. I recognize the pain in it, much like I recognize the pain of taking a stapler to the hand even though I've never had it happen.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #25 on: February 16, 2012, 08:51:30 am »
0

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.
Boo for your anti-random spirit!

Kahryl

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #26 on: February 16, 2012, 09:12:31 am »
+6

My absolute favorite misfortune ever due to RAW EXPOSURE is buying exactly two terminals and having them collide THE ENTIRE GAME.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #27 on: February 16, 2012, 09:17:47 am »
+3

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.
Boo for your anti-random spirit!

Are you saying Boo or Boo-urns?
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Axxle

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #28 on: February 16, 2012, 02:17:35 pm »
+2

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.

You should play in veto mode then, that's one of the reasons it's there for.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #29 on: February 16, 2012, 02:40:57 pm »
0

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.

You should play in veto mode then, that's one of the reasons it's there for.

I leave it on don't care, but I feel like if I make it so I always play in veto mode, I'll miss being able to play against a decent population of people on the site.
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Axxle

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #30 on: February 16, 2012, 02:45:17 pm »
+3

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.

You should play in veto mode then, that's one of the reasons it's there for.

I leave it on don't care, but I feel like if I make it so I always play in veto mode, I'll miss being able to play against a decent population of people on the site.

Yeah, one of my peeves is people who sit in auto-match and decline matches.  It makes me reluctant to accept any matches from them after that since I can't shake the feeling that they're specializing in a certain combo (or at the very least playing with boards they're strong at) and just waiting till it shows up randomly.  And most of the time I keep getting automatched with them after I decline the second, third, fourth times.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #31 on: February 16, 2012, 02:49:29 pm »
+2

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.

You should play in veto mode then, that's one of the reasons it's there for.

I leave it on don't care, but I feel like if I make it so I always play in veto mode, I'll miss being able to play against a decent population of people on the site.

Yeah, one of my peeves is people who sit in auto-match and decline matches.  It makes me reluctant to accept any matches from them after that since I can't shake the feeling that they're specializing in a certain combo (or at the very least playing with boards they're strong at) and just waiting till it shows up randomly.  And most of the time I keep getting automatched with them after I decline the second, third, fourth times.

Sometimes I look at a set of cards, and it has Sea Hag and Torturer and all this crap and I go, I'm just not in the mood for this right now. Given that the overall goal is enjoyment, I feel like this is fair. I'm not trying to get cards I'll be better at, I'm just trying to play a game that I won't suffer through.
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Ferrouswheel

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #32 on: February 16, 2012, 03:16:57 pm »
0

Not really in the spirit of the thread, but accepting a game that has minions or a torturer/village engine without noticing. I just hate minions so much.

You should play in veto mode then, that's one of the reasons it's there for.

I leave it on don't care, but I feel like if I make it so I always play in veto mode, I'll miss being able to play against a decent population of people on the site.

Yeah, one of my peeves is people who sit in auto-match and decline matches.  It makes me reluctant to accept any matches from them after that since I can't shake the feeling that they're specializing in a certain combo (or at the very least playing with boards they're strong at) and just waiting till it shows up randomly.  And most of the time I keep getting automatched with them after I decline the second, third, fourth times.

Sometimes I look at a set of cards, and it has Sea Hag and Torturer and all this crap and I go, I'm just not in the mood for this right now. Given that the overall goal is enjoyment, I feel like this is fair. I'm not trying to get cards I'll be better at, I'm just trying to play a game that I won't suffer through.

Although it bothers me from time to time when someone does this, I'll admit that if I was just torturer lock downed, I'd prefer to play a game without them. I much prefer people who decline games due to a specific card to people who decline games based on their opponent.


I will add two new ones to the list though:

 - Losing when you were second player and would have won on your turn.

 - Not exactly a downer, but : Playing a player who is significantly rated higher than you who does things that you don't understand, and you precede to win. It really bugs me when my opponent is someone I expect to lose to, they do something really bizarre and it doesn't seem to go any where. Were they experimenting, or was I a turn away from being completely crushed? It's the way I felt when I first played people who knew how to use chapel correctly, but we were playing 4 player (in real life) and chapelling into a strategy doesn't work as well if the other 3 players manage to get enough of the provinces first. At least when I play someone who I expect to beat, and they do something odd that doesn't work out I don't wonder what was going on, I just assume they made a mistake. </rant>
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jonts26

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #33 on: February 16, 2012, 03:25:16 pm »
+1

