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Author Topic: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies  (Read 78035 times)

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Commodore Chuckles

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #275 on: March 12, 2022, 03:27:58 pm »
+1

Was thinking Faithful Hound would protect me from the gang of pickpockets. I was wrong.

yeah suddenly i have to care about what order duration draw happens at the start of next turn. I had played a highwayman and did that before Gang of Pickpockets and uh whoops

It also makes Expedition a lot less useful if you don't have a good way to gain Favors.
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mxdata

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #276 on: March 12, 2022, 03:39:49 pm »
+1

Was thinking Faithful Hound would protect me from the gang of pickpockets. I was wrong.

yeah suddenly i have to care about what order duration draw happens at the start of next turn. I had played a highwayman and did that before Gang of Pickpockets and uh whoops

It also makes Expedition a lot less useful if you don't have a good way to gain Favors.

Any Duration draw too, for that matter. Especially Hireling. I guess you'd get some free sifting, but that's about it
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grrgrrgrr

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #277 on: March 12, 2022, 03:54:47 pm »
+3

If you buy Band of Misfits in a kingdom with Family of Inventors, your opponent can screw you over by making BoM cheaper.

They can also nerf Remodel and its enhanced variants by making Gold/Platinum cheaper.

Another annoying anti-synergy is Courier + Herb Gatherer. You'd think Herb Gatherer can give Courier a maximum array of targets. But then you realize Courier starts with "Discard the top card of your deck". Yikes.
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dpm

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #278 on: March 12, 2022, 05:43:51 pm »
+1

If you buy Band of Misfits in a kingdom with Family of Inventors, your opponent can screw you over by making BoM cheaper.

They can also nerf Remodel and its enhanced variants by making Gold/Platinum cheaper.

Another annoying anti-synergy is Courier + Herb Gatherer. You'd think Herb Gatherer can give Courier a maximum array of targets. But then you realize Courier starts with "Discard the top card of your deck". Yikes.

Courier is really good with League of Masons, though -- spend a favor to put the exact card you need into the discard, and Courier it. 

Suppose Remake is the trasher, you're a little bit behind in getting thin, and your opponent puts -1 on Duchess...

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AJD

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #279 on: March 12, 2022, 08:29:47 pm »
+2

Was thinking Faithful Hound would protect me from the gang of pickpockets. I was wrong.

yeah suddenly i have to care about what order duration draw happens at the start of next turn. I had played a highwayman and did that before Gang of Pickpockets and uh whoops

It also makes Expedition a lot less useful if you don't have a good way to gain Favors.

Any Duration draw too, for that matter. Especially Hireling. I guess you'd get some free sifting, but that's about it

It's better to have that sifting than just have reduced handsize! The problem with Expedition/Pickpockets is that you have to draw the extra cards before you discard down to 4, but that's not the case with Hireling, so you can draw back to 5 anyway.
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mxdata

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #280 on: March 12, 2022, 08:34:57 pm »
0

Was thinking Faithful Hound would protect me from the gang of pickpockets. I was wrong.

yeah suddenly i have to care about what order duration draw happens at the start of next turn. I had played a highwayman and did that before Gang of Pickpockets and uh whoops

It also makes Expedition a lot less useful if you don't have a good way to gain Favors.

Any Duration draw too, for that matter. Especially Hireling. I guess you'd get some free sifting, but that's about it

It's better to have that sifting than just have reduced handsize! The problem with Expedition/Pickpockets is that you have to draw the extra cards before you discard down to 4, but that's not the case with Hireling, so you can draw back to 5 anyway.

Oh, right! I forgot you can order Duration draw after Gang of Pickpockets
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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #281 on: March 13, 2022, 08:29:55 am »
+2

Was thinking Faithful Hound would protect me from the gang of pickpockets. I was wrong.

yeah suddenly i have to care about what order duration draw happens at the start of next turn. I had played a highwayman and did that before Gang of Pickpockets and uh whoops

It also makes Expedition a lot less useful if you don't have a good way to gain Favors.

Any Duration draw too, for that matter. Especially Hireling. I guess you'd get some free sifting, but that's about it

It's better to have that sifting than just have reduced handsize! The problem with Expedition/Pickpockets is that you have to draw the extra cards before you discard down to 4, but that's not the case with Hireling, so you can draw back to 5 anyway.

