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Author Topic: Dominion: Pirate's Life  (Read 1791 times)

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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #25 on: August 17, 2017, 10:42:16 pm »
0

Concerning BGG, I just posted it there for publicity. Not everyone that likes Dominion and is willing to check out fan expansions knows that this website exists. I actually found out that this site existed through Reddit (which is where I originally posted).

Now about revealing Reactions, I never quite understood the infinite revealing. What wording would be appropriate to reveal once per attack/gain?

I'll change Blessing's colouring accordingly. I had thought about it but forgot.
« Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 10:43:19 pm by Uldiniad »
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ConMan

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #26 on: August 17, 2017, 11:02:45 pm »
+2

Generally, you can't prevent infinite revealing - it's in your hand, it goes back into your hand, there's no accountability. The two ways around infinite revealing are (1) make it only do something useful on the first reveal (e.g. if you reveal Moat a second time, it doesn't double-protect you or anything), or (2) put it somewhere it can't be revealed again (e.g. Horse Traders gets set aside and goes back into your hand at the start of your next turn, Caravan Guard gets played, etc).
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werothegreat

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #27 on: August 17, 2017, 11:17:55 pm »
+1

Now about revealing Reactions, I never quite understood the infinite revealing. What wording would be appropriate to reveal once per attack/gain?

I did something similar here:

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16928.msg710352#msg710352
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majiponi

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #28 on: August 18, 2017, 09:24:31 am »
+1

Ravhiser doesn't work well. For example, my hand is 5 Coppers, you play Ravhiser, I reveal Ravhiser, trash it, you choose me, I choose "gain, trash another", to gain Ravhiser. I don't have to trash anything except for the first Ravhiser. And what happens when 2 players reveal the same?
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Jack Rudd

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #29 on: August 18, 2017, 10:00:44 am »
+1

I can try reorder it. But I definitely don't want the opponents to reveal their hand before the player has chosen the effect
You don't need them to, but you do need them to before they actually trash the card. Because if the card to be trashed is a Rats or a Cultist, you will otherwise be unable to tell if they have been cheating.
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #30 on: August 18, 2017, 11:00:23 am »
0

I can try reorder it. But I definitely don't want the opponents to reveal their hand before the player has chosen the effect
You don't need them to, but you do need them to before they actually trash the card. Because if the card to be trashed is a Rats or a Cultist, you will otherwise be unable to tell if they have been cheating.

Good point. Will look into that. I'll update the image on the first post and make an update post as soon as I have made the changes :)
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #31 on: August 18, 2017, 11:03:36 am »
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Ravhiser doesn't work well. For example, my hand is 5 Coppers, you play Ravhiser, I reveal Ravhiser, trash it, you choose me, I choose "gain, trash another", to gain Ravhiser. I don't have to trash anything except for the first Ravhiser. And what happens when 2 players reveal the same?

Good observations. Had not considered cases where the player had no Actions in hand. Will have to add clauses for that type of thing. When 2 players reveal the same I guess it is up to you to choose which copy you get but I don't think that needs extra wording. Could be put in a FAQ for the card
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #32 on: August 18, 2017, 11:04:43 am »
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Now about revealing Reactions, I never quite understood the infinite revealing. What wording would be appropriate to reveal once per attack/gain?

I did something similar here:

http://forum.dominionstrategy.com/index.php?topic=16928.msg710352#msg710352

I had been checking your cards and saw that. Thanks for the reference. Will be looking into it for help with wording.
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #33 on: August 18, 2017, 11:07:20 am »
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Generally, you can't prevent infinite revealing - it's in your hand, it goes back into your hand, there's no accountability. The two ways around infinite revealing are (1) make it only do something useful on the first reveal (e.g. if you reveal Moat a second time, it doesn't double-protect you or anything), or (2) put it somewhere it can't be revealed again (e.g. Horse Traders gets set aside and goes back into your hand at the start of your next turn, Caravan Guard gets played, etc).

Thanks a bunch for the tips. I'll definitely be thinking of these two options when reviewing Blessing :)
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LastFootnote

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #34 on: August 18, 2017, 11:14:37 am »
+3

Concerning BGG, I just posted it there for publicity. Not everyone that likes Dominion and is willing to check out fan expansions knows that this website exists. I actually found out that this site existed through Reddit (which is where I originally posted).

There is a difference between posting a thread with your fan cards on BGG and creating an actual board game entry for your fan expansion. It takes a lot of chutzpah to post a barely-tested fan expansion with lots of problematic cards alongside the official ones. Not that you're the first to do so.

EDIT: I mean it's labeled "fan expansion", which is great. Really it just boggles my mind that BGG lumps official expansions for things together with fan ones. There should be separate categories. But that's not your fault, that's just BGG being BGG.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 11:18:47 am by LastFootnote »
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #35 on: August 18, 2017, 11:23:30 am »
0

Concerning BGG, I just posted it there for publicity. Not everyone that likes Dominion and is willing to check out fan expansions knows that this website exists. I actually found out that this site existed through Reddit (which is where I originally posted).