- Not exactly a downer, but : Playing a player who is significantly rated higher than you who does things that you don't understand, and you precede to win. It really bugs me when my opponent is someone I expect to lose to, they do something really bizarre and it doesn't seem to go any where. Were they experimenting, or was I a turn away from being completely crushed? It's the way I felt when I first played people who knew how to use chapel correctly, but we were playing 4 player (in real life) and chapelling into a strategy doesn't work as well if the other 3 players manage to get enough of the provinces first. At least when I play someone who I expect to beat, and they do something odd that doesn't work out I don't wonder what was going on, I just assume they made a mistake. </rant>

It's probably foolish to assume higher ranked players can play all kingdoms better and lower ranked players play all kingdoms worse. Dominion can be quite varied and people have different strengths. Ranking is basically just an average over many many kingdom possibilities.

That said, as a high ranked player, I do experiment sometimes. And sometimes it backfires horribly. Also if you see a strange strategy being played, and it doesn't work out, it can sometimes be attributed to luck, not poor strategy. It's often very difficult to separate thsoe two over one game. But really, you could just ask the other play what they were thinking after the game.
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Davio

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #34 on: February 16, 2012, 03:32:31 pm »
+1

Here's one that I keep running into:
- Setting the game up so you'll be able to win next turn with all but horrible shuffle luck, and then of course having that bad luck (for example drawing KC-KC-Col-Col-Col) so your opponent wins instead.

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Axxle

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #35 on: February 16, 2012, 03:42:18 pm »
0

Sometimes I look at a set of cards, and it has Sea Hag and Torturer and all this crap and I go, I'm just not in the mood for this right now. Given that the overall goal is enjoyment, I feel like this is fair. I'm not trying to get cards I'll be better at, I'm just trying to play a game that I won't suffer through.

Not saying you *actually* do that, it's just what I irrationally feel.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #36 on: February 16, 2012, 04:49:38 pm »
+5

I voted for drawing initial buys on turn 5, but another big downer is opening with Baron/Remake/Salvager/Island/etc. and drawing it with 4 coppers the first time.
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Asklepios

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #37 on: February 17, 2012, 04:08:47 am »
0

Being swindled two turns in a row from Province to Peddler.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #38 on: February 17, 2012, 12:08:31 pm »
+1

I found something even worse than drawing your two openers on turn 5. Having them set to be drawn on turn 5 and having Oracle hit them. Then not drawing either of them until turn 8 (this actually happened to me in an IRL game last night)
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #39 on: February 17, 2012, 12:43:25 pm »
0

I found something even worse than drawing your two openers on turn 5. Having them set to be drawn on turn 5 and having Oracle hit them. Then not drawing either of them until turn 8 (this actually happened to me in an IRL game last night)

In that case doesn't oracle HAVE to be one of your openers? Unless you are saying that oracle killed one of your turn 3/4 buys.
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Thisisnotasmile

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #40 on: February 17, 2012, 01:02:14 pm »
0

I found something even worse than drawing your two openers on turn 5. Having them set to be drawn on turn 5 and having Oracle hit them. Then not drawing either of them until turn 8 (this actually happened to me in an IRL game last night)

In that case doesn't oracle HAVE to be one of your openers? Unless you are saying that oracle killed one of your turn 3/4 buys.

Sounds to me that Oracle was an opponent's opener.
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mnavratil

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #41 on: February 17, 2012, 01:04:51 pm »
0

...And I am dumb. Forgot about that whole attack of Oracle. Carry on then.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #42 on: February 17, 2012, 01:24:05 pm »
+1

While getting one of your opening buys on turn 5 hurts, I don't think it ever hurts more than when that buy was Chapel.

Also, I think everyone can relate to a classic.  It's a Province game nearing the end, and you draw $7.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #43 on: February 19, 2012, 04:25:22 pm »
0

I went mine/mint which was more of a vote for confusing cards in general (I have not actually mistaken mine for mint yet) one of my favorite (least favorite) misreads of the kingdom which I do a ton is not realizing it is a colony game until turn 6 or 7. This is usually not as bad as most of the others on this list, but I do it so often (like every other colony game it seems) that I have to hate it the most.
Gah, yes! You plan out a decent strat, play well -- in a non-Colony setting -- for several turns, then an opponent buys a Platinum (possibly after you have a Province), *look of shock, followed by face-palm* I vote for adding this to the survey, just because I'm curious if we're not the only ones.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #44 on: February 19, 2012, 06:46:29 pm »
+1

I went mine/mint which was more of a vote for confusing cards in general (I have not actually mistaken mine for mint yet) one of my favorite (least favorite) misreads of the kingdom which I do a ton is not realizing it is a colony game until turn 6 or 7. This is usually not as bad as most of the others on this list, but I do it so often (like every other colony game it seems) that I have to hate it the most.
Gah, yes! You plan out a decent strat, play well -- in a non-Colony setting -- for several turns, then an opponent buys a Platinum (possibly after you have a Province), *look of shock, followed by face-palm* I vote for adding this to the survey, just because I'm curious if we're not the only ones.