Oh, right! I forgot you can order Duration draw after Gang of Pickpockets
yeah more on the "annoying" side than "potentially harmful" side
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mxdata

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #282 on: March 14, 2022, 06:37:57 pm »
+1

Fortune Teller can function as a counter to Order of Masons. If you leave your Victory cards in the discard pile with Order of Masons, then Fortune Teller just ends up putting your entire deck into the discard pile, and you'd have to use Masons all over again on your next draw if you want to keep them out of your draw pile. So, unless you have enough Favors to do it twice in a row, you end up getting those cards mixed back into your draw pile
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mxdata

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #283 on: March 19, 2022, 12:21:39 pm »
+2

Distant Shores is a terrible card when Black Cat is also in the kingdom
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Gherald

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #284 on: April 08, 2022, 02:05:31 am »
+2

Royal Galley + Groundskeeper
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ipofanes

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #285 on: April 15, 2022, 01:03:55 am »
+1

Cards gained by Crafter's Guild do not count towards the Garrison tokens, no matter if you spend the favours this turn or next turn. (Edge cases aside.)
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humcalc216

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #286 on: May 26, 2022, 02:03:42 pm »
+4

Crossroads + Ways. If you play your first Crossroads as a Way, you don't get +3 Actions from any of your Crossroads.
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Honkeyfresh

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #287 on: May 27, 2022, 11:30:26 pm »
+1

Distant Shores is a terrible card when Black Cat is also in the kingdom

Why is it that the ultimate card in a pile spams me with estates?  +1 vp and 1 estate in exile would've made it actually a good card.
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Honkeyfresh

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #288 on: May 27, 2022, 11:31:55 pm »
0

Royal Galley + Groundskeeper

umm what is annoying about a +1 card/Action an +1vp bonus on the second turn?
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Gubump

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #289 on: May 27, 2022, 11:53:26 pm »
0

Royal Galley + Groundskeeper

umm what is annoying about a +1 card/Action an +1vp bonus on the second turn?

For the first turn, it's set aside and not in play.
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Honkeyfresh

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #290 on: May 28, 2022, 01:33:10 am »
0

Royal Galley + Groundskeeper

umm what is annoying about a +1 card/Action an +1vp bonus on the second turn?

For the first turn, it's set aside and not in play.

ah i see.  I was thinking the second turn
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jomini

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #291 on: June 08, 2022, 06:30:03 pm »
+2

Royal Galley + Groundskeeper

umm what is annoying about a +1 card/Action an +1vp bonus on the second turn?

For the first turn, it's set aside and not in play.

ah i see.  I was thinking the second turn

Which is the correct way to think about it. Not the best option out there as you only have your Keeper in play every other turn ... but Rg is very good at setting up megaturns where you can bank massive points piling down the estates or even the duchies.

Crossroads + Ways. If you play your first Crossroads as a Way, you don't get +3 Actions from any of your Crossroads.
Sure, but for a lot Xroads decks you want to have extra Xroads to be sure to get the actions (e.g. for something like Bridge troll) and then you can use the others for something better (e.g. Xroads/Btroll/Mole needs to play exactly one Xroads, and then just cycles through the deck off the other Xroads until you get to the Btrolls). In any event, there are exceedingly few Ways that you will want to play before gaining the +3 Actions if you want them. E.g. Seal, Monkey, and Ox are not going to be your first Xroads play, let alone Butterfly or Horse.

Xroads is actually extremely strong with just about all the Ways and definitely better than Xroads alone. Having options on $2 cards makes them wildly better pretty much regardless of what the option is.

Distant Shores is a terrible card when Black Cat is also in the kingdom
This is rarely true. If Distant shores is good you either have a green tolerant deck (e.g. Shepherd) or, more commonly, good enough trashing to deal with incoming estates. Adding a few curses on top may well be trivial to burn off (e.g. Count, Chapel, Forge, Sauna, Donate). Likewise games with other cursers often mean that few curses are left to toss with Black cats. The draw for your opponent is annoying, but a deck that supports a lot of Bcats is likely one where they are going to draw through regardless of if you gain an estate or buy a province.

And even if the trashing is not there, Dshores is net neutral on deck quality one shuffle after you play it. Often, game is winding down as you buy it and there are likely to be few curses left regardless. Yes, if you lack curse trashing (e.g. Spice merchant) if can be hard. But if you would gamble on a duchy, you should likely gamble on a Dshore.

The real brutal attack here is Rabble. Even if you are green tolerant, you will have a lot of hands with 3 estates and no enabler.
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Honkeyfresh

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #292 on: June 10, 2022, 03:37:53 pm »
0

Royal Galley + Groundskeeper

umm what is annoying about a +1 card/Action an +1vp bonus on the second turn?