EDIT: I mean it's labeled "fan expansion", which is great. Really it just boggles my mind that BGG lumps official expansions for things together with fan ones. There should be separate categories. But that's not your fault, that's just BGG being BGG.

Agreed about categorizing them. BGG has a good share of flaws/inconsistencies.
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #36 on: August 18, 2017, 01:11:12 pm »
0

UPDATE: Thanks for pointing out the quirks again

Blessing: Corrected colouring. Changed wording to ensure the Reaction is only revealed once per gained card.

Imposter: Corrected colouring.

Pirate: Reordered wording to ensure the players reveal their hand before trashing to prove they are not cheating.

Ravisher: Previous owner now gains the trashed Action back into their hand, if they choose so. Changed wording to ensure that the previous owner cannot choose to gain their previous action back without giving an equal-costing Action in exchange.
« Last Edit: August 18, 2017, 01:13:04 pm by Uldiniad »
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werothegreat

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #37 on: August 18, 2017, 07:05:44 pm »
+3

Some of your cards are really text-dense.  Simple is better.  I would recommend trying to find ways to pare down words, even if that means getting rid of effects.  One card doesn't have to do everything (even Jack of all Trades doesn't, really).  Figure out what the card is trying to do, and have it do that, without any extranea.  Then add vanilla bonuses for balance purposes, as necessary.
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #38 on: August 18, 2017, 07:55:19 pm »
0

Some of your cards are really text-dense.  Simple is better.  I would recommend trying to find ways to pare down words, even if that means getting rid of effects.  One card doesn't have to do everything (even Jack of all Trades doesn't, really).  Figure out what the card is trying to do, and have it do that, without any extranea.  Then add vanilla bonuses for balance purposes, as necessary.

Will consider that. Ravisher and Pirate are the worst on those aspects for sure

Thanks for the tips
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #39 on: September 02, 2017, 07:21:12 pm »
0

UPDATE

Pirate: Removed the curse-giving since it is brutal enough on its own (and Saboteur only did one effect).

Stock: Replaces Stock Market. We found it was a little weak. So we thought of trying it as a treasure.
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Aquila

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #40 on: September 03, 2017, 12:44:56 pm »
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UPDATE

Pirate: Removed the curse-giving since it is brutal enough on its own (and Saboteur only did one effect).
OK, looks like you've removed the first-play-only limitation with it. So the possibility of trashing the opponent's deck is back again, but they can defend against it now with their own pirate.

Stock: Replaces Stock Market. We found it was a little weak. So we thought of trying it as a treasure.
There's no way as yet to play actions in the buy phase, so there's bound to be a problem come up with it. The closest I can think of to a card that depends on being played at the Action Phase is Tactician - if the company is Tactician and you play Stock last at your buy phase, there's no real penalty to it. When you change an Action into a Treasure card, you should always ask 'why not just add +1 action instead?' I don't know a good answer why not here, but if you decided you really wanted to involve the Company at the buy phase, then perhaps you could set a company aside to play at the start of next turn, or you can buy a Company (could be with debt) straight onto the deck?
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guidobass

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #41 on: September 03, 2017, 01:46:27 pm »
+1

Villa puts a player back into their Action phase when they gain a Villa, with the gained Villa going into their hand.
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Asper

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #42 on: September 03, 2017, 03:41:16 pm »
0

UPDATE

Pirate: Removed the curse-giving since it is brutal enough on its own (and Saboteur only did one effect).
OK, looks like you've removed the first-play-only limitation with it. So the possibility of trashing the opponent's deck is back again, but they can defend against it now with their own pirate.

Stock: Replaces Stock Market. We found it was a little weak. So we thought of trying it as a treasure.
There's no way as yet to play actions in the buy phase, so there's bound to be a problem come up with it. The closest I can think of to a card that depends on being played at the Action Phase is Tactician - if the company is Tactician and you play Stock last at your buy phase, there's no real penalty to it. When you change an Action into a Treasure card, you should always ask 'why not just add +1 action instead?' I don't know a good answer why not here, but if you decided you really wanted to involve the Company at the buy phase, then perhaps you could set a company aside to play at the start of next turn, or you can buy a Company (could be with debt) straight onto the deck?

I agree that Stock should not be a Treasure if it allows playing a Company. I'm not really a fan of allowing to play a Company either in fact, but if you have that, there's really no reason to not make this an Action with +1 Action instead. Basically it becomes a Village variant this way, where you must use one of the actions on a particular card.

Rules wise, I don't see an issue playing an Action card in your buy phase. It's just ugly. Then again, official cards already play Treasures in your buy phase and play Actions outside of your turn, but I can't say I'm a fan of those, either.

Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #43 on: September 03, 2017, 06:29:35 pm »
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Villa puts a player back into their Action phase when they gain a Villa, with the gained Villa going into their hand.