I do this all the time.  Most recently, I got a half dozen turns into a crazy Counting House strategy only to realize it was a Colony game.  I lost, but I'd have likely won on my next turn, so I still felt good about it given the circumstances.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #45 on: February 19, 2012, 07:05:59 pm »
0

My newest Dominion Downer: Got my ass kicked 3 straight times by WanderingWinder, didn't even get on his livestream for any feedback. How sad.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #46 on: February 19, 2012, 07:26:20 pm »
0

My newest Dominion Downer: Got my ass kicked 3 straight times by WanderingWinder, didn't even get on his livestream for any feedback. How sad.


You should have asked for some help/advice/thoughts afterward! I've been busier and thus recording less recently, though I want to make a new batch of videos soon.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #47 on: February 19, 2012, 07:55:04 pm »
0

My newest Dominion Downer: Got my ass kicked 3 straight times by WanderingWinder, didn't even get on his livestream for any feedback. How sad.


You should have asked for some help/advice/thoughts afterward! I've been busier and thus recording less recently, though I want to make a new batch of videos soon.

It's all right, a lot of stuff was pretty clear in retrospect, like how silly it was to not get a tactician. Next time I'll be sure to ask though =)
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #48 on: February 26, 2012, 12:14:26 pm »
0

2P on familiar boards is so frustrating. pretty much gg unless your opponent also hits 2P
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #49 on: February 27, 2012, 04:08:40 am »
0

- Losing when you were second player and would have won on your turn.

 - Not exactly a downer, but : Playing a player who is significantly rated higher than you who does things that you don't understand, and you precede to win. It really bugs me when my opponent is someone I expect to lose to, they do something really bizarre and it doesn't seem to go any where. Were they experimenting, or was I a turn away from being completely crushed? It's the way I felt when I first played people who knew how to use chapel correctly, but we were playing 4 player (in real life) and chapelling into a strategy doesn't work as well if the other 3 players manage to get enough of the provinces first. At least when I play someone who I expect to beat, and they do something odd that doesn't work out I don't wonder what was going on, I just assume they made a mistake. </rant>

You've just described two of my favourite Dominion Uppers!

A closely lost match usually means a match that was against an opponent that was well suited to my skill level. If I win by  a large margin, its usually a little disappointing as my opponnent's skill level would have meant that I might as well have being solitaire. If I lose by a large margin, its usually because I'm trying something new and unconventional and it goes belly up, or I'm so tired that my judgment fails. But if its close, that normally means I've played well, my opponent has played well, and the game has come down to a test of brinksmanship and fortune. That suits me fine!

As for beating higher ranked players, I love it! I've not yet played a higher ranked player and though that I won because their skill was lacking. THAT would be disappointing, sure. Each time I've beaten someone of higher rank its been because I've managed to play to or beyond their high level, or because I've had recognisable good fortune.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #50 on: February 27, 2012, 02:31:32 pm »
+2

Thinking about a game you played half an hour ago and realizing you could have won by three-piling on your last turn instead of buying more points.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #51 on: February 28, 2012, 05:44:24 pm »
0

You've just described two of my favourite Dominion Uppers!

A closely lost match usually means a match that was against an opponent that was well suited to my skill level. If I win by  a large margin, its usually a little disappointing as my opponnent's skill level would have meant that I might as well have being solitaire. If I lose by a large margin, its usually because I'm trying something new and unconventional and it goes belly up, or I'm so tired that my judgment fails. But if its close, that normally means I've played well, my opponent has played well, and the game has come down to a test of brinksmanship and fortune. That suits me fine!

Well, it depends on the game. Sometimes a hard fought battle is lots of fun, but if it was a torturer pin or something and then I lose by a turn that's another matter. I will also say, that even if it is a dominion downer, that doesn't exclude having fun. I was playing a RL game where all but one person drew CCPEE in a familiars game, and the person who didn't proceeded to destroy everyone, but it was still fun.