For the first turn, it's set aside and not in play.

ah i see.  I was thinking the second turn

Which is the correct way to think about it. Not the best option out there as you only have your Keeper in play every other turn ... but Rg is very good at setting up megaturns where you can bank massive points piling down the estates or even the duchies.


Plus the extra action/draw could be massive, especially if there are no _2 actions/draw on the board
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mxdata

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #293 on: June 17, 2022, 02:13:03 am »
+5

Hermit is unable to trash Curses when Charlatan is in the kingdom, meaning that what is normally a great way to deal with Curses becomes useless for that function
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mxdata

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #294 on: June 17, 2022, 02:30:21 am »
+4

Hermit is unable to trash Curses when Charlatan is in the kingdom, meaning that what is normally a great way to deal with Curses becomes useless for that function

I came across this in a kingdom with Charlatan, Hermit, and Pooka. Which was kinda funny because Hermit lost its ability to trash Curses, while Pooka gained that ability
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Honkeyfresh

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #295 on: June 29, 2022, 04:42:24 pm »
0

Highwayman and cursed gold.  Basically gives a free copper and they don't get the curse. And they get the option to +3 & curse if it helps them.  Probably won't stop u getting highwayman, but makes other strong attacks more sesirable and haunted haunted woods a no brainer.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2022, 06:18:36 pm by Honkeyfresh »
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jomini

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #296 on: June 30, 2022, 10:34:55 am »
+1

Highwayman and cursed gold.  Basically gives a free copper and they don't get the curse. And they get the option to +3 & curse if it helps them.  Probably won't stop u getting highwayman, but makes other strong attacks more sesirable and haunted haunted woods a no brainer.
Highway man is highly effective at mitigating the impacts of curse on your turn, though. The worst thing about the early curses is that they lower the odds that you will line up your trasher & curses, villages & terminals, cursed gold & remodel, or the rest. Highwayman does the drawing up front and trades off a shorthand for a big hand, which is wildly better for things like using Remake.

Yeah, the attack on Highwayman is less impressive, but the draw is much, much better when dealing with mid-efficiency trashers or attempting to fire off engines with low efficiency trashers with the extra curses from Cursed gold. Being able to open something like Remake/Highwayman is exceedingly powerful.
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Honkeyfresh

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #297 on: July 01, 2022, 04:06:36 pm »
0

Highwayman and cursed gold.  Basically gives a free copper and they don't get the curse. And they get the option to +3 & curse if it helps them.  Probably won't stop u getting highwayman, but makes other strong attacks more sesirable and haunted haunted woods a no brainer.
Highway man is highly effective at mitigating the impacts of curse on your turn, though. The worst thing about the early curses is that they lower the odds that you will line up your trasher & curses, villages & terminals, cursed gold & remodel, or the rest. Highwayman does the drawing up front and trades off a shorthand for a big hand, which is wildly better for things like using Remake.

Yeah, the attack on Highwayman is less impressive, but the draw is much, much better when dealing with mid-efficiency trashers or attempting to fire off engines with low efficiency trashers with the extra curses from Cursed gold. Being able to open something like Remake/Highwayman is exceedingly powerful.

Oh I agree, like I said it probably won't really stop u buying highwayman (as I agree it's an elite attack card) it's just a small anti-synergy with it. More likely it will just make you track if their cursed gold is coming up in debating 2 terminal actions and possibly then choose the non highwayman option, but it's still only a very small negative anyway.
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vidicate

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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #298 on: July 02, 2022, 11:23:05 pm »
0

Haha imagine these two in the same kingdom—Skirmisher + Berserker, lulz. I think they might actually be the same dude, when he’s both on and off duty, or perhaps before and after unemployment ;D ;D Oh! Maybe that’s why they can’t trigger each other’s attack :o Yep, that’s now my head-canon.
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Re: Annoying and potentially harmful card anti-synergies
« Reply #299 on: July 07, 2022, 06:08:40 pm »
+1

Not a total anti-synergy but it changes how u play it.  Alchemist and Crypt, what a neat combo. You are so smart! Crypt potions so you always have 1 on play right?  Yeah, but only if you don't put it in the crypt (so maybe get 2 to cycle them) b/c when you put it in the crypt it leaves play and all your alchemists leave the realm of the top-decked.
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"Sometimes I say some things people may think are just outlandish, but I'm going to have the last laugh." -- Riff Raff  Exodus 6:66
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