Thanks for reminding me of that :)
I'm wondering if there is any way I could use this kind of mechanic for Stock Market
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #44 on: September 03, 2017, 07:08:32 pm »
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OK, looks like you've removed the first-play-only limitation with it. So the possibility of trashing the opponent's deck is back again, but they can defend against it now with their own pirate.
The first-play-only effect has been replaced with the attack only affecting players with 5 or more cards in hand. So I don't see how you can trash opponent's hand (which I agree is ludicrous) given the new effect. Concerning the defense, I was told to look at Knights for their power, price and self-trashing upon trashing another Knight effect.

Quote
There's no way as yet to play actions in the buy phase [...] I don't know a good answer why not here, but if you decided you really wanted to involve the Company at the buy phase, then perhaps you could set a company aside to play at the start of next turn, or you can buy a Company (could be with debt) straight onto the deck?

It is true that there is no way yet. I am getting ahead of myself because I was thinking of trying to get Stock to follow the idea of after buy phase cards from Nocturne. Anyway, I like the suggestions concerning how to manage Actions that are played in the buy phase, will consider them when reviewing. Or I'll wait for Nocturne to come out and see if I could get Stock to act like those Doom (I think that's their name) cards :)
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #45 on: September 03, 2017, 07:30:02 pm »
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Quote
I agree that Stock should not be a Treasure if it allows playing a Company. I'm not really a fan of allowing to play a Company either in fact, but if you have that, there's really no reason to not make this an Action with +1 Action instead. Basically it becomes a Village variant this way, where you must use one of the actions on a particular card.

Rules wise, I don't see an issue playing an Action card in your buy phase. It's just ugly. Then again, official cards already play Treasures in your buy phase and play Actions outside of your turn, but I can't say I'm a fan of those, either.

I had considered +1 Action, but I thought it would be quite a bit stronger than turning it into a treasure and also couldn't think of a good price for it with that addition.
Treasures you can play automatically without using an action, that was my thought pattern.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2017, 08:30:52 pm by Uldiniad »
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Asper

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #46 on: September 03, 2017, 09:09:00 pm »
+1

There's no way as yet to play actions in the buy phase

There is. Just not in your buy phase. When another player plays Relic, you can play Caravan Guard.

Seriously, though: Rules-wise, playing a Village in your buy phase should just give you +1 Card and +2 Actions like it's supposed to do. You just can't use these Actions to play another Action card. If you could play Action cards in your buy phase only because you have Actions left over, you could just play all your money before playing your Library. And you do have Actions left in your buy phase, as we know from Villa and Diadem. So no real "problem" here. Just fully-avoidable confusion.

Quote
I agree that Stock should not be a Treasure if it allows playing a Company. I'm not really a fan of allowing to play a Company either in fact, but if you have that, there's really no reason to not make this an Action with +1 Action instead. Basically it becomes a Village variant this way, where you must use one of the actions on a particular card.

Rules wise, I don't see an issue playing an Action card in your buy phase. It's just ugly. Then again, official cards already play Treasures in your buy phase and play Actions outside of your turn, but I can't say I'm a fan of those, either.

I had considered +1 Action, but I thought it would be quite a bit stronger than turning it into a treasure and also couldn't think of a good price for it with that addition.
Treasures you can play automatically without using an action, that was my thought pattern.

Well, the Treasure version has the advantage that you can play it even if you have no Actions left when you draw it. Like, play Smithy, draw Stock, play Militia. That's pretty strong. It has the downside that nonterminal cards will never be played with Stock as long as you can avoid it, though. Basically it goes good with terminals: Terminal draw because you can play it after the draw, and coin because those are the perfect Stock card (no loss or risk). Nonterminals have the only advantage that you can load up on them to drain the pile, but then you get nothing special out of having them.

Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #47 on: September 04, 2017, 07:28:13 pm »
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Quote
Well, the Treasure version has the advantage that you can play it even if you have no Actions left when you draw it. Like, play Smithy, draw Stock, play Militia. That's pretty strong. It has the downside that nonterminal cards will never be played with Stock as long as you can avoid it, though. Basically it goes good with terminals: Terminal draw because you can play it after the draw, and coin because those are the perfect Stock card (no loss or risk). Nonterminals have the only advantage that you can load up on them to drain the pile, but then you get nothing special out of having them.

You're right. I'll probably either add +1 Action to the previous version and check the price for that addition or think of some other way of making Stock more interesting as a Treasure despite the Company's effects.
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #48 on: September 11, 2017, 08:50:43 pm »
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UPDATE

Stock Market: Replaces Stock. Added +1 Action. Now costs 4$.
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Uldiniad

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Re: Dominion: Pirate's Life
« Reply #49 on: November 19, 2017, 01:34:17 pm »
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UPDATE

Aztec Gold: Removed because of its similarity to Cursed Gold.

Pirate Cove: Modified to use Cursed Gold. Now costs 4$.
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