As for beating higher ranked players, I love it! I've not yet played a higher ranked player and though that I won because their skill was lacking. THAT would be disappointing, sure. Each time I've beaten someone of higher rank its been because I've managed to play to or beyond their high level, or because I've had recognisable good fortune.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy beating higher ranking players, it's just when they clearly are embarking on some bizarre strategy and I don't know if I won through luck, or having a better strategy, I much prefer to understand what both sides were doing at the end of the game.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #52 on: March 02, 2012, 10:55:12 am »
0

I'm surprised "3/4 split when there's a power $5 that opponent gets" isn't rated higher. If the card is Witch or Mountebank that is surely as bad as Potion + $2 on a Familiar board. It's the reason I prefer to play identical opening hands when I can, or more often IRL I play "choose your opening buys".

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #53 on: March 02, 2012, 11:08:16 am »
+2

Comparing to poker all-in probabilities (not unfamiliar for a lot of people I hope):

$4/$3 against an opponent's $5/$2 on Mountebank board = KJo vs AQ
+P$2 on familiar board vs +P$3 = 27o vs AA

Just to illustrate that the Familiar case is basically gg, while the Mountebank isn't at all.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #54 on: March 02, 2012, 01:46:12 pm »
0

Comparing to poker all-in probabilities (not unfamiliar for a lot of people I hope):

$4/$3 against an opponent's $5/$2 on Mountebank board = KJo vs AQ
+P$2 on familiar board vs +P$3 = 27o vs AA

Just to illustrate that the Familiar case is basically gg, while the Mountebank isn't at all.

o being offsuit? And do you have the stats if you miss familiar but hit Apocethary, Transmute, University or Scrying pool?
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #55 on: March 02, 2012, 01:51:54 pm »
0

Comparing to poker all-in probabilities (not unfamiliar for a lot of people I hope):

$4/$3 against an opponent's $5/$2 on Mountebank board = KJo vs AQ
+P$2 on familiar board vs +P$3 = 27o vs AA

Just to illustrate that the Familiar case is basically gg, while the Mountebank isn't at all.
Yeah, I have no idea what that means, sorry.
In my experience it's just as bad. Most often it's gg, but not always, in both cases. It depends a lot on what else is available of course.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #56 on: March 02, 2012, 02:17:51 pm »
0

Having played a few tens of thousands hands of poker, I'm rarely bothered by bad shuffle luck, such as the 2$p Familiar or 7$ draws. If you've lost with Aces to Ace-X all-in pre-flop for $100+ pots as much as I have, not much can bother you about card order. The real downers for me are my own mistakes. For example, I was playing in a 4 player game and was a turn or two away from Bishop-Plat-Gold-Gold-Colony and no one saw it coming (not playing against experts, of course), and I trashed my Chapel one turn too early by a miscalculation. It cost me about 5 turns and the game and I was grumbling about it for about an hour.

Good players lose all the time to sucky situations. The best way to mitigate that is to learn from your mistakes and get better so those situations don't hurt as much, not complaining about "luck". I'm not implying this thread is useless or anything, it is quite entertaining, but anyone posting here has played enough games to know that you've been on the giving end of that bad luck enough to "give" you some wins too.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #57 on: March 02, 2012, 02:24:39 pm »
0

Comparing to poker all-in probabilities (not unfamiliar for a lot of people I hope):

$4/$3 against an opponent's $5/$2 on Mountebank board = KJo vs AQ
+P$2 on familiar board vs +P$3 = 27o vs AA

Just to illustrate that the Familiar case is basically gg, while the Mountebank isn't at all.
Yeah, I have no idea what that means, sorry.
In my experience it's just as bad. Most often it's gg, but not always, in both cases. It depends a lot on what else is available of course.

KJo = King-Jack of different suits
AQ = Ace-Queen.
The Ace Queen is the favorite, but not by a ton.

AA = Aces
27o = Two-Seven of different suits.
Aces are about 4.5 to 1 favorite.

The latter situation certainly hurts worse in my experience, but maybe not as much as the poker analogy implies. I think it depends heavily on your opponent and the rest of the board. Going Familiar with $3p is pretty obvious to all but the n00best of players, so your skill could save you if there are combos that he/she doesn't see.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #58 on: March 02, 2012, 02:29:39 pm »
+1

The best way to mitigate that is to learn from your mistakes and get better so those situations don't hurt as much, not complaining about "luck". I'm not implying this thread is useless or anything, it is quite entertaining, but anyone posting here has played enough games to know that you've been on the giving end of that bad luck enough to "give" you some wins too.

That would imply people remember the 'good luck', or as often happens in poker, prescribe when they have good luck down to Great play on thier part instead of reversing the thought.

I had a friend once who called two all-ins with A6, both other hands were AK, and of course he hit a 6 to win. I never did convince him it was a bad move "How can it be bad, I won!"

This is why I wanted it to say probobility instead of luck earlier!
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #59 on: March 02, 2012, 03:23:49 pm »
0

That would imply people remember the 'good luck', or as often happens in poker, prescribe when they have good luck down to Great play on thier part instead of reversing the thought.

Yeah, I've been guilty of that, but it lessens with experience, at least for me. Also, losing hundreds of dollars to an idiotic play dozens of times in poker lessens the effect of losing a close Dominion game (for no money) because I drew $7 three turns in a row.

I had a friend once who called two all-ins with A6, both other hands were AK, and of course he hit a 6 to win. I never did convince him it was a bad move "How can it be bad, I won!"

Why give the free poker lesson? I always say, "nice hand" and hope they do it again. With my regular Dominion group that is composed of good friends of mine, we always talk about the game afterwards because we all want to get better. But I also play in another more competitive group and I never "give lessons" there. "Yeah, Pirate Ship sure is fun!" "No, I don't think buying Great Halls with your first four buys cost you the game. Just bad luck".
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #60 on: March 02, 2012, 03:28:26 pm »
0


Well, firstly because he was bragging he had done so well, and also, this was at a proper tournament and I was a little embarissed!

Also, they are my friends, so when I play them at home, we never play for serious money because otherwise pretty soon we would stop playing because they would be broke!

However, that being said, I rarely give them Dominion advice because I only just edge them out there some of the time!
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #61 on: March 04, 2012, 08:00:01 am »
0

I have overcome my hatred of 4/3 vs 5/2!
http://dominion.isotropic.org/gamelog/201203/04/game-20120304-044106-c2487343.html
..that and he bought a Highway with no +buys on the board =P
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #62 on: March 04, 2012, 09:35:52 am »
0

Opening Mint/Fool's Gold to draw Mint / Copper / Estate x 3 on Turn #3 is pretty annoying.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #63 on: March 04, 2012, 06:40:59 pm »
+1

when your opponent kc-golem and all of them are mean attacks like ghost ship and mountebank. card #6 is a lab. What does he draw with his lab? a kc and a golem
« Last Edit: March 04, 2012, 06:45:56 pm by Morgrim7 »
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #64 on: March 06, 2012, 04:55:45 pm »
0

Speaking of downers, I recently had a game where I drew 2p (P-C-C-E-E) two shuffles in a row. That was frustrating.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #65 on: March 12, 2012, 11:12:05 am »
0

You play a Jack of All Trades.
... You gain a Silver.
... You discard the Grand Market from the top of your deck.
... You draw a Grand Market.
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RisingJaguar

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #66 on: March 12, 2012, 04:24:18 pm »
0

You play a Jack of All Trades.
... You gain a Silver.
... You discard the Grand Market from the top of your deck.
... You draw a Grand Market.
I'll take this over $2+P any day
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #67 on: March 12, 2012, 04:27:36 pm »
0

Why are you buying 2 Grand Markets in a JOAT game?
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #68 on: March 13, 2012, 01:58:25 am »
0

Having just experienced it... $2P on a Familiar board on turn 5
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #69 on: March 13, 2012, 12:00:11 pm »
+1

This doesn't bug me that much, because it doesn't happen that much, but I'll still mention it.

Having an opponent mess up your reshuffle (Spy, Oracle, etc.) when you're carefully managing it.

For instance your current hand is Plat-Plat-Gold-Gold-Spy and your draw pile is empty.
You're thinking: "I won't play Spy this turn, it'll force a reshuffle without my Plats and Golds in!"
And then your opponent plays one...
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Davio

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #70 on: March 13, 2012, 12:05:06 pm »
0

Comparing to poker all-in probabilities (not unfamiliar for a lot of people I hope):

$4/$3 against an opponent's $5/$2 on Mountebank board = KJo vs AQ
+P$2 on familiar board vs +P$3 = 27o vs AA

Just to illustrate that the Familiar case is basically gg, while the Mountebank isn't at all.
You don't need Familiar anyway, just swallow 10 Curses in 14 turns, trash them all eventually and win!

Been wanting to post that miraculous game for some time.  ;D
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #71 on: March 15, 2012, 01:51:15 am »
0

A very slow game (due to card selection) against a very slow opponent (due to, who knows, brain damage?) who never talks.

OMG this game has gone on for almost half an hour.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #72 on: March 15, 2012, 02:31:39 am »
0

Having just experienced it... $2P on a Familiar board on turn 5

Pretty certain I've experienced $2P on both T5 and T8.  I think I then resigned.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #73 on: March 15, 2012, 06:11:43 am »
+1

A very slow game (due to card selection) against a very slow opponent (due to, who knows, brain damage?) who never talks.

OMG this game has gone on for almost half an hour.

I think that online people deserve more slack for taking a while. People often play while they're doing something else, especially in3-4p games where each person might be taking a mega-turn. A RL game often takes around 30 minutes (if you're lucky). People who have slow internet/aren't chained to their computers/want to think carefully about their choices deserve the benefit of the doubt, in my opinion, because I know that there are times when I'm going to be in the same boat.

One of my big pet peeves is people who resign by choice in 3p games. The extra provinces make everything cumbersome and I've built a 3p deck for a 2p game.

or KC/Possession. But is that pet peeve, or burning hatred?
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #74 on: March 15, 2012, 10:42:57 am »
+1

I think that online people deserve more slack for taking a while.

I don't really agree with this.  I think this one gets my vote for biggest pet-peeve.

People often play while they're doing something else...

This is just rude.  People who do this are making another person sit and wait so that they can spend time on something else.  (Obviously, it is possible to do something else while playing Dominion and still be responsive to the game.  That is not what I am talking about.)  Some people are new, and are slow to play.  This has never bothered me (as long as I am aware that is the reason); however, there are times, where the person on the other end is clearly not paying attention to the game and just takes ages to play the game.  They are slow to play cards, slow to start turns, and slow to respond to player interaction.  This is extremely inconsiderate, and anyone who does it should step back and think about the fact that there is an actual person on the other end of that computer interface.  If you really can't be bothered to respect another human being's time, please play Androminion or something.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #75 on: March 15, 2012, 05:06:09 pm »
0

I sometimes play Dominion while doing something else (depends on the type of game, whether we both have megaturns with no interactions), but.....

The other thing I'm doing is browsing the internet and when my Firefox Tab screems "Your Turn!!!" I immediately switch back and play my turn.
So I keep an eye on the game while doing something else and react promptly.
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Deadlock39

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #76 on: March 15, 2012, 05:15:17 pm »
0

I sometimes play Dominion while doing something else (depends on the type of game, whether we both have megaturns with no interactions), but.....

The other thing I'm doing is browsing the internet and when my Firefox Tab screems "Your Turn!!!" I immediately switch back and play my turn.
So I keep an eye on the game while doing something else and react promptly.

I take no issue with this type of multitasking.  I do this myself if the game has cards that just take a while to play due to their effects.  It's when the "Your Turn!!!" notification gets ignored for a minute or two several times in a game that I get frustrated.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #77 on: March 15, 2012, 09:30:42 pm »
0

A very slow game (due to card selection) against a very slow opponent (due to, who knows, brain damage?) who never talks.

OMG this game has gone on for almost half an hour.

I think that online people deserve more slack for taking a while. People often play while they're doing something else, especially in3-4p games where each person might be taking a mega-turn. A RL game often takes around 30 minutes (if you're lucky). People who have slow internet/aren't chained to their computers/want to think carefully about their choices deserve the benefit of the doubt, in my opinion, because I know that there are times when I'm going to be in the same boat.

http://councilroom.com/game?game_id=game-20120314-225307-c68ae32c.html

My opponent's T26 (next to last turn) took longer than 5 minutes.  12 total cards were played.  Cartographer and WW don't take 30 seconds apiece to figure out.

And yeah, if your multitasking is anything other than reading or browsing--both of which you can do while watching the "Your Turn!" flash--that's incredibly rude.  If you're here to play, play.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #78 on: March 19, 2012, 09:45:38 am »
0

My opponent's T26 (next to last turn) took longer than 5 minutes.  12 total cards were played.  Cartographer and WW don't take 30 seconds apiece to figure out.

To be fair, Cartographer can take a significant amount of time just to play on Iso when it's important to rearrange your card order each time, because the interface for switching card order around feels fairly finicky (at least it does to me).  Given that your opponent was mixing up Cartographers with card draw (and so reordering mattered), seems likely this was part of the problem.  Ironically, that's the kind of turn that would go much faster in RL than on Iso.
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dondon151

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #79 on: March 22, 2012, 03:40:51 am »
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IRL we'd just implicitly agree, if playing Cartographer with Wishing Well, that we'd just automatically wish for the proper card.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #80 on: March 22, 2012, 04:49:28 am »
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My stupid mistakes bother me the most. Choosing to draw with Steward when there's nothing to draw. Buying a single $5 card with $10 when I thought I had multiple buys. Getting confused by complicated KC shenanigans and throwing away a won game. Sometimes I start the game too fast and completely miss an important kingdom card on the board.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #81 on: March 24, 2012, 01:33:23 am »
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23 victory cards in the deck with a silk road rush, and losing by a few points. It happened to me TWICE tonight.
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Morgrim7

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #82 on: March 24, 2012, 09:41:36 am »
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When you have a hand full of powerful actions or a lot of money and golem hits your tactician.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #83 on: March 24, 2012, 01:59:14 pm »
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When you have a hand full of powerful actions or a lot of money and golem hits your tactician.

Why do you have a Tactician in a Golem deck? And why didn't you realise it would be very likely, if you already have lots of actions in hand?
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #84 on: March 24, 2012, 02:47:13 pm »
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When you have a hand full of powerful actions or a lot of money and golem hits your tactician.

Why do you have a Tactician in a Golem deck? And why didn't you realise it would be very likely, if you already have lots of actions in hand?
Many kc in deck, (not in hand) hoping to hit one and kc a mountebank.
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Mad, I tell you.

Maaaaaaaaaaaaad." -Voltgloss
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #85 on: March 24, 2012, 06:54:30 pm »
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That doesn't answer either question... I'd be very hesitant to play Golem if I had a tactician in deck, and I'd be fully aware it was a reasonable probability to happen if I did (unless you had, like, 20 other actions in deck, you're looking at a 20%+ probability)
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.
I hereby declare myself the best dominion player in the world. Obviously.

barsooma

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #86 on: March 24, 2012, 07:45:39 pm »
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That doesn't answer either question... I'd be very hesitant to play Golem if I had a tactician in deck, and I'd be fully aware it was a reasonable probability to happen if I did (unless you had, like, 20 other actions in deck, you're looking at a 20%+ probability)

But how are you going to play double Tactician without Golem????!??
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #87 on: March 24, 2012, 07:48:41 pm »
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That doesn't answer either question... I'd be very hesitant to play Golem if I had a tactician in deck, and I'd be fully aware it was a reasonable probability to happen if I did (unless you had, like, 20 other actions in deck, you're looking at a 20%+ probability)

But how are you going to play double Tactician without Golem????!??

Throne Room.  ;)
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #88 on: March 24, 2012, 09:31:44 pm »
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Double tactician being playing two active tacticians at once? Yeah... no. Double Tactician is a fun theorycraft, but not a viable strategy. The way to play double tactician is to gain tactician onto deck, along with a draw card, then play golem to tactician, draw, and hopefully hit your other tactician. Otherwise, I suspect Golem and Tactician have a negative effect together.

...And I'm right. http://councilroom.com/optimal_card_ratios?card_x=Golem&card_y=Tactician Pretty significant nombo there.
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...spin-offs are still better for all of the previously cited reasons.
But not strictly better, because the spinoff can have a different cost than the expansion.
I hereby declare myself the best dominion player in the world. Obviously.

barsooma

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #89 on: March 24, 2012, 09:33:50 pm »
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Double tactician being playing two active tacticians at once? Yeah... no. Double Tactician is a fun theorycraft, but not a viable strategy. The way to play double tactician is to gain tactician onto deck, along with a draw card, then play golem to tactician, draw, and hopefully hit your other tactician. Otherwise, I suspect Golem and Tactician have a negative effect together.

...And I'm right. http://councilroom.com/optimal_card_ratios?card_x=Golem&card_y=Tactician Pretty significant nombo there.

Inconceivable!
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #90 on: May 06, 2012, 06:45:42 pm »
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I hate it when I confuse Crossroads with Courtyard. So annoying! >:(
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Mad, I tell you.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #91 on: May 06, 2012, 07:19:40 pm »
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...one of my favorite (least favorite) misreads of the kingdom which I do a ton is not realizing it is a colony game until turn 6 or 7. This is usually not as bad as most of the others on this list, but I do it so often (like every other colony game it seems) that I have to hate it the most.
This happens to me almost every colony game.  I can't figure out what goes on that I can miss two additional cards in a stack of what is normally 7 or 8.  Anybody have any idea how this happens?
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #92 on: May 06, 2012, 08:04:10 pm »
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...one of my favorite (least favorite) misreads of the kingdom which I do a ton is not realizing it is a colony game until turn 6 or 7. This is usually not as bad as most of the others on this list, but I do it so often (like every other colony game it seems) that I have to hate it the most.
This happens to me almost every colony game.  I can't figure out what goes on that I can miss two additional cards in a stack of what is normally 7 or 8.  Anybody have any idea how this happens?

Well, I'm on a Netbook so I often can't see the extra cards because they're off my screen. I have to hit Ctrl - (a helpful tip someone gave me on iso chat!) or go to fullscreen. In a Potion game even Fullscreen is too big for my screen.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #93 on: May 06, 2012, 08:52:07 pm »
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misclicking gold instead of platinum... or other such misclicks...

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #94 on: May 06, 2012, 10:55:17 pm »
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...one of my favorite (least favorite) misreads of the kingdom which I do a ton is not realizing it is a colony game until turn 6 or 7. This is usually not as bad as most of the others on this list, but I do it so often (like every other colony game it seems) that I have to hate it the most.
This happens to me almost every colony game.  I can't figure out what goes on that I can miss two additional cards in a stack of what is normally 7 or 8.  Anybody have any idea how this happens?

Well, I'm on a Netbook so I often can't see the extra cards because they're off my screen. I have to hit Ctrl - (a helpful tip someone gave me on iso chat!) or go to fullscreen. In a Potion game even Fullscreen is too big for my screen.
Text mode, my friend.

ksf_

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #95 on: May 08, 2012, 08:24:03 pm »
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Even in text mode I had to edit the chrome on Firefox to see everything and still be able to read anything.
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mnavratil

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #96 on: May 09, 2012, 12:50:54 pm »
+1

..I had to edit the chrome on Firefox...

??? You did what now?
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #97 on: May 09, 2012, 12:59:22 pm »
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..I had to edit the chrome on Firefox...

??? You did what now?

Yeah?  You don't know about that?  It's like editing the explorer on Safari.  ;)
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Thisisnotasmile

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #98 on: May 09, 2012, 01:01:16 pm »
+2



Any more for any more?
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paddyodoors

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #99 on: May 09, 2012, 01:03:19 pm »
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Worst Dominion Downer for me is not getting to $5 until Turn 6 (or later).
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #100 on: May 09, 2012, 01:20:52 pm »
+2

..I had to edit the chrome on Firefox...

??? You did what now?

Yeah?  You don't know about that?  It's like editing the explorer on Safari.  ;)

I don't know if this is what the OP is talking about, but if you dig deep into Firefox, they call the markup that controls their interface "the chrome."  The term pre-dates the Google browser.  https://developer.mozilla.org/en/XUL_School/The_Essentials_of_an_Extension#The_Chrome
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Davio

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #101 on: May 09, 2012, 02:56:21 pm »
+2

Poor Firefox has had so many name changes, been using it since Phoenix. :)
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mDuo13

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #102 on: May 09, 2012, 03:52:34 pm »
+1

Getting $7 for like four turns in a row.
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Grujah

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #103 on: May 09, 2012, 07:49:01 pm »
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Poor Firefox has had so many name changes, been using it since Phoenix. :)

I've been using it since it was just called Mozilla Navigator ;)

Though I've switch to Chrome some time ago.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #104 on: May 18, 2012, 02:43:50 pm »
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Just realized whats mine (by far): going 2nd after a loss. Especially annoying because it tends to happen when you're feeling irritated already.
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #105 on: May 18, 2012, 03:03:12 pm »
+1

Just realized whats mine (by far): going 2nd after a loss. Especially annoying because it tends to happen when you're feeling irritated already.
When we play IRL, our hose rule is "if you lost, you go first next game."
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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #106 on: May 18, 2012, 03:07:57 pm »
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Just realized whats mine (by far): going 2nd after a loss. Especially annoying because it tends to happen when you're feeling irritated already.
When we play IRL, our hose rule is "if you lost, you go first next game."
That's how Iso does it... but sometimes you have two people coming of a loss playing each other.
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Deadlock39

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #107 on: May 18, 2012, 03:08:47 pm »
+1

Axxle beat me too it.  Posting anyway...

That is actually the official rule, so not really a house rule.

It is also Isotropic's rule, but if both players lost, only one gets to go first.  This is the source of Eevee's frustration.

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Re: What is your favorite Dominion Downer?
« Reply #108 on: May 18, 2012, 08:46:55 pm »
0

..I had to edit the chrome on Firefox...

??? You did what now?

Yeah?  You don't know about that?  It's like editing the explorer on Safari.  ;)

I don't know if this is what the OP is talking about, but if you dig deep into Firefox, they call the markup that controls their interface "the chrome."  The term pre-dates the Google browser.  https://developer.mozilla.org/en/XUL_School/The_Essentials_of_an_Extension#The_Chrome

That is in fact what I was referencing, although the sleek redesign has been a nice benefit.